Congratulations Zeke on saying so long to the day job. Going all in on The Lookout will ultimately benefit hundreds of thousands of people myself included. I share your content with everyone I can think of and always know I am offering folks a valuable resource. Susie is great, really enjoyed this session. The main steam media, has of course, made a SH** show, of this weeks fires and your calm, well reasoned, analysis is exactly what folks need. Big thanks.
@@Jcozz they can’t get any deeper than headlines as they don’t know shit. But rants and wild speculation and sensationalism sells. Subscribe and share this channel as much as we can
As an Aussie looking in at this horrendous situation you are doing a wonderful public service for everyone to understand all the areas that are burning and for those overseas viewers like me it also gives us a birds eye view and understanding of the layout of Los Angeles and how these fires can be so devastating because of the hills and how winds get channeled in to these suburbs
Zeke- you rock it! Thank you for your inviting your son to join alongside you..watching his facial expressions as you spoke your hearts firm truth, brought all your reactions to a fresh high...for kids see thru the crap, and even their eyes speak huge volumes of wisdom. 🗽 Susie, way to add your wisdom and creativity! I will encourage my libraries & family operated book sellers to bring in your book . Great show Zeke !
Someone in the live stream commented that "can't we just clear the vegetation so nothing would burn?" Removing vegetation completely would lead to all kinds of flash flooding problems. The chaparral slows water flow and holds soils on the slopes. When it burns and then heavy precipitation follows the flash flooding in incredibly damaging, most times far from the area the fire burned in. An example of this is the flooding in Montecito area near Santa Barbara a few years back. This was following a very large wildland fire that traveled in the tens or more miles from its origin.
@@alicemilligan2699 This is a complicated issue. Some areas where structural development has occurred are really not suited for it. You try to save homes and end up causing invasive species establishment and watershed effects. The questioning of the wisdom of building those developments has to be addressed.
People should keep in mind that the thinning, ground fuel removal followed by wide area prescribed fire management that is successful in areas with conifers (needled trees) has almost no applicability in the chaparral vegetation types. As a retired forester who has been on over 100 wildland fire assignments this is of great interest to me. I've never worked as a land manager in the chaparral vegetation type. What I heard about 30 years ago is prescribed fires don't work well, won't even carry over wide areas, in vegetation that is less than 30 years old. When the chaparral gets more than 30 years old it then burns catastrophically. So an answer of how to manage these fuels to prevent damaging fire is that there is none. I would love to hear from someone that has worked in fire management in chaparral fuel types. I certainly lack experience in such environments. I rely on what I've heard from those that have. Also, I've retired and no longer have day to day contact with those in fire management.
Yes I think Goats may be the way to go they eat everything. But I’ve heard similar about chaparral being an all or nothing type of fuel type. Kind similar to Pinyon pine juniper stands acting like a brush type and being an all or none type of fire behavior.
@@lasurfette7830 You missed what I said: "What I heard about 30 years ago is prescribed fires don't work well, won't even carry over wide areas, in vegetation that is less than 30 years old. When the chaparral gets more than 30 years old it then burns catastrophically. So an answer of how to manage these fuels to prevent damaging fire is that there is none."
@@XAlpineSuptDN I'm not sure you are correct, goats may not eat Manzanita and some other species that have very hard stems and branches. Goats are typically used for fuel break areas that consist of light brush and grass. I question the conversion of wide areas to grass and light brush when considering soil conservation and flash flooding effects. However, I will repeat, I'm not an expert in the management of the chaparral vegetation type.
One thing that Oakland and Berkeley, and many other communities, have done, is not permit the eucalyptus to grow back, and to remove them as soon as fiscally practical. Part of what sent the 1991 Oakland Hills into fast mode was the explosivity of eucalyptus, combined with the single digit humidity and strong Diablo winds.
New communities could also only allow fire resistant vegetation types. But also people need to makes sure they are cleaning out their gutters regularly and keeping burnable stuff away from their homes. Seat cushions can catch fire on a deck and catch the rest of the house on fire and once trex decks are on fire they very hard to put out. They burn great as was shown in the Flight 93 museum fire investigation.
Yes, the houses in palisades burned leaving a lot of vegetation, but it looked like it was the palm fronds and other brush/leaves spreading the embers.
The problem is also with the vegetation that people have allowed to build up in the gutters of their homes or in the valleys of roofs or the burnable stuff on their decks that catch spot fires. It’s not just the vegetation growing but I saw plenty of vegetation leading directly to people’s houses. Just like a wick to a fuse. Plus once one house is burning it’s adding to the ember wash.
Yea, it’s all the large embers blowing around ahead of the main fire front. Since many folks have gone to dry scape yards saving water and maintenance. One huge factor is using wood chips mulching around plants and homes. These dry chips are available to burn from ember cast and then smolder at ground level going unnoticed by many. I’d outlaw all dry wood products within 4’ of any structure.
@@flycaptron49 Agreed. Our new house in the lower Sierra foothills was required to have gutter guards, but then, ironically, the builder surrounded the house with bark mulch. Unclear why CalFire, who signed off the defensible space declaration required by sellers, permits bark mulch anywhere in California. We replaced it with rock and pulled anything remaining away from the house.
@@user-reg27364 yeah that’s pretty crazy. It’s just another receptive fuel to catch fire. Especially having mulch under decks or trex decks is a disaster waiting to happen. What’s the point of doing all that fuels mitigation to reduce fuels when then they allow people to surround their home in receptive fuels. The aerial spotting threat will always be there in any fuel type. People just don’t get that no matter how much water or people or aircraft you had wouldn’t have prevented this. You would have had to been sitting right where the fire started with your hose ready to squirt it out in order to stop this. And I will tell you that it’s not like there is any state red, blue whatever that had wildfires this year that didn’t burn homes too. It’s a fact of life these day with homes in the wildland urban interface and fast moving catastrophic fires.
Something we used to talk about on the hotshot crew I worked on when we’d be out on these fires was it would be great if communities were better planned so that they had paved or even graveled pathways around the outside of a community that had the vegetation cut back to provide and opportunity for first responders to A) better protect properties and B) possibly burn out from to stop the spread of the fire in that area. Pretty tough to do once you’ve built all the homes in steep country though. FIREWISE is still the best answer even though it’s not 100% effective. I’m surprised there are more CWPP’s (community wildfire protection plans) in place in SoCal.
Fascinating report -- I'm now late for work 😊 To people just tuning in, hang on for the discussion on potential future methods for managing fire. We need much more education on these ideas. Thanks for posting.
We did prescribed fire in Moraga. One key hill is now back to cattle grazing per request by the fire department, city and cattle family to address fuel mitigation. First time in over 60yrs back to cattle grazing. Another hill side getting a stock tank for water to encourage the cattle to graze farther down the ridge line again to address fuel mitigation etc. The bigger issue now is the 50-60 yr old housing with heavy improper landscaping density within the neighborhoods! Add in the craftsman wood sided style housing even shingle style houses within the neighborhoods. Very few have re sided with cement board alternatives. Which gets us to that point where the fuels are the houses not the open space fuels.
This time insurance will refuse to write a policy, which means lenders won’t lend on uninsurable collateral. Florida condos will change forever too. I think it will be different this time after the dirt lot in Pacific Palisades and Altadena is sold.
Someone in the live stream comments stated that the arrival time for the first L.A. City Fire Department fire apparatus was 2 hours after the fire was first reported. Spreading such misinformation is irresponsible. I'm working on finding out the actual times of the first report, initial dispatch and arrival of the first crews, but haven't found it yet.
The original call was received at 10:30. Units were dispatched at 10:32. A "light force" was first on scene. A Light Force is a ladder truck and engine. The Light Force captain provided a on scene size up report as of 10:48. The scanner listener I communicated with used a fire dispatch log of LAFD and his scanner logger/recorder. He believes he missed the initial on scene time of 10:44 due to other traffic in other parts of the city on different frequencies. Even considering the the latest time of 16 minutes of the dispatch time is widely different than the rumor of 2 hours. I believe the initial dispatch included more that the on Light Force. I don't have the arrival time for the additional resources.
Seek out your state fire officials and see if they have an Rx program. They would probably be able to point you in the right direction. Some states like Florida at least used to be very proactive about Rx fire. Others are not so great. Or if you live in the boonies seek out your local VFD chief. Also seek out your local Emergency Operations folks in some cases that is the county sheriff. For example in CO the local sheriff is responsible for wildfire but they usually are also involved with Rx fire.
In regards to changing the layout of a neighbourhood after a fire, it seems like a good idea until you start to understand the infrastructure under the roads and sidewalks that would have to change. You would be potentially digging up thousands of feet or sewer, storm, water, electrical, data lines that all use the space under our roads. It's actually worse than starting fresh because the old services would have to be removed. | only have the time to watch about half of the interview so I apologize if you got to my point in the second half, thank you for all your effort in the last few days.
❤️ ALL OF IT THANK YOU! YOU SPEAK SO CLEARLY! APPRECIATE YOUR PASSION FOR THE TREES! I DO MY BEST TO HUG A TREE Place your ear It sounds similar to a konch shell you can feel the tree breathe with you. I also know they communicate they admire me🥰
Why not building homes which will not immediately catch fire? Europe builds brick and concrete based homes. In USA homes are basically tinder wood boxes. At least have roofs and outside walls resist amber and fire?
In CA most homes are built Mediterranean style both due to weather temperatures, fire and the biggie earthquakes. Stone / block / brick buildings in CA get knocked down when the ground shakes. Wood structure homes don’t fall down when the ground shakes. My 1901 home built of blood red heart wood Redwood unlike anything you can get today. It has 2 inch thick exterior plaster that destroys masonry bits on the outside of the building. My 1968 home also wood construction with heavy plaster exterior and Spanish tile roof which is massively cooler during the hot summers than tar shingle roofing. The biggest issue is fuels mitigation and yes Craftsman style homes modeled after east coast style with wood siding even wood shingle siding sprinkled throughout the neighborhood. There is even 50 yr old wood shingle roofing still on homes in my neighborhood. Those homes are not insurable but also pose serious risk to the entire neighborhood.
How hot are these fires burning to turn everything into white ash? Porcelain toilets incinerate at temperatures over 4,000 degrees! (Reference Alpha Vedic). What is going on?
Plus if you have needles and dead leaves built up in your gutters or so many people have trex decks which burn really readily. A big one though is that embers fall in the gutters and catch leaves on fire in the gutter and then catch the wood between the gutter and the house on fire and. then it just builds from there.
Thanks for responses. Pretty sure insurances will require certain fire preventing measures going forward to even offer insurance. Not trimming down the brush in these wind prone dry areas… everyone know it’s just question of time. Many more people could have died. Insurances in future pay for maintaining brush and forests around neighborhoods as cities have no money? (The prop tax gets spent on other projects)
@ I had to use their stuff for a mapping class I just took in my grad school. I was curious, I see you use Google earth pro or something, what softwares do you personally suggest for mapping?
Congratulations Zeke on saying so long to the day job. Going all in on The Lookout will ultimately benefit hundreds of thousands of people myself included. I share your content with everyone I can think of and always know I am offering folks a valuable resource. Susie is great, really enjoyed this session. The main steam media, has of course, made a SH** show, of this weeks fires and your calm, well reasoned, analysis is exactly what folks need. Big thanks.
@@Jcozz they can’t get any deeper than headlines as they don’t know shit. But rants and wild speculation and sensationalism sells. Subscribe and share this channel as much as we can
As an Aussie looking in at this horrendous situation you are doing a wonderful public service for everyone to understand all the areas that are burning and for those overseas viewers like me it also gives us a birds eye view and understanding of the layout of Los Angeles and how these fires can be so devastating because of the hills and how winds get channeled in to these suburbs
Zeke- you rock it! Thank you for your inviting your son to join alongside you..watching his facial expressions as you spoke your hearts firm truth, brought all your reactions to a fresh high...for kids see thru the crap, and even their eyes speak huge volumes of wisdom. 🗽 Susie, way to add your wisdom and creativity! I will encourage my libraries & family operated book sellers to bring in your book . Great show Zeke !
Thanks for providing a great service to people. It's difficult to get accurate and non-hysterical info these days.
We appreciate you man! Thank you for all you do.
Thank you for providing this forum. Keep up the great work.
Thanks!
Excellent coverage and discussion. Thanks.
I’m sorry people are trolling you, you are so cool
We just appreciate you ,thank you for being there for us
Someone in the live stream commented that "can't we just clear the vegetation so nothing would burn?" Removing vegetation completely would lead to all kinds of flash flooding problems. The chaparral slows water flow and holds soils on the slopes. When it burns and then heavy precipitation follows the flash flooding in incredibly damaging, most times far from the area the fire burned in. An example of this is the flooding in Montecito area near Santa Barbara a few years back. This was following a very large wildland fire that traveled in the tens or more miles from its origin.
You can't remove native vegetation without increasing the probability of invasive species, that might be more flammable, becoming established.
This has happened in Malibu also.
I think they meant the dead stuff
@@alicemilligan2699 This is a complicated issue. Some areas where structural development has occurred are really not suited for it. You try to save homes and end up causing invasive species establishment and watershed effects. The questioning of the wisdom of building those developments has to be addressed.
Maybe the LA Fire Department, mayor and Governor should listen to your channel?
People should keep in mind that the thinning, ground fuel removal followed by wide area prescribed fire management that is successful in areas with conifers (needled trees) has almost no applicability in the chaparral vegetation types. As a retired forester who has been on over 100 wildland fire assignments this is of great interest to me. I've never worked as a land manager in the chaparral vegetation type. What I heard about 30 years ago is prescribed fires don't work well, won't even carry over wide areas, in vegetation that is less than 30 years old. When the chaparral gets more than 30 years old it then burns catastrophically. So an answer of how to manage these fuels to prevent damaging fire is that there is none.
I would love to hear from someone that has worked in fire management in chaparral fuel types. I certainly lack experience in such environments. I rely on what I've heard from those that have. Also, I've retired and no longer have day to day contact with those in fire management.
Goats, my boy.
Yes I think Goats may be the way to go they eat everything. But I’ve heard similar about chaparral being an all or nothing type of fuel type. Kind similar to Pinyon pine juniper stands acting like a brush type and being an all or none type of fire behavior.
Planned and controlled burns then?
@@lasurfette7830 You missed what I said: "What I heard about 30 years ago is prescribed fires don't work well, won't even carry over wide areas, in vegetation that is less than 30 years old. When the chaparral gets more than 30 years old it then burns catastrophically. So an answer of how to manage these fuels to prevent damaging fire is that there is none."
@@XAlpineSuptDN I'm not sure you are correct, goats may not eat Manzanita and some other species that have very hard stems and branches. Goats are typically used for fuel break areas that consist of light brush and grass. I question the conversion of wide areas to grass and light brush when considering soil conservation and flash flooding effects. However, I will repeat, I'm not an expert in the management of the chaparral vegetation type.
Appreciate you both.
One thing that Oakland and Berkeley, and many other communities, have done, is not permit the eucalyptus to grow back, and to remove them as soon as fiscally practical. Part of what sent the 1991 Oakland Hills into fast mode was the explosivity of eucalyptus, combined with the single digit humidity and strong Diablo winds.
New communities could also only allow fire resistant vegetation types. But also people need to makes sure they are cleaning out their gutters regularly and keeping burnable stuff away from their homes. Seat cushions can catch fire on a deck and catch the rest of the house on fire and once trex decks are on fire they very hard to put out. They burn great as was shown in the Flight 93 museum fire investigation.
Great Guest, it is great to hear her perspectives on various aspects of this issue.
Yes, the houses in palisades burned leaving a lot of vegetation, but it looked like it was the palm fronds and other brush/leaves spreading the embers.
The problem is also with the vegetation that people have allowed to build up in the gutters of their homes or in the valleys of roofs or the burnable stuff on their decks that catch spot fires. It’s not just the vegetation growing but I saw plenty of vegetation leading directly to people’s houses. Just like a wick to a fuse. Plus once one house is burning it’s adding to the ember wash.
Yea, it’s all the large embers blowing around ahead of the main fire front. Since many folks have gone to dry scape yards saving water and maintenance. One huge factor is using wood chips mulching around plants and homes. These dry chips are available to burn from ember cast and then smolder at ground level going unnoticed by many. I’d outlaw all dry wood products within 4’ of any structure.
@@flycaptron49 Agreed. Our new house in the lower Sierra foothills was required to have gutter guards, but then, ironically, the builder surrounded the house with bark mulch. Unclear why CalFire, who signed off the defensible space declaration required by sellers, permits bark mulch anywhere in California. We replaced it with rock and pulled anything remaining away from the house.
@@user-reg27364 yeah that’s pretty crazy. It’s just another receptive fuel to catch fire. Especially having mulch under decks or trex decks is a disaster waiting to happen. What’s the point of doing all that fuels mitigation to reduce fuels when then they allow people to surround their home in receptive fuels. The aerial spotting threat will always be there in any fuel type. People just don’t get that no matter how much water or people or aircraft you had wouldn’t have prevented this. You would have had to been sitting right where the fire started with your hose ready to squirt it out in order to stop this. And I will tell you that it’s not like there is any state red, blue whatever that had wildfires this year that didn’t burn homes too. It’s a fact of life these day with homes in the wildland urban interface and fast moving catastrophic fires.
I am happy to have found your broadcast. The content and tone are appreciated. Sanity.
Zeke is top notch people both in his experience and his ideas.
Something we used to talk about on the hotshot crew I worked on when we’d be out on these fires was it would be great if communities were better planned so that they had paved or even graveled pathways around the outside of a community that had the vegetation cut back to provide and opportunity for first responders to A) better protect properties and B) possibly burn out from to stop the spread of the fire in that area. Pretty tough to do once you’ve built all the homes in steep country though. FIREWISE is still the best answer even though it’s not 100% effective. I’m surprised there are more CWPP’s (community wildfire protection plans) in place in SoCal.
Fascinating report -- I'm now late for work 😊 To people just tuning in, hang on for the discussion on potential future methods for managing fire. We need much more education on these ideas. Thanks for posting.
Could you please, PLEASE, give us a detailed look at Altadena? The media only films the Palisades.
Have been enjoying your reports
Thank you
Well those were some cool sound effects! 😳😎😉
When will Suzie's video about the insurance backlash from the Palisades and Eaton fires be posted?
Fantastic work. Thank you.
I really appreciate your channel and your expertise.
🪔Love your coverage; you bring it all from a different angle..Tku for mapping and showing us whats what...
Cool start ! I'll subscribe just for your humanity.
thank you for your work !👍
Thank you for your profession and knowledge. I was worried about the fire could wipe out all Pasadena, too. Great detailed explanation.
With the wind blowing South and the fire crews on the north side it seems Palos Verdes is next.
Really glad to find your channel. Thank you. New sub. Definitely going to check out Susie Cagle.
Really great video
We did prescribed fire in Moraga. One key hill is now back to cattle grazing per request by the fire department, city and cattle family to address fuel mitigation. First time in over 60yrs back to cattle grazing. Another hill side getting a stock tank for water to encourage the cattle to graze farther down the ridge line again to address fuel mitigation etc.
The bigger issue now is the 50-60 yr old housing with heavy improper landscaping density within the neighborhoods! Add in the craftsman wood sided style housing even shingle style houses within the neighborhoods. Very few have re sided with cement board alternatives. Which gets us to that point where the fuels are the houses not the open space fuels.
Great coverage. Thank you The science says that glass melts over 2,700 degrees. Why is this fire burning so hot?
This time insurance will refuse to write a policy, which means lenders won’t lend on uninsurable collateral. Florida condos will change forever too. I think it will be different this time after the dirt lot in Pacific Palisades and Altadena is sold.
Would be nice if you told us the sites youre using and tje links youre sccessing.
Someone in the live stream comments stated that the arrival time for the first L.A. City Fire Department fire apparatus was 2 hours after the fire was first reported. Spreading such misinformation is irresponsible. I'm working on finding out the actual times of the first report, initial dispatch and arrival of the first crews, but haven't found it yet.
The original call was received at 10:30. Units were dispatched at 10:32. A "light force" was first on scene. A Light Force is a ladder truck and engine. The Light Force captain provided a on scene size up report as of 10:48. The scanner listener I communicated with used a fire dispatch log of LAFD and his scanner logger/recorder. He believes he missed the initial on scene time of 10:44 due to other traffic in other parts of the city on different frequencies. Even considering the the latest time of 16 minutes of the dispatch time is widely different than the rumor of 2 hours. I believe the initial dispatch included more that the on Light Force. I don't have the arrival time for the additional resources.
How do I volunteer to help with these prescribed burns in my state?
Seek out your state fire officials and see if they have an Rx program. They would probably be able to point you in the right direction. Some states like Florida at least used to be very proactive about Rx fire. Others are not so great. Or if you live in the boonies seek out your local VFD chief. Also seek out your local Emergency Operations folks in some cases that is the county sheriff. For example in CO the local sheriff is responsible for wildfire but they usually are also involved with Rx fire.
In regards to changing the layout of a neighbourhood after a fire, it seems like a good idea until you start to understand the infrastructure under the roads and sidewalks that would have to change. You would be potentially digging up thousands of feet or sewer, storm, water, electrical, data lines that all use the space under our roads. It's actually worse than starting fresh because the old services would have to be removed.
| only have the time to watch about half of the interview so I apologize if you got to my point in the second half, thank you for all your effort in the last few days.
❤️ ALL OF IT
THANK YOU!
YOU SPEAK SO CLEARLY!
APPRECIATE YOUR PASSION FOR THE TREES!
I DO MY BEST TO HUG A TREE
Place your ear
It sounds similar to a konch shell you can feel the tree breathe with you.
I also know they communicate they admire me🥰
Maybe these areas shouldn't be rebuilt.
Literally living in a wildfire zone.
Idk. People act like it's ohio .
Why not building homes which will not immediately catch fire? Europe builds brick and concrete based homes. In USA homes are basically tinder wood boxes. At least have roofs and outside walls resist amber and fire?
The ductile nature wood framing is needed in California because masonry houses crack collapse on people in earthquakes.
In CA most homes are built Mediterranean style both due to weather temperatures, fire and the biggie earthquakes. Stone / block / brick buildings in CA get knocked down when the ground shakes. Wood structure homes don’t fall down when the ground shakes.
My 1901 home built of blood red heart wood Redwood unlike anything you can get today. It has 2 inch thick exterior plaster that destroys masonry bits on the outside of the building.
My 1968 home also wood construction with heavy plaster exterior and Spanish tile roof which is massively cooler during the hot summers than tar shingle roofing.
The biggest issue is fuels mitigation and yes Craftsman style homes modeled after east coast style with wood siding even wood shingle siding sprinkled throughout the neighborhood. There is even 50 yr old wood shingle roofing still on homes in my neighborhood. Those homes are not insurable but also pose serious risk to the entire neighborhood.
How hot are these fires burning to turn everything into white ash? Porcelain toilets incinerate at temperatures over 4,000 degrees! (Reference Alpha Vedic). What is going on?
Plus if you have needles and dead leaves built up in your gutters or so many people have trex decks which burn really readily. A big one though is that embers fall in the gutters and catch leaves on fire in the gutter and then catch the wood between the gutter and the house on fire and. then it just builds from there.
Thanks for responses. Pretty sure insurances will require certain fire preventing measures going forward to even offer insurance. Not trimming down the brush in these wind prone dry areas… everyone know it’s just question of time. Many more people could have died. Insurances in future pay for maintaining brush and forests around neighborhoods as cities have no money? (The prop tax gets spent on other projects)
More competance in that carbordbox then in the full administration, thanks!
What’s your beef with esri?
@@KingBeach-c6l 30 years of bug-riddled software and $xxx,xxx dollars spent paying to use it. #fuc
@ I had to use their stuff for a mapping class I just took in my grad school. I was curious, I see you use Google earth pro or something, what softwares do you personally suggest for mapping?
@ QGIS, Photoshop, CalTopo, Avenza Maps,
👍
😂
Can you take the local voter maps and do an over lay on loss of voters?
Thanks!
Thanks!