Batman Brave And The Bold The Nightwing Episode
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- Опубліковано 9 вер 2024
- The evolution of Dick Grayson from Robin to Nightwing is a well known part of Batman history, and had been adapted many times. These days Dick Grayson is most often though of as his adult persona and not as the boy wonder. It's always interesting to see how different pieces of media handle this transition. Today's outing Batman The Brave and The Bold and the episode Sidekicks Assemble. An episode that contains nods to the Teen Titans, Ra's Al Ghul, and a bit of a disappointing Nightwing moment. We discuss it all here on Casually Comics!
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Which Batman Adaptation Has Your Favourite Nightwing?
It's Always Been From the 2003 Teen Titans Animated Series it introduced to Dick Grayson. With just the episode "How Long is Forever" i fell in love with the character!!!
I like Young Justice's version since his transition to Nightwing was very smooth (even to the point Bruce and Dick are very cool with each other after the fact) compared to other adaptations. Plus they go into the "man whore" aspect of Dick even though its a kid's show 🤣 .As for a crazy one i would go with the TAS comic version because Bruce Timm is just insane (stop trying to push this Bruce and Barbara ship on others pls?)
@@philipcampbell4096agreed
I think Young Justice did it best, even if we didn't get to see the actual transition.
He grows and is yet consistent throughout, which is a strong suit of that show, and helps it remain one of the best animated DC series out there... Despite the frying-pan-to-the-face of political correctness that drags down it's later seasons (not a commentary on the subject matter of the political correctness, but the ridiculously delivered manner of it)
Young Justice 🖖🏾
Wonder girl (donna troy) gets zero love in the animated shows. She’s the only founding titan not in brave and bold, got replaced by Wonder Woman in dc super hero girls, and was just a UN rep in young justice. Let’s not even talk about her TTG episode.
She was TTG? Huh I've only ever seen in Young Justice and she's barley a character there.
I think it has to do with the wonder woman embrogo. It's something stupid. Or toy sales
I think this was around the time when a lot of Wonder Woman characters were in a copyright hell, so they couldn’t be used. It’s why Wonder girl didn’t show up until season 2 or why Wonder Woman wasn’t present in the final season of the Batman show
So right
She was also the only founding member to not appear at all in the 2003 Teen Titans cartoon(Kid Flash appears in the end of the show where he rizzes Jinx, Speedy competes in a tournament with BB, Cyborg, and Robin, Robin is self-explanatory, and Aqualad has 2 episodes where he's a key focus, plus Speedy and Aqualad are part of Titans East in it).
Something that I find very annoying is how absolutely no adaptation of Nightwing makes the connection with Superman, every time they tend to invent some other origin for the name or simply say that he became Nightwing, and the way the dcu is setting it up maybe it's the same thing.
It has become a dream for me to see an animated series in which we have a scene in which Clark and Dick talk about the legend of the Kryptonian vigilante.
That'd be awesome.
In general, most modern depictions of Nightwing seriously downplay just how much Dick considers Clark a mentor as well. I would venture a guess a big part of that is simply due to how many Superman sidekicks there are nowadays, between Supergirl and Superboy, that they keep Robin/Nightwing 'in his own lane' and only having him see Bruce as his mentor.
That's because the golden age story of Superman and the original Nightwing character never left the comics. there never was an adaption or mention of it ever, and even today most people only know about it because of people like us repeating that information on the internet.
I totally agree, I’m super excited for the DCU but the relationship between Superman, Batman, and Dick Grayson feels like something they could easily fumble. They need to be closely nit and have a history as the world’s finest.
Heck there are few Superman Robin teamups period. Knight Time of Superman TAS is so much fun because of this. It was fun seeing Tim and Clark work together, almost like partners rather than hero-sidekick.
"Speedy, quick! Retrieve my bow from that Crocodile pit!" is easily the highlight of the episode for me 😂 This version of Dick Grayson isn't my favorite, he is a bit annoying. But it was cool to see both the Earth 2 Robin suit and the 80s Disco Nightwing suit in animation. I think The Batman also had an homage to Disco Nightwing in one episode too.
Yeah, it was a great laugh. And Speedy still had his bow and trick arrows. How hard is it to shoot a grappling hook arrow at GA's bow and pull up to them?
Aqualad: "Could you stop flirting and just fight?!"
Garth, it's Dick Grayson...You know there's nothing you can do...
I liked that BnB Dick was completely hopeless in love, the opposite of the thirst trap of the comics.
To be fair, in the comics, Ra's Al Ghul DID try to get Tim Drake as an heir instead of bruce at one point, but it was in the Red Robin era of Batman RIP, and Tim had no interest in a new member of the Al ghul clan, there was barely any mentions of Talia...
Aqualad: "Bro, what the Hell are you doing flirting with Talia?! She's the love interest of your mentor!"
Nightwing: "I know. After knowing what happened with Barbara I need some poethic payback, you know?"
In Fairness... It makes a bit of sense with the silver age context. In that time Bruce was depicted to be in his mid-to late 30ies while Talia was shown to be in her early 20ies, so Dick flirting with her is not as weird as you'd think.
Plus... remember when Dick, in the comics mind you, kinda-sorta flirted with Catwoman right after taking over for Bruce in the late 2000s? yes, that was a thing, shortlived as it was.
yes Batman sleeping with Batgirl remains in infamany I see in 2024
To be fair, Dick started the war. He was about to get married and the night before he got married, he bang Barbara and then told her he’s getting married, and it’s not with her. He just wanted her to know.
Is that fr?@@mrdude88
It was interesting that Dick had such an arc in this show, going from kid Robin to adult Robin to Nightwing to even Batman! Really did make you wish the show did do some more Grayson, given how much it’s shown they liked doing his episodes.
Nightwing came out ready to be called Disco Fever but, Batman knew it and had to put a stop to it.
I think if Dick added to why he found Nightwing a good idea, saying maybe will come through even during dark times without being in the dark, or some thing else. Showing more of the kind of hero Dick wants to move towards other than rebelling or wanting to be taken seriously.
You will never forget the one time Jason slept with Talia and I won't forget when Catwoman kissed Nightwing.
70’s disco popped collar Nightwing is the best Nightwing
Finally someone agrees with me
Thanks for spotlighting that great Nightwing debut scene from Teen Titans. That scene (along with the matching one in Batman, where Dick hands the Robin costume over to Jason) was incredibly satisfying to those of us who'd watched Dick Grayson's growth over the years. It is pretty amazing that Nightwing as a concept has survived through so many reboots and adaptations, but that just shows what a natural evolution of the character it was.
Yeah, when it comes to untangling Donna Troy, the best thing I can say is that at least she's not Hawkman.
The world does not need more than one Hawkman.
I wish he got more appreciation in animation
I say 2 Hawkmen are fine. Golden and Silver age, it's when they try to merge or add more to the history
Hawkman Power Girl and Donna Troy team up and the part where they tell each other their origins takes up 90% of the page count.
True.
lmao "quick retrieve my bow from that crocodile pit!" Green Arrow didn't give to fucks about speedy in this haha
Green Arrow was indeed a jerk.
@@SpaceJawa always has been.
Love the old Mister Zero costume. If there was a super-villain high school, it's colors would be purple and green.
Now I can't help but imagine Lex Luther as a principal.
@@GabePuratekuta Reverse Flash a P.E teacher constantly trying to get his students into running.
@@ProjektTakuBrainiac as the science teacher. Which science class? All of them.
Ngl, I love the wholesome episode intro. It's pretty curious tho think the evolution those cute little kids would get over the years, with Robin becoming the supreme alpha male of DC, Speedy a one-arm drug-addict who lost his daughter and Aqualad...Aqualad...
Is that why Speedy didn't have an arm in Young Justice?
I agree. The Nightwing joke would have landed better as a "hey, how'd you know?"
Fun fact , the Teen Titans first animated adaptation was part of Filmation Aquaman show in 1967 …the team featured: Aqualad, Kid Flash, Speedy , & Wondergirl, with Speedy filling the Robin role as team leader… not very deep stories as they were only 7/8 minutes…& another fun fact Wondergirl in this series got a animated adaptation before Wonder Woman who did not get one until The Super Friends I believe 1973 …Keep Up The Outstanding Work Sasha 🖖🏾
Another Fun Fact is that the show featured the first animated adaptation for a lot of DC characters in the silver age : Aquaman, Aqualad, Mera , Ray Palmer’s Atom, Barry & Wally’s Flash & Kid Flash, Hal Jordan’s GL, Hawkman, & the JLA : Atom, Flash, GL, Hawkman, & Superman 🖖🏾
Also Black Manta as the only real prominent villain 🖖🏾
True Mera was portrayed as more of a playmate for Aqualad , then a romantic partner for Aquaman & was definitely the damsel in distress…As far as the other Aquaman villains, I knew of them when I made my statement of Black Manta being the only prominent villain IMO 🖖🏾
Also although not the powerhouse she is today , & definitely having some damsel in distress moments Sue Storm Richards /Invisible Girl did have her powers & was a key member of 1967 Hanna Barbera Fantastic Four cartoon 🖖🏾
Thank you, I had forgotten all about Wonder Woman being on a episode of the Brady Kids cartoon in 1972 , which of course predates her on the Super Friends in 1973 🖖🏾
I didn't mind the Dick/Talia thing at all since it felt one-sided on Dick's end and a later episode would later confirm Talia's romantic feelings for Bruce, although the show takes his relationship with Catwoman more seriously.
Nightwing is a sidekick stepping out of his mentor's shadow and although stumbling several times, manages to find his own footing. Red Arrow almost feels like a cautionary tale of a sidekick doing the same thing and stumbling much, much harder.
Would love to see you cover Red Arrow's transformation from Speedy. You can easily link it back to Young Justice, which really leaned into the Red Arrow origin (Robin/Nightwing were there, of course, but YJ decided to do that whole story with a timeskip, plus made the original Robin younger than Speedy).
I wish animation tv shows were able to explore Wonder Woman characters more, especially the wonder girls. In young justice cassie was one of the, favourite characters. It sucks there was an embargo
Nightwing in his Brave & the Bold incarnation looks like a reformed Fantômas
+1 for Young Justice Nightwing being my favourite adaptation, but I also like the 90s Batman Animated version because I was already a Wingnut by then and this was the first time he'd been put on screen.
12:41 What do you think Dick’s mantle was before Batman decided the name Nightwing?
It is a shame that Lor-Zod formerly known as Christopher Kent lost the Nightwing Mantle, and all his memories being part of the Superman family and his friendship with Tim Drake.
Lor-Zod is just remembered as a villain and Son of Zod.
I feel like Young Justice was going to do a more heroic Lor-Zod by having him be born early and live without his father's influence, but that was a story for another time.
Ra's couldn't team up with Poison Ivy. How would that get him get a MALE HEIR? If anything Ivy would have hindered that out of spite.
She wouldn't have to be a failed heir to still team-up. They still have similar goals and methods.
The weird thing about the Bob Haney quote is his less than caring attitude created so many wonderful moments. Highly recommend the podcast Teen Titans wasteland/titan up the defense if you want to experience all the joy of the silver age. Also you will become an Aqualad fan
my fave Nightwing appearance of OG Nightwing is Crisis on Infinite Earths #3. I didn't know he had changed and it was like "Hey! he's finally Nightwing!"
They could have had all three do this. From Aqualad to Tempest and Speedy changes to Arsenal
This has made me realize I want an early years Batman and Robin in the style of Team Four Star's Goku and Gohan. With Superman as Piccolo. Fight(ing crime) obsessed Batman being a not great dad because of his obsessions and Superman intervening and coming to be more caring.
I would love to see you cover the episode of Batman teaming up with Captain Marvel/Shazam with the former de-aging throughout the episode. It's a wacky good time with some precious moments.
Might be perfect for their approach, but my favorite versions of Nightwing are always when he spent time flying solo as Robin before changing to the new attire.
I like that they used Earth-2 older Robin costume (which I first saw in a Brave and the Bold comic) but found a way to update it within the show.
I love it when they tie the sidekicks to the heroes and talk about their upbringing. One of my favorites is actually not even a comic, it's a novel by Devin Grayson called "DC Universe: Inheritance". The former sidekicks talking to the other heroes and sharing the differences on how they were brought up and trained.
I love that novel! It's on my shelf right now. I've always thought it was the best and most insightful portrayal of the sidekicks' pre-hero lives. That casual line about Roy still dreaming and counting in his first language hit me hard when I first read it, especially because Ollie was so clearly negligent that I knew no one had spoken to Roy in anything other than English at home for years. It was heartbreaking.
That book is why I started collecting language dictionaries--and yes, I started by tracking down one for Navajo/Dine'bizaad. Now I make a point of learning at least a few words in any language I expect to encounter in a new place. All because of Ollie Queen's terrible parenting. 😂
You always have the nicest hair.
"Comics are to kids what booze and sex are to adults" - No wonder Wortham was able to sink his hooks into the public's minds so easily.
Of course, there's the Golden Age, where Robin continued to be Robin, even into his 50s.
From what I remember of Nightwing explaining about his (then) new costume, was that Wonder Woman also had an influence, with the bracers (and when you think about it, the yellow/golden wings on the costume).
The direction you suggested at the end would've been SO much better!
I want John Dimaggio’s Aquaman to be James Gunn’s template for the character
I have never have to escape through a bedroom window with all my clothes bundled inside a t-shirt because of comics, just saying.
Then you haven't done comics right.
I kinda wish the BATB Teen Titans weren't so...classical. I mean, I didn't expect the iconic 80's team from the Wolfman/Perez Era to appear, but featuring also Kid Flash, Donna Troy, Kid Flash and Lilith Clay would have been far better. Glad the tie-in comics fixed that
I am fine leaving out the others, but having Wonder Girl around would have been nice. Though it would be weird if they introduced her before Wonder Woman (it’s been a minute since I’ve watched this show, but I remember Wonder Woman/Superman weren’t introduced until way later)
@@Camo1177yeah we're introduced around late season 2 early season 3 ish.
But what about Kid Flash?
@@GabePuratekuta Kid flash in this shows universe wouldn't be able to appear he's to busy protecting star city.
@@Flyboy1953 Yeah I confuse the cities sometimes.
I think one thing I would have liked a bit more was if Batman was not the one who gave him the name Nightwing in the episode.
I'd still like to see a video on the episode "Fall of the Blue Beetle!" It's the one where Jaime finds out what happened to the previous Blue Beetle. I like how it's a loose adaptation of a story from the Charleton run, but it shifts the focus from Ted to Jaime.
I really like the episode where Booster and Bats go back in time to spend one last day with Ted. They bicker but in the end work together, making Ted super happy to see both his best friends getting along. It was very sweet.
"There was more anger in the transition..." No kidding. I think it reached its zenith (or nadir depending on your pov) with the infamous "F*** Batman" in the Titans show.
The ending with Batman giving him the name Nightwing always bothered me, even as a kid.
Two other little things that I noticed and bothered me about the episode are some continuity inconsistencies in the opening flashback. For example they have Kanjar Ro in the training simulator, even though chronically no one should know who he is yet, until the series premier. Same with Plastic Man, as he is shown in the League lineup quickly, even though O'Brian doesn't become Plastic Man until later. Which you can tell by his origin, because Batman is wearing his main costume, instead of the old one from this flashback.
I'd just take it as them reusing character designs like how the DCAMU does it a lot of civilian characters looking like characters from young justice.
@@kermitgotthesickkicks4265 I suppose that is the reason why. But it was always just a little thing that annoyed with this brief part, little tiny canon inconsistencies. Besides that it's a fun episode.
@@symbiote42 Oh absolutely agreed.
Dick is one of the very few side kicks who went on to be their own hero not only that someone who can or come very close to being as good or great as their predecessor, at least, in my opinion, and reading night wing and Batman comics
I was literally re-watching this episode when this video posted
Talia is really making her way through the entire Bat family.
Hey Sasha - the episodes of the Brave and the Bold that stick out for me are the Doom Patrol and Red Tornado.
Brave and the Bold and Green Lantern were favorites of my daughter and we'd watch them together - I was the odd Dad who wanted to know what his kids were watching was age appropriate.
She was crying up a storm at the end of both of those episodes.
Loved this B&B episode, wish it had Kid Flash.
Next to Chill Of The Night, Sidekicks Assemble episode is one of my favorite BATB episodes of the series! It’s very good! I also really love the Deadman episode.
Could you cover one of the Booster Gold episodes? Specifically the one where he tries to prevent Ted's death. It would be awesome to learn about the comics it takes inspiration from.
so... when will we get a video about the BatB episode which essentially is an animated version of a Fanfiction Alfred wrote...?
(yes, this is a thing, and this was the first animated appearance of damian wayne, too)
I would have loved to hear an exchange between Aquaman and Aqualad...
Aqualad: "You still dress me in swim shorts!"
Aquaman: "We live in the sea with water-based powers. I only dress this way because the land dwellers modesty hang-up."
Great analysis. You are always so clear when describing complicated continuity.
I love this series because it does not take itself too seriously, which is why I like the name joke by Batman. Does it undermine Dick's "evolution"? Yes, which, I think, is fairly consistent. It can be serious, but usually returns back to funny. Gotta keep it light.
God do I love this version of Aquaman! I know it will never be seen anywhere else.
Besides, Batman is not going to change overnight.
Age ain't nothing but a number to the Alghul family.
I fondly remember the afternoon of my childhood when I bought the latest issue of 'The New Teen Titans' off the rack at my local grocery store & seeing Nightwing's debut. Yes, the OG costume looked VERY "Disco"!
Please make a video on the Young Justice comic! 🙏🙏🙏
I have a love/hate relationship with the fact that the 'Big Beats' of the Batman story are laid out.
I'm so happy I discovered your channel. Thank you for the consistently good content!
Robin flirting with Batman's foe/love interest was probably started as a thing by Milton Caniff back in the 30s and 40s, in the very popular and successful Terry and the Pirates comic strip. Terry Lee was originally a kid who followed Pat Ryan around China on various adventures, who had all the ladies after him. Dragon Lady being Pat's most famous love interest.
Terry grew up in the strip, Pat mostly leaves the series during WW2 when, now young adult, Terry became a pilot in China. Pat joining the Navy if memory serves. But Caniff's only aged the teen girl characters that Terry had met while a boy and didn't age the adult female characters. This allowed Terry to romance the Dragon Lady himself when he finally ran into her again.
Caniff had a thing about aging his male characters while not aging or more slowly aging the women in his series. You saw this in his Steve Canyon comic strip as well.
Nightwing will Forever be one of my favorite Superheros of all Time!!!
you are the only person making Brave and the Bold content and I appreciate it!
Should I be concerned that the first thing I thought was, “Did Sasha get new bookshelves?” 😳
Your hair is stunning and like how it matches your shirt. And i appreciate your channel cause my comic knowledge goes up
They should have had him be able to fly when the wind caught his collar, kind of like the flying nun.
It's actually pretty funny that not only did he don the disco costume well after Disco was over, but that costume lasted for almost ten years (and went through a 90stastic update in 92) before settling into the look he has right now, ironically when 70's nostalgia was in full swing.
His current costume definitely looks sharper, but I do think it has the unfortunate side effect of making him look more out of place in larger scale superhero battles, and dare I say "naked" (Which says a lot considering the original Robin costume)?
I have loved Nightwing as a character since I bought the Tales of the Teen Titans issue from The Judas Contract storyline where he premiered. (I also remember buying the Man-Bat issue you mentioned. Yes, I'm old. :) )
My thoughts exactly. I really don't think any Batman show really understands Dick's transition from Robin to Nightwing. They always over-involve Batman by having him come uo with the name or the costume, or absolve him of their disagreement.
I wouldn't say the 90s show involved batman that much in comparison to the comics.
Robin + Disco + Batman = Nightwing
Comic books have never been for kids. No matter what era. There's a ton of adult themes.
i think that Anya Taylor-Joy might be portraying the Frankie Raye version of Nova (one of Galactus' other Heralds).
Beau Garrett portrayed a version of Frankie Raye in "Fantastic Four: The Rise of the Silver Surfer" (2007).
🙂
There should be a Bruce drinking Graysons milkshake Meme or panel he does it all the time lol
Ah the Discowing suit 😂
As i got older i realies i had indeed become a square.
Want to see the disco suit? Read Batman 66 meets Wonder Woman 77.
It also makes a complete hash over why Robin became Nightwing.
Disco wing was so confusing to me as a kid. I had seen Batman TAS and then the Teen Titans tv show and they only had one nightwing design. I went back to read the comics and I was like who is this guy getting ready to go a party in 70s. haha
You do such a good job on these!
Discowing. I never thought about that. The super high collar thing was so common in comics back then I never even questioned it. But being a teenage boy I paid more attention Starfire's costume. But I absolutely hated Jerico's look.😅
Can we take a moment to appreciate the use of the better adult Robin costumes from Brone Age Earth 2?
Always
Disco Wing always hurt my brain. The collar in particular.
I love disco suit personally
Re him being stuck in a rut: I wasn't reading at the time New Teen Titans first appeared so don't have the attachment to the character that others do. But I've always found him the most interesting when he fill in for Batman . Having to embrace a destiny he's done his best to avoid is interesting.
Was never that keen on him and Babs as a couple because they're a safe bet and always seemed better as just friends. But them together in the current run does work okay because it does turn out to be better than having a love interest who won't stick around because we can't change the status quo.
I got mentioned in a video! Yay!!!!! straightens glasses, I mean, very good video as always. Completely agree
8:09 Oh my god, this scene looks like you put a fish-eye lens over Ra's al Ghul's head.
Nightwing, bah! [Spit upon the ground]
Dick Grayson is Robin. The only Robin. Forever.
Love your channel. I would love to see your take on the 2006 Batman Confidential story line from issues 17-21
Happy Valentine’s Day Casually Comic
Can I use the disco stone?
You said that in the comics when Dick first appears wearing the Nightwing suit he is presenting it to his teammates. But I'm pretty sure that when he first appears wearing it, the rest of the Titans have already been captured by Deathstroke, Terra and the H.I.V.E. The people that are there to see Dick's new costume for the first time are Deathstroke's wife (ex-wife?) and her son, Jericho. That's why you have the page split into two panels - one of the new Nightwing, and the other of Mrs. Deathstroke introducing her son, Jericho, in his costume (who would go on to join the Titans).
You know, there is a hero that deserves a lot of attention. For many reasons, a hero who helped make the muffler accessory a common piece of hero suits, the hero who was a hero in both fiction and reality. Kamen rider. Yes I get you focus on DC, however, kamen rider is an incredibly important character to the history of entertainment.
Yes, that Jason Todd defilement by Talia also lives rent free in my head. If someone starts a support group I’ll be there!
I love how this episode is bringing together the past 5 or so. Episodes that you've done absolutely fantastic
There are much worse superhero costumes than “discowing”. I dig it.
said this b4 but i would like to see a video exploring the 9 things FOX didn’t want on the 90’s batman animated series and how the crew applied them
Starfire did to Dick Grayson what Batgirl couldn't.
I liked that they used the Earth 2 Robin costume for the grown-up Dick Grayson before he became Nightwing. But, yeah, that wasn't my favorite version of the character or the depiction of the transition. The comics did it best the first go-around I think. I grew up with the DCAU so that still holds up for me, but as others have mentioned, I too, am not a fan of any Bruce/Barbara romance. Blech! I'd have loved to see more of The Batman's Neighing. I enjoyed that episode. I liked Teen Titans 2003 quite bit as well so seeing Nightwing appear on that (as well as when he was Red X) was a welcome surprise.
As a kid in the 90s, I wasn't a fan of Nightwing's disco costume.
I can't remember if the first time I saw the black suit with the blue design was on a comic cover or the fourth season of Batman TAS, but I took to it right away.
It kind of reminded me of Spider-Man's black and white suit, the stripped-down aesthetic with the symbol in the middle of the chest and back.
There's very little about the New 52 that I like(d), but Nightwings black and red variant suit with the spikes that Batman's gloves have is definitely one thing I liked. I'd always use that skin in the first Injustice game.
I feel like Sasha just walked in the living room one day, saw her daughter watching Batman BatB on Max, and just went, “Yeah I can make some content off this” 😂
"I'm leaving you, Batman... and I'm taking the BatButt with me!"
I theorize that Marv Wolfman felt the name fit the Character, but had felt he had to acknowledge that it came from elsewhere in the cannon. But the way he did it was smooth.
I really liked the Nightwing and Flamebird stories, essentially Batman and Robin in a Kryptonian setting. I always wanted to see more of those stories, but I guess it's not going to happen.
Ironically, I JUST re-watched this episode of Brave and the Bold a couple of days ago, so it's still pretty fresh in my mind. I thought parallel storylines was done well, even re-using some of the same dialogue. But it did bother me that Talia was the one who seemed to be the final push for Robin to come into his own, and that Batman himself came up with the Nightwing name. That's just not right.
Very cool video. I discovered your channel yesterday and I binged a few of these.
It could be interesting to analyse the growing pain episode ( i'm not sure if it is this one to be honest) and see how Nightwing origins are different ? Anyway really interesting video