Firewatch felt like a story someone would tell you if you hung around with them long enough. It wasn’t a happy ending, sad, or anything. Just An Ending. It was the end of a job, end of a relationship with someone, end of the summer.
Bro that was way deeper than the game trying to tell it though the game was amazing I never played it never had the money to but I did see a bunch of vids from different UA-camrs and this game is amazing
This video made me realise that the whole game was isolating. That you never got to interact in person with any character. Whether it was Delilah, seeing the teens have fun, the veteran. It’s like you’re the one that has to navigate through the grief, and no one is there to help you through it. It’s you and you alone to save yourself
Up until the very end, when the rescue team come to you, the first time you touch another person for months, they are helping you into a helicopter to leave. I loved the ending.
@@CreedyXIX yeah I understand the ending, story wise at least. Though for a game about making choices some of em are limited and needed more fleshing out, maybe we could see what Henry did after he was picked up. I feel that would have complimented the ending rather than just cutting to the title screen. And in my time playing the game I wish there was more interactions with not only Delilah but also with the environment, adding more to the games narrative, rather than handicapping it.
Also it would have been nice for you to be able to see Delilah in her watchtower through a pair of binoculars or something only seeing a silhouette of her trough the watchtower or something (if they animated the veteran walking around, surely they sure could do the same with Delilah)
I used to think Firewatch had a bad ending, not meeting Delilah after all that seemed kind of frustrating. But after all these years, the ending makes more sense. Henry was trying to find a escape. With Delilah, he found that. But both of them were just running away. You can’t always run away from your problems. Someday you’ll have to face them. It’s a powerful ending no matter how off-putting it felt.
The problem I have with the ending is it felt like they kept building up, with a conclusion that just seemed muddled and confusing, and didn’t make sense. Like, how did Goodwin set everything up? Where did he get all of the equipment? Isn’t he just a hermit living out in the woods? The ending imo felt kind of cheap. I get the message and what it was going for, but it would of been better if it actually should Henry going back and facing his problems
Personally I find it a bad ending. Not trying to bash it or riding the hate train as people say it but I just personally find it a that way. The game promised a good story, which could mean anything really. It's like being being promised a drink, agreeing to have it only to get a cabbage smoothie. The thing is, I don't like it, simple as that. I hate it, it's bitter and whatever. Now that they're telling me it's good and it's supposed to taste like that. Yeah well, still doesn't change that I don't like the taste. It may be designed to taste like that, still I don't like it. That's all there is to it. Another one that I could compare it to other than food is Cuckholding. I don't like it, but some do and it's designed that way. And yet again, still. I don't like it.
Firewatch had a relevent end for me. I had a long term girlfriend at the time and we had played thru 90% of the game. When i finished it alone later and Delilah wasnt there, it felt exactly how it should have.
I had a similar experience with the original Life is Strange, I played it with my first real girlfriend and we were both in tears at the end. We ended up breaking up a few months later and I found myself drawn back to the game and the ending was much more emotional for me. The thought that if I could just go back and have another try I could fix everything was stuck in my head after the break up and the game genuinely helped me put that to bed. Sometime things just aren't meant to be and trying to fight that fact will only make things worse.
The ending of fire watch is like graduating college. You completed your goals and you move on with your life. Its probably the last time you see or hear from people you've grown to know well. You dont get some happy ending of "we will definitely keep in touch after this is over".
I loved that Firewatch was happy to be such a specific, emotional experience. Having Delilah run from the responsibility and pressure of meeting you in person mirrors your own running away from your wife's problems. The reality you didn't want to or weren't able to face. The emptiness at the end of the game hit like a hammer and I wish there were more that took those swings.
The irony about Firewatch is you can go through the game and try to stay "faithful" to Julia and the narrative sort of falls apart. The game really expects you to bond with Delilah.
I dunno, to me it just felt like an excuse for the dev to not create a model for a woman or even just draw her for an ending still picture. The way the teens are textureless girl models from really far away and Julia's face was hidden in the picture by the camera it just seemed like the dev didn't know how2girl.
When I played Firewatch, the ending actually affected me. Because I didn't get to meet her or see her, That stayed with me, because I as the player, really felt something for these characters. I went to bed, and my dreams did the rest. I dreamed that as I was escaping the Fire, I saw her there, at the end, as I reached her tower, she was there at the base of it... With the dream, Firewatch was on my mind for a solid week, before I finally let it go. It was such an emotional ride, that I'll never forget. Recently I tried replaying the game, but after about the midway point, I gave up. There was nothing left... It was like walking through a grave yard. Speaking with her again, felt empty.... Definitely the strangest experience I've had with a game.
I agree. It’s very weird. Played and finished it day one in 2016, never could finish it again. It affected me profoundly the first time round and it’s still an amazing game but yes, the spark was lost for me after finishing it. Which I guess is the point, eh?
To me. When Henry got to her tower and found that she had left. He decided to sit down, and remain there. Allowing the flames to consume him. His depression and guilt never left him. and when finding the tower empty, his mind crashed as he thought he had lost his mind, and only had imagined Delilah's existence ower the months he had spent there. Dark, but better than the ending we were given by the devs.
Man, I loved this game so much. Being able to navigate around the Forrest and solving a mystery. The conversation. The sadness. It wasn’t a bad ending. This game made me rethink the types of games I really enjoy. If it wasn’t for What Remains of Edith Finch, I would have never have found this game. Both are just fantastic.
Kind of random, but your post reminded me that I almost never finish games, and yet I've finished both of those and The vanishing of Ethan Carter. Maybe I need to rethink what I like as well.
I watched a playthrough and I genuinely don’t understand why so many other people hated this game? I didn’t find the ending “disappointing” or “bad” at all. I thought the story was fantastic. Not all stories have to have a happy ending.
stop praising such a garbage ending I fucking gate it when something is so hyped so built upon to be nothing all I felt from the ending is disappointment that it was nothing then sadness as I realised that no such thing can happen in reality then anger and dissatisfaction as I knew I had been tricked by the game into playing it to the end expecting something only to be hit with nothing this real life based formula is THE WORST FUCKING ENDING TO A GAME I HAVE EVER PLAYED
I think that part of the point of this video is that it's *not* a bad ending. It's unsatisfying, but in a very intentional way that carries a message about life, pain, and grief. Personally, I kind of like games like that. "The Last of Us Part II" falls into that same category of games that I've enjoyed because they weren't afraid to address the darker, more absurd parts of the human condition.
“There was nothing on that mountain that mountain that could possibly satisfy the hole left inside of him, no answer to his suffering.” There actually is something up there that can heal Henry’s pain. There’s an alternate ending, and all you have to do is… well, it’s the title of the game. Just watch the fire instead of getting on the helicopter. I personally find this a lot more satisfying of an ending, imagining the pilot radioing this back in, that you refused to board, imagining this information being relayed to Delilah, imagining Henry becoming another ghost of the mountain. It’s really the last and only decision you can make that gives Henry some agency.
I actually really liked the ending to Firewatch. It feels so real, that a man wrapped in guilt, trying to escape a life he can’t cope with would want to get swept up in some grand mystery in the middle of nowhere. The fact that it turned out to be nothing, and the main “villain” being a man just like Hank was really impactful. Even not being able to see Delilah at the end made sense realistically
I feel like this video really accentuates the difference between an unsatisfying ending and a bad one. Bad endings leave you with a bitter taste in your mouth, like your time would've been better spend doing basically *anything else* than playing this game. Often, they don't make sense or are just... lazy. Uplifting or depressing, regardless they just feel *wrong.* Unsatisfying endings, like that in Firewatch, are well-crafted and grounded in the reality of the game. While they don't wrap everything up with a bow and feel-good emotions, they still feel good. Fitting. Rewarding, in a strange way, despite not being what you might've wanted.
I think "fitting" is the right word. When it's done right, you look back and realize that it was really never going to end any other way, it just wouldn't make sense to.
@@realpunkfruit I personally disagree; to me Firewatch's ending isn't bad, just not what I wanted as someone who enjoys feel-good happy endings. But you do you, we're all entitled to our opinions :]
Firewatch's ending and story has stayed with me for so long precisely because of its "anticlimactic" finale. As you said, the vet staying in the woods mirrors Henry's desire to escape from the tragedy of his real life. The idea that the government is spying on 2 random people is easier for him to deal with then his wife's Dimentia is heart breaking and feels very real. Great Essay! Happy youtube recommended you. Subscribed.
The ending to Borderlands is much better than I remember. You were one of the first to make it to the core of the compound around the vault. Eons before that ancient race was so advanced that none would ever break their security. Until now. And that security wasn't to protect a weapon. It was to protect the universe FROM a weapon. The destroyer was almost ethereal. A being from a higher dimension that thinks only of consumption, and gains the attributes of all it consumes. But by accident the ancient Eridians made exactly what was needed to kill it. It was forced to be in our dimension, and play by it's rules to feed. It was mortal. It's just sad the explanation that made it better was in future games.
Having played none of them the creature being locked in the vault seemed like the obvious takeaway from his description. Another one of those misinterpreted legends over time stories.
Tbh the First time ive beaten Bl1 i really liked the end. It was one of the first shooters I have played and i already loved the whole game. Finding out about the aliens and a hard Endboss which is a real Challenge with loot to obtain was perfect for me. Only later i changed my opinion after i was left hungry for more Infos about the aliens and everything and the dissapointment set in.
But the combat with the vault monster is extremely lame, the narrative the whole game has been pretty weak anyways so by the time you get to the vault it's like "That's it?". It's a lame ending no matter how you try to look at it. Also you don't even get to fight the enemy Siren or even see her powers.
Although Firewatch isn't perfect by any means, I'd still rather live in a world with Firewatch than one without. It's a fun romp of a game that many can relate to and it makes you think which is more than most games can say.
I was in my mid twenties when firewatch came out. I remember playing it at or around release and just really feeling disappointment with the ending. I look back at it now, seven years later, and it's kind of crazy how much more I appreciate it. When I was younger, I wanted to believe everything I had been through in my life, all my personal suffering, meant something. Firewatch begs the question that some things just... happen. There is no greater purpose or reason or meaning. Life just occurs sometimes. And you can rage and fight, putting together every combination of the pieces to try and form a coherent whole or you can just accept it, take your licks and move forwards with your life.
About three minutes in, but I wanted to give praise to the nonlinear structure of your videos. I don't yet know where you're going with the Firewatch thread, but I can't wait to find out.
Hey, was in a cursed image Discord with you 3-4 years ago and used to watch you evaluate on Reddit. It's really impressive seeing how you've grown here. I'm proud of you, keep it up.
I'm actually somewhat relieved to hear that there wasn't a "good ending" I missed out on in Firewatch. I thought I had somehow caused the "bad ending" with my dialogue choices. (SPOILERS) I was even pretty sure it was because of that time when we hear her talking to someone else over a hot mic. I figured it was only bait to sound like she was talking about me and I didn't care even if she was, anyway. My final interpretation of the situation was that she was probably just radioing another tower somewhere and talking about someone else. With that in mind, I chose to ask who she was talking to. My thinking was that she was about to tell me about another colleague I hadn't met, which would have been interesting. I was just trying to make friendly conversation; I didn't mean it in a jealous or prying way at all, but she reacted pretty negatively and there was no way to backpedal or explain myself. I was always worried that that was why she decided not to wait and say goodbye in person, so it's nice to hear that she wouldn't have come no matter what.
Firewatch is still one of my favorite games despite its ending. It made me feel like I was truly understood during a time of serious loneliness and inner turmoil in my life.
It's preference. I insulted you just because the other commentator was talking about how this game helped him though a though time and you had the urge to make a stupid joke. Bet i also enjoy nice gameplay that makes my goblin brain happy but sometimes having a serious and mature story i nice
@@madmonty4761 Eh, both are important depending on the goals of the game. Sometimes, story is the only focus, and it can pay off. And other games just say fuck a story here's our game, just play it. And the mechanics are strong enough that the game is amazing without a narrative. And some are a perfect blend of both like The Outer Wilds imo.
After watching this I realize how much I can relate to the characters of fire watch. It’s weirdly comforting to know that something out there can describe my actions so accurately. From being lost and lonely to escaping into the wilderness and distracting myself and finally coming home and realizing that all the things I left behind are still waiting there for me. The only thing that really kept moving was time.
One of the things I found fascinating about Firewatch is Ned & Brian's story is actually spaced in the drops and there are enough clues that you can put together what happened before going into the cave. While I do wish that the mystery sub-plot had a better ending, Henry and Delilah's story HAD to end that way. (Though the secret end where Henry lets the fire consume him is a valid option as an ending with the mental state he is in.) He's still married to his wife and very clearly loves her, he just doesn't know what to do when it comes to her care. Yes, things can get flirty if you let it, but if you only have one person to talk to for almost 3 months, you are going to be close. Henry is a man running from his problems, from his grief. Until he processes that, Delilah made the right choice to stay away. That is what makes Firewatch such an amazing game.
What I loved about this game is how it took the idea of escapism, both from Henry’s personal life and the player simply playing a game to escape reality for a bit, and gave you the brutal reminder that yes… you are going to have to address it again soon. Thanks for the great video.
The way you space out this video with multiple games with bad endings but also a core focus game that you return to is really different and unique. Honestly awesome!
I found it really annoying tbh- xD The cuts are so abrupt and it just leaves me wishing that the Firewatch story was more focused into a single portion. I can't even finish this video because it's so dissonant.
I saw a good few comments on other videos on Firewatch's ending, how it was unsatisfying but realistic. Not everything in life ends with climatically, with a dramatic ending that wraps your experience up with a nice ribbon. Sometimes, life just moves on, and you have to accept that.
The ending of Firewatch was great, it was a perfect conclusion for the narrative leading up to it and I never understood why people called it disappointing or lackluster. Okay, I do get why people might feel that way, but those people really missed the entire point of the game. The ending is not a subversion for its own sake, the narrative and themes did lead up to it. You have to really not pay attention to the game to come to the conclusion that the ending was disappointing.
That's kind of why I loved it as well. There are few games that address what would really happen to the characters in reality. Don't get me wrong, games like GTA, or Fallout, where you win the day, and everything kind of ends great for you are fun, but downer, more realistic endings are something I enjoy as well. No matter what happened here, Henry wasn't going to discover a cure for dementia, or a fix-all for his life back home. Another game that does this is the first State Of Decay. The entire game builds up the idea of getting back to the regular world, and that because Trumbull Valley is an enclosed box canyon, you just need to escape quarantine, and then you can get help, only to realize that immediately beyond the quarantine zone, and possibly even the world, has already been overrun by the infection, and help isn't on its way, or even close by. The original Red Dead, Halo:Reach, and the Mass Effect trilogy also had these types of endings, where no matter what you do, sometimes you don't get to save the day, or even just live to see the day saved by someone else, and enjoy the fruits of your labor. It's depressing as hell, but also realistic.
NOT EVERYTHING IS ABOUT REAL LIFE GAMES ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE REAL IT FUCKING SUCKS WHEN A GAME TRIES TO BE REAL BECAUSE NOTHING HAPPENS IN REAL LIFE THATS WHY THE ENDING SUCKS *NOBODY GIVES A FLYING FUCK ABOUT REAL LIFE BASED GAMES AND ESPECIALLY ENDINGS*
It has a wonderful, perfect ending for the themes it is discussing and portraying. It couldn't have ended any better way, in my opinion. You never have a game that really portrays loss and human fragility.
@@I-like-cows No, that's the point you're seeking in video games. I could say the same of any art. Oh why isn't this music happy, this movie have a happy ending or this painting brightly colored and cheerful? Because art can have different purposes and impart different feelings. They're not confined to one specific "They're supposed to" from any one person. That's art.
@@Ian-mv7yu whats the purpose of shit that exists for the sole purpose to be sad and unsatisfying other than for people to make video essays analyzing the "genius" of it
@@baseddepartment6675 well you just answered your own question lmao. on a more serious note, art does not need a purpose to exist. at its core, art is simply an outlet for human expression and emotion. any artistic creation doesn’t really need any deeper point to its existence other than the creator wanting to make it. some people might have or find deeper meanings, but it’s not a prerequisite to making or enjoying art in any medium.
@@baseddepartment6675art that is sad has a purpose of introspection. Being cursed with sentience means we analyze our own feelings. Games like this help with it. People carry trauma and art exposure can help heal that as well. I know I deal with my parents divorce through games like dishonored. A broken family that still holds it together and takes on a dark cruel world because of their love for one another is the main point of the first game. It’s just what you can take out of a game that helps sometimes. Even if it’s sad.
Sir you have exploded onto my UA-cam recommendations and have absolutely blown everything I usually watch out of the water. Fantastic stuff dude, I can’t wait to see what you get up to next. 🎉
For anyone looking to play Firewatch after watching this video, PLEASE turn off your marker on the map. I did this and finding the way around the park was so much more fun and immersive. Trust me, you won't regret it.
I'd say so. It's very relaxing and therapeutic to play, plus you can pick new dialogue options that might change things, albeit minuscule things. Price is a bit steep for some so, personally, I'd wait for it to go on sale before buying.
@ccaagg, one of my exact problems with Metro Exodus, great game don’t get me wrong, but I felt WAY too safe. I always knew where I was and I didn’t like that.
@@ccaagg You shouldn't be wishing for lack of them but a toggle, everyone can win. Some people do just suck at reading maps and can't learn it, that is life. Trying to force people when both sides can win is just rude. Let everyone win.
The graphics, the story, the soundtrack. Fire watch is just amazing. It’s the only game I’ve played where you can feel so fufilled playing, then so empty after finishing.
This Chanel is beautiful and amazingly polished. I am watching this straight from seeing the games. You can’t play any more video and it was amazing. Your video essays are amazing man. tons of love.
This video brought me to tears, I lost my father 10 years ago and so grief is a very familiar concept to me. The way you covered the story of Firewatch and the themes of grief really did move me, thank you for sharing your amazing content with the world.
@@ThaROG-cu7mb Thank you. I sometimes feel his presence around, as if I can imagine what he would say to me in a particular moment. I appreciate the fact that you took the time to send your condolences in the first place 💜
@@Beanie-Babe i see his reply is deleted or something, so just to take his place. I will say I am sorry for your loss. i lost my mom and dad when i was 6 and i really feel you. but, life moves on and talking about it makes it worse when its been multiple years so FRICK IT IMMA GO BOWLING.
Your segment about the cod ending really resonated with me. There's this otome called even if: TEMPEST, where the main character suffers so much pain and agony at the hands of her family and continues to suffer throughout the story, sometimes still because of them even after escaping their grasp. At the ending of the game, the player is presented with much the same choice, and again the revenge option is the wrong one. Only there is no consequence to taking your revenge within canon, and the abusers face no consequences if you choose not to kill them. One of the *main themes* of the game is that the main character is desperately seeking power to be able to fight back against these people, and once you have it, you're not allowed to use it without the game breaking the plot to force a bad ending. It feels horribly unjust and unsatisfying, because even if the moral is the good ol' "the best revenge is letting go and living well", you are actively letting a criminal get away with their crimes and have lost your main motive for even getting this far. Edit: Oh, and there is *genuinely* no satisfaction to be had in the revenge-taking. Your abuser is portrayed as this cocky, untouchable person even in their last moments. Edit 2: Thinking back on it, all I truly know is that the revenge ending ends up in execution, and the non-revenge ending might have had them imprisoned (which would be fine by me), but if the game doesn't mention it I'm not making it up for them.
So basically you get screwed every which way. It... doesn't sound like a satisfying experience to me. I know other people have other standards, but it feels like the writer was... just incompetent.
Firewatch's ending elevates it from media product to Art. Disappointment, longing, and regret are all valid emotions for art to evoke.
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You're absolutely right. The ending of firewatch felt so bad in the moment, but it made the game even more memorable. The more I think about it, the better I think it was. It hits you right in the feels, but not in the sense we're used to. If I recall correctly Gone Home did something similar and was the game that originally led me to play Firewatch. It's also just a gorgeous game with great voice acting.
I cried during Ned’s monologue when I played the game. Not just because of that but the culmination of everything. The soundtrack is definitely part of it, it’s so expertly crafted and perfectly tells you how you should feel at any point in the story. It’s one of the few games that made me forget I was playing a video game.
I've never played or watched anything about firewatch, but this somehow still kinda made me tear up. That says something about firewatch, but also very much about your story telling. Very well done, thanks for making this video
It is worth watching a playthrough or playing it yourself. The dialog is really good and it's worth experiencing the growth of the relationship between both characters.
LMAO, you just brought back a hilarious memory of me and a friend rushing through Borderlands 3, fighting over loot and just laughing, talking shit about borderland 1's ending, only to go on to loot the post-game Vault and find literally exclusively white tiered loot
A Plague Tale: Requiem had the most depressing yet peaceful ending I've seen in a game yet. I've never cried at an ending, but god, that ending fucked me up for days. I felt like I was genuinely mourning a loved one, it was that bad.
This really is art, I just went through a situation where someone close to me acted out in terrible ways towards me and others. it turned out to be because of grief they felt rather than malice and also an end that is not exactly a happy one but one that has clarity to what happened
You should have known Ghosts 'n' Goblins was out to troll you when the "two hits and your done" game handed you a shield and all you could do was throw it at things. Also, props for featuring a bit of Gungrave footage! That game had such a unique balance of arcade gameplay and compelling narrative.
On my first playthrough I never notice how intentional it was for the veteran to mention your wife in his very last line. There's a good chance that the character and maybe even the player has completely forgotten about her until the last day, when you have to return to her.
Dude you’re one of my fav essayists on UA-cam. You’re so creative not only in the topics you cover, but how you present them and the emotion you can invoke. I love how you broke up Firewatch’s story with the stories of other games all culminating in a satisfying ending. As contrary as that is to the topic of the video lol
A small thing I noticed: I like how you can view the Chapters in any order you want. Only the Firewatch ones are connected in some way. The rest can be viewed out of order. I've never seen a video like this before. It's a nice refresher from the videos where you're forced to see Chapters in a certain order or else you'll get confused as to what happens in it. Here though? It's a small-scale video about disappointing endings. Just that. There doesn't need to be a grand narrative that ties everything together or hidden codes or messages that leads to something else. This is a simple video made for people like me that just want to sit back and relax without worrying about everything. I think that's pretty cool.
I get what you overall meant with this comment, but I can't wrap around my head about you "relaxing without worrying about everything", on a video about unsatisfying game endings that keeps reminding you of real life troubles, I want to be this level headed
I'm so glad the video took the course it took. The expectation setting was great and I agree with your end point. That's what grief is. I too, always wondered why people were compelled to make that type of story/ending. After experiencing my first big grief in life 1 year ago, I began to notice how much of media I love is filled with grief. Or, actually, how much of the world is surrounded by it. Built upon it. Thanks for this video.
Someone pointed out that given some context clues Delilah was bored and was using the veteran guy to mess with Henry but it went completely ass backwards when they discovered the dudes deceased child at the bottom of the cave and Delilah panicked and that’s why she left you at the end because she was too guilty and felt responsible for both the death of a child and the manipulation of Henry and she felt like she couldn’t face him and left meanwhile the veteran still not wanting to face the loss of his kid or society just retreated deeper into the park either dying in the fire or finding a new hiding spot
Damn, I haven't played Firewatch but the story gave me hardcore What Remains of Edith Finch vibes. Highly, HIGHLY recommend for anyone who enjoyed Firewatch!
Thank you for this. I played Firewatch when it first came out - which feels like a lifetime ago but was apparently as recent as 2016 - and my abiding memory of it has always been how bitterly disappointing I found the ending. After loving the game so much and finding it so refreshing and engaging, the ending left such a bad taste that it kind of ruined the entire game for me retroactively and killed off any desire I may have had to revisit it, and consequently I haven't really thought about the game since. Your video has not only reminded me of what I loved about it and allowed me to relive a story I otherwise wouldn't have, but also did such a good job of explaining and contextualising the ending that I now feel a little silly for responding to it as negatively as I did. It's really given me a new perspective on the game - I may end up replaying it after all. I looked up Campo Santo to see what they've done since. Apparently they were subsumed by Valve in 2018, and though they were at one point working on a title called In the Valley of Gods, all mention of that game has now been scrubbed. Other than Half-Life: Alyx, Valve has apparently decided that Campo Santo's creative storytelling prowess is best put to use working on auto-battler Dota Underlords, and... Steam. I love the games industry.
What I felt about the ending of Firewatch was that none of the doubts I had about Delilah or the government spying on them were actually erased. With the heli ride at the end, I was still wondering if Delilah might have been spying on me for other reasons than her own curiosity. I think this sort of story writing in games helps the player become more mature, by forcing them to realize that life doesn't always have a clear end to any given situation. It teaches us to deal with unresolved emotions, among other things that are painfully bound to what being human is about...
I played Firewatch before and I must say the way you presented the story and ultimately its (arguably) unsatisfying ending was fantastic. Perfectly mirrors what one experiences on their first play-through. I thoroughly enjoyed this video. This style of video essay is exactly the kind that I love watching. Thanks to the algorithm for suggesting but mostly to you for turning me into a brand new subscriber. Can’t wait to watch more of your content.
i haven’t seen anything like these video essays on the platform. Your way of weaving one overarching story throughout smaller examples of whatever you’re writing about is so well done in every video. Been here since around 10k and i’m not leaving anytime soon. Keep it up man‼️
i'm not sure if anyone still remembers this game, but presentable liberty is the epitome of an unsatisfying ending. not because the ending is poor, but because it leaves you completely hopeless. you were the cure, trapped inside of the only room which could ever grant you peace and freedom, but unfortunately you learned these things just a day late.
The saddest thing of all is that the games creator killed himself I believe, or died in some way. It's sad to think that a dude who made one of the hardest hitting games I've ever seen or played having died like that.
@@darealrylocke6531 yes, he did commit suicide. it's extremely sad, because it was likely caused from all the failed kickstarters he had planned. it really is such a shame
This is one of the reasons why the Stanley Parable is my favorite game, because there are so many endings, and no 'official' one. The player can choose what they want it to be, and how it should end.
Aw man I wish you had talked about SOMA, it’s a fun twist on this trend because it effectively has two endings that happen at once, one which is satisfying and one which is horribly unsatisfying and even scary.
and funny enough they both have somewhat of the same structure in terms of lonliness, 2 people etc. both dialouges, especially from the actrees in soma and firewatch were phenomal and very natural in their delivery
God now I remember playing SOMA for myself (never completed it) and watching Mark play it. Definitely keep remembering when he mercy kills that whoever the fuck at the seafloor sand.
@@wormy7279 Yup, it's absolutely horrifying. When the ending was "happening" I had the most unpleasant case of a skin crawl. It was a great ending and I prefer it over Firewatch one.
This video really had me engaged more than most episodes of tv shows. I have valuable, important things to do but I pushed them back to be able to continue and finish watching this video. I felt like it was worth it. I believe it was.
My problem with firewatch was less the ending itself and more how the game progresses. It feels like there was a bunch of content that just never made it into the game, stuff thats hinted at but never followed up on and then it just kinda ends in a few minutes with everything being explained away.
i remember playing this game over a year ago and it was such a great experience. for such a short and simple game that i finished in a night, it has always stuck with me. the game totally immersed me in the world. will always remember it.
I have no idea how to feel about this. I feel conflicted. On one hand, yes this is art. Its beautiful in how unsatisfying it is and how it meticulously creates these layers on intrigue only to let it all fall down. That is just beautiful. But on the other, i hate it. I hate this sort of thing and hate that it'll stick with me forever. Chilidish or not, those good satisfying endings are better than what this offered me. And yet, I can't help but feel like this leans towards cynicism (which is the worstest thing by the way). Maybe thats just my emotions getting in the way of my critical thinking, but who cares. And after looking through my own feelings and thoughts I feel like a certain game does it best. Far : Lone Sails is a game where you're trying to get from point A to Point B. Plain and simple, using a sort of vehicle in order to do so. You get upgrades as you get further and encounter jaw-dropping sites all without knowing what your goal is. You see abandoned houses and deserted areas, making you believe that you're the last one left. And eventually, boom, your vehichle is completely cut in half. Unable to use fuel, you use the sail upgrade to slowly make your way to the end, opening and closing the sail to literally balance the vehichle on one wheel. And once you get there, its just a tower with a contraption on top. You put some fuel in, and it lights a fire. Thats it, a journey to just light a fire. But as the camera goes out, and night roles in, I realized something that cured my attitude. That fire is hope. Hope that someone will come, hope that you aren't the only one. Hope that there is someone out there. This hope is what encourages us to keep going. Its what helps us get through grief. Henry has to go back to the real world, but that doesn't mean he won't live it. Everyday we have a choice, even if its as simple as getting out of bed, its still a choice. And we make that choice everyday. Thank you for showing us this work of art that highlights the childishness of escaping reality. I'll face it, and I'll dance while doing it.
I don't know if I'd call myself a cynic per se, but I just want to say I found your comment funny. Not in the, "lol, you're lame" kind of way, but appreciable and maybe a bit ~naive~. I have to disagree with you about cynicism being the worst thing, I wholeheartedly believe that apathy is the worst feeling - a complete void of emotion and lack of connection with something just makes me feel like something is worthless and completely devoids me of any motivation. I like your take on Far Lone Sails, it sounds like the opposite of what this video got out of Firewatch and the opposite of what Firewatch itself seems to want to portray while also utilizing similar design elements. An interesting dichotomy of game design.
@@AlHyckGaemsTAD Best comment I've seen. I believe that what we consider as worse than the other comes from entirely different perspectives l, hence why our different viewpoints, I feel as though cynicism still totally blows. Don't get me wrong, what you have described still is something terrible and I don't wish that on my worst enemy, I feel that cynicism is the spark that starts the road down to complete numbness. The belief that nothing matters and you can't do anything about it essentially bases itself on hopelessness. In my opinion, what you described is the outcome, whilst I described the source. Again, maybe I'm wrong, that can and will inevitably happen when discussing topics such as this, but I can't help but feel that the cause of this numbness is indeed worse. Also, I'm glad others know about Far Lone Sails. It's a good little game.
@Dave Just Dave believing nothing matters no matter what is nihilism, not cynicism. Cynicism is believing that everyone does what they do for only themselves and their own reputation/gains.
I believe the thematically best unsatisfying ending in any game was the one in Kane & Lynch 2: Dog Days. The game is centered around the fact that you, the player, are both the cameramen and the puppeteer, filming and controlling two broken and unreedemable sociopaths struggle for survival against the entirety of Shangai underworld in the span of 48 hours of pure hell; it's kill or be killed and the only thing you do for 4 hours is shooting your way out increasingly desperate and hopeless situations; the only purpose to such violence is to escape Shangai. In the end you shoot up an airport and rush to a departing airliner, Kane & Lynch hijack the plane, leaving you the cameramen behind, the plane takes off and the cameramen hastily turns off the camera, they have escaped for now and the Dog Days are over, the two men literally escape the story and there is nothing more to be filmed, cut to black and the credits roll, for the entirety of the game you only heard deafening gunfire, our characters swearing and the inhuman droning of the soundtrack only to be met with a calm chinese love ballad. All the bodies you piled up were purposeless, all the violence inferted and subjected meaningless, it is a game truly about how the banality of evil, and i can't stop thinking about it.
To me, the reason why I liked the Firewatch ending and hated TLoU2 ending is because in Firewatch, you still feel like you accomplished something. Like you said, it wasn't the ending we were hoping for, but it was A ending. We got to the bottom of the mystery, so imho, it was a good ending. We know that the bad stuff that has happened to Henry will still be right there, waiting to greet him, but sometimes, life is just like that, you know? Sometimes life just sucks. And in Henry's case, it sucks mostly because of things out of his control. In TLoU2, on the other hand, it's frustrating because the things that make Ellie's ending such a shitty ending are a result of her own choices, and you don't ever get to make those choices for her. And we as the player are supposed to take the consequences of her own choices, while never being allowed a saying in those choices. She set out to avenge Joel, she killed half of the world to get in a position where she could finally have her revenge, and in the end.... she didn't. Because, after leaving piles and piles of bodies behind her, she wanted to "stop the cycle of violence and revenge". And at the end of the story, she lost Joel, she lost Dina, she lost their baby and she lost her fookin fingers, as well as the ability to play the guitar, consequently. Firewatch's ending might be unsatisfying because people wanted a different resolution to the mystery, or to meet Delilah in person, and they might be right, but at least we know that the devs gave our boy Henry an okay ending. His struggles with life will continue, but he's good with that. TLoU2 ending is unsatisfying because to make a point that "revenge is bad and the cycle of violence should be stopped by whoever gets the chance", they turned their main character into a hypocrite. Ellie didn't simply gave up her goal of revenge. She failed it. She decided not to "cross the line" when she already was 10 kilometers beyond the line. At the end of the game, Ellie was nothing but a miserable, hypocrite failure. I looked at Ellie leaving through that window and thought "yeah, you're the worst protagonist to any story I've ever saw." And this is amplified by the fact that this is a videogame. We were supposed to be able to change her ending. To make better choices for her. But we couldn't. They didn't let us.
I don't necessarily think that just because games are interactive that it means that we should get to decide what ending happens. They clearly wanted Ellie to be her own character and not a puppet of the player, and that's why we don't get to make her most important decisions for her...but I think you did hit the nail on the head of what makes that ending so infuriating for people: It didn't feel fitting. It felt like the game took the controller away and scolded you at the last minute, moralizing to you in a way that didn't feel believable. You were absolutely right to say that they tried to say "killing Abby would be crossing the line" when you already know Ellie crossed that line AGES ago. There's no reason for her to stop now, it feels so artificial and forced. She would have done it. She killed so many other people to get there, after all, what's one more? I don't think she should have a HAPPY ending, it isn't happy at all, and even after all the revenge I think the message should still be that it wasn't really worth it in the end...but you can't have her murder people the whole game and then suddenly decide murder is bad and act like that message still works, it feels like a cheap cop-out to moralize at the player.
@@ZeroKitsune Except we were actually supposed to have a choice at the end of TLOU2 though, and it was only scrapped towards the end of development because of Halley Gross deciding to do it
@@ZeroKitsune It isn’t saying that killing Abbie is crossing the line. Its Ellie realizing that she crossed that line so so long ago. Its her realizing that Joel wouldn’t have wanted this for her, Joel won’t come back from it, and that she is doing the same thing to Lev that Abbie did to her.
Why should you get to decide Ellie’s choices? Do you get mad that you don’t get to decide Macbeth’s choices when you read it watch other tragedies? Last of Us 2’s ending isn’t supposed to be satisfying to the player, it’s supposed to be cathartic for Ellie. I think as players we get so wrapped up and engrossed in the stories that we play that we begin to project our thoughts and desires onto the protagonists we play as, but it’s not about what we would find conventionally satisfying. In the case of last of us 2, it’s about watching Ellie realize that killing Abby won’t give her what she really wants, which was the chance to reconcile with Joel. Her character arc comes to a fitting ending, as we go from seeing her believe that revenge is the way to cope with getting a chance at reconciliation with Joel taken from her, to seeing her reaping the psychological and physical consequences of this belief, to finally seeing her realize that revenge won’t give her what she ultimately desires, which is the chance to forgive joel. I think conversely while Firewatch gives us a conclusion to the mystery, it is devoid of personal relation to Henry’s journey of grief and thus feels a lot more empty. I think this is because the only throughline between the central plot/mystery of the game and Henry’s character arc is the overarching theme of grief, but this doesn’t really ever interact with Henry’s personal story/character in any meaningful, tangible way.
Firewatch felt at its best when it was about the chemistry between Henry and Delilah. I wish that pseudo-mystery thing that happens in the 2nd half never happened; it took us away from that playful chemistry. For me, I do not remember this game for this "mystery plot", I remember it for the simpler things, about two people just bonding and getting to know each other, with faint hints of a possible romance. I once had an ex who I met kind of similarly, talking online for weeks and finally deciding to meet. So maybe thats partially the reason Firewatch hits so close for me haha. Delilah being absent in the end of the game just destroyed me, I felt bitter at Delilah, as if she never cared to meet at least once before leaving, even after everything that happened. No game has made me feel like that ever. This story was SO simple, so inconsequential, maybe thats why I love it so much. No saving the world, no fights, no fancy game mechanic. Just a story of two people getting close, and then it going nowhere, something that happens in a lot of potential romances. What a game.
Fire watch has one my favorite endings in a game ever. Easily in my top 5 story games of all time. The ending being unsatisfying opened up a genre that I didn't realize really existed. I will always love this game
Man, this video reminds me how good Firewatch was. It's one of the few games I felt emotional after finishing no matter how bad the ending was. Sometimes I just want to go back to the first time playing it and experience the emotions all over again, but I somehow also never want to go back as the ending is finite. This makes it feel real but unsatisfying, but I'm just glad I got to experience it before saw I anyone play it. Thanks for the video.
The ending that felt most unsatisfying in a game for me was Danganronpa v3. The reveal at the end felt so mean-spirited toward fans of the series, making you wonder if any of it-the hours you put into this game and the previous ones-was worth it at all. A lot of games have unsatisfying endings, but few have outright mean ones. Great video.
Jesus Christ Firewatch made me feel alive and concious of the people & time slipping by. I’m not sure weather i would wanna play this game again for the first time or not at all to begin with… it gives the same feeling you have when your pet dies and you thinks to yourself you will never be ready again to get another pet. Anyways i’m glad i played this game and found your video years later.
Firewatch reply upset me when I finished it. As I let it sit, as i slept on it, I came to the same realization you did. Namely, that this is a reflection of real life. Grief doesn't go away because you figure out what's going on, or because you beat the bad guy, or because you escaped. That gratification was missing. It was sad. I felt robbed. I was confused. Much like Henry did. But life went on. This lesson, that a story doesn't have to be gratifying or satisfying too be beautiful and worth the telling or hearing, dramatically shaped my outlook on the media I consume, and how I deal with big emotions like grief. Basically, do the best you can as you keep on living, and look for the beauty in what you had while you had it.
First off, I liked the video. Interesting structure, good voice, good script, and I enjoyed watching. That said, comparing Firewatch to TLOU2 is like comparing Your Lie In April to High Guardian Spice. The problem with these "real world" stories, the ones that get it dead wrong in any case, about loss and grief is that grief, and life, isn't just a cold, empty, terrible feeling, but the people who write terribly conceived stories don't care. They want their audience to suffer, not for art, but just to suffer. There is no cold contempt for their own audience in Firewatch. There is nothing but contempt in TLOU2. With Firewatch, we have a story told to near perfection, very subtly, about grief but also about how you build a perception of the world up, often out of almost nothing, and craft horror stories out of thin air to fill in gaps. It's not just a story about grief, it's a story about how you view the world, and how grief fits into that misconception idea. Grief is a single data point in a long story you know almost none of, and with it, you fill in gaps and the picture you paint is often a cold, terrible one. A horror story, through and through, that is based on a very small amount of information. Compared to the ghost stories we tell ourselves, reality is a bit more brutal, and a lot less interesting, and the end of Firewatch shows that beautifully. You *GAIN* something from Firewatch, because the people who made it knew what they were doing, and they were crafting a piece of art, not a political statement, nor a rebuke for their audience. They weren't trying to save the world or show that they were saving the world; they were just telling a story about how people shape their idea of the world, and how grief plays a big part in people's lives. TLOU2 is a story about a bunch of murder hobos living in a post apocalyptic world where no one (it seems) follows their own rules, no one has any principles that really matter, no one is really evil (even though literally everyone is cruel and evil), no one is good, no one cares about actual justice (ostensibly because no one has the time or resources) but everyone cares about current year issues (even though no one should have the time or resources). No struggles mean anything, and nothing turns out well at all. Humanity is doomed, and no amount of singing and dancing in some hipster flannel party at the end of the world is going to change that. There are no lessons learned. There is no redemption, no revenge, nothing gained at all. A father loses his family, the woman who stole them both away loses them both, the man who raised her dies to a freak of nature, the freak of nature becomes a wasted weak person who never pays for her own crimes, the woman who refuses to kill her has nothing to go home to, no home at all, no ability to even play the song her surrogate father taught her, no way to preserve his memory, and no one at all (since she will never have children) to pass the stories on to. She has the cure for a disease that has destroyed the world, and she won't even pass that on nor will anyone likely ever even know now that she has that cure. Nothing matters. it could be a story about going down to the gas station for some beer only to find that they are closed for renovations, and the main character has to just go back to their crappy apartment because "isn't that just how the world is? Nothing ever works out." It's a story about a hoarder who lived down the street from you that you only hear about after they die and someone has to call the authorities because of the terrible smell; full of things that seem significant to someone, but spending hours digging through the piles of crap only leaves you with a vague sense that someone, somewhere, was there and probably had some things in their head, and probably even cared about a great many things, but there's no connection to anything at all for you, and no one even cares enough to try and explain it to you. It's several hours of random white noise, characters that are utterly inept or cartoonishly villainous... to the point where a regular person playing the game ends up shifting all of that antagonism to the people who made the game, rather than the characters in it. Just like with a hoarder, you don't end up hating the person who hoarded, you end up hating the massive pile of shit they left behind that you have to slog through. But if the hoarder is still around, and telling you you are the dumbest, worst, most ista-phobe-ism gamer word that ever gamer worded? That hatred of the hoard shifts to the person who created it. Sure, we could say "it's a art" but TLOU2 doesn't qualify as well done art any more than the hoarder's stash qualifies as a treasure trove. There *may be* glittering diamonds in there amongst the old Chinese newspapers and rat droppings, but they are the exception, not the rule. The only positive thing TLOU2 has given me is an appreciation for games that aren't it, and I don't think that was the intended function of the project.
A way out is the only game that ever made me cry at the end, just because over the course of the game, hearing Vincent and Leo talk and get to know each other gave me an attachment to both my character and also to leo, combined with the fact that the players know what has to happen in the final Mission but neither wants it to. Even so, 10/10 game
This guy talks about the game I’m such a certain way that it really brings the story into perspective. his voice is calming, passive, and friendly, this makes the videos a lot more engaging and it’s awesome. Thank you
I felt like the General Knoxx armory DLC made a lot of things right with Borderlands 1. It finally gave us that epic vault of loot we'd all been hoping for.
I feel like the question is, what is the point of stories as “a thing”? Why do we want to experience stories? Why do we keep going past the first page of a book? When a story is unsatisfying, it means it didn’t fulfill those things. Those things weren’t *satisfied*. You can have a sad ending, or a dark ending to a story. But having no real ending that satisfies the story I to that point *is* bad. I played Firewatch forever ago and felt the whole experience was pointless because there was no ending. Even if the point was “everything is void of meaning” or whatever, the character realising that and reflecting on what happened in the story would satisfy. Because there would be a point to experiencing those things. The *reaction* would be the point of the story. I’ve pretty much forgotten everything about Firewatch because it basically told me “This was a waste of time.” Maybe it had some sort of “button” on it-but from the video sounds like it really didn’t, in which case I stand by my point.
really like your non-linear approach to your videos, talking about one topic then switching to a different game and going back without notice. i really like video essays and i’m glad i found your channel, i really like your writing and speaking style
I would like to point out, my biggest problem with Firewatch will always be that the ending does not actually gel with the story told. Specifically, the paper we find that details the boy and his father going missing says there was an exhaustive search of the area for weeks, before they were considered lost. That makes sense, and is what is supposed to happen. Now, Daddy being able to hide himself, and not waiting anything to do with people anymore makes sense. But then we get to both how his son died, and more importantly, the locked area of the cave. That bridge, which I will remind you is noted to go out sometimes, and would have been out when the search teams arrived, was repaired not by daddy, but by the people after him. This means that at no point in 3 years did anyone decide, 'hey, maybe we should check the cavern below the bridge for the missing person?' because dad never once moved the son's body, he just left it there, too ashamed to face it. In a narrative sense, it kind of works, tragedy and maybe showing that the 'exhaustive' search was nothing of the sort. But everything else implies they weren't lying, and somehow just missed his body down there during those weeks. It feels cheap, like a plot point that doesn't work, but is there solely for the twist. And it killed my enjoyment of the game beforehand, as that was the last memory I was left with.
I don't understand why he was fooling around in the research camp either, or why he sets it ablaze. And also how the researchers didn't notice him there.
@@JewTube001 Eh, dark woods make it easy to get around. Remember, this is not modern times, where setting up motion sensitive cameras and the like would be relatively cheap and easy. These people are likely running on a budget that barely gets them two cameras and a grad student. That said, him setting it ablaze only makes sense if you take the view that he IS crazy by now, and has little to know grasp on reality, merely seeing the researchers as intruders in HIS woods. That said, someone that crazy is probably going to be all but dead in a month, let alone three years. The area has plenty of game and water, to be fair, but none of it would be healthy enough to keep a man in good condition, as the water would be unfiltered, and the food would have to be uncooked, otherwise he would have been found before now, given campfires are one of the things you're there to look for.
Great video. I ended up gaining a new perspective on Firewatch, a deeper understanding of the emptiness I felt after rhe credits rolled. However, respectively, I have to disagree about the inclusion of Part 2, as, unlike with Firewatch, Ghosts n' Goblins, and COD Black Ops 1 and 2, the contradiction of Ellie's motivations at the end, which aren't really consistent with the narrative, don't just illicit a feeling of emptiness within the player, but also hollow out the game itself in the end. When the writers had the opportunity to go all the way and commit to the character _they_ created, they faltered; they couldn't muster up the courage to pull the trigger. To commit to a logically consistent dark tone. If the writers couldn't trust us to make that choice or simply wanted a linear experience, like the developers of Ghosts n' Goblins, they should've gone all the way, showing the true extent of revenge and its consequences. I mean, think about it: Had Ellie gone through with drowning Abbie on that shore, seeing the former back at the farm house, two fingers missing, and no family, we would've seen the consequences of her decisions in full. Yet, because she sought mercy, or some form of redemption, going back to an empty house doesn't really make sense, narratively speaking. Either way, it doesn't really make sense why Dina would leave such an isolated, self-sustaining, _beautiful_ home, but I digress. The Last of Us Part 2 _is_ art, yes. I wouldn't say it's well-written or well-crafted, as the emptiness _I_ felt didn't correlate with the game's narrative whatsoever. I was more frustrated than anything else, and that feeling didn't stick with me for long. Honestly, I think Dark Souls 1 would make for a better example. As we later discovered in the 3rd entry, restoring the flame in Lordran only prolonged the inevitable. Lothric still fell and, once again, a fire keeper resurrected warriors to restore the flame just a _little bit longer,_ prolonging the Age of Fire to no greater end but perpetual decay, decline, and rot. Ironically enough, because of the consequences of choosing martyrdom in Lordran and fulfilling the prophecy, we've unintentionally doomed the world to hollow further. We've denied everyone, the undead especially, an end to their suffering. And all of it was shown throughout the game. Even Solar and Siegfried, two of the jolliest people in Lordran, eventually succumb to despair. So, what's left? An Age of Darkness, so that one day a new fire may rise from the ashes once more. Of course, choosing self-preservation isn't as satisfying as being the hero your prophesized to be. Why wouldn't it? After all, considering all the hardship you went through to reach the end, why betray your goal? From a gameplay _and_ narrative perspective, it makes sense. Without the hindsight Dark Souls 2 and 3 give us, there's no reason _not_ to "play the hero" and "save" the day. That's what _meaningful_ unsatisfaction looks like, in my opinion, because From Software committed to a consistent tone and narrative throughout the entire trilogy. That, to me, signifies a piece of well-crafted art. One that makes those feelings of emptiness very meaningful.
I think you missed a lot of Ellie's character development. Her refusal to kill Abby at the end made perfect sense to me and tied the whole thing together. You talk about showing the truth of revenge and its consequences, but just because Ellie didn't actually Abby... there are still consequences. She left Dina, and Dina didn't want to live there alone, so Dina went back to Jackson. That's a perfectly logical consequence. The narrative doesn't have to explicitly reward every act it considers good; there are other ways to communicate that. I'd love to discuss Ellie's character arc in more detail if you're up to it.
I hate the idea that sparing the big bad guy is somehow some sort of good moral choice in movies and games especially superhero movies. Forget about the hundreds of nameless cronies killed along the way as long the person responsible for all the mayhem lives then it’s good. If anything they are the only person who absolutely should die
I hoped that you ended where you did with your essay; good stuff. Games like Firewatch, The Beginner's Guide, and Disco Elysium are my absolute favorites. A game's ability to put you in the shoes of its protagonist and make you experience directly what they are going through is an avenue that's not explored enough yet. Video games are the next frontier in story telling, and with these titles, the games industry is dipping its toes in tragedy, reflecting ourselves back at us. You mentioned that you didn't quite know what it was that attracted you to these titles, perhaps catharsis is the answer. Keep it up.
I honestly barely even had the hope of actually meeting Delilah in the game. I feel like games with no mirrors or any visible characters outside of your hands have become way too obvious in the fact that the devs didnt make any character models (at least for close up conversation). Thats fine except when a game is trying to make you think youre going to meet someone face to face.
I think one of the best parts about games that have unsatisfying endings to me is that they're so much more realistic, at least in the sense of how endings turn out in reality. Endings more often than not aren't satisfying in real life, something ends and that's that. You're never guaranteed closure, you're never guaranteed anything. Something as passionate and bright as an inferno sweeping over a mountain can just disappear, seemingly out of nowhere and it won't let you get more out of it, it's already gone. There's nothing more to see, there's no continuation to the story, there's just a bitter absence of something more intriguing that you're left with.
i love how games manage to give me heartache, i’ve never felt the kind of physical pain i get with games over other mediums like tv shows or movies or books, it’s that sort of interactive model that makes it so strong for me, i love it so much
I want you to know that I think you are a genius. Your nonlinear editing, stroytelling and Explanation and ideas. It truly is genius, because i have never seen anything like it. I realy like it. You see games as art. its realy good
This video was in my recommended for a couple weeks and I kept avoiding it because I both like firewatch and was afraid it would just be more shitting on the last of us 2. So glad I finally clicked. What a wonderful commentary on endings in video games and media.
Fire watch had a great end for me, it entered the character as someone in the middle of his life with a mid life crisis, then we get to see his brief break from it all, then after that his life will go on away from the player. Felt really good for me, kind of having a sense of your never really gonna know the end of a certain situation in life.
The ending to borderlands kind of reminds me of the ending to Skyrim, after beating Alduin, the one thing the entire game has worked up to, the people in Sovngarde kind of just give you on a pat on the back, say well done, and then just send you back to Tamriel
Firewatch was a masterpiece of a game. I never thought of it as about grief but it makes more sense to me. In my opinion, Firewatch tries to emphasize the loneliness when grieving alone, in the forest, by yourself. There's no one there with you. You don't see the teenagers faces, you don't see the man who attacked you, you don't see the man's face in the helicopter who rescued you, and you don't even get to see Delilah. You ARE alone, no matter how many people you're surrounded by, you don't know anyone. If you ask me? It's true loneliness.
Haven't seen anyone bring this up so I thought I'd mention, even if I'm just coming back to this video & it's probably too late: It is interesting that you mention that killing Menendez has to be the canon ending as (I don't know if you knew this or not but) it is the canonical ending; Raul dies, Cordis Die riots begin & then they soon die out, that's pretty much it. You wanna know how you find out? In Black Ops 3, there is a terminal in the campaign's various hub which you can access which operates somewhat similar to the one found in Black Ops 1 - you can find out various information about the Black Ops world before & after BO2. Included in this is the failure of the Cordis Die revolution and it is explained that most of Menendez's supporters saw it as an act of cowardice rather then the will of a Martyr or something like that. It was written off to support a new narrative for BO3. Turns out the true unsatisfactory ending to BO2 was hidden away a niche corner of BO3
I played Firewatch in my senior year of high school, which is when I also had to read Jane Eyre for my literature class. Needless to say, I was shocked to find that one of the books you could find in the game was Jane Eyre, but looking back on it after watching this video I've come to appreciate its inclusion. At first, I saw the connection between both Jane running away to Whitcross and Henry running away to Shoshone Park and thought that Jane Eyre's inclusion was to make a point about how our first instinct is to run away from our problems, as both Jane ultimately returns to Rochester and Henry is forced to go back home to Colorado. But after watching your video, I feel like Jane Eyre was included to just poke fun at the fantasy of the release running away could have. Jane Eyre ultimately ends with Jane returning back to Rochester on the basis of a coincidence in which they both envisioned Jane returning and even when Jane does return, it just so happens that Jane has an equivalent financial status to Jane, Rochester is blinded and needs a caretaker and that Bertha Mason is dead. When compared to the harsh reality portrayed in Firewatch and what you mentioned about just being left with nothing, I feel like I can only scoff at the events of Jane Eyre as a child-like fantasy. I don't know if you'll read this but I really loved this video and I hope everything is working out for you 👍
Firewatch felt like a story someone would tell you if you hung around with them long enough. It wasn’t a happy ending, sad, or anything. Just An Ending. It was the end of a job, end of a relationship with someone, end of the summer.
Bro that was way deeper than the game trying to tell it though the game was amazing I never played it never had the money to but I did see a bunch of vids from different UA-camrs and this game is amazing
Lazy writing but every twitter user is addicted to it 🤨
@@adriansrsa90 bro nobody needs your negativity here so go take that stick and jam it up your bum and leave because nobody needs it today
this is such a beautiful way of putting it
rmb when pewds almost got sued jus cuz he covered firewatch playthrough?
This video made me realise that the whole game was isolating. That you never got to interact in person with any character. Whether it was Delilah, seeing the teens have fun, the veteran. It’s like you’re the one that has to navigate through the grief, and no one is there to help you through it. It’s you and you alone to save yourself
Up until the very end, when the rescue team come to you, the first time you touch another person for months, they are helping you into a helicopter to leave. I loved the ending.
@@CreedyXIX yeah I understand the ending, story wise at least. Though for a game about making choices some of em are limited and needed more fleshing out, maybe we could see what Henry did after he was picked up. I feel that would have complimented the ending rather than just cutting to the title screen.
And in my time playing the game I wish there was more interactions with not only Delilah but also with the environment, adding more to the games narrative, rather than handicapping it.
Also it would have been nice for you to be able to see Delilah in her watchtower through a pair of binoculars or something only seeing a silhouette of her trough the watchtower or something (if they animated the veteran walking around, surely they sure could do the same with Delilah)
I used to think Firewatch had a bad ending, not meeting Delilah after all that seemed kind of frustrating. But after all these years, the ending makes more sense. Henry was trying to find a escape. With Delilah, he found that. But both of them were just running away. You can’t always run away from your problems. Someday you’ll have to face them. It’s a powerful ending no matter how off-putting it felt.
.
The problem I have with the ending is it felt like they kept building up, with a conclusion that just seemed muddled and confusing, and didn’t make sense. Like, how did Goodwin set everything up? Where did he get all of the equipment? Isn’t he just a hermit living out in the woods? The ending imo felt kind of cheap. I get the message and what it was going for, but it would of been better if it actually should Henry going back and facing his problems
Had that Lion King feel to it bro had Hakuna Matata in the mountains until the end.
Personally I find it a bad ending. Not trying to bash it or riding the hate train as people say it but I just personally find it a that way. The game promised a good story, which could mean anything really. It's like being being promised a drink, agreeing to have it only to get a cabbage smoothie. The thing is, I don't like it, simple as that. I hate it, it's bitter and whatever. Now that they're telling me it's good and it's supposed to taste like that. Yeah well, still doesn't change that I don't like the taste. It may be designed to taste like that, still I don't like it. That's all there is to it.
Another one that I could compare it to other than food is Cuckholding. I don't like it, but some do and it's designed that way. And yet again, still. I don't like it.
but if firewatch was a story about grief, wouldnt that ending make it perfect with the game?
Dude's house catches fire. Days later, releases a video featuring Firewatch. Incredible.
shoulda watched
Yeah I was working on this script before it happened, I think life wanted to be a little poetic
@@TheCursedJudge The universe is weird. It might also be indifferent, but at least it's weird.
It took a hot minute but the videos out 🤷
@@TheReZisTLust Perhaps the tragedy... Kindled his creativity.
Firewatch had a relevent end for me. I had a long term girlfriend at the time and we had played thru 90% of the game. When i finished it alone later and Delilah wasnt there, it felt exactly how it should have.
I had a similar experience with the original Life is Strange, I played it with my first real girlfriend and we were both in tears at the end. We ended up breaking up a few months later and I found myself drawn back to the game and the ending was much more emotional for me. The thought that if I could just go back and have another try I could fix everything was stuck in my head after the break up and the game genuinely helped me put that to bed. Sometime things just aren't meant to be and trying to fight that fact will only make things worse.
Wow, that timing was perfect for you.
Brutal. So sorry.
God damn that is sad
@@evelynsahoe8896oof man gws
The ending of fire watch is like graduating college. You completed your goals and you move on with your life. Its probably the last time you see or hear from people you've grown to know well. You dont get some happy ending of "we will definitely keep in touch after this is over".
honestly facts
Lol wish i knew what that felt like
I still talk to my college friends..
@@dragonicbladex7574 All of them?
Same with high school
I loved that Firewatch was happy to be such a specific, emotional experience. Having Delilah run from the responsibility and pressure of meeting you in person mirrors your own running away from your wife's problems. The reality you didn't want to or weren't able to face. The emptiness at the end of the game hit like a hammer and I wish there were more that took those swings.
The irony about Firewatch is you can go through the game and try to stay "faithful" to Julia and the narrative sort of falls apart. The game really expects you to bond with Delilah.
I dunno, to me it just felt like an excuse for the dev to not create a model for a woman or even just draw her for an ending still picture. The way the teens are textureless girl models from really far away and Julia's face was hidden in the picture by the camera it just seemed like the dev didn't know how2girl.
@@JZStudiosonline My man was looking for escape and to drown his pain. I didn't even consider being faithful :)
@@SamuelCatsy people jerk it off so hard they can't see that half baked and rushed elements
@@improvgm8663 sounds like you’re a POS
When I played Firewatch, the ending actually affected me. Because I didn't get to meet her or see her, That stayed with me, because I as the player, really felt something for these characters. I went to bed, and my dreams did the rest. I dreamed that as I was escaping the Fire, I saw her there, at the end, as I reached her tower, she was there at the base of it... With the dream, Firewatch was on my mind for a solid week, before I finally let it go. It was such an emotional ride, that I'll never forget. Recently I tried replaying the game, but after about the midway point, I gave up. There was nothing left... It was like walking through a grave yard. Speaking with her again, felt empty.... Definitely the strangest experience I've had with a game.
Wow! That sounds like an experience.
I agree. It’s very weird. Played and finished it day one in 2016, never could finish it again. It affected me profoundly the first time round and it’s still an amazing game
but yes, the spark was lost for me after finishing it. Which I guess is the point, eh?
To me. When Henry got to her tower and found that she had left. He decided to sit down, and remain there. Allowing the flames to consume him. His depression and guilt never left him. and when finding the tower empty, his mind crashed as he thought he had lost his mind, and only had imagined Delilah's existence ower the months he had spent there.
Dark, but better than the ending we were given by the devs.
you should see the GOOFY shit i dream man… lucky mf
Well the story was just about that summer. They never talk again. Henry and Delilah never see each other again.
I got confused when he switched to borderlands, cause i was like "what does this have to do with firewatch"
That might have been the most abrupt transition I’ve ever seen on UA-cam
Man, I loved this game so much. Being able to navigate around the Forrest and solving a mystery. The conversation. The sadness. It wasn’t a bad ending. This game made me rethink the types of games I really enjoy. If it wasn’t for What Remains of Edith Finch, I would have never have found this game. Both are just fantastic.
Kind of random, but your post reminded me that I almost never finish games, and yet I've finished both of those and The vanishing of Ethan Carter. Maybe I need to rethink what I like as well.
Ive never played the game and i cried when i saw that fathers day card
I watched a playthrough and I genuinely don’t understand why so many other people hated this game? I didn’t find the ending “disappointing” or “bad” at all. I thought the story was fantastic. Not all stories have to have a happy ending.
stop praising such a garbage ending I fucking gate it when something is so hyped so built upon to be nothing all I felt from the ending is disappointment that it was nothing then sadness as I realised that no such thing can happen in reality then anger and dissatisfaction as I knew I had been tricked by the game into playing it to the end expecting something only to be hit with nothing this real life based formula is THE WORST FUCKING ENDING TO A GAME I HAVE EVER PLAYED
I think that part of the point of this video is that it's *not* a bad ending. It's unsatisfying, but in a very intentional way that carries a message about life, pain, and grief.
Personally, I kind of like games like that. "The Last of Us Part II" falls into that same category of games that I've enjoyed because they weren't afraid to address the darker, more absurd parts of the human condition.
“There was nothing on that mountain that mountain that could possibly satisfy the hole left inside of him, no answer to his suffering.”
There actually is something up there that can heal Henry’s pain. There’s an alternate ending, and all you have to do is… well, it’s the title of the game. Just watch the fire instead of getting on the helicopter.
I personally find this a lot more satisfying of an ending, imagining the pilot radioing this back in, that you refused to board, imagining this information being relayed to Delilah, imagining Henry becoming another ghost of the mountain. It’s really the last and only decision you can make that gives Henry some agency.
Hope you’re doing good and staying safe. Sending support and hearts. ❤❤❤
I actually really liked the ending to Firewatch. It feels so real, that a man wrapped in guilt, trying to escape a life he can’t cope with would want to get swept up in some grand mystery in the middle of nowhere. The fact that it turned out to be nothing, and the main “villain” being a man just like Hank was really impactful. Even not being able to see Delilah at the end made sense realistically
His name's Henry.
edith had a tragic and non-happy ending, but it wasnt shallow like firewatches
now which ending did you got with, leave, or burn?
muh realism
You're making excuses for the writers. Who forgot to turn in an actual ending.
I feel like this video really accentuates the difference between an unsatisfying ending and a bad one. Bad endings leave you with a bitter taste in your mouth, like your time would've been better spend doing basically *anything else* than playing this game. Often, they don't make sense or are just... lazy. Uplifting or depressing, regardless they just feel *wrong.*
Unsatisfying endings, like that in Firewatch, are well-crafted and grounded in the reality of the game. While they don't wrap everything up with a bow and feel-good emotions, they still feel good. Fitting. Rewarding, in a strange way, despite not being what you might've wanted.
I think "fitting" is the right word. When it's done right, you look back and realize that it was really never going to end any other way, it just wouldn't make sense to.
@@ZeroKitsune That's a good way of putting it, yeah :]
you described firewatches ending in the first few lines, its a Bad ending.
@@realpunkfruit I personally disagree; to me Firewatch's ending isn't bad, just not what I wanted as someone who enjoys feel-good happy endings. But you do you, we're all entitled to our opinions :]
playing firewatch was a massive waste of time. its a bad ending to a story themes of which, it turned out, i did not give two flipping shits about.
Firewatch's ending and story has stayed with me for so long precisely because of its "anticlimactic" finale. As you said, the vet staying in the woods mirrors Henry's desire to escape from the tragedy of his real life. The idea that the government is spying on 2 random people is easier for him to deal with then his wife's Dimentia is heart breaking and feels very real. Great Essay! Happy youtube recommended you. Subscribed.
The ending to Borderlands is much better than I remember. You were one of the first to make it to the core of the compound around the vault. Eons before that ancient race was so advanced that none would ever break their security. Until now. And that security wasn't to protect a weapon. It was to protect the universe FROM a weapon. The destroyer was almost ethereal. A being from a higher dimension that thinks only of consumption, and gains the attributes of all it consumes. But by accident the ancient Eridians made exactly what was needed to kill it. It was forced to be in our dimension, and play by it's rules to feed. It was mortal. It's just sad the explanation that made it better was in future games.
Having played none of them the creature being locked in the vault seemed like the obvious takeaway from his description. Another one of those misinterpreted legends over time stories.
Tbh the First time ive beaten Bl1 i really liked the end. It was one of the first shooters I have played and i already loved the whole game. Finding out about the aliens and a hard Endboss which is a real Challenge with loot to obtain was perfect for me. Only later i changed my opinion after i was left hungry for more Infos about the aliens and everything and the dissapointment set in.
damn that's cool.
I love that explanation, I just remember it being the exact same creature from the end of Half-Life: Opposing Force, which Gearbox also made, lol.
But the combat with the vault monster is extremely lame, the narrative the whole game has been pretty weak anyways so by the time you get to the vault it's like "That's it?". It's a lame ending no matter how you try to look at it. Also you don't even get to fight the enemy Siren or even see her powers.
This is exactly why I think Firewatch is one of the most memorable games of all time when it comes to story.
Loved it
Although Firewatch isn't perfect by any means, I'd still rather live in a world with Firewatch than one without.
It's a fun romp of a game that many can relate to and it makes you think which is more than most games can say.
The game was unfinished and it shows hard in the ending. Was a clear rewrite to tie things up.
@@skyhunter2816 mhm, its pretty clear how you pulled that out of your a**
@@skyhunter2816 disagree hard. it was a beautiful ending entirely consistent with the themes throughout the game.
I was in my mid twenties when firewatch came out. I remember playing it at or around release and just really feeling disappointment with the ending.
I look back at it now, seven years later, and it's kind of crazy how much more I appreciate it.
When I was younger, I wanted to believe everything I had been through in my life, all my personal suffering, meant something.
Firewatch begs the question that some things just... happen. There is no greater purpose or reason or meaning. Life just occurs sometimes. And you can rage and fight, putting together every combination of the pieces to try and form a coherent whole or you can just accept it, take your licks and move forwards with your life.
Very well said
How old are you now
@@LilXancheX in their early to mid thirties probably, nearing Henry's age
About three minutes in, but I wanted to give praise to the nonlinear structure of your videos. I don't yet know where you're going with the Firewatch thread, but I can't wait to find out.
innit doubt i would've really cared if he hadnt interweaved different games
Same
Gives me big time Jacob Geller vibes.
I have to disagree i found myself lost at what was going on but i’m also watching this before bed so i am sleepy
3 minutes in and I still have no idea what he wants. Don't like this style.
Hey, was in a cursed image Discord with you 3-4 years ago and used to watch you evaluate on Reddit. It's really impressive seeing how you've grown here. I'm proud of you, keep it up.
Oh shit, I appreciate it
What a wholesome interaction.
@@landonhagan450 thats so funny
Was that server OkBuddyRetard/whenthe?
I was in that server, TheMemeSheriff, but I was also in the cursed images discord
I'm actually somewhat relieved to hear that there wasn't a "good ending" I missed out on in Firewatch. I thought I had somehow caused the "bad ending" with my dialogue choices. (SPOILERS) I was even pretty sure it was because of that time when we hear her talking to someone else over a hot mic. I figured it was only bait to sound like she was talking about me and I didn't care even if she was, anyway. My final interpretation of the situation was that she was probably just radioing another tower somewhere and talking about someone else. With that in mind, I chose to ask who she was talking to. My thinking was that she was about to tell me about another colleague I hadn't met, which would have been interesting. I was just trying to make friendly conversation; I didn't mean it in a jealous or prying way at all, but she reacted pretty negatively and there was no way to backpedal or explain myself. I was always worried that that was why she decided not to wait and say goodbye in person, so it's nice to hear that she wouldn't have come no matter what.
There is a different ending...
Instead of fleeing the mountains to the helicopter, just stay in your tower.
I absolutely love your style and structuring of essays, your vision for narratives is genuinely exhilarating
Firewatch is still one of my favorite games despite its ending. It made me feel like I was truly understood during a time of serious loneliness and inner turmoil in my life.
I also enjoy walking around doing nothing
@@airidaspetrauskas4910 all i said is i dont see the appeal asshole
@@airidaspetrauskas4910 im sorry for thinking gameplay is more important than story
It's preference. I insulted you just because the other commentator was talking about how this game helped him though a though time and you had the urge to make a stupid joke. Bet i also enjoy nice gameplay that makes my goblin brain happy but sometimes having a serious and mature story i nice
@@madmonty4761
Eh, both are important depending on the goals of the game. Sometimes, story is the only focus, and it can pay off. And other games just say fuck a story here's our game, just play it. And the mechanics are strong enough that the game is amazing without a narrative.
And some are a perfect blend of both like The Outer Wilds imo.
After watching this I realize how much I can relate to the characters of fire watch. It’s weirdly comforting to know that something out there can describe my actions so accurately. From being lost and lonely to escaping into the wilderness and distracting myself and finally coming home and realizing that all the things I left behind are still waiting there for me. The only thing that really kept moving was time.
One of the things I found fascinating about Firewatch is Ned & Brian's story is actually spaced in the drops and there are enough clues that you can put together what happened before going into the cave. While I do wish that the mystery sub-plot had a better ending, Henry and Delilah's story HAD to end that way. (Though the secret end where Henry lets the fire consume him is a valid option as an ending with the mental state he is in.) He's still married to his wife and very clearly loves her, he just doesn't know what to do when it comes to her care.
Yes, things can get flirty if you let it, but if you only have one person to talk to for almost 3 months, you are going to be close. Henry is a man running from his problems, from his grief. Until he processes that, Delilah made the right choice to stay away.
That is what makes Firewatch such an amazing game.
true
period.
What I loved about this game is how it took the idea of escapism, both from Henry’s personal life and the player simply playing a game to escape reality for a bit, and gave you the brutal reminder that yes… you are going to have to address it again soon. Thanks for the great video.
Ol
80
yep ......AND IT SUCKS ASS
The way you space out this video with multiple games with bad endings but also a core focus game that you return to is really different and unique. Honestly awesome!
I found it really annoying tbh- xD The cuts are so abrupt and it just leaves me wishing that the Firewatch story was more focused into a single portion. I can't even finish this video because it's so dissonant.
@@maskedmischief932The cut from the intro to Firewatch to BL1 felt incredibly jarring in particular. This is still a good video but…yeah
I hate it
I saw a good few comments on other videos on Firewatch's ending, how it was unsatisfying but realistic. Not everything in life ends with climatically, with a dramatic ending that wraps your experience up with a nice ribbon. Sometimes, life just moves on, and you have to accept that.
Yeah I quite liked firewatch's ending, gave me something to think about
The ending of Firewatch was great, it was a perfect conclusion for the narrative leading up to it and I never understood why people called it disappointing or lackluster. Okay, I do get why people might feel that way, but those people really missed the entire point of the game. The ending is not a subversion for its own sake, the narrative and themes did lead up to it. You have to really not pay attention to the game to come to the conclusion that the ending was disappointing.
That's kind of why I loved it as well. There are few games that address what would really happen to the characters in reality.
Don't get me wrong, games like GTA, or Fallout, where you win the day, and everything kind of ends great for you are fun, but downer, more realistic endings are something I enjoy as well. No matter what happened here, Henry wasn't going to discover a cure for dementia, or a fix-all for his life back home. Another game that does this is the first State Of Decay. The entire game builds up the idea of getting back to the regular world, and that because Trumbull Valley is an enclosed box canyon, you just need to escape quarantine, and then you can get help, only to realize that immediately beyond the quarantine zone, and possibly even the world, has already been overrun by the infection, and help isn't on its way, or even close by. The original Red Dead, Halo:Reach, and the Mass Effect trilogy also had these types of endings, where no matter what you do, sometimes you don't get to save the day, or even just live to see the day saved by someone else, and enjoy the fruits of your labor. It's depressing as hell, but also realistic.
@@therobustempyrean1436 With the Mass Effect trilogy you do kind of save the day, fuck up the day, and go on that blurred line with those 3+1 endings.
NOT EVERYTHING IS ABOUT REAL LIFE GAMES ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE REAL IT FUCKING SUCKS WHEN A GAME TRIES TO BE REAL BECAUSE NOTHING HAPPENS IN REAL LIFE THATS WHY THE ENDING SUCKS *NOBODY GIVES A FLYING FUCK ABOUT REAL LIFE BASED GAMES AND ESPECIALLY ENDINGS*
It has a wonderful, perfect ending for the themes it is discussing and portraying. It couldn't have ended any better way, in my opinion. You never have a game that really portrays loss and human fragility.
because the whole point of video games is to escape reality and have fun non of which are present in real life
@@I-like-cows No, that's the point you're seeking in video games. I could say the same of any art. Oh why isn't this music happy, this movie have a happy ending or this painting brightly colored and cheerful? Because art can have different purposes and impart different feelings. They're not confined to one specific "They're supposed to" from any one person. That's art.
@@Ian-mv7yu whats the purpose of shit that exists for the sole purpose to be sad and unsatisfying other than for people to make video essays analyzing the "genius" of it
@@baseddepartment6675 well you just answered your own question lmao. on a more serious note, art does not need a purpose to exist. at its core, art is simply an outlet for human expression and emotion. any artistic creation doesn’t really need any deeper point to its existence other than the creator wanting to make it. some people might have or find deeper meanings, but it’s not a prerequisite to making or enjoying art in any medium.
@@baseddepartment6675art that is sad has a purpose of introspection. Being cursed with sentience means we analyze our own feelings. Games like this help with it. People carry trauma and art exposure can help heal that as well. I know I deal with my parents divorce through games like dishonored. A broken family that still holds it together and takes on a dark cruel world because of their love for one another is the main point of the first game. It’s just what you can take out of a game that helps sometimes. Even if it’s sad.
Sir you have exploded onto my UA-cam recommendations and have absolutely blown everything I usually watch out of the water. Fantastic stuff dude, I can’t wait to see what you get up to next. 🎉
For anyone looking to play Firewatch after watching this video, PLEASE turn off your marker on the map. I did this and finding the way around the park was so much more fun and immersive. Trust me, you won't regret it.
Do you think it's still worth playing after plot spoilage? It's been on my wishlist for ages, but I never got around to it.
I'd say so. It's very relaxing and therapeutic to play, plus you can pick new dialogue options that might change things, albeit minuscule things. Price is a bit steep for some so, personally, I'd wait for it to go on sale before buying.
@@nefariousyawn definitely worth it man, try to get the turtle!
@ccaagg, one of my exact problems with Metro Exodus, great game don’t get me wrong, but I felt WAY too safe. I always knew where I was and I didn’t like that.
@@ccaagg You shouldn't be wishing for lack of them but a toggle, everyone can win.
Some people do just suck at reading maps and can't learn it, that is life. Trying to force people when both sides can win is just rude. Let everyone win.
The graphics, the story, the soundtrack. Fire watch is just amazing. It’s the only game I’ve played where you can feel so fufilled playing, then so empty after finishing.
This Chanel is beautiful and amazingly polished. I am watching this straight from seeing the games. You can’t play any more video and it was amazing. Your video essays are amazing man. tons of love.
This video brought me to tears, I lost my father 10 years ago and so grief is a very familiar concept to me. The way you covered the story of Firewatch and the themes of grief really did move me, thank you for sharing your amazing content with the world.
@@ThaROG-cu7mb Thank you. I sometimes feel his presence around, as if I can imagine what he would say to me in a particular moment. I appreciate the fact that you took the time to send your condolences in the first place 💜
@@Beanie-Babe i see his reply is deleted or something, so just to take his place. I will say I am sorry for your loss. i lost my mom and dad when i was 6 and i really feel you. but, life moves on and talking about it makes it worse when its been multiple years so FRICK IT IMMA GO BOWLING.
Your segment about the cod ending really resonated with me. There's this otome called even if: TEMPEST, where the main character suffers so much pain and agony at the hands of her family and continues to suffer throughout the story, sometimes still because of them even after escaping their grasp. At the ending of the game, the player is presented with much the same choice, and again the revenge option is the wrong one. Only there is no consequence to taking your revenge within canon, and the abusers face no consequences if you choose not to kill them. One of the *main themes* of the game is that the main character is desperately seeking power to be able to fight back against these people, and once you have it, you're not allowed to use it without the game breaking the plot to force a bad ending. It feels horribly unjust and unsatisfying, because even if the moral is the good ol' "the best revenge is letting go and living well", you are actively letting a criminal get away with their crimes and have lost your main motive for even getting this far.
Edit: Oh, and there is *genuinely* no satisfaction to be had in the revenge-taking. Your abuser is portrayed as this cocky, untouchable person even in their last moments.
Edit 2: Thinking back on it, all I truly know is that the revenge ending ends up in execution, and the non-revenge ending might have had them imprisoned (which would be fine by me), but if the game doesn't mention it I'm not making it up for them.
And this is one of the reasons I absolutely hate TLOU part 2
i'd never heard of that game but it sounds very fascinating. that's so cool! i'll have to check it out.
So basically you get screwed every which way.
It... doesn't sound like a satisfying experience to me. I know other people have other standards, but it feels like the writer was... just incompetent.
@@anon9469 It's not incompetence if it's intentional, regardless of whether you'd say it's "good" or "worth it."
Reply 5
Firewatch's ending elevates it from media product to Art. Disappointment, longing, and regret are all valid emotions for art to evoke.
You're absolutely right. The ending of firewatch felt so bad in the moment, but it made the game even more memorable. The more I think about it, the better I think it was. It hits you right in the feels, but not in the sense we're used to. If I recall correctly Gone Home did something similar and was the game that originally led me to play Firewatch. It's also just a gorgeous game with great voice acting.
it made it more memorable by making me hate it
@@realpunkfruit exactly
I cried during Ned’s monologue when I played the game. Not just because of that but the culmination of everything. The soundtrack is definitely part of it, it’s so expertly crafted and perfectly tells you how you should feel at any point in the story. It’s one of the few games that made me forget I was playing a video game.
I've never played or watched anything about firewatch, but this somehow still kinda made me tear up. That says something about firewatch, but also very much about your story telling. Very well done, thanks for making this video
It is worth watching a playthrough or playing it yourself. The dialog is really good and it's worth experiencing the growth of the relationship between both characters.
LMAO, you just brought back a hilarious memory of me and a friend rushing through Borderlands 3, fighting over loot and just laughing, talking shit about borderland 1's ending, only to go on to loot the post-game Vault and find literally exclusively white tiered loot
That's even funnier given how common legendaries are in that game
A Plague Tale: Requiem had the most depressing yet peaceful ending I've seen in a game yet. I've never cried at an ending, but god, that ending fucked me up for days. I felt like I was genuinely mourning a loved one, it was that bad.
This really is art, I just went through a situation where someone close to me acted out in terrible ways towards me and others.
it turned out to be because of grief they felt rather than malice and also an end that is not exactly a happy one but one that has clarity to what happened
I love that video format - all that switching from game to game while having a main story about firewatch. Amazing stuff
You should have known Ghosts 'n' Goblins was out to troll you when the "two hits and your done" game handed you a shield and all you could do was throw it at things.
Also, props for featuring a bit of Gungrave footage! That game had such a unique balance of arcade gameplay and compelling narrative.
dude, i seriously love the way this guy talks about these things, it honestly hits the spot and is just fills me with a mix of all emotions
On my first playthrough I never notice how intentional it was for the veteran to mention your wife in his very last line. There's a good chance that the character and maybe even the player has completely forgotten about her until the last day, when you have to return to her.
Dude you’re one of my fav essayists on UA-cam. You’re so creative not only in the topics you cover, but how you present them and the emotion you can invoke. I love how you broke up Firewatch’s story with the stories of other games all culminating in a satisfying ending. As contrary as that is to the topic of the video lol
i really like it too. its so well made. got sucked into this video like a good movie does! This made my evening
A small thing I noticed: I like how you can view the Chapters in any order you want. Only the Firewatch ones are connected in some way. The rest can be viewed out of order.
I've never seen a video like this before. It's a nice refresher from the videos where you're forced to see Chapters in a certain order or else you'll get confused as to what happens in it. Here though? It's a small-scale video about disappointing endings. Just that. There doesn't need to be a grand narrative that ties everything together or hidden codes or messages that leads to something else. This is a simple video made for people like me that just want to sit back and relax without worrying about everything. I think that's pretty cool.
I get what you overall meant with this comment, but I can't wrap around my head about you "relaxing without worrying about everything", on a video about unsatisfying game endings that keeps reminding you of real life troubles, I want to be this level headed
I'm so glad the video took the course it took. The expectation setting was great and I agree with your end point. That's what grief is. I too, always wondered why people were compelled to make that type of story/ending. After experiencing my first big grief in life 1 year ago, I began to notice how much of media I love is filled with grief. Or, actually, how much of the world is surrounded by it. Built upon it.
Thanks for this video.
Someone pointed out that given some context clues Delilah was bored and was using the veteran guy to mess with Henry but it went completely ass backwards when they discovered the dudes deceased child at the bottom of the cave and Delilah panicked and that’s why she left you at the end because she was too guilty and felt responsible for both the death of a child and the manipulation of Henry and she felt like she couldn’t face him and left meanwhile the veteran still not wanting to face the loss of his kid or society just retreated deeper into the park either dying in the fire or finding a new hiding spot
Damn, I haven't played Firewatch but the story gave me hardcore What Remains of Edith Finch vibes. Highly, HIGHLY recommend for anyone who enjoyed Firewatch!
Thank you for this. I played Firewatch when it first came out - which feels like a lifetime ago but was apparently as recent as 2016 - and my abiding memory of it has always been how bitterly disappointing I found the ending. After loving the game so much and finding it so refreshing and engaging, the ending left such a bad taste that it kind of ruined the entire game for me retroactively and killed off any desire I may have had to revisit it, and consequently I haven't really thought about the game since. Your video has not only reminded me of what I loved about it and allowed me to relive a story I otherwise wouldn't have, but also did such a good job of explaining and contextualising the ending that I now feel a little silly for responding to it as negatively as I did. It's really given me a new perspective on the game - I may end up replaying it after all.
I looked up Campo Santo to see what they've done since. Apparently they were subsumed by Valve in 2018, and though they were at one point working on a title called In the Valley of Gods, all mention of that game has now been scrubbed. Other than Half-Life: Alyx, Valve has apparently decided that Campo Santo's creative storytelling prowess is best put to use working on auto-battler Dota Underlords, and... Steam. I love the games industry.
Talk about an unsatisfying end, eh?
What I felt about the ending of Firewatch was that none of the doubts I had about Delilah or the government spying on them were actually erased. With the heli ride at the end, I was still wondering if Delilah might have been spying on me for other reasons than her own curiosity. I think this sort of story writing in games helps the player become more mature, by forcing them to realize that life doesn't always have a clear end to any given situation. It teaches us to deal with unresolved emotions, among other things that are painfully bound to what being human is about...
I played Firewatch before and I must say the way you presented the story and ultimately its (arguably) unsatisfying ending was fantastic. Perfectly mirrors what one experiences on their first play-through.
I thoroughly enjoyed this video. This style of video essay is exactly the kind that I love watching. Thanks to the algorithm for suggesting but mostly to you for turning me into a brand new subscriber.
Can’t wait to watch more of your content.
i haven’t seen anything like these video essays on the platform. Your way of weaving one overarching story throughout smaller examples of whatever you’re writing about is so well done in every video. Been here since around 10k and i’m not leaving anytime soon. Keep it up man‼️
i'm not sure if anyone still remembers this game, but presentable liberty is the epitome of an unsatisfying ending. not because the ending is poor, but because it leaves you completely hopeless. you were the cure, trapped inside of the only room which could ever grant you peace and freedom, but unfortunately you learned these things just a day late.
Yes. Dear GOD I need to play that game again.
Presentable Liberty really is a one of a kind experience if you ask me.
this sounds really interesting, thanks for this comment gonna read up on it
The saddest thing of all is that the games creator killed himself I believe, or died in some way. It's sad to think that a dude who made one of the hardest hitting games I've ever seen or played having died like that.
@@darealrylocke6531 yes, he did commit suicide. it's extremely sad, because it was likely caused from all the failed kickstarters he had planned. it really is such a shame
Firewatch reminds me of my own life too well, that cold void you describe and the feeling of unsatisfaction
This is one of the reasons why the Stanley Parable is my favorite game, because there are so many endings, and no 'official' one. The player can choose what they want it to be, and how it should end.
The silly bird ending is my canon one
broom closet ending is better@@lolucorn1
Aw man I wish you had talked about SOMA, it’s a fun twist on this trend because it effectively has two endings that happen at once, one which is satisfying and one which is horribly unsatisfying and even scary.
Scary is an understatement
and funny enough they both have somewhat of the same structure in terms of lonliness, 2 people etc. both dialouges, especially from the actrees in soma and firewatch were phenomal and very natural in their delivery
God now I remember playing SOMA for myself (never completed it) and watching Mark play it. Definitely keep remembering when he mercy kills that whoever the fuck at the seafloor sand.
@@wormy7279 Yup, it's absolutely horrifying. When the ending was "happening" I had the most unpleasant case of a skin crawl. It was a great ending and I prefer it over Firewatch one.
@@Exel3nce I use to think they were the same actress considering how extremely similar their roles and accents are.
This video really had me engaged more than most episodes of tv shows. I have valuable, important things to do but I pushed them back to be able to continue and finish watching this video. I felt like it was worth it. I believe it was.
My problem with firewatch was less the ending itself and more how the game progresses. It feels like there was a bunch of content that just never made it into the game, stuff thats hinted at but never followed up on and then it just kinda ends in a few minutes with everything being explained away.
TRUE WHY IS NOONE TALKING ABOUT HOW THE GAME REALLY WASNT EVEN THAT GREAT..
@@pyromaniac999 Because it really was that great (:
@@fairsaa7975 it couldve been so much better
i remember playing this game over a year ago and it was such a great experience. for such a short and simple game that i finished in a night, it has always stuck with me. the game totally immersed me in the world. will always remember it.
Just played Firewatch today. I did not know a game that lasted 3-4 hours would impact me and scar me this much. The emptiness I feel is unmatched.
I have no idea how to feel about this. I feel conflicted. On one hand, yes this is art. Its beautiful in how unsatisfying it is and how it meticulously creates these layers on intrigue only to let it all fall down. That is just beautiful. But on the other, i hate it. I hate this sort of thing and hate that it'll stick with me forever. Chilidish or not, those good satisfying endings are better than what this offered me. And yet, I can't help but feel like this leans towards cynicism (which is the worstest thing by the way). Maybe thats just my emotions getting in the way of my critical thinking, but who cares. And after looking through my own feelings and thoughts I feel like a certain game does it best. Far : Lone Sails is a game where you're trying to get from point A to Point B. Plain and simple, using a sort of vehicle in order to do so. You get upgrades as you get further and encounter jaw-dropping sites all without knowing what your goal is. You see abandoned houses and deserted areas, making you believe that you're the last one left. And eventually, boom, your vehichle is completely cut in half. Unable to use fuel, you use the sail upgrade to slowly make your way to the end, opening and closing the sail to literally balance the vehichle on one wheel. And once you get there, its just a tower with a contraption on top. You put some fuel in, and it lights a fire. Thats it, a journey to just light a fire. But as the camera goes out, and night roles in, I realized something that cured my attitude. That fire is hope. Hope that someone will come, hope that you aren't the only one. Hope that there is someone out there. This hope is what encourages us to keep going. Its what helps us get through grief. Henry has to go back to the real world, but that doesn't mean he won't live it. Everyday we have a choice, even if its as simple as getting out of bed, its still a choice. And we make that choice everyday. Thank you for showing us this work of art that highlights the childishness of escaping reality. I'll face it, and I'll dance while doing it.
I don't know if I'd call myself a cynic per se, but I just want to say I found your comment funny. Not in the, "lol, you're lame" kind of way, but appreciable and maybe a bit ~naive~. I have to disagree with you about cynicism being the worst thing, I wholeheartedly believe that apathy is the worst feeling - a complete void of emotion and lack of connection with something just makes me feel like something is worthless and completely devoids me of any motivation.
I like your take on Far Lone Sails, it sounds like the opposite of what this video got out of Firewatch and the opposite of what Firewatch itself seems to want to portray while also utilizing similar design elements. An interesting dichotomy of game design.
@@AlHyckGaemsTAD Best comment I've seen. I believe that what we consider as worse than the other comes from entirely different perspectives l, hence why our different viewpoints, I feel as though cynicism still totally blows. Don't get me wrong, what you have described still is something terrible and I don't wish that on my worst enemy, I feel that cynicism is the spark that starts the road down to complete numbness. The belief that nothing matters and you can't do anything about it essentially bases itself on hopelessness. In my opinion, what you described is the outcome, whilst I described the source. Again, maybe I'm wrong, that can and will inevitably happen when discussing topics such as this, but I can't help but feel that the cause of this numbness is indeed worse.
Also, I'm glad others know about Far Lone Sails. It's a good little game.
@Dave Just Dave believing nothing matters no matter what is nihilism, not cynicism. Cynicism is believing that everyone does what they do for only themselves and their own reputation/gains.
@@SimonPetrikov12 Ah, got my things mixed up then, my bad!
@Dave Just Dave you're good lol. The only reason I know the difference is because of a show called Arby n Chief haha
Well that was a life changing experience. Watched while really high, and the way you put the end of firewatch and it actually clicked i was in tears
God I miss weed lmao
@@Eyezick-l5z it’s an interesting little plant
lmao glad you liked it
I believe the thematically best unsatisfying ending in any game was the one in Kane & Lynch 2: Dog Days.
The game is centered around the fact that you, the player, are both the cameramen and the puppeteer, filming and controlling two broken and unreedemable sociopaths struggle for survival against the entirety of Shangai underworld in the span of 48 hours of pure hell; it's kill or be killed and the only thing you do for 4 hours is shooting your way out increasingly desperate and hopeless situations; the only purpose to such violence is to escape Shangai.
In the end you shoot up an airport and rush to a departing airliner, Kane & Lynch hijack the plane, leaving you the cameramen behind, the plane takes off and the cameramen hastily turns off the camera, they have escaped for now and the Dog Days are over, the two men literally escape the story and there is nothing more to be filmed, cut to black and the credits roll, for the entirety of the game you only heard deafening gunfire, our characters swearing and the inhuman droning of the soundtrack only to be met with a calm chinese love ballad. All the bodies you piled up were purposeless, all the violence inferted and subjected meaningless, it is a game truly about how the banality of evil, and i can't stop thinking about it.
To me, the reason why I liked the Firewatch ending and hated TLoU2 ending is because in Firewatch, you still feel like you accomplished something. Like you said, it wasn't the ending we were hoping for, but it was A ending. We got to the bottom of the mystery, so imho, it was a good ending. We know that the bad stuff that has happened to Henry will still be right there, waiting to greet him, but sometimes, life is just like that, you know? Sometimes life just sucks. And in Henry's case, it sucks mostly because of things out of his control.
In TLoU2, on the other hand, it's frustrating because the things that make Ellie's ending such a shitty ending are a result of her own choices, and you don't ever get to make those choices for her. And we as the player are supposed to take the consequences of her own choices, while never being allowed a saying in those choices. She set out to avenge Joel, she killed half of the world to get in a position where she could finally have her revenge, and in the end.... she didn't. Because, after leaving piles and piles of bodies behind her, she wanted to "stop the cycle of violence and revenge". And at the end of the story, she lost Joel, she lost Dina, she lost their baby and she lost her fookin fingers, as well as the ability to play the guitar, consequently.
Firewatch's ending might be unsatisfying because people wanted a different resolution to the mystery, or to meet Delilah in person, and they might be right, but at least we know that the devs gave our boy Henry an okay ending. His struggles with life will continue, but he's good with that. TLoU2 ending is unsatisfying because to make a point that "revenge is bad and the cycle of violence should be stopped by whoever gets the chance", they turned their main character into a hypocrite. Ellie didn't simply gave up her goal of revenge. She failed it. She decided not to "cross the line" when she already was 10 kilometers beyond the line. At the end of the game, Ellie was nothing but a miserable, hypocrite failure. I looked at Ellie leaving through that window and thought "yeah, you're the worst protagonist to any story I've ever saw." And this is amplified by the fact that this is a videogame. We were supposed to be able to change her ending. To make better choices for her. But we couldn't. They didn't let us.
I don't necessarily think that just because games are interactive that it means that we should get to decide what ending happens. They clearly wanted Ellie to be her own character and not a puppet of the player, and that's why we don't get to make her most important decisions for her...but I think you did hit the nail on the head of what makes that ending so infuriating for people:
It didn't feel fitting. It felt like the game took the controller away and scolded you at the last minute, moralizing to you in a way that didn't feel believable.
You were absolutely right to say that they tried to say "killing Abby would be crossing the line" when you already know Ellie crossed that line AGES ago. There's no reason for her to stop now, it feels so artificial and forced. She would have done it. She killed so many other people to get there, after all, what's one more? I don't think she should have a HAPPY ending, it isn't happy at all, and even after all the revenge I think the message should still be that it wasn't really worth it in the end...but you can't have her murder people the whole game and then suddenly decide murder is bad and act like that message still works, it feels like a cheap cop-out to moralize at the player.
hmm thats true,.. ive hated the ending to firewatch for so long but youve got me thinking :v
@@ZeroKitsune Except we were actually supposed to have a choice at the end of TLOU2 though, and it was only scrapped towards the end of development because of Halley Gross deciding to do it
@@ZeroKitsune It isn’t saying that killing Abbie is crossing the line. Its Ellie realizing that she crossed that line so so long ago. Its her realizing that Joel wouldn’t have wanted this for her, Joel won’t come back from it, and that she is doing the same thing to Lev that Abbie did to her.
Why should you get to decide Ellie’s choices? Do you get mad that you don’t get to decide Macbeth’s choices when you read it watch other tragedies? Last of Us 2’s ending isn’t supposed to be satisfying to the player, it’s supposed to be cathartic for Ellie. I think as players we get so wrapped up and engrossed in the stories that we play that we begin to project our thoughts and desires onto the protagonists we play as, but it’s not about what we would find conventionally satisfying.
In the case of last of us 2, it’s about watching Ellie realize that killing Abby won’t give her what she really wants, which was the chance to reconcile with Joel. Her character arc comes to a fitting ending, as we go from seeing her believe that revenge is the way to cope with getting a chance at reconciliation with Joel taken from her, to seeing her reaping the psychological and physical consequences of this belief, to finally seeing her realize that revenge won’t give her what she ultimately desires, which is the chance to forgive joel.
I think conversely while Firewatch gives us a conclusion to the mystery, it is devoid of personal relation to Henry’s journey of grief and thus feels a lot more empty. I think this is because the only throughline between the central plot/mystery of the game and Henry’s character arc is the overarching theme of grief, but this doesn’t really ever interact with Henry’s personal story/character in any meaningful, tangible way.
Firewatch felt at its best when it was about the chemistry between Henry and Delilah. I wish that pseudo-mystery thing that happens in the 2nd half never happened; it took us away from that playful chemistry. For me, I do not remember this game for this "mystery plot", I remember it for the simpler things, about two people just bonding and getting to know each other, with faint hints of a possible romance. I once had an ex who I met kind of similarly, talking online for weeks and finally deciding to meet. So maybe thats partially the reason Firewatch hits so close for me haha. Delilah being absent in the end of the game just destroyed me, I felt bitter at Delilah, as if she never cared to meet at least once before leaving, even after everything that happened. No game has made me feel like that ever. This story was SO simple, so inconsequential, maybe thats why I love it so much. No saving the world, no fights, no fancy game mechanic. Just a story of two people getting close, and then it going nowhere, something that happens in a lot of potential romances. What a game.
Fire watch has one my favorite endings in a game ever. Easily in my top 5 story games of all time. The ending being unsatisfying opened up a genre that I didn't realize really existed. I will always love this game
Try what remains of Edith finch if you havent
@@Madflipthat is such a good story! I wish it got the recognition firewatch did.
i already know this is gonna be good
Man, this video reminds me how good Firewatch was. It's one of the few games I felt emotional after finishing no matter how bad the ending was. Sometimes I just want to go back to the first time playing it and experience the emotions all over again, but I somehow also never want to go back as the ending is finite. This makes it feel real but unsatisfying, but I'm just glad I got to experience it before saw I anyone play it. Thanks for the video.
I really appreciate that you clarify your stance on tlou 2 discourse at the end.
The ending that felt most unsatisfying in a game for me was Danganronpa v3. The reveal at the end felt so mean-spirited toward fans of the series, making you wonder if any of it-the hours you put into this game and the previous ones-was worth it at all. A lot of games have unsatisfying endings, but few have outright mean ones. Great video.
Jesus Christ Firewatch made me feel alive and concious of the people & time slipping by.
I’m not sure weather i would wanna play this game again for the first time or not at all to begin with…
it gives the same feeling you have when your pet dies and you thinks to yourself you will never be ready again to get another pet.
Anyways i’m glad i played this game and found your video years later.
Firewatch reply upset me when I finished it. As I let it sit, as i slept on it, I came to the same realization you did. Namely, that this is a reflection of real life. Grief doesn't go away because you figure out what's going on, or because you beat the bad guy, or because you escaped. That gratification was missing.
It was sad. I felt robbed. I was confused. Much like Henry did. But life went on.
This lesson, that a story doesn't have to be gratifying or satisfying too be beautiful and worth the telling or hearing, dramatically shaped my outlook on the media I consume, and how I deal with big emotions like grief. Basically, do the best you can as you keep on living, and look for the beauty in what you had while you had it.
this video is amazingly structured, and ironically the ending is extremely satisfying. thank you for this gem
the structure and some of the writing was straight out of a Jacob Geller video, and I mean that ten thousand percent as a compliment
First off, I liked the video. Interesting structure, good voice, good script, and I enjoyed watching.
That said, comparing Firewatch to TLOU2 is like comparing Your Lie In April to High Guardian Spice.
The problem with these "real world" stories, the ones that get it dead wrong in any case, about loss and grief is that grief, and life, isn't just a cold, empty, terrible feeling, but the people who write terribly conceived stories don't care. They want their audience to suffer, not for art, but just to suffer. There is no cold contempt for their own audience in Firewatch. There is nothing but contempt in TLOU2.
With Firewatch, we have a story told to near perfection, very subtly, about grief but also about how you build a perception of the world up, often out of almost nothing, and craft horror stories out of thin air to fill in gaps. It's not just a story about grief, it's a story about how you view the world, and how grief fits into that misconception idea. Grief is a single data point in a long story you know almost none of, and with it, you fill in gaps and the picture you paint is often a cold, terrible one. A horror story, through and through, that is based on a very small amount of information. Compared to the ghost stories we tell ourselves, reality is a bit more brutal, and a lot less interesting, and the end of Firewatch shows that beautifully. You *GAIN* something from Firewatch, because the people who made it knew what they were doing, and they were crafting a piece of art, not a political statement, nor a rebuke for their audience. They weren't trying to save the world or show that they were saving the world; they were just telling a story about how people shape their idea of the world, and how grief plays a big part in people's lives.
TLOU2 is a story about a bunch of murder hobos living in a post apocalyptic world where no one (it seems) follows their own rules, no one has any principles that really matter, no one is really evil (even though literally everyone is cruel and evil), no one is good, no one cares about actual justice (ostensibly because no one has the time or resources) but everyone cares about current year issues (even though no one should have the time or resources). No struggles mean anything, and nothing turns out well at all. Humanity is doomed, and no amount of singing and dancing in some hipster flannel party at the end of the world is going to change that. There are no lessons learned. There is no redemption, no revenge, nothing gained at all. A father loses his family, the woman who stole them both away loses them both, the man who raised her dies to a freak of nature, the freak of nature becomes a wasted weak person who never pays for her own crimes, the woman who refuses to kill her has nothing to go home to, no home at all, no ability to even play the song her surrogate father taught her, no way to preserve his memory, and no one at all (since she will never have children) to pass the stories on to. She has the cure for a disease that has destroyed the world, and she won't even pass that on nor will anyone likely ever even know now that she has that cure. Nothing matters. it could be a story about going down to the gas station for some beer only to find that they are closed for renovations, and the main character has to just go back to their crappy apartment because "isn't that just how the world is? Nothing ever works out."
It's a story about a hoarder who lived down the street from you that you only hear about after they die and someone has to call the authorities because of the terrible smell; full of things that seem significant to someone, but spending hours digging through the piles of crap only leaves you with a vague sense that someone, somewhere, was there and probably had some things in their head, and probably even cared about a great many things, but there's no connection to anything at all for you, and no one even cares enough to try and explain it to you.
It's several hours of random white noise, characters that are utterly inept or cartoonishly villainous... to the point where a regular person playing the game ends up shifting all of that antagonism to the people who made the game, rather than the characters in it. Just like with a hoarder, you don't end up hating the person who hoarded, you end up hating the massive pile of shit they left behind that you have to slog through. But if the hoarder is still around, and telling you you are the dumbest, worst, most ista-phobe-ism gamer word that ever gamer worded? That hatred of the hoard shifts to the person who created it.
Sure, we could say "it's a art" but TLOU2 doesn't qualify as well done art any more than the hoarder's stash qualifies as a treasure trove. There *may be* glittering diamonds in there amongst the old Chinese newspapers and rat droppings, but they are the exception, not the rule.
The only positive thing TLOU2 has given me is an appreciation for games that aren't it, and I don't think that was the intended function of the project.
A way out is the only game that ever made me cry at the end, just because over the course of the game, hearing Vincent and Leo talk and get to know each other gave me an attachment to both my character and also to leo, combined with the fact that the players know what has to happen in the final
Mission but neither wants it to. Even so, 10/10 game
This guy talks about the game I’m such a certain way that it really brings the story into perspective. his voice is calming, passive, and friendly, this makes the videos a lot more engaging and it’s awesome. Thank you
I felt like the General Knoxx armory DLC made a lot of things right with Borderlands 1. It finally gave us that epic vault of loot we'd all been hoping for.
I just discovered your channel last week and got to this video so I paused this, bought and played the game and now I’m back a day later lol
I feel like the question is, what is the point of stories as “a thing”? Why do we want to experience stories? Why do we keep going past the first page of a book?
When a story is unsatisfying, it means it didn’t fulfill those things. Those things weren’t *satisfied*. You can have a sad ending, or a dark ending to a story. But having no real ending that satisfies the story I to that point *is* bad.
I played Firewatch forever ago and felt the whole experience was pointless because there was no ending. Even if the point was “everything is void of meaning” or whatever, the character realising that and reflecting on what happened in the story would satisfy. Because there would be a point to experiencing those things.
The *reaction* would be the point of the story.
I’ve pretty much forgotten everything about Firewatch because it basically told me “This was a waste of time.” Maybe it had some sort of “button” on it-but from the video sounds like it really didn’t, in which case I stand by my point.
Amazing video. Amazing art and portray of art. Congrats on your huge success in the past few months, it is much deserved!
really like your non-linear approach to your videos, talking about one topic then switching to a different game and going back without notice. i really like video essays and i’m glad i found your channel, i really like your writing and speaking style
I would like to point out, my biggest problem with Firewatch will always be that the ending does not actually gel with the story told. Specifically, the paper we find that details the boy and his father going missing says there was an exhaustive search of the area for weeks, before they were considered lost. That makes sense, and is what is supposed to happen.
Now, Daddy being able to hide himself, and not waiting anything to do with people anymore makes sense. But then we get to both how his son died, and more importantly, the locked area of the cave. That bridge, which I will remind you is noted to go out sometimes, and would have been out when the search teams arrived, was repaired not by daddy, but by the people after him.
This means that at no point in 3 years did anyone decide, 'hey, maybe we should check the cavern below the bridge for the missing person?' because dad never once moved the son's body, he just left it there, too ashamed to face it.
In a narrative sense, it kind of works, tragedy and maybe showing that the 'exhaustive' search was nothing of the sort. But everything else implies they weren't lying, and somehow just missed his body down there during those weeks.
It feels cheap, like a plot point that doesn't work, but is there solely for the twist. And it killed my enjoyment of the game beforehand, as that was the last memory I was left with.
I don't understand why he was fooling around in the research camp either, or why he sets it ablaze. And also how the researchers didn't notice him there.
@@JewTube001 Eh, dark woods make it easy to get around. Remember, this is not modern times, where setting up motion sensitive cameras and the like would be relatively cheap and easy. These people are likely running on a budget that barely gets them two cameras and a grad student.
That said, him setting it ablaze only makes sense if you take the view that he IS crazy by now, and has little to know grasp on reality, merely seeing the researchers as intruders in HIS woods. That said, someone that crazy is probably going to be all but dead in a month, let alone three years.
The area has plenty of game and water, to be fair, but none of it would be healthy enough to keep a man in good condition, as the water would be unfiltered, and the food would have to be uncooked, otherwise he would have been found before now, given campfires are one of the things you're there to look for.
exactly. finishing firewatch felt like watching a movie, and being told the whole thing was a dream at the end,..
Exactly it made the whole game feel pointless
Great video. I ended up gaining a new perspective on Firewatch, a deeper understanding of the emptiness I felt after rhe credits rolled. However, respectively, I have to disagree about the inclusion of Part 2, as, unlike with Firewatch, Ghosts n' Goblins, and COD Black Ops 1 and 2, the contradiction of Ellie's motivations at the end, which aren't really consistent with the narrative, don't just illicit a feeling of emptiness within the player, but also hollow out the game itself in the end. When the writers had the opportunity to go all the way and commit to the character _they_ created, they faltered; they couldn't muster up the courage to pull the trigger. To commit to a logically consistent dark tone. If the writers couldn't trust us to make that choice or simply wanted a linear experience, like the developers of Ghosts n' Goblins, they should've gone all the way, showing the true extent of revenge and its consequences. I mean, think about it: Had Ellie gone through with drowning Abbie on that shore, seeing the former back at the farm house, two fingers missing, and no family, we would've seen the consequences of her decisions in full. Yet, because she sought mercy, or some form of redemption, going back to an empty house doesn't really make sense, narratively speaking. Either way, it doesn't really make sense why Dina would leave such an isolated, self-sustaining, _beautiful_ home, but I digress. The Last of Us Part 2 _is_ art, yes. I wouldn't say it's well-written or well-crafted, as the emptiness _I_ felt didn't correlate with the game's narrative whatsoever. I was more frustrated than anything else, and that feeling didn't stick with me for long.
Honestly, I think Dark Souls 1 would make for a better example. As we later discovered in the 3rd entry, restoring the flame in Lordran only prolonged the inevitable. Lothric still fell and, once again, a fire keeper resurrected warriors to restore the flame just a _little bit longer,_ prolonging the Age of Fire to no greater end but perpetual decay, decline, and rot. Ironically enough, because of the consequences of choosing martyrdom in Lordran and fulfilling the prophecy, we've unintentionally doomed the world to hollow further. We've denied everyone, the undead especially, an end to their suffering. And all of it was shown throughout the game. Even Solar and Siegfried, two of the jolliest people in Lordran, eventually succumb to despair. So, what's left? An Age of Darkness, so that one day a new fire may rise from the ashes once more. Of course, choosing self-preservation isn't as satisfying as being the hero your prophesized to be. Why wouldn't it? After all, considering all the hardship you went through to reach the end, why betray your goal? From a gameplay _and_ narrative perspective, it makes sense. Without the hindsight Dark Souls 2 and 3 give us, there's no reason _not_ to "play the hero" and "save" the day. That's what _meaningful_ unsatisfaction looks like, in my opinion, because From Software committed to a consistent tone and narrative throughout the entire trilogy. That, to me, signifies a piece of well-crafted art. One that makes those feelings of emptiness very meaningful.
I think you missed a lot of Ellie's character development. Her refusal to kill Abby at the end made perfect sense to me and tied the whole thing together. You talk about showing the truth of revenge and its consequences, but just because Ellie didn't actually Abby... there are still consequences. She left Dina, and Dina didn't want to live there alone, so Dina went back to Jackson. That's a perfectly logical consequence. The narrative doesn't have to explicitly reward every act it considers good; there are other ways to communicate that. I'd love to discuss Ellie's character arc in more detail if you're up to it.
I hate the idea that sparing the big bad guy is somehow some sort of good moral choice in movies and games especially superhero movies. Forget about the hundreds of nameless cronies killed along the way as long the person responsible for all the mayhem lives then it’s good. If anything they are the only person who absolutely should die
I hoped that you ended where you did with your essay; good stuff. Games like Firewatch, The Beginner's Guide, and Disco Elysium are my absolute favorites. A game's ability to put you in the shoes of its protagonist and make you experience directly what they are going through is an avenue that's not explored enough yet. Video games are the next frontier in story telling, and with these titles, the games industry is dipping its toes in tragedy, reflecting ourselves back at us. You mentioned that you didn't quite know what it was that attracted you to these titles, perhaps catharsis is the answer. Keep it up.
3 of my favourite narrative games as well!
Henry always looked like a shorter, less muscular Saxton Hale in my mind.
My disappointment is immeasurable, and my day is ruined.
thank you now i will never unsee that
SAXTON HAAAAAAALLLLLEEEEEEE
I’m sorry I couldn’t stop laughing how to transition from firewatch to borderlands one caught me off guard😂
I'm glad the joke landed lol
I honestly barely even had the hope of actually meeting Delilah in the game. I feel like games with no mirrors or any visible characters outside of your hands have become way too obvious in the fact that the devs didnt make any character models (at least for close up conversation). Thats fine except when a game is trying to make you think youre going to meet someone face to face.
Firewatch was beautiful the amount of anxiety I felt walking in the dark in the game was so scary and the tragic plot twist
I think one of the best parts about games that have unsatisfying endings to me is that they're so much more realistic, at least in the sense of how endings turn out in reality. Endings more often than not aren't satisfying in real life, something ends and that's that. You're never guaranteed closure, you're never guaranteed anything. Something as passionate and bright as an inferno sweeping over a mountain can just disappear, seemingly out of nowhere and it won't let you get more out of it, it's already gone. There's nothing more to see, there's no continuation to the story, there's just a bitter absence of something more intriguing that you're left with.
i love how games manage to give me heartache, i’ve never felt the kind of physical pain i get with games over other mediums like tv shows or movies or books, it’s that sort of interactive model that makes it so strong for me, i love it so much
I want you to know that I think you are a genius. Your nonlinear editing, stroytelling and Explanation and ideas. It truly is genius, because i have never seen anything like it. I realy like it. You see games as art. its realy good
This video was in my recommended for a couple weeks and I kept avoiding it because I both like firewatch and was afraid it would just be more shitting on the last of us 2. So glad I finally clicked. What a wonderful commentary on endings in video games and media.
I'm glad you enjoyed!
Fire watch had a great end for me, it entered the character as someone in the middle of his life with a mid life crisis, then we get to see his brief break from it all, then after that his life will go on away from the player. Felt really good for me, kind of having a sense of your never really gonna know the end of a certain situation in life.
The ending to borderlands kind of reminds me of the ending to Skyrim, after beating Alduin, the one thing the entire game has worked up to, the people in Sovngarde kind of just give you on a pat on the back, say well done, and then just send you back to Tamriel
Firewatch was a masterpiece of a game. I never thought of it as about grief but it makes more sense to me. In my opinion, Firewatch tries to emphasize the loneliness when grieving alone, in the forest, by yourself. There's no one there with you. You don't see the teenagers faces, you don't see the man who attacked you, you don't see the man's face in the helicopter who rescued you, and you don't even get to see Delilah. You ARE alone, no matter how many people you're surrounded by, you don't know anyone. If you ask me? It's true loneliness.
Haven't seen anyone bring this up so I thought I'd mention, even if I'm just coming back to this video & it's probably too late:
It is interesting that you mention that killing Menendez has to be the canon ending as (I don't know if you knew this or not but) it is the canonical ending; Raul dies, Cordis Die riots begin & then they soon die out, that's pretty much it.
You wanna know how you find out? In Black Ops 3, there is a terminal in the campaign's various hub which you can access which operates somewhat similar to the one found in Black Ops 1 - you can find out various information about the Black Ops world before & after BO2. Included in this is the failure of the Cordis Die revolution and it is explained that most of Menendez's supporters saw it as an act of cowardice rather then the will of a Martyr or something like that. It was written off to support a new narrative for BO3. Turns out the true unsatisfactory ending to BO2 was hidden away a niche corner of BO3
I played Firewatch in my senior year of high school, which is when I also had to read Jane Eyre for my literature class. Needless to say, I was shocked to find that one of the books you could find in the game was Jane Eyre, but looking back on it after watching this video I've come to appreciate its inclusion. At first, I saw the connection between both Jane running away to Whitcross and Henry running away to Shoshone Park and thought that Jane Eyre's inclusion was to make a point about how our first instinct is to run away from our problems, as both Jane ultimately returns to Rochester and Henry is forced to go back home to Colorado. But after watching your video, I feel like Jane Eyre was included to just poke fun at the fantasy of the release running away could have. Jane Eyre ultimately ends with Jane returning back to Rochester on the basis of a coincidence in which they both envisioned Jane returning and even when Jane does return, it just so happens that Jane has an equivalent financial status to Jane, Rochester is blinded and needs a caretaker and that Bertha Mason is dead. When compared to the harsh reality portrayed in Firewatch and what you mentioned about just being left with nothing, I feel like I can only scoff at the events of Jane Eyre as a child-like fantasy. I don't know if you'll read this but I really loved this video and I hope everything is working out for you 👍