Great visual info on the effects of energy retention of the 77 gr. .223 combo. I will be trying these out as handloads soon since my 22" barreled .223 has the 1 in 9 twist as well, I wasn't sure it would stabilize them. Unfortunately my 22-250 only has the 1 in 12 twist barrel so a no go. Buddy has had his re-barreled with a 24" 1 in 8 barrel and is getting a bit over 3,100 fps out of it while using 80 gr. Noslers I believe. Devastating!
Thanks for re-posting your comment. I was "all thumbs" earlier. Thank you for your encouraging words. Always appreciated. You should be fine with 1 in 9 for stabilizing the 77 grains bullets, but the real question is "at what distance will you no longer be fine?" As you probably already know, stabilization is mainly about rpms. For example you can make up for a slow twist with enough speed just as you can make up for lack of speed with a faster twist. Your friend probably could have gone with a 1 in 9 or 1 in 8.5 and been just fine with the kind of speed he is running...
@@outdooradventures1696 Thank you for your thoughts and input, always appreciate someone with your knowledge and experience to add their insight into the many facets of what happens after the trigger has been pulled. I'd like to do some experimenting later on with the 22-250 to see at what range destabilization takes effect. Not sure what happened on your end with my comment disappearing, it was always here on my end on multiple devices. I simply copied my comment, deleted it from your page and then pasted it again which at least made it easy for me.LOL
Thank you kindly for your kind words. Always appreciated and never taken for granted. I hope you will do that de-stabilization experiment and post it on your channel. Feel free to put a link to it in any of my comments and we will do our best to give it a boost.
I have been "all thumbs" lately and even deleted some amazing 22-250 footage and just now getting home from re-filming it. It will be quite the vid once it is all finished. I am constantly trying to put my older vids "out of business" by making better ones. If I do not make my videos obsolete, someone else will. Same principle with smartphone makers....They are always making new phones that make their rather new models obsolete so that no other company will. I will stop rambling now. :)
I have a dpms oracle 1&9 not the fanciest AR but I'm happy with it everyone says it won't stabilize the 77 grain from what I saw it was pretty accurate out of your rifle with the same twist rate thanks for another great video awesome shooting by the way 👍
Thank you Mr Jaxon for your encouraging words along this journey. They are definitely appreciated and never taken for granted. If you decide to start making some vids of your own, we would all get behind you and do whatever we could to give your channel a boost.
@ Pvt Jaxon. In regards to the stabilization issues, remember that stabilization works on the principle of revolutions per minute (rpms). When a bullet has most of it's initial velocity, it is easier to stabilize it. However, as the bullet travels downrange and loses velocity, it may become destabilized due to the drop in rpms and that is when a twist rate that is faster initally will begin to pay dividends...
I agree. I have an 18" Rock River ATH v2 that has impressed me at some pretty good distance with 77gr SMK. So far wind is tough on it but it's been 800 yards as of now. I need a little more load work and hopefully a little more speed. Those IMI Razor Core 77gr are smoking. Last loading 2600 was my max. Different powder on its way.
Thank you also for your support and encouragement. Here is an interesting bit of info. I filmed the 55 grn v-max, 60 grn v-max, 69 grn hp, and 77 grn hp in 223 all on the same day I filmed the 55 grn v-max 22-250 hitting clay at 100 yards. It was a windy day as you may have noticed. I figured the 60 grn v-max in 223 would be affected by the wind about the same as the 55 grn 250...I was wrong. 250 was affected less. Then I thought surely that the 69 grn 223 would be affected about the same as the 55 grn 250. Wrong again. It was not until I shot the 77 grn 223 that it was virtually identical to the 55 grn 250 in terms of bucking the wind.
And they all got there. Considering the 250 is basically and old cartridge designed for speed and hitting power with the 14" twist, the 223 can achieve amazing hitting power with the much tighter twist and heavier pills. My son's 223 has a 9" twist and I didn't think it could stabilise the 77s. Thought its max would be the 65s. Your 223 is 9" isn't it? One must wonder when it would destabilise.... I know the 250 won't stabilise the Nosler 52gn Custom Comp HPs, not even at 50yds, 😂😂, they are too long, keyhole @50yds with quite a hot load, the buggers. Trouble is though, when I rebarrel my 250 I have either modify or replace the stock as well, because the current barrel is a carrier and I'll be replacing it with a sitter (heavy barrel). Cheers mate, keep up the great work. 👋👋👋
Thanks for the good info. Always appreciated. Would have responded sooner, but just got home from a full day of filming. I truly believe that I have not yet made my best vid. What I was able to capture today, is something most people (myself included) have NEVER seen before and is something I may not ever be able to capture again.
I wanna run some 77s outta my 20” 1/7 gotta good feeling they will be awesome, but not sure if they will help me at 500 yards vs the 62 green tips that I put 7 rnds on some AR500 plate steel . Will they help or should I just keep shooting the 62 grain?
Thanks for sharing the good info on the 62 grain. That is some nice shooting on your part… see if this vid will help to answer your question. ua-cam.com/video/7d3EBUEIbHs/v-deo.html looking forward to your thoughts…
I run 77gr bullets at matches. Had a first rounds impact at 982yards last match (10" circle iirc). I'd load with AA2520 or TAC. I get 2,850fps out of a 20" AR with 77gr TMKs.
What's the difference between a light barrel M 16 A1 and a heavier barrel A2? Does a heavier barrel affect accuracy? Why does the 1/12 twist of the M 16 A1 seem more devastating firing the 55 grain 5.56 cartridge?
The 1:12 twist barely stabilized the 55 FMJBT, so they would immediately tumble (they will tumble even in cold, dense air). A bullet going through anything sideways has a lot more area and transfers energy very rapidly - so it causes far more damage than the ice pick effect of a .224 diameter FMJ zipping right through a target without tumbling.
I saw a test somewhere on here that showed no real difference between 1 in 7 or 1 in 12 in terms of stability or damage to target with 55 grain. It was the 1 in 14 twist that barely stabilized 55 grain bullets.
Thank you for believing. Much appreciated. Just now got home from a full day of filming so that I can make good on my word...(Will do my best to make you proud to say that you believed earlier than anyone else claimed.)
The visuals from that 77gn impact stills were great💯💯💯😬
Thank you for your kind words. Much appreciated... Your timing was great also as I am in the middle of editing more 77 grain footage for a new vid...
Well done. Thank you.
Great visual info on the effects of energy retention of the 77 gr. .223 combo. I will be trying these out as handloads soon since my 22" barreled .223 has the 1 in 9 twist as well, I wasn't sure it would stabilize them.
Unfortunately my 22-250 only has the 1 in 12 twist barrel so a no go. Buddy has had his re-barreled with a 24" 1 in 8 barrel and is getting a bit over 3,100 fps out of it while using 80 gr. Noslers I believe. Devastating!
Thanks for re-posting your comment. I was "all thumbs" earlier. Thank you for your encouraging words. Always appreciated. You should be fine with 1 in 9 for stabilizing the 77 grains bullets, but the real question is "at what distance will you no longer be fine?" As you probably already know, stabilization is mainly about rpms. For example you can make up for a slow twist with enough speed just as you can make up for lack of speed with a faster twist. Your friend probably could have gone with a 1 in 9 or 1 in 8.5 and been just fine with the kind of speed he is running...
@@outdooradventures1696 Thank you for your thoughts and input, always appreciate someone with your knowledge and experience to add their insight into the many facets of what happens after the trigger has been pulled. I'd like to do some experimenting later on with the 22-250 to see at what range destabilization takes effect.
Not sure what happened on your end with my comment disappearing, it was always here on my end on multiple devices. I simply copied my comment, deleted it from your page and then pasted it again which at least made it easy for me.LOL
Thank you kindly for your kind words. Always appreciated and never taken for granted. I hope you will do that de-stabilization experiment and post it on your channel. Feel free to put a link to it in any of my comments and we will do our best to give it a boost.
I have been "all thumbs" lately and even deleted some amazing 22-250 footage and just now getting home from re-filming it. It will be quite the vid once it is all finished. I am constantly trying to put my older vids "out of business" by making better ones. If I do not make my videos obsolete, someone else will. Same principle with smartphone makers....They are always making new phones that make their rather new models obsolete so that no other company will. I will stop rambling now. :)
I have a dpms oracle 1&9 not the fanciest AR but I'm happy with it everyone says it won't stabilize the 77 grain from what I saw it was pretty accurate out of your rifle with the same twist rate thanks for another great video awesome shooting by the way 👍
Thank you Mr Jaxon for your encouraging words along this journey. They are definitely appreciated and never taken for granted. If you decide to start making some vids of your own, we would all get behind you and do whatever we could to give your channel a boost.
@ Pvt Jaxon. In regards to the stabilization issues, remember that stabilization works on the principle of revolutions per minute (rpms). When a bullet has most of it's initial velocity, it is easier to stabilize it. However, as the bullet travels downrange and loses velocity, it may become destabilized due to the drop in rpms and that is when a twist rate that is faster initally will begin to pay dividends...
Nice video good scientific experiment make the same at 200 and 300 yards to see what's happens Greetins for PR.
77 grain in a 18” 223 1/7 Wilde barrel is hard to beat. In my personal opinion, makes the 223 very useful non-varmint hunting round.
I agree. I have an 18" Rock River ATH v2 that has impressed me at some pretty good distance with 77gr SMK. So far wind is tough on it but it's been 800 yards as of now. I need a little more load work and hopefully a little more speed. Those IMI Razor Core 77gr are smoking. Last loading 2600 was my max. Different powder on its way.
What is the weight of the bullet? Is it always better to go with the heavier bullet when hunting?
Would be interesting to see 35gr vs 77gr on the 223.
Those 77s did the job, 😂😂.
Thinking the 77 v Valkyrie 😂😂 (if you can find one).
Great info thanks for posting.
👏👏👏 👋👋👋
Thank you also for your support and encouragement. Here is an interesting bit of info. I filmed the 55 grn v-max, 60 grn v-max, 69 grn hp, and 77 grn hp in 223 all on the same day I filmed the 55 grn v-max 22-250 hitting clay at 100 yards. It was a windy day as you may have noticed. I figured the 60 grn v-max in 223 would be affected by the wind about the same as the 55 grn 250...I was wrong. 250 was affected less. Then I thought surely that the 69 grn 223 would be affected about the same as the 55 grn 250. Wrong again. It was not until I shot the 77 grn 223 that it was virtually identical to the 55 grn 250 in terms of bucking the wind.
And they all got there. Considering the 250 is basically and old cartridge designed for speed and hitting power with the 14" twist, the 223 can achieve amazing hitting power with the much tighter twist and heavier pills.
My son's 223 has a 9" twist and I didn't think it could stabilise the 77s. Thought its max would be the 65s. Your 223 is 9" isn't it? One must wonder when it would destabilise.... I know the 250 won't stabilise the Nosler 52gn Custom Comp HPs, not even at 50yds, 😂😂, they are too long, keyhole @50yds with quite a hot load, the buggers.
Trouble is though, when I rebarrel my 250 I have either modify or replace the stock as well, because the current barrel is a carrier and I'll be replacing it with a sitter (heavy barrel).
Cheers mate, keep up the great work.
👋👋👋
Thanks for the good info. Always appreciated. Would have responded sooner, but just got home from a full day of filming. I truly believe that I have not yet made my best vid. What I was able to capture today, is something most people (myself included) have NEVER seen before and is something I may not ever be able to capture again.
I wanna run some 77s outta my 20” 1/7 gotta good feeling they will be awesome, but not sure if they will help me at 500 yards vs the 62 green tips that I put 7 rnds on some AR500 plate steel . Will they help or should I just keep shooting the 62 grain?
Thanks for sharing the good info on the 62 grain. That is some nice shooting on your part…
see if this vid will help to answer your question.
ua-cam.com/video/7d3EBUEIbHs/v-deo.html
looking forward to your thoughts…
I run 77gr bullets at matches. Had a first rounds impact at 982yards last match (10" circle iirc).
I'd load with AA2520 or TAC. I get 2,850fps out of a 20" AR with 77gr TMKs.
What's the difference between a light barrel M 16 A1 and a heavier barrel A2? Does a heavier barrel affect accuracy? Why does the 1/12 twist of the M 16 A1 seem more devastating firing the 55 grain 5.56 cartridge?
Heavier barrel means less whip and more rounds before barrel heats up and degrade accuracy
The 1:12 twist barely stabilized the 55 FMJBT, so they would immediately tumble (they will tumble even in cold, dense air). A bullet going through anything sideways has a lot more area and transfers energy very rapidly - so it causes far more damage than the ice pick effect of a .224 diameter FMJ zipping right through a target without tumbling.
I saw a test somewhere on here that showed no real difference between 1 in 7 or 1 in 12 in terms of stability or damage to target with 55 grain. It was the 1 in 14 twist that barely stabilized 55 grain bullets.
Here is the link to the 55 grain fmj vs 62 grain fmj
ua-cam.com/video/23B9Zt04R9I/v-deo.html
Let's see what happens. The best is yet to come.
Thank you for believing. Much appreciated. Just now got home from a full day of filming so that I can make good on my word...(Will do my best to make you proud to say that you believed earlier than anyone else claimed.)
Impressive
Thank you. 👍