Correct 5.1 & 7.1 Surround Sound Positions for Speakers
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- Опубліковано 21 сер 2024
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In this clip, audio guru Mark Edward Lewis from Cinema Sound shows us where surround sound speakers should be positioned in a room in 5.1 and 7.1 surround sound as well as how to position speakers for stereo left and right.
Learn more about how to get a Hollywood $50 million impact on your audience at www.cinemasound...
After watching this video I realized I need a new house, not new speakers :(((
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Ikr
As funny as your reply is, it is dead on. I understand what he is saying in theory but, as you already know, room size and many other factors, make that either extremely difficult or impossible.
BTW, you owe me a drink for the one I spit out after reading your reply😁😁😁
Tell me about it!
😅 haha, me too 🤭
This is all well and good as long as your lounge is the size of a football pitch.
Yeah, how many rooms can actually manage this kind of setup? Dedicated home theatre rooms maybe, but in most rooms not a chance
Such an arrangement would be wonderful if I owned a mansion, but since I live in a small frame house, I make do with setting my 7.1 speakers where I can. They work well enough for me too.
Just cam on to this cux I'm try to set up system...who in the hell had 1 couch in the middle of a room...no 1 I know...lmfao
@@TheMotscham Not even theaters have that distribution haha
Nice video, but impractical. Most people I have seen do not have the option to set the speakers up in a circle in this manner. This is where tuning the receiver for the distances comes in hand. So while this video gives a nice basic explanation of positioning, more than likely, if someone is spending money for surround, they are going to have a receiver that will compensate for speakers being at odd distances in a rectangular room, and in most cases, the receivers come with a special mic to put at the center of the listening area, and it will auto tune the speakers for you. Just think about an actual movie theater. It isn't a circle.
If you use that microphone that measure this distances that sometimes follow with the AV-receiver. I've seen NONE using this, and the surround is all madness. In most cases it is not even used as surround, but it is still in stereo with some surround-FX applied. LOL 😂
Edit: The problem with these uneven mic-measurements is that you will get into odd phase-shifts and weird sounds (filter characteristics).
Just measure to a specific point where you’re sitting from each speaker. Then said that distance in your receiver. Problem solved.
@@Foreverjazzfan Absolutely not. Have you heard how that EQs the sound. It is utter garbage doing such adjustments. Just move yourself instead.
@@rabarebra Moving yourelf is unlikely to be practical, if you have a decent sized screen, you will be atleast 10-12ft away from the screen, so to put your rear speakers equi distnance away would require a 20x20ft room (and, acoustically, a sqaure room is a bad idea). A system shouldnt ruin the sound simply by delaying the channel a few ms, I am setting my home cinema up now, but my Blu-ray has indvidual speaker delay on, and whilst I have only been using stereo til now, I have delayed the sound to get lip sync. If your receiver is ruining the sound, maybe you need to upgrade?
Agreed. Few people have a large enough room to allow equal spacing. Most rooms do not permit enough space for the surround speakers (rear and/or sides). This is where adjustments are needed via the AVR. I wish I could have a dedicated media room to setup the perfect environment and sit in the center.
There is very little professional level YT content dedicated to non-optimal room designs and are almost always geared towards people with the dedicated/perfect room (again, allowing center seating).
In a 5.1 setup the surround speakers go to your sides facing the listening position. When you move up to a 7.1 THEN you add the rear speakers, not the other way around as this video suggests.
And all your speakers don't NEED to be equal distances. Any good receiver is going to have room correction software that will measure and account for the distance of your speakers.
Agree
Cinema Sound, you mention not to put speakers on the ceiling. What about Dolby Atmos which requires that?
This is the longest conversation I've ever heard people have in Chinese 😁
room correction is a feature in the better "home theatre" systems. no pro system relies on that. if you have a good amp, you build your house around it. unless you cant pay for that, you shouldnt listen to music or watch movies on a good system. you are just not worth it
the only issue with delay is lip sync. for each foot of difference between the farthest speaker and the closest speaker there will be a 1 millisecond additional delay. the furthest speaker will fire first and then the closest speaker will fire a few milliseconds after so you hear them at the same time particularly if your rears far far away you will have lip sync issues between the front speakers and screen. your average screen has a video feed response time of 5 ms so nowadays(not input lag), it is a good idea to not have a difference speaker distance per foot more than the response time or so. I have always preferred to have my "surround" channels(which I prefer to call rears usually) about 120 degrees with 5.1. If adding "rear" for 7.1 I'd bring the surrounds to 90° and raise them up so a bit so tweeters hit all listeners and delays are more even. The correct distance between fronts to sides to rears is important, 80° like the video shows is no good better to have them at 110 so tweeters hit each listener and have rears straight behind pointing towards the center channel.
Guess you never heard of digital delay and level control have you?
In a perfect world this would be great but viewing areas often arent so cut and dry to enable this set up. For example if your normal viewing position is right up against a wall your gonna have 1 speaker way closer to you than the other. That's when you have to tweak out pot on these speakers and it becomes far more difficult.
Very well explained sir! Learned so much from watching less than 5 min video on spkr placements. Thank you!
I know this is an older video, but even processors back when this video was made account for distance and time delay so you don't need everything to be perfectly symmetrical. Your subs go where they have the best bass response. Your processor will take care of distances and delay. Of course this is assuming your run something like Dirac or Audyssey.
With a room full of furniture and a room that isn't perfectly round or square, this just isn't realistically possible. I put my speakers where I can lol
it depends on how serious you take this hobby. I worked around this problem by slowly buying my furniture around the speaker system rather than vice versa. It still doesn't look too much like a home theatre and still like a living room but it's almost as the video suggests.
Can't believe it but I have my speakers just like you said. Thanks
Can’t you just calibrate your receiver to account for a different speaker placement
Of course. But how would you do that if you didn't have a receiver that had a built in calibration protocol and microphone?
Cinema_Sound You can manually do it by measuring your distance from each of the speakers and then putting it on the receiver, and I’m pretty sure that 90% of the people watching this today will have receivers that can do either of these features And if not go on eBay and spend 50 bucks to get a new receiver that can do this
My surrounds left and right are on the back wall but way further than the surround back and up with down facing angle. And properly angled, the back ones are just facing down more and it works!!!!
A big wow...Very informative video. I was captivated by the speaker. Thank you for sharing with us such a great audio information.
Its very informative about Sound Positions for Speakers.Done well great job lets have a watch again this video.
If only i had a cinema room this would be fine
Uptading from normal two speakers to 7. 1
(This video helped me so much)
Excelente proyecto, los felicito sigan adelante, Saludos desde Venezuela.
The only way to have a center speaker sound coming directly from the screen is to have an 8k screen that only has 4k of pixels with a checkerboard of holes missing so sound can come out of it. You could have voice sounds coming directly from the mouths :)
Funny 😂
@@rabarebra Sony already invented it now it's called Acoustic Surface Audio+. The sound comes from the mouths by vibrating the screen.
@@warlockboyburns "Vibrating the screen" 😂
@@rabarebra Yes that's the technical term
@@warlockboyburns Good luck, would never buy anything like that. Wouldn't compete with any fidelity I am used to.
Whats up with the non-stop flashing advertisement/vendors?
Good video, but doesn't room correction adjust for distance\delay and levels? Like Audyssey.
Just let the receiver calibrate the listening spot and then adjust with your ear to get it just right, most homes won't work "the perfect speaker position".
@@cinema_sound5003 My friend.. Audio signals delaying is one of most common techniques in proffesional audio engineering, thats your opinion can be fairly described as urban legends of Hi-Fi maniacs..
What do you do if your listening position is back against the wall? Where do you put the back surround speakers?
great video, i learned something new, the golden triangle! maybe do something about the dipole speakers placement and the controversy between object based audio vs dipole speakers? that should help people making the right decision when buying equipment in the future. and maybe something about hires audio & speakers? too much people neglect these details, that information is gold.
nice video, straight to the point, and visual explanation
Ain't no body house furniture is set up like what you show to support a home theater. I understand it's the proper positioning to get the most outa you're surround sound but to some people(ME) it's sort of discouraging to even get a surround sound jus cause my living area could never be set up like this.
This is absolutely true. The optimal placement is really just something to aspire to. Basically, try your best to get as close to it as possible. However, unless you have a dedicated home theater room, you basically have to "make do" with what you have. That may mean one surround speaker much further away than the other, or the surrounds not quite optimally placed. The good thing is our hearing is not so accurate, and the placement in the surrounds is not so precise that things will be thrown off too much by having the speakers slightly out of alignment. Room correction in your AV receiver can generally fix any difference in speaker distance--it may not be 100%, but it will be good enough. The end result may not be "ideal", but it will be close enough to get the job done. For the most part unless you do a really horrendous job of placing the speakers or have an absolutely terrible room to work with, you'll end up with a decent outcome.
Just do the best you can. It will be good.
Our basement is sort of set up like this, with a 5.1 surround home theater setup, except that we have the side speakers on the ceiling.
I dont know anyone that has a room like this. Yes in a demonstration room were your trying to sell speakers maybe you'd be in a room like that but most people don't but with that said nice video...
I can appreciate the logic here, especially with pulling the FR-L & FR-R speakers forward to line up with the center channel... which I'll do tonight!
However, in virtually every video I've seen thus far on this subject, there exists this fantasy world where all this extra space exists behind the listening position. Not for me.
I'm like many others, who have a tiny place. My couch is right up against the damn wall. No luxury of said large room, but I still want my 7.2.2.
My surround L&R Surround are to my 9:00 & 3:00, on their own speaker stands for now, just to build the soundstage.
My Surround Backs or Atmos' (or whatever we call them) are at ear level atop the far back corners of the couch, because I haven't quite decided where they should actually be (I'm using old Bose 2001s from a galaxy far far away... drivers facing me, tweeters facing ceiling... I figured they're Direct/Reflecting design would be ideal as Atmos surrounds.)
I used the Audessey mic setup on my Marantz NR1711, & thus far it sounds pretty bad ass. But if I'm going to change the Surround Backs to Atmos Heights, what's the best location, when I'm in a small square space with very little area behind the listening position? Is it even worth changing at this point? If my environment is small, is moving those 2 going to create that big a difference? Feeling a bit to lazy to run more wiring & find an elevated mounting solution, but might try it in the future...
I just watched this video. Very well explained.
Question:
If one can’t get the the surround distance you suggest, does the electronic distance and levels adjustments in the AVR compensate for this? Thanks
it does
Absolutely Brilliant..Changed my entire experience..💯💣👍
What about the height of the surround speakers? Should they be at the ear level? Thank you!
No absolutely not they should be about 3 feet above your ear...
In a 5.1 and a 7.1 its not a magic triangle its a magic X meaning fronts are in line with the rears your center goes though the center of the x and your left and right surrounds go though the middle of that same x and your listening area is in the middle and make sure you turn your fronts and rears 30 degrees out from the wall do not make them flush with the wall this set up works well with movies music and if you have it hookup games as well.
Hope this is a better understanding, this is the exact setup i use for years just make sure your fronts and rears towers are off the floor bass hates carpet with powered subs this doest apply at all but find a good location for you sub or subs
This works with any size room in a house appartments your going to have to adjust to your environment
Not all room are equal but its a start again hope this helps
Went with Bi-polar rears and eliminated all the geometry needs. More expansive sound. Def Tech SR9040s are awesome. Just ensure your auto calibration on your receiver ignores these during setup as they confuse the AV unit.The included guide walks you through proper settings.
The best thing is keeping speakers away from the floor and placing them above ear level
My mother and stepfather put all of the speakers in the front. I'm not allowed to touch the speakers.
Superb video. Many thanks 😊
What I think sound system is the life of music. In this creative video, they have utilized it shown properly. Best of luck from heart.
very nice video! quick question what if you have a rectangular room,?should you bring the speakers closer (farther from tv) to make that perfect circle or should I just adjust the speaker levels on the receiver? also if i use height speakers, should they be directly above me or should they be in front/ behind me?
After watching this video i realized i need a new life, in which i could afford these things!
My problem Is my room no 4th wall, can't move listening position into the center of the room, only place for listening against back wall along with surround speakers
And Why don't we use floor standing speakers for are surround sound?
4:16 I thought that was my baby haha
what a nice Speakers video it is!! Greetings from my heart
A good HT receiver's setup can compensate for different distances.
The subwoofer crawl is the best way to determine the best placement for compact bass.
The speaker setup in this video is crazy
those monitors? they are designed for mixing, not for home theater usage
My room is 13' x10'........i have the tv on a 13ft wall side....the room is a rectangle....i cant figure out a good position for my 5.1 system...i know the basics...but sometimes the basics dont apply
Why not just mesure the distance to every speaker and put that in into settings on your receiver so it gives perfect levels. No "low" or "late" sounds, just great :)
@@cinema_sound5003 my basic LG Home Cinema / 3D Blu-ray has it so thought all would have it. Seems like an easy thing to put in the receiver that works out great.
Sub behind is NOT weird, it is EPIC
This is also assuming that the couch is in the middle of the room when 95% of the time its off the back wall, Id like you guys to talk about how the speakers are affected when this is the case. It is with me but I already combated this problem.I happen to have a 11.4 , 7.4.4 .But i also happen to have 4 heights which i can switch off with ceiling and front wides Thanks
@@cinema_sound5003 my room is 14 x 18. My room is all Def tech stuff, plus I review for AVS,so I have a constant influx of new gear. My AVR. Iss the Denon 6500 amps range from Emotiva to NAD. I can say its a delicate balance act making things give.
This is an excellent video!! When I finished my basement space, I ran 7.1 wiring in a layout like you show at 3:20 (with sides at 80 deg, due to layout limitations) and it is very good for side-to-side, but the rear speakers do not seem to fill in enough to shift the effect behind the listener. I wonder if I should aim the side speakers backward, to a point behind the center position a bit, to enhance the surround effect? My speakers are at mounted 90 deg to the wall so focal point is slightly in front of listener right now, so I am wondering if it is worth getting speaker mounts to allow aiming these back. A gain of 10 degrees seems like not enough to be worth it, but if focusing back a even further would help, I would consider it. (e.g. if two people sit 3 ft apart, I would aim each side speaker at the closest person, rather then a midpoint between the listeners, for about a 20 deg angle to the wall)
Another option I was considering was to investigate if my receiver could treat rear speakers to same mix as side (e.g. 5.1 mix with "dual" side speakers), and then balance the levels (side and rear) so I could create a "virtual" speaker over my shoulder (between these). However, I do not think this is doable with my Yamaha RX-V673 receiver, and perhaps the tweak in the paragraph above would be enough, and allow true 7.1 to continue to be used.
Appreciate your thoughts/experience.
What if I have a 20x20x8 a square room. I can do the even distances but people are saying that a square room is not ideal for good acoustics especially bass response. I have dual subs btw.
Wow! thank you for this very informative video!
After watching this I removed my 5.1 Audio Decoder and Converted My speaker to 2.1 (power output 600watt RMS Subwoofer and 140+140 Watt RMS Left Right Speakers). Sounds Better than 5.1 ._.
You're not getting the surround sound from 2.1.Unless you're watching movie from flash drive.
When setting up a receiver with the included mic, does it typically calibrate volume, synch, or both?
...or use the AV receiver to time correct phase for unequal distanced speakers
searched and searched for a video explaining the best way to mount my sonos system speaker for 5.1 and you guys did a great job explaining it. One question if I understand this correctly its better to the the speakers close to ear level for height vs up in the air in the corner of the room aimed down? My problem is with my open floor plan I have no outlets directly behind my couch so I can only mount them along the walls in the room.
Ok. Thanks. I think I will experiment with different heights and see how they sound before buying any kind of mounting bracket.
Time alignment is new for this guy
Almost every cinema reciever like denon Yamaha onkyo has YPAO. Doesn't the automated YPAO/mic audio calibration solve this problem entirely? Regarding different distances, delay and volume..
I'll have to refute your claim. Only models over $500 have that kind of capability. most poeple buy the cheap stuff.
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Finally someone who really understands what he is talking about... Thanks!!
Very useful video, make it more! Congratz!
Can I put my subwoofer 7 feet above the floor
Man, is 2018 and av receivers can setup distance and delay, so you dont have to place speakers in the same distance of you
Thanks Mark, that helps a lot!
think the biggest problem when you set up your home theater is the center speaker, it will never be at the same level
in height than the others ... for obvious reasons, one of these reasons is
the screen, or you put that speaker underneath or on top of the tv
Thank you for this information you are really a good person
How do you set up distance. 0 to 3 m? Which do I choose?
Great information. Thanks!
Amazing video. Thanks for sharing!
OK. You're "technique" for compensating for more than one person on the couch is wrong. What you're supposed to do (and what ALL theatres do) is raise the side fills and angle them down toward the farthest listening position. In this case, you would raise and angle the Left Side fill to point at the right end of the couch and vice versa for the Right Side fill.
Would have been nice if you demonstrated how to measure the angles for the surrounds in 5.1 and 7.1.
Yes, the side walls are raised ~20 degrees and the tweeter is angled toward the last seat in the row(s) (google search cinema surround speakers - notice how they are shaped? Actually the google search shows you in the third row exactly what they do. The back wall is also raised and angled down. Check it out next time you're in a theatre. This is to evenly distribute (as best as possible) high frequencies.
www.google.ca/search?rlz=1C1ASUM_enCA533CA533&biw=1920&bih=974&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=jl0uW8GDHZrCjgS-9oK4Cg&q=cinema+surround+speaker&oq=cinema+surround+speaker&gs_l=img.3..0j0i5i30k1.2646.5080.0.5173.23.23.0.0.0.0.153.2322.11j11.22.0....0...1c.1.64.img..1.22.2320...35i39k1j0i67k1j0i30k1j0i8i30k1j0i24k1.0.GZJsTV8uZJg#imgrc=hTDVnBopOARzgM:
awesome Correct 5.1 & 7.1 Surround Sound Positions for Speakers
we've got a U shaped couch with the right side against the wall. so i guess its impossible to have good audio for everyone. unless i would mount everything on the ceiling, but wouldnt that sound weird tho?
what if your main wall is not straight it is angled so front right left center good and the couch is center where to put the rears at a angle ? or just behind the couch.
Excellent video and very good
Thanks for the video. I have my speakers set up in this way. The question I have is, I have 2 rear speakers left & right, but when I play music the rear speakers seldom go off. What affects the rear speakers being triggered?
It would be whatever your receiver or soundbar is telling your speakers to do. You're upmixing audio and need to change it to "direct" or whatever it is called on your sound system in the EQ settings.
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What if the rooms shape does not allow for equal distances between speakers?
Most of the time it doesn't, which is why any receiver these days can be calibrated for the sweet spot
Sound travels at a speed of 330 yards per second, so I don't think that placing the surround or rear speakers one or 2 feet off is ever going to make a difference. Just turn it up! LOL.....
Very positive and inspiring SIGAN ASI EXCELENTE VIDEOS
Auto-eq with time alignment fixes the bad speaker distances.
good .............................
thank you very much
Good video, good tips. Thanks bro 👍👍
wow... amazing cinema sound...i have got to get that...
amazing tutorial, must try
Wouldn't things like YPAO or Sony's auto calibration make speaker distance less of an issue than speaker angle?
Hi,
I am planning to get 85" QLED(2021 Q70A) and a matching sound bar to have home theatre setup in my lounge space.
My lounge size is 12.5 foot depth, width is 10.5 foot and ceiling height is 7.9 foot. I wish to have 4 seats in a row. Mostly i watch regular TV shows, movies, and sports. I dont play games on this home theatre.
Could you please advise on choosing between Home theatre soundbar samsung HW-Q900A and Q870A(2021). Both are in same price the range.
HW-Q900A has 7.1.2 channel sound without rear speakers.
HW-Q870A has 5.1.4 channel sound with wireless rear speakers.
Could you please suggest me to choose the better soundbar from the above two and few tips on setup, considering my room space, TV size and seating capacity.
Thanks in advance.
Agree with all, but impossible to do in... example, a bedroom, where you are with your back against the wall
If you're doing a 5.1 it should be okay. It's not optimal, but it'll be fine. If you're doing 7.1, yeah you can't have your back against a wall. Small room, if one wants surrounds, 5.1 is preferable.
My back is against a wall. I listen only to movies. How should I place my rears? Should i use bookshelf speakers or those dual triangle like surround speakers?
Wow! That surely simplified it. Now if you could please offer me some advice. I am doing 7.1. I have (3) 5.5 driver towers in front. Matching center. 2 bipole speaker and in the market for the other (2) to complete set. And I have a 10” sub. My question 1 is do I place the bipoles in rear or sides? And recommendation for the missing 2. Small bookshelf? Etc. thanks. I’m using a Yamaha R8 series receiver
In general what should front and rear balance be like in a mix? How much lower are rear speakers? Say on orchestra balance strings brass etc?
I'd always subtract the rear by 25% in level. They usually mix rear content too loud. That is my experience. Adjust how YOU like it.
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Hi, on 5.1 I ve put my surround speaker 1.5/2 feet above ear level, is it right? Sometime is fine, same case not. Dolby specifies this but most people say the opposite leaving surround on ear level, but they are distracting..
What about for those of us that like to mount everything in the ceiling or wall? I have 2 round Martin logan's in the ceiling above the couch and I want to put 2 in wall behind the couch and on the TV wall
I got 7.1 but where can we get 7.1 content because netflix and other streaming services provide 5.1 only since our tv dosent have atmos
Blu-Ray.
Nice advice but not possible in my living room. The room isn't wide enough to have the front speakers equal distance away from each other as they are from me. And the the room isn't long enough to have the back speakers the same distance away as the fronts.
I have a less than ideal room for theatre speaker placement however, the audio calibration works wonders. I currently run my system in 5.1 with my front speakers bi-amped but am considering adding back surround and converting to 7.1. Is there a way i could upload a picture of my room, and setup, so you could recommend placement of the two additional drivers? Secondly, i am not using subs because my tower speakers are handling the low end very well. Would I be sacrificing a lot of bass and clarity by going back to a single amplification channel for each front?
Wouldn't that just be a matter of configuring the DTS decoder? I mean if the decoder knows that it doesn't have a dedicated sub, but it has full-range towers, it should just send those frequencies to them.
Like on my PC, the driver thinks there's a pair of full-range speakers. Just the single pair. But because it thinks there are full range speakers there, it does send the subwoofer audio data over the stereo line out.
Fermitu Poupon , i agree. I'm not sure he recognized, or answered, my question as i wrote it. My receiver did exactly that. After connecting a sub and doing a sound test, it still provided an LFE signal and split it between the 2 front channels.
To rephrase my question, i wanted to know if i would notice an audible difference in having my front channels bi-amped versus just a single channel of amplification.
Cinema Sound, my apologies... My system was setup correctly as a 5.0 channel system with my fronts using the additional two channels for bi-amped L & R.
My question was if there a way i can provide a diagram of my room and current speaker locations so that you could suggest best placement of rear speakers so that i could step it up to a 7 channel setup? My tv and fronts are somewhat "caddy cornered" facing the couch with my surrounds left and right of the seating area. I would like to add rear surrounds but am unsure as to the optimum positioning.
So sound traveling at 761 mph out the speaker will sound “late”????
Quality knowledge..
What about putting surrounds in the ceiling? Are there special considerations, or is the magic triangle enough?
What the correct position for ceiling speakers.
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