Absolutely, never has “Oh my Wife will deal with this conversation about this problem” meant so much. I like the no bullshit Italian style, take no prisoners approach 😁 That aside why would you try and open a woman’s Car door that shocking at night. Charging points need a rethink bright, cameras you provide a safe environment you’ll get the customers.
@@GraemeHart8888 Entitlement, that's why. I am a big guy driving an expensive car. Nobody would dare walk up and open my door. Many guys, including apparently Mr. EV, consider women as lesser beings somehow in need of their guidance. The public exposure of women in the captive environment of charging is a genuine concern. Uncouth and aggressive men often feel entitled to impose on physically weaker people. It is incumbent on the rest of us to make women feel comfortable at charging stations. We can best do this by leaving them alone and seeing that others do as well.
Classic Flaviana: "First of all, I don't like people!" Just can't help loving her.. If you're a driver, please remember to keep well away from those "bullshit" towns. 😂
Flaviana is right - a display of charging etiquette on the charger or on a prominent separate sign is a great idea. But it's not beyond technology to be able to detect a queue of drivers and at that time limit all chargers to 80% max and kick the car off at that point.
Tesla supercharger do the former. The set your limit to 80 at busy stations but agree with the second one. Cars should disconnect once complete so others can disconnect and charge
There is much information missing from the original post. What Level of charger was that person at? What was their level of charge? Could the woman have asked the person to not peer into her car? Most people today have access to a Cellular Phone and could have called for help (IE: Dial 911) or simply turn on the headlights. Most people when noticing this would simply back off and get away from the circumstances. Any kind of altercation is alleviated if common sense is used.
@Ibrahim Ulf Karlsson that's a really good idea. I genuinely think a lot of people don't understand the plus 80% charging drop off. It'd be a good way to educate everyone
@@nialli2000 you need to ensure you communicate to them why it's so expensive when they go over 80% or might just think rapid charging is really expensive
"If you see that there's a woman with children and it's late at night, you must be a c-word if you don't get the F away." Brilliant and on point! Thanks for being blunt, Flaviana! Greetings from Germany! 👏
I would love to see a weekly show with Flaviana, just pick a random topic and let's hear her thoughts. Honest, down to earth, funny (without trying to be) and so natural. A show with opinions and anecdotes that doesn't hold back - what's not to love.
You guys have such a natural charisma going on that it makes it irrelevant if we agree or not with your opinions, we just have to see it all. As opposed to the fake approach on many channels 👍😀
You should have a seperate channel featuring Flavia and her down to earth no bullshit opinions on life in general..... she would be a hit in this world of fakeness
When I hired an e-Niro and parked at a charger that was in use, I gently knocked on the other car's window (fully steamed up, no idea who was inside) and politely asked the two women inside how long they had left. I didn't want to wait in the car for the charger to be available and be sat there for 30 minutes when I could have done some shopping in the meantime. But now I look back that was intrusive and unnecessary I feel, and could have made them uncomfortable. They were very friendly and helpful though. If I could see the state of charge of the car from the machine, I would never have felt the need to speak to them.
Oh dear, it's too bad General Motors is no longer in Europe. They have icons on the outside of their vehicles giving viewers some idea of how much charge they have from the outside. Of course, people might not understand this and also might resort to more intrusive methods.
I think the main thing is the lack of training for new owners transitioning from ICE cars. Charging to 100% is usually far slower than making two stops for 50% each time but that's a foreign concept for someone who has only ever used an ICE vehicle. It'll get better when charging hubs are commonplace and every petrol station has at least one EV bay, but for the moment I agree with Flavia that if you're not an enthusiast then a full EV is not a good choice for you because of the poor state of charging facilities in the UK. Hopefully that will change soon but for now it is what it is. Also we enthusiasts need to keep in mind that not all EV drivers are as keen as we are, so we need to respect others' personal space. Instavolt definitely has the right idea with the large LED signs above each post to indicate free/busy, perhaps they could extend that to include remaining charge time?
Training won't do anything when every charge is going to take 1 hour to do. After a while you'll get fed up with moving from charger to charger and tell everyone else to go get fucked, this is probably the real reason why EV cars didn't work the first time.
@@zagan1 Why would each charge take an hour? Even at a 50kW station, which is slow by today's standards, most EVs can go from 20-80% in a half hour or less. My point was that most people don't know that the charge rate slows down as the battery gets more full, so two stops charging from 25-75% will take a lot less cumulative time than running it down to zero and charging back to 100. So it benefits the driver to stop more, and it benefits other drivers by keeping turnover high at the station. With regard to previous generation EVs like the EV1 and earlier designs going back even before the petrol engine was invented, the problem was energy density. Until recently, the technology needed to store hundreds of miles of energy under the floor of a car didn't exist, and it wasn't developed until it was needed for mobile phones.
I usually only charge up to what I need to get me to where I’m going, and mostly charge at night at home. But people hogging chargers for hours to charge up to the max it’s ridiculous, I had one guy charge up his Mitsubishi Outlander petrol/ hybrid car for over 8 hours and security had to go to his apartment to tell him to move his car.
She’s a real people person. 😂. Great video. Keep up the good work 👍🏻 The only way to fix this is the charger automatically stops at 80% if someone else is waiting. There’s a lot of selfish people who don’t care about anyone else apart from themselves.
@@yitzele Chargers have the ability to read battery SOC so if you stick a bit sign up saying the charger will only charge to 80%, people will get the idea when it keeps kicking them off even if they try restarting charging.
Flaviana is totally correct. Rapid chargers should cut off charging at 80% or so.. so many times i see people sitting there for an hour trying to get up to 100%. The charger should automatically cut them off. for emergency.. e.g. if the person has limited range and needs that extra 20%. then there should be an AC charger for them to use. Or the charger should display a massive warning that they need to authorise an extra payment to go beyond 80%. It would suit the charging company too. Why waste your expensive hardware pushing 5kw into a car that is charging slowly when you could be pushing 50kw into another customers car and making 10 times the money. And. Yes. there should be some way of informing the person charging how many people are waiting in the queue behind him.. it could be done through the app. You go into the app. tell the app which charger you are waiting for.. and then the person charging gets notified that people are waiting and therefore the charge will stop at 80% unless they authorise additional payment.
Tesla does this for busy chargers - which I assume it can detect based on usage. They even change your car limit to 80% no matter what you have it set to. They send a notification when you’re close to finishing, another when it’s done, and then charge you expensive ‘overstay’ penalties per minute you remain connected
I’m really grateful you have started this discussion. As EV use increases the pressure on public charge points will also increase. There will be a new kind of Road Rage unless charging companies introduce ‘nudge’ mechanisms like limiting charge times or percentages when others are waiting.
This needs a traffic light system on chargers. Green, no restriction. Orange, when all chargers are in use, 20 minute limit, automatic cutoff. Red, out of order. This would both be self limiting AND cause drivers to pressure the car manufacturers to "extract the digit" and support their vehicles. There should also be a single lane entrance to the bays, preventing queue jumping. (Similar to a car wash) Multiple lanes would cause anyone waiting in the "wrong queue" to become frustrated.
Some good points, but not all cars can use all chargers, so it gets complicated quickly at virtually all UK motorway chargers if you are unlucky to have a chademo car.
Welcome back straight talking and blunt Flavia... love it... I'm in Australia...my wife is from the Balkans and just loves Flavia.. We don't really care about EV's but love watching Flavia as entertainment. She is just so refreshing
I always filled my petrol car to full too Andrew😂 I do think most of the problems are 95 percent down to new Ev drivers who have no interest in the intricacies of charging etc....
I was charging at a rapid charger to 80% (always) & there was BMW X5 hybrid in the next charging bay parked the wrong way round not plugged in. When the driver eventually turned up I remonstrated with him I was told that his was an electric car which gave him the right to park there! There were lots of empty parking spaces elsewhere.
In my experience PHEVs are the ones trying to benefit the most without adhering to any etiquette. How many times I have come to destination chargers where PHEVs were plugged in but NOT charging. Just for the parking space. Thinking people would not notice. It's vile.
Simple explanation for this. Firstly he’s a selfish BMW⚓️, second PHEV’s should only charge at home or at work and stop taking up necessary charging bays, thirdly did I mention the driver is a selfish BMW⚓️?
It's just plain rude TO "HOVER" not everyone wants to chat and I can appreciate the fears of the more vulnerable. We're supposed to be good at queueing in the UK. Is it just me or have people found others have become more selfish during the lockdown.
Thanks for shining the spotlight on the issues of charging etiquette and anti-social behaviour. I loved Flaviana's tangential monologue on visiting Tuscany. Keep up the great work!
Thanks for the interesting video. I have a couple of suggestions to help with the charging problem: 1) Have a sliding scale of cost/kwh based on the time spent at a charger e.g. first 15 mins at 40p/kwh then 60p/kwh for the next 15 mins (or part of) etc. Chargers read your cars make etc. so they should not allow someone stopping and paying for 14 mins of charge and then restart a new charge at the same charger! 2) Need to educate the public that we have to move from a fill up habit to a top up habit. e.g. people only need to charge from say 20% to 70% then move on. The fill up habit is engrained from petrol, it was easy to run the tank down 1/4 full then then fill the tank. I think some of the problems will go away when evs have a larger range i.e. 600miles and petrol stations convert to charging stations in the next 20 years. Flaviana has a very valid point, which I must admit I had not realised. I will certainly from now on try and be more considerate and let ladies have their space and privacy.
A very important video. Flaviana is right that some people don't understand basic etiquette. Remembering back to my impulsive early 20s I was carefree and was never taught anything about etiquette. I didn't have the life experience to even comprehend that women (or men) by themselves in cars could feel vulnerable. I get it now, and I'm sure videos like this will help people understand and visualise the impact of their actions. I recently needed an early hours charge at a Lidl rapid and there was someone already charging there. Rather than drive up and park in the 2nd bay to wait, I gave the guy space, parked about 12 spots away, turned off my lights and waited patiently for 30 minutes in my car. Then when I saw him getting out I drove over to park and rolled down the window to say hi. Since he seemed friendly I got out and we had a nice chat at around 4 am. If it had been a woman I would have waited at least until she'd unplugged and got back in her car before I drove over. I generally don't engage with women drivers especially unless they say hello first.
Another wonderful video! We all appreciate hearing both sides on this. Anytime there is a paradigm shift in technology or the way we do things in general, we as a society go through phases of maturity where we see how things are, find the issues and fix them. From an engineering standpoint, the chargers themselves represent part of the solution to the puzzle of charging but the entire process of charging in a way that allows people to feel safe and not being in the "slow" line etc. still has not been standardized. Common sense is not common, and I think can be taught if the person cares enough to learn, but in any case, there has to be a way that the common sense behavior is automatically enforced. Roger Starkey's comments elsewhere here on a traffic light system looks promising to me.
Better than a tv soap listening to you both. Lol! Always enjoy seeing the two of you together and your conversations. I'm with Flaviana on this. Looking forward to the next one.
Rather than stopping at 80%, just make the rate more expensive after 80%. So, if you really need it, you can pay for it, but it might dissuade most people.
@@stevezodiac491 The point is that charging slows significantly at 80%, regardless of the car. It can take as long to get from 80 to 100% as it does from 20 to 80.
I don’t think that’s fair. As someone with a 22kWh Leaf, will only be able to gain 17.6kWh, while an Audi e-tron 55, would be allowed 69.28kWh. So are you suggesting, that just because you can afford a more expensive vehicle, you are more important and automatically have the right to drive further?
Excellent idea and this is what is being done now since Feb 1st 2022 in Quebec, the largest charger network (Circuit Electrique) is now doubling the price for any charges over 90%. it should help.
Really interesting points, I found virtually all other EV owners to be really friendly and keen to have a chat, but in the past most EV owners looked like me. As this gets much more popular and mainstream these excited old EV owners will just to relax and curb their enthusiasm. But standing on the bonnet? Really?
I just love the banter between you two. I do know that I feel guilty charging my EV past 50% - unless I NEED to - because it is so slow, but I’ve been doing this for 4 years. I’m with you Andrew re “filling” a petrol car. Stops at a fueling station are disgusting and smelly enough. Good stuff, kids!
I see my own Italian wife saying exactly the same thing and we are not even in the UK. She is absolutely right that traveling long distance is not great fun when charging stations need to be part of the plan. The UK has more than we do in NA unless you drive a Tesla. Etiquette is a big problem everywhere in a world where politeness has virtually disappeared.
...and one more point: A DC charging is affecting the battery, especially after 80%, so think about your battery life as well. Charge the rest of 20% at home and is cheaper.
I like the idea of a limit. If you are alone continue to charge but if people are waiting then only charge to 80% only. Sadly how would it be enforced? Another great video. Mrs T definitely should have her own channel 😬😬
Hello everyone, I am in the same situation. My wife drives our EV every day but she would never buy an EV if she had to charge it on her own on public charges. Back on the topic now, I do not see any harm if you kindly ask the person who is currently charging how long they are going to stay for, just to know whether to wait or go elsewhere. I do not mind being asked too. There are plenty of choices all over the plece nowadays and it is only going to get better. Buy an EV, you will net regret.
Fantastic Video, both of you are amazing together more of this please. Andrew it's actually great having your wife on these videos as you get to hear all the angles and she made some great points. Especially around some signage etiquette for users etc. Thanks for your channel.
Chargers should have multiple cables (ideally 4 assuming 4 parking spots around it) and distribute the power. The lower your SOC the higher power should be given. So if one person wants to charge to 100 percent it does not affect others that much since less power is drawn.
First reaction after reading the initial post: bloody hell. Thank you for being open and visible in raising this so we can all check our behaviour. But, wow.
My wife’s concerns about charging an EV when travelling long distances on her own meant we decided not to upgrade our 24kwh Leaf for a longer range model. We are keeping the Leaf for local journeys and replacing our 2010 Prius with an MG HS PHEV.
We went Aberdeen to Paris, about the same distance as Canterbury to Tuscany. That was in a 28kwh Ioniq, real range 115 miles, and was a bit of an adventure. Since then we've been to the South of England twice in a 64kwh Soul and it's almost disappointingly banal, no need to plan much anymore. The main problem now is accommodation destination charging.
Thanks so much for another fascinating video. It was lovely to see the wonderful Mrs EV again and hear some more of her typically amusing and grounded thoughts. Nice to catch a quick glimpse of Baby too. And thanks as ever for your thoughtful observations, Mr EV. I completely agree with all of them and have great sympathy for new EV drivers experiencing their brutal learning curve (we've all been there, after all). Thanks again!
Seeing the state of charge is totally irrelevant. Somebody could be in for a splash and dash or for a fill to brim as they have hours to go on the road. It's completely unacceptable to expect somebody to release a charger just because they think that you have enough juice. Can you imagine somebody in a queue for petrol or diesel harassing the person filling their tank because they are giving it a full tank and not just half a dozen litres? In reality, when we get our first EV I intend to charge to 80% only when we are going on trips of 100 plus miles. At other times it doesn't matter if there is only 20% to 30% charge in the battery as most journeys will be less than 20 mile round trips.
24:00 A Tesla with the supercharger network solves this issue I have to say without the need to pay for expensive petrol. No stress to check if the charger is free and no need to plan the trip beforehand.
Best thing Tesla did was to create a charging network for their own (and now other) EVs. Brilliant move! Zero chance that most other automakers will follow suit, although I think Rivian is working on their own charging network. Interesting times ahead.
I agree with you Clive, it’s not so well thought out. Just like Andrew says it depends on the range of the car but it also depends on the direction of travel. You may be going up into the mountains well away from motorway chargers and therefore need to get to 95%. I do not think any kind of charger mandated limits would work except for changing the price structure to go up after a half hour and then 45 minutes etc. Money is the best motivator, it is tricky though that people could unplug and then replug, So it would need to be tied to your account to know that this is a session continuation. For instants Porsche offers free charging for three years but only for 30 minute sessions and those sessions need to be one hour apart.
If you're anything like us Norwegians each person would "deposit" 5 queues each just to be safe. At the 12-stalls Superchargers each 200km charge would take 12 minutes. A 12-stalls place would then let a car finish every minute. The Superchargers are 120 km apart anyway. Cool eh?
The Tesla Superchargers will automatically won't let you charge beyond 80% if they are particularly busy which given the range of the vehicles is pretty reasonable. I agree there needs to be some sort of etiquette at chargers and to be fair most people are reasonable, but there's always someone who spoils it for the rest of us. Also there should definitely be better lighting/facilities at charging points. You are spot on that often chargers are hidden round the back of somewhere in the dark which is unfortunately not safe. Edit: I also always filled my petrol cars to the brim whenever I went to the petrol station. I understand not everyone can afford to do that every time, especially given the current prices of fuel, but why go more often that you have to? Another reason I love my EV, charging at home is super convenient.
@@SirHackaL0t. Ah, fair enough. I've only been to one really busy Supercharger, South Mimms on the junction of the M25 and A1, and it stopped my charging at 80% because all the charge points were in use. It's also the only time I've had to queue for a Supercharger.
Love this topic, I am waiting for my ev to arrive, I think something that could help with this is to select the amount of charge you are going to on the machine, it then will display above the machine what charge you have and a time for the charge to finish. I believe at least you can see what the time is going to be without having to get out.
Too many cars, not enough chargers The imbalance needs addressing with more high power chargers. 50kw chargers should be upgraded to reduce charge times as most new cars can charge faster. There also needs to be a proper queue system.
This woman needs her own channel! She is a vibe! And too real :). She won't let you speak anyway so a new channel is great. I love her down to earth, everyday travel perspective on EVs is very valuable.
This video should be compulsory viewing at car dealers when anyone buys an EV. It not only teaches about charging to and beyond 80% but also being mindful about personal safety while charging. Brilliant video. Best wishes to everyone. Brian.
If dealers are too lazy to explain etiquette of charging, perhaps they could include with all the bumf that they hand out at delivery a simple A4 sheet of paper explaining charging ettiqette and do's and don'ts of charging (and the reasons why). On a recent trip my GOM showed that I might not have enouh charge to get home (it indicated I would be short by around 10 miles). I stopped at a Gridserve charger, waited for about 30 mins for the car before me to charge to 100%, there was also a car behind me that needed to charge - so I topped up with 10 mins of charge so that they would not have to wait long. Simples, I got home OK and the person behind me didn't have to wait very long. It is really just about being mindful and considerate to others.
We’ll done on tackling this prickly issue. Let’s face it, it’s mainly down to a disgusting lack of reliable charging, and as you say, the love of placing many of them in dark, dank isolated places. Apologies as I ramble with a few anecdotes. Rambling anecdote 1. I dropped my wife off at work (a one-off day in the back of beyond) and didn’t want to travel all the way to the nearest Supercharger in Bristol, in all the bloody rain and traffic. So, decided to try a 3rd party pump at Leigh Delamere services. Hooked up to the one and only Grisdserve charger, and it worked…at around 43 kw. No sooner had I sat back to watch one of your episodes on the Tesla display, glowing in the realisation that this strange third party charger was juicing our car up, when a Leaf screeched up with a very stressed mother and young daughter combo. After she’d paced round the charger and my car a few times, she plugged in the ChadMo and celebrated the fact that it wasn’t charging her car, by opening her front and rear doors into our wing mirror and rear door.;) So I paused the video and got out in the rain before she wrote our car off and asked if I could help. “Oh, I didn’t realise anyone was sat in the car” she explained. We ascertained that the CCS and ChadMo wouldn’t work simultaneously, and so I said give me 5mins or so to get to a Tesla supercharger in Bristol. She and her daughter darted into the services and I went and found them after the five minutes were up. I and they were piss wet through by now. We eventually got her Leaf charging, and her stress began to subside. Basically, thank God for Tesla and the supercharger network I thought. Ramble 2. At Darts farm, we’ve had 3 instances of non Teslas going from pump to pump in vain. One, iPace, Mach-e and Peugeot. You’re kind of faced with two options…let them stress out (they we’re all low on charge…down to 4miles in one case), or go over and help. The lovely wife and I went over in each separate case, and ended up in long jolly conversations. In a nutshell, we pointed them to the three Gridserve chargers 2 miles away at Exeter services, which none of them knew about. And it’s not their fault. As Flaviana points out, everyone’s cool at fuel stations, but the EV manufacturers seem to just throw their customers out there to fend for themselves. So rightly and wrongly we mention ABRP, ZapMap, PlugShare etc. And perhaps most importantly in regards of trying to use the Superchargers, the ‘find us’ charger map on Tesla’s website. The media announce that Tesla ‘are opening their charger network to all makes’, but don’t mention that it’s currently being trialed at selected stations in the Netherlands, only. To keep up to date, regularly visit Tesla’s charging map, and the useable stations (when they become available) will show icons with some random ‘vibration’ lines on them. The solid red is no-go unfortunately, and on last look there’s nothing in the UK as yet. Our daughter has an Ioniq 28kWh and looks now and again…and her charger port is in the correct place and regularly accepts 67kW. She wouldn’t know these ins-and-outs if I didn’t tell her…it’s pioneering days, and you’ve got to be nerdy.
I love your wife, say's it like it is and straight to the point. Flaviana: i fill my petrol to the top every time as look for the cheapest petrol before it rises again. Agree that there needs to be a major increase in chargers. All new car parks should have to have a % of EV charge points. All Chargers should have videos to capture non chargers and overstay charges. Agree that hybrids should not have a Type 2 or 2c charge port and hence not take up EV chargers or be able to use them Rental cars are ridiculaously expensive, moving house so seen the prices !!! Mr EV : i want a car but due to interrnal size issues many are just not worth looking at. The others are then too expensive for average people to afford.
I am an olda person, and a as male I can understanda why women would be nervous about charging at night on there own, so I would only be interested in knowing how long I would have to wait before I would get a chargea. This would only apply to Rapid chargera, however with fasta charger I would just move on to the next charger if those chargers are occupied. I would go to look because I need to decide on whether to wait or to move on. I cannot make that decision until I know how long I would have to wait, so walking up to the charger to see as most display state of charge, is the right we all have. Plus it would be at that point I would see if anyone was in the car and unless they open their window I would either wait or move on, depending on my state of charge. However 9 out of 10 people let you know. Beside I would never argue with an Italian Womana she mighta throw my car at me!!! lol
A revision to my previous. Re charging stations...... Repurpose Fossil fuel signs. Instead of showing price for various fuels, at the same position, display: 1) Station status. Green, unlimited, Orange, Restricted "X" minutes, or kWh 2) Approximate wait time. They know who's charging which car. If it's restricted, it's simple to calculate who will be finished first, and when, plus how many are waiting. Display this "on the road" and ping a message to cars navigating, some will move on to the next station. 3) If not restricted, Bays available. (6,14, 24,25,) etc. Indicators on those bays for quick status identification. 4) If restricted, a "holding area" (similar to air traffic control!!?) With a "ticket" system, updated for electronic devices. If there's a queue, as you enter the holding area, you scan a QR code. That generates a "next in line" unique code on your phone. the car behind can't use their code untill you exit that area using yours. You scan in. Park. Approximate wait time is sent. You "do stuff". Another message tells you "5 minutes to access" Next message "code active" Bay XX (Charger number) The scanner at the holding area exit reads your QR code let's you into the charge area. Your charger has a flashing indicator. If you miss the slot, say you're "otherwise engaged", after 2 minutes(?) The following cars get to queue jump. Your code is still valid, you can take the next charger when you return by hitting a "ready" button, then you're next (ish) in line. . No visible lists to cause arguments, No sitting in the car wondering "how long!!!!??"😠 No jumping in front at the charger, No "window knocking". . Only needed when busy.
Both the original poster and Flaviana have some very valid points. Safety & security should be paramount. No more chargers stuck in the dark corners of the car parks! I like the idea of limiting charges, based on how many chargers are available. The flip-side of that is that people need to know when their cars have finished charging. Especially if you're somewhere like motorway services or using destination chargers, where you may not be waiting with your car. And without wanting to sound like a hybrid-hater, hybrids have access to fuel & electric. Surely filling with fuel instead of using a public charger is the easier option (not necessarily greener option).
I went to Devon last week in my ev, four of the chargers I stopped at did not work! one of the them (BP Pulse) had been out of commission 6 months. the public charging network is a disgrace. Yes there are a few hubs but nowhere near enough. Unless there are big changes the ev revaluation will fail, as so many car makers and dealers want to happen!
It's a change of mindset. When using a public charger just put in enough to get you to your destination or next charger, it's quicker and cheaper, always have a buffer though. Andrew - you're a lucky man. Flaviana - start your own channel, your no BS views on anything makes for great viewing.
Another great vid and very valid points, particularly about 80-100% taking so long, something that doesn't appear to be mentioned to new EV buyers. And, charging stops permitting, journeys can be even quicker by hopping between stops when the charging curve starts reducing well before reaching 80% but you really need to know your vehicle and have reasonably good range management for that. All that aside .... masks ..... great way to close off that conversation 😂
Flavians you rather contradict yourself by inferring that to buy a petrol car is selfish (around the 22 min mark), and then earlier explain you would always buy a 'petrol' car as EV's are too inconvenient! However the fact that I sat through the whole half hour video is down to your brilliant character, and you are clearly the star of the channel!
I agree; it is one of the things I'd dread doing public charging. I'll stay cozy in my car while it charges and I'll move when I've hit my charge target, don't worry I have no intention of staying longer than needed. Meanwhile, leave me alone.
Charging only to 80% and then driving on to the next charger may be quicker in theory but in practice it's a gamble. Any speed advantage can be demolished by delays at the next charger. Can you find it? Is it available? Are there payment or charging issues and is it charging at full speed?
Yes new EVers need to know that they should keep their battery state of charge between 20 and 80% and always try to arrive at a charger near or less than the 20% mark
How about a system for group chargers that stops all cars at 80% if there are no free bays? That and a display showing time to 80% that can be read without walking up to the car/charger?
More chargers and consequently more choice is needed and soon, hopefully will evolve into the OK situation that they appear to have in Norway. Even in Norway there appears to be some queuing at peak holiday times but in general queues (In Bjorn Nylands videos for example) appear very reasonable.
I hardly dare mention that I’m a 4.4ltr Range Rover driving subscriber 😊🙏 But at least I will one day be a Tesla driver once the S is available again in the uk 🤞🏻
I love the way Flaviana goes off topic, such fun and she s right, EV's are not yet for everyone but they are getting there, if we look back to the early days of petrol cars there were very few garages where you could buy petrol. Planning a long trip would have been even harder. I am surprised at how rapid the increase in number of charge locations is now.
Don’t know if this has been mentioned by anyone else (too many comments to read them all) but perhaps wider adoption of the Need to Charge app might be an answer to this. No face to face contact required, no personal details revealed and provides a channel to ping people on chargers to see how long they are going to be.
Thanks for the video. I never thought about basing the charge time / limit on the number of available chargers at a site. That seems like a very reasonable / civil way to ensure more people have an opportunity to charge when charge stations are not abundant. Well done Flaviana. BTW: You are not alone.... Most people do not want to feel compelled to chat / talk EVs when charging one's vehicle.
Another excellent and entertaining video. Especially Mrs EVs monologue. The tour of the BS towns and "the bit of France on the left that we couldn't visit". Charging etiquette too. A very important subject. The last long journey we took, I changed tactics and charged more frequently and only to around 80%. We got there quicker!
Many chargers are located in dark isolated areas which should be improved, as no one feels safe in a strange location sitting in darkness. Flavianna is a gem, so down to earth and honest about things. She should see a doctor about that occasional horn sound she makes :o)
Really like watching these, but what I’m hearing from both of you is a “lack of communication” (to quote Cool Hand Luke). There was no acknowledgement that it’s different for women. Women on their own are much more vulnerable than men on their own. Andrew’s ideas about CCTVs etc (with lots of “shoulds”) are good as far as they go. But why would a single woman (especially) buy an EV and submit herself to the risk?
You're right to highlight this 'Elephant in the Room' about etiquette and security/vulnerability of public charging areas. Only ever seen a queue for EVs on some of Bjorn's videos in Norway. But they had space to wait. Haphazard at motorway services car parks.
I make sure I return to my car before I get to 80% if someone turns up I will move on. How about a cut off based on charging speed. Hubs need to have rapids and lots of AC. You roll up plug in to the 150kw charger and when your speed has dropped below 22kw if the site is busy it cuts off and you move to one of the AC chargers.
Another great video. I think an issue that might be relevant is the number of people who can't charge at home - at the moment these people are, in the main, sticking with ICE or Hybrid - in short it won't always be the case that nearly everyone charges at home - possibly up to 40% will need to charge at a public charger. It would be re-assuring to know that planning is being done to accommodate those who can't charge at home.
I charge mostly at home, but I can see this being an issue for people that can't. I don't care as much about self driving cars while in the car, but it would be amazing if your car can drive itself to a public charger while you are sleeping and drive back waiting for you when you are awake if you can't charge at home.
Andrew, she is so funny. You should start a podcast with her. That Italian tone, the smirks and the trip recall. She nailed it. On other hand your calmness, composure and smoothness. Great video.
There should be anpr cameras covering charging stations linked to the charger. If it detects a vehicle in a bay and the charger is not actually dispensing a charge a fine is automatically imposed. If that car IS plugged into the charger but no charge is being dispensed, then a fine will be levied after a set period (to allow the return of the owner subsequent to termination of charge), say, 10 minutes.
Mrs EV is being deliberately provocative (you can see when she smiles) but much of what she says is true. Assurances that it will soon all be better because lots more chargers are going in I find less convincing. Like the EV family I suspect current EV owners are more likely to have home charging and so only need to charge on long journeys and while on holiday. During the transition a higher proportion of owners without home charging will join the queues for chargers and they will need them more often. Needing to charge for a daily commute makes for extra pressure to get a charge to avoid being late for work and makes a nasty situation more likely. I also have concerns that where there are many chargers there is no system of queuing so that customers are dealt with in order. I went to the chargers at Rugby during the summer and all the non Tesla slots were full. When others arrived there was no formal place for them to wait and it required them all to note who arrived first and behave in a civilised way. On that occasion all was fine but it would have been easy for a new arrival to not realise some cars parked in spaces opposite were waiting to charge and to drive straight into a just freed up slot.
Charging fees based on time (minutes) rather than by KwHr will encourage most people to stop charging beyond 80% because it would get very cost inefficient. The planned expansion of chargers in the next few years will not keep pace with growth in EV sales, so network capacity will remain a big limitation in the next few years, possibly even get worse before it gets better.
A big issue I've found is the snobbery and "I've had my EV longer than you " attitude of some drivers, I agree that some drivers deliberately don't care about others either because they feel some self-serving entitlement to hand on to the charger for as long as they can. I've had a guy approach me asking me if I live in the village where the charger is located claiming that the charger is for the use of residents only and I've also witnessed a taxi driver harass a woman claiming he has priority as a public service and could she disconnect and let him use the charger. There is no quick answer but I think the use of rapids should be restricted to 40 mins between 7am to 9pm and auto-stop forcing drivers to move on I also think that there needs to be a mechanism where cars cannot be parked on rapids and left unattended for more than 20 mins to stop the park and leave morons.
And it's not entitled to demand someone leaves because you perceive your need to be greater than theirs? Works both ways. The taxi and village thing are silly though
I think an "Italian wife reacts" channel would be a hit! Flaviana is a star
Absolutely, never has “Oh my Wife will deal with this conversation about this problem” meant so much. I like the no bullshit Italian style, take no prisoners approach 😁 That aside why would you try and open a woman’s Car door that shocking at night. Charging points need a rethink bright, cameras you provide a safe environment you’ll get the customers.
@@SWR112 why would you try to open anyone's door?
@@GraemeHart8888 Entitlement, that's why. I am a big guy driving an expensive car. Nobody would dare walk up and open my door. Many guys, including apparently Mr. EV, consider women as lesser beings somehow in need of their guidance. The public exposure of women in the captive environment of charging is a genuine concern. Uncouth and aggressive men often feel entitled to impose on physically weaker people. It is incumbent on the rest of us to make women feel comfortable at charging stations. We can best do this by leaving them alone and seeing that others do as well.
And if you don't agree you are a C-word! I love that woman!
Classic Flaviana: "First of all, I don't like people!" Just can't help loving her.. If you're a driver, please remember to keep well away from those "bullshit" towns. 😂
Flaviana is right - a display of charging etiquette on the charger or on a prominent separate sign is a great idea. But it's not beyond technology to be able to detect a queue of drivers and at that time limit all chargers to 80% max and kick the car off at that point.
Tesla supercharger do the former. The set your limit to 80 at busy stations but agree with the second one. Cars should disconnect once complete so others can disconnect and charge
@@nialli2000 or make the price progressive. Charge as long as you want, but at 80-100% the price will be doubled.
There is much information missing from the original post. What Level of charger was that person at? What was their level of charge? Could the woman have asked the person to not peer into her car? Most people today have access to a Cellular Phone and could have called for help (IE: Dial 911) or simply turn on the headlights. Most people when noticing this would simply back off and get away from the circumstances. Any kind of altercation is alleviated if common sense is used.
@Ibrahim Ulf Karlsson that's a really good idea. I genuinely think a lot of people don't understand the plus 80% charging drop off. It'd be a good way to educate everyone
@@nialli2000 you need to ensure you communicate to them why it's so expensive when they go over 80% or might just think rapid charging is really expensive
"If you see that there's a woman with children and it's late at night, you must be a c-word if you don't get the F away." Brilliant and on point! Thanks for being blunt, Flaviana! Greetings from Germany! 👏
I love Flaviana. You should always have her on. Very direct and to the point and she is very correct!!
If only we could get Flaviana to organise the charger deployment in the UK!
I would love to see a weekly show with Flaviana, just pick a random topic and let's hear her thoughts. Honest, down to earth, funny (without trying to be) and so natural. A show with opinions and anecdotes that doesn't hold back - what's not to love.
You guys have such a natural charisma going on that it makes it irrelevant if we agree or not with your opinions, we just have to see it all.
As opposed to the fake approach on many channels
👍😀
You should have a seperate channel featuring Flavia and her down to earth no bullshit opinions on life in general..... she would be a hit in this world of fakeness
Definite candidate for minister of common sense.
@@BRI535D That would be Andrew, not her
When I hired an e-Niro and parked at a charger that was in use, I gently knocked on the other car's window (fully steamed up, no idea who was inside) and politely asked the two women inside how long they had left. I didn't want to wait in the car for the charger to be available and be sat there for 30 minutes when I could have done some shopping in the meantime. But now I look back that was intrusive and unnecessary I feel, and could have made them uncomfortable. They were very friendly and helpful though. If I could see the state of charge of the car from the machine, I would never have felt the need to speak to them.
Oh dear, it's too bad General Motors is no longer in Europe. They have icons on the outside of their vehicles giving viewers some idea of how much charge they have from the outside. Of course, people might not understand this and also might resort to more intrusive methods.
Brilliant... Italian passion and straight talking from your wife, makes a truly entertaining and enjoyable video.
I think the main thing is the lack of training for new owners transitioning from ICE cars. Charging to 100% is usually far slower than making two stops for 50% each time but that's a foreign concept for someone who has only ever used an ICE vehicle.
It'll get better when charging hubs are commonplace and every petrol station has at least one EV bay, but for the moment I agree with Flavia that if you're not an enthusiast then a full EV is not a good choice for you because of the poor state of charging facilities in the UK. Hopefully that will change soon but for now it is what it is.
Also we enthusiasts need to keep in mind that not all EV drivers are as keen as we are, so we need to respect others' personal space. Instavolt definitely has the right idea with the large LED signs above each post to indicate free/busy, perhaps they could extend that to include remaining charge time?
Training won't do anything when every charge is going to take 1 hour to do.
After a while you'll get fed up with moving from charger to charger and tell everyone else to go get fucked, this is probably the real reason why EV cars didn't work the first time.
@@zagan1 Why would each charge take an hour? Even at a 50kW station, which is slow by today's standards, most EVs can go from 20-80% in a half hour or less. My point was that most people don't know that the charge rate slows down as the battery gets more full, so two stops charging from 25-75% will take a lot less cumulative time than running it down to zero and charging back to 100. So it benefits the driver to stop more, and it benefits other drivers by keeping turnover high at the station.
With regard to previous generation EVs like the EV1 and earlier designs going back even before the petrol engine was invented, the problem was energy density. Until recently, the technology needed to store hundreds of miles of energy under the floor of a car didn't exist, and it wasn't developed until it was needed for mobile phones.
I usually only charge up to what I need to get me to where I’m going, and mostly charge at night at home. But people hogging chargers for hours to charge up to the max it’s ridiculous, I had one guy charge up his Mitsubishi Outlander petrol/ hybrid car for over 8 hours and security had to go to his apartment to tell him to move his car.
She’s a real people person. 😂. Great video. Keep up the good work 👍🏻
The only way to fix this is the charger automatically stops at 80% if someone else is waiting. There’s a lot of selfish people who don’t care about anyone else apart from themselves.
I agree. But practically, what's to stop these idiots from then disconnecting and starting a new session?
@@yitzele Chargers have the ability to read battery SOC so if you stick a bit sign up saying the charger will only charge to 80%, people will get the idea when it keeps kicking them off even if they try restarting charging.
@@CED99 good. I hope something like this gets implemented
@@yitzele No two successive sessions with the same CC/RFID/whatever.
@@bazoo513 they'll just create two accounts then
Flaviana is totally correct. Rapid chargers should cut off charging at 80% or so.. so many times i see people sitting there for an hour trying to get up to 100%. The charger should automatically cut them off. for emergency.. e.g. if the person has limited range and needs that extra 20%. then there should be an AC charger for them to use. Or the charger should display a massive warning that they need to authorise an extra payment to go beyond 80%.
It would suit the charging company too. Why waste your expensive hardware pushing 5kw into a car that is charging slowly when you could be pushing 50kw into another customers car and making 10 times the money.
And. Yes. there should be some way of informing the person charging how many people are waiting in the queue behind him.. it could be done through the app. You go into the app. tell the app which charger you are waiting for.. and then the person charging gets notified that people are waiting and therefore the charge will stop at 80% unless they authorise additional payment.
Tesla does this for busy chargers - which I assume it can detect based on usage. They even change your car limit to 80% no matter what you have it set to. They send a notification when you’re close to finishing, another when it’s done, and then charge you expensive ‘overstay’ penalties per minute you remain connected
I’m really grateful you have started this discussion. As EV use increases the pressure on public charge points will also increase. There will be a new kind of Road Rage unless charging companies introduce ‘nudge’ mechanisms like limiting charge times or percentages when others are waiting.
This needs a traffic light system on chargers.
Green, no restriction.
Orange, when all chargers are in use, 20 minute limit, automatic cutoff.
Red, out of order.
This would both be self limiting AND cause drivers to pressure the car manufacturers to "extract the digit" and support their vehicles.
There should also be a single lane entrance to the bays, preventing queue jumping.
(Similar to a car wash)
Multiple lanes would cause anyone waiting in the "wrong queue" to become frustrated.
Some good points, but not all cars can use all chargers, so it gets complicated quickly at virtually all UK motorway chargers if you are unlucky to have a chademo car.
@@martinweston8147
Chademo is becoming an edge case?
@@rogerstarkey5390 yes the EU has gone to CCS
@@CED99
It's called "sarcasm"
Welcome back straight talking and blunt Flavia... love it... I'm in Australia...my wife is from the Balkans and just loves Flavia..
We don't really care about EV's but love watching Flavia as entertainment. She is just so refreshing
I always filled my petrol car to full too Andrew😂
I do think most of the problems are 95 percent down to new Ev drivers who have no interest in the intricacies of charging etc....
I was charging at a rapid charger to 80% (always) & there was BMW X5 hybrid in the next charging bay parked the wrong way round not plugged in. When the driver eventually turned up I remonstrated with him I was told that his was an electric car which gave him the right to park there! There were lots of empty parking spaces elsewhere.
Ive seen PHEVs doing the same
In my experience PHEVs are the ones trying to benefit the most without adhering to any etiquette. How many times I have come to destination chargers where PHEVs were plugged in but NOT charging. Just for the parking space. Thinking people would not notice. It's vile.
What a clown!
Simple explanation for this. Firstly he’s a selfish BMW⚓️, second PHEV’s should only charge at home or at work and stop taking up necessary charging bays, thirdly did I mention the driver is a selfish BMW⚓️?
It's just plain rude TO "HOVER" not everyone wants to chat and I can appreciate the fears of the more vulnerable. We're supposed to be good at queueing in the UK. Is it just me or have people found others have become more selfish during the lockdown.
Thanks for shining the spotlight on the issues of charging etiquette and anti-social behaviour. I loved Flaviana's tangential monologue on visiting Tuscany. Keep up the great work!
Flaviana's black humour and sarcasm is always the highlight in a Mr. EV's episode - please let Flaviana become an essential part of all your episodes!
Thanks for the interesting video. I have a couple of suggestions to help with the charging problem:
1) Have a sliding scale of cost/kwh based on the time spent at a charger
e.g. first 15 mins at 40p/kwh then 60p/kwh for the next 15 mins (or part of) etc.
Chargers read your cars make etc. so they should not allow someone stopping and paying
for 14 mins of charge and then restart a new charge at the same charger!
2) Need to educate the public that we have to move from a fill up habit to a top up habit.
e.g. people only need to charge from say 20% to 70% then move on.
The fill up habit is engrained from petrol, it was easy to run the tank down 1/4 full then
then fill the tank.
I think some of the problems will go away when evs have a larger range i.e. 600miles and
petrol stations convert to charging stations in the next 20 years.
Flaviana has a very valid point, which I must admit I had not realised.
I will certainly from now on try and be more considerate and let ladies have their space and
privacy.
More Flaviana please. My wife and I just love her comments! Very entertaining and right on target
A very important video. Flaviana is right that some people don't understand basic etiquette. Remembering back to my impulsive early 20s I was carefree and was never taught anything about etiquette. I didn't have the life experience to even comprehend that women (or men) by themselves in cars could feel vulnerable. I get it now, and I'm sure videos like this will help people understand and visualise the impact of their actions.
I recently needed an early hours charge at a Lidl rapid and there was someone already charging there. Rather than drive up and park in the 2nd bay to wait, I gave the guy space, parked about 12 spots away, turned off my lights and waited patiently for 30 minutes in my car. Then when I saw him getting out I drove over to park and rolled down the window to say hi. Since he seemed friendly I got out and we had a nice chat at around 4 am. If it had been a woman I would have waited at least until she'd unplugged and got back in her car before I drove over. I generally don't engage with women drivers especially unless they say hello first.
Another wonderful video! We all appreciate hearing both sides on this. Anytime there is a paradigm shift in technology or the way we do things in general, we as a society go through phases of maturity where we see how things are, find the issues and fix them. From an engineering standpoint, the chargers themselves represent part of the solution to the puzzle of charging but the entire process of charging in a way that allows people to feel safe and not being in the "slow" line etc. still has not been standardized. Common sense is not common, and I think can be taught if the person cares enough to learn, but in any case, there has to be a way that the common sense behavior is automatically enforced. Roger Starkey's comments elsewhere here on a traffic light system looks promising to me.
Andrew, you are so reasonable. They do say that opposites attract…..
Better than a tv soap listening to you both. Lol! Always enjoy seeing the two of you together and your conversations. I'm with Flaviana on this. Looking forward to the next one.
Rather than stopping at 80%, just make the rate more expensive after 80%. So, if you really need it, you can pay for it, but it might dissuade most people.
80% of what, a 106 mile range car, a 160, 200, 250, 280 ? Not the same thing to all cars.
@@stevezodiac491 The point is that charging slows significantly at 80%, regardless of the car. It can take as long to get from 80 to 100% as it does from 20 to 80.
I don’t think that’s fair. As someone with a 22kWh Leaf, will only be able to gain 17.6kWh, while an Audi e-tron 55, would be allowed 69.28kWh. So are you suggesting, that just because you can afford a more expensive vehicle, you are more important and automatically have the right to drive further?
good point
Excellent idea and this is what is being done now since Feb 1st 2022 in Quebec, the largest charger network (Circuit Electrique) is now doubling the price for any charges over 90%. it should help.
Really interesting points, I found virtually all other EV owners to be really friendly and keen to have a chat, but in the past most EV owners looked like me. As this gets much more popular and mainstream these excited old EV owners will just to relax and curb their enthusiasm. But standing on the bonnet? Really?
I just love the banter between you two. I do know that I feel guilty charging my EV past 50% - unless I NEED to - because it is so slow, but I’ve been doing this for 4 years. I’m with you Andrew re “filling” a petrol car. Stops at a fueling station are disgusting and smelly enough. Good stuff, kids!
I see my own Italian wife saying exactly the same thing and we are not even in the UK. She is absolutely right that traveling long distance is not great fun when charging stations need to be part of the plan. The UK has more than we do in NA unless you drive a Tesla. Etiquette is a big problem everywhere in a world where politeness has virtually disappeared.
...and one more point: A DC charging is affecting the battery, especially after 80%, so think about your battery life as well. Charge the rest of 20% at home and is cheaper.
Charging etiquette should be added to the highway code... if it isn't already
I like the idea of a limit. If you are alone continue to charge but if people are waiting then only charge to 80% only. Sadly how would it be enforced?
Another great video. Mrs T definitely should have her own channel 😬😬
Hello everyone, I am in the same situation. My wife drives our EV every day but she would never buy an EV if she had to charge it on her own on public charges. Back on the topic now, I do not see any harm if you kindly ask the person who is currently charging how long they are going to stay for, just to know whether to wait or go elsewhere. I do not mind being asked too. There are plenty of choices all over the plece nowadays and it is only going to get better. Buy an EV, you will net regret.
Fantastic Video, both of you are amazing together more of this please. Andrew it's actually great having your wife on these videos as you get to hear all the angles and she made some great points. Especially around some signage etiquette for users etc. Thanks for your channel.
Chargers should have multiple cables (ideally 4 assuming 4 parking spots around it) and distribute the power. The lower your SOC the higher power should be given. So if one person wants to charge to 100 percent it does not affect others that much since less power is drawn.
I agree. That’s how Kempower chargers work, right?
Maybe kind of a que priority system too. First in, first priority, above 80% SOC last priority.
First reaction after reading the initial post: bloody hell. Thank you for being open and visible in raising this so we can all check our behaviour. But, wow.
My wife’s concerns about charging an EV when travelling long distances on her own meant we decided not to upgrade our 24kwh Leaf for a longer range model. We are keeping the Leaf for local journeys and replacing our 2010 Prius with an MG HS PHEV.
A very good discussion that covers the growing number of issues with public chargers, which I have managed to avoid using so far.
We went Aberdeen to Paris, about the same distance as Canterbury to Tuscany. That was in a 28kwh Ioniq, real range 115 miles, and was a bit of an adventure. Since then we've been to the South of England twice in a 64kwh Soul and it's almost disappointingly banal, no need to plan much anymore. The main problem now is accommodation destination charging.
Dealers should have an info pack showing common sense info and how to be nice to other EV drivers at chargers
But that shouldn't be necessary!
Those who need the advice the most are the least likely to read it or follow it.
@@AndrewLumsden Lots of things shouldn’t be necessary in life but we still need to be told or trained.
Thanks so much for another fascinating video. It was lovely to see the wonderful Mrs EV again and hear some more of her typically amusing and grounded thoughts. Nice to catch a quick glimpse of Baby too. And thanks as ever for your thoughtful observations, Mr EV. I completely agree with all of them and have great sympathy for new EV drivers experiencing their brutal learning curve (we've all been there, after all). Thanks again!
Totally agree with Flavia. Wait until I leave, don’t come and ask, keep away from my space.
When charge rate drops below a specified amount (say 20Kw) then rapid chargers should stop....this would stop people dawdling.
Seeing the state of charge is totally irrelevant. Somebody could be in for a splash and dash or for a fill to brim as they have hours to go on the road.
It's completely unacceptable to expect somebody to release a charger just because they think that you have enough juice. Can you imagine somebody in a queue for petrol or diesel harassing the person filling their tank because they are giving it a full tank and not just half a dozen litres?
In reality, when we get our first EV I intend to charge to 80% only when we are going on trips of 100 plus miles. At other times it doesn't matter if there is only 20% to 30% charge in the battery as most journeys will be less than 20 mile round trips.
24:00 A Tesla with the supercharger network solves this issue I have to say without the need to pay for expensive petrol.
No stress to check if the charger is free and no need to plan the trip beforehand.
Best thing Tesla did was to create a charging network for their own (and now other) EVs. Brilliant move! Zero chance that most other automakers will follow suit, although I think Rivian is working on their own charging network. Interesting times ahead.
The ‘i am waiting’ button would be abused. Nothing stopping someone pressing it many times to cut short a charge session.
I agree with you Clive, it’s not so well thought out. Just like Andrew says it depends on the range of the car but it also depends on the direction of travel. You may be going up into the mountains well away from motorway chargers and therefore need to get to 95%. I do not think any kind of charger mandated limits would work except for changing the price structure to go up after a half hour and then 45 minutes etc. Money is the best motivator, it is tricky though that people could unplug and then replug, So it would need to be tied to your account to know that this is a session continuation. For instants Porsche offers free charging for three years but only for 30 minute sessions and those sessions need to be one hour apart.
If you're anything like us Norwegians each person would "deposit" 5 queues each just to be safe. At the 12-stalls Superchargers each 200km charge would take 12 minutes. A 12-stalls place would then let a car finish every minute. The Superchargers are 120 km apart anyway. Cool eh?
The Tesla Superchargers will automatically won't let you charge beyond 80% if they are particularly busy which given the range of the vehicles is pretty reasonable. I agree there needs to be some sort of etiquette at chargers and to be fair most people are reasonable, but there's always someone who spoils it for the rest of us.
Also there should definitely be better lighting/facilities at charging points. You are spot on that often chargers are hidden round the back of somewhere in the dark which is unfortunately not safe.
Edit: I also always filled my petrol cars to the brim whenever I went to the petrol station. I understand not everyone can afford to do that every time, especially given the current prices of fuel, but why go more often that you have to? Another reason I love my EV, charging at home is super convenient.
Not quote true, it sets the limit to 80% but you are quite able to change that back to a higher amount if you want.
@@SirHackaL0t. Ah, fair enough. I've only been to one really busy Supercharger, South Mimms on the junction of the M25 and A1, and it stopped my charging at 80% because all the charge points were in use. It's also the only time I've had to queue for a Supercharger.
@@NickFoster You get a message saying that the charge limit is being set to 80% but you can still change it afterwards to do more if you need it.
Love this topic, I am waiting for my ev to arrive, I think something that could help with this is to select the amount of charge you are going to on the machine, it then will display above the machine what charge you have and a time for the charge to finish. I believe at least you can see what the time is going to be without having to get out.
Too many cars, not enough chargers The imbalance needs addressing with more high power chargers. 50kw chargers should be upgraded to reduce charge times as most new cars can charge faster. There also needs to be a proper queue system.
This woman needs her own channel! She is a vibe! And too real :). She won't let you speak anyway so a new channel is great. I love her down to earth, everyday travel perspective on EVs is very valuable.
Flaviana has to get her own channel. I’m in love 🥰😂
Flaviana is a youtube star. Can't get enough of her.
This video should be compulsory viewing at car dealers when anyone buys an EV. It not only teaches about charging to and beyond 80% but also being mindful about personal safety while charging. Brilliant video. Best wishes to everyone. Brian.
If dealers are too lazy to explain etiquette of charging, perhaps they could include with all the bumf that they hand out at delivery a simple A4 sheet of paper explaining charging ettiqette and do's and don'ts of charging (and the reasons why).
On a recent trip my GOM showed that I might not have enouh charge to get home (it indicated I would be short by around 10 miles). I stopped at a Gridserve charger, waited for about 30 mins for the car before me to charge to 100%, there was also a car behind me that needed to charge - so I topped up with 10 mins of charge so that they would not have to wait long.
Simples, I got home OK and the person behind me didn't have to wait very long. It is really just about being mindful and considerate to others.
dealers, don't talk to me about dealers....
wheeler dealers says it all. all they know is 'glass's guide' and hp/lease rates...
Variable charge rates based on time.. first 30mins one price, next 15mins a bit dearer, 15 after that, etc etc.
We’ll done on tackling this prickly issue. Let’s face it, it’s mainly down to a disgusting lack of reliable charging, and as you say, the love of placing many of them in dark, dank isolated places.
Apologies as I ramble with a few anecdotes.
Rambling anecdote 1. I dropped my wife off at work (a one-off day in the back of beyond) and didn’t want to travel all the way to the nearest Supercharger in Bristol, in all the bloody rain and traffic. So, decided to try a 3rd party pump at Leigh Delamere services. Hooked up to the one and only Grisdserve charger, and it worked…at around 43 kw. No sooner had I sat back to watch one of your episodes on the Tesla display, glowing in the realisation that this strange third party charger was juicing our car up, when a Leaf screeched up with a very stressed mother and young daughter combo. After she’d paced round the charger and my car a few times, she plugged in the ChadMo and celebrated the fact that it wasn’t charging her car, by opening her front and rear doors into our wing mirror and rear door.;) So I paused the video and got out in the rain before she wrote our car off and asked if I could help. “Oh, I didn’t realise anyone was sat in the car” she explained. We ascertained that the CCS and ChadMo wouldn’t work simultaneously, and so I said give me 5mins or so to get to a Tesla supercharger in Bristol. She and her daughter darted into the services and I went and found them after the five minutes were up. I and they were piss wet through by now. We eventually got her Leaf charging, and her stress began to subside. Basically, thank God for Tesla and the supercharger network I thought.
Ramble 2. At Darts farm, we’ve had 3 instances of non Teslas going from pump to pump in vain. One, iPace, Mach-e and Peugeot. You’re kind of faced with two options…let them stress out (they we’re all low on charge…down to 4miles in one case), or go over and help. The lovely wife and I went over in each separate case, and ended up in long jolly conversations. In a nutshell, we pointed them to the three Gridserve chargers 2 miles away at Exeter services, which none of them knew about. And it’s not their fault. As Flaviana points out, everyone’s cool at fuel stations, but the EV manufacturers seem to just throw their customers out there to fend for themselves.
So rightly and wrongly we mention ABRP, ZapMap, PlugShare etc. And perhaps most importantly in regards of trying to use the Superchargers, the ‘find us’ charger map on Tesla’s website. The media announce that Tesla ‘are opening their charger network to all makes’, but don’t mention that it’s currently being trialed at selected stations in the Netherlands, only. To keep up to date, regularly visit Tesla’s charging map, and the useable stations (when they become available) will show icons with some random ‘vibration’ lines on them. The solid red is no-go unfortunately, and on last look there’s nothing in the UK as yet. Our daughter has an Ioniq 28kWh and looks now and again…and her charger port is in the correct place and regularly accepts 67kW. She wouldn’t know these ins-and-outs if I didn’t tell her…it’s pioneering days, and you’ve got to be nerdy.
All new EVs should come with an A3 sheet of paper saying ‘DON’T BE A DICK’
I love your wife, say's it like it is and straight to the point.
Flaviana: i fill my petrol to the top every time as look for the cheapest petrol before it rises again.
Agree that there needs to be a major increase in chargers. All new car parks should have to have a % of EV charge points.
All Chargers should have videos to capture non chargers and overstay charges.
Agree that hybrids should not have a Type 2 or 2c charge port and hence not take up EV chargers or be able to use them
Rental cars are ridiculaously expensive, moving house so seen the prices !!!
Mr EV : i want a car but due to interrnal size issues many are just not worth looking at. The others are then too expensive for average people to afford.
I am an olda person, and a as male I can understanda why women would be nervous about charging at night on there own, so I would only be interested in knowing how long I would have to wait before I would get a chargea. This would only apply to Rapid chargera, however with fasta charger I would just move on to the next charger if those chargers are occupied. I would go to look because I need to decide on whether to wait or to move on. I cannot make that decision until I know how long I would have to wait, so walking up to the charger to see as most display state of charge, is the right we all have. Plus it would be at that point I would see if anyone was in the car and unless they open their window I would either wait or move on, depending on my state of charge. However 9 out of 10 people let you know. Beside I would never argue with an Italian Womana she mighta throw my car at me!!! lol
A revision to my previous.
Re charging stations......
Repurpose Fossil fuel signs.
Instead of showing price for various fuels, at the same position, display:
1) Station status.
Green, unlimited,
Orange, Restricted "X" minutes, or kWh
2) Approximate wait time.
They know who's charging which car. If it's restricted, it's simple to calculate who will be finished first, and when, plus how many are waiting.
Display this "on the road" and ping a message to cars navigating, some will move on to the next station.
3) If not restricted,
Bays available. (6,14, 24,25,) etc.
Indicators on those bays for quick status identification.
4) If restricted, a "holding area" (similar to air traffic control!!?)
With a "ticket" system, updated for electronic devices.
If there's a queue, as you enter the holding area, you scan a QR code. That generates a "next in line" unique code on your phone. the car behind can't use their code untill you exit that area using yours.
You scan in.
Park.
Approximate wait time is sent.
You "do stuff".
Another message tells you "5 minutes to access"
Next message "code active" Bay XX (Charger number)
The scanner at the holding area exit reads your QR code let's you into the charge area. Your charger has a flashing indicator.
If you miss the slot, say you're "otherwise engaged", after 2 minutes(?) The following cars get to queue jump.
Your code is still valid, you can take the next charger when you return by hitting a "ready" button, then you're next (ish) in line.
.
No visible lists to cause arguments,
No sitting in the car wondering "how long!!!!??"😠
No jumping in front at the charger,
No "window knocking".
.
Only needed when busy.
Flaviana, you're a star! I love the no nonsense attitude. Thanks for this video both of you.
Both the original poster and Flaviana have some very valid points. Safety & security should be paramount. No more chargers stuck in the dark corners of the car parks! I like the idea of limiting charges, based on how many chargers are available. The flip-side of that is that people need to know when their cars have finished charging. Especially if you're somewhere like motorway services or using destination chargers, where you may not be waiting with your car.
And without wanting to sound like a hybrid-hater, hybrids have access to fuel & electric. Surely filling with fuel instead of using a public charger is the easier option (not necessarily greener option).
I went to Devon last week in my ev, four of the chargers I stopped at did not work! one of the them (BP Pulse) had been out of commission 6 months. the public charging network is a disgrace. Yes there are a few hubs but nowhere near enough. Unless there are big changes the ev revaluation will fail, as so many car makers and dealers want to happen!
That’s shocking. I’ve never experienced such a low success rate. Good thing you weren’t stranded!
It's a change of mindset. When using a public charger just put in enough to get you to your destination or next charger, it's quicker and cheaper, always have a buffer though.
Andrew - you're a lucky man.
Flaviana - start your own channel, your no BS views on anything makes for great viewing.
Another great vid and very valid points, particularly about 80-100% taking so long, something that doesn't appear to be mentioned to new EV buyers.
And, charging stops permitting, journeys can be even quicker by hopping between stops when the charging curve starts reducing well before reaching 80% but you really need to know your vehicle and have reasonably good range management for that.
All that aside .... masks ..... great way to close off that conversation 😂
Love your wife’s honesty.
Mate, I’m with you, I always fill the car to 100% diesel. I think we must be at least 90% of the population.
That's great to hear! I thought I was going crazy there for a second.
Flavians you rather contradict yourself by inferring that to buy a petrol car is selfish (around the 22 min mark), and then earlier explain you would always buy a 'petrol' car as EV's are too inconvenient!
However the fact that I sat through the whole half hour video is down to your brilliant character, and you are clearly the star of the channel!
I agree; it is one of the things I'd dread doing public charging. I'll stay cozy in my car while it charges and I'll move when I've hit my charge target, don't worry I have no intention of staying longer than needed. Meanwhile, leave me alone.
Charging only to 80% and then driving on to the next charger may be quicker in theory but in practice it's a gamble. Any speed advantage can be demolished by delays at the next charger. Can you find it? Is it available? Are there payment or charging issues and is it charging at full speed?
Exactly this.
Yes new EVers need to know that they should keep their battery state of charge between 20 and 80% and always try to arrive at a charger near or less than the 20% mark
How about a system for group chargers that stops all cars at 80% if there are no free bays? That and a display showing time to 80% that can be read without walking up to the car/charger?
Flaviana is hilarious! I don’t think I’ve ever laughed so hard while watching an “EV” video on UA-cam. 😂😂
Totally agree she is a hoot!!
More chargers and consequently more choice is needed and soon, hopefully will evolve into the OK situation that they appear to have in Norway. Even in Norway there appears to be some queuing at peak holiday times but in general queues (In Bjorn Nylands videos for example) appear very reasonable.
I hardly dare mention that I’m a 4.4ltr Range Rover driving subscriber 😊🙏 But at least I will one day be a Tesla driver once the S is available again in the uk 🤞🏻
Wise move sir!
I love the way Flaviana goes off topic, such fun and she s right, EV's are not yet for everyone but they are getting there, if we look back to the early days of petrol cars there were very few garages where you could buy petrol. Planning a long trip would have been even harder. I am surprised at how rapid the increase in number of charge locations is now.
Don’t know if this has been mentioned by anyone else (too many comments to read them all) but perhaps wider adoption of the Need to Charge app might be an answer to this. No face to face contact required, no personal details revealed and provides a channel to ping people on chargers to see how long they are going to be.
Thanks for the video. I never thought about basing the charge time / limit on the number of available chargers at a site. That seems like a very reasonable / civil way to ensure more people have an opportunity to charge when charge stations are not abundant. Well done Flaviana. BTW: You are not alone.... Most people do not want to feel compelled to chat / talk EVs when charging one's vehicle.
Another excellent and entertaining video. Especially Mrs EVs monologue. The tour of the BS towns and "the bit of France on the left that we couldn't visit".
Charging etiquette too. A very important subject. The last long journey we took, I changed tactics and charged more frequently and only to around 80%. We got there quicker!
Many chargers are located in dark isolated areas which should be improved, as no one feels safe in a strange location sitting in darkness.
Flavianna is a gem, so down to earth and honest about things.
She should see a doctor about that occasional horn sound she makes :o)
I don't know what the "beep" you're talking about😂
I'm with you, when I had a ice car I almost always topped up to the limit of fuel. So you're not alone.
My ev is always full like my ice cars. Where I live it needs to be in case of emergencys
charging most EVs to 100% is bad for battery longevity
Oh god, please don't top off with an ice, you'll damage the EVAP system and tend to dump gas out. The tank needs empty space to expand.
@@MYE19 That's what makes LFP great, you can and should!
Really like watching these, but what I’m hearing from both of you is a “lack of communication” (to quote Cool Hand Luke). There was no acknowledgement that it’s different for women. Women on their own are much more vulnerable than men on their own. Andrew’s ideas about CCTVs etc (with lots of “shoulds”) are good as far as they go. But why would a single woman (especially) buy an EV and submit herself to the risk?
This was amazing, comedy gold! Loved it, keep up being you guys.
You're right to highlight this 'Elephant in the Room' about etiquette and security/vulnerability of public charging areas. Only ever seen a queue for EVs on some of Bjorn's videos in Norway. But they had space to wait. Haphazard at motorway services car parks.
I make sure I return to my car before I get to 80% if someone turns up I will move on. How about a cut off based on charging speed. Hubs need to have rapids and lots of AC. You roll up plug in to the 150kw charger and when your speed has dropped below 22kw if the site is busy it cuts off and you move to one of the AC chargers.
Your wife cracks me up,I laugh so much,it scares my little dog and then I have to reassure her that iam alright!
Your comment just makes me crack up al the more. I can visualize your dog wondering what you are doing.
+1 vote for the Flavian’s channel! :-)
Another great video. I think an issue that might be relevant is the number of people who can't charge at home - at the moment these people are, in the main, sticking with ICE or Hybrid - in short it won't always be the case that nearly everyone charges at home - possibly up to 40% will need to charge at a public charger. It would be re-assuring to know that planning is being done to accommodate those who can't charge at home.
I charge mostly at home, but I can see this being an issue for people that can't. I don't care as much about self driving cars while in the car, but it would be amazing if your car can drive itself to a public charger while you are sleeping and drive back waiting for you when you are awake if you can't charge at home.
Andrew, she is so funny. You should start a podcast with her. That Italian tone, the smirks and the trip recall. She nailed it. On other hand your calmness, composure and smoothness. Great video.
There should be a BIG sign on each charge station that reads - - Only stop here WHILE you are charging, this is NOT a parking space!
There should be anpr cameras covering charging stations linked to the charger. If it detects a vehicle in a bay and the charger is not actually dispensing a charge a fine is automatically imposed.
If that car IS plugged into the charger but no charge is being dispensed, then a fine will be levied after a set period (to allow the return of the owner subsequent to termination of charge), say, 10 minutes.
Mrs EV is being deliberately provocative (you can see when she smiles) but much of what she says is true. Assurances that it will soon all be better because lots more chargers are going in I find less convincing. Like the EV family I suspect current EV owners are more likely to have home charging and so only need to charge on long journeys and while on holiday. During the transition a higher proportion of owners without home charging will join the queues for chargers and they will need them more often. Needing to charge for a daily commute makes for extra pressure to get a charge to avoid being late for work and makes a nasty situation more likely.
I also have concerns that where there are many chargers there is no system of queuing so that customers are dealt with in order. I went to the chargers at Rugby during the summer and all the non Tesla slots were full. When others arrived there was no formal place for them to wait and it required them all to note who arrived first and behave in a civilised way. On that occasion all was fine but it would have been easy for a new arrival to not realise some cars parked in spaces opposite were waiting to charge and to drive straight into a just freed up slot.
Charging fees based on time (minutes) rather than by KwHr will encourage most people to stop charging beyond 80% because it would get very cost inefficient. The planned expansion of chargers in the next few years will not keep pace with growth in EV sales, so network capacity will remain a big limitation in the next few years, possibly even get worse before it gets better.
This one had me and wife in stitches. Love it!
Mrs EV giving her frank no bs opinion! Love it 🌟 Mrs EV you are a star ⭐️
Watched to the end - I'm hooked - a great act you have there! She's delightful and your patience is commendable.
A big issue I've found is the snobbery and "I've had my EV longer than you " attitude of some drivers, I agree that some drivers deliberately don't care about others either because they feel some self-serving entitlement to hand on to the charger for as long as they can. I've had a guy approach me asking me if I live in the village where the charger is located claiming that the charger is for the use of residents only and I've also witnessed a taxi driver harass a woman claiming he has priority as a public service and could she disconnect and let him use the charger. There is no quick answer but I think the use of rapids should be restricted to 40 mins between 7am to 9pm and auto-stop forcing drivers to move on I also think that there needs to be a mechanism where cars cannot be parked on rapids and left unattended for more than 20 mins to stop the park and leave morons.
the old Ecotricity chargers used to limit a rapid charge to 40 mins
And it's not entitled to demand someone leaves because you perceive your need to be greater than theirs?
Works both ways.
The taxi and village thing are silly though