Is the Engine dead? / Adventure bike build Yamaha XJ 600 part 2
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- Опубліковано 6 чер 2024
- is the engine of my motorcycle dead, lets find out.
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#motovlog #motorcycletrip #bikelife #yamahaxj600 #yamahaxj600diversion - Авто та транспорт
Really like how casual you are. No fancy Garage, no fancy equipment, no master grade knowledge. Seeing you tinker around is inspiring and a good proof that all you need is willpower and everything else will fallow.
Yes. He is real blogger 👍🙋
I hope that everything else will follow 😂
Thank you for the appreciation
I’m really loving this series! Can’t wait until you get her back running!
Thank you so mutch for writing this out. I was so unsure about if people like it. As it is not travel content and I also am not a experienced mechanic at all
Watching you learn is part of the entertainment. It's a easy engine to work on too.
The key information you get from this compression test is the difference between the individual cylinders. The absolute value is influenced by a load of factors and a 10% error is probably an optimistic guess with these testers. 9 to 10 is in the ballpark for that engine thus and, though at the lower end of the range, doesn´t sound bad. As the bike has seen a bit of road, I wouldn't worry too much at this point.
The incident with the bike on its side should have done no harm either. Had it done, you'd know by now. The risk of the engine with the oil collected at one side is that a pushrod or piston flooded with oil from below get overloaded when having to overcome the momentum of the oil's mass. That damage would have happened there and then. There's always oil remnants in the bearings that bridge a few seconds of poor lubrication situations. That one is low on the list of possible causes for issues. That also is why real hardcore off-road bikes have dry sump lubrication. External oil tanks are not that dependent on gravity! (Same goes for the majority of aircraft, by the way.)
The fact that one cylinder spat out petrol is interesting though, and makes me think there might be an issue with its inlet valve:
A carburettor only emits fuel when there is air passing through it. That is due to the Bernoulli principle and the carburettor being a pipe using the Venturi effect (See the according articles on Wikipedia! 🙃) For the carburettor to suck fuel, air must have gone through it. For the fuel to come out to the open, the air must have been travelling in the wrong direction. Any compression stroke must only ever happen on a closed inlet valve. Inlet open only ever must be with the piston going down. So there may be a stuck valve or the valve timing off. There may be a worn out valve guide or valve shaft, weakened valve spring or leaky valve seats. There also is a chance that the timing chain is worn or had gotten lose and skipped a tooth at some point, which also may explain your Yammie's poor starting. (That comes to my mind only now! 😵💫) Other issues are not entirely impossible to make this effect, but I estimate them to be very unlikely. As you will have the cylinderhead cover off soon, you will have easy access to check these possible sources of issues.
It will be pretty expensive, but do consider complete overhauls of the carburettors once you are confident the rest of the engine is worth the effort. Them being possible source of so much serious trouble and big engine damage plus their age and condition does suggest that to be a decent measure to me. But that's a matter for later, I think. First getting the health status of cylinder head, camshafts, valves, Valve seats, timing chain, chain tensioners etc. sorted will be on the list.
I'm not going to say "Don't worry!" but I will say "Don't worry too much!". The care and thought you put into every step and your obviously good insight into the inner workings tell me you are on a good heading. Not worrying opens the door to silly mistakes. Lack of worry with such jobs causes the lack of attention that makes even masters at such jobs f*ck up. But do have your good confidence and go ahead step by step, checking thrice before and after doing once.
You are doing a good job! 💪🙏😎
Thank you for the indept comment I hope stuff will be fine with the valves
@lesMC I hope so, too. But you know what? If they are forked you'll fix them. 🤷♂💪 It's no black magic, I think I already told the story of that friend of mine who gave his Honda CRX engine a rebuild on his desk in his room, including regrinding the valves and all. It's easy-peasy. 🙃
Cleanliness is important therefore;
1)Block intakes with plastic and clean the valve cover. Do not remove the plastic (bags)before this is done otherwise there is a risk of dirt entering the engine.
2) Petrol tank/ -tap flush and clean + -filter(replace). This prevents further dirt entering the carbs. ONLY after that is the right time to clean the carbs!
3)I‘m still skeptical about your ignition coils. My guess is they‘ve seen better days.
4)Valve clearances is done patiently in stages after intensive research in the net and looking eventually in UA-cam.
Preferably together with an experienced person.
Best of luck from Düsseldorf
Sher 😉
Thanks for the good tips and the tips about the valves. I am going to research that carefully ☺️
You can watch other people do valve adjustments on UA-cam to get an idea of what to expect. It's not hard to do but it takes time and patience. You may need shims before you start so check on that. You will definitely need feeler gauges. Good luck!
Already organizing them ☺️
Really enjoying these videos they will put your subscriptions through the roof .👍Alan Northern Ireland
I hope that people will like them☺️
Cover up the engine so that nothing falls into it. You don't want any foreign material in your engine.
What material would be good for that, going to do the work in the garage, when I am not working on it I will put plastic over it
I'm enjoying this series and looking forward to the next episode👍
Once I had fuel coming out of the wrong end of the carburettor as well. Trying to break my head on what caused it. I think it was an issue with valve adjustment. I'll let you know when I remember more.
It would probably be good if you spent an afternoon organising your (part) of the garage. You might be able to find some free lamps, working tables and shelves at and online second-hand market place.
You are right, I will tidy up the garage ☺️
There is an improvement kit for the carburator. This is a known issue...pls check the Wikipedia page section WEAKNESS in German. Take your time for the valve adjustment.....and PREPARE. Tools, light and energy. Start early!
You are battling different topics: age related topics, service topics and weak points. But overall you have basically a very reliable bike. No worries!
Definitely preparing for it going to start with reading up on it tomorrow as I still struggle with a cold
Compression is usually checked with the engine hot, so it's to be expected that it's a little lower when it's cold
Good to know ☺️
All of the adjustments you’re doing is exactly what I’m doing to mine. I just bought it from someone who had already done a bit of work to it but they clearly didn’t care to learn how to fix it properly and now I’m dealing with the repercussions of that. It’s all pretty simple though so don’t even stress out about it
One small hint - before ordering on ebay, give Yamaha dealer a call. Turns out clutch cable for my 15yo Transalp is ~50Eur in ebay, ~60 in internet shops, but oem honda one is 35eur right from the dealer. Same for oem battery, front sprocket and fork seals. Sometimes dealer prices and pats availability, especially on smaller consumables will surprise you. In past I was sure dealer prices are always ridiculous and always at least twice that on ebay. I was wrong.
Thank you that’s a good idea☺️
We love this series, keep poking at it till it runs!
The valves are easy job. Nice little trick is to open walve, insert zip ty into spark plug hole into valve seat. Return to tdci an valve stays open. You can now remove valve shim
Thanks for the tip
9 bar compression is OK. Less 8 - bad. In firs you need to buy rebuild set for carburators and check fuel cock. Its work from vacuum. Fuel pump too. Also carbs need to be cleaned with carb cleaning liquid or ultrasonic bath. I think problem is fuel delivery. Check vacuum tubes on 1 and 2 cylinders - its for tank valve and fuel pump.
I have put it on the list ☺️
Great way for me to learn about engines. Thank you 👍🏼👍🏼
I hope so ☺️
You might want to check your carburstor floats. If any of them are not sealing they will take in fuel. This will ultimately flood those cylinders with fuel
Going to do that☺️
This has been a fun series to watch! Reminds me of when I was working on my Suzuki Intruder - it was running on one cylinder. Turns out there was 2 bent valves that were stuck open. On this bike I adjusted the valves myself (first time ever for such a job). There was another incident where after putting the bike together and starting it, it started up with very high revs and ran like that for some time while I was trying to figure out what was wrong. One cable from the carburetor getting pulled on which caused the carburetor air flap to be fully open. I suspect this is where the valves hit the piston and they got bent. Either that or i messed up the valve adjustment. Hopefully this doesn't scare you, just thought I would share my experience 😅My humble advice would be to pay very, very close attention to how everything is when you take it apart.
I know you'll get this bike working again and I'm looking forward to it 👍
Thank you for this amazing comment, I hope I can get it done, Suzuki intruder is an amazing bike actually thought about buying one recently ☺️
I would agree with others on the valves being out. I had one of these bikes and it also had an average of a 123 psi per cylinder. The valves were all out of spec and after adjustment each cylinder came up to 142psi on average.
Hopefully it does the same for mine
Clean the carbs/float bowl again. Even if you think its clean, its not. I mean like really clean them, like cause an environmental disaster with the amount of carb cleaner you need to use. I had to clean them on my old GL500 like 4 or 5 times before the bike ran completely fine again
Ok, thank you, I will do that, with loads of carb cleaner ☺️
Wow, 1.never strip a carb in that mess on the table 😲. 2. no clearance failure on an intake valve can cause spitting fuel unless you have a major fault on it and it will tell you with noise/engine damage. 3. you should really check the part which one you decided to skip ( the fuel level in the floater compartment of the carb-> floater needle might not be shut enough for the pressure of the fuel pump ) 4. again less swearing and be more organized, that's a major point. 4. the two cables on the carbsystem is a.) the opener b.) the closer because you have a membrane carb that needs a closer too. The cables you took of are for the TPS Sensor that tells the CDI the state of the throttle, The heating of the carbs come on your older model through the little oil pipes underneath the carbs. Good luck on setting the clearances of the valves and be VERY accurate to the manual you got for that, it is quite tricky and I still push it as far away as I can and the milage let me do🙂
The n house for all the nice tips definitely going to check on the carbs ☺️ aswell
if you squirt a little bit of oil in the cylinder and the compression shoots up it is usually the rings that are on the way out
Thank you, that will probably come in handy
Get yourself a hand vacuum pump with gauge on it - good to chase vacuum leaks.
Once again a very interesting video. You have shown before that you can handle difficult situations so just do all the research beforehand - loads of tutorials on UA-cam. I usually copy/print the necessary pages from the manual - it's a pain flicking all over the place, and it avoids damaging/soiling the manual. Good luck
Thank you for encouraging me ☺️. Going to look in to how it’s done and then get going. Sadly still to sick to work on it
@@FreeMilesMC Really sorry to hear that. There are so many bugs going around. Hope you recover soon.
Original Yamaha Membranschieber werden nicht gerade günstig sein.Kann sein, dass es von Tourmax günstigen Ersatz gibt.Wegen des herausspritzenden Benzins würde ich mir nochmal dringend die Unterdruckbenzinpumpe anschauen.Da ist auch eine Gummimembrane verbaut die gerade bei dem heutigen Sprit nach längerer Standzeit porös geworden sein kann.Bei dem elektrischen Anschluß am Vergaser bin ich mir nicht sicher.Könnte eine Vergaserheizung sein oder aber auch ein elektrischer Choke.Müßte aber im Handbuch erklärt sein.Ich meine mich zu erinnern,daß früher öfter das mangelhafte Startverhalten nach nur wenigen Tagen Standzeit bemängelt wurde.Da die Vergaser aufgrund ihrer Anordnung nur ein sehr kleines Schwimmerkammervolumen besitzen, verdunsten die zündfähigen Bestandteile besonders schnell.Als Abhilfe gab es ,glaube ich,ein speziel gebogenes,syphonartiges Belüftungsschlauchset von Yamaha zum Nachrüsten.Spätere Modelle hatten dann elektrische Spritpumpen die immer frisches,zündfähiges Benzin gewährleisten.
Hatte früher selber mal kurzzeitig eine XJ 600 mit über 100000km auf der Uhr.Kompression war noch gut,volle Leistung,Ventile selber mit den Shims ausdistanziert.Alles machbar,nur Mut!
Tuh ich auf die Liste mit den Dingen die ich brauch.
Ja hast recht ist aber vorallem so teuer weil du das quasi nicht ohne Schieber kaufen kannst aber wen man die Membran mit der Teile Nummer von der Membran aus dem Paket für Schieber und Membran sucht findet man sie für einen guten Preis
Aber ansonsten hast du recht für den Preis kriegt man einen neuen Motor für die Kiste 😬
With a pressure meter you measure the pressure *difference* between cilinder and outside atmosphere. The atmospheric pressure is also working on your air intake. Your geological height doesn't matter.
Ah ok, thanks for the Info, i thought it did as the owners manual stated the sea Level pressure
This is great series!
Good progress 😀 i renovated an old 70s moped than ran like shit to new this winter. Most fun Ive had in a good while and learned tons!
Awaiting your part 3 patiently
👊
1. Its all good with compression for this bike 8 bars more than enough and there is no diff between cylinders.
2. Don’t touch the valves before you done the carbs. Valves spacing not the problem here
You are doing great 👍🏻 keep up the good work, Your on the right track valves can definitely cause fuel to spat out of the carbs. Ive also seen that happen do to poor timming but id check the valves first. You need a good set of feeler gauges and shims to adjust the valves
I am currently organizing to get these ☺️
Try to fill some grams of oil from spark hole directly to cylinder and check compression again - if compression rise your pistons rings is not very good. If compression not rise - you must look at valves. Maybe they ar dirty and not closing well.
I think you have rust or dirt in the gas tank and it clogs up your carburetors, buy a rebuild kit for carbs and put an additional fuel filter on the fuel line between the pump and carbs, clean the gas tank and take a look when exactly carbs flotors are opening the valves (flotors hight I think is called) check the gas pump (I used many times a vacuum line connected at my car and a bucket for the pickup line 😅) just don't give up 👍
im also putting off checking my valves but i have bought feeler gauges ready :D
Just keep going bro! No matter how hard it seems, you can only learn more about mechanics. I am also twitching and tingling my bike using UA-cam tutorials, trial and error, but overall my bike keeps going greate! 😂 I will support you in this project at least with my Like and view!
Fun to come with you on your journey into the unknown. I don't know a lot, but learning is fun. Do you not have a friend with more knowledge than you that can help? Its' a good and quick way to learn. Also, you need better space and light for it to be fun. I saw a video from 2vintage a day or so ago and he had the same thing, petrol shooting out of a carb. It was a valve adjustment fault. Good luck!
the fuel pump has a cutoff pressure of around 4psi- when you turn key on, youll hear pump go "tick, tick, tick, then stops when pressue obtained "
it is more important that the carbs all open at the same time and rate, the fuel spitting out could be the valve it opening early, ie the valve timing has skipped a tooth. you need to get the motor to TDC and check the marks on the cam chain sprocket lines up with the top of the head. it will be in your manual
Thank you, I will google how to do that ☺️
there's a guy on youtube "2vintage" who is always doing top end work, valve timing and adjustments give him a watch could be useful
@@FreeMilesMC
Hey schöne Grüße aus Berlin, meine halbe Familie wohnt in deiner Kleinstadt :-)
Ich hatte eine 1200 Bandit aus 99, man kann beim Prüfen des Ventilspiels erstmal nichts kaputt machen, da du nur den Ventildeckel abnimmst und dann erstmal mit der Fühlerlehre misst. Erst wenn du merkst, dass etwas eingestellt werden muss, könnte man theoretisch etwas falsch machen (außer dir fällt etwas in den Schacht der Steuerkette, den muss man gleich abdecken).
Ansonsten kann es ja nur an Strom, Benzin oder Luft liegen. Würde die Kerzen alle tauschen (kostet ja fast nichts), neues Benzin in den Tank und die Vergaser wirklich perfekt machen mit neuen Membranen. Saugstutzen ebenfalls neu.
Gemischschrauben wie im Handbuch erklärt einstellen.
Dann alles rein und richtig zusammenbauen (auch den richtigen Luftfilter ordentlich ran, sonst stimmen da die Druckunterschiede nicht). Beten und starten.
Do it slowly, step by step , follow the manual. It's simple engine. Just don't brake anything and double check the clearances and torque of the nuts. If it run for a short time with poor oil flow...no problems. It didn't seize. It's a bit neglected, that's all...🙋
Thanks for the tips and encouragement ☺️
Ive got an XJ900 Diversion- basicall same engine design.
Check the compression on the 4th cylinder using the second tip, the pressed one, press well. It is more accurate.
Ok, thank you ☺️
Man don't throw any parts from that engine away. A lot of parts can be resurfaced or reused by professionals. And parts for these are getting rare these days.
Im just wondering is the fuel gate fully ON and have you checked the fuses or tried to change them?
If there any corosion or broken cables that could be the reason.
Double check the coils that they have a good connection.
If the gas tank is disconected its possible that you have a air bubble in the pipe so make sure to have fuel all the way in the line. When you disconect the carburator it takes a litle time before its fuel all the way in the system and that can cause missfiring om the cylinders.
Just some pointers i would have checked. Sins you have struggled with the bike for somewhile its possible to forget to easy stuff 😅
Good luck 💪🔧
Carburettor diaphragm and inlet manifold is what you need. These can be expensive. I did my own clearances last year and I am not a confident person. I am not sure how good the Haynes manual is as I use Clymer. A set of feeler gauges is what you need for valve shim gap measuring. Good luck.
Definitely need feelers gauges.
Great point!
Those inlet things from carb to engine = inlet manifold
inlet rubbers
Das geilste war das Deutsche Fluchen zwischendurch 😂
I wouldn't bother putting time or money into that bike you've got your money's worth out of it part it out
It’s more about sentimental value at this point ☺️
Why not?
It's about the journey of fixing the bike!
Is there big oil consumption on the bike?
Yes
What tires are those ?
Tkc 80 used them for Iceland
Those are really nice and aggressive tires. Best for such terrains. Good choice.@@FreeMilesMC
they are called diaphragms
A contraceptive😂
wouldn't want to stick mine in there@@nedflanders4699