One of the marks of an intelligent person is the ability to admit, at any time, that they might be wrong. The thing that I love the most about this channel is that you guys aren't didactic. You give us tools and techniques and then turn us loose to do as we wish with the knowledge you've given us. Thanks, guys. This was really great!
Thanks again for a great video! On a related note, Timothy Roberts makes some great videos on cymbal making. I've learned a lot about hammering, lathing and whatnot from those videos. I'm sure you've checked them out too.
The cymbalsmith "lore" is absolutely amazing when you acknowledge that almost all of the best cymbal brands has the same family roots. Sabian is founded by... one of Zildjian brothers after a conflict. Istanbul was founded by Agop and Mehmet after working 30 years for Zildjian. And then, as we know, they parted due to different taste. Same stuff with less known brands like Amedia, Bosphorus, Turkish (which also makes cymbals for Zultan). Even the Meinl's Byzance line was designed but one of the masters - Ibrahim Diril. And yeah, he also gained experience with turkish brands and now has his own amazing company. I just love seeing arguments about cymbal brands online knowing they all just originate from different tastes and philosophies of the makers. Paiste is interesting because of their completely separated timeline, but im not a big fan. And thats okay, because we all look for different thing in sound.
As a complete beginner to drumming (55), I am about 2 months in. The resources and knowledge you and others share is greatly appreciated. Pretty much everyday I’m watching or reading etc. about drums, cymbals, sticks, heads, etc. This topic you just posted on your channel is one I’ve been waiting for. 👍 I got a 7 pc Tama SuperStar classic and a Paiste 900 pack. So these being lathed a lot definitely drives my curiosity of other designs. Thanks a lot man🥁 rock on!
Love this series. Particularly as a hobbyist player it really helps to cut through some of the "chaff" out there. And in simple terms as in most activities....right tool for the right job makes all the difference! Thank-you!
Great video, all really pertinent points that you touched on. Cymbal-smithing is such a huge and fascinating subject. I’ve found when I get a new cymbal it certainly feels different under stick, and sonically (that is, new cymbals that haven’t been played, or only lightly demoed) change as the bronze loosens up. Thanks guys, love your channel.
This is really good stuff and important information. I like that you brought up that cymbals sound can change over time. I purchased a 20” Dream Bliss crash/ride new, that at first sounded a bit quiet and too smooth in the mix of the rest of my cymbals. After about 2 to 3 years it changed into the exact opposite-too loud and trashy sounding. The shape of the cymbal did not change from what I could see. I ended up trading it in for something else.
Thanks for this video, very instructive as always! Cymbals is a complex topic. As a french guy, I would say that describing cymbal sound needs a lot of words, very much like it's needed to describe wine taste! I personally use t-cymbals that are less known, but very interesting to the extend of sound diversity.
On the subject of "hearing with your eyes" could you comment on the idea that brilliant finish cymbals are brighter in tone? I believe this is a very widespread misconception as the brilliant finish process must surely remove some material or apply a coating which will reduce the weight or dampen the cymbals sound.. however I've never had the opportunity to compare traditional and brilliant finish models of comparable weight so I'm not 100% certain and would love to hear your perspective on this?
Brilliant finishes are generally just polished so the lathe grooves become flat. This difference in the lathe lines creates most of the sound difference. Generally brilliant cymbals are a little more tame and have less overtone information because those grooves do not disrupt the sound production
Actually the meinl extra thin hammered (by hand) crash is very popular in modern metal. I play metal and I play hand hammered cymbals and they work very well. I found that the trick is a actually the balance between drums and cymbals. If you take one overhead mic, you want a balanced sound - if you have darker cymbals you can have darker drums (less wires, less clicky bass drum) more natural sounding drums that work perfectly well in all genres. If you got very heavy bright cymbals you will also need the wood beaters and snappy bright snare ❤
I usually find vintage old-school cymbals yo be a lot brighter than I expect. Usually because it was recorded to tape, sometimes with ribbon microphones. Today most mics are very bright so bright cymbals make no sense
I've been wondering about that ride, but now I know. A modified Meinl sand ride. No wonder it sounded kind of familiar, since I play a 20" sand ride as my main ride. From the video, it seems like your modified ride is a bit more balanced and brilliant. It has less of the low washiness that I absolutely love, but a really nice overall sound nonetheless.
Really great to learn more about that simpson modded AA. It’s one of the best cymbals I’ve ever heard in any of these UA-cam vids: balanced, breathy, musical, perfect mix of bright + subtle. So a AA blank modeled after a 40’s zildjian? Anyone of you own the particular cymbal it was modeled after?
One of the marks of an intelligent person is the ability to admit, at any time, that they might be wrong. The thing that I love the most about this channel is that you guys aren't didactic. You give us tools and techniques and then turn us loose to do as we wish with the knowledge you've given us.
Thanks, guys. This was really great!
Thanks again for a great video! On a related note, Timothy Roberts makes some great videos on cymbal making. I've learned a lot about hammering, lathing and whatnot from those videos. I'm sure you've checked them out too.
The cymbalsmith "lore" is absolutely amazing when you acknowledge that almost all of the best cymbal brands has the same family roots. Sabian is founded by... one of Zildjian brothers after a conflict. Istanbul was founded by Agop and Mehmet after working 30 years for Zildjian. And then, as we know, they parted due to different taste. Same stuff with less known brands like Amedia, Bosphorus, Turkish (which also makes cymbals for Zultan). Even the Meinl's Byzance line was designed but one of the masters - Ibrahim Diril. And yeah, he also gained experience with turkish brands and now has his own amazing company. I just love seeing arguments about cymbal brands online knowing they all just originate from different tastes and philosophies of the makers. Paiste is interesting because of their completely separated timeline, but im not a big fan. And thats okay, because we all look for different thing in sound.
The guy who designed the Meinl Byzance line Was MURAT Diril,not Ibrahim
100% the best presenter of information ive seen anywhere on toutube for the drumming community. Great to watch. 👍😊
As a complete beginner to drumming (55), I am about 2 months in. The resources and knowledge you and others share is greatly appreciated.
Pretty much everyday I’m watching or reading etc. about drums, cymbals, sticks, heads, etc.
This topic you just posted on your channel is one I’ve been waiting for. 👍
I got a 7 pc Tama SuperStar classic and a Paiste 900 pack. So these being lathed a lot definitely drives my curiosity of other designs.
Thanks a lot man🥁 rock on!
After 20 plus years of drumming, I'm still learning so much from Sounds like a drum, other channels and social media .Keep on 🥁 🤘
Love this series. Particularly as a hobbyist player it really helps to cut through some of the "chaff" out there. And in simple terms as in most activities....right tool for the right job makes all the difference! Thank-you!
Great video, all really pertinent points that you touched on. Cymbal-smithing is such a huge and fascinating subject. I’ve found when I get a new cymbal it certainly feels different under stick, and sonically (that is, new cymbals that haven’t been played, or only lightly demoed) change as the bronze loosens up. Thanks guys, love your channel.
This is really good stuff and important information. I like that you brought up that cymbals sound can change over time. I purchased a 20” Dream Bliss crash/ride new, that at first sounded a bit quiet and too smooth in the mix of the rest of my cymbals. After about 2 to 3 years it changed into the exact opposite-too loud and trashy sounding. The shape of the cymbal did not change from what I could see. I ended up trading it in for something else.
Thanks for this video, very instructive as always! Cymbals is a complex topic. As a french guy, I would say that describing cymbal sound needs a lot of words, very much like it's needed to describe wine taste! I personally use t-cymbals that are less known, but very interesting to the extend of sound diversity.
On the subject of "hearing with your eyes" could you comment on the idea that brilliant finish cymbals are brighter in tone? I believe this is a very widespread misconception as the brilliant finish process must surely remove some material or apply a coating which will reduce the weight or dampen the cymbals sound.. however I've never had the opportunity to compare traditional and brilliant finish models of comparable weight so I'm not 100% certain and would love to hear your perspective on this?
Brilliant finishes are generally just polished so the lathe grooves become flat. This difference in the lathe lines creates most of the sound difference. Generally brilliant cymbals are a little more tame and have less overtone information because those grooves do not disrupt the sound production
As always, incredible content. Thank you so much for these informative videos and your service to the drumming community
Actually the meinl extra thin hammered (by hand) crash is very popular in modern metal.
I play metal and I play hand hammered cymbals and they work very well.
I found that the trick is a actually the balance between drums and cymbals. If you take one overhead mic, you want a balanced sound - if you have darker cymbals you can have darker drums (less wires, less clicky bass drum) more natural sounding drums that work perfectly well in all genres. If you got very heavy bright cymbals you will also need the wood beaters and snappy bright snare ❤
I usually find vintage old-school cymbals yo be a lot brighter than I expect. Usually because it was recorded to tape, sometimes with ribbon microphones. Today most mics are very bright so bright cymbals make no sense
Lets go. Waiting for this!
That blank actually sounds pretty good as is! 😂
It sure does! And sometimes it’s the perfect fit for a particular context.
@@SoundsLikeADrumWhat is the weight of the blank?
~2400g
I've been wondering about that ride, but now I know. A modified Meinl sand ride. No wonder it sounded kind of familiar, since I play a 20" sand ride as my main ride. From the video, it seems like your modified ride is a bit more balanced and brilliant. It has less of the low washiness that I absolutely love, but a really nice overall sound nonetheless.
Really great to learn more about that simpson modded AA. It’s one of the best cymbals I’ve ever heard in any of these UA-cam vids: balanced, breathy, musical, perfect mix of bright + subtle. So a AA blank modeled after a 40’s zildjian? Anyone of you own the particular cymbal it was modeled after?
Hardcore agree, that's one nice-sounding cymbal.
Yes that era of zildjian As are great. I own a 19 transition stamp from around that time and it is one of my favorites
My personal favorite cymbal series is the AAX by Sabian
I had a 21” ride that was really nice sounding back in the 90’s
+soundslikeadrum *Flattened B20 bronze ingots are hammered first.* Lathing comes after hammering.