Maybe just an veiled insult... The marketing department would not them call customers backward for not buying their new EVs. You know how abusive and smug lefties are?
I can see that young people might mostly have been brainwashed into adoration of EVs. The ones with rich and generous parents might get them and learn from experience how much they were misled.
Older drivers can't afford them either. We need basic, cheap transport not tech laden monsters. It will certainly be an interesting few years in the run up to the cut off dates. So far manufacturers have failed to produce affordable cars.
The best selling car in the world last year was an EV… and they are selling at a significantly faster rate this year than last year…. How do you not consider that to be mainstream…?
Imagine you're 19, your GF is horny, you want to scoot over there but your battery is empty. "Sorry, my battery is empty". 20min later.. "Yeah, mine as well".
@@Audioremedy0785 _"nicer to drive"_ That's a matter of opinion. As far as cheaper to run, wait till you have a problem with it. Enjoy the depreciation and insurance costs.
Absolutely. It was always the intention but only the last few years have they shown their true colours. These things always have to reach a point where it can no longer be hidden.
Exactly, a well looked after Corolla will see many new cars off into the junk yard. In fact in 30 years your Corolla will probably see 6 EVs to the junker.
It still is.. i dont understan the drama here, Fiat has never stoped making the 500 with a petrol engine. the oinly thing now is that they are updating the Petrol 500 to the new look of the EV 500.. this is a non story
@@kebabgud Here in Canada we had the 300 and 500 ICE vehicles. The 300 was a puny 2 door and the 500 a larger 4 door. The 500 model is 2023, no 2024s are being imported imported. The E500 is a 2 door model that is exactly the same size and shape as the 300 model. The only model now sold here. So it seems they stuck an electric motor and battery in the 300 series and called it a E500 for Canada.
It also started out as a very small city car. It's now the size of a small SUV. A friend has an old abarth... Every time I see it I'm a bit shocked how tiny it is.
@@mikepickford1a friend owns a 1959 Fiat Abarth Record Monza Zagato its amazing like driving a skateboard through the twisties still a potent machine 65 years old I can’t imagine an EV version being close to that much fun or surviving that long
@@mikepickford1 A shoe horn is standard equipment so you can shoe horn yourself into it. The 300 series is even smaller. I could put a Fiat 300 in the trunk of my Elantra to use it as a spare.
Small city EVs are a fail in USA. One reason - No garage. NYC has near zero EVs; no garages to charge at. Dah. Do what Seattle did & start putting chargers on city streets? Are you going to let only EVs park on a spot for charging on the street - its illegal; the streets were paid for with gas taxes; to try and change use is called conversion - an illegal action. So you have chargers but petrol cars parked there? Oh well; oh are they the private Standard Tesla type DC charging no, they're slow chargers. Net Xi Bro's pushing this transition are too stupid to admit it just doesn't work. Now charge cables are stolen for the copper.
@@robertkubrick3738electric has also Amperage! Yes if you take 2 phase 240V in America you have the voltage to charge but no amperage! Does not work and as such has never been build anywhere
@@videocanonuser Is the first time your preconception of EVs has been challenged? Check out the amount of energy required to make an EV, and the amount of use it takes to offset this.
The young drivers don't even realize that they have to pay back student loans. You expect them to know anything about cars? They don't, that's why they are so easy to sell on a Battery car, that and Ooh, shiny!
A guy in work's daughter got an electric 500. It didn't do the mileage they claimed it would and, after a month dropped dead. It got towed to Fiat who told her she'd blown the battery by using fast chargers. They claimed she owed them, she countered that she wasn't informed she shouldn't just use these things and managed to leave the thing with them getting her money back. She's got no off road parking or charger at home so couldn't give the thing a full eight hours on trickle charge. She then bought a petrol Hyundai!
@@Audioremedy0785 But, at best, Tesla cars run on nuclear power and rapidly depreciating batteries. Inverter-based grid resources (wind and solar) follow, not dictate, the AC waveform provided by grid-run turbines; when voltage drops during an outage, a PV installation makes grid start-up more challenging. The scientist, Tesla, gave us the AC power grid, not the challenge of mining and battery manufacturing and recycling.
The e500 not selling isn't an EV problem, its a 32k GBP for a Fiat 500 problem. Seriously, on what planet did Fiat think a 500 was worth mid tier premium car money? What were they smoking? I want some...what I don't want is to spend 32k on a Fiat 500.
This 100%. It’s funny that despite this being the obvious reason for this issue, Mguy doesn’t mention it. He just settles on ‘oh it must be because the EV market is struggling despite overwhelming data that confirms that this is not the case’.
@@Audioremedy0785just like how you're on every comment evangelizing EVs when you have another car that's an ICE. You do realize most people can't afford two cars?
I'm astonished how Francois has been surviving as CEO of Fiat as in my view he never figured out the brand and what it stood for...only a price comparison of the ICE 500 with the 500e would convince any 5 year old that the 500e was addressing an entirely different clientele
Capitalism is the freedom to choose. Communism is mandates for the greater good. It's insane to ban sub 99g/km ICE engines as they're cleaner than EVs and not everyone has a driveway to charge an EV.
There's no way any country could have all electric cars. The grid won't handle those kinds of demands, people will go broke because of depreciation and repair costs, and the highway will be littered with dead cars from people who had to make a long road trip but didn't calculate the 2% incline they had to drive on.
People also are not even factoring in the fragility of the electrical grid. You get an ICE storm anywhere in North America you can have areas with no Electricity for a week.
I don't want a "far more advanced package" I want a robust and affordable car that is convenient to operate and will last a long time. "Far more advanced packages" are for people with more money than sense who've been brainwash by marketing spin.
You make a 20 to 30 thousands of Euros Fiat 500, for 100km to 200km of range and sales are bad? But why? 😂😂😂😂😂😂🤑 Even If someone likes EVs, we are not made out of money. You can get an old model with 1/4 of the price or less. And go to work and back just fine.
Yeah. It’s kind of the point that he deliberately swerves in the video (as it’s totally logical). It’s a rubbish EV. The fact it has not caught on has nothing do with demand for EVs as a whole. People would rather get a second hand Tesla than one of these.
@@stevenmitchell7830 because you have an abstract fear of nice cars 🤣 I love those videos online of EV haters actually driving one and watching their eyes light up. It’s the difference between hating on something because you don’t understand it and deciding how you feel about something by experiencing it.
This starts to be a little bit ridiculous and it is only beginning. Don't get me wrong, small city EV cars make A LOT of sense, but not for 30k euro with poor charging time and range. I wonder which company will be next to announce "shocking" return of ICE version of some model. In my country (Czech, in EU), Stellantis decided to sell small and cheap family VANs (Berlingo, Partner, Rifter) only as EV models two years ago. They re-introduced ICE versions of those vehicles month ago, because literally no one bought 35k euro small family VAN with range of 200km (150 miles) on highway and 40 minutes of charge. So it is already happening but so far only on local markets.
After having travelled to several old cities in EU I have never really understood how are you supposed to charge an EV over there? There are lots of old buildings and historical streets in tight spaces meaning no charging stations can be built. Even to this day all of the small cars are still petrol, people who live there use scooters and bikes making something like a Model 3 Tesla way too big even.
EVs should have always been targeted at small cheap city keys, instead of ICE replacements. The sensible thing would be to let both exist together, and slowly being the infrastructure up to speed. EV City cars help keep local emissions down, while ICE can be used to keep the country running elsewhere. The glut of expensive SUV EVs is just crazy.
I don't get these small hybrids. I got one as a courtesy car. 1L gutless engine and the hybrid didn't seem to work. It was only when I went up a long steep hill and had to change down and floor it that the battery kicked in. It didn't last to the top of the hill. When I had to put something in the boot there was the battery. In the space the spare wheel should of been. About the size of a laptop and maybe 3 times as thick. What is the point? An overtaking battery on a gutless engine. Just put a 1.6 in the front and junk the battery and electric motor. It's just a toy.
@josephberrie9550 Oh no! The youtube grammer police. You must be so proud of yourself. Well if you're going to write ffs shouldn't you write it properly too? Or were you unable to spell a 4 letter word?
In the UK the Mini EV is £43,000 and that is the basic model. The beautiful JCW top of the range is £36,000. No content. Depreciation on the EV is 50% after the 1st year. Depreciation on the JCW is 15% after 1 year. Which one will you go for?
That is not to say all manufactures see things that way. Citroen hav a new city car for £25K with a cheaper version with a smaller battery arriving soon.The Mini is made by BMW so expect a premium price.
@@videocanonuser 25k GBP is still too expensive. And a smaller battery also means that it takes longer to charge the same amount of km. And then you still pay more per 100km at the standard DC charger than at the petrol station.
@@gordonsheridan3143 while I agree that small EVs are overpriced, £43k is much much more than a basic Mini. A basic Cooper e on their website is £31k (still too much for what it is)
The biggest problem is charging, especially when you live in an apartment and no parking or charging point, so why you buy an EV, just like in Australia.
Progressives want to put all their pets into one box, not realising that they are all incompatible. They want you driving EVs but also want you living in apartments, while also installing solar panels (which you can't because you live in an apartment) and relying on renewable energy (which you can't because it isn't reliable).
Depends on how good the infrastructure is around you. I've got a lot of cheap slow chargers around me at places like grocery stores, gyms and parks so charging is not much of an issue for me.
Said it ages ago.. the big companies will saying what ever the government wants about going totally EV to avoid any penalties and collect subsidies, but behind the scenes they will keep their options open, Then later they can say the reason they are still producing ICE cars is so that they won’t go bust, because they have a legal responsibility to their shareholders to protect the company.
"Slower than anticipated uptake of electric cars in Europe" ... Do they not do any market research? Don't they ask customers what they might like in a car? Or were they assured by Von Der Leyen that people would be forced to buy them?
Nah they're making excuses for why their overpriced city car is not selling while the rest of the market keeps growing. The thing costs 32k. I can get a used Model S for 30k
People are tired of many things which is why in UK we can see a new Government setting out their progressive policies on TV this morning during the State Opening of Parliament.
In one of your other videos you stated that the infrastructure of the power companies cannot support the charging of EV'S and we would be paying higher rates for electricity. That has to be the understatement of the century! I live in Commifornia where the state has mandated the switch to EV'S. With the poor condition of our grid, resultant wildfires caused by the grid, and trying to upgrade the grid, our electricity rates are up 42% from two years ago. CPUC just authorized rate increases. The average Joe is already paying for the upgrade of the grid to cover this! We are being fleeced by our government and the utility companies.
The so called "wild" fires are not as we are told. Research YT channels "Brush Junkie", "Hawaii Real Estate" and other channels about the Lahaina fire and many other fires.
As Fiat are ceasing production of the current petrol 500 this year, I decided to order a petrol 500 Abarth 695. 5 months later, I am still awaiting delivery but apparently although the car is in the country, it cannot be delivered at the moment due to the ridiculous quota/ percentage rules. Will any company survive this nonsense? ML
The US has long had a bigger is better mindset consistently exploited by their automakers. The Suez crisis that spawned the mini didn’t affect the US at all.
If a petrol car runs out, it's an inconvenience to go and get a Jerry can of fuel from the petrol station. When an EV runs out of charge it's an all up lift. Know a woman who has one of those Fiat EVs. She's a bit of a ditz and has run out of charge a number of times and been stranded.
Do you know that there is a „Jerry can“ also for EVs? You can buy them in the same size as the gas one and it will last 20km. Ok not the same range but enough to get to the next charger of any kind
@@kgfgfg1 I had a laugh, did google search of these "EV jerry cans". On the "SparkCharge" website they said a battery was 73 Ibs! You ain't goin' down the road lugging these things to be filled. Another curious observation is that the website was giving values for charge times...etc...assuming you are using them in a 4 battery stack. What are they trying to hide? Are they supposed to be used as a stack? If so, that's 292 Ib jerry can.
I spent an evening watching who were driving the Tesla’s into a charging station parking lot, and they certainly were young, and looked like they were all in the Tech industry, the person on the other end of the line when you phone IT at work.
electric scooters make a lot of sense as BEVs. Easy to carry around, cheap and more comfortable than a bicycle. Especially for small distances, "the last mile" or simply roads where motor vehicles are forbidden. Quality management would be very important though.
@@ferrumignis They're much smaller, so much less of a problem. We also have batteries in laptops and phones. Battery problems are strongly related to scale. These scooters are sold without subsidie, because at that scale some people prefer the convenience of an electric scooter. And if it doesn't work you can always revert to manual propulsion until you can recharge. Not an option with a car. Some governments have quota's on car manufacturers where they have to sell at least, say, 30% EV's. If you buy one of the scooter manufacturers maybe you can include their numbers in the quota.
Here, in Japan, I'm sure that I see the new ICE Fiat 500s on the road already and they seem popular. One of my clients has one and I joked with her that I had one 40 years ago!
My reaction to his statement - 'Show me the data'. The notion that younger drivers, who typically have the least disposable income AND for whom car insurance is normally higher than that for older drivers, are the ones propping up new EV sales, is frankly ludicrous. Older drivers may well be 'rejecting' EV's, but that's largely because they're; not stupid, do their homework and are less likely to spend their hard-earned cash on impractical solutions or passing fads.
Diesel car manufacturers faced massive class action law suits due to small false claims on emissions. What will happen to EV manufacturers who are claiming zero emissions when people finally wake up to the fact that EV's are NOT zero emission and in fact have higher emissions than IC's?
AH the Fiat 500. Nice little car, great for european cities, even older ones! Not sure how they believe that 100% EV is possible yet. For that the charging needs to be there too. In many villages HOME CHARGING a car on the street on the ROAD SIDE Is forbidden because the cable... but if you don't have parking close to the actual house how the hell are you supposed to charge it?
😂Old people are often the ones buying new cars. I've never bought a new car because I don't like cheaply made eco-boxes. I usually buy cars when they're about 1/4 to 1/3 of the new price. My previous car was even bought from a guy who inherited the car from his dad and lasted me for 15 years.
anyone willing to pay >30000 € for such a crappy car needs to see a doctor. the funny thing is that the original 500 (which is a cool car) was meant to serve as cheap option for people and served its purpose.
"Doctor, I want to buy a shitty electric car for €30,000." "I see. Have you ever had these kinds of thoughts before?" "No, not really. I just woke up and felt like I had to do something." "For what?" "The environment." "I see. Is the environment in the room with us now?"
@@Biosynchro funny, actually I think there are a lot of people who can be diagnosed with delusion, which used to be indeed a reason to go to the doctor, but now it is the new norm. It is not just the EV, it extends to many other topics...
Young drivers don't want EVs either! I'm 29 and I own a well-maintained 2007 Peugeot 107, with the trusty Toyota 1KR-FE engine, as my first car. One of the best used cars you can buy, let me tell you. It's even got plenty of oomph due to its lightweight (~850kg)! 💗👍
As soon I got older I found I have responsibilities like taking care of my family and not losing my job, I need to think economically because money need to be earnt. I also found I do not like being exposed to the unknown any more. So older people turning their back is completely normal.
I love the 500. We had a Twinair 105 a few years ago and it was the most fun car I've ever driven. The EV version might be very nice but it has a poor range, the hybrid might be a good balance but it's S-L-O-W. Bring back the petrols, and I don't mean the sluggish 1.2!
The market will dictate, not politicians, because they are easily voted OUT if the consensus dictates that. If the government want to play hard ball, then car companies might just walk and let the government take on the task of making cars, but the public may again refuse to buy them, so checkmate.
@@videocanonuser Bullshit. Any company can and will stop producing if they are not making a profit and no government will change that fact. People said Nissan would never stop making cars in Australia, but they did, and they packed up and went home. And they were not the only ones. Now in 2024 we have no car companies producing cars in Oz after almost a century of car production. As for lawful commands, dream on. Pollies will do what it takes to get re-elected and don't want an angry public or industries who will fight back and get them out of office. Climate change is a distant second to the almighty dollar and that will always be the case. The world revolves around money and power.
Whilst driving today to a railway station in the afternoon and driving back home ( about 15-20 minutes each way I saw 3 electric vehicles. This was in Sydney Australia.
Europe will NEVER be all-electric, let alone by 2035. If they stick with the current legislation, it will become like the GDR/Cuba, where used cars exceeded the price of new ones, and people keep old vehicles running for decades (and even old ecoboxes will become desirable if they have a petrol engine).
It is the same with ICE cars. Many people keep driving the old ones because nobody wants to deal with all that Euro6 crap and the ridiculously expensive repairs.
My opinion is that instead of today's big, complicated, high-performance cars, in which a lot of often unnecessary systems are built, we should move towards small, relatively limited engine power, light cars. In most cases, it is enough to go at max 130-150 km/h, which can be achieved with a light 1.3 liter or even smaller ICE engine, with a relatively light 1000 kg small car, using 4-5-6 liters/100 km of fuel. These would be relatively cheap, accessible to people, and people would have private transportation with relatively low emissions. Even in America, 90% of people do not need 6-7 meter long and 2.5 meter high trucks for daily transportation with 1-2 people. Cheap, simple, relatively limited engine power, easy to repair cars, supported by significant tax breaks, so that people voluntarily buy them instead of the F150 and similar unnecessarily large cars. And we should also introduce the Japanese Kei-car concept in the cities.
@@michaelkilbride2927And all the other superminis in it's class; Polo, Fiesta, Corsa, 208 etc. City cars like the VW UP, Suzuki Celereo, Smart ForTwo/FourFour and the Fiat 500 take this a step further.
As someone working in IT when something is "Advanced" it means there are more things to maintain and break down all while being hard to repair. That's why I drive a 23yo car
Yeah, I know what you mean and right you are. It's just that spare parts can become a problem with cars that old. I have a 2006 Corolla and afaik spares are not (yet) a problem.
Not this model and maybe not even made on the same platform. Peugeot is heavily invested in EVs and Fiat is part of the same Stellantis group. So it may be based on a Peugeot platform. If the petrol version will be a 1.2 3-cylinder, better stay away from that as well because it will be that awful Peugeot engine.
How many of the commenters here know what a catalytic converter does? You might be surprised! It takes unburnt fuel vapour and CO (carbon monoxide) and converts it into CO2 (carbon dioxide)! Any takers on how we ended up here now?
When I was younger back in the 80's we used to buy cars and motorbikes and compare performance, handling, mpg, and the like...I cannot remember anyone bringing up the topic of how far they could drive between fill ups...maybe it is the chosen topic of ICE owners as it is their only advantage....comparing the performance and fuel economy of a fossil car with the 308/530 BHP BYD Seal would be a bit embarrassing.
The Fiat 500 that they imported into the U.S. previously made a big splash initially, until people realized they were just piles of junk. Unfortunately the Italians aren't renowned for their vehicle reliability, and they sure haven't helped Chrysler and Jeep since taking over.
Got a text from my power company yesterday (Massachusetts Usa) to not use any unnecessary power due to the heat wave. Good thing we have very few evs to suck the grid down.
The only proble with fiat 500 is it is too expensive and a little too short range, but mainly the price is an issue. It would be great car for the city but there is no adequate infrastructure in the cities
"Older drivers..." Is that anyone over the age of 17?
Anyone who has had a reliable petrol car in their life.
Maybe just an veiled insult... The marketing department would not them call customers backward for not buying their new EVs. You know how abusive and smug lefties are?
@@mikepickford1 Like Republican Elon Musk and his EVs... 🤣
16
@@maxhugen I do not like everything about him, but I like his free speech ideas.
I don't know any young people with an ev. They can't afford them!
I can see that young people might mostly have been brainwashed into adoration of EVs. The ones with rich and generous parents might get them and learn from experience how much they were misled.
Exactly. I think EVs have a place as cheap, urban runabouts. Not outrageously expensive, massive, luxury SUVs.
Older drivers can't afford them either. We need basic, cheap transport not tech laden monsters. It will certainly be an interesting few years in the run up to the cut off dates.
So far manufacturers have failed to produce affordable cars.
It's all lies. No truth can be found in media.
They'd much rather have the latest mobile phone.
What drugs were they on to think these useless things will ever be mainstream.
Enforced woke moralism. d
ESG laced with SC (stakeholder capitalism).
They are attacking ALL personal transport…they don’t even want you to have useless Ev’s
The best selling car in the world last year was an EV… and they are selling at a significantly faster rate this year than last year…. How do you not consider that to be mainstream…?
They were given brown envelopes by the politicians to push them because of the WEF rules.
Young drivers also don't want EVs. They're waking up too.
Imagine you're 19, your GF is horny, you want to scoot over there but your battery is empty.
"Sorry, my battery is empty".
20min later..
"Yeah, mine as well".
Being young, they were sucked in, by *"it does zero to 100 in x seconds."* No matter, most people learn from their mistakes. 😎
On what basis? That they are selling in record numbers?
@@maxhugen‘it’s fast, nicer to drive and much cheaper to run’.
@@Audioremedy0785 _"nicer to drive"_ That's a matter of opinion. As far as cheaper to run, wait till you have a problem with it. Enjoy the depreciation and insurance costs.
the EU is the new Soviet Union
🎯
Absolutely. It was always the intention but only the last few years have they shown their true colours. These things always have to reach a point where it can no longer be hidden.
Always has been
Yes, their anti-free-market 5-year-plan is failing already.
@@Chopper650 bit Hyperbolic lol
Thought of the day …
Stay Away from EV … and keep your old ICE Corolla as long as you can.
Exactly, a well looked after Corolla will see many new cars off into the junk yard. In fact in 30 years your Corolla will probably see 6 EVs to the junker.
Dang.. I do not have a Corolla. I'll keep look after my cars though.
17 year old Corolla here! Hell yeah, I'm keeping that thing until the paint falls off.
@@eyerollthereforeiam1709 new paint job will be cheaper than replacing batteries in an EV.
2006 Corolla owner here. Still going strong.
The EU will be forced t change its mind
You're wrong. Communists never admit mistakes
@@maxlunatic6545
They are more Fascist than Communist
The EU doesn’t realise that it is not the world.
@@nickjames5366
The EU don't care though
They will dig their heels in and coerce us even more
Stating off by insulting their customers, good job Fiat 💩
They took lessons from Hollywoke.
And they probably still wonder why hardly anybody buys their cars anymore 😂
they're trying to one-up themselves inventing the most ugly car ever.
Multipla was just a test run.
Fiat 500 was petrol powered in the first place.
He said that.
It still is.. i dont understan the drama here, Fiat has never stoped making the 500 with a petrol engine. the oinly thing now is that they are updating the Petrol 500 to the new look of the EV 500..
this is a non story
@@kebabgud Actually no. They wanted the new model to be electric only, but now it will be available with ICE. This is a story.
@@kebabgud Here in Canada we had the 300 and 500 ICE vehicles. The 300 was a puny 2 door and the 500 a larger 4 door. The 500 model is 2023, no 2024s are being imported imported. The E500 is a 2 door model that is exactly the same size and shape as the 300 model. The only model now sold here. So it seems they stuck an electric motor and battery in the 300 series and called it a E500 for Canada.
@@kebabgud They are only selling the hybrid version at the moment.
The Fiat 500 started out as a petrol car, why did they chnage it to EV only? That's a mistake that shouldn't take tbh
It also started out as a very small city car. It's now the size of a small SUV. A friend has an old abarth... Every time I see it I'm a bit shocked how tiny it is.
@@mikepickford1a friend owns a 1959 Fiat Abarth Record Monza Zagato its amazing like driving a skateboard through the twisties still a potent machine 65 years old I can’t imagine an EV version being close to that much fun or surviving that long
they removed the remaining two cylinders from the engine
To quote the Italian Captain Bertorelli in 'Allo 'Allo: "Whatta mistake-a ta make-a!"
@@mikepickford1 A shoe horn is standard equipment so you can shoe horn yourself into it. The 300 series is even smaller. I could put a Fiat 300 in the trunk of my Elantra to use it as a spare.
Small city EVs are a fail in USA. One reason - No garage. NYC has near zero EVs; no garages to charge at. Dah. Do what Seattle did & start putting chargers on city streets? Are you going to let only EVs park on a spot for charging on the street - its illegal; the streets were paid for with gas taxes; to try and change use is called conversion - an illegal action. So you have chargers but petrol cars parked there? Oh well; oh are they the private Standard Tesla type DC charging no, they're slow chargers. Net Xi Bro's pushing this transition are too stupid to admit it just doesn't work. Now charge cables are stolen for the copper.
The streetlights would have to be 220v-240V which very few cities lights are in the US.
@@robertkubrick3738electric has also Amperage! Yes if you take 2 phase 240V in America you have the voltage to charge but no amperage! Does not work and as such has never been build anywhere
It doesn't help that Insurance Companies will write-off an EV for a cracked wing mirror, which has a massive impact on running costs!
Doesn't help their (already bogus) green credentials either.
@@ferrumignis in what way are green credentials bogus?
‘I don’t like EVs so I am just going to totally make something up about them’
Hail cracked the windshield on mine. I'm still driving it with a new windshield xD
@@videocanonuser Is the first time your preconception of EVs has been challenged? Check out the amount of energy required to make an EV, and the amount of use it takes to offset this.
O these youngsters buying EV's will soon face a reality check.
The youngest drivers don't know any better and just do what they are told.
🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏
They're also waking up. I know plenty of young drivers who don't have EVs and have no interest in buying one. So there's hope.
The young today are brainwashed into what to think, about everything, woke, climate change etc, but the old can still think for themselves.
I'm a young driver. I had a Golf TDI and traded it for a used e-Golf. I've driven gas and just prefer electric.
@@Luka_3D To say that, you must be a troll.
So the youngest drivers are happy with over priced cars and catastrophic depreciation?
Brainwashed
Yes the young drivers are all rushing out to buy milk floats apparently 😂
So long as their parents pay for them
Young and dumb and full of....ideology.
The young drivers don't even realize that they have to pay back student loans. You expect them to know anything about cars? They don't, that's why they are so easy to sell on a Battery car, that and Ooh, shiny!
Yet somehow these people still find their way into positions of power.
Corruption goes a long way.
A guy in work's daughter got an electric 500. It didn't do the mileage they claimed it would and, after a month dropped dead. It got towed to Fiat who told her she'd blown the battery by using fast chargers. They claimed she owed them, she countered that she wasn't informed she shouldn't just use these things and managed to leave the thing with them getting her money back. She's got no off road parking or charger at home so couldn't give the thing a full eight hours on trickle charge. She then bought a petrol Hyundai!
New education
You pay for
Imagine a car company making cars that people want to buy in this day and age.
If they remade the original Bambina I'd have one.
Crazy, ain't it. The government needs to do something about it.
Congratulations. You have just imagined Tesla.
Popularity is something that is punished by elitists these days. It's a sign of being "uneducated" if you want something that you actually like.
@@Audioremedy0785 But, at best, Tesla cars run on nuclear power and rapidly depreciating batteries. Inverter-based grid resources (wind and solar) follow, not dictate, the AC waveform provided by grid-run turbines; when voltage drops during an outage, a PV installation makes grid start-up more challenging. The scientist, Tesla, gave us the AC power grid, not the challenge of mining and battery manufacturing and recycling.
The e500 not selling isn't an EV problem, its a 32k GBP for a Fiat 500 problem. Seriously, on what planet did Fiat think a 500 was worth mid tier premium car money? What were they smoking? I want some...what I don't want is to spend 32k on a Fiat 500.
This 100%. It’s funny that despite this being the obvious reason for this issue, Mguy doesn’t mention it. He just settles on ‘oh it must be because the EV market is struggling despite overwhelming data that confirms that this is not the case’.
They are charging £17,000 for the hybrid.
@@Audioremedy0785just like how you're on every comment evangelizing EVs when you have another car that's an ICE. You do realize most people can't afford two cars?
£6.99 is too much money for shyte fiats!
I'm astonished how Francois has been surviving as CEO of Fiat as in my view he never figured out the brand and what it stood for...only a price comparison of the ICE 500 with the 500e would convince any 5 year old that the 500e was addressing an entirely different clientele
"Price" is meaningless term to the marxist elites. There's only The Government for them.
Capitalism is the freedom to choose.
Communism is mandates for the greater good.
It's insane to ban sub 99g/km ICE engines as they're cleaner than EVs and not everyone has a driveway to charge an EV.
I've never even owned a sub 99g/km car. Even my current hybrid Lexus is rated at 137g/km.
Still not too shabby for a car with a 3.5 V6.😂
An electric powered version of a car that uses stuff all fuel?
Demented.
There's no way any country could have all electric cars.
The grid won't handle those kinds of demands, people will go broke because of depreciation and repair costs, and the highway will be littered with dead cars from people who had to make a long road trip but didn't calculate the 2% incline they had to drive on.
In Norway sales of combustion engined vehicles for personal transportation are almost nil"
People also are not even factoring in the fragility of the electrical grid. You get an ICE storm anywhere in North America you can have areas with no Electricity for a week.
@@videocanonuser I was about to say that lol
I don't want a "far more advanced package" I want a robust and affordable car that is convenient to operate and will last a long time.
"Far more advanced packages" are for people with more money than sense who've been brainwash by marketing spin.
I want a simple car, dependable, with some comfort, economical, and repairable. And I don't want a smart phone car to spy on me and the neighborhood.
You make a 20 to 30 thousands of Euros Fiat 500, for 100km to 200km of range and sales are bad? But why? 😂😂😂😂😂😂🤑 Even If someone likes EVs, we are not made out of money. You can get an old model with 1/4 of the price or less. And go to work and back just fine.
Yeah. It’s kind of the point that he deliberately swerves in the video (as it’s totally logical). It’s a rubbish EV. The fact it has not caught on has nothing do with demand for EVs as a whole. People would rather get a second hand Tesla than one of these.
@@Audioremedy0785And the rest of us would rather get COVID than get a used Tesla.
@@stevenmitchell7830 because you have an abstract fear of nice cars 🤣 I love those videos online of EV haters actually driving one and watching their eyes light up. It’s the difference between hating on something because you don’t understand it and deciding how you feel about something by experiencing it.
@@Audioremedy0785 Yeah a lot of these new evs are just overpriced to shit. I can get a used Model S for 30k xD
This starts to be a little bit ridiculous and it is only beginning. Don't get me wrong, small city EV cars make A LOT of sense, but not for 30k euro with poor charging time and range. I wonder which company will be next to announce "shocking" return of ICE version of some model.
In my country (Czech, in EU), Stellantis decided to sell small and cheap family VANs (Berlingo, Partner, Rifter) only as EV models two years ago. They re-introduced ICE versions of those vehicles month ago, because literally no one bought 35k euro small family VAN with range of 200km (150 miles) on highway and 40 minutes of charge. So it is already happening but so far only on local markets.
Autocar(?) Did a review of a Nissan leaf. It cost £1,500 and had 60 mile range. For going to the shops and back it was good value
After having travelled to several old cities in EU I have never really understood how are you supposed to charge an EV over there? There are lots of old buildings and historical streets in tight spaces meaning no charging stations can be built. Even to this day all of the small cars are still petrol, people who live there use scooters and bikes making something like a Model 3 Tesla way too big even.
@@doriangray6985 Sure... While the battery lasts, then you have to pay to get someone to remove it from your driveway.
EVs should have always been targeted at small cheap city keys, instead of ICE replacements. The sensible thing would be to let both exist together, and slowly being the infrastructure up to speed. EV City cars help keep local emissions down, while ICE can be used to keep the country running elsewhere. The glut of expensive SUV EVs is just crazy.
@@doriangray6985 Until the temperature drops and 60 miles becomes 40.
My home two in Hull uk, has very little charging stations. Drivers are laying cables across the pavement. Waiting for the fines to start rolling out.
I suspect woke councils will ignore this as long as possible and mayne even start permitting it to promote the EV message.
What’s a woke council?
@@videocanonuser A council with woke policies. You genuinely found that hard to understand?
I don't get these small hybrids. I got one as a courtesy car. 1L gutless engine and the hybrid didn't seem to work. It was only when I went up a long steep hill and had to change down and floor it that the battery kicked in. It didn't last to the top of the hill. When I had to put something in the boot there was the battery. In the space the spare wheel should of been. About the size of a laptop and maybe 3 times as thick. What is the point? An overtaking battery on a gutless engine. Just put a 1.6 in the front and junk the battery and electric motor. It's just a toy.
HAVE been ffs Have been
@josephberrie9550 Oh no! The youtube grammer police. You must be so proud of yourself. Well if you're going to write ffs shouldn't you write it properly too? Or were you unable to spell a 4 letter word?
@@thehairygolfer "Should've," not "should of." 👍
Taxpayers money supporting Tesla / Jaguar ........EV junk.
In the UK the Mini EV is £43,000 and that is the basic model. The beautiful JCW top of the range is £36,000. No content. Depreciation on the EV is 50% after the 1st year. Depreciation on the JCW is 15% after 1 year. Which one will you go for?
Speaking of Fiat, I remember the Panda being sold for around 10k EUR not too long ago.
Came with 5min "fast charging" and 500km+ range.
That is not to say all manufactures see things that way. Citroen hav a new city car for £25K with a cheaper version with a smaller battery arriving soon.The Mini is made by BMW so expect a premium price.
I wouldn't buy a brand new car then sell it 1 year later....who does that?
@@videocanonuser 25k GBP is still too expensive. And a smaller battery also means that it takes longer to charge the same amount of km.
And then you still pay more per 100km at the standard DC charger than at the petrol station.
@@gordonsheridan3143 while I agree that small EVs are overpriced, £43k is much much more than a basic Mini. A basic Cooper e on their website is £31k (still too much for what it is)
At least they may not go blindly bankrupt like Jaguar.
TATA JaguAR .....
FIAT does not exist after it's last bankrupcy it became part of Stellanties together with Citroen, Jeep, Christler, Peugot and a lot of others....
Tata don't want Jaguar. Land Rover products are apparently selling better.
Audi closes the factory in Brussels where it produces electric models because there is no demand for them at all...
Yes, and them losing 20% of the market in China to BYD had absolutley nothing to do with that xD
The biggest problem is charging, especially when you live in an apartment and no parking or charging point, so why you buy an EV, just like in Australia.
Progressives want to put all their pets into one box, not realising that they are all incompatible. They want you driving EVs but also want you living in apartments, while also installing solar panels (which you can't because you live in an apartment) and relying on renewable energy (which you can't because it isn't reliable).
Depends on how good the infrastructure is around you. I've got a lot of cheap slow chargers around me at places like grocery stores, gyms and parks so charging is not much of an issue for me.
Volkswagen's E-Up is for the Yorkshire market.
Said it ages ago.. the big companies will saying what ever the government wants about going totally EV to avoid any penalties and collect subsidies, but behind the scenes they will keep their options open,
Then later they can say the reason they are still producing ICE cars is so that they won’t go bust, because they have a legal responsibility to their shareholders to protect the company.
"Slower than anticipated uptake of electric cars in Europe" ... Do they not do any market research? Don't they ask customers what they might like in a car? Or were they assured by Von Der Leyen that people would be forced to buy them?
Nah they're making excuses for why their overpriced city car is not selling while the rest of the market keeps growing. The thing costs 32k. I can get a used Model S for 30k
People are tired of unrepairable e- waste and no tax rebates
People are tired of many things which is why in UK we can see a new Government setting out their progressive policies on TV this morning during the State Opening of Parliament.
Why do you think they are unrepairable?
@@Luka_3D hard to part swap since recalibration will be needed and turnaround time won't be quick if you're in a hurry when car breaks down suddenly
@@vasudevmenon2496 What recalibration? You mean battery pack voltage balancing?
@@Luka_3D that is one. Not sure if the cameras and sensors needs recalibration depending on the car manufacturer
In one of your other videos you stated that the infrastructure of the power companies cannot support the charging of EV'S and we would be paying higher rates for electricity. That has to be the understatement of the century! I live in Commifornia where the state has mandated the switch to EV'S. With the poor condition of our grid, resultant wildfires caused by the grid, and trying to upgrade the grid, our electricity rates are up 42% from two years ago. CPUC just authorized rate increases. The average Joe is already paying for the upgrade of the grid to cover this! We are being fleeced by our government and the utility companies.
The so called "wild" fires are not as we are told. Research YT channels "Brush Junkie", "Hawaii Real Estate" and other channels about the Lahaina fire and many other fires.
And yet newsom is voted in? Looks like the majority of Californians don't mind the increase in their cost of living.
Older and wiser.
Wisdom comes with age.
💯
Well..... Wisdom *should* come with age. EVs are proof that's not always the case.
Please explain about all the politicians making these crazy decisions?
Sometimes instead of the great wisdom you get only Parkinson and dementia...
@@teolynx3805 There are no guarantees in life.
As Fiat are ceasing production of the current petrol 500 this year, I decided to order a petrol 500 Abarth 695. 5 months later, I am still awaiting delivery but apparently although the car is in the country, it cannot be delivered at the moment due to the ridiculous quota/ percentage rules. Will any company survive this nonsense? ML
Great choice, I hope it's every bit as fun as you expect when you finally get it.
Joe Biden reckons EV'S are the ducks nuts 👌
He's history
I doubt JB can reckon much of anything these days.
Biden has lost the plot.. sleepy joe is on another planet
My neighbor had a 500 here in the US, petrol version....One of only 600 sold that year in the entire USA.
The US has long had a bigger is better mindset consistently exploited by their automakers. The Suez crisis that spawned the mini didn’t affect the US at all.
A sucker born everyday 😂
If a petrol car runs out, it's an inconvenience to go and get a Jerry can of fuel from the petrol station. When an EV runs out of charge it's an all up lift.
Know a woman who has one of those Fiat EVs. She's a bit of a ditz and has run out of charge a number of times and been stranded.
does she work for he U.S. secret service
Do you know that there is a „Jerry can“ also for EVs? You can buy them in the same size as the gas one and it will last 20km. Ok not the same range but enough to get to the next charger of any kind
@@kgfgfg1 I had a laugh, did google search of these "EV jerry cans". On the "SparkCharge" website they said a battery was 73 Ibs! You ain't goin' down the road lugging these things to be filled. Another curious observation is that the website was giving values for charge times...etc...assuming you are using them in a 4 battery stack. What are they trying to hide? Are they supposed to be used as a stack? If so, that's 292 Ib jerry can.
@kgfgfg1 It will still take a lot of time to charge from one battery to the other.
@@kgfgfg1lol @ 20 km is enough to get to charger… okaaaayz
If it's for older drivers, can we have our 8 track back.
Actually I'm disappointed that some modern cars don't even have CD players. Like, what now??
YARIS GR 300HP
Awesome machine, I want one so badly 😊
OMG. Talk dirty to us! Oh yeeeeah!
I spent an evening watching who were driving the Tesla’s into a charging station parking lot, and they certainly were young, and looked like they were all in the Tech industry, the person on the other end of the line when you phone IT at work.
From petrol to EV and back to petrol ? Now that's doing things ASS backwards !
It's like purposely driving into a dead-end road and turning back.
None of my 3 tin lids own one and definitely don’t want one
They should start selling electric scooters and other small electric devices to pad their numbers and make it look like they're selling more EV's.
Electric scooters aka "incendiary devices".
electric scooters make a lot of sense as BEVs.
Easy to carry around, cheap and more comfortable than a bicycle.
Especially for small distances, "the last mile" or simply roads where motor vehicles are forbidden.
Quality management would be very important though.
@@ferrumignis They're much smaller, so much less of a problem. We also have batteries in laptops and phones. Battery problems are strongly related to scale. These scooters are sold without subsidie, because at that scale some people prefer the convenience of an electric scooter. And if it doesn't work you can always revert to manual propulsion until you can recharge. Not an option with a car. Some governments have quota's on car manufacturers where they have to sell at least, say, 30% EV's. If you buy one of the scooter manufacturers maybe you can include their numbers in the quota.
@@voswouter87 They may be smaller, but they have claimed many more house fires.
Here, in Japan, I'm sure that I see the new ICE Fiat 500s on the road already and they seem popular. One of my clients has one and I joked with her that I had one 40 years ago!
My reaction to his statement - 'Show me the data'. The notion that younger drivers, who typically have the least disposable income AND for whom car insurance is normally higher than that for older drivers, are the ones propping up new EV sales, is frankly ludicrous. Older drivers may well be 'rejecting' EV's, but that's largely because they're; not stupid, do their homework and are less likely to spend their hard-earned cash on impractical solutions or passing fads.
Mr Blackout will not be happy! 😂
Diesel car manufacturers faced massive class action law suits due to small false claims on emissions.
What will happen to EV manufacturers who are claiming zero emissions when people finally wake up to the fact that EV's are NOT zero emission and in fact have higher emissions than IC's?
Funny: Here in Germany there runs a FORD commercial before your content - new model, NOT, repeat, NOT ELECTRIC! :-))
Have you seen that hybrid Volvo that caught fire in Wigan England
no, but I see thousands for EV's on the road that have not caught fire...
GT4RS
GT3RS
NEW BUILD 6R4
NEW BUILD MK 2 ESCORT
NEW BUILD MK1 ESCORT
YARIS GR 4WD 300HP
ALL ON SALE NOW
In my Will I have asked not to be driven to the Crem in an electric hearse.
AH the Fiat 500. Nice little car, great for european cities, even older ones!
Not sure how they believe that 100% EV is possible yet. For that the charging needs to be there too.
In many villages HOME CHARGING a car on the street on the ROAD SIDE Is forbidden because the cable... but if you don't have parking close to the actual house how the hell are you supposed to charge it?
1:15 lol ''Older Drivers''
Brilliant Fiat strategy, blame
poor sales on 'old people' .
😄
😂Old people are often the ones buying new cars. I've never bought a new car because I don't like cheaply made eco-boxes. I usually buy cars when they're about 1/4 to 1/3 of the new price. My previous car was even bought from a guy who inherited the car from his dad and lasted me for 15 years.
anyone willing to pay >30000 € for such a crappy car needs to see a doctor. the funny thing is that the original 500 (which is a cool car) was meant to serve as cheap option for people and served its purpose.
"Doctor, I want to buy a shitty electric car for €30,000."
"I see. Have you ever had these kinds of thoughts before?"
"No, not really. I just woke up and felt like I had to do something."
"For what?"
"The environment."
"I see. Is the environment in the room with us now?"
@@Biosynchro funny, actually I think there are a lot of people who can be diagnosed with delusion, which used to be indeed a reason to go to the doctor, but now it is the new norm. It is not just the EV, it extends to many other topics...
Young drivers don't want EVs either! I'm 29 and I own a well-maintained 2007 Peugeot 107, with the trusty Toyota 1KR-FE engine, as my first car. One of the best used cars you can buy, let me tell you. It's even got plenty of oomph due to its lightweight (~850kg)! 💗👍
While UA-cam surfing I came across this. Racoon confused a cyber truck for a dumpster cracked me up.
ua-cam.com/video/969pwh4Mxr8/v-deo.htmlsi=HAIm8JlftGAc44PK
As soon I got older I found I have responsibilities like taking care of my family and not losing my job, I need to think economically because money need to be earnt. I also found I do not like being exposed to the unknown any more. So older people turning their back is completely normal.
I love the 500. We had a Twinair 105 a few years ago and it was the most fun car I've ever driven. The EV version might be very nice but it has a poor range, the hybrid might be a good balance but it's S-L-O-W. Bring back the petrols, and I don't mean the sluggish 1.2!
BATTERY RELACEMENT COST
NEEDS TO BE INCLUDED IN
RUNNING COSTS
Don't you just love that point in time when Truth catches up with Bullshit and then overtakes it.
The market will dictate, not politicians, because they are easily voted OUT if the consensus dictates that.
If the government want to play hard ball, then car companies might just walk and let the government take on the task of making cars,
but the public may again refuse to buy them, so checkmate.
The car companies will not walk away from their investments and will obey the lawful commands of elected governments.
@@videocanonuser Bullshit. Any company can and will stop producing if they are not making a profit and no government will change that fact. People said Nissan would never stop making cars in Australia, but they did, and they packed up and went home. And they were not the only ones. Now in 2024 we have no car companies producing cars in Oz after almost a century of car production.
As for lawful commands, dream on. Pollies will do what it takes to get re-elected and don't want an angry public or industries who will fight back and get them out of office.
Climate change is a distant second to the almighty dollar and that will always be the case. The world revolves around money and power.
Whilst driving today to a railway station in the afternoon and driving back home ( about 15-20 minutes each way I saw 3 electric vehicles. This was in Sydney Australia.
haha "older drivers". Never ever seen an elderly in a fiat 500.
Lying is the norm for government and companies. The bigger, the worse the lies.
Europe will NEVER be all-electric, let alone by 2035. If they stick with the current legislation, it will become like the GDR/Cuba, where used cars exceeded the price of new ones, and people keep old vehicles running for decades (and even old ecoboxes will become desirable if they have a petrol engine).
It is the same with ICE cars. Many people keep driving the old ones because nobody wants to deal with all that Euro6 crap and the ridiculously expensive repairs.
My opinion is that instead of today's big, complicated, high-performance cars, in which a lot of often unnecessary systems are built, we should move towards small, relatively limited engine power, light cars. In most cases, it is enough to go at max 130-150 km/h, which can be achieved with a light 1.3 liter or even smaller ICE engine, with a relatively light 1000 kg small car, using 4-5-6 liters/100 km of fuel. These would be relatively cheap, accessible to people, and people would have private transportation with relatively low emissions. Even in America, 90% of people do not need 6-7 meter long and 2.5 meter high trucks for daily transportation with 1-2 people. Cheap, simple, relatively limited engine power, easy to repair cars, supported by significant tax breaks, so that people voluntarily buy them instead of the F150 and similar unnecessarily large cars. And we should also introduce the Japanese Kei-car concept in the cities.
You just described a suzuki swift
@@michaelkilbride2927 Oh yes! The new Swift is super! I have one from 2002...
@@michaelkilbride2927And all the other superminis in it's class; Polo, Fiesta, Corsa, 208 etc. City cars like the VW UP, Suzuki Celereo, Smart ForTwo/FourFour and the Fiat 500 take this a step further.
I'm with you, just don't *make* people drive what you described. Otherwise we'll all end up with a modern day Trabant.
we have them already its called the TOYOTA AYGO and other variations
You can buy a 2 year old 500e here in UK for £11000 from a dealer, so trade price around £9000, that’s brutal depreciation.
Of course.
It's Stellantis.
As someone working in IT when something is "Advanced" it means there are more things to maintain and break down all while being hard to repair. That's why I drive a 23yo car
Yeah, I know what you mean and right you are. It's just that spare parts can become a problem with cars that old. I have a 2006 Corolla and afaik spares are not (yet) a problem.
You could not pay me to drive a Fiat 500.
Fun fact: a the petrol and a diesel version have been on sale in the EU since 2008......
Not this model and maybe not even made on the same platform. Peugeot is heavily invested in EVs and Fiat is part of the same Stellantis group. So it may be based on a Peugeot platform. If the petrol version will be a 1.2 3-cylinder, better stay away from that as well because it will be that awful Peugeot engine.
during thw 1959s my brother was driving a Fiat 500. It was lots of fun riding in that car while he was driving that roller skate around Rochester NY
Petrol version of Fiat 500 existed years before the EV, but yes, price is to high for small EV.
Young and dumb ... old and wise!
Let the market decide what it wants.
How many of the commenters here know what a catalytic converter does? You might be surprised!
It takes unburnt fuel vapour and CO (carbon monoxide) and converts it into CO2 (carbon dioxide)!
Any takers on how we ended up here now?
When I was younger back in the 80's we used to buy cars and motorbikes and compare performance, handling, mpg, and the like...I cannot remember anyone bringing up the topic of how far they could drive between fill ups...maybe it is the chosen topic of ICE owners as it is their only advantage....comparing the performance and fuel economy of a fossil car with the 308/530 BHP BYD Seal would be a bit embarrassing.
Can't wait for the Abarth!
It is the other way around. They made an EV version of the petrol version.
The problem is, it's still a fiat. You will be left stranded just as much as the EV version.
The Fiat 500 that they imported into the U.S. previously made a big splash initially, until people realized they were just piles of junk. Unfortunately the Italians aren't renowned for their vehicle reliability, and they sure haven't helped Chrysler and Jeep since taking over.
Got a text from my power company yesterday (Massachusetts Usa) to not use any unnecessary power due to the heat wave. Good thing we have very few evs to suck the grid down.
VOLVO REINTRODUCING ESTATE CAR VERSIONS OF SALOONS
But that's so they've somewhere to store the spare battery
Volvo never stopped making wagons.
The only proble with fiat 500 is it is too expensive and a little too short range, but mainly the price is an issue. It would be great car for the city but there is no adequate infrastructure in the cities
it's also ugly.
I would say 0.8 Multipla Units.
I LOVE my 2013 FIAT 500c Abarth! So much it’s my second one in a different color. Fun, efficient and a great community of owners.
If owning a electric car means you may get locked in and be unable to get out who would take a chance on that???
Isn't that just in a Tesla with their fancy door handles?
Many.
I drive the Abarth 695 and absolutely love it. Petrol ⛽️ rules vroom vroom
Ahh yes, we have the Fiat 500 over here in the States. We call it the Grand Wagoneer.
What happened is we have people in power who don't understand how the real people and world works
They do.
They understand very well.
It's just that their intentions are malicious.
If you can't see that, it might seem like incompetence.
We are 10 years behind in technology for us to meet the 2030 deadline. But politicians cannot see this.
The double whammy. One it is an EV and the 2nd is even worse being a Fiat.
PORSCHE PANAMERA HYBRID
£25,000 FOR NEW BATTERY.
LASTS 3 - 5 YEARS
Not a surprise as 500 EV cost twice the price of 500 ICE.
My two children and several of their friends all drive jdm's.
All the cars were built prior to 2004, run extremely well and hold value.
Reliable and Fiat , words that just don't go together.