Why not? He was smart, he wasn't tough or strong. He knew how to play the cards he was dealt. That's the key to success, whether you are strong, weak, intelligent or dimwitted, be real witth yourself and play to your strngeths. If you can't beat someone with physical force, beat them with wit or fuck them over.
At the end of the speech, Cicero also wrote "Please, do not mercilessly beat the messenger as if it were me." Unfortunately, the one reading was cut short before reaching that part.
Romans were huge on Greek legends and believed that Rome was born from Trojan refugees. Comparing him to Helen was prroboly the biggest burn he could suffer lmao.
@@Wanderer628 Bonus points that Anthony had a great admiration of Hellenistic culture after having spent his early adulthood in Greece (he was in fact trying escape those debts Cicero mentioned), he knew depth of that insult.
@Wanderer628 nonsense. According to Roman beliefs, Rome was founded by the brothers Romulus and Remus. the brothers were born in Alba Longa, a village near the seven hills of Rome
I'll bet that dude was happy that he had such a great job, working for Cicero and the Senate. He probably had that very thought, as he finished his breakfast that morning. He probably even warmed up his voice, so he could read the message, loud and clear.
This little scene is a superb essence of all the Phillipics - they are 14 speaches which include some 200 pages of insults and are enumerating all Antonys faults and sins. This way Cicero immortalized the man he hated most;)The words in this scene are nearly directly quoted from the 2nd Phillipic.
@@Chris-bs4qy Philippics (Latin: Philippicae) are a series of 14 speeches composed by Cicero in 44 and 43 BC, condemning Mark Antony. Cicero likened these speeches to those of Demosthenes against Philip II of Macedon
The producers talked about this during Caesar's death scene, spilling blood in the forum is bad juju as the forum is a religious place. So when caesar was killed in real life everyone ran away. Same case here, Cicero is calling Antony a woman which is a horrible insult. The senators know blood will be spilled and they want no part of it.
And we may add, Curia, it was actually the entrance to the Theater of Pompey, where the Senate used to meet during the last few years. The Senate House, Curia Hostilia , burnt in 52 bc.
@@gringlebandersnatch yeah pretty much. Plus Cleopatra played him like a violin. I'm sure the kids he had with Cleopatra probably wasn't even his for Cleopatra was well versed in the art of deception. Overall, Marc Antony was definitely a simp for Cleo and his excessive need to feel some type of pleasure lead to his ultimate demise. If he would have stayed focused and surrounded himself with better people Antony would have defeated Octavian.
You know that's not the first time something like that has happened Rome's second emperor Tiberius had a captain of the praetorian guard named Lucius Aelius Seianus executed by reading a speech in the Senate house we're at the bottom of the speech it said he and his entire family was to be executed
For those of you who think the reader should have realized what he was reading and stopped, Emperor Tiberius managed to get an extremely dangerous political opponent to read the speech ordering his own destruction by delaying the payload until much later in the script.
As much as I love this show, I kinda hate what they did with Cicero. He was an incredibly brave man, while here he’s very worm-ish. When he critiqued Antony he did it multiple times and in person, during the height of Antony’s power in Rome. Very different than how it’s portrayed here.
This show fails hard when it comes to historical accuracy but I think they established Cicero as a brave man a couple times. Before he surrendered to Caesar he says he's not afraid to die. When he realized Octavian's intentions he didn't hesitate to write to Brutus and Cassius to come and save the republic. Also I think his death scene was great. He dies like a Roman. There are different kinds of bravery after all.
i swear they did a great job with the casting , every character , every actor is very suited in their role , the actors who plays Caesar , his servant , brutus , pompei , little augustus then adult one , cicero , and marc anthony all are exceptionally good performances , i really imagine the real figures being somehow close even though thats imposible... at least for cinematic purpose thats how marc anthonmy should be portrayed , realistic or not , i dont care for the accuracy of the portrayal , this is how the general population wants or believes marc anthony was
Quite rare for the civil war, Cicero and Anthony really hated each other on a personal level. Though he was against both of them, he never bare any kind of hatred like that for Caesar or Octavian for example.
That last like about a woman's role suiting Antony best HAD to have been the clincher. I like how the senators just filed out. It's like they're psychic. "Should we stay or should we leave?" "Well, Antony looks pissed, almost like he's going to kill someone and I don't want to miss that, but yeah we should probably get the hell out of here before he snaps." Oh Cicero you had some pretty big stones. How badly you shall be missed...
"Woman's Role" is a reference to the fact that Marcus Antonius' political foes spread the rumor/insinuation that he was the passive partner in a sexual relationship with Caesar. I wouldn't have read it. I'd be like "Fuck Cicero." Piss off a lawyer or a soldier, there's no easy way out of this haha
@@chinchin2931 There was a time when Brutus was rumored to have been with Caesar that way, as well. But, it was not meant to be taken seriously, but rather a way to disparage Brutus and pressure him to take a stand against Caesar.
In ancient rome and greece, its okay for a man of high position to have sex with other man of lower status (i.e slaves). As long the man of lower status played the passive role (being penetrated, as its considered as the nuptial role of women).
It is rather a reference to the fact that Marcus Antonius had (allegedly)some homosexual relationships in his youth with the other young men, namely Gaius Scribonius Curio, and that he, according to Cicero, was a passive partner. It was Octavianus, who was involved in the gossip about Ceasar.
This scene was fucking hilarious. Marc Antony is an awesome character, but one of the things that makes him awesome is his pride and violent nature. The senators all leaving out of fear of being beaten up personally by Marc Antony because they all knew what was about to happen was a great touch. That poor bastard stuck reading the letter as Marc Antony, so furious he is literally shaking with rage, forces him to finish reading it? Fucking awesome. And this is to nothing of Cicero's cowardly yet hilarious and eloquent strategy. The second they said he was ill but had left a speech, you knew what was going to happen. And you knew Antony's reaction would be priceless.
@@isaacsaffold6505 Not exactly, as you say. Historians and especially those researching the military matters appreciate his skills. If he was just a drunkard (this is Cicero's abuse) he would not be able to rule on the East or organize Philippi campaign.
@@trueromancat7978 yeah we have to bear in mind that an immense amount of propaganda was used against Antony, this video being an example, and then he was defeated by his greatest rival who went on to control the press. I wonder if we would see Octavian as nothing more than the spoilt and manipulative boy lover of Caesar or something if Antony was the victor
@@raulpetrascu2696 Antony was a victor for a long time. Disastrous Parthian campaign caused him to lose a lot of soldiers. But even despite very hostile circumstances, he managed to subdue Armenia (actually - today the large part of Syria and Turkey). To avoid tensions in Syria he arranged in a very fruitful way the matters in Judea(that was a part of Syrian Province back then). We find in all the Middle East many inscriptions commemorating Marcus Antonius, as he awarded many privileges to the major cities. He introduced many good laws promoting sport and athletes (!!!) and nobody except archaeologists ever heard about them;) What Plutarch didn't mention, does not exist in public memory about many major figures. As far as politics, He left Rome and turned toward Egypt. I can not say it was his mistake, but from the political point of view, it was. He led triumph in Alexandria with his new wife. That was a major point around which the propaganda was built. Actually, he refused to be Roman. According to Roman law, any Roman who married a foreign woman would lose Roman citizenship. Probably in Antony's times, the rules were a bit slackened. On the other hand, Octavian put all the old rules into the light again.
First insult: Everyone starts leaving.." forget this shit, we're out of here". Senator: Starts shitting himself Mark Anthony: Getting madder and madder... "go on"..
Antony didn't kill the messenger. He laughed outwardly, but just waited for the right time to bring the hammer down. His Cicero's nailed to the Senate door, despite Octavian wanting him to be spared.
And in real life, Antony answers to Cicero by "anti-philippic" (unfortunately lost and probably destroyed). In fact, the real Antony was a cultured man, who loved philosophy and rhetoric, and the image of a vulgar man/ruthless that many people have of him comes from the propaganda of the "Octavian party". However I love the show, after all it's entertainment, but it's cool to talk about the authentic aspects (and those that aren't ).
Yeah, not really. Beating someone to death is not a b!tch move. Getting beaten to death is a b!tch move. Keyboard warriors tend to think when someone gets mad it means they lost because that's troll logic online. When you get your brains literally beaten out you're the bitch. And in a world where conversations can end that way folks tend to speak with a little more respect most of the time as its not the guy who gets mad, it's the guy who stops breathing at the end of the conversation everyone sees as the b!tch. But since we're online, the safe haven of cowardly wits, different rules apply. But say the wrong things in certain other situations and it'll be the end.
@@sgtmac46 Everybody thinks you're so tough; don't worry. Now calm down. So, is physical strength the only thing that makes a man in your mind? It has nothing to do with fairness or reason or keeping one's emotions in check? To you, a man is a guy who insists that someone reads him a letter and then gets so furious when he does so that he beats that person... a guy with no combat experience who is probably 20-30 years older than him... to death? That's what "a man" does in your mind? Define "posturing".
@@CERTAIND00M All the things you listed that makes a man are things you tell yourself to convince yourself you’re a man. You called it a “bitch move” because you’re a social media shit poster and among your club you claim someone is a “bitch” if they get mad trading insults. But that’s because social media is a bitch world where everyone involved is a bitch. In the real world Anthony lived in you talk shit and get beaten to death it’s you who ends up being the bitch. Mark Anthony wasn’t a bitch because the message Cicero sent that was “triggering him” had lethal consequences. The guy he beat to death didn’t live to tell how he “pwned” Anthony….Nor did Cicero who he had killed. Different world where words have consequences. But yes I know you know nothing about that world. This is the little tiny world you live in. Where words are cheap. Talk some more worthless shit.
That's what makes Cicero such a great figure, he knew how much of a tyrant Anthony and cesar were and he exploited it by doing the one thing every tyrant hates by making fun of them and pointing out there flaws and still to this day the cult of personality around the tyrants persists.
Mind you, Cicero was himself immensely rich, made so by backing & propping a dying republic (which also committed many unspeakable acts against it's own and other continents of the world, not to speak of humanity itself). Also lest we forget, he failed & died violently for it also (and had his hands nailed to the senate doors). So, Cicero is ALSO not the flawless persona that most anti-Caesar/Anthonian's would have others believe either, is he? 🤣
A subtle detail that I think shows amazing acting is at 2:31 when Antony pulls on the end of the scroll as if unsheathing his sword, but then realises it is a scroll so just decides to beat the messenger.
When you're being fed treasonists lines, you run or hand the transcript/listening device over and apologize. He lost his life for treason. He chose to say the lines by freewill. He could've refused and asked for protection but still chose to committ treason. He gets no sympathy or empathy.
As much as I like how this displays Antony's character, its a little over the top. No one would murder a senator on the floor and walk away like nothing happened *cough Brutus
"As, then, there is in seeds the cause which produces trees and plants, so of this most lamentable war you were the seed. Do you, O conscript fathers, grieve that these armies of the Roman people have been slain? It is Antonius who slew them. Do you regret your most illustrious citizens? It is Antonius, again, who has deprived you of them. The authority of this order is overthrown; it is Antonius who has overthrown it. Everything, in short, which we have seen since that time (and what misfortune is there that we have not seen?) we shall, if we argue rightly, attribute wholly to Antonius. *As Helen was to the Trojans, so has that man been to this republic-the cause of war, the cause of mischief, the cause of ruin."* - Marcus Tullius Cicero, *Second* Oration Against Anthony.
it was Octavian (Augustus) that had Cicero post scripted because Cicero was only supporting him to defeat Mark Anthony. "let us use this boy then discard him"
If Cicero was an idiot, you mean. Reading something like that in front of a man with such poor self control and extremely violent tendencies is a suicidal act
I wish they got in my favourite line, ‘prima vulgare scortum, certa flagitii merces, nec ea parva’; “at first a common prostitute, with a fixed price for sex, and not a small one either”, great nevertheless!
In reality it is more advanced burn, but it is just a show and roman politcis were very complex, as the speech were longer. The meritum is quite the same: "You assumed the manly gown, which you soon made a womanly one; at first a public prostitute, with a regular price for your wickedness, and that not a low one. But very soon Curio stepped in, who carried you off from your public trade, and, as if he had bestowed a matron’s robe upon you, settled you in a steady and durable wedlock. No boy bought for the gratification of passion was ever so wholly in the power of his master as you were in Curio’s."
Yeah, Curio was the one who I also suspected Cicero meant when he spoke about "a woman's role". He messed Anthony's finances pretty good, but they were able to patch it out.
There was never a moment in this show where James Purefoy as Mark Antony was anything short of spectacular.
This guy is my hero for life 😂
Heard apparently the actor was having the time of his life during filming, can’t say I blame him.
I hope to meet him one day just to say he was unmatched playing Mark Antony!
Have Purefoy ever made a bad performence? Hell, he even made Resident Evil watchable
At this point, Purefoy is more of a Mark Anthony than the original Mark Anthony. And no I'm not referring to the singer/actor
"a woman's role has always suited you best" is the death sentence for the reader....
You'd think the senator would have had the brains to read the speech to himself before reading it out in public before Marc Anthony and the Senate!
And isn't that sad
@@wiseonwords I don't think he was a Senator per se, but more a kind of Senate Clerk
@@wiseonwords it was sealed
Nyaaaaaaaagh!!!
The orginal keyboard warrior.
Lmao I died reading this
Why not? He was smart, he wasn't tough or strong. He knew how to play the cards he was dealt. That's the key to success, whether you are strong, weak, intelligent or dimwitted, be real witth yourself and play to your strngeths. If you can't beat someone with physical force, beat them with wit or fuck them over.
@@bostontowny4life744 It's strange I can almost sense how short and small you are just from reading that.
@@jaredlandry says the guy whose short and small. You just scream Napoleon complex. You also most certainly use the word “beta” frequently.
Oh have no illusion, he would do this in person too. HBO's rome makes him out to be more cowardly than he actually was.
At the end of the speech, Cicero also wrote "Please, do not mercilessly beat the messenger as if it were me." Unfortunately, the one reading was cut short before reaching that part.
Should have put it in the beginning
Becoming bankrupt before turning of age. Lol thats a burn
@@mathewgrelr7084 yep
No wonder Anthony had Cicero killed when he became one of Rome's rulers after Caesar was assassinated.
@@davidallbaugh6858
Thank you for giving me that SPOILER
My favorite thing about this scene remains that the entire senate leaves because they know what's coming.
Wasn't the real Mark Antony known to womanize and have a bit of a temper or is that something the show exaggerated?
@@nicholas4727 Bang on the money, even his former boss wanted to replace him.
@@nicholas4727 Killing the messenger is exaggerated, but the scene is absolutely perfect ;)
@@trueromancat7978 What did he actually do? Just throw a fit and storm out?
@@nicholas4727 One theory among psychologists is that he had bipolar disorder.
"You are Rome's Helen of Troy."
lol
Romans were huge on Greek legends and believed that Rome was born from Trojan refugees. Comparing him to Helen was prroboly the biggest burn he could suffer lmao.
@@Wanderer628 Rome's Helen of Troy Is what Cicero means to Antony as a man nothing but a whore who brought calamities to rome.
@@Wanderer628 Bonus points that Anthony had a great admiration of Hellenistic culture after having spent his early adulthood in Greece (he was in fact trying escape those debts Cicero mentioned), he knew depth of that insult.
😂😂😂😂
@Wanderer628 nonsense. According to Roman beliefs, Rome was founded by the brothers Romulus and Remus. the brothers were born in Alba Longa, a village near the seven hills of Rome
I'll bet that dude was happy that he had such a great job, working for Cicero and the Senate. He probably had that very thought, as he finished his breakfast that morning. He probably even warmed up his voice, so he could read the message, loud and clear.
"A message to read from the great Cicero. Could this day get any better?!"
@@snewsh It was a promotion too. He got the red stripes to his toga from Mark Antony -- the toga praetexta.
@@yxx_chris_xxy Oh noez! 😂
Maybe he should have pre-read the message
This little scene is a superb essence of all the Phillipics - they are 14 speaches which include some 200 pages of insults and are enumerating all Antonys faults and sins. This way Cicero immortalized the man he hated most;)The words in this scene are nearly directly quoted from the 2nd Phillipic.
The audio book is 10 hours long too, it's amazing. My absolute favourite piece of literature
@@DIY_Miracle dam I'm gonna check it out now lol becoming bankrupt before becoming of age ! Great burn
what are speaches?
@@Chris-bs4qy Philippics (Latin: Philippicae) are a series of 14 speeches composed by Cicero in 44 and 43 BC, condemning Mark Antony. Cicero likened these speeches to those of Demosthenes against Philip II of Macedon
Yes, Cicero was always very brave. When he was somewhere else.
2:30 that one guy who just has to hear it all haha
Lmao where did he go?
Likely an Edit mistake.
epic hahah
He's so happy and cheerful before reading the first insult, by the end hes a shaking sweating mess.
Superb Acting!!
I think you mean by the end he's a a dead bloody husk.
@@sean6775 By the end, a puddle on the Senate floor.
Go on...
That's what made this series so great, the acting.
Poor man should have emphasized on the fact that those were the "WORDS OF MARCUS TULIUS CICERO"
He should have read the speech to himself BEFORE he entered the Senate. At least then he would have known to hand it over to someone else.
@@wiseonwords what if someone else was given the speech originally and did that exact thing to our poor unfortunate speaker in this scene?
He should have paused, then said "It's for your eyes only, and handed it to M A
@@wiseonwords It was sealed
He kinda did.
I love how at 1:42, half the senate is like "Yeah, I'mma just show myself out..."
LOL
😂😂😂
James Purefoy was absolutely incredible in this show
He was good in Sharpes as well
Nobody else coulda played that role.
Go on...
@@jonathancooper4914The real Mark Anthony couldn't do better
2:29 Senator enjoying the view.
2:48 He runs the fuck out.
The producers talked about this during Caesar's death scene, spilling blood in the forum is bad juju as the forum is a religious place. So when caesar was killed in real life everyone ran away. Same case here, Cicero is calling Antony a woman which is a horrible insult. The senators know blood will be spilled and they want no part of it.
But he was not killed in the forum but in the Curia of Pompey
And we may add, Curia, it was actually the entrance to the Theater of Pompey, where the Senate used to meet during the last few years. The Senate House, Curia Hostilia , burnt in 52 bc.
@@haldir3120 it served as such at the time
@@trueromancat7978 dead clodius noises
Mark Antony’s rage fits are always entertaining 😂
he died like a true roman, as he lived. Impossible not to admire
The Senator who read the letter?
Mark Antony is a legendary romantic warrior
@@SkeletonWord well I was referring to cicero in this 8 year old comment, but sure. This denunciation was his death sentence
@@ant1724 He died like a simp out played by Octavian.
@@gringlebandersnatch yeah pretty much. Plus Cleopatra played him like a violin. I'm sure the kids he had with Cleopatra probably wasn't even his for Cleopatra was well versed in the art of deception. Overall, Marc Antony was definitely a simp for Cleo and his excessive need to feel some type of pleasure lead to his ultimate demise. If he would have stayed focused and surrounded himself with better people Antony would have defeated Octavian.
Can i point out how conveniently large and sturdy that scroll is.
Clearly Cicero hated the reader even more than Mark Anthony, and wanted to make sure the later would have improvised weaponry at hand.
If i had been the messinger i would have just put it down and said "here you read the rest" and then ran off.
Exactly.
You know that's not the first time something like that has happened Rome's second emperor Tiberius had a captain of the praetorian guard named Lucius Aelius Seianus executed by reading a speech in the Senate house we're at the bottom of the speech it said he and his entire family was to be executed
@@heroking3677 Hahaha
"but then, a woman's role has always suited you best"
AND HIS NAME IS JOHN CEEEENAAAAAA *airhorns
There will no wrestling in this senate!
I know it's mean, but I laughed my ass off when Mark Antony beat that dude. If I were the reader, I would have dropped the scroll and ran like hell.
The reason is because killing the messenger proves Cicero right. Antony is a bitch.
@Zhanger But perhaps he could have confused him by running out with the rest of the fat senators.
Just give it to Antony.
Beating that guy to death proves ciseros point
@Zhanger I would still try. Lol!!
"These are and i cannot stressed this out enough. These are the words of Cicero so Antony dont murder me"
If he had started with that he might have walked away with just a slap or two. Or if had just dropped the scroll and run...
He should have walked over to Antony instead of reading it out loud. Poor guy
For those of you who think the reader should have realized what he was reading and stopped, Emperor Tiberius managed to get an extremely dangerous political opponent to read the speech ordering his own destruction by delaying the payload until much later in the script.
Yes, for those interested, this was dramatized in I, Claudius as the fall of Sejanus.
Isn't it funny that's a recurring theme in Roman politics
You think something like that would happen today in the US Senate or has a chance of happening
@@heroking3677 as if they read any of their bills
@@SZ-wb1qb unfortunately you're right I highly doubt they actually read the bills that they sign
Cicero shall not abandon Rome. But he shall abandon the messenger.
Cicero knew how to mess with someone’s mind and reputation. he was calculated as hell back then. Literal definition of “you had me in the first half”
Thumbs up to Cicero for trolling Antony.
The senators running away is the funniest part
I just like how the senators in the background get up and leave.
“Uh-oh! I don’t like where this is going. I’m out of here!”
As much as I love this show, I kinda hate what they did with Cicero. He was an incredibly brave man, while here he’s very worm-ish. When he critiqued Antony he did it multiple times and in person, during the height of Antony’s power in Rome. Very different than how it’s portrayed here.
he was a spineless b tch. if you admire him, then you are person of low upbringing and stature.
@@christoff124 sounds like a woman’s role wound suit you best
@@HannibalsHorse looks like wage slave role is all you are good for.
This show fails hard when it comes to historical accuracy but I think they established Cicero as a brave man a couple times. Before he surrendered to Caesar he says he's not afraid to die. When he realized Octavian's intentions he didn't hesitate to write to Brutus and Cassius to come and save the republic. Also I think his death scene was great. He dies like a Roman. There are different kinds of bravery after all.
Yeah cicero was a great statesman. The show did him dirty
... and on that day, the saying "don´t kill the messenger" was invented.
i swear they did a great job with the casting , every character , every actor is very suited in their role , the actors who plays Caesar , his servant , brutus , pompei , little augustus then adult one , cicero , and marc anthony all are exceptionally good performances , i really imagine the real figures being somehow close even though thats imposible... at least for cinematic purpose thats how marc anthonmy should be portrayed , realistic or not , i dont care for the accuracy of the portrayal , this is how the general population wants or believes marc anthony was
One guy stayed behind to watch his reaction
Would *you* want to be in a room with Antony as this is being read to him?
I’d be sitting there with the Roman equivalent of popcorn watching this roast take place
would you walk away from your duty to your people?
I'd be eating grapes in the corner
I wouldn't mind if I was holding a shotgun.
@@TheGreenTaco999 Can't really perform my duty to the people if I am dead, can I?
Quite rare for the civil war, Cicero and Anthony really hated each other on a personal level. Though he was against both of them, he never bare any kind of hatred like that for Caesar or Octavian for example.
That last like about a woman's role suiting Antony best HAD to have been the clincher.
I like how the senators just filed out. It's like they're psychic. "Should we stay or should we leave?" "Well, Antony looks pissed, almost like he's going to kill someone and I don't want to miss that, but yeah we should probably get the hell out of here before he snaps."
Oh Cicero you had some pretty big stones. How badly you shall be missed...
Napoleon reacting to Ridley Scott
These being the words of Marcus Tullius Cicero, the patron saint of trolls and shitposters...
"Woman's Role" is a reference to the fact that Marcus Antonius' political foes spread the rumor/insinuation that he was the passive partner in a sexual relationship with Caesar. I wouldn't have read it. I'd be like "Fuck Cicero." Piss off a lawyer or a soldier, there's no easy way out of this haha
Caesar himself was teased by his troops for allegedly having a homosexual affair with king nicomedes
@@chinchin2931 There was a time when Brutus was rumored to have been with Caesar that way, as well. But, it was not meant to be taken seriously, but rather a way to disparage Brutus and pressure him to take a stand against Caesar.
In ancient rome and greece, its okay for a man of high position to have sex with other man of lower status (i.e slaves). As long the man of lower status played the passive role (being penetrated, as its considered as the nuptial role of women).
It's foreshadowing with Cleopatra, too.
It is rather a reference to the fact that Marcus Antonius had (allegedly)some homosexual relationships in his youth with the other young men, namely Gaius Scribonius Curio, and that he, according to Cicero, was a passive partner. It was Octavianus, who was involved in the gossip about Ceasar.
This scene was fucking hilarious. Marc Antony is an awesome character, but one of the things that makes him awesome is his pride and violent nature.
The senators all leaving out of fear of being beaten up personally by Marc Antony because they all knew what was about to happen was a great touch. That poor bastard stuck reading the letter as Marc Antony, so furious he is literally shaking with rage, forces him to finish reading it? Fucking awesome.
And this is to nothing of Cicero's cowardly yet hilarious and eloquent strategy. The second they said he was ill but had left a speech, you knew what was going to happen. And you knew Antony's reaction would be priceless.
He was an awesome character on this show but he wasn't anything to admire in real life.
@@isaacsaffold6505 Not exactly, as you say. Historians and especially those researching the military matters appreciate his skills. If he was just a drunkard (this is Cicero's abuse) he would not be able to rule on the East or organize Philippi campaign.
@@trueromancat7978 yeah we have to bear in mind that an immense amount of propaganda was used against Antony, this video being an example, and then he was defeated by his greatest rival who went on to control the press. I wonder if we would see Octavian as nothing more than the spoilt and manipulative boy lover of Caesar or something if Antony was the victor
@@raulpetrascu2696 Antony was a victor for a long time. Disastrous Parthian campaign caused him to lose a lot of soldiers. But even despite very hostile circumstances, he managed to subdue Armenia (actually - today the large part of Syria and Turkey). To avoid tensions in Syria he arranged in a very fruitful way the matters in Judea(that was a part of Syrian Province back then). We find in all the Middle East many inscriptions commemorating Marcus Antonius, as he awarded many privileges to the major cities. He introduced many good laws promoting sport and athletes (!!!) and nobody except archaeologists ever heard about them;) What Plutarch didn't mention, does not exist in public memory about many major figures. As far as politics, He left Rome and turned toward Egypt. I can not say it was his mistake, but from the political point of view, it was. He led triumph in Alexandria with his new wife. That was a major point around which the propaganda was built. Actually, he refused to be Roman. According to Roman law, any Roman who married a foreign woman would lose Roman citizenship. Probably in Antony's times, the rules were a bit slackened. On the other hand, Octavian put all the old rules into the light again.
@@trueromancat7978 what, when he gave everything in the East to Cleopatra's kids and hoped that they'd always suck up to Rome?
First insult: Everyone starts leaving.." forget this shit, we're out of here".
Senator: Starts shitting himself
Mark Anthony: Getting madder and madder... "go on"..
Mark Anthony forgot one thing: do not kill the messenger.
Antony didn't kill the messenger. He laughed outwardly, but just waited for the right time to bring the hammer down. His Cicero's nailed to the Senate door, despite Octavian wanting him to be spared.
In real life ?
@@pierren___ Yeah, I read about it.
@@minutemanthezealoustiger1499 oh wow ! Epic
And in real life, Antony answers to Cicero by "anti-philippic" (unfortunately lost and probably destroyed). In fact, the real Antony was a cultured man, who loved philosophy and rhetoric, and the image of a vulgar man/ruthless that many people have of him comes from the propaganda of the "Octavian party".
However I love the show, after all it's entertainment, but it's cool to talk about the authentic aspects (and those that aren't ).
@@MrThierryclement why did octavian betrayed anthony
Everyone be like “I guess it’s a half day today”
This was what trolling somebody was like 2,000 years ago 😆
One of history's noblest keyboard warriors, short of Demosthenes.
The unwilling messenger...
Poor dude... He only read the scrool!
The best part is Antony confirms that Cicero is right the moment he beats the messenger to death. Just like a bitch.
Yeah, not really. Beating someone to death is not a b!tch move. Getting beaten to death is a b!tch move. Keyboard warriors tend to think when someone gets mad it means they lost because that's troll logic online. When you get your brains literally beaten out you're the bitch. And in a world where conversations can end that way folks tend to speak with a little more respect most of the time as its not the guy who gets mad, it's the guy who stops breathing at the end of the conversation everyone sees as the b!tch. But since we're online, the safe haven of cowardly wits, different rules apply. But say the wrong things in certain other situations and it'll be the end.
@@sgtmac46 Everybody thinks you're so tough; don't worry. Now calm down.
So, is physical strength the only thing that makes a man in your mind? It has nothing to do with fairness or reason or keeping one's emotions in check? To you, a man is a guy who insists that someone reads him a letter and then gets so furious when he does so that he beats that person... a guy with no combat experience who is probably 20-30 years older than him... to death? That's what "a man" does in your mind?
Define "posturing".
LOL! He deleted his comment.
...Hey, admitting when you're wrong is probably one of the manliest things you can do. Kudos.
@@CERTAIND00M Who deleted a comment? Getting beat to death is a bitch move. If you’re saying I deleted my comment it’s still there.
@@CERTAIND00M All the things you listed that makes a man are things you tell yourself to convince yourself you’re a man. You called it a “bitch move” because you’re a social media shit poster and among your club you claim someone is a “bitch” if they get mad trading insults. But that’s because social media is a bitch world where everyone involved is a bitch. In the real world Anthony lived in you talk shit and get beaten to death it’s you who ends up being the bitch. Mark Anthony wasn’t a bitch because the message Cicero sent that was “triggering him” had lethal consequences. The guy he beat to death didn’t live to tell how he “pwned” Anthony….Nor did Cicero who he had killed. Different world where words have consequences. But yes I know you know nothing about that world. This is the little tiny world you live in. Where words are cheap. Talk some more worthless shit.
That poor senator is best known today for being the inadvertent inventor of the phrase, "learn how to read a room."
I would have dropped the scroll and ran the hell out of there before finishing it.
I like how the senators started noping out of there once they realized what the content of the speech was.
Cicero was always very brave... when he was somewhere else.
Most important lessons I’ve learned in life is never beat the messenger the guy who was reading something that someone wrote
You fool.. STOP READING AND RUN!!!
That's what makes Cicero such a great figure, he knew how much of a tyrant Anthony and cesar were and he exploited it by doing the one thing every tyrant hates by making fun of them and pointing out there flaws and still to this day the cult of personality around the tyrants persists.
Mind you, Cicero was himself immensely rich, made so by backing & propping a dying republic (which also committed many unspeakable acts against it's own and other continents of the world, not to speak of humanity itself).
Also lest we forget, he failed & died violently for it also (and had his hands nailed to the senate doors).
So, Cicero is ALSO not the flawless persona that most anti-Caesar/Anthonian's would have others believe either, is he? 🤣
they didnt want to be seen as being "OK" with what was being said. their presence was a sign of approval.
Cicero did so with the knowledge that Antony would have him killed almost immediately, which he was.
This acting is top notch.
Guy that watched the beat down: I-i guess he got what was coming to him?"
M A:I'm not gunning for you...
A subtle detail that I think shows amazing acting is at 2:31 when Antony pulls on the end of the scroll as if unsheathing his sword, but then realises it is a scroll so just decides to beat the messenger.
Marc Antony, one of historys baddasss!!!!!!
Cicero= Ancient Troll
Dude, have you ever heard the expression “don’t shoot the messenger”?
When you're being fed treasonists lines, you run or hand the transcript/listening device over and apologize. He lost his life for treason. He chose to say the lines by freewill. He could've refused and asked for protection but still chose to committ treason. He gets no sympathy or empathy.
Funny to be heard in a senate that used to consider itself descendants of Troy. Do you get the historic Irony used by Cicero?
Helen was the reason Troy fell
I think his rage broke, Vegeta!!!
It's over 9000 thousand!!!
imagine Marc Anthony's fury of all the senators around the guy speaking leaves
Antony: "DID YOU JUST ASSUME MY GENDER?!?!?!?"
Is this where "don't kill the messenger" derives from?
I loved him in Rome, he is great in The Following!!!
The origin of “Don’t kill the messenger.”
As much as I like how this displays Antony's character, its a little over the top. No one would murder a senator on the floor and walk away like nothing happened *cough Brutus
Ooo i like that Shade😂
1:40 "Yeahhh, I'm getting the FUCK outta here"
Speeches from Great Historical Figures :
From the Roman Senate, the Great Mark Antony, 44 BC, chapter 2:27 :
- "Nuaaaaahhh !"
I thought it was because they knew bloodshed was possibly about to come.
Cicero man who had balls of marble.
"As, then, there is in seeds the cause which produces trees and plants, so of this most lamentable war you were the seed. Do you, O conscript fathers, grieve that these armies of the Roman people have been slain? It is Antonius who slew them. Do you regret your most illustrious citizens? It is Antonius, again, who has deprived you of them. The authority of this order is overthrown; it is Antonius who has overthrown it. Everything, in short, which we have seen since that time (and what misfortune is there that we have not seen?) we shall, if we argue rightly, attribute wholly to Antonius. *As Helen was to the Trojans, so has that man been to this republic-the cause of war, the cause of mischief, the cause of ruin."* - Marcus Tullius Cicero, *Second* Oration Against Anthony.
it was Octavian (Augustus) that had Cicero post scripted because Cicero was only supporting him to defeat Mark Anthony.
"let us use this boy then discard him"
Lol.....drop the damn thing n runnnnn !!!
If Cicero had been brave he would have read the speech himself.
If Cicero was an idiot, you mean. Reading something like that in front of a man with such poor self control and extremely violent tendencies is a suicidal act
He actually did historically
In real life, Cicero toasted Antony if had always a chance.
Or stupid.
did the end of the messenger reading the letter not give you a hint as to why some people would rather stay away from that place when he is pissed? :)
I guess this is where the phrase "Don't kill the messenger" came from.
i had thought because they no longer felt comfortable, and possibly a bit fearful to be in a room with such an enemy of cicero.
At least someone stayed behind to enjoy the show. 2:29
@2:14 the look I give the stock market before it plummets.
His murder-yell was great.
I wish they got in my favourite line, ‘prima vulgare scortum, certa flagitii merces, nec ea parva’; “at first a common prostitute, with a fixed price for sex, and not a small one either”, great nevertheless!
Go on...
Go. ON...
@@hesketh7085 NUUAAHHHHH
Go on... GO ON! .....a woman's role has always suited you best...
RAGE!!!!! LMAO!
I love the war cry at 2:27 LOL
Marcus Tulius Cicero - the original shitposter
That was a sorry move by Cicero. He knew full well that he had condemned that man to death.
speaking about putting oneself in danger!
this is probably why Antony nailed his hands to the senate door xD
i thought Fulvia did it
@@marcokite in this series fulvia doesn't exist.
He wrote and spoken 14 speeches so yeah IT kinda was coming
He was thinking as reading "You are certainly not without accomplishments"
::YES, Something positive::
Only for it to be shattered.
In reality it is more advanced burn, but it is just a show and roman politcis were very complex, as the speech were longer. The meritum is quite the same:
"You assumed the manly gown, which you soon made a womanly one; at first a public prostitute, with a regular price for your wickedness, and that not a low one. But very soon Curio stepped in, who carried you off from your public trade, and, as if he had bestowed a matron’s robe upon you, settled you in a steady and durable wedlock. No boy bought for the gratification of passion was ever so wholly in the power of his master as you were in Curio’s."
Yeah, Curio was the one who I also suspected Cicero meant when he spoke about "a woman's role". He messed Anthony's finances pretty good, but they were able to patch it out.
Translation: Not only were you a prostitute, but you were a stupid and naive prostitute who got your money stolen by your pimp.
Antony was like Caesar's Jesse Pinkman
That poor guy should've refused to read it and handed Antony the paper.
Everyone leaving knew what was coming!! Poor messenger!! 😅