Might be the burn rate of the powder, and whether the longer barrel can take advantage of a longer burn time. Your handloads may be using faster powder than some of the OEM ammo, so the longer barrel is just increasing drag.
When you look at the results from Ballistics by the inch, they tested four different .44 mag factory loads and all of them plateau at only around 14 inches of barrel length. Most factory loads are probably made for revolvers with fast burning powders for short barrels. Have you tried rifle powders?
@@samwilliams1142 Quite possible. If have 3 44 Mags, a 4" Taurus T44, a 7.5" Super Blackhawk, and a 20" Marlin 1894. I have found that faster powders work best in the T44 with less flash and sooting out of the barrel ports, and the hotter powders like the Marlin best. The SBH likes everything, lol. Using a near max W296 load under a 200 gr XTP resulted in 1950-2000 fls out of the Marlin and just under 1600 in the SBH. Backed off of the load as I think both velocities may be too hot for the bullets. Not to mention the recoil for the SBH is pretty stout. Won't even try them in the T44, as it is 10 oz lighter than the SBH, which already recoils very hard with these loads. One thing about handloading is you can find the powder/bullet combos that are most efficient in your own guns.
Put a wet wash cloth on the dents in wood and briefly put a steam iron on the area, careful not to over heat. The steam from the wet cloth will raise the damaged area maybe enough to touch up the finish
I have the very same Rossi, love it. Your velocity disappointment is definitely a pressure issue with typical pistol powders. What powder did you use with those screaming Lehigh handloads? I tried a variety of existing loads when I got my Rossi. My 250 grain trailboss "mousefart" loads actually keyholed out of the Rossi, even though they shot true out of my 7.5" super Blackhawk and 10" contender barrels. I added the receiver peep to mine in place of the safety, got it from Steves Gunz. Only issue I had with the Rossi was that the magazine tube was sliding forward with my heavy loads. Was able to fix that with some JB Weld under the forearm.
You won't regret getting a Marble Arms tang sight. They have positive windage & elevation adjustments. I have installed the taller stem on mine for My Uberti 1873 rifle in 44 WCF. That rifle has a 30" barrel & that sight has allowed me to make numerous very precise shots exceeding 300 yards. I appreciate watching your Videos. Keep up the good work.
Thanks for your comment, especially the feedback on the Tang site. I think it will be fun to lob 44 caliber bullets out to Extended ranges. Seems like an evening of relaxing shooting. Possibly from a comfortable chair, possibly with cool beverage by my side😉
+1 for the Marble Arms tang sight - I run one on my little Miroku 44 Mag 16" Take down 1892 - the taller stem is a must. Even with my minuscule barrel length I recorded 1997 f/s using a XTP 180gr in front of 27.5gr of H110 - thanks for your videos.
I bought the same rifle 20 years ago...Still have it, BUT when I got it, even as new it needed a lot of work to smooth the action down. It was very rouigh, very stiff and it even pulled a cartridge apart on extraction. Sent it off to a first class smith in Tesas who smoothed it up for Cowboy action, Runs like a champ now. Action is smooth and even feeling, Plain open sights are spot on.
Congratulatipm ons on your new rifle . I have used the Marble tang mounted peep sight for years with complete satisfaction. I have three mounted on various rifles. It sure nice when you need to make a windage change, to reach up and turn that knobs. Thanks for the video,George, much enjoyed!
Thanks for your comment. I don't know what powder is used in the factory ammo, but in the Berry's handloads as well as my XTP handloads I used A2400. That is not a handgun powder.
@@TargetSuite Well, there is a limit to the slowest powder for every cartridge.. I would guess that the max barrel length for speed would be 20-22 inches. It is likely the 20 inches but the longer sight radius and other factors make up for the lower speed. BTW I love my tang sights. I even have one vernier one on a 45-70 Gov Rolling Block
Thanks for all your comments. And you hinted at what I'm thinking, and that is that this is not a performance rifle it is going to be a fun rifle to lob slow-moving heavy bullets at extended ranges. So the longer Barrel is helpful whether or not it's generating more velocity. And thanks for your comments about the Tang site. I suspect by the end of the day I'll have one on order😉
I just about snarfed my coffee when I heard "if you haven't checked out my shorts, please do" lol. I half expected him to pop on screen with some James Reeves level shorts lol.
The minor blems you pointed out are... less than you're going to give it yourself just shooting and handling... I reckon. And as to the velocities, I don't find that disappointing. The 44 Mag after all is a pistol round and the propellants for it are pretty quick burning = just not a long enough burn to take advantage of the longer barrel length. The loads that did go faster probably had slower burning powder. Just a guess. Another great vid ! Keep em coming!
I think it's momentum of a given load versus barrel friction, with an already nearly maxed out efficiency factor for this particular caliber and cartridge, sometimes favoring one barrel length for one powder and bullet selection/combination, and in other loadings favoring the other. I love your presentations, and the way you think! Usually similar to my own approach, and often taking it further and teaching me a lot! Thank you.
It seems to me that you've reached the point of diminished returns at 20" maybe with a slower burning powder with near capacity charge weights the extra 4" could exploit some unused energy. It also seems to me the with the lighter bullets with presumably higher velocity in the bore are able to utilize a little more time spent in the barrel to reach a more complete burn, thus reaching higher velocities at the muzzle.
Have a 44mag Rossi 92 Silver in 20” that I’ve been shooting SASS for 10 years, and I love it. Action was a bit rough out of the box but I was able to smooth things out myself with a bit of judicious polishing here and there. Have to keep an eye on the side screws as they tend to loosed. Love this rifle, though my shooting buddies laugh at me cuz the 6” leather thong I have in the saddle ring gets caught in the hammer sometimes…but I ain’t takin it off…I likes it too much. BTW…added the saddle ring myself. Had it custom made to match the stainless finish…looks awesome!
I have an R92 and out of the box it was terrible. It cycled terribly and would constantly jam. I polished the feed ramp and removed all burrs from the action. Now it's my favorite rifle and it now it ALWAYS cycles buttery smooth.
Hi George. If you’re thinking of installing a tang sight on that Rossi you might want to check the tang is in line with the barrel. I had a Marbles tang sight fitted to my Winchester 94 (.357) by a gunsmith and while it’s dead centre on the tang I have to almost run out of windage adjustment to get it to shoot to point of aim. The tangs are not always flat either, which can tilt the sight one way or t’other, but I’m sure you know all of this anyway. Always a pleasure to watch your videos.
@@greybone777 Yes, I could do that, but it looks even weirder and more obvious with the front sight drifted well over to the left in its dovetail. As long as I have enough adjustment left on the rear sight I’ll stay with that. Thanks for your comment 👍
Sorry to here about the finish and fit flaws with the Rossi. I have never been impressed with 44 special because the cost is close to the 44 magnum. I just use reduced loads in 44 mag brass and lead bullets for plinkers. The big advantage of owning a 357 /38 special is lower cost and versatility. Lower recoil and enough power for deer , hogs , coyotes at closer wood and brush ranges. The 38 special is like a big 22 on small edible game like rabbits and squirrels. A 38 hole in and 38 hole out.
Nice video. For rifles I’d suggest trying H4227 with 240 or heavier projectiles. If you cast, a gas checked (or powder coat) 240 might be the ticket. Some lever guns don’t feed all types of semi was cutters.
I just got a new r92 357/38 octagon.The gun is perfect accept for 2 very small shadows in the bluing on one side , it is very hard to see. Other than that, the fit and finish is spot on.I am very pleased
Can’t really fault the gun for the disappointments you have. For the cosmetic stuff you could have walked away from the sale. Also, since you did not, it kind of shows why he would not come down on price. He clearly knew you were not willing to walk away from the sale over those cosmetic issues. As far as the velocity, every load uses different powders with different burn rates which I’m sure you know. The only way to really use a 24” barrel length on a pistol caliber carbine for more velocity is hand loading with slower powders.
Exactly what I was looking for. Local place has the 24" and a stainless 20" 44mag. The 20" barrel sure looks thin, maybe its just thinner to the 24" octagonal. Appreciate the comparison of several different brands in both barrel lengths.
Buffalo Bore had published similar results for some of their ammo, can’t remember if it was .44, .45 or what, but around 18 inches was ideal if my memory serves me correctly. I think more powder or slower burning powder would produce the results you are looking for. Just so much powder to burn in those short cases. Question, will the Rossi action accommodate those longer 300+ grain .44 mag loads from BB?
About 11+ yrs ago I chronographed the Hornady 160gr LEVERevolution 30-30 ammo in my Marlin 20” barrel and my Winchester 24”. I shot 10 rounds through each of them and they both came out averaging 2465fps. As far as accuracy goes, the Marlin hated it and the Winchester loved it. To this day, from the bench and using a Williams Peep sight, I can still get 1.5” groups @100yds and I’ve taken a number of deer, a black bear and one cow elk with the Winchester. So I wasn’t overly surprised with the first couple findings on your 44’s. The best I could figure out is the powder burn was completely done in my rifles and basically the bullet was only encountering friction on the last 4 inches in my Winchester.
Thanks. I really appreciate that comment. I too have had vastly different results with the Hornady FTX bullets. Some guns love them some hate them. But to their defense I have not done a definitive work to find out why. I just chose not to use them instead.
Hornady years ago publish velocity for there 45 Colt Leverevolution out of 5.5” barrel and 20”. The velocity wasn’t the significant increase I expected from a rifle so a called Hornady and one of there techs told me that the 45 Colt Leverevolution power charge was design specific for 45 Colt handguns. Basically he stated the load was running out of powder charge in. 20” barrel before it exited. I am would speculate that the cartridges your experiencing little velocity change with are maxed out in a 20” barrel and probably designed as a handgun load. Where as your hand loads, Buffalo Bore etc are loaded to max charges and have enough powder to be used in that 4” extra of barrel.
I think you have nailed it. There may also be some issues with chamber diameter and bore diameter but I think the biggest issue is how the cartridges were loaded.
A bit of sarcasm here but I usually drop my new gun or bang it against something ON PURPOSE just to get it over with they all get banged up eventually if you actually use them. Why I prefer used stuff it already has character instead of perfection. Good enough for me.
Haha! I don't have to worry about that on this one. It comes pre-banged. When I first saw this gun at the store it was hanging on the wall. When I went back to buy it it was back on a counter and had some stuff piled around it. I'm pretty sure the damage happened at the gun store. But I really didn't care because I wanted it for personal use and to get this video out. I had promised this a long time ago.
Hey George; according to a friend at "Remington Ammunition", typical gains/ losses equal 10fps per inch of barrel length. Of course, that +/- figure is only applicable to their ammunition. Other manufactures offer +/- figures in the 15fps range. All of this is predicated on hunting ammunition that I've asked specifically about and not to hot loaded specialty ammunition. Where the 25fps per inch "rule of thumb" comes from I am unaware and I've never heard, or read, anything other than anecdotal evidence, that supports the "rule". That is why I asked for your demonstration. I suspect we, collectively, will learn something about velocity data between 20" to 24" barrel performance that is contrary to the "rule" as we've been told over the years. As always, thank you very much for you hard work and keep up the excellent job. I never fail to learn something as I enjoy watching the video work you produce. P.S. I am really looking forward to the "impressionism" artwork.
Thanks for your input Gregory. I'm sure there's a lot of questions we won't answer but it's a fun Journey nonetheless. Speaking of Journeys, I'm really looking forward to the impressions series. I probably should have started smaller and worked up but with smaller cans and lighter loads it will still be interesting. Just on a little smaller scale😄
Great review Target Suite! I own the Rossi R95 Trapper 30 30 for my big game ventures here in Vermont. This rifle is excellent, and is comparable to any Marlin, Henry, etc., that I have ever owned. It's not fancy, just a work horse, but it's accurate, dependable, and good fit and finish.
I finally got a Rossi R92 20" blued/wood 357 mag last week. And put 10 rounds in to check the operation and that was fine but I noticed that the blueing was coming off the loading gate after loading just 10 rds. So I looked at yours closely and noticed yours has the same problem. I have a Marlin 94 and a Uberti 1873 and there's no issues with the finish on the loading gates after years of shooting. I called Rossi and they said they haven't heard any other complaints and I could send the rifle into them to fix it. I asked "can't you just send me a new loading gate?" they wouldn't do that. I'm not going to send it back and have them put another one on that would have the same defect. So tried some cold blueing by Birchwood Casey and that came off too. So I'm disappointed in that aspect of the finishing quality, but otherwise a nice rifle for the money, good fit and finish and action feels pretty smooth too. Anybody else had issues with the loading gates blueing coming off?
Unfortunately, and you have discovered, as I have, there are compromises that we have to live with in the Rossi lever guns. But to get an affordable 1892 lever gun at this price I am okay with the lower "quality" bluing.
Thanks for sharing George. This reinforces 20" as my favorite barrel length in a pistol cartridge rifle, for balance between usable powder burn/velocity, muzzle blast, mag capacity, and distance between the sights.
You are welcome. Yes my 20-in Barrel Winchester will still get the most love. This gun is going to be a relaxed casual shooter probably from a chair probably with a cold beverage nearby. Of course when I feature it on UA-cam I will be much more serious😉
Barrel length is only helpful up to a point. Perhaps a longer burning or slower burning powder would help? I can see that if the powder burns off way before the bullet leaves barrel, that the friction of the last little bit would slow it down. I don't know if im correct or not but just seems like a good explanation.
You are correct about barrel length working against you. I actually demonstrated this with two target 22 rifles. Beyond about 16 in a standard 22 long rifle will begin to slow down due to friction in the bore. I suspect that was what was at Play in one of the loads I showed in this video. Thanks for the comment and thank you for watching!
I noticed similar velocity issues with the .357 mag in a rifle. The revolver cartridges are generally optimized for use in a 6 inch barrel. Those fast powders probably run out of push before they run out of barrel. I did some testing with my hand loads and observed slower powders deliver better velocity out of the longer barrels. No extensive analysis. Just wondered why, and played a little.
My research indicates that the average handgun powder is all burnt up after about 17 inches. After 17 inches the bullet is slowing down due to friction.
A tang site would probably help with long distance shooting. Aperture sites are nice for distance but the buckhorn site is great for quick, close shots. What kind of range do you think you can accurately get with a .44 mag.? My lever is a .25-35 and I also used to have a .30-30 both Winchesters. I did fire a .44-40 replica 40 yrs ago. Don’t remember the make. He’d gotten it through Dixie Gun Works I believe. That rifle seemed a bit anemic for anything past 100 yds but it wasn’t the most accurate rifle I ever fired. You still did a good job of destroying that homney can and that’s the best use for homney in my opinion.
I Worked in a gun store for several years and I sold a hundred Rossi carbines. People would ask about them and I would explain the the gun was designed by a genius, built of modern steel on c&c machinery to exacting tolerances. In a country where people can work for less. That's why they can sell them at a reasonable price. The other reason that keeps the price low is that you don't get much hand fitting of parts or hand polishing of the action. You can let it wear in over time or pay a gunsmith to do an action job on it or learn to do it yourself. Thanks the difference between a thousand dollar Browning and a $500 Rossi. I sold a ton of them and none ever came back. John Davis Jax Fl
.44 Magnum is a pistol round. Typically pistol rounds are designed around short barrels. I know that a 9mm, for example, increases velocity in longer barrels up to about 12 inches, then it starts to slow down, the powder being burned, the extra barrel length just adds friction. I suspect you could tailor a powder/bullet combination for a slower burn to optimize the longer barrel.
You hit the nail on the head. And I will try to find a powder bullet combo that will utilize more of that Barrel length. But slower burning powders typically don't pack enough energy by volume to offer an advantage in the small space allotted by Pistol cartridges. But, that doesn't prevent me from trying😉
Had one long ago switched to Chiappa Alaskan 44Mag and its an extrem upgrade for me.... allready over 300shoots. (Here in Europe we dont get Winchester Marlin and co so easy..) Best Ammo for Rossi is Magtech, surpise surprise...(same company) Also Magtech is often very hot loaded and the 44Mag is very hot))
Straight wall cartridges are by far less barrel-lenght related than bottle-necks. In most cases you will not see much velocity increase After 16-18 inch. "Ballistics by the inch"
Ballistics as measured by the LabRadar showed two loads that were 170-ish fps faster out of the longer barrel. And my more recent vid with this 24" Rossi revealed a bore that was .003" larger than the SAAMI spec. So, the big question in my mind is why some loads really seemed to benefit from the longer barrel, and some didnt🤔
I like the rossi 92 in 45 long colt, however for 44 mag I went with the Henry Big Boy and its a thumper especially with the hardcast and +P type rounds.
Your powder is burning off before the bullet is passing somewhere in your barrel. Not sure where because it could be that case in both rifles, but, that 4 inches is significant enough to allow the shorter barrel to push the bullet out faster. That goes for the rounds where there is little to no deviation, though there would be less travel to the end of the barrel vs the rounds where the 20 inch barrel is over 100 feet faster. Otherwise there will be at least some significant increase in bullet speed. This is why they shortened the barrels on the M4A2s to 10 inches for SF guys that shoot the heavy bullets in order to better suppress the report of the cartridge when they were testing the 300 blkout. They stuck with the 10" barrel and heavy bullet when they decided to go with the 6.8 round (a mistake if you ask me as the 6.5 grendel is ballisticly a far superior round with 7.62 type numbers past 500 yards as the bullet is so efficient it carries it's energy and speed better from 500 to 1000 meters over the 7.62). You dont want to give up any efficiency in a gunfight.
I feel like a putting any sight besides a buck horn or red dot on a 44 mag rifle is very contradictory to the best use of the pistol round in a rifle a quick handy short range rifle that you can get a quick sight picture and take out game at close range fast pace
I certainly understand your point. And thank you. But this gun as I said in the video, will be a fun gun. And I look forward to shooting long range with the 44 Magnum round.
I think to have read in ‘The American Rifle’ that 50 fps was the expected difference between velocity and barrel lengths for every inch? Could bullet diameter have caused the unexpected results? Installed a Marble’s tang sight on a model 94. Put a 0.5” rear sight and a ‘folding’ front sight on the 26” barreled rifle. Use the folding sight for 25 yards, and dropping the front sight, the tang sight for 100 yards
All the magnum pistol cartridges are pretty much maxxed out at about 16in, there's really not much difference in velocity between the 16, 20, & 24in barrel BUT the longer the barrel the longer the tube so the longer barrels hold more ammo 16in=8rds, 20in=10rds, 24in=12rds. The difference probably has more to do with powder than anything else, just guessing but slower burning powder probably had a higher velocity with the longer barrels
It's very likely something like the powder choice. And I'll do some more experimenting to try and find out what works best. But the powders I use are all optimized for rifling Barrels in 44 Magnum.
@@TargetSuite In the past I tested 20" Marlin SS vs 24" 44 , the 24" got more vel with full power rounds , with Unique , they both got very little over an 8" or 4 5/8" .
Quick unrelated question, has anyone else had trouble with loading these ? Should I just cut my ammo tube spring a little or is it going to get easier over time ?
This one is not too bad. But my 357 Rossi needed a jackhammer to get the last couple of rounds in. So I shortened that one a tad. But proceed as your own risk because Too Short is even worse😉
I think you should slug the barrel and see if there’s a difference between the them, Second of all I think faster burning powder might not have as much velocity difference, Barnes bullets are generally very sore and we’ll expand up to fit the rifling quite easy and buffalo boar uses similar bullets that are soft copper however the Lee had the fence probably wouldn’t expand out and it got a really good increase, imagine part of your loss the difference is in some kind of bore diameter issue, if that’s not the case it’s merely the powder is all burning up before the bullet leaves the barrel
Those are great thoughts. One thing I've heard about Rossi's is that they have a larger chamber. That would account for a lower velocity but not one that is lower with some rounds but not others. But by the end of the day I will have slugged that Barrel and maybe slugged the bore as well. Thanks for your comment and if you will email me with some information about the custom plaques you make with the 50-110 I will share it.
My Rossi 92 44 slugged at 431.5. I size my cast bullets to .433. I match my powder burn to barrel length for optimal performance. AA #9 has performed the best for me in my 357 & 44 .
Here is a load that works great for plinking in my Uberti/Winchester 1873 .44 Mag 200 gr. plated Xtreme loaded with 9 gr. Unique. About like a top end .44-40
the tang peep is pretty classy, but I just put a small square patch of electrical tape with a 1/16" clean punch hole onto my right glasses lens. Always perfectly in line with e my natural head position every time. Also, if you have corrective lenses, it will automatically be at the correct optical distance from your eye. Your glasses will correct the target image while the peep corrects the sight image at the same time. Costs about a penny, can be easily peeled off and stuck to your gun box or even on the receiver for later use. Easy to replace in a second. Takes but a few minutes to fuss it onto the right spot on the lens but it will usually be way up in the upper left, against the frame. You won't even see it when looking around. Works just a well on plain safety glasses.
I have 2 trains of thought on the velocity question. It is possible that all of the powder is being burned up in the 20 inch barrel, so the 24 inch barrel wouldn't have an advantage. Or, is it possible that the 20 inch barrel is a little tighter than the 24 inch, and some of the pressure it blowing past the rounds, especially if the bullets are at the smaller end of the tolerance in the 24 inch.
Great thoughts. It's interesting that some of the loads saw no benefit even a degradation of velocity. But others saw a significant increase in velocity. So, I will be checking the bore and chamber diameters, but I also suspect that powder choice is a big part of those higher velocities. Just my $.02
I think the main differences in velocities across the board are due to the differences in the powders and the bullet weights used by the manufacturers. Since you are handloading it would be nice to see a test of a fast burning pistol powder, a medium burn rate powder and a slow burning rifle powder, using the same weight and manufacturer of bullet across the board for the test with the 20" and 24" barrell's. My loading manuals all list 44 magnum (pistol) and 44 magnum (rifle) seperately. I have read that the factory rounds are designed to work as best as they can be made to in both pistols and rifles. So I would guess the factory rounds use a medium burn rate powder that will function in both a pistol and a rifle. As a handloader you can tailor your recipie for either of the two. It would be my bet the long burning rifle powders would greatly outperform the pistol powders in either rifle but give an advantage in velocity to the 24" over the 20" barrel especially as you aproach the high end of the load charts. One thing I have noticed with handloding Berry's is that the copper plating is not sufficiently thick enough to prevent them from leading barrels when pushed to the higher end of the charts they are not copper jacketed they are electrolosis plated and should be loaded using the cast lead bullet chart not the jacketed bullet chart or staying on the low end of the jacketed bullet charts. Just my findings with having used Berry's in several pistols and rifles myself and leading several barrels up badly by pushing them too fast. They however are really great at lower velocities in both of my 500 magnum pistols and my 44 magnum pistols. I have not had good luck yet with them in my 44 Henry rifle and because of that I have not tried them in any other rifles mainly because I already have pet loads for them using jacketed bullets that I know perform well without leading up my barrels. I hate trying to clean lead out of barrels.
I have a Miroku Winchester 92 with a 20" barrel (twin actually) and a Marlin 1894 Cowboy with a 24" barrel in 44 mag. The 24" Marlin was consistently gaining 50 FPS or so over the Miroku. Different rate of twist, I believe, but still. H110 22 gr I believe.
Not strange at all. Pistol powders usually burn fast and max velocity will be met long before the end of 24" barrel. Some of the magnum powders burn slower and the gasses will still be expanding at the end of a 24" pipe.
Was it a hot day? Was the ammo warm, because those 180 grains were about 150 fps faster than normal. Otherwise, it appears that the standard factory ammo has a magnum pistol powder that completely burns up in 20" barrel. The ones that had an increase in the 24" must have a slower powder, possibly IMR 4227 (or a fast rifle powder) that can take advantage of the longer barrel. However they are still far less energetic than the factory ammo.
It was a hot day. Probably in the mid-90s when I did the chronograph work. And I think you are spot on. The ones that saw a velocity increase had to have a powder that was formulated for a longer Barrel.
Could you repeat/display or provide a link to the powders used with your reloads? Also,, how critical are magnum vs large pistol primers. Both are very difficult ot find? Thanks!
The issue with a perfect gun , the first nick is so painful . Pitty the person that makes the first ding if it's not You !! You hate to have any people touch it . Now , it came with the 1st & 2nt ding ... feel free to take out in the field or let other people shoot it , it will gain more battle scars & character with use & age !!
Hey I really enjoy your videos, as I am a hopeless lever gun fanatic! I currently own a 1894 Marlin Cowboy limited, 24” octagon barrel in .44 magnum, a newly purchased Henry Big Boy steel in .357 magnum, and I have an original 1892 Winchester made in 1897 which has been re-chambered in .357 magnum, and is real gem of a shooter. I have a rather simple question for you. You have metal targets mounted on metal fence posts - how are you attaching those targets to the posts? I need to do the same thing and was wondering how they are attached. Keep posting these great videos (and try a Henry Big Boy steel. I think it is equal to, if not a little better than a Ruger made Marlin)Thanks!
That's a good question. I have recently contacted Rossi about some technical questions and I hear nothing in return. I don't know that they have any technical people here in the US to answer questions like that.
I have a Henry big boy brass .44 with a 20 "octagon barrel. To say i love this rifle is correct. It will shoot almost anything accurate. 240 to 270 grns.i hand load all my rounds. And i am at max charge of imr 4227. The rifle likes it that way. It will almost keep 1" at 100yds. I have a 1-5 Leupold scope on mine . God bless. 😊
Have model 92 in 44 mag since 2013. Start with the bad first. Only 2 things did not like when and after I bought it was only half of a loading door on it. Obvously knew about it when I bought it. But did not know about this. Then after I shot it the 1st few times, don't like sights on it. Don't get me wrong they are good out to 50 yards, but longer shots then 50 yards not very good. Other then that very good rifle, nice and light, actually 1 of the best I have. At the time thought I was paying to much $$$. But comparing other post and the gun prices now days I got a great deal on it.
I am no professional but what's happening is, it's a pistol caliber made for a short barrel. So in the rile length barrel your getting a complete powder burn so the gains are minimal after 16 to 20 inches. Your reaching the maximum velocity in less than 24 inches
I think your velocity increase is going to be slow with longer barrel length due to the expansion ratio..not a very big chamber size for a .429 bore. So a small amount of expanding gas to push on the base of the bullet.
Exactly right and this is why slower "rifle" powders are not helpful in a pistol caliber carbine. They are made for bottleneck cartridges which have more powder space and much smaller expansion ratios per inch of barrel.
These marks has nothing to do with the make of the gun, it's been mishandled. Although, all mu guns have marks from being used, I don't mind. It give character to the gun and show it is something I enjoyed using. I never buy a gun for the safe only.
@@TargetSuite I bought my son a 1892 .44 Magnum from Miroku, when he turned 16 ( few years ago now) replaced the wood as it had very ''boring'' but well made, wanted to give the gun some personal touch.
Re tang sight: Other than improving the appearance of the rifle, I don't think the 44 Magnum is suited much beyond 150 yards - so why bother with a tang sight?
It's just something I've always wanted to do and it will be purely an adventure in shooting without any real practical application. Where'd you say it another way long range shooting with a 44 mag will just be for fun😉
@@ZREXER1250 I also used a 44 Magnum in a T/C Contender with a 14" barrel for metallic silhouette shooting, it is quite effective on the rams at 200 meters as long as bullet placement is high on the ram. I eventually switched to a 7 mm IHMHSA because of bullets with much better BCs and greater retained energy at the greater distances. The 44 Magnum is great for targets and steel beyond 150 yards, less so for game animals - IMHO.
@Mark Carew I agree with the limited range of the 44 Magnum. 75 yards is about it for me when it comes to hunting. And with that said I've never taken any deer with a 44 magnum Beyond about 40 ft.
When you shoot cartridges that burn pistol powder, the longer barrel is not an advantage. Switch to a magnum rifle powder and you will see an improvement in both the shorter and the longer barrel, but not in the pistols.
Logic tells me you are correct. I did have a couple of factory loads that showed a significant increase with the longer Barrel. No telling what powder they used. And my hand load with the 125 grain Lehigh Defense bullet also showed a significant increase with the longer barrel. However on that particular round the bullet has a big Hollow base and so I'm able to put a lot more powder behind that bullet. In fact, the case is just about a tenth of an inch from being from being full and when the bullet is seated the extra powder gets pushed up into that recess effectively giving me greater case capacity than normal for the 44 Magnum. Thanks for your comment, and thank you for watching!
That 125 grain copper at 2500 ft per second is really impressive! Being that that's a copper fluid transfer do you think it would work well with deer? Do you know anybody that's actually used it for hunting? You would have a really flat trajectory and a lot more range. I wonder what velocity you have to maintain to achieve the fluid transfer because I know those bullets do not mushroom? Interesting as always thank you 👍
UA-cam keeps taking down a comment with a link in it. So aggravating. Anyway, it seems the smaller ammo makers like Buffalo Bore are using most all the case capacity and it's yielding increased velocity with 4" extra barrel. I would also assume BB and Underwood and the like are using slower burning powders, to prevent pressure spiking too high and increase shove duration in longer barrels (revolvers, for one).
Haven't red the other comments but here's a thought. The only time a longer barrel is going to produce higher velocity is when all the powder is consumed in both barrels. If a larger charge is fired through a short barrel the excess powder does nothing to propell the bullet it simply makes a large flash at the muzzel.
Thanks for your comment. And the problem with pistol caliber rounds in a rifle is there's just not enough volume in the case to fill it full of slower burning powder which will generate pressure over a longer period of time resulting in higher velocity. So there is a point of diminishing returns. I'm hoping I can experiment a little bit and find out what some of those premium rounds are doing to get higher velocity out of a longer barrel. Thanks for your comment and thanks for watching!
I have seen impressive testing from Ruger M77/44 rifles , 18.5 " RE: Vel. . I think 20" is the sweet spot for Lever rifles . The 24 " may shoot better with open sights ??
You are right about that! Unfortunately, this rifle had some real issues and spent 4 months and customer service. When I got it back from Rossi it had rust on it and a new Barrel that was worse than the original. I'm hoping Marlin will come out with a cowboy model with a 24 inch barrel. That would be sweet!
I think a real sweet spot in the Rossi lineup is the 16” barrel R92 in 44mag with the skinner peep and picatinny rail forward of the action. The one with the large loop with paracord wrap. I could see putting a red dot on that and being a happy hunter out to about 100 yards, but most opportunities for where I hunt are around 50 yards. I’ve been eyeballing the 454 Casull one though…not that I need it, but I sure do want it!
I have a Henry 22 and a Rossi pump 22(plastic)...... shooting wise the Rossi stands up to the Henry I've been looking at getting 357/44 lever action and since Rossi is a couple hundred dollars less, that's the way I'm leaning I might notice the marks in the wood.....I really don't think that has to do with the brand, probably the dealer
Good morning.... Nice shooting.... I looked at the rifle ... Before I bought my Henry Big Boy 44.... The safety on the Rossie and the wood stocks seemed cheaper than I liked... Then I seen they are no longer AMERICAN Made. So that helped my decision on Buying my Henry.... Thanks for the video.
Thanks for your comment! As far as I know , Rossi rifles have always been made in Brazil. And they have been through quite a few changes in quality. I'm glad they are on the uptick right now. Thanks for watching.
@@TargetSuite Yes, Rossi was originally from Brazil, then got taken over by Taurus (also in Brazil) and is now owned and manufactured by CBC (also in Brazil). When comparing Henry, Marlin, Winchester, Uberti and Rossi, we should never forget that the Rossi are substantially lower cost than the other ones. I don't know about the US, but here in Germany, Rossi is literally half the price of the others. For what they are, they are really good rifles that shoot well. They are not as luxurious as the others.
Hi George I’ve just read about 400 comments, you may not get much F.P.S. Increase with the 24” barrel but my experience are that the loudness is decreased substantially compared to a 16” barrel 44 magnum. If you’re sitting at a bench in the back 40 lobbing a box of ammo, it may not make much of a difference since you’ll be wearing hearing protection but people a quarter mile away or deer during archery season may respond differently. Maybe. I have a single shot CVA in 44 magnum that I use for hunting sometimes and I cut it down from 22 inches down to 16 1/2 inches to be able to get through thick brush and also fit in a small blind better. The CVA is very accurate but it is much louder than when it was at 22”. Adding a different perspective ,Dave.
When I cut the CVA 5.5” off of 22”. My near max loads of 300 grain copper with H110 printed a few inches lower at 200 yds. I was guessing that it was mostly due to reduced fps. I don’t have a cronnie. Maybe barrel harmonics and muzzle crown are help effecting it printing lower.
@@davidedward13nothing wrong with your perspective but any rifle, regardless of how loud at the muzzle, unless it’s suppressed and shooting near subsonic loads, can/will spook game. Plus if you’re the only one in the woods trying to be quiet, it’s noble but no one else around you is going to care…they’re going to shoot whatever they brought…likely an inappropriate target gun in some hyper velocity cartridge with a tanker style muzzle brake on the end that shakes the forest and deafens all around it…to shoot a deer at 50 yards.
Maybe in the lower power rounds the powder gets mostly burned up in the first 20 inches, so you get velocities that are very close, even faster in a shorter barrel. But more powerful rounds there is more powder to burn, so you can get higher velocities out of the longer barrel. I've heard of this in 22 rifles where the powder is all burned up before it leaves the barrel. Never thought about it on bigger rounds like 44 though, but I suppose it is possible.
Most .44 mag factory loads are probably optimized for 6 inch barrels (revolvers) because if you had a load that needs 16 inches to completely burn up, all you'd get from your revolver would be a 10" fireball and no velocity...
Nice rifle! I think you've found the point where barrel length doesn't gain you much velocity. I have a .44 mag Rossi with the 16" barrel and when I use Hodgdon's data for a 20" barrel I get nearly the same velocities, so 16 to 20 already doesn't make much of a difference. Between that 16" and my 12" ranch hand there's still not a heck of a lot of difference, and that's with H110. I've gotten slightly higher velocities in the 12" barrel with Lil'gun (using less powder too), but I'm not sure about longer barrels. I think your main advantages with the 24" is a longer sight radius and more magazine capacity. In case you didn't burn through enough ammo as it is, haha!
Thanks! I was a couple hundred feet per second below the velocity ceiling for the berries bullets. But you are right about the burn rate. That is a major factor.
I love this channel. Probably bore and chamber dimensions vary. That volume may be enough to cause pressure drop on the long barrel. It makes sense to me that when everything is pushed to maximum, that is where you stand a chance of gaining from the extra length, as the time under pressure beats out the volume increase effect. Fantastic experiment, thank you.
I would either go with a Marbles tang sight or a Lyman receiver sight. Both would be great for longer range shooting. The Marbles of course would be more historically correct for an early 92, while the Lyman would be for a later one.
I have a Rossi 44 mag in a short barrel. It’s fantastic and so small it looks like a carbine pellet rifle.I killed a deer with it at 60 yards dropped in its tracks with leverlution ammo
As far as the velocity, it could be the quicker burning powder kept the bullets at the same velocity, and a slower burn rate could have increased the velocity in the longer barrel. Just a thought!
As others mentioned with some loads the optimal velocity may be reached in a shorter barrel, 'But'. Even when of the same length length not all barrels are equal. You should have seen some significant velocity increase with an extra 4 inches of barrel. Variations in chamber, rifling, and other dimensions could all be important. My guess is if you cut 4 inches off of the 24 inch barrel it will shoot slower than the other barrel. For a 44 mag the only reason for a 24 inch barrel is for a longer magazine tube or longer sighting radius. Now for a 25-35 with reloads and slow powder I can see the wisdom of a longer barrel, but then it has been a long time since anyone to my knowledge has made a 25-35 rifle.
Might be the burn rate of the powder, and whether the longer barrel can take advantage of a longer burn time. Your handloads may be using faster powder than some of the OEM ammo, so the longer barrel is just increasing drag.
That seems to be the most likely candidate. Thanks!
When you look at the results from Ballistics by the inch, they tested four different .44 mag factory loads and all of them plateau at only around 14 inches of barrel length. Most factory loads are probably made for revolvers with fast burning powders for short barrels. Have you tried rifle powders?
I agree. It could be a combination of both.
The 44 special might reverse the velocity gain coming out faster from the shorter barrel. They have less and faster powder.
@@samwilliams1142 Quite possible. If have 3 44 Mags, a 4" Taurus T44, a 7.5" Super Blackhawk, and a 20" Marlin 1894. I have found that faster powders work best in the T44 with less flash and sooting out of the barrel ports, and the hotter powders like the Marlin best. The SBH likes everything, lol. Using a near max W296 load under a 200 gr XTP resulted in 1950-2000 fls out of the Marlin and just under 1600 in the SBH. Backed off of the load as I think both velocities may be too hot for the bullets. Not to mention the recoil for the SBH is pretty stout. Won't even try them in the T44, as it is 10 oz lighter than the SBH, which already recoils very hard with these loads. One thing about handloading is you can find the powder/bullet combos that are most efficient in your own guns.
I have the Rossi 357 20" and love it !
Put a wet wash cloth on the dents in wood and briefly put a steam iron on the area, careful not to over heat. The steam from the wet cloth will raise the damaged area maybe enough to touch up the finish
That trick has worked on several different gun stocks.
Larry Potterfield from Midway has a good video showing that.
Might try slugging the bore and see if the Winchester has a tighter bore
I have the very same Rossi, love it. Your velocity disappointment is definitely a pressure issue with typical pistol powders. What powder did you use with those screaming Lehigh handloads? I tried a variety of existing loads when I got my Rossi. My 250 grain trailboss "mousefart" loads actually keyholed out of the Rossi, even though they shot true out of my 7.5" super Blackhawk and 10" contender barrels. I added the receiver peep to mine in place of the safety, got it from Steves Gunz. Only issue I had with the Rossi was that the magazine tube was sliding forward with my heavy loads. Was able to fix that with some JB Weld under the forearm.
You won't regret getting a Marble Arms tang sight. They have positive windage & elevation adjustments. I have installed the taller stem on mine for My Uberti 1873 rifle in 44 WCF. That rifle has a 30" barrel & that sight has allowed me to make numerous very precise shots exceeding 300 yards. I appreciate watching your Videos. Keep up the good work.
Thanks for your comment, especially the feedback on the Tang site. I think it will be fun to lob 44 caliber bullets out to Extended ranges. Seems like an evening of relaxing shooting. Possibly from a comfortable chair, possibly with cool beverage by my side😉
Wow! How are loading that 44 WCF? I'm running 200 gr. cast over 6 gr. 700x. I'm still getting used to the rifle, shooting about 4" at 100 yds.
@@wdtaut5650 Unique powder works very well but I get my best accuracy with Bullseye. You'll have to determine how much is appropriate for your needs.
I have one of those on my Rossi 357 with a 16 inch barrel, dings a ten inch plate at 100 yards easily, that's all I need from it.
+1 for the Marble Arms tang sight - I run one on my little Miroku 44 Mag 16" Take down 1892 - the taller stem is a must. Even with my minuscule barrel length I recorded 1997 f/s using a XTP 180gr in front of 27.5gr of H110 - thanks for your videos.
I bought the same rifle 20 years ago...Still have it, BUT when I got it, even as new it needed a lot of work to smooth the action down. It was very rouigh, very stiff and it even pulled a cartridge apart on extraction. Sent it off to a first class smith in Tesas who smoothed it up for Cowboy action, Runs like a champ now. Action is smooth and even feeling, Plain open sights are spot on.
Congratulatipm ons on your new rifle . I have used the Marble tang mounted peep sight for years with complete satisfaction. I have three mounted on various rifles. It sure nice when you need to make a windage change, to reach up and turn that knobs. Thanks for the video,George, much enjoyed!
Simple the choice of powder. If I load with a slower powder I get an increase. The rounds were loaded for handguns
Thanks for your comment. I don't know what powder is used in the factory ammo, but in the Berry's handloads as well as my XTP handloads I used A2400. That is not a handgun powder.
@@TargetSuite look it up on a relative burning chart and see if you have a slightly slower powder for that bullet
I did. And the powders that I use are the slowest called out in all of the reloading manuals for 44 mag out of a rifle.
@@TargetSuite Well, there is a limit to the slowest powder for every cartridge.. I would guess that the max barrel length for speed would be 20-22 inches. It is likely the 20 inches but the longer sight radius and other factors make up for the lower speed. BTW I love my tang sights. I even have one vernier one on a 45-70 Gov Rolling Block
Thanks for all your comments. And you hinted at what I'm thinking, and that is that this is not a performance rifle it is going to be a fun rifle to lob slow-moving heavy bullets at extended ranges. So the longer Barrel is helpful whether or not it's generating more velocity. And thanks for your comments about the Tang site. I suspect by the end of the day I'll have one on order😉
I just about snarfed my coffee when I heard "if you haven't checked out my shorts, please do" lol. I half expected him to pop on screen with some James Reeves level shorts lol.
It was Shorts not shorts😉😄
Sir, i love your rossi lever gun vids! and just also your love for lever actions in general gotta love the lever action !
Thanks!
The minor blems you pointed out are... less than you're going to give it yourself just shooting and handling... I reckon. And as to the velocities, I don't find that disappointing. The 44 Mag after all is a pistol round and the propellants for it are pretty quick burning = just not a long enough burn to take advantage of the longer barrel length. The loads that did go faster probably had slower burning powder. Just a guess. Another great vid ! Keep em coming!
I think it's momentum of a given load versus barrel friction, with an already nearly maxed out efficiency factor for this particular caliber and cartridge, sometimes favoring one barrel length for one powder and bullet selection/combination, and in other loadings favoring the other. I love your presentations, and the way you think! Usually similar to my own approach, and often taking it further and teaching me a lot! Thank you.
You survived without the glasses! Simply miraculous!
It seems to me that you've reached the point of diminished returns at 20" maybe with a slower burning powder with near capacity charge weights the extra 4" could exploit some unused energy. It also seems to me the with the lighter bullets with presumably higher velocity in the bore are able to utilize a little more time spent in the barrel to reach a more complete burn, thus reaching higher velocities at the muzzle.
Good thoughts! Thanks!
For looks though the octagon barrel is hard to beat
Have a 44mag Rossi 92 Silver in 20” that I’ve been shooting SASS for 10 years, and I love it. Action was a bit rough out of the box but I was able to smooth things out myself with a bit of judicious polishing here and there. Have to keep an eye on the side screws as they tend to loosed. Love this rifle, though my shooting buddies laugh at me cuz the 6” leather thong I have in the saddle ring gets caught in the hammer sometimes…but I ain’t takin it off…I likes it too much. BTW…added the saddle ring myself. Had it custom made to match the stainless finish…looks awesome!
I have an R92 and out of the box it was terrible. It cycled terribly and would constantly jam. I polished the feed ramp and removed all burrs from the action. Now it's my favorite rifle and it now it ALWAYS cycles buttery smooth.
Your story really had a great ending! I too will be doing a little internal work on this gun, mostly to make it load more easily. Thanks for watching!
Hi George. If you’re thinking of installing a tang sight on that Rossi you might want to check the tang is in line with the barrel. I had a Marbles tang sight fitted to my Winchester 94 (.357) by a gunsmith and while it’s dead centre on the tang I have to almost run out of windage adjustment to get it to shoot to point of aim. The tangs are not always flat either, which can tilt the sight one way or t’other, but I’m sure you know all of this anyway. Always a pleasure to watch your videos.
Thank you for your comment! Actually I never would have thought about the Tang being out of alignment with the barrel. I'll check it out.
Drift the front sight. 👌
@@greybone777 Yes, I could do that, but it looks even weirder and more obvious with the front sight drifted well over to the left in its dovetail. As long as I have enough adjustment left on the rear sight I’ll stay with that. Thanks for your comment 👍
Sorry to here about the finish and fit flaws with the Rossi. I have never been impressed with 44 special because the cost is close to the 44 magnum. I just use reduced loads in 44 mag brass and lead bullets for plinkers.
The big advantage of owning a 357 /38 special is lower cost and versatility. Lower recoil and enough power for deer , hogs , coyotes at closer wood and brush ranges. The 38 special is like a big 22 on small edible game like rabbits and squirrels. A 38 hole in and 38 hole out.
Nice video. For rifles I’d suggest trying H4227 with 240 or heavier projectiles. If you cast, a gas checked (or powder coat) 240 might be the ticket. Some lever guns don’t feed all types of semi was cutters.
I just got a new r92 357/38 octagon.The gun is perfect accept for 2 very small shadows in the bluing on one side , it is very hard to see. Other than that, the fit and finish is spot on.I am very pleased
That's fantastic. Congratulations. I think I have the same two shadows in the bluing.
Can’t really fault the gun for the disappointments you have. For the cosmetic stuff you could have walked away from the sale. Also, since you did not, it kind of shows why he would not come down on price. He clearly knew you were not willing to walk away from the sale over those cosmetic issues.
As far as the velocity, every load uses different powders with different burn rates which I’m sure you know. The only way to really use a 24” barrel length on a pistol caliber carbine for more velocity is hand loading with slower powders.
My older Rossi (Puma) 16inch barreled 44 mag ..handled 44 Spl & 44 Russian
Exactly what I was looking for. Local place has the 24" and a stainless 20" 44mag. The 20" barrel sure looks thin, maybe its just thinner to the 24" octagonal. Appreciate the comparison of several different brands in both barrel lengths.
Buffalo Bore had published similar results for some of their ammo, can’t remember if it was .44, .45 or what, but around 18 inches was ideal if my memory serves me correctly. I think more powder or slower burning powder would produce the results you are looking for. Just so much powder to burn in those short cases.
Question, will the Rossi action accommodate those longer 300+ grain .44 mag loads from BB?
About 11+ yrs ago I chronographed the Hornady 160gr LEVERevolution 30-30 ammo in my Marlin 20” barrel and my Winchester 24”. I shot 10 rounds through each of them and they both came out averaging 2465fps. As far as accuracy goes, the Marlin hated it and the Winchester loved it. To this day, from the bench and using a Williams Peep sight, I can still get 1.5” groups @100yds and I’ve taken a number of deer, a black bear and one cow elk with the Winchester.
So I wasn’t overly surprised with the first couple findings on your 44’s. The best I could figure out is the powder burn was completely done in my rifles and basically the bullet was only encountering friction on the last 4 inches in my Winchester.
Thanks. I really appreciate that comment. I too have had vastly different results with the Hornady FTX bullets. Some guns love them some hate them. But to their defense I have not done a definitive work to find out why. I just chose not to use them instead.
Hornady years ago publish velocity for there 45 Colt Leverevolution out of 5.5” barrel and 20”. The velocity wasn’t the significant increase I expected from a rifle so a called Hornady and one of there techs told me that the 45 Colt Leverevolution power charge was design specific for 45 Colt handguns. Basically he stated the load was running out of powder charge in. 20” barrel before it exited. I am would speculate that the cartridges your experiencing little velocity change with are maxed out in a 20” barrel and probably designed as a handgun load. Where as your hand loads, Buffalo Bore etc are loaded to max charges and have enough powder to be used in that 4” extra of barrel.
I think you have nailed it. There may also be some issues with chamber diameter and bore diameter but I think the biggest issue is how the cartridges were loaded.
I have the Marbles tang on my Rossi 92 44 and love it I also installed a few Steve's Gunz parts and slickened up the action
Thanks for your comment. I plan to go down the same path you did with my rossi.
A bit of sarcasm here but I usually drop my new gun or bang it against something ON PURPOSE just to get it over with they all get banged up eventually if you actually use them. Why I prefer used stuff it already has character instead of perfection. Good enough for me.
Haha! I don't have to worry about that on this one. It comes pre-banged. When I first saw this gun at the store it was hanging on the wall. When I went back to buy it it was back on a counter and had some stuff piled around it. I'm pretty sure the damage happened at the gun store. But I really didn't care because I wanted it for personal use and to get this video out. I had promised this a long time ago.
Hey George; according to a friend at "Remington Ammunition", typical gains/ losses equal 10fps per inch of barrel length. Of course, that +/- figure is only applicable to their ammunition. Other manufactures offer +/- figures in the 15fps range. All of this is predicated on hunting ammunition that I've asked specifically about and not to hot loaded specialty ammunition. Where the 25fps per inch "rule of thumb" comes from I am unaware and I've never heard, or read, anything other than anecdotal evidence, that supports the "rule". That is why I asked for your demonstration. I suspect we, collectively, will learn something about velocity data between 20" to 24" barrel performance that is contrary to the "rule" as we've been told over the years. As always, thank you very much for you hard work and keep up the excellent job. I never fail to learn something as I enjoy watching the video work you produce. P.S. I am really looking forward to the "impressionism" artwork.
Thanks for your input Gregory. I'm sure there's a lot of questions we won't answer but it's a fun Journey nonetheless. Speaking of Journeys, I'm really looking forward to the impressions series. I probably should have started smaller and worked up but with smaller cans and lighter loads it will still be interesting. Just on a little smaller scale😄
Great review Target Suite! I own the Rossi R95 Trapper 30 30 for my big game ventures here in Vermont. This rifle is excellent, and is comparable to any Marlin, Henry, etc., that I have ever owned. It's not fancy, just a work horse, but it's accurate, dependable, and good fit and finish.
A Williams Receiver Sight makes those things shoot sooo good without having to worry about the sight dropping or putting your eye out.
Steve also makes a peep sight that fits into the safety hole on the bolt. I just don't know how well it works.
Thanks! I've seen that but would prefer the style of the marble arms Tang site.
I finally got a Rossi R92 20" blued/wood 357 mag last week. And put 10 rounds in to check the operation and that was fine but I noticed that the blueing was coming off the loading gate after loading just 10 rds. So I looked at yours closely and noticed yours has the same problem. I have a Marlin 94 and a Uberti 1873 and there's no issues with the finish on the loading gates after years of shooting. I called Rossi and they said they haven't heard any other complaints and I could send the rifle into them to fix it. I asked "can't you just send me a new loading gate?" they wouldn't do that. I'm not going to send it back and have them put another one on that would have the same defect. So tried some cold blueing by Birchwood Casey and that came off too. So I'm disappointed in that aspect of the finishing quality, but otherwise a nice rifle for the money, good fit and finish and action feels pretty smooth too. Anybody else had issues with the loading gates blueing coming off?
Unfortunately, and you have discovered, as I have, there are compromises that we have to live with in the Rossi lever guns. But to get an affordable 1892 lever gun at this price I am okay with the lower "quality" bluing.
Thanks for sharing George. This reinforces 20" as my favorite barrel length in a pistol cartridge rifle, for balance between usable powder burn/velocity, muzzle blast, mag capacity, and distance between the sights.
You are welcome. Yes my 20-in Barrel Winchester will still get the most love. This gun is going to be a relaxed casual shooter probably from a chair probably with a cold beverage nearby. Of course when I feature it on UA-cam I will be much more serious😉
The octagon barrel is way better looking of the two!
Barrel length is only helpful up to a point. Perhaps a longer burning or slower burning powder would help? I can see that if the powder burns off way before the bullet leaves barrel, that the friction of the last little bit would slow it down. I don't know if im correct or not but just seems like a good explanation.
You are correct about barrel length working against you. I actually demonstrated this with two target 22 rifles. Beyond about 16 in a standard 22 long rifle will begin to slow down due to friction in the bore. I suspect that was what was at Play in one of the loads I showed in this video. Thanks for the comment and thank you for watching!
I noticed similar velocity issues with the .357 mag in a rifle. The revolver cartridges are generally optimized for use in a 6 inch barrel. Those fast powders probably run out of push before they run out of barrel. I did some testing with my hand loads and observed slower powders deliver better velocity out of the longer barrels. No extensive analysis. Just wondered why, and played a little.
Higher velocity can play hob with your group size and accuracy (barrel harmonics/whip issue usually) , so it's not necessarily desirable.
My research indicates that the average handgun powder is all burnt up after about 17 inches. After 17 inches the bullet is slowing down due to friction.
A tang site would probably help with long distance shooting. Aperture sites are nice for distance but the buckhorn site is great for quick, close shots. What kind of range do you think you can accurately get with a .44 mag.? My lever is a .25-35 and I also used to have a .30-30 both Winchesters. I did fire a .44-40 replica 40 yrs ago. Don’t remember the make. He’d gotten it through Dixie Gun Works I believe. That rifle seemed a bit anemic for anything past 100 yds but it wasn’t the most accurate rifle I ever fired. You still did a good job of destroying that homney can and that’s the best use for homney in my opinion.
I Worked in a gun store for several years and I sold a hundred Rossi carbines.
People would ask about them and I would explain the the gun was designed by a genius, built of modern steel on c&c machinery
to exacting tolerances. In a country where people can work for less.
That's why they can sell them at a reasonable price.
The other reason that keeps the price low is that you don't get much hand fitting of parts or hand polishing of the action. You can let it wear in over time or pay a gunsmith to do an action job on it or learn to do it yourself.
Thanks the difference between a thousand dollar Browning and a $500 Rossi.
I sold a ton of them and none ever came back.
John Davis Jax Fl
Thanks John. I appreciate the input of one with your background.
The last Rossi .357 lever gun I saw, about 4 months ago, was priced at $820.00. It sold, but not to me.
@@Salieri47 it's not that the guns worth more, it's that our dollar is worth less.
I also applied the leather lever wraps and it really enhanced the visual of the rifle plus added some comfortability
.44 Magnum is a pistol round. Typically pistol rounds are designed around short barrels. I know that a 9mm, for example, increases velocity in longer barrels up to about 12 inches, then it starts to slow down, the powder being burned, the extra barrel length just adds friction. I suspect you could tailor a powder/bullet combination for a slower burn to optimize the longer barrel.
You hit the nail on the head. And I will try to find a powder bullet combo that will utilize more of that Barrel length. But slower burning powders typically don't pack enough energy by volume to offer an advantage in the small space allotted by Pistol cartridges. But, that doesn't prevent me from trying😉
@@TargetSuite I have some right spicy loads out of an 1894 using W296 or A9.
Magnum rifle primer and IMR 4198.
Great demonstration. I always enjoy you programs, especially with the 1892 clones. My favorite lever gun although I shoot an 1873 a lot. George
Had one long ago switched to Chiappa Alaskan 44Mag and its an extrem upgrade for me.... allready over 300shoots. (Here in Europe we dont get Winchester Marlin and co so easy..)
Best Ammo for Rossi is Magtech, surpise surprise...(same company) Also Magtech is often very hot loaded and the 44Mag is very hot))
Straight wall cartridges are by far less barrel-lenght related than bottle-necks. In most cases you will not see much velocity increase After 16-18 inch. "Ballistics by the inch"
Ballistics as measured by the LabRadar showed two loads that were 170-ish fps faster out of the longer barrel. And my more recent vid with this 24" Rossi revealed a bore that was .003" larger than the SAAMI spec. So, the big question in my mind is why some loads really seemed to benefit from the longer barrel, and some didnt🤔
Possibly it's as simple as the
Trying this again
Maybe it's as simple as the bearing surfaces on the bullets fitting the bore better
I like the rossi 92 in 45 long colt, however for 44 mag I went with the Henry Big Boy and its a thumper especially with the hardcast and +P type rounds.
Your powder is burning off before the bullet is passing somewhere in your barrel. Not sure where because it could be that case in both rifles, but, that 4 inches is significant enough to allow the shorter barrel to push the bullet out faster. That goes for the rounds where there is little to no deviation, though there would be less travel to the end of the barrel vs the rounds where the 20 inch barrel is over 100 feet faster. Otherwise there will be at least some significant increase in bullet speed. This is why they shortened the barrels on the M4A2s to 10 inches for SF guys that shoot the heavy bullets in order to better suppress the report of the cartridge when they were testing the 300 blkout. They stuck with the 10" barrel and heavy bullet when they decided to go with the 6.8 round (a mistake if you ask me as the 6.5 grendel is ballisticly a far superior round with 7.62 type numbers past 500 yards as the bullet is so efficient it carries it's energy and speed better from 500 to 1000 meters over the 7.62). You dont want to give up any efficiency in a gunfight.
I feel like a putting any sight besides a buck horn or red dot on a 44 mag rifle is very contradictory to the best use of the pistol round in a rifle a quick handy short range rifle that you can get a quick sight picture and take out game at close range fast pace
I certainly understand your point. And thank you. But this gun as I said in the video, will be a fun gun. And I look forward to shooting long range with the 44 Magnum round.
@@TargetSuite I guess it’s like long range rim fire shooting getting a round to hit at long distance that doesn’t fly flat is more challenging
I think to have read in ‘The American Rifle’ that 50 fps was the expected difference between velocity and barrel lengths for every inch?
Could bullet diameter have caused the unexpected results?
Installed a Marble’s tang sight on a model 94. Put a 0.5” rear sight and a ‘folding’ front sight on the 26” barreled rifle. Use the folding sight for 25 yards, and dropping the front sight, the tang sight for 100 yards
All the magnum pistol cartridges are pretty much maxxed out at about 16in, there's really not much difference in velocity between the 16, 20, & 24in barrel BUT the longer the barrel the longer the tube so the longer barrels hold more ammo 16in=8rds, 20in=10rds, 24in=12rds. The difference probably has more to do with powder than anything else, just guessing but slower burning powder probably had a higher velocity with the longer barrels
It's very likely something like the powder choice. And I'll do some more experimenting to try and find out what works best. But the powders I use are all optimized for rifling Barrels in 44 Magnum.
@@TargetSuite In the past I tested 20" Marlin SS vs 24" 44 , the 24" got more vel with full power rounds , with Unique , they both got very little over an 8" or 4 5/8" .
@Dan O'Neill Thanks!
Quick unrelated question, has anyone else had trouble with loading these ? Should I just cut my ammo tube spring a little or is it going to get easier over time ?
This one is not too bad. But my 357 Rossi needed a jackhammer to get the last couple of rounds in. So I shortened that one a tad. But proceed as your own risk because Too Short is even worse😉
I think you should slug the barrel and see if there’s a difference between the them, Second of all I think faster burning powder might not have as much velocity difference, Barnes bullets are generally very sore and we’ll expand up to fit the rifling quite easy and buffalo boar uses similar bullets that are soft copper however the Lee had the fence probably wouldn’t expand out and it got a really good increase, imagine part of your loss the difference is in some kind of bore diameter issue, if that’s not the case it’s merely the powder is all burning up before the bullet leaves the barrel
Those are great thoughts. One thing I've heard about Rossi's is that they have a larger chamber. That would account for a lower velocity but not one that is lower with some rounds but not others. But by the end of the day I will have slugged that Barrel and maybe slugged the bore as well. Thanks for your comment and if you will email me with some information about the custom plaques you make with the 50-110 I will share it.
My Rossi 92 44 slugged at 431.5. I size my cast bullets to .433. I match my powder burn to barrel length for optimal performance. AA #9 has performed the best for me in my 357 & 44 .
@Georgiaboy44 I got 8 lb of AA #9. Next reloads will be charged with that powder and I'll compare. Thanks!
@@georgiaboy4410 same issue on my Rossi, went with a .434 mold and .433 sizing die. JSP bullets “patterned” not grouped.
Here is a load that works great for plinking in my Uberti/Winchester 1873 .44 Mag 200 gr. plated Xtreme loaded with 9 gr. Unique. About like a top end .44-40
the tang peep is pretty classy, but I just put a small square patch of electrical tape with a 1/16" clean punch hole onto my right glasses lens. Always perfectly in line with e my natural head position every time. Also, if you have corrective lenses, it will automatically be at the correct optical distance from your eye. Your glasses will correct the target image while the peep corrects the sight image at the same time. Costs about a penny, can be easily peeled off and stuck to your gun box or even on the receiver for later use. Easy to replace in a second. Takes but a few minutes to fuss it onto the right spot on the lens but it will usually be way up in the upper left, against the frame. You won't even see it when looking around. Works just a well on plain safety glasses.
I have 2 trains of thought on the velocity question. It is possible that all of the powder is being burned up in the 20 inch barrel, so the 24 inch barrel wouldn't have an advantage. Or, is it possible that the 20 inch barrel is a little tighter than the 24 inch, and some of the pressure it blowing past the rounds, especially if the bullets are at the smaller end of the tolerance in the 24 inch.
Great thoughts. It's interesting that some of the loads saw no benefit even a degradation of velocity. But others saw a significant increase in velocity. So, I will be checking the bore and chamber diameters, but I also suspect that powder choice is a big part of those higher velocities. Just my $.02
Is the lack of velocity gains a powder thing?
I think the main differences in velocities across the board are due to the differences in the powders and the bullet weights used by the manufacturers. Since you are handloading it would be nice to see a test of a fast burning pistol powder, a medium burn rate powder and a slow burning rifle powder, using the same weight and manufacturer of bullet across the board for the test with the 20" and 24" barrell's. My loading manuals all list 44 magnum (pistol) and 44 magnum (rifle) seperately. I have read that the factory rounds are designed to work as best as they can be made to in both pistols and rifles. So I would guess the factory rounds use a medium burn rate powder that will function in both a pistol and a rifle. As a handloader you can tailor your recipie for either of the two. It would be my bet the long burning rifle powders would greatly outperform the pistol powders in either rifle but give an advantage in velocity to the 24" over the 20" barrel especially as you aproach the high end of the load charts. One thing I have noticed with handloding Berry's is that the copper plating is not sufficiently thick enough to prevent them from leading barrels when pushed to the higher end of the charts they are not copper jacketed they are electrolosis plated and should be loaded using the cast lead bullet chart not the jacketed bullet chart or staying on the low end of the jacketed bullet charts. Just my findings with having used Berry's in several pistols and rifles myself and leading several barrels up badly by pushing them too fast. They however are really great at lower velocities in both of my 500 magnum pistols and my 44 magnum pistols. I have not had good luck yet with them in my 44 Henry rifle and because of that I have not tried them in any other rifles mainly because I already have pet loads for them using jacketed bullets that I know perform well without leading up my barrels. I hate trying to clean lead out of barrels.
Is there much difference in felt recoil on the 24 inch barrel vs the 20 inch barrel in .44 mag?
I have a Miroku Winchester 92 with a 20" barrel (twin actually) and a Marlin 1894 Cowboy with a 24" barrel in 44 mag. The 24" Marlin was consistently gaining 50 FPS or so over the Miroku. Different rate of twist, I believe, but still. H110 22 gr I believe.
Not strange at all. Pistol powders usually burn fast and max velocity will be met long before the end of 24" barrel. Some of the magnum powders burn slower and the gasses will still be expanding at the end of a 24" pipe.
Was it a hot day? Was the ammo warm, because those 180 grains were about 150 fps faster than normal. Otherwise, it appears that the standard factory ammo has a magnum pistol powder that completely burns up in 20" barrel. The ones that had an increase in the 24" must have a slower powder, possibly IMR 4227 (or a fast rifle powder) that can take advantage of the longer barrel. However they are still far less energetic than the factory ammo.
It was a hot day. Probably in the mid-90s when I did the chronograph work. And I think you are spot on. The ones that saw a velocity increase had to have a powder that was formulated for a longer Barrel.
Could you repeat/display or provide a link to the powders used with your reloads?
Also,, how critical are magnum vs large pistol primers. Both are very difficult ot find? Thanks!
The issue with a perfect gun , the first nick is so painful . Pitty the person that makes the first ding if it's not You !! You hate to have any people touch it . Now , it came with the 1st & 2nt ding ... feel free to take out in the field or let other people shoot it , it will gain more battle scars & character with use & age !!
Oh yes. Having it pre-dinged is a plus😄 Trips to the range can be much more relaxing now.
Hey I really enjoy your videos, as I am a hopeless lever gun fanatic! I currently own a 1894 Marlin Cowboy limited, 24” octagon barrel in .44 magnum, a newly purchased Henry Big Boy steel in .357 magnum, and I have an original 1892 Winchester made in 1897 which has been re-chambered in .357 magnum, and is real gem of a shooter. I have a rather simple question for you. You have metal targets mounted on metal fence posts - how are you attaching those targets to the posts? I need to do the same thing and was wondering how they are attached. Keep posting these great videos (and try a Henry Big Boy steel. I think it is equal to, if not a little better than a Ruger made Marlin)Thanks!
Probably get marked up soon as you take it out in the field for any length of time,just adds character.
Yes sir. I will not fret over every tiny mark on this gun.
@@TargetSuite 👍
Hey George, do you think the Rossi has tighter rifling? Perhaps a cold hammer forged barrel in the Rossi, I hear those are slower.
That's a good question. I have recently contacted Rossi about some technical questions and I hear nothing in return. I don't know that they have any technical people here in the US to answer questions like that.
I have a Henry big boy brass .44 with a 20 "octagon barrel. To say i love this rifle is correct. It will shoot almost anything accurate. 240 to 270 grns.i hand load all my rounds. And i am at max charge of imr 4227. The rifle likes it that way. It will almost keep 1" at 100yds. I have a 1-5 Leupold scope on mine . God bless. 😊
If the powder completely burns in the shorter barrel, then there will be no increase in the longer barrel.
Just a guess- slower burning powder would gain more velocity in longer barrel!?
Have model 92 in 44 mag since 2013. Start with the bad first.
Only 2 things did not like when and after I bought it was only half of a loading door on it. Obvously knew about it when I bought it.
But did not know about this. Then after I shot it the 1st few times, don't like sights on it. Don't get me wrong they are good out to 50 yards, but longer shots then 50 yards not very good.
Other then that very good rifle, nice and light, actually 1 of the best I have. At the time thought I was paying to much $$$. But comparing other post and the gun prices now days I got a great deal on it.
At least it sounds like there's a happy ending to that sad story
I am no professional but what's happening is, it's a pistol caliber made for a short barrel. So in the rile length barrel your getting a complete powder burn so the gains are minimal after 16 to 20 inches. Your reaching the maximum velocity in less than 24 inches
I think your velocity increase is going to be slow with longer barrel length due to the expansion ratio..not a very big chamber size for a .429 bore. So a small amount of expanding gas to push on the base of the bullet.
Exactly right and this is why slower "rifle" powders are not helpful in a pistol caliber carbine. They are made for bottleneck cartridges which have more powder space and much smaller expansion ratios per inch of barrel.
These marks has nothing to do with the make of the gun, it's been mishandled. Although, all mu guns have marks from being used, I don't mind. It give character to the gun and show it is something I enjoyed using. I never buy a gun for the safe only.
I agree 100%. I believe that these dings came from the gun store not rossi.
@@TargetSuite I bought my son a 1892 .44 Magnum from Miroku, when he turned 16 ( few years ago now) replaced the wood as it had very ''boring'' but well made, wanted to give the gun some personal touch.
Re tang sight: Other than improving the appearance of the rifle, I don't think the 44 Magnum is suited much beyond 150 yards - so why bother with a tang sight?
It's just something I've always wanted to do and it will be purely an adventure in shooting without any real practical application. Where'd you say it another way long range shooting with a 44 mag will just be for fun😉
@@TargetSuite Sounds like a great reason to invest in a tang sight, I look forward to a future video with your results.
@@ZREXER1250 I also used a 44 Magnum in a T/C Contender with a 14" barrel for metallic silhouette shooting, it is quite effective on the rams at 200 meters as long as bullet placement is high on the ram. I eventually switched to a 7 mm IHMHSA because of bullets with much better BCs and greater retained energy at the greater distances. The 44 Magnum is great for targets and steel beyond 150 yards, less so for game animals - IMHO.
@Mark Carew I agree with the limited range of the 44 Magnum. 75 yards is about it for me when it comes to hunting. And with that said I've never taken any deer with a 44 magnum Beyond about 40 ft.
Tang sights are an improvement for old eyes like mine.
Bought a Ranch Hand in .44 Mag and put a regular butt stock on it. Added a Skinner rear sight and it's good to go as a camp gun.
When you shoot cartridges that burn pistol powder, the longer barrel is not an advantage.
Switch to a magnum rifle powder and you will see an improvement in both the shorter and the longer barrel, but not in the pistols.
Logic tells me you are correct. I did have a couple of factory loads that showed a significant increase with the longer Barrel. No telling what powder they used. And my hand load with the 125 grain Lehigh Defense bullet also showed a significant increase with the longer barrel. However on that particular round the bullet has a big Hollow base and so I'm able to put a lot more powder behind that bullet. In fact, the case is just about a tenth of an inch from being from being full and when the bullet is seated the extra powder gets pushed up into that recess effectively giving me greater case capacity than normal for the 44 Magnum. Thanks for your comment, and thank you for watching!
That 125 grain copper at 2500 ft per second is really impressive! Being that that's a copper fluid transfer do you think it would work well with deer? Do you know anybody that's actually used it for hunting? You would have a really flat trajectory and a lot more range. I wonder what velocity you have to maintain to achieve the fluid transfer because I know those bullets do not mushroom? Interesting as always thank you 👍
Hi from France, Rossi 44 mag works well with 240 grs FMJ or FMJ-SP with 44 mag load !
Wow! It's great to hear from you. I didn't know I had viewers from France. Thanks for your comment!
UA-cam keeps taking down a comment with a link in it. So aggravating.
Anyway, it seems the smaller ammo makers like Buffalo Bore are using most all the case capacity and it's yielding increased velocity with 4" extra barrel. I would also assume BB and Underwood and the like are using slower burning powders, to prevent pressure spiking too high and increase shove duration in longer barrels (revolvers, for one).
Yep. They don't allow links to any sites that sell firearms related stuff.
Beautiful rifle, my wife bought me a 45/70 brass framed Henry octogan barrel.
Haven't red the other comments but here's a thought. The only time a longer barrel is going to produce higher velocity is when all the powder is consumed in both barrels. If a larger charge is fired through a short barrel the excess powder does nothing to propell the bullet it simply makes a large flash at the muzzel.
Thanks for your comment. And the problem with pistol caliber rounds in a rifle is there's just not enough volume in the case to fill it full of slower burning powder which will generate pressure over a longer period of time resulting in higher velocity. So there is a point of diminishing returns. I'm hoping I can experiment a little bit and find out what some of those premium rounds are doing to get higher velocity out of a longer barrel. Thanks for your comment and thanks for watching!
I have seen impressive testing from Ruger M77/44 rifles , 18.5 " RE: Vel. . I think 20" is the sweet spot for Lever rifles . The 24 " may shoot better with open sights ??
You also get two additional rounds in the magazine with the 24" model.
You are right about that! Unfortunately, this rifle had some real issues and spent 4 months and customer service. When I got it back from Rossi it had rust on it and a new Barrel that was worse than the original. I'm hoping Marlin will come out with a cowboy model with a 24 inch barrel. That would be sweet!
I think a real sweet spot in the Rossi lineup is the 16” barrel R92 in 44mag with the skinner peep and picatinny rail forward of the action. The one with the large loop with paracord wrap. I could see putting a red dot on that and being a happy hunter out to about 100 yards, but most opportunities for where I hunt are around 50 yards.
I’ve been eyeballing the 454 Casull one though…not that I need it, but I sure do want it!
Hornady flex tip. That would be my choice bullet. It has a higher coefficient.
I have a Henry 22 and a Rossi pump 22(plastic)...... shooting wise the Rossi stands up to the Henry
I've been looking at getting 357/44 lever action and since Rossi is a couple hundred dollars less, that's the way I'm leaning
I might notice the marks in the wood.....I really don't think that has to do with the brand, probably the dealer
Good morning.... Nice shooting.... I looked at the rifle ... Before I bought my Henry Big Boy 44.... The safety on the Rossie and the wood stocks seemed cheaper than I liked... Then I seen they are no longer AMERICAN Made. So that helped my decision on Buying my Henry.... Thanks for the video.
Thanks for your comment! As far as I know , Rossi rifles have always been made in Brazil. And they have been through quite a few changes in quality. I'm glad they are on the uptick right now. Thanks for watching.
@@TargetSuite Yes, Rossi was originally from Brazil, then got taken over by Taurus (also in Brazil) and is now owned and manufactured by CBC (also in Brazil).
When comparing Henry, Marlin, Winchester, Uberti and Rossi, we should never forget that the Rossi are substantially lower cost than the other ones. I don't know about the US, but here in Germany, Rossi is literally half the price of the others. For what they are, they are really good rifles that shoot well. They are not as luxurious as the others.
Hi George
I’ve just read about 400 comments, you may not get much F.P.S. Increase with the 24” barrel but my experience are that the loudness is decreased substantially compared to a 16” barrel 44 magnum. If you’re sitting at a bench in the back 40 lobbing a box of ammo, it may not make much of a difference since you’ll be wearing hearing protection but people a quarter mile away or deer during archery season may respond differently. Maybe.
I have a single shot CVA in 44 magnum that I use for hunting sometimes and I cut it down from 22 inches down to 16 1/2 inches to be able to get through thick brush and also fit in a small blind better. The CVA is very accurate but it is much louder than when it was at 22”.
Adding a different perspective ,Dave.
Thanks Dave. It's good to get a "fresh" response👍👍
When I cut the CVA 5.5” off of 22”. My near max loads of 300 grain copper with H110 printed a few inches lower at 200 yds.
I was guessing that it was mostly due to reduced fps. I don’t have a cronnie. Maybe barrel harmonics and muzzle crown are help effecting it printing lower.
@@davidedward13nothing wrong with your perspective but any rifle, regardless of how loud at the muzzle, unless it’s suppressed and shooting near subsonic loads, can/will spook game. Plus if you’re the only one in the woods trying to be quiet, it’s noble but no one else around you is going to care…they’re going to shoot whatever they brought…likely an inappropriate target gun in some hyper velocity cartridge with a tanker style muzzle brake on the end that shakes the forest and deafens all around it…to shoot a deer at 50 yards.
Maybe in the lower power rounds the powder gets mostly burned up in the first 20 inches, so you get velocities that are very close, even faster in a shorter barrel. But more powerful rounds there is more powder to burn, so you can get higher velocities out of the longer barrel. I've heard of this in 22 rifles where the powder is all burned up before it leaves the barrel. Never thought about it on bigger rounds like 44 though, but I suppose it is possible.
Good thoughts. It could very well be something like you have pointed out.
Most .44 mag factory loads are probably optimized for 6 inch barrels (revolvers) because if you had a load that needs 16 inches to completely burn up, all you'd get from your revolver would be a 10" fireball and no velocity...
Nice rifle! I think you've found the point where barrel length doesn't gain you much velocity. I have a .44 mag Rossi with the 16" barrel and when I use Hodgdon's data for a 20" barrel I get nearly the same velocities, so 16 to 20 already doesn't make much of a difference. Between that 16" and my 12" ranch hand there's still not a heck of a lot of difference, and that's with H110.
I've gotten slightly higher velocities in the 12" barrel with Lil'gun (using less powder too), but I'm not sure about longer barrels.
I think your main advantages with the 24" is a longer sight radius and more magazine capacity. In case you didn't burn through enough ammo as it is, haha!
Haha! Thanks for your comment!
You just bought a rifle that was "pre-dinged" as the Tappert Brothers would say.
Haha! I like that. And coming pre-dinged sure does make those early trips to the range more relaxing😄
Plated bullets have a velocity ceiling. The powder burn rate is definitely a factor also
Thanks! I was a couple hundred feet per second below the velocity ceiling for the berries bullets. But you are right about the burn rate. That is a major factor.
"Take a look at your shorts" that shocked me for a second. Oh no, where is he going with this, Rossi underwear?
Haha! I won't make that mistake again I promise you😄
I love this channel. Probably bore and chamber dimensions vary. That volume may be enough to cause pressure drop on the long barrel. It makes sense to me that when everything is pushed to maximum, that is where you stand a chance of gaining from the extra length, as the time under pressure beats out the volume increase effect. Fantastic experiment, thank you.
Thank you. I appreciate your input! And thanks for watching!
I really miss my three levers
I let one get away a long time ago. I sure miss it. But sometimes life demands sacrifice😉
I would either go with a Marbles tang sight or a Lyman receiver sight. Both would be great for longer range shooting. The Marbles of course would be more historically correct for an early 92, while the Lyman would be for a later one.
Yes, it's burn time in the barrel. All pistol powder is used up in a few inches of travel. Rifle powder will get more bang out of a longer barrel.
I have a Rossi 44 mag in a short barrel. It’s fantastic and so small it looks like a carbine pellet rifle.I killed a deer with it at 60 yards dropped in its tracks with leverlution ammo
As far as the velocity, it could be the quicker burning powder kept the bullets at the same velocity, and a slower burn rate could have increased the velocity in the longer barrel. Just a thought!
As others mentioned with some loads the optimal velocity may be reached in a shorter barrel, 'But'. Even when of the same length length not all barrels are equal. You should have seen some significant velocity increase with an extra 4 inches of barrel. Variations in chamber, rifling, and other dimensions could all be important. My guess is if you cut 4 inches off of the 24 inch barrel it will shoot slower than the other barrel.
For a 44 mag the only reason for a 24 inch barrel is for a longer magazine tube or longer sighting radius. Now for a 25-35 with reloads and slow powder I can see the wisdom of a longer barrel, but then it has been a long time since anyone to my knowledge has made a 25-35 rifle.