hey thanks for teaching my son how you play. I adopted my autistic nephew about 8yrs ago he had dexterity problems and he hated the workouts the Dr gave him so I put him on tekken and gave him an arcade stick and his dexterity improved over a year so much the dr was dumbfounded and now he's recommending other parents to get their kids into tekken. He's learned alot from. You and tought it was a cool story thanks fgc yall have been super supportive I even got his first combo on video i was so proud.
First of all congratulations to you and your nephew/son. So you’re saying tekken could be a way to improve someone’s dexterity? I’m genuinely curious? You know science stuff lol
I've become so much like Lee Chaolan it's scary. I wear long fur-collar coats and physically assault my adoptive father . When I look in the mirror, I can't help but say "Tatakai to wa motto eregantona monoda na". I can't have s*x with my girlfriend anymore without forcing her to dress up as Nina or Alisa, both of whom remind me of Lars. When I order sushi, I refuse to get sashimi, because it sounds too much like mishima. I just keep b2 looping forward, until my father is destroyed
@ you think it’s that bad? Where it’s competitively an issue? It’s strong but imo he doesn’t have much and even those, he gets like one per round. Strong but not busted to me
@@JIX9ISLER1986 it does too much, side walk left in neutral to beat his low, when he has a demon paw that will catch you for doing that. And it just should not do everything lmao
His heat smash was pretty OP. That was the big nerf DJ had. And it wasn’t just TMM asking for that. Plus, that was the only thing TMM complained about.
I'll rematch if you have at least 70 defence, most of the ppl I fight are fake 90+ attack with 30 defence just spamming flow charts or knowledge checks.
At some point. You just get over it honestly. Eventually Everybody has their own reasons for bot rematching. As a hwo main I try to keep some self awareness. Some people hate my guts in the same way and I understand if they refuse to rematch. Win or lose. Maybe someone had a burglar just invade their house. What if they were running late to work and just wanted to squeeze in a quick 10 minute game. Before giving their job several hours of their life At the end of the day we're all just trying to have fun and enjoy life however way we can. It might help to keep in mind. Relax. Its just a game bro :P
I love those nerf ideas for bryan. I understand he's difficult but at the same time, it's hard to admit that when he has a lightspeed attack that's plus 5 and a demon paw that goes halfscreen and is homing.
I feel like I’m being gaslit every time someone says Bryan is difficult. Like ok, maybe at Kishin and up, by at blue ranks and lower really people will press into his counter hit stuff all day
he's not difficult. He hasn't been since T7. check the amount of taunts you see compared to hatchet even at high level. He was difficult when you had to rely on taunt step which is no longer necessary
@@Ti_Fire Kishin is hardly the bar for what makes a character hard to play. If you're talking about skill floor of getting started, sure, but usually people are talking about skill ceiling. IE opening up good players.
Hes not difficult to play in neutral, and taunt is not required to play him because of his strong tools. People that tell you Bryan is extremely difficult are purposely trying to play him in a way they makes him difficult to play, but it is entirely possible to get GoD with Bryan and never using taunt simply because of how good his pressure tools and poking are atm. He’s defo overtuned, I know players who were barely orange rank in t7 and are now tekken god with Bryan in t8, they aren’t some kind of prodigy, ofc they put work in but Bryan does a lot of the work. Not insanely difficult to learn, but difficult to master, a Bryan specialist is of course impressive.
Yeah, cannonball straight being +5 is indeed ridiculous, and requiems tracking is so insane, nerfing the two would make Bryan more fun in neutral, as he would be more diverse, and more fun to fight against, as he wouldn't have such oppressive neutral
Both qcb1 and qcf1+2 have made him ultra braindead in neutral in T8. The moves are actively hurting his identity as a character because there's almost no reason why you shouldn't spam both when the reward is so high and the risk is so low.
Legit I think you fix law if you lock the dss plus frames behind execution again. That way new players can do dss combos but they don’t get insane frames by just holding forward while sniffing glue
@GerardoFirestorm No, it won't, lmao. Dude, legacy law players are already doing this stuff in 7 and previous iterations. Also any decent law if they notice you don't respect dss won't fully commit and counter hit you.
I think what they'll due is nerf the damage and lock season 1 dmg behind blue sparks, which can only be attained through legacy dss execution. Rather this is what would be cool if they did lol
@@GerardoFirestorm lol mishimas? Even Nina is executional for how good she is. her offense has to be seamless and fast, so you gotta give tons of variety and keep adding new stuff into it. Law is just braindead Dss into staying safe most of the round or game... they have to nerf it. i mean they can at least keep the ez version but make it less rewarding.
This braindead mixup exists now over 30 years. We laws face so many players that are familiar with the matchup and know how to take their turn. Have you checked out the win ratio of the character? Its not as easy as you think to be versatile with this character.
Played against a Nina last night for like 30 matches and I know the match up really well but she still feels unfair. I'm not even the type of person to cry about characters needing nerfs. I swear you can't ever press against a good Nina player and good luck ducking some of her main strings. SS doesn't really work against her poking either. The best advice I can give when fighting her is try to bait the power crush.
Dont listen to TMM he always has been overrating her. She has problems with range, tracking to her left (that's why they gave her b2, 2 in the first place) and hitting ch launching tools on block.
As a Shaheen main, he can be nerfed in a couple of ways, First, his f2 3 should not give +20 on hit. That is the main reason the whole gimmick of f 23, guard break, f23 guard break combo becomes possible with no repercussion. If f 23 get to be like +8 then i think based on frame, the opponent can stop the string with a low jab or power crash. Sure its a 50/50, but at least its a fair 50/50 other than duck or die. Second, his guard break should not do any damage. I do not understand why a character that has the ability to kill grey health does 14 damage on an unguardable for free like that. Get rid of that damage and you are really only left with f23 damage so it is not as overwhelming. Most importantly, I think all characters should have their power crash heat engagers nerfed one way or another. In Shaheens case, it gets way too overlooked on how easy it is to proc it if I am really desperate.
Frankly, Shaheen's toolset also tracks too much across the board. His df1 has a huge hitbox and is essentially impossible for a large portion of the cast to step. d3 also tracks in both directions. That's before you even get to his true homing moves at i15. The net effect is that you have to play 2D Tekken against Shaheen while he gets to move around as he wants. That is incredibly powerful in high skill play.
@@thefabledenglishman6000 This I do not agree with. His df1 tracks only ssrs and not ssl. Same thing with d3. The tradeoff is that he doesn't have any sort of big damage tools from it like Drag does with his df1 to 4 ch. He is a big keep your opponent in check kind of a character without any way to instakill your opponent and keep on dragging your plus frames. So I like that sort of playstyle, but I think his heat is a bit contradicting his playstyle cuz he goes all out in heat. Thats why his heat should be nerfed, but not his core mechanics.
@@ericpark8286 Go test his df1 and try to step it to the left. Most of the cast can't do it reliably. It has a huge delayed hitbox that makes it extremely difficult. It is borderline broken. You don't need big damage combo extensions when you have an i13 -1 df1. That alone is one of the best tools you can possibly have in a Tekken game because it sets up the most basic mixups Tekken has - which is a df1 into jab to beat mids or df1 into step to beat jabs. And Drag's df1 is steppable in both directions anyway. It isn't remotely comparable.
@@thefabledenglishman6000 If you can't do it "reliably" then that is a skill issue. You can definitely sidestep his df1, same with d3. As for the other things, you are only talking about his good things about his kit. Why not talk about the bad parts on how he has practically no moves that are + on block? There is only one move that is more or so used while having decent + on block, which is his stealth 1+2. It is 19f with +2. Best thing to do is to either do a while stand kick or grab. That is pretty much it. There is no move that can qcf 4 like drag or b3 like feng that can infinite plus frame on chip. I am not complaining about his weaknesses, i'm just saying if you gon call out his good stuff as if he is mr.perfect, then he has flaws too.
@@BustaNAugusta getting outplayed by any character hurts. the problem with people is they don't know when did they get outplayed and when something is broken/they have no options. including bryan mains. they gonna jerk themselves to their main and whine about other chars when they get outplayed by core tekken fundamentals
As 20 year yoshi main i think yoshi gameplay in tekken 8 was finally done perfectly.I have to agree that changing properties will make him less yoshi and less trolly. Changing his gameplay will make character less fun. If they cut the combo damage and damage from few moves would be good nerf without ruining the character.
@NotAigis- unblockable is a techtrap and 6 frame has short range and is launch punishable on block. Yeah its balanced. The problem isnt those moves. Its lies elsewhere. He aleays had flash and unblockables
@@NotAigis- Truth be told its not easy to counter them. The thing back then in t7 was that you could anticipate flash and techtrap. In t7 yoshi has other busted moves that are so strong he forces you after the ground to fall into the tech trap and his neutral game has very strong moves not allowing you to do anything. He pressures you until you try to push a button to flash. He either damage nerf on some moves and overall combo damage. The moves are not much different from t7. Just more damaging.
too many character's weakness all disappear with heat activated or it gives them access to way too strong moves when they're already strong character even without those heat enhanced moves. Everyone just ends up playing the same, they said the Heat will make each character unique, but in reality, it just turns everyone into a 50/50 monster, only just a very small handful of characters actually feel "unique" with Heat
+1 I see people thinking that changing some frames or damage here and there will really fix the game. But in reality that's just going to stabilize the mess that's already there. And a stabilized mess keeps being a mess at the end of the day.
@@johnmacoyea, T8 is just a fucking mess iMO. All they've been doing is making everything high damage, crazy 50/50, absurd frames, etc. It's just an exhausting game, and I say this as a hardcore tekken player of 20+ years, I just play this game less and less, it's sad to see it
Yup. This is exactly what happens when you create an all encompassing mechanic for a series/game like Tekken where the diversity and uniqueness of characters was always in their individual movesets. All in the name of "pulling in the casual" or making tournaments more enjoyable to watch...as if they werent in T7.
@@ATC43 yea T7 Season 1-3 were great IMO, then they kept adding CH and power creep Happened and I think the WORST offender was Kuni+Infinite stages, then idiots kept going “Tekken 7 is too much backdashing bruh” when it’s specifically Kuni on infinites. This was more of a character issue instead of game design issue, but the developers actually took that seriously and decided to just nerf all backdash, give chip damage, and remove infinites. I hate this approach to game design where instead of fine tuning each character, they just make a broad game system change where every character feels like they are put in a box and you have to only play a specific style, which is what T8 feels like, just non stop attacking, endless 50/50 and mashing like a lunatic and only focused on launchers and big damage, no wonder people are so exhausted and already burned out from the game, it’s just too much of the same thing
@@bludika I have nothing to add. Completely agreed on every front. Especially the part about the T7 "issue" with backdashing being a character(and TWT rule) specific problem. Give me that over the system problems inherent to T8 any day of the week.
Dont even care about character nerfs at this point. Give me infinite rematch for quick match. For ranked, please either give us infinite rematch OR force the set. So tired of one and dones or someone getting back a win and leaving. Force the first to 2 or let us rematch many times (obviously with reduced points). I think the atmosphere of allowing people the freedom to not play the set while not allowing the freedom to keep playing is contributing to an environment where people are picking and choosing matchups more than ever. If someone could play a long set against an "annoying" character they struggle against, maybe they would be enticed to actuallt run it back and get some experience for the next time they run into them. I think now someone just goes "screw this, ill take one loss or yolo a win out and leave". I really think it has to be one or the other. Allow us infinite rematch or FORCE the best of 3 like most ranked modes in other fighting games.
forcing people to complete a set will never work; some people just wanna play a game before having to go out, and then some people get unfair matchmaking and dont wanna lose more points. for example; as bushin rank, i get matched up with tons of tekken God supreme and God ranks on their second or third characters. i shouldnt have to be forced to lose a potential 1000+ points to them when i shouldnt even be matching up with them in the first place
@@crillz9660dude, one match is not that long, they can look at the time and see if they have enough to compete 1 set, this is some high level drama queen stuff right here.
It's such a good thing we have TMM to be honest. So few people have an actual feeling for what's fair and balanced and what isn't. There's many more moves in the game that need nerfs but the things TMM mentioned just need to happen for now.
Season 2 character nerds are good and all but how about other quality of life changes? 1. Side setting "random" option if possible. 2. Battle BGM options: "Your Character" "Opponent Character" "Stage" "Random" 3. Opponent outfit settings: "Default" options. (They can keep their gimmick items) 4. Practice mode "Assign a button to immediately control CPU character." Instead of going through numerous menus. There's definitely more stuff but this is straight from the hip.
Even though all of my mains are on here I agree with this list 100%. You've got pretty much every character here and there isn't one that missing or one I disagree with. I do still wanna point out that Claudio outside of the wall still has noticeable weaknesses outside of that dp like shit lows, sub par jab game, etc.
Yeah exactly i main Claudio and he definitely has one of the worst jab neutral game . And ss4 is his only good committable low everything else is -on block. Db3 is +3 but it’s reactable and its launch lol
1) Jin. No tracking on ff2 - okay, if all ff2 and similar moves also loose tracking (Kaz's ff2 is way more pain in the ass to deal with). Nerf his heat smash - also okay, if he gets something else in heat (like making his Omen stance to have some range - now it's useless). Now in heat he has only heat smash or heat dash from ff2 or 1+2. 2) Law No tracking on 1+2 - okay, if dss 3 become mid: now his nunchacks are the only mid tracking option from dss. If 1+2 looses tracking, dss will be useless against SS+duck. 111 not to be a ch-launcher - okay, kinda fair. But all fast ch-launcher should be removed or made launch-punishable (yes, gachi-cat mains, I'm talking about you). Most of Law's buffs in t8 are compensation for his nerfs (for example in t7 he has 2 best whiff-punish moves in the game, now he doesn't). 3) Xiaoyu No mixup after backturn heat smash on heat - okay, just make it knockdown with some oki on hit. But I see no reason nerfing it on block. No heat wall combo - okay, if she gets back her wall oki setups. She always plays around her wall setups but most of them were deleted. And her Hypno mixup is fine: if you let her to transist into stance and charge her moves, it's your fault - you had plenty of time to interrupt you, and even now you can guess the mixup (and this mixup is launch-punishable in both sides: mid is steppable while low can be hopkicked). 4) Bears No need to nerf them - just delete them at all and bring back normal characters.
Ahh i still remember playing law in t7 starting out, my first combos off 3+4,4 whiff punish 😊 4u3-b2-b2,1-ff2,3 and if it wall carried then i did junkyard dragon tail lol
IMO they can nerf Xiao hypnotist and should, but also bring back her setups, all of them, these were extremely fun to do and allowed much player expression, much more than having to rely on Hypnotist for your entire mixup game, it was also much more hype to watch. NONE of the setups were broken balance wise and its pretty clear that people facing Xiao hate her new mixup more
I cant believe TMM has no clue how Law works in T8. Law got massive nerfs from 7, every thing he has going for him now are compensations. i agree with 1,1,1 being brutal but other characters shouldnt have that either to beging with. His winrate is one of the lowest in high ranks for a reason. The best law's who have mained him for a decade + struggle.
@@bekabex8643 well lets hope the devs know these things, i think they do as only slide was really touched. 1,1,1 seems like an intentional design choice so i think its gonna stay
@nayd5043 they hate her new mixup cause they don't know the counterplay. If you know the match-up, her mixup becomes more risky than the classic Mishima-style mixup. Both options are launch-punishable unless Xiaoyu has +20.
I actually agree with most of the King nerfs, df2's hit confirm is kind of needed so I'd rather they just find a way to nerf the combo damage from it. And RKO I think is perfectly reactable online considering it comes out of the sprint, which has a long windup itself. Anytime King goes into the sprint you have a lot of time to mentally prepare yourself to look out for the move, and then suddenly 23 frames isn't that tough to react to anymore. That's a big part of reaction time that you get to take care of before the RKO animation even starts
So Claudio has to take risks on every low. He has to have good mids to make up for the lack of everything else. Claudio Wall game has been his specialty since T7. Again, he has to have something if Claudio doesn't have 50/50. Claudio is strong, but your ideas for nerfs only serve to make it easier for you to play defense. because you don't know what to do, not to make the character better, so i disagree with your assessment.
Claudio already has an S tier wall game in t7, where his only real low was ss4. That low isn't flashy but it's -12 ob and gives advantage on hit and has a solid ch effect. That paired with running 2 which now deals chip damage alongside the mega mids would still give him an S tier wall game. The low heat smash is just overkill, with all the aforementioned, and making it -15 would still keep it as a relevant threat in his kit. It would also keep him as the mid dispensing machine.
ninas 12 frame homing slap move is 3 highs in a row bro you can duck it at anytime and its launch punish it. there's nothing op about that its launch punishable. and comboing into side step one plus 2 is extremely hard to connect. you notice in the vid he claimed it can get you a combo and then he didn't get a combo. lol. db2 is only a counter hit combo and it has a 24 frame startup if your pressing against a move that slow you deserve to get comboed. the only remotely unfair thing i think ninas has is deleting recoverable health on throws, but keep in mind almost all her lows are negative 20 or more on block, she doesn't have a hopkick combo starter. and so many of her strings have launch punishable highs. people really overestimate her and just fail to realize her obvious weaknesses in counter play. duck launch her highs block her lows then launch her and shes easily beaten. also every throw she has that deletes recoverable health can be teched out of by simply pressing 2.
11:21 I'm an enthusiast player and law was my first main in t7. and not only I agree with (almost) everything, there are some things more I would love being changed. the only thing I disagree is that 1, 1, 1 isn't easy to confirm. it's not hard, by any means. but it is not trivial. I think the confirm window is adequately tight. that being said, the most obvious thing is just to bring dss back. you can't have godly frames/pressure with just 0 execution. the high execution demand was what made it interesting. being able to pressure on neutral with ws4 was a big show of reflex and technique. they could simply keep both systems, as they interlap. just make it so that you can only get perfect frames and blue sparks with legacy dss input. like this: going for the easy input all moves get 3 more frames of startup, and legacy input can have access to his options as they are today. this simple change would bring all that made law exciting back, without changing anything to casual players as they barely know what a frame is lol (and they don't even use dss to pressure, let's be honest). the second change is what he already talked about, to make slide and nunchuck linear. the slide tracking is simply idiotic. also, make ws2 NOT push back. ws2 launches, has a big range and TRACKS. why tf does it have pushback?????????????? and about the nunchuck, it has terrible recovery, so whiffing it is lethal. problem is, it tracks way too much. making it more linear would require you to condition your opponent before having access to it, which would be cool. I think that these changes would be enough to make law an AMAZING character, and without making him weak. I would love that version of him third change is ridiculous but it is a SYSTEMATIC problem in t8. his ff3 power crush for some god forsaken reason tracks too much and is -13. MINUS THIRTEEN. this is simply ATROCIOUS. in my opinion, most if not all power crushes should be LAUNCH PUNISHABLE. this should simply not exist. it is so obvious that I almost forgot lol oh, a smaller but welcome change too would be to make uf3 a bit slower. it's already super linear, which is cool, but once your opponent plays too linear you can simply spam it. should be a bit slower but still faster than f1+2. and talking about f1+2, it should track a bit less. I've had hit people sidewalking it, which I think is wrong. it should clip simple sidesteps but it should whiff on walk
As a Yoshi player, toning down his overall damage doesn't sound so bad. However, I think the guard break should stay. But instead of it giving Yoshi +14, it should give +13 so he can still get a guaranteed DF1,4. *EDIT:* Maybe even a guaranteed 1,1 after guard break when the opponent is near the wall.
the things is when u see the damage that other characters do is not fair lowering his damage alone. why nina and dragunov got damage nerfs and u believe they are the only ones that need it not really so . btw other characters have guard break and yoshi managing to apply that is fine o-o.
He’s not saying the guard break should go it’s the post-combo guaranteed tech trap into it. They tend to be nerfing those types of things anyway, so they probably will. They practically emergency hotfixed the game over Jun’s similar setup.
@@DoctorDarlingTTV paul bryan and some other character have that too same with wall splat doctor and in paul and bryan case they have guaranteed combos yoshi only have his back punish. having a guard break that u cant do anything makes no sense but if they remove from everyone then its fine i dont mind yoshi have other tools 👍👍
As a Jin main and I feel other Jin mains can agree with the idea the heat smash should have less range than it does demon paw was stupid on launch and still is that includes Kazuya’s I don’t mind less range and tracking bcuz a good player can realign with movement anyway no matter what nerfs he gets unlike the people who dropped characters like Reina and dvj and victor after nerfs I think Jin mains will stay loyal to him higher execution in s2 would be nice also and more fun too
Nobody left Deviljin because of the nerfs, only in competitions did they stop playing with it because it wasn't viable against Alisas, Dragunov's, Ninas etc.
I can promise you one thing. Nerf him all you want Im still wining games with him cause most of the bums crying and complaining are sht anyway. Did the same thing with Heihachi only in reverse cause people say he isn't that good yet somehow folks still can't block for shit against him.
Ikr ppl complaining about Jin Fkn suck he’s got one of the most telegraphed movesets in the game. That being said d2 is stupid and I refuse to use it because it’s cheap af. His heat smash is basically the same as his T7 rage so let them cry
@@OutbreakPerfectDvJNobody left devil Jin because of the nerfs? You realize the math proves you wrong right? Devil Jin was one of the most popular characters used in the beginning of tekken 8. Now he’s barely used, look up the facts before you spout nonsense.
Before watching I bet I can guess the list 🙄 since all folks wanna do is cry the leading cause for the crying is VERY predictable: (No order) 1. Dragnov 2. Nina 3. Yoshimitsu 4. Jin 5. Ling 6. Law 7. Alisa 8. Kuma 9. King 10. Lili Edit: All except Lili and I didn't mention Shaheen, Claudio, Victor, and Bryan so thats 9/10 with 4 not mentioned. The 9 where obvious but the 4 of the others being mentioned surprises me.
The scary and damning part is that all of these buffs to these characters were intentional to have their pick rates increased. Nobody would have touched King, Alisa, Jin if they were not outright broken.
@@yellowscarlightningscream8347 king was always popular with new people literally me and a lot of others ik who got into tekken had king as their first main why r u capping
Bro was complaining about Claudio in Heat at the wall, but everything he described sounded very similar to what Kazuya does in Heat at the wall. I don't even know Claudio that well, but whenever I use Kazuya it feels like I completely shut my opponent down at the wall
I'm sorry but where in kazuyas movelist is there a long range homing safe mid (Claudio's B1)? Genuinely curious, because I believe that is what mainman is referring to, keeping in mind Claudio has that outside of heat as well
@brantrix What I meant is the general setup. Low Heat Smash, paired with Parricide Fist to scare you into not ducking, as well as df3 2 1, which can be delayed for frames or let go immediately to catch a reaction. For tracking, he has his b4 wallsplat, or heat dash on block. Just very opressive. Of course there is counterplay, but it's very hard to deal with. Again, I don't play Claudio, but to me Kazuya seems just as opressive at the wall as the scenario TMM was describing here.
@@chakrashadow3220 I think this is where your understanding may have a bit of a disconnect, all the moves you've stated are either steppable or duckable (has counter play) and comparing the frequency of kazuyas heat dash to Claudio's B1 is a bit disingenuous. What I took from the video is Claudio's B1 at the wall is strong because it is a safe, homing, long range mid (can neither be stepped nor ducked), and you cannot take your turn afterwards because the risk of power crush at the wall if it is blocked is too high. I think he explained his point quite well here, there is no counter play.
@@brantrix I said I know there is counterplay to Kazuya's wall pressure, but in my own experience, it's not too hard to condition opponents to react the way you want at the wall, or press accordingly to how they have played. Maybe I'm just used to the wall pressure scenario, but it doesn't seem too hard as Kazuya. Of course I know there's counterplay, but I don't see it very often. I'll pick up Claudio and see what the deal is, because his wall pressure doesn't seem too much harder to get out of than Kazuya's.
@@chakrashadow3220 You can sidestep petricide fist. You can't sidestep claudio homing's move. So with kazuya there is counterplay with claudio there isn't. Also as the other commenter said, you have to deal with kazuya heat's smash once per round where with claudio you can basically spam it which makes it impossible to counter to some degree.
The fact he said her chainsaw stance is insane even though people like Nina and Bryan and dragonoff can out jab her out of it as of most that can jab her out if it
She always had terrible lows. Nerf her lows and that Powercrush and she’ll be fine. Revert back her fc df4 sweep to the way it was (slower + no CH launch) and change the ch launch property to qcf 3 low and give it a different reaction on hit for a guaranteed follow-up like qcf 2 or ff3 instead of full launch.
@@since2133 So she's always had terrible lows and you want to make them crappier instead of nerfing her guns, ss4,2, b22...you know, the moves which are strong. Under your proposed changes, there would be no reason to duck against Nina, at all. The slow option for wipe the floor is 31f, insanely reactable and she dies in exchange for getting a ff3/qcf2 crouch cancel follow up? D2 will still be underwhelming since it's 0 on hit, and qcf3 ch only guaranteeing a qcf2 or ff3 is incredibly underwhelming since she's also gonna get launched on block. Removing the ch launchers on wipe the floor (and slowing it down) and qcf3 takes away any reason to duck against her. db3 is -13 on block, +4 on hit, and on ch only guarantees a followup from knockdown status. That's not scary enough that it will get me to duck. Lows and throws are how you open up people in Tekken man, this is so unserious lol.
@@Exponential_Entropy yeah they are about to kill the old school/legacy character because t8 systems buffed her too much. most/almost everything remained the same as she was in t7 but now she does a lot of chip and deletes chip in several ways/her guns do insane damage on wall. never heard people complainig about b2,2 in t7. yeah it's a strong move. ss1+2? yeah lets remove this. qcf2? lets remove this. db2? lets remove this. df1,2? lets remove this. throws delete recoverable health? lets remove her 20 years old throws I guess! and then nina ends up with literally nothing to work with. depressing time for tekken fans
Bro exactly. By their definition only his wall game is good so if you take that away then he’s arguably trash plus his neutral jab and low game is definitely lacking. I seriously don’t think he needs any nerfs
Ah okay… someone said to me TMM said „jin doesn’t have a varied set of lows and he wants to buff his other lows and nerf d+2.“i will get back to this guy for this attempt of gaslighting.
Am i wrong or doesn't season 2 start on january 1st? And we still miss 1 character in season 1. So they will bring out a character in less then a month and we still have no trailer?
As a Jin player yah the heat smash is busted and the character is way too easy compared to Tekken 7 like there is no execution beside electric now even electric can be done with 1 button it's so stupid the more easy the character is the more boring it gets
"the character is way too easy compared to Tekken 7 " This is NOT a Jin problem this is a Tekken 8 "problem" People forget steve law and many others that had execution are easier as well
@@JIX9ISLER1986while I do enjoy execution, and I think it's fun and needed on certain things, it's important to understand that high level play is more about the strategy and mind games than the execution. Raising the execution on a character doesn't really do much on a higher level of play, like at all. But I will say that it does lose some satisfaction with the loss of execution
Blah blah shut up and play a different character then Im so sick of you annoying ass legacy Jin mains crying about him being top tier now. Like genuinely shut the fk up and pick a different character then or just use him. Holy sht....
As a Drag player I think qcf4 should track less and should definitely not be +7. I think between +0 to +3 max. EXCEPTION would be to make it revert back to its launch version (+7/W!/no pushback) BUT consume heat. 2 or 3 of them uses your whole heat. That could be interesting. I think the hatchet range can stay as it is mainly bc of how far the pushback is on hit and him only being +3. One back dash and you're outta there.
As a King main I agree with everything, but I want to add with df21 95% of King players dont/can't confirm the counter hit let alone finish the combo after they accidently hit it.
Bryan’s block punishment also needs to be more consistent. Some moves just give way too much push back. This is a problem with a lot of the cast tho. Where something’s don’t get punished correctly. Also Bryan’s heat burst also has too much tracking. It tracks more than other characters and catches people stepping. Alisa df1 string is to strong as well. Lee is very strong as well I think he may get more shine and is going heavily under the radar because of more problematic characters.
PLEASE! Make a video about Negan in Tekken 7 like you did with Marduk and Akuma! Another character id love to see showcased is Eliza and Why they wouldn't work in Tekken 8 because of Super Meter. Love the channel and work you do. I always watch your videos to prepare myself to play.
This reminds me, Mainmanswe if you see this thank you so much for that anti yoshimitsu guide the other day, your tip to look out for his un-blockable sweep and orbital punish it worked like a charm. Fought a yoshimitsu with Steve today and he was helpless. Combo juggled him up and down the entire length of the stage every single time he tried it on me. 100% success rate son. it was glorious.
@@chickenpizza5703no, just nerf. What's even the point of nerfing a top tier who has literally everything if then you wanna compensate with buffs? He already has good lows outside d2.
i disagree with d2, i feel it should just not be almost homing and be side stepable like kazuyas. i feel-14 is fine in my opinion 21 should also be +3 or 2 like jack azu 21 not +6, or make it able to ss the 4 more consistent or -11 for the (4). man jin is perfect
That’s what I’m saying his neutral is not as good as most characters in this game aswell excluding his star burst but you need to activate it first in order for you to take advantage of it
people think Claudio is op cause he has db1+2 and low heat smash And I’ll be fine if they take that and bring back his tekken 7 things B33 ch luncher Ff1+2 was good in neutral D22 was good mixup if the opponent duck u can do hopkick They removed alot of his good stuff
I agree 100% people don't realize that's an actual weakness that Claudio has but I also don't think we should bring back d2 2 launcher because he would lose part of his identity of having shit lows and it'll always be more boring for me. I'm chill with low heat smash.
What I don't get is why you say Heihachi's heat smash is fair, at all, when it absolutely does the identical forced 50/50 of that of Xiaoyu's,. It's even better as it doesn't require a stance.
So still no proper solution for Yoshi. This will basically revert him back to T7 state with couple of additional moves. I believe ~70 dmg optimized combos is not something that deserves nerfs when there's Heihachi and his joke dmg. Besides that, there's still almost no Yoshis in top tournament stages, which is a clear indication that the character is not that strong as you think he is. Also no mention of Kazuya who was overtuned to S tier with the latest buffs, but somehow TMM is talking about nerfing Victor lol.
heihachi is significantly riskier with no access to flash, poorer lows, less healing, etc, he's an obejctively worse character than quite a lot of characters and his damage is one of the only things really going for him
For xiaoyu she has busted dmg in heat and wall splat cuz outside of that she doesnt have much fr. No insane + frame, most of her mix up is fake , easily steppable, she is top tier but not like other char, she is strong for evasion
Heat wall combo is the only situation xiaoyu can do comparable confirmed damage to other characters in the game. Every single character has crazy wall carry to crazy wall combo, I don't know why xiaoyu has to be the exception to not have that. I think nerfing heat and wall combos in general might work since almost every round those two things get combined.
both of u are right same with yoshimitsu like he dont have a single plus frame string and quick hit if people play more defensively is really hard to apply his combos and techs.
I think her heat game should be nerfed and her other tools buffed, its like the entire character is heat at this point which is kinda poorly designed. Revert all of the nerfs she got from T7 to T8 and then tone down her heat.
@@nayd5043 the entire character is far from being only heat, but the purely offensive stuff is pretty much all focused in heat. She gets easy access to + frames and a powerful mixup. Outside of heat offensive capabilities come from timing and setups mostly. Only potent mixup is pretty much hypnotist in heat since the other lows are not threatning enough. I like the idea of nerfing heat and buffing other tools but I hope it doesn't end up in a t7 character in t8.
@@Rius9106Its a little bit of a Tekken 8 problem for some characters, but I think heat power creep is too much. I dont think the Tekken 7 character in 8 will be much of a problem with the right mindset (actually if you look at good Tekken 7 Xiaos, she was kinda playing Tekken 8 in 7! They were so aggressive with the setups and pressure lol) because I think its a fact that her mixup utility outside of heat is worse in this game than it was before, but I think giving back her old setup/pressure with the current heat might be a bit too much. Personally I think nerfs to spike combo and backturn heat smash for some of her old tech back would be a fair trade
My problem with nina especially is that she's too safe for all that she has. You take next to no risks, just poking someone down. There are so many good mids that are just straight up safe, whereas other characters give up turns for a decent mid or straight up get punished. Then you add on the fact that she's evasive as hell, and it gets so tiring fighting her.
As a Feng gamer I agree he could still be toned down a bit. But b3 is similar to Bryan’s b1 except it doesn’t launch on counter, so it’s a little more plus to compensate. Honestly just giving him a generic df1 or at least one that doesn’t counter anymore could be a good balance change. The neutral df1 is kinda his identity at this point but the ch doesn’t need to stay Actually fcdf4 could be a stagger on block like the beta
As a Jin main, I agree with pretty much everything. His uf2 can be -10 as well. Other characters mentions are highely reasonable, I like how you elaborate every single nerf that you calling out for. GGs.
@@logicallyspeaking1780 not to discredit arslan but he tier whores if he’s playing her she’s probably o.p. Tournament results doesn’t mean the character isn’t good. Regardless arslan won proving she is still very good. A character can be broken and not win. It’s hard to win with anyone so people tend to lean towards the easy and broken rather than hard in broken because it takes away the level of being hard.
So tired of ppl clinging to the tourney argument like bro are you playing in tournaments placing in top 8s? No? So why compare that when you're just an average online mf playing the game like most ppl wtf is her being in tourneys gonna do for you personally.. besides potentially get her nerfed. Such a dumb argument.
For nina i have a proposition: keep her as she is with one change: make all of her attacks, even pokes 100% recoverable, so she needs to rely on her grabs to remove that recoverable health
8:52 see this is what i don’t get. Muscle Armor is the only safe on block power crush that King has, which makes for his bad backdash and movement in general. So why take that away and make all of his power crush punishable ? Everything else i agree.
@George_Spartan117 eddy, devil Jin, Zafina are just a few to name that do not. Ig zafina has one from stance, so she can't do it whenever she wants and only while in heat and it uses her heat as well. and the majority of the roster only has safe on block power crushes which are still launch on duck bc they are highs. Isn't kings a safe mid power crush? And it is confirmable.
@@Sicknificant1 The universal rule is: HIGH power crush = Safe on block MID power crush = not safe (unless you’re victor) As for zafina, she’s the only character that has a freaking power crush LAUNCHER. So it makes perfect sense to be unsafe on block. King’s muscle armor is not something you can spam and its not a panic button/keep out attack option either. Think of it almost like a parry. If you want to make muscle armor unsafe then make his B3 HIGH power crush safe (which was also nerfed significantly btw) let him have a defensive tool. You can’t take everything away
Nina is perfect the way she is. Very few people play her and even less are actually dangerous playing her, she demands high level execution to do her crazy shit, unlike those pesky Mishimas with their 1,1,2s, hellsweeps and easy heat electrics
@@centro-link It’s the same in every game. On SF6 release, people were going to war about Ken and JP being fine the way they are, other people just need to learn the matchup. People do their best trying to bs their way out of getting their obviously overpowered character nerfed
@@centro-link It's not the character, it's the player. I play both ranked and unranked (I'm blue rank ATM) and I hardly ever see Nina and even less do I fight someone who knows how to execute her tricky shit.
The problem with king is when they decided, you know what.. let him block instantly from jaguar sprint.. i somewhat understand the reason but it doesnt make much sense considering its a Sprint. What you could do is maybe let him do his little jaguar sidestep or whatever from jaguar sprint instead if you wanna try to run away from something.
Huh, Nina? A -14 powercrush, average lows, her df1,2 is very streppable & the rest of the stuff mentioned she’s had since Tekken 7 but was mid tier in that game and no one played her. Don’t let the best Tekken player in the world make you think she’s anywhere near the best lol. Jin & Drag are horrendous
I agree with pretty much everything here but have some notes (the ones i don't mention from the vid here is because i agree with what's been said and i don't have any significant note to add for them IMO): - Dragunov is strong but you can't compare his ability to take your recoverable health with Nina's. The only way he can take your recoverable health is with only one option AFTER he successfully ultimate tackles you, which is something you can kinda handle, just break the 1 option; Nina's options to get rid of your recoverable life on the other hand, are more efficient: if you panic heatburst after receiving one of her ridiculous damaging combos and she interrupts you with her i11 f2+4 throw, your recoverable health's gone; if you panic a -11 on block powercrush in the same situation, she punishes your powercrush with her f2+4 throw and your recoverable health is gone; if you do a -13 on block low and she blocks it, she can ws3 for 25 guarantee damage into a three different breaks guessing game for potential 40 to 50 damage in total (as far as i remember) and ALL of the three options take your recoverable health into crazy oki; and im not even counting the rest of instances where she can take your recoverable health like multithrows, etc. - Yoshi's wall ground flip setup after b1,1 into f1+2, also should be check, its a really a dumb situation where Yoshi only wins/wins. - King's b1,2 also should be checked since it is also easily CH confirmable, so King basically has an i12 SAFE counterhit launcher in a game where those have been significantly nerfed for everyone. I don't see his Jaguar sprint needed to be nerf since it is actually reactable even in a good 4bars connection, and im not a big fan of balance nerfs based on connection experience since according to that logic they should be nerfing things like snake edge. - Law's 1,1 heatdash combo, even if it now can be ducked i've never been a fan of having i10 launchers without significant risk at least, btw i think Hwoarang's while in heat 2,4(RFS) counterhit combo is even more ridiculous than Law's one, and that one also needs to go. - Feng: i think they've been taking the wrong approach on nerfing his back kempo, such as nerfing his launcher, etc... the thing is Feng never commits to the launcher there since he only does that option AFTER he sees his opponent whiffing a move, so its irrelevant if his launcher option is launch punishable or not (outside the mixup of course), characters with this type stances with HUGE backward evasive properties shouldn't be able to block during the entire animation of the stance if they don't commit to an attack, that's why Fengs kinda spam that stupid stance and get away with it most of the time (btw there's a bug in training mode thats been around since i have memory even in previous tekken that happen to certain stances, where the dummy cant block during back kempo even if you record it to block for those who think its viable to punish it on reaction by testing it that way). - Victor wall setup is dumb either way even if there are few characters who counterplay it (Jack, King, Hwoarang, etc), you can powercrush the f4,2 route, but he also has the 2,1 into stance 2,2 route which is a force block and you can't powercrush through that one on wake up.
@@thefabledenglishman6000 go to training, set the dummy first action to block and second action to punish, in the punish section record one action to stay blocking and in other to retaliate with df1 for example. Now you using King, jab the dummy on block which is +1 and then b1 and only go for the 2 extension if you see the dummy doing something in between your jab and the b1, and tell me if it is not confirmable...
@@vlastermaster Anecdotal claims aside, you have 12 frames to input the 2 after seeing the counter hit. That is far faster than accepted human reaction time in Tekken.
@@vlastermasterI’ve tuned into Jesandy streams a lot, the top King guy, and I’ve watched him test if this is CH confirmable. He couldn’t do it. It’s not a consistent thing to pull off like df2 1
Imma be the one to say it. IMO, I feel like they should bring back the counter hit property for one of Bryan’s moves ( while crouching) df4. That’s just me
Bryan is so underestimated its the character with Aslia that i struggle the most against , his lows are just unpredictible and do so much damage , adding a wall carry 50% health damage combos and a very good neutral .
As a Jin main 1) D2 = i agree i said this myself make it either -15 on block keeping the Counter hit combo or keep it -14 but take away the CH launcher 2) Heat Smash = Jin has no HEAT buffs so nerfing the range on the heat smash would not make sense UNLESS you BUFF his Power Stance 3) 214 = yes it is a great move HOWEVER the counterplay is simple - if Jin delays the 4 you can side step and launch him (turn on your brain) If you take away the CH knockdown then it better be +6 in hit
Bro, I can count the times i had my 214 stepped with the fingers of my one hand in 2400+ hours of Jin in Tekken 7... It was bitched to all hell for being the perfect string, perfect OS for steps/mashing in t7, and there it was "only" +4 on counter hit. It's incredibly taxing mentally to step, and holy hell you have to be predictable with it for your opponents to do it. And if so, even if your opponent tries to step your (21)4, they sure as hell aren't ducking 2,4 - another mental stack lol. The CH knockdown has no business being there. If you wanna keep the CH knockdown, make the last hit unsafe or make the blockstun and recovery longer after 2,1.
@@songoku6067 Jin does not have any enhancements while in heat status - his power stance is basically useless unless its near a wall - that is why his heat smash is that good - if you nerf the heat smash they have to buff his heat properties
@@Alpdude "Bro, I can count the times i had my 214 stepped with the fingers of my one hand" that sounds like a skill issue - the counterplay for 214 has always been the same - if jin delays the 4 he dies
Honeslty I rather see a nerf to claudio db1+2 rather than his heat smash cuz that move allowed me to rob to many goddamn game, as you said he goes way to deep into the pasta. His low heat smash on the other hand is fine, he doesn't have strong lows anyway.
couldn't agree more. especially with Alisa, her chainsaw stance is completely broken and forces you into guessing and / or just taking the massive chip. absolutely not fun, very frustrating.
Ppp just jumping on the “nerf Nina” bandwagon she’s not an issue literally if you say it’s her frames that’s the character clowns. You literally have to know what moves to do and also combine it with ss1 cancels that’s how she’s played a fast framed poke character. No issue with her she’s not broken at all u guys are just trash and don’t know how to deal with the opponent . Also has a lot of highs literally just fuzzduck often and can laugh her more often than not it’s gonna be a high first hit unless your ducking a lot then the opponent will adapt and use dF2 poke and extensions more
Tbh I hope they sensibly nerf Yoshi just so people will stop telling me "I'm carried" for playing him. Completely ignoring the work I put into actually doing it *well* I think MMSwe said in a recent video that boiled down to Yoshi being easy to play, which I very much disagree with.
Awwww, you want a participation trophy for playing a video game? Especially a dogshit, button masher like tekken 8. You are carried it is the sad truth. Everyone is carried in this sorry excuse for a game. Stop crying. Tmm beta soy boy self is turning you all into bitches.
I don't think so kuma wall combo needs a nerf cuz for years this guy got beated on wall like crazy for no reason it's a fair he can hit you hard on the wall aswell
hey thanks for teaching my son how you play. I adopted my autistic nephew about 8yrs ago he had dexterity problems and he hated the workouts the Dr gave him so I put him on tekken and gave him an arcade stick and his dexterity improved over a year so much the dr was dumbfounded and now he's recommending other parents to get their kids into tekken. He's learned alot from. You and tought it was a cool story thanks fgc yall have been super supportive I even got his first combo on video i was so proud.
First of all congratulations to you and your nephew/son. So you’re saying tekken could be a way to improve someone’s dexterity? I’m genuinely curious? You know science stuff lol
I've about fighting games being used as a tool for recovering hand functions
thats awesome
i thought this was gonna be a troll comment but thats actually really cool
Really?
First on the list nerf Devil Jin.
Devil Jin doesn't need nerfing he's bottom 5
@@PabloRey18 Agreed he's too strong. They need to make his wave dash side steppable.
@@PabloRey18 It's a joke. Devil Jin gets nerfed every patch so now it's tradition to just nerf Devil Jin
His jab comes out too fast, it should be f15
That reminded me when Leroy was the worst character in this game and they nerfed him in the next patch... That was Hilarious
They should give dragunov electric ngl
And Yoshi flash
And make Qcf 4 i5 and unblockable
They should give him a wavedash and chainthrows to mix up his throw game
Mid electric which is +10 on block with no pushback!!!...
@@dannyrpt ngl I am kinda sad we lost Drag's chain throw.
I've become so much like Lee Chaolan it's scary. I wear long fur-collar coats and physically assault my adoptive father . When I look in the mirror, I can't help but say "Tatakai to wa motto eregantona monoda na". I can't have s*x with my girlfriend anymore without forcing her to dress up as Nina or Alisa, both of whom remind me of Lars. When I order sushi, I refuse to get sashimi, because it sounds too much like mishima. I just keep b2 looping forward, until my father is destroyed
u dont have a gf
Notice how every UA-camr never says their character need nerfs
@@RomariosoflyI don’t think kazuya here would need any nerfs
@@KahnzTV FF2 in heat and Shikuae are busted. And Patricide fist needs toning down besides that Kazuya is fine.
@ you think it’s that bad? Where it’s competitively an issue? It’s strong but imo he doesn’t have much and even those, he gets like one per round. Strong but not busted to me
I stopped playing tekken 8 to go see a movie and Jims scourge is still tracking to me in the cinema pls help
side WALK LEFT beats d2 in the neutral
side step duck punish beats it as well
@@JIX9ISLER1986 it does too much, side walk left in neutral to beat his low, when he has a demon paw that will catch you for doing that. And it just should not do everything lmao
@@Hypanoz That is why you side step duck to beat both options - its an option select movement
if the demon paw tracks and you sidestep duck you will still get hit
@@jedcole6545 nope watch this video - evidence @37:51
How Tekken Influencers GASLIGHT YOU into a False Consensus: The DEFINITIVE Compendium
Last time Tmm asked for nerfs. He killed DVj
He killed? What?
and now he's asking to kill legacy/oldschool nina because she breaks chip system
Low key where's the mention about Kazuya nerf when dude's in Heat
Back when people bitched about anything that's "broken" without really learning the matchup. Its sad to see what DVJ became of those outbursts
His heat smash was pretty OP. That was the big nerf DJ had. And it wasn’t just TMM asking for that. Plus, that was the only thing TMM complained about.
Wrong. Every character aside from my main should be nerfed.
Who's your main?
@@GuestieyeVids2.0 YOUR MOM
He said that. So many characters he mentioned but not Kazuya
@@wwk_ exactly. calling other characters for 50 50 mix nerfs but doenst mention the true 50 50 machine with demon paw mid hit tracking in neutral.
@@wwk_ kazuya isnt op he didnt mention all chars anyway
I curse the entire bloodline of those who win and do not rematch.
Amen 🙏
Those people know they're frauds.
I'm not a witch so I don't curse bloodlines but I agree with your sentiment
I'll rematch if you have at least 70 defence, most of the ppl I fight are fake 90+ attack with 30 defence just spamming flow charts or knowledge checks.
At some point. You just get over it honestly. Eventually
Everybody has their own reasons for bot rematching. As a hwo main I try to keep some self awareness. Some people hate my guts in the same way and I understand if they refuse to rematch. Win or lose. Maybe someone had a burglar just invade their house. What if they were running late to work and just wanted to squeeze in a quick 10 minute game. Before giving their job several hours of their life
At the end of the day we're all just trying to have fun and enjoy life however way we can. It might help to keep in mind. Relax. Its just a game bro :P
I love those nerf ideas for bryan. I understand he's difficult but at the same time, it's hard to admit that when he has a lightspeed attack that's plus 5 and a demon paw that goes halfscreen and is homing.
I feel like I’m being gaslit every time someone says Bryan is difficult.
Like ok, maybe at Kishin and up, by at blue ranks and lower really people will press into his counter hit stuff all day
he's not difficult. He hasn't been since T7. check the amount of taunts you see compared to hatchet even at high level. He was difficult when you had to rely on taunt step which is no longer necessary
@@Ti_Fire Kishin is hardly the bar for what makes a character hard to play. If you're talking about skill floor of getting started, sure, but usually people are talking about skill ceiling. IE opening up good players.
Hes not difficult to play in neutral, and taunt is not required to play him because of his strong tools. People that tell you Bryan is extremely difficult are purposely trying to play him in a way they makes him difficult to play, but it is entirely possible to get GoD with Bryan and never using taunt simply because of how good his pressure tools and poking are atm.
He’s defo overtuned, I know players who were barely orange rank in t7 and are now tekken god with Bryan in t8, they aren’t some kind of prodigy, ofc they put work in but Bryan does a lot of the work.
Not insanely difficult to learn, but difficult to master, a Bryan specialist is of course impressive.
@@Ti_FireI agree, I feel like I'm being gaslit every time I hear how difficult bryan is.
As a Bryan player. I completely agree. Nerf his neutral, not his damage. Bryan's thing is his counter hit of death.
Yeah, cannonball straight being +5 is indeed ridiculous, and requiems tracking is so insane, nerfing the two would make Bryan more fun in neutral, as he would be more diverse, and more fun to fight against, as he wouldn't have such oppressive neutral
@@Hypanoz yea idk why his qcf 1+2 tracks so much. It's not like bryan has bad homing moves. He has excellent ones. Ff4 and 1+2 is amazing
Even neo soul crusher?🥺
Both qcb1 and qcf1+2 have made him ultra braindead in neutral in T8. The moves are actively hurting his identity as a character because there's almost no reason why you shouldn't spam both when the reward is so high and the risk is so low.
@@McDouble-qj9tb is that 3+4,2?
Legit I think you fix law if you lock the dss plus frames behind execution again. That way new players can do dss combos but they don’t get insane frames by just holding forward while sniffing glue
You can always jab interrupt him on dss. Adding the muh execution; in the game where everyone have easiesr inputs will kill Law tournament viability
@GerardoFirestorm No, it won't, lmao. Dude, legacy law players are already doing this stuff in 7 and previous iterations. Also any decent law if they notice you don't respect dss won't fully commit and counter hit you.
I think what they'll due is nerf the damage and lock season 1 dmg behind blue sparks, which can only be attained through legacy dss execution. Rather this is what would be cool if they did lol
@@GerardoFirestorm lol mishimas? Even Nina is executional for how good she is. her offense has to be seamless and fast, so you gotta give tons of variety and keep adding new stuff into it. Law is just braindead Dss into staying safe most of the round or game... they have to nerf it. i mean they can at least keep the ez version but make it less rewarding.
This braindead mixup exists now over 30 years. We laws face so many players that are familiar with the matchup and know how to take their turn. Have you checked out the win ratio of the character? Its not as easy as you think to be versatile with this character.
Played against a Nina last night for like 30 matches and I know the match up really well but she still feels unfair. I'm not even the type of person to cry about characters needing nerfs. I swear you can't ever press against a good Nina player and good luck ducking some of her main strings. SS doesn't really work against her poking either. The best advice I can give when fighting her is try to bait the power crush.
Dont listen to TMM he always has been overrating her. She has problems with range, tracking to her left (that's why they gave her b2, 2 in the first place) and hitting ch launching tools on block.
Stop crying get good if they beat you nerf them are you crying about jack
You know what would nerf Nina? Buffing back dashing. This will automatically take her back to t7 status. Good character with obvious range issues.
@@wwk_and the downplay begins
@@wwk_so where would you rank nina
As a Shaheen main, he can be nerfed in a couple of ways, First, his f2 3 should not give +20 on hit. That is the main reason the whole gimmick of f 23, guard break, f23 guard break combo becomes possible with no repercussion. If f 23 get to be like +8 then i think based on frame, the opponent can stop the string with a low jab or power crash. Sure its a 50/50, but at least its a fair 50/50 other than duck or die. Second, his guard break should not do any damage. I do not understand why a character that has the ability to kill grey health does 14 damage on an unguardable for free like that. Get rid of that damage and you are really only left with f23 damage so it is not as overwhelming.
Most importantly, I think all characters should have their power crash heat engagers nerfed one way or another. In Shaheens case, it gets way too overlooked on how easy it is to proc it if I am really desperate.
Frankly, Shaheen's toolset also tracks too much across the board. His df1 has a huge hitbox and is essentially impossible for a large portion of the cast to step. d3 also tracks in both directions. That's before you even get to his true homing moves at i15. The net effect is that you have to play 2D Tekken against Shaheen while he gets to move around as he wants. That is incredibly powerful in high skill play.
I dont think his guard break or f2,3 should be nerfed at all, if u do that then he wont even threaten u with anyth at heat
@@thefabledenglishman6000 This I do not agree with. His df1 tracks only ssrs and not ssl. Same thing with d3. The tradeoff is that he doesn't have any sort of big damage tools from it like Drag does with his df1 to 4 ch. He is a big keep your opponent in check kind of a character without any way to instakill your opponent and keep on dragging your plus frames. So I like that sort of playstyle, but I think his heat is a bit contradicting his playstyle cuz he goes all out in heat. Thats why his heat should be nerfed, but not his core mechanics.
@@ericpark8286 Go test his df1 and try to step it to the left. Most of the cast can't do it reliably. It has a huge delayed hitbox that makes it extremely difficult. It is borderline broken.
You don't need big damage combo extensions when you have an i13 -1 df1. That alone is one of the best tools you can possibly have in a Tekken game because it sets up the most basic mixups Tekken has - which is a df1 into jab to beat mids or df1 into step to beat jabs.
And Drag's df1 is steppable in both directions anyway. It isn't remotely comparable.
@@thefabledenglishman6000 If you can't do it "reliably" then that is a skill issue. You can definitely sidestep his df1, same with d3. As for the other things, you are only talking about his good things about his kit. Why not talk about the bad parts on how he has practically no moves that are + on block? There is only one move that is more or so used while having decent + on block, which is his stealth 1+2. It is 19f with +2. Best thing to do is to either do a while stand kick or grab. That is pretty much it. There is no move that can qcf 4 like drag or b3 like feng that can infinite plus frame on chip. I am not complaining about his weaknesses, i'm just saying if you gon call out his good stuff as if he is mr.perfect, then he has flaws too.
They should give Paul a second Death Fist
Nah man they should give him a Death Foot, and it should do tripple damage cuz kicks are 3× stronger than punches.
Make his burning fist atleast 50% healt bar damage
@@X--pv7kz It should also be a 10 frame low thats also a power crush. But as a trade off it only deals 2.5x damage of death fist.
Death fist should remove all recoverable health to
@@whyareyoureadingthislookaw8319 Oh my God.... that's Genius 🤯🤯
the bryan downplay is crazy 💀
Get’n outplayed by Bryan players hurts 🤣
lol facts
@@BustaNAugusta getting outplayed by any character hurts. the problem with people is they don't know when did they get outplayed and when something is broken/they have no options. including bryan mains. they gonna jerk themselves to their main and whine about other chars when they get outplayed by core tekken fundamentals
git gud if you're getting bodied by bryan players LOL
Every Tekken player is secretly a Bryan main.
As 20 year yoshi main i think yoshi gameplay in tekken 8 was finally done perfectly.I have to agree that changing properties will make him less yoshi and less trolly. Changing his gameplay will make character less fun. If they cut the combo damage and damage from few moves would be good nerf without ruining the character.
Ain’t no way you think an unblock-able low and 6 frame flash is balanced
@NotAigis- unblockable is a techtrap and 6 frame has short range and is launch punishable on block. Yeah its balanced. The problem isnt those moves. Its lies elsewhere. He aleays had flash and unblockables
@@Stockfish1511 that’s my bad then, didn’t know the counters
@@NotAigis- Truth be told its not easy to counter them. The thing back then in t7 was that you could anticipate flash and techtrap. In t7 yoshi has other busted moves that are so strong he forces you after the ground to fall into the tech trap and his neutral game has very strong moves not allowing you to do anything. He pressures you until you try to push a button to flash. He either damage nerf on some moves and overall combo damage. The moves are not much different from t7. Just more damaging.
too many character's weakness all disappear with heat activated or it gives them access to way too strong moves when they're already strong character even without those heat enhanced moves. Everyone just ends up playing the same, they said the Heat will make each character unique, but in reality, it just turns everyone into a 50/50 monster, only just a very small handful of characters actually feel "unique" with Heat
+1 I see people thinking that changing some frames or damage here and there will really fix the game. But in reality that's just going to stabilize the mess that's already there. And a stabilized mess keeps being a mess at the end of the day.
@@johnmacoyea, T8 is just a fucking mess iMO. All they've been doing is making everything high damage, crazy 50/50, absurd frames, etc. It's just an exhausting game, and I say this as a hardcore tekken player of 20+ years, I just play this game less and less, it's sad to see it
Yup. This is exactly what happens when you create an all encompassing mechanic for a series/game like Tekken where the diversity and uniqueness of characters was always in their individual movesets. All in the name of "pulling in the casual" or making tournaments more enjoyable to watch...as if they werent in T7.
@@ATC43 yea T7 Season 1-3 were great IMO, then they kept adding CH and power creep
Happened and I think the WORST offender was Kuni+Infinite stages, then idiots kept going “Tekken 7 is too much backdashing bruh” when it’s specifically Kuni on infinites. This was more of a character issue instead of game design issue, but the developers actually took that seriously and decided to just nerf all backdash, give chip damage, and remove infinites. I hate this approach to game design where instead of fine tuning each character, they just make a broad game system change where every character feels like they are put in a box and you have to only play a specific style, which is what T8 feels like, just non stop attacking, endless 50/50 and mashing like a lunatic and only focused on launchers and big damage, no wonder people are so exhausted and already burned out from the game, it’s just too much of the same thing
@@bludika I have nothing to add. Completely agreed on every front. Especially the part about the T7 "issue" with backdashing being a character(and TWT rule) specific problem. Give me that over the system problems inherent to T8 any day of the week.
Dont even care about character nerfs at this point.
Give me infinite rematch for quick match.
For ranked, please either give us infinite rematch OR force the set. So tired of one and dones or someone getting back a win and leaving. Force the first to 2 or let us rematch many times (obviously with reduced points).
I think the atmosphere of allowing people the freedom to not play the set while not allowing the freedom to keep playing is contributing to an environment where people are picking and choosing matchups more than ever. If someone could play a long set against an "annoying" character they struggle against, maybe they would be enticed to actuallt run it back and get some experience for the next time they run into them. I think now someone just goes "screw this, ill take one loss or yolo a win out and leave".
I really think it has to be one or the other. Allow us infinite rematch or FORCE the best of 3 like most ranked modes in other fighting games.
Hard agree on infinite rematch (even for ranked). tekken 7 online used to be so much for that only.
forcing people to complete a set will never work; some people just wanna play a game before having to go out, and then some people get unfair matchmaking and dont wanna lose more points. for example; as bushin rank, i get matched up with tons of tekken God supreme and God ranks on their second or third characters. i shouldnt have to be forced to lose a potential 1000+ points to them when i shouldnt even be matching up with them in the first place
yeah i'd rather have infinite rematches, being forced to play a best of 3 against a yoshimitsu or hwoarang every time would be terrible for my health
Beautifully put.
@@crillz9660dude, one match is not that long, they can look at the time and see if they have enough to compete 1 set, this is some high level drama queen stuff right here.
It's such a good thing we have TMM to be honest. So few people have an actual feeling for what's fair and balanced and what isn't. There's many more moves in the game that need nerfs but the things TMM mentioned just need to happen for now.
Season 2 character nerds are good and all but how about other quality of life changes?
1. Side setting "random" option if possible.
2. Battle BGM options:
"Your Character"
"Opponent Character"
"Stage"
"Random"
3. Opponent outfit settings:
"Default" options.
(They can keep their gimmick items)
4. Practice mode
"Assign a button to immediately control CPU character." Instead of going through numerous menus.
There's definitely more stuff but this is straight from the hip.
To be honest, everyone needs nerfs, even if it's a lil tap to a couple moves.
Probably the truest comment
@President_Shin, be careful what you wish for, strive did this with its season 4 patch, and it had the opposite effect.
Fk no
Even though all of my mains are on here I agree with this list 100%. You've got pretty much every character here and there isn't one that missing or one I disagree with. I do still wanna point out that Claudio outside of the wall still has noticeable weaknesses outside of that dp like shit lows, sub par jab game, etc.
Yep i play 3 characters here and if I have to take 3 pretty big nerfs to lower the power ceiling I'll take that deal.
his low heat smash compensates for his bad lows
Yeah exactly i main Claudio and he definitely has one of the worst jab neutral game . And ss4 is his only good committable low everything else is -on block. Db3 is +3 but it’s reactable and its launch lol
1) Jin.
No tracking on ff2 - okay, if all ff2 and similar moves also loose tracking (Kaz's ff2 is way more pain in the ass to deal with).
Nerf his heat smash - also okay, if he gets something else in heat (like making his Omen stance to have some range - now it's useless). Now in heat he has only heat smash or heat dash from ff2 or 1+2.
2) Law
No tracking on 1+2 - okay, if dss 3 become mid: now his nunchacks are the only mid tracking option from dss. If 1+2 looses tracking, dss will be useless against SS+duck.
111 not to be a ch-launcher - okay, kinda fair. But all fast ch-launcher should be removed or made launch-punishable (yes, gachi-cat mains, I'm talking about you).
Most of Law's buffs in t8 are compensation for his nerfs (for example in t7 he has 2 best whiff-punish moves in the game, now he doesn't).
3) Xiaoyu
No mixup after backturn heat smash on heat - okay, just make it knockdown with some oki on hit. But I see no reason nerfing it on block.
No heat wall combo - okay, if she gets back her wall oki setups. She always plays around her wall setups but most of them were deleted.
And her Hypno mixup is fine: if you let her to transist into stance and charge her moves, it's your fault - you had plenty of time to interrupt you, and even now you can guess the mixup (and this mixup is launch-punishable in both sides: mid is steppable while low can be hopkicked).
4) Bears
No need to nerf them - just delete them at all and bring back normal characters.
Ahh i still remember playing law in t7 starting out, my first combos off 3+4,4 whiff punish 😊
4u3-b2-b2,1-ff2,3 and if it wall carried then i did junkyard dragon tail lol
IMO they can nerf Xiao hypnotist and should, but also bring back her setups, all of them, these were extremely fun to do and allowed much player expression, much more than having to rely on Hypnotist for your entire mixup game, it was also much more hype to watch.
NONE of the setups were broken balance wise and its pretty clear that people facing Xiao hate her new mixup more
I cant believe TMM has no clue how Law works in T8. Law got massive nerfs from 7, every thing he has going for him now are compensations. i agree with 1,1,1 being brutal but other characters shouldnt have that either to beging with. His winrate is one of the lowest in high ranks for a reason. The best law's who have mained him for a decade + struggle.
@@bekabex8643 well lets hope the devs know these things, i think they do as only slide was really touched. 1,1,1 seems like an intentional design choice so i think its gonna stay
@nayd5043 they hate her new mixup cause they don't know the counterplay. If you know the match-up, her mixup becomes more risky than the classic Mishima-style mixup.
Both options are launch-punishable unless Xiaoyu has +20.
I actually agree with most of the King nerfs, df2's hit confirm is kind of needed so I'd rather they just find a way to nerf the combo damage from it. And RKO I think is perfectly reactable online considering it comes out of the sprint, which has a long windup itself. Anytime King goes into the sprint you have a lot of time to mentally prepare yourself to look out for the move, and then suddenly 23 frames isn't that tough to react to anymore. That's a big part of reaction time that you get to take care of before the RKO animation even starts
So Claudio has to take risks on every low. He has to have good mids to make up for the lack of everything else. Claudio Wall game has been his specialty since T7. Again, he has to have something if Claudio doesn't have 50/50. Claudio is strong, but your ideas for nerfs only serve to make it easier for you to play defense. because you don't know what to do, not to make the character better, so i disagree with your assessment.
Claudio already has an S tier wall game in t7, where his only real low was ss4. That low isn't flashy but it's -12 ob and gives advantage on hit and has a solid ch effect. That paired with running 2 which now deals chip damage alongside the mega mids would still give him an S tier wall game.
The low heat smash is just overkill, with all the aforementioned, and making it -15 would still keep it as a relevant threat in his kit. It would also keep him as the mid dispensing machine.
ninas 12 frame homing slap move is 3 highs in a row bro you can duck it at anytime and its launch punish it. there's nothing op about that its launch punishable. and comboing into side step one plus 2 is extremely hard to connect. you notice in the vid he claimed it can get you a combo and then he didn't get a combo. lol. db2 is only a counter hit combo and it has a 24 frame startup if your pressing against a move that slow you deserve to get comboed. the only remotely unfair thing i think ninas has is deleting recoverable health on throws, but keep in mind almost all her lows are negative 20 or more on block, she doesn't have a hopkick combo starter. and so many of her strings have launch punishable highs. people really overestimate her and just fail to realize her obvious weaknesses in counter play. duck launch her highs block her lows then launch her and shes easily beaten. also every throw she has that deletes recoverable health can be teched out of by simply pressing 2.
Electric is a high that must mean it’s a bad move
@ nobody said highs are bad moves. We are saying they have counterplay and dont need to be nerfed. Should every electric in the game be nerfed also? 😂
"Least Coping" Nina main. Downplay is insane.
@ i gave actually tips to defeat her but sure. Whatever you say keyboard warrior
Doesn’t first two hits of b222 jail on block?
Great suggestions, honestly….. TMM comes off real salty when he loses against these characters, but these are very rational takes
11:21 I'm an enthusiast player and law was my first main in t7. and not only I agree with (almost) everything, there are some things more I would love being changed. the only thing I disagree is that 1, 1, 1 isn't easy to confirm. it's not hard, by any means. but it is not trivial. I think the confirm window is adequately tight. that being said, the most obvious thing is just to bring dss back. you can't have godly frames/pressure with just 0 execution. the high execution demand was what made it interesting. being able to pressure on neutral with ws4 was a big show of reflex and technique. they could simply keep both systems, as they interlap. just make it so that you can only get perfect frames and blue sparks with legacy dss input. like this: going for the easy input all moves get 3 more frames of startup, and legacy input can have access to his options as they are today. this simple change would bring all that made law exciting back, without changing anything to casual players as they barely know what a frame is lol (and they don't even use dss to pressure, let's be honest).
the second change is what he already talked about, to make slide and nunchuck linear. the slide tracking is simply idiotic. also, make ws2 NOT push back. ws2 launches, has a big range and TRACKS. why tf does it have pushback?????????????? and about the nunchuck, it has terrible recovery, so whiffing it is lethal. problem is, it tracks way too much. making it more linear would require you to condition your opponent before having access to it, which would be cool. I think that these changes would be enough to make law an AMAZING character, and without making him weak. I would love that version of him
third change is ridiculous but it is a SYSTEMATIC problem in t8. his ff3 power crush for some god forsaken reason tracks too much and is -13. MINUS THIRTEEN. this is simply ATROCIOUS. in my opinion, most if not all power crushes should be LAUNCH PUNISHABLE. this should simply not exist. it is so obvious that I almost forgot lol
oh, a smaller but welcome change too would be to make uf3 a bit slower. it's already super linear, which is cool, but once your opponent plays too linear you can simply spam it. should be a bit slower but still faster than f1+2. and talking about f1+2, it should track a bit less. I've had hit people sidewalking it, which I think is wrong. it should clip simple sidesteps but it should whiff on walk
As a Yoshi player, toning down his overall damage doesn't sound so bad.
However, I think the guard break should stay. But instead of it giving Yoshi +14, it should give +13 so he can still get a guaranteed DF1,4.
*EDIT:* Maybe even a guaranteed 1,1 after guard break when the opponent is near the wall.
the things is when u see the damage that other characters do is not fair lowering his damage alone. why nina and dragunov got damage nerfs and u believe they are the only ones that need it not really so . btw other characters have guard break and yoshi managing to apply that is fine o-o.
launching unblockable low should not exist.
@@KoufalKoufax he have that because he dont have tools like other characters lol u can avoid it really easy.
He’s not saying the guard break should go it’s the post-combo guaranteed tech trap into it. They tend to be nerfing those types of things anyway, so they probably will. They practically emergency hotfixed the game over Jun’s similar setup.
@@DoctorDarlingTTV paul bryan and some other character have that too same with wall splat doctor and in paul and bryan case they have guaranteed combos yoshi only have his back punish. having a guard break that u cant do anything makes no sense but if they remove from everyone then its fine i dont mind yoshi have other tools 👍👍
As a Jin main and I feel other Jin mains can agree with the idea the heat smash should have less range than it does demon paw was stupid on launch and still is that includes Kazuya’s I don’t mind less range and tracking bcuz a good player can realign with movement anyway no matter what nerfs he gets unlike the people who dropped characters like Reina and dvj and victor after nerfs I think Jin mains will stay loyal to him higher execution in s2 would be nice also and more fun too
Nobody left Deviljin because of the nerfs, only in competitions did they stop playing with it because it wasn't viable against Alisas, Dragunov's, Ninas etc.
I can promise you one thing. Nerf him all you want Im still wining games with him cause most of the bums crying and complaining are sht anyway.
Did the same thing with Heihachi only in reverse cause people say he isn't that good yet somehow folks still can't block for shit against him.
Ikr ppl complaining about Jin Fkn suck he’s got one of the most telegraphed movesets in the game. That being said d2 is stupid and I refuse to use it because it’s cheap af. His heat smash is basically the same as his T7 rage so let them cry
@@OutbreakPerfectDvJNobody left devil Jin because of the nerfs? You realize the math proves you wrong right? Devil Jin was one of the most popular characters used in the beginning of tekken 8. Now he’s barely used, look up the facts before you spout nonsense.
@@Sacredix I didn't say that, go read my comment and then speak, instead of coming to UA-cam and saying shit, crybaby.
Before watching I bet I can guess the list 🙄 since all folks wanna do is cry the leading cause for the crying is VERY predictable:
(No order)
1. Dragnov
2. Nina
3. Yoshimitsu
4. Jin
5. Ling
6. Law
7. Alisa
8. Kuma
9. King
10. Lili
Edit: All except Lili and I didn't mention Shaheen, Claudio, Victor, and Bryan so thats 9/10 with 4 not mentioned.
The 9 where obvious but the 4 of the others being mentioned surprises me.
Drag's qcf4 needs to be +3 on block, not hit grounded, and after heat dash only guarantees a ground hit.
Make the move useless basically
@@meteor1945 +3 is good enough
@Invader.Xim. how? with its pushback its not plus at all at +3 and in every situation wr2 would be better
@@meteor1945 because +3 makes it still + so like it works ig. Tbh never really liked the move wr2 is way cooler
@Invader.Xim. i agree if they give wr2 more tracking and give it back +6 they can kill snk 4
"Top Characters To NERF for Tekken 8 Season 2"
Devil Jin mains: (sweating bullets)
The scary and damning part is that all of these buffs to these characters were intentional to have their pick rates increased. Nobody would have touched King, Alisa, Jin if they were not outright broken.
What? King and Jin were always top popularity lol
@@kaiok6776 I am talking about new players. Jin and King being popular were all old school players. New players wanted easy characters.
@@yellowscarlightningscream8347 king was always popular with new people literally me and a lot of others ik who got into tekken had king as their first main why r u capping
Bro was complaining about Claudio in Heat at the wall, but everything he described sounded very similar to what Kazuya does in Heat at the wall.
I don't even know Claudio that well, but whenever I use Kazuya it feels like I completely shut my opponent down at the wall
I'm sorry but where in kazuyas movelist is there a long range homing safe mid (Claudio's B1)?
Genuinely curious, because I believe that is what mainman is referring to, keeping in mind Claudio has that outside of heat as well
@brantrix What I meant is the general setup.
Low Heat Smash, paired with Parricide Fist to scare you into not ducking, as well as df3 2 1, which can be delayed for frames or let go immediately to catch a reaction. For tracking, he has his b4 wallsplat, or heat dash on block. Just very opressive. Of course there is counterplay, but it's very hard to deal with. Again, I don't play Claudio, but to me Kazuya seems just as opressive at the wall as the scenario TMM was describing here.
@@chakrashadow3220 I think this is where your understanding may have a bit of a disconnect, all the moves you've stated are either steppable or duckable (has counter play) and comparing the frequency of kazuyas heat dash to Claudio's B1 is a bit disingenuous. What I took from the video is Claudio's B1 at the wall is strong because it is a safe, homing, long range mid (can neither be stepped nor ducked), and you cannot take your turn afterwards because the risk of power crush at the wall if it is blocked is too high. I think he explained his point quite well here, there is no counter play.
@@brantrix I said I know there is counterplay to Kazuya's wall pressure, but in my own experience, it's not too hard to condition opponents to react the way you want at the wall, or press accordingly to how they have played.
Maybe I'm just used to the wall pressure scenario, but it doesn't seem too hard as Kazuya. Of course I know there's counterplay, but I don't see it very often.
I'll pick up Claudio and see what the deal is, because his wall pressure doesn't seem too much harder to get out of than Kazuya's.
@@chakrashadow3220 You can sidestep petricide fist. You can't sidestep claudio homing's move. So with kazuya there is counterplay with claudio there isn't. Also as the other commenter said, you have to deal with kazuya heat's smash once per round where with claudio you can basically spam it which makes it impossible to counter to some degree.
The fact he said her chainsaw stance is insane even though people like Nina and Bryan and dragonoff can out jab her out of it as of most that can jab her out if it
Nina has always been good at everything. She was so good that you knew itll be a hard fight every time you fought her, even back in tekken 6
Shit i remember thinking that since Tekken 2
@@livingashtree1942 I'm playing Tekken 1 as we speak and she's annoying. Stupid frames on forward flip! 😭
She always had terrible lows. Nerf her lows and that Powercrush and she’ll be fine.
Revert back her fc df4 sweep to the way it was (slower + no CH launch)
and change the ch launch property to qcf 3 low and give it a different reaction on hit for a guaranteed follow-up like qcf 2 or ff3 instead of full launch.
@@since2133 So she's always had terrible lows and you want to make them crappier instead of nerfing her guns, ss4,2, b22...you know, the moves which are strong.
Under your proposed changes, there would be no reason to duck against Nina, at all. The slow option for wipe the floor is 31f, insanely reactable and she dies in exchange for getting a ff3/qcf2 crouch cancel follow up? D2 will still be underwhelming since it's 0 on hit, and qcf3 ch only guaranteeing a qcf2 or ff3 is incredibly underwhelming since she's also gonna get launched on block. Removing the ch launchers on wipe the floor (and slowing it down) and qcf3 takes away any reason to duck against her.
db3 is -13 on block, +4 on hit, and on ch only guarantees a followup from knockdown status. That's not scary enough that it will get me to duck. Lows and throws are how you open up people in Tekken man, this is so unserious lol.
@@Exponential_Entropy yeah they are about to kill the old school/legacy character because t8 systems buffed her too much. most/almost everything remained the same as she was in t7 but now she does a lot of chip and deletes chip in several ways/her guns do insane damage on wall. never heard people complainig about b2,2 in t7. yeah it's a strong move. ss1+2? yeah lets remove this. qcf2? lets remove this. db2? lets remove this. df1,2? lets remove this. throws delete recoverable health? lets remove her 20 years old throws I guess! and then nina ends up with literally nothing to work with. depressing time for tekken fans
Can people leave Claudio alone and not nerf him.
Bro exactly. By their definition only his wall game is good so if you take that away then he’s arguably trash plus his neutral jab and low game is definitely lacking. I seriously don’t think he needs any nerfs
Ah okay… someone said to me TMM said „jin doesn’t have a varied set of lows and he wants to buff his other lows and nerf d+2.“i will get back to this guy for this attempt of gaslighting.
I'm still waiting about what they should "NERF" with Nina
Am i wrong or doesn't season 2 start on january 1st? And we still miss 1 character in season 1. So they will bring out a character in less then a month and we still have no trailer?
TWT isn't far out and they have the TGAs, I guess.
They can nerf the character but they can never nerf the player
Also ppl think they will get a rank upgrade if they nerf characters which is not happening 🤣🤣
As a Jin player yah the heat smash is busted and the character is way too easy compared to Tekken 7 like there is no execution beside electric now even electric can be done with 1 button it's so stupid the more easy the character is the more boring it gets
"the character is way too easy compared to Tekken 7 "
This is NOT a Jin problem this is a Tekken 8 "problem"
People forget steve law and many others that had execution are easier as well
@@JIX9ISLER1986while I do enjoy execution, and I think it's fun and needed on certain things, it's important to understand that high level play is more about the strategy and mind games than the execution. Raising the execution on a character doesn't really do much on a higher level of play, like at all. But I will say that it does lose some satisfaction with the loss of execution
Blah blah shut up and play a different character then Im so sick of you annoying ass legacy Jin mains crying about him being top tier now. Like genuinely shut the fk up and pick a different character then or just use him. Holy sht....
As a Drag player I think qcf4 should track less and should definitely not be +7. I think between +0 to +3 max. EXCEPTION would be to make it revert back to its launch version (+7/W!/no pushback) BUT consume heat. 2 or 3 of them uses your whole heat. That could be interesting.
I think the hatchet range can stay as it is mainly bc of how far the pushback is on hit and him only being +3. One back dash and you're outta there.
I’ll never understand the Nina hate. She can stomp scrubs but you have to play like Jodd to get the real nutty stuff. That’s like .1% of players.
As a King main I agree with everything, but I want to add with df21 95% of King players dont/can't confirm the counter hit let alone finish the combo after they accidently hit it.
its called skill issue if you can confirm a counterhit move
Bryan’s block punishment also needs to be more consistent. Some moves just give way too much push back. This is a problem with a lot of the cast tho. Where something’s don’t get punished correctly. Also Bryan’s heat burst also has too much tracking. It tracks more than other characters and catches people stepping. Alisa df1 string is to strong as well. Lee is very strong as well I think he may get more shine and is going heavily under the radar because of more problematic characters.
I always get my heat burst stepped as a Bryan player…but Bryan struggles to step everyone else because of his Jack-sized hurtbox.
PLEASE! Make a video about Negan in Tekken 7 like you did with Marduk and Akuma! Another character id love to see showcased is Eliza and Why they wouldn't work in Tekken 8 because of Super Meter. Love the channel and work you do. I always watch your videos to prepare myself to play.
dragunov needs a one shot move
This reminds me, Mainmanswe if you see this thank you so much for that anti yoshimitsu guide the other day, your tip to look out for his un-blockable sweep and orbital punish it worked like a charm. Fought a yoshimitsu with Steve today and he was helpless. Combo juggled him up and down the entire length of the stage every single time he tried it on me. 100% success rate son. it was glorious.
Claudio has 77 moves, 20 of them are starburst and grabs... nerfing him is... wild lol
Claudio fights like a gay man
If Claudio ain’t in Starburst, he’s not a threat
@@Bagszszs you getting beat by a "gay" man? Lol
@j.i.nthenobody54 and when he acquires star burst he does his little animation which for most moves stops his flow/pressure...
you don’t need to use many moves to be effective. shaheen also has barely any moves but both are still top 10
It makes me want to see Anna and Kunimitsu in T8. Still waiting on Armor King, and some special guest Char.
I love how Scourge (d+2) is the first subject of Jin's section. That move is way too spammable for everything it does.
no lie the edgy karate guy has a decent rework of Jin in an over view of him.
@@Tha-mountainbring back d,3,3 and making d3,4,3 actually good at the expense of d2 sounds like a really good idea legit
@@chickenpizza5703no, just nerf. What's even the point of nerfing a top tier who has literally everything if then you wanna compensate with buffs? He already has good lows outside d2.
@@chickenpizza5703 yeah gotta agree with the other guy, jin's just strong enough that a flat-out nerf is more than acceptable
@@chickenpizza5703 he isn't bring back d3,3 be is making d3,4 into it and some of that 214 magic too
main man rant wont ever be complete without a law rant 😂
i disagree with d2, i feel it should just not be almost homing and be side stepable like kazuyas. i feel-14 is fine in my opinion
21 should also be +3 or 2 like jack azu 21 not +6, or make it able to ss the 4 more consistent or -11 for the (4).
man jin is perfect
jin sucks ass. Just play heihachi cuz gramps is actually cool unlike jin
Also the grab is 35135123512 frames active, if you punish an active grab, you get CH by the grab.
nerf kazuya.
As a jin main i think the nerfs you spoke of are reasonable
They aren't but thats why we have opinions
@@NemoRackkz HUH 🤦🏾🤦🏾🤦🏾
@@leonelgarcia2651 kaz has many ch launchers that dont use bound like steel pedal and thats faster than jins d2.
Claudio needs low heat smash
They nerfed his d22 luncher
He has no good lows besides ss4 and db43 which is the second hit is high
That’s what I’m saying his neutral is not as good as most characters in this game aswell excluding his star burst but you need to activate it first in order for you to take advantage of it
people think Claudio is op cause he has db1+2 and low heat smash
And I’ll be fine if they take that and bring back his tekken 7 things
B33 ch luncher
Ff1+2 was good in neutral
D22 was good mixup if the opponent duck u can do hopkick
They removed alot of his good stuff
I agree 100% people don't realize that's an actual weakness that Claudio has but I also don't think we should bring back d2 2 launcher because he would lose part of his identity of having shit lows and it'll always be more boring for me. I'm chill with low heat smash.
What I don't get is why you say Heihachi's heat smash is fair, at all, when it absolutely does the identical forced 50/50 of that of Xiaoyu's,. It's even better as it doesn't require a stance.
So still no proper solution for Yoshi. This will basically revert him back to T7 state with couple of additional moves. I believe ~70 dmg optimized combos is not something that deserves nerfs when there's Heihachi and his joke dmg.
Besides that, there's still almost no Yoshis in top tournament stages, which is a clear indication that the character is not that strong as you think he is.
Also no mention of Kazuya who was overtuned to S tier with the latest buffs, but somehow TMM is talking about nerfing Victor lol.
heihachi is significantly riskier with no access to flash, poorer lows, less healing, etc, he's an obejctively worse character than quite a lot of characters and his damage is one of the only things really going for him
Nina being bollocks in the story and OP in-game is a funny dichotomy
For xiaoyu she has busted dmg in heat and wall splat cuz outside of that she doesnt have much fr. No insane + frame, most of her mix up is fake , easily steppable, she is top tier but not like other char, she is strong for evasion
Heat wall combo is the only situation xiaoyu can do comparable confirmed damage to other characters in the game. Every single character has crazy wall carry to crazy wall combo, I don't know why xiaoyu has to be the exception to not have that. I think nerfing heat and wall combos in general might work since almost every round those two things get combined.
both of u are right same with yoshimitsu like he dont have a single plus frame string and quick hit if people play more defensively is really hard to apply his combos and techs.
I think her heat game should be nerfed and her other tools buffed, its like the entire character is heat at this point which is kinda poorly designed.
Revert all of the nerfs she got from T7 to T8 and then tone down her heat.
@@nayd5043 the entire character is far from being only heat, but the purely offensive stuff is pretty much all focused in heat. She gets easy access to + frames and a powerful mixup. Outside of heat offensive capabilities come from timing and setups mostly. Only potent mixup is pretty much hypnotist in heat since the other lows are not threatning enough. I like the idea of nerfing heat and buffing other tools but I hope it doesn't end up in a t7 character in t8.
@@Rius9106Its a little bit of a Tekken 8 problem for some characters, but I think heat power creep is too much.
I dont think the Tekken 7 character in 8 will be much of a problem with the right mindset (actually if you look at good Tekken 7 Xiaos, she was kinda playing Tekken 8 in 7! They were so aggressive with the setups and pressure lol) because I think its a fact that her mixup utility outside of heat is worse in this game than it was before, but I think giving back her old setup/pressure with the current heat might be a bit too much. Personally I think nerfs to spike combo and backturn heat smash for some of her old tech back would be a fair trade
My problem with nina especially is that she's too safe for all that she has. You take next to no risks, just poking someone down. There are so many good mids that are just straight up safe, whereas other characters give up turns for a decent mid or straight up get punished. Then you add on the fact that she's evasive as hell, and it gets so tiring fighting her.
Jin’s heat smash makes absolutely no sense
It does.... Cause its the one they gave him.....
He could do the same in tekken 7
Hey, would love to hear your take on the opposite, meaning what buffs other characters could/should get.
call every character to be nerfed except the 50 50 goat Kazuya. great list
As a Feng gamer I agree he could still be toned down a bit. But b3 is similar to Bryan’s b1 except it doesn’t launch on counter, so it’s a little more plus to compensate. Honestly just giving him a generic df1 or at least one that doesn’t counter anymore could be a good balance change. The neutral df1 is kinda his identity at this point but the ch doesn’t need to stay
Actually fcdf4 could be a stagger on block like the beta
Nina has the best power crush in TEKKEN 8
As a Jin main, I agree with pretty much everything. His uf2 can be -10 as well. Other characters mentions are highely reasonable, I like how you elaborate every single nerf that you calling out for. GGs.
Mainman if Nina is so good why is not she winning a lot and why don't we have pros playing her?
Arslan?
@@derrickbunch1142 yeah only he is carrying her, we have jodd but he is winning so much. However, we have lot of top mains in Drag, Yoshi.
@@logicallyspeaking1780 not to discredit arslan but he tier whores if he’s playing her she’s probably o.p. Tournament results doesn’t mean the character isn’t good. Regardless arslan won proving she is still very good. A character can be broken and not win. It’s hard to win with anyone so people tend to lean towards the easy and broken rather than hard in broken because it takes away the level of being hard.
So tired of ppl clinging to the tourney argument like bro are you playing in tournaments placing in top 8s? No? So why compare that when you're just an average online mf playing the game like most ppl wtf is her being in tourneys gonna do for you personally.. besides potentially get her nerfed. Such a dumb argument.
For nina i have a proposition: keep her as she is with one change: make all of her attacks, even pokes 100% recoverable, so she needs to rely on her grabs to remove that recoverable health
8:52 see this is what i don’t get. Muscle Armor is the only safe on block power crush that King has, which makes for his bad backdash and movement in general. So why take that away and make all of his power crush punishable ? Everything else i agree.
Yea idk...
I do know about half the roster doesn't have a safe power crush though.
Muscle armor is not overpowered. You can low or throw it to counter. You need a hard read for it to connect.
Im pretty sure everyone in the roster has a safe power crush
@George_Spartan117 eddy, devil Jin, Zafina are just a few to name that do not.
Ig zafina has one from stance, so she can't do it whenever she wants and only while in heat and it uses her heat as well.
and the majority of the roster only has safe on block power crushes which are still launch on duck bc they are highs.
Isn't kings a safe mid power crush? And it is confirmable.
@@Sicknificant1 The universal rule is: HIGH power crush = Safe on block
MID power crush = not safe (unless you’re victor)
As for zafina, she’s the only character that has a freaking power crush LAUNCHER. So it makes perfect sense to be unsafe on block.
King’s muscle armor is not something you can spam and its not a panic button/keep out attack option either. Think of it almost like a parry. If you want to make muscle armor unsafe then make his B3 HIGH power crush safe (which was also nerfed significantly btw) let him have a defensive tool. You can’t take everything away
I don't have a problem with Nina at all, yoshi, drag, and kaz need the biggest nerfs, oh ya and chainsaws
At high ranks Nina is a problem
Are you a Nina main?
Nina is perfect the way she is. Very few people play her and even less are actually dangerous playing her, she demands high level execution to do her crazy shit, unlike those pesky Mishimas with their 1,1,2s, hellsweeps and easy heat electrics
And the Nina downplay begins. This isn’t tekken 7 buddy
She’s not easy to use optimally but she still very strong especially in the right hands that’s why few people use her
@@centro-link It’s the same in every game. On SF6 release, people were going to war about Ken and JP being fine the way they are, other people just need to learn the matchup. People do their best trying to bs their way out of getting their obviously overpowered character nerfed
@@centro-link you dont need to use her optimally here, you dont even need ws1 loops, etc... she is a pretty dumb character arguably top1
@@centro-link It's not the character, it's the player. I play both ranked and unranked (I'm blue rank ATM) and I hardly ever see Nina and even less do I fight someone who knows how to execute her tricky shit.
The problem with king is when they decided, you know what.. let him block instantly from jaguar sprint.. i somewhat understand the reason but it doesnt make much sense considering its a Sprint. What you could do is maybe let him do his little jaguar sidestep or whatever from jaguar sprint instead if you wanna try to run away from something.
Huh, Nina? A -14 powercrush, average lows, her df1,2 is very streppable & the rest of the stuff mentioned she’s had since Tekken 7 but was mid tier in that game and no one played her. Don’t let the best Tekken player in the world make you think she’s anywhere near the best lol. Jin & Drag are horrendous
Note the range
"It has some range...yeah, SOME range!"
Harada’s Promised Consort needs a 10 frame mid electric. I’m surprised he doesn’t have one already
What was that? Nerf Devil Jin? Coming right up!
They should give Jin, Yoshi’s katana just to mess with TMM.
Nina downplayers disgust me. I picked up that character and immediately reached blue ranks in 5 hours
Can easily do that with any character in t8
@@BruceWayne-hf7zw i'm new to playing online tekken that's the thing
19:46 “The ass should not be guaranteed”
Fire quote
I agree with pretty much everything here but have some notes (the ones i don't mention from the vid here is because i agree with what's been said and i don't have any significant note to add for them IMO):
- Dragunov is strong but you can't compare his ability to take your recoverable health with Nina's. The only way he can take your recoverable health is with only one option AFTER he successfully ultimate tackles you, which is something you can kinda handle, just break the 1 option; Nina's options to get rid of your recoverable life on the other hand, are more efficient: if you panic heatburst after receiving one of her ridiculous damaging combos and she interrupts you with her i11 f2+4 throw, your recoverable health's gone; if you panic a -11 on block powercrush in the same situation, she punishes your powercrush with her f2+4 throw and your recoverable health is gone; if you do a -13 on block low and she blocks it, she can ws3 for 25 guarantee damage into a three different breaks guessing game for potential 40 to 50 damage in total (as far as i remember) and ALL of the three options take your recoverable health into crazy oki; and im not even counting the rest of instances where she can take your recoverable health like multithrows, etc.
- Yoshi's wall ground flip setup after b1,1 into f1+2, also should be check, its a really a dumb situation where Yoshi only wins/wins.
- King's b1,2 also should be checked since it is also easily CH confirmable, so King basically has an i12 SAFE counterhit launcher in a game where those have been significantly nerfed for everyone. I don't see his Jaguar sprint needed to be nerf since it is actually reactable even in a good 4bars connection, and im not a big fan of balance nerfs based on connection experience since according to that logic they should be nerfing things like snake edge.
- Law's 1,1 heatdash combo, even if it now can be ducked i've never been a fan of having i10 launchers without significant risk at least, btw i think Hwoarang's while in heat 2,4(RFS) counterhit combo is even more ridiculous than Law's one, and that one also needs to go.
- Feng: i think they've been taking the wrong approach on nerfing his back kempo, such as nerfing his launcher, etc... the thing is Feng never commits to the launcher there since he only does that option AFTER he sees his opponent whiffing a move, so its irrelevant if his launcher option is launch punishable or not (outside the mixup of course), characters with this type stances with HUGE backward evasive properties shouldn't be able to block during the entire animation of the stance if they don't commit to an attack, that's why Fengs kinda spam that stupid stance and get away with it most of the time (btw there's a bug in training mode thats been around since i have memory even in previous tekken that happen to certain stances, where the dummy cant block during back kempo even if you record it to block for those who think its viable to punish it on reaction by testing it that way).
- Victor wall setup is dumb either way even if there are few characters who counterplay it (Jack, King, Hwoarang, etc), you can powercrush the f4,2 route, but he also has the 2,1 into stance 2,2 route which is a force block and you can't powercrush through that one on wake up.
King's b12 is not CH confirmable. The confirm window is 12 frames. Some people may THINK they can confirm it, but it is not humanly possible.
@@thefabledenglishman6000 go to training, set the dummy first action to block and second action to punish, in the punish section record one action to stay blocking and in other to retaliate with df1 for example. Now you using King, jab the dummy on block which is +1 and then b1 and only go for the 2 extension if you see the dummy doing something in between your jab and the b1, and tell me if it is not confirmable...
@@vlastermaster Anecdotal claims aside, you have 12 frames to input the 2 after seeing the counter hit. That is far faster than accepted human reaction time in Tekken.
@@thefabledenglishman6000 did you even read and TRIED anything of what i told you in my previous comment dude?...
@@vlastermasterI’ve tuned into Jesandy streams a lot, the top King guy, and I’ve watched him test if this is CH confirmable. He couldn’t do it. It’s not a consistent thing to pull off like df2 1
Low heat smashes SHOULD NOT EXIST WITHOUT GOING INTO STANCES.
Imma be the one to say it. IMO, I feel like they should bring back the counter hit property for one of Bryan’s moves ( while crouching) df4. That’s just me
Bryan is so underestimated its the character with Aslia that i struggle the most against , his lows are just unpredictible and do so much damage , adding a wall carry 50% health damage combos and a very good neutral .
Bryan takes double the damage if you block his lows. He only gets a combo from the worst snake edge in the game…a mini combo at that.
@@BustaNAugusta worst snake edge def Lili, she got 30f but it's kinda close w Bryan which is 29f
after dragunov nerfs, ppl still find some shit to complain and want more nerfs until he is shit asf
I'm not sure your aware, but he's absolutely broken right now
Cause he is still too overpowered
He is the only fking character in the entire game to have a + on block heat engager move that hits grounded its an unwinnable situation on the wall
@@subwafers7138 don't forget the damage! And the fact that a tiny delay can make it hit side step!
@ fk make it homing as well and makes u go into rage if it hits, might as well go all in lmao
Thanks for covering Jin! Sick of Jin mains down playing their characters...
As a Jin main
1) D2 = i agree i said this myself make it either -15 on block keeping the Counter hit combo or keep it -14 but take away the CH launcher
2) Heat Smash = Jin has no HEAT buffs so nerfing the range on the heat smash would not make sense UNLESS you BUFF his Power Stance
3) 214 = yes it is a great move HOWEVER the counterplay is simple - if Jin delays the 4 you can side step and launch him (turn on your brain)
If you take away the CH knockdown then it better be +6 in hit
This is too smart for MM to read it
Heat buffs? What are you even talking about dude
Bro, I can count the times i had my 214 stepped with the fingers of my one hand in 2400+ hours of Jin in Tekken 7... It was bitched to all hell for being the perfect string, perfect OS for steps/mashing in t7, and there it was "only" +4 on counter hit. It's incredibly taxing mentally to step, and holy hell you have to be predictable with it for your opponents to do it. And if so, even if your opponent tries to step your (21)4, they sure as hell aren't ducking 2,4 - another mental stack lol. The CH knockdown has no business being there. If you wanna keep the CH knockdown, make the last hit unsafe or make the blockstun and recovery longer after 2,1.
@@songoku6067 Jin does not have any enhancements while in heat status - his power stance is basically useless unless its near a wall - that is why his heat smash is that good - if you nerf the heat smash they have to buff his heat properties
@@Alpdude "Bro, I can count the times i had my 214 stepped with the fingers of my one hand"
that sounds like a skill issue - the counterplay for 214 has always been the same - if jin delays the 4 he dies
Jin Nina and Ling gives me nightmares
Nerf deeznutz :)
Honeslty I rather see a nerf to claudio db1+2 rather than his heat smash cuz that move allowed me to rob to many goddamn game, as you said he goes way to deep into the pasta. His low heat smash on the other hand is fine, he doesn't have strong lows anyway.
Make Alisa have huge start up frames and make her a spacing character. She has chainsaws for hands. That's heavy, and huge recovery frames on whiff.
couldn't agree more.
especially with Alisa, her chainsaw stance is completely broken and forces you into guessing and / or just taking the massive chip.
absolutely not fun, very frustrating.
Even as a bryan main i agree , i ll remove also bufferable taunt heat smash
Ppp just jumping on the “nerf Nina” bandwagon she’s not an issue literally if you say it’s her frames that’s the character clowns. You literally have to know what moves to do and also combine it with ss1 cancels that’s how she’s played a fast framed poke character. No issue with her she’s not broken at all u guys are just trash and don’t know how to deal with the opponent . Also has a lot of highs literally just fuzzduck often and can laugh her more often than not it’s gonna be a high first hit unless your ducking a lot then the opponent will adapt and use dF2 poke and extensions more
I'd like to see Jin's dive kick nerfed. I'm so tired of seeing every tournament Jin spam it to high heaven.
Tbh I hope they sensibly nerf Yoshi just so people will stop telling me "I'm carried" for playing him. Completely ignoring the work I put into actually doing it *well*
I think MMSwe said in a recent video that boiled down to Yoshi being easy to play, which I very much disagree with.
Awwww, you want a participation trophy for playing a video game? Especially a dogshit, button masher like tekken 8. You are carried it is the sad truth. Everyone is carried in this sorry excuse for a game. Stop crying. Tmm beta soy boy self is turning you all into bitches.
I don't think so kuma wall combo needs a nerf cuz for years this guy got beated on wall like crazy for no reason it's a fair he can hit you hard on the wall aswell