Having read the Odyssey before HOO, I remember just feeling sad for Calypso. Not only she’s forced to spend eternity on an island with only men as company (no offense to men of course), she is forced to be hopelessly in love with them leading to a never ending cycle of rejection and isolation. So when I read HOO, I was excited to see Leo come to Ogygia and potentially rescue Calypso or very least be her friend as he’s one of my favorite characters, along with the fact that both Leo and Calypso share the same conflict regarding rejection and isolation. But when Riodan decided to pair them up and make them at odds with each other in TOA, I just felt disappointed as not only Calypso and Leo’s arcs were rushed through Caleo, HOO lost a chance to have a deep and meaningful friendship that HOO was severely lacking in. Either way, my main ship with Calypso and Leo is friendship and happiness.
Honestly Calypso's attitude change in HOO was at least justified by the fact that this is the 4th time she has to deal with this even after Percy asked for her freedom. Less justified in Trials. I feel like Rick figured he'd do something similar to Percabeth but forget their bickering was a very small part of the relationship. Maybe the break they take away from each other will sort things out. Either they both change for the better and give things another shot or part ways. Either way a solo Leo book about him learning he doesn't need a relationship to help his self-esteem would be great.
@@Unclaimeddemigod I mean, she did such a good job with Nico. It would be ironic that the two characters people shipped before they even met would be headlining a standalone book in an entirely platonic way.
@@thebeavpercabethftw9604 I think it's too late for a solo Leo book about not needing a relationship; Rick went in the complete opposite direction to what he should have; so unless He has a time machine ;)
@@jasongrace5117 Don't see why it's too late. Leo can always have the realization that he thought what would make him happy is a romantic relationship and that it isn't the case. Especially since he and Calypso are on break.
Ahh, I'm so excited for everyone to watch this. We had a lot of fun talking about this relationship and now I just want to talk about them all with Celia - absolute legend! Enjoy the video everyone!
Leo calling Calypso "mamacita" made me cringe sooo much when I first read ToA! At first I thought it was a very wrong translation (like the Spanish translator trying to use slang or something), but then I read the English version and was like "oooh no, you didn't do that". But what annoyed me a lot more is that (before Reyna), it did not occur to anyone to correct Leo in that. I think that is why she was so shocked when she heard him, kind of like "How did you all let this slide all this time?!" Putting myself in his shoes, I think there could have been a lot of reasons for him to behave like that. The first and more obvious is that he grown up without his mom. Although it doesn't justify it, it really shaped Leo's personality and behaviour. Another reason, highly linked to that one, could be the language difference. Leo grew up speaking both English and Spanish mixed up (something very common in Mexican-American kids) and this could lead to mislead some words for others when changing languages. I'm not Mexican-american, but I've noticed that when I'm trying to change between languages, sometimes words that have a casual meaning in one language could mean overall the same in the other, but not with the same level of "formality". Again, this doesn't justify him using them, but no one informed him about it! Leo grew up in the streets of Texas, foster care and a correctional facility, so is highly probably that he heard those words in particular contexts that made him believed that it was right to use them. Anyway, when Reyna step on the game and become the older sister he needed, that made me so happy.
I just looked at the translation, and oh my gods. I'm so glad that Reyna corrected him on that. 💀 This is what it said : "The literal translation of mamacita is "little mother" but the figurative and more accurate translation is "hot momma." The moniker is never really used to describe an actual mother, a genuine mamá or mamita. Instead, the word is inextricably linked to a man's perception of a woman as an object of sexual desire."
I feel like another reason why Caleo happened was to prove that Leo could be a hero and save someone for once. For all his life, Leo couldn’t save his loved ones, all of whom can be seen as damsels in distress, whether that be his mom or Echo. So with Leo saving Calypso, the ultimate damsel in distress in the Riodanverse, Leo gets to redeem himself for being unable to save his mom and Echo while also achieving the hero narrative by getting the girl in the end. However, I feel that a more interesting take on this would be to have Leo rescue Calypso simply by being her friend, thus breaking the curse. This way Leo realizes that he can be a hero just by being himself, motivating him to protect those he cares about, like the Seven. So when Leo and Calypso sail off into the unknown, he promises on the River Styx that he’ll do anything to protect his friends, which he accomplishes through his sacrifice during the battle with Gaea. With this take, not only Leo and Calypso gain a relationship (romantic or not) out of mutual understanding and empathy, it also subverts the hero trope of getting the girl by having Caleo be platonic, makes Leo’s sacrifice more impactful as it was a way for him to save his loved ones successfully, along with solidifying Leo as a hero, the type of hero who would fall on Calypso’s island in the first place.
17:00 U said what I was thinking in my mind First become friends, best friends and slowly love each other and come in relation It is the best way of making unbreakable love
So that's what the polls were about. It was an interesting discussion. Still dont 100% agree, but you both raised interesting points. I think we can all agree that Rayna is awesome, so I'm satisfied
You know instead of Rick yeeting calypso into the story, he should have yeeted grover! Leo could have gotten teleported to Grover (the gods may consider Grover weak). Then Leo and Grover could have became friends, and Grover could help Leo realize that he doesn’t need approval from a girl, self love is important. This would have been so much better and then Grover and Percy could have reunited.. omg WHY DIDNT U DO THIS RICK?!
I feel like some of the people on the polls, at least one person doesn't like caleo because they wanted Leo (a fictional person) to be their boyfriend lol
personally, i LOVED the ship at the beginning. but later onwards, just like fran said, there is so little of calypso in the ship, that it just doesnt seem like one y'know. but i know for a fact that they have tremendous potential, because like cmon, it was just wrong timing for them all the time. leo was pretty self aware about the problems the relationship faced in the dark prophecy, like how he himself said it faced a lot of issues right at the start. other ships, if you look at them (te main ones at least) percabeth literally took 4-5 years to finally get together. frazel had gone from friends to lovers and like that hardly goes wrong, and jasper was just shit so we're not gonna talk about that. even solangelo had time to have a safe space to grow in, and all the while , they had a TEAM to rely on for any kind of problem- relationship or danger based. and since caleo lacked that, because nobody knew anything about them in the slightest, they had to be independent from the very beginning. now i know it might be like, ohh but if they were truly compatible they wouldnt have problems. and thats the thing. they did have problems, but they werent big enough for them to break up. you tell me a couple doesnt fight at all, i wont believe you. (frankly, solangelo is the only ship that feels real at this point, but i wont complain. why pick fights when there cannot be?) everybody goes through disagreements. caleo having no safe space just aggravated that. and like new relationship, tons of fights with monsters, not staying in a single space for more than a night (for calypso especially, considering she didnt move for 3000 years and then suddenly is moving around all the time is A BIG AF CHANGE) but still staying together is just speaking potential. another thing about the whole age gap thing, i'll have to respectfully disagree with everyone who thinks that that's an issue, because frankly, in her case( because she doesnt age physically) age only refers to her experience of the world. and calypso was ISOLATED from the world for at least 3 millennia? (i think ) her experience count is exactly 0. she didnt know what an apartment was you guys, shes basically a newborn for the modern world. besides that, she had no interaction with mortals in years. so technically, her age is an issue only if you think about it chronologically, because like how in the world can a person age mentally if you are not interacting with anybody?? if her chronological age was ALSO an issue, then i dont see how people can still ship solangelo and frazel without getting the icks. cal is basically just a foetus that swam around the womb, for a long time, thought a lot, and fell in love a couple times. so i dont think its an issue. and besides, she turns mortal afterwards, so problem in the power dynamic. she has awesome windy powers and leo has awesome fire powers. also, last part, if you've stayed with me this long, i applaud you, because this is just a rant lol, leo did become super stupid in toa. and maybe its because of inexperience of being in a relationship, but that doesnt really excuse being called mamacita, especially if cal didnt like it. but i truly believe that leo can grow through in this relationship and only become better, because its kind of obvious hes stupid about a lot of stuff on the first try. and the entire thing abt leo losing his past story after meeting cal is bull, no offense, because we never got his pov after boo. in BoO, he still gave up his life for the quest, and yelled at gaia that he did it for his mom. so yeah, his past is there, we just cant see it because he doesn't talk about it openly unless its his pov. their character arcs were rushed, true, but we can keep an open mind about character development and give this a try- instead of them having character dev individually, they acn just go through it together as a couple, because in a healthy relationship, you grow and learn together. so i can only hope that after the cal goes to summer camp thing, things go for the better, because we obviously saw leo realising his mistake and regretting it. and maybe see a little bit more of calypso?? cuz she was downplayed yall. that was all from my side. thank you for listening to my ted talk.
15:20-17:20 exactly my point for Calypso people have several reasons for not liking Caleo; resons related mostly to leo(casually ignoring Calypso) My only reasons for not liking Caleo
The first time I watched this video I completely disagreed, but after I reread the books I realized how toxic it was and I love Leo but I just don’t think they were right for each other. In TOA especially, it seemed like Leo was putting in a lot more effort
i think it would have been better is leo had brought calypso back the first time on ogygia because then calypso would be able to find herself easier she could get advice from the girls on the argo 2 and the tension between percy annabeth and her would be hilarious
In my opnion, Caleo isn´t THAT toxic but sometimes is REALLY problematic. Talking about the age diference, I agree with you guys, but I don´t understand whay most fans fro the Riordanverse hate the age diference of caleo but don´t complain about it in Sadie Kane and Anubis relationship.
People *do* complain about the age difference in Anubis and Sadie Kane. I've seen people say it's gross and predatory, which is why I apply the same thinking to Caleo. It's gross, forced, and they struggle to work as a couple.
i really respect ur opinion n i really love u(i've subscribed ;) but many times in this video i thot that u were kind of making fun of Caleo n the shippers.. (not saying dat cuz i'm a shipper..i really liked the points u put up)
7:45 spoiler for kane chroniclee but Anubis and sadie are shipped by kane chronicles fanbase and loved everybody likes it more the saide and walt really
Ok but I feel like the friend things with Calypso would’ve been cool to see, honestly I see it like a Penelope and Wreck it Ralph friendship. Maybe Leo doesn’t need to swear or even mention the river styx and instead to bring Calypso on their side of the war, he saids he can free her from the island. Calypso being the skeptic because she was on the other side before. And him being a demigod. Calypso : “NEWS FLASH- Leo : “What?” Calypso : “ NONE OF US ARE GETTING WHAT WE WANT😭” Honestly it’s just a funny and fun thought 😂 And Also, I really hope they change things around, one idea I have for Khione, is that instead of a love interest or something, maybe she can be a foil to Calypso, and Also, it can be that Calypso can be a reflection of his Mother or make a better reason why He wants to take her off the island is that Yea their best friends, but he doesn’t want to loose someone in his life. In fact, she make him an actual Selfless Hero who doesn’t want to loose anyone he cares about and even a conflict of other people going through the same thing he went through. Go further into that, make Soemthing changes and I think it will be good. But yea that’s just me.
well no offense, but are you really going to consider age and immortal dating mortal as a fact in a story based on Greek mythology where literally everyone is dating whoever they like. as for the age gap and fighting in relationship part let me remind you of Hades kidnapping Persephone and her literally crying for days to go back but slowly she came around and everyone likes them. Also immortal duse loving mortal girl? Hades was intent on keeping Maria di Angelo alive after 2 children , if that's not more than a single fling ,I don't know what is. In all honesty , it is less forced than Jasper who we don't see how they got around, we only got Piper saying there will be time to get in a relationship with him , while in Caleo's case , they ended up with Calypso kiss Leo before he left Ogygia to save the world(Much like Annabeth kissing Percy when they parted so that Percy could save the world . and another parallel between these two seens is that Percy thought that Annabeth was about to punch him and calyspso said she hated him before she kissed him. And both scenes happen in their respective 4th book)
I don't like Calypso at all because she loved Percy and my heart is with Percabeth. I know she was forced to and stuff but she cursed Annabeth (or was it Percy) and that is just not it💁🏻♀️💁🏻♀️😅😅 I don't like that Calypso got included in the HoO series
I don't like Calypso but for me, it's not because she loved Percy. I'm a Percabeth fan yes, but if it were real, she wouldn't be able to control those feelings. I don't like Calypso because she is a jerk to Leo and only loved him because he could get her off the island. People say "Oh she was hurt so many times" as an excuse for her rude actions but it can't be excused! You can't excuse being a jerk. I liked her in BotL but in HoO and ToA? I couldn't deal with her. I just couldn't like her. I don't like Calypso and I don't like Caleo and that's my opinion. The person reading this doesn't have to agree. If you like Calypso and Caleo then that's fine. I'm just sharing what I think.
I feel like Caleo is simmered down because of magic and Calypso probably turned 16 when she gave up titan-hood, or she was already still 16 because gods stop aging in their 20s or 30s to keep their youth (I know they can choose forms, im talking about their human disguises and their true form), or because of Ogygia's weird time. In the wiki it even states, "According to Percy, it was difficult to tell whether she was 15 or 16 due to her timeless features, but he found her to be "twice as brilliant" as the stars, and far more beautiful than even Aphrodite herself, for she seemed more natural." So, it isn't the worst ship. LUKABETH AND MEGPOLLO ON THE OTHER HAND, IS JUST PLAIN WEIRD! I feel like Leo and Calypso should get there own book together to tye up some loose ends and toxicity in there relationship. Also, if Calypso is still over 4000 years old, maybe make the book take place when Leo is 18 so it isn't weird. (I know it's stated she is 16 biologically or something (can't remember) but that only makes it a little better)
I argee with a lot of this, but i just finished reading TOA and i noticed Calypso body shames Leo SO MUCH. litterally so damn much for being very underweight. she called him unattractive to his face multiple times. I can see where Leo doesn't respect Calypso. but come on, i do not think she respects him at all either. i truely hope that after TOA off screen, Leo and Calypso break up and just move on, becuase it did not work, honey
I agree. Caleo are terrible toward each other and need to break up. I wanted Calypso to join the hunters, honestly. She doesn't love him. She loves the idea of being saved and loved so much she puts up with him.
I'm the biggest Caleo hater, honestly. It was creative to bring in Calypso, but I don't think it was executed correctly. I kept expecting her to become a hunter, as well, and expecting her to leave because she's been scorned and love only hurt her. She only bickered with him. She only disliked him in HOO and viewed him as an inconvenience. She's not attracted to him. She may love him, but the attraction isn't there.
I guess its fine. We can't really tell if it pedophilia because we dont know if Calypso is 4000 or 16 because of Ogygia's weird time. In the books and wiki it explains that Calypso gave up titan-hood after leaving the island, which probably means she became the age she looks (16). Also, if she did age, wouldn’t she be dead after giving up titan-hood? Also also, Nico is biologically in his 80s, yet is dating Will. I’m not saying I support adult and kid relationships. Also, isn’t Odysseus the pedo for sleeping with Calypso. I know she tried coming onto him in most variations, but he should’ve known better to sleep with her. He didn’t even love her! He did it for his own lustful desires! I think Leo needs his own book, where him and Calypso work things out! (and also maybe Rick should put some indications that she is 16 because she gave up immortality and didn’t die.) Also, it did state they are rude to each other, but think about how many times couples fight but eventually talk through it. It did state in the wiki that some of Leo’s friends said they think it will get better. P.S it is kinda forced. That's why I think Leo needs his own book. BUT, THAT'S JUST A THOERY! A GREEK THOERY!
I feel like Leo only acts the way he does because he dosn't respect Piper or Calypso but to cover up hi's insecurity around people. He shows a grate deal of care for Calypso and hi's friend (have not read all the triles of apollo). Alos Calypso is not curest to fal in love with every man that end upp on her island bud the gods send people she can't help but fal in love with (if i remember corectly long time sens i las read the books). Thats whay Kyone sent Leo to Calypsos island, because she that Calypso would never fall in love with him.
I guess the ship is kinda fine. We can't really tell if it pedophilia because we dont know if Calypso is 4000 or 16 because of Ogygia's weird time. In the books and wiki it explains that Calypso gave up titan-hood after leaving the island, which probably means she became the age she looks (16). Also, if she did age, wouldn’t she be dead after giving up titan-hood? Also also, Nico is biologically in his 80s, yet is dating Will. I’m not saying I support adult and kid relationships. Also, isn’t Odysseus the pedo for sleeping with Calypso. I know she tried coming onto him in most variations, but he should’ve known better to sleep with her. He didn’t even love her! He did it for his own lustful desires! I think Leo needs his own book, where him and Calypso work things out! (and also maybe Rick should put some indications that she is 16 because she gave up immortality and didn’t die.) Also, it did state they are rude to each other, but think about how many times couples fight but eventually talk through it. It did state in the wiki that some of Leo’s friends said they think it will get better. P.S it is kinda forced. That's why I think Leo needs his own book. Also the wiki says "According to Percy, it was difficult to tell whether she was 15 or 16 due to her timeless features, but he found her to be "twice as brilliant" as the stars, and far more beautiful than even Aphrodite herself, for she seemed more natural." So, she might be 16 and didn't age once she hit 16 (maybe her aging process stopped at a certain time like most gods, since gods don't truly age). But, I feel like it's 50/50. People have mixed opinions if it's good or not. Calypso does argue with Leo and jabs him in the kidneys, but arguing is normal in couples and him getting jabbed in the kidneys is probably teasing. It's not like he's getting hit in the ribs with a fist. Besides, Leo is 2 years away from becoming 18, probably is 17-18 by The Sun and The Star, which would cause it to no longer be pedophilia if Calypso is still over 4000. (Age of consent in New York is 17+ I believe)
I think both Leo and Calypso are disrespectful to each other, but couple will be couples. I don't think they are toxic. They just argue a lot. Thats not really toxic compared to other relationships out there.
I personally think it was a cute ship, sorta toxic, yes, but I think it has potential it just wasn't put on paper the way/the way it was imagined in Ricks head. But I think if the Disney plus series gets that far they could really develope Calypso into a more dynamic character. I feel like it would be hard to do because of her being isolated on and Island and stuff, but if in the show if they gave her a bigger part in the battle and maybe gives important advice in The Battle Of The Labrynth to Percy that sticks with him or something like that. Make references of her show up often and give her her own character. And about the age thing, for one of wouldn't be like Leo dating Demeter or smth bc Calypso is not a god, but a demi-titan (so like same for Leo). And time doesn't work the same on her island, although in the real-world she is thousands of years old, on her island she is a teen in her own way. Idk, just my opinion
I don't see why you would ship something you think is toxic, though. We all know it's toxic, so why bother with it? They are disrespectful towards each other and don't seem to actually love each other. Calypso loves that Leo saved her and broke her curse, but she doesn't find him attractive or love him as a person. I say cut off the Hydra head before it multiples and gets worse.
bro this is a offical ship between them. the author put them in a relationship. and i dont know why they have to talk about it. and even if the genders were reversed it would still be ok because calypso would still look 15.
It doesn’t really matter what you look like if you have eons of life experience over your life partner (who can’t even legally drink and is barely old enough to legally drive!)
Having read the Odyssey before HOO, I remember just feeling sad for Calypso. Not only she’s forced to spend eternity on an island with only men as company (no offense to men of course), she is forced to be hopelessly in love with them leading to a never ending cycle of rejection and isolation. So when I read HOO, I was excited to see Leo come to Ogygia and potentially rescue Calypso or very least be her friend as he’s one of my favorite characters, along with the fact that both Leo and Calypso share the same conflict regarding rejection and isolation. But when Riodan decided to pair them up and make them at odds with each other in TOA, I just felt disappointed as not only Calypso and Leo’s arcs were rushed through Caleo, HOO lost a chance to have a deep and meaningful friendship that HOO was severely lacking in.
Either way, my main ship with Calypso and Leo is friendship and happiness.
Honestly Calypso's attitude change in HOO was at least justified by the fact that this is the 4th time she has to deal with this even after Percy asked for her freedom. Less justified in Trials. I feel like Rick figured he'd do something similar to Percabeth but forget their bickering was a very small part of the relationship. Maybe the break they take away from each other will sort things out. Either they both change for the better and give things another shot or part ways. Either way a solo Leo book about him learning he doesn't need a relationship to help his self-esteem would be great.
@@Unclaimeddemigod I mean, she did such a good job with Nico. It would be ironic that the two characters people shipped before they even met would be headlining a standalone book in an entirely platonic way.
@@thebeavpercabethftw9604 I think it's too late for a solo Leo book about not needing a relationship; Rick went in the complete opposite direction to what he should have; so unless He has a time machine ;)
@@jasongrace5117 Don't see why it's too late. Leo can always have the realization that he thought what would make him happy is a romantic relationship and that it isn't the case. Especially since he and Calypso are on break.
@@jasongrace5117 actually it’s not too late,after Tower of Nero it makes perfect sense for a stand-alone Leo book
Ahh, I'm so excited for everyone to watch this. We had a lot of fun talking about this relationship and now I just want to talk about them all with Celia - absolute legend! Enjoy the video everyone!
Leo calling Calypso "mamacita" made me cringe sooo much when I first read ToA! At first I thought it was a very wrong translation (like the Spanish translator trying to use slang or something), but then I read the English version and was like "oooh no, you didn't do that". But what annoyed me a lot more is that (before Reyna), it did not occur to anyone to correct Leo in that. I think that is why she was so shocked when she heard him, kind of like "How did you all let this slide all this time?!"
Putting myself in his shoes, I think there could have been a lot of reasons for him to behave like that. The first and more obvious is that he grown up without his mom. Although it doesn't justify it, it really shaped Leo's personality and behaviour. Another reason, highly linked to that one, could be the language difference. Leo grew up speaking both English and Spanish mixed up (something very common in Mexican-American kids) and this could lead to mislead some words for others when changing languages. I'm not Mexican-american, but I've noticed that when I'm trying to change between languages, sometimes words that have a casual meaning in one language could mean overall the same in the other, but not with the same level of "formality". Again, this doesn't justify him using them, but no one informed him about it! Leo grew up in the streets of Texas, foster care and a correctional facility, so is highly probably that he heard those words in particular contexts that made him believed that it was right to use them.
Anyway, when Reyna step on the game and become the older sister he needed, that made me so happy.
Idk, Leo does some crazy things in the name of flirting; I blame Rick🤐
I just looked at the translation, and oh my gods. I'm so glad that Reyna corrected him on that. 💀
This is what it said :
"The literal translation of mamacita is "little mother" but the figurative and more accurate translation is "hot momma." The moniker is never really used to describe an actual mother, a genuine mamá or mamita. Instead, the word is inextricably linked to a man's perception of a woman as an object of sexual desire."
I feel like another reason why Caleo happened was to prove that Leo could be a hero and save someone for once. For all his life, Leo couldn’t save his loved ones, all of whom can be seen as damsels in distress, whether that be his mom or Echo. So with Leo saving Calypso, the ultimate damsel in distress in the Riodanverse, Leo gets to redeem himself for being unable to save his mom and Echo while also achieving the hero narrative by getting the girl in the end. However, I feel that a more interesting take on this would be to have Leo rescue Calypso simply by being her friend, thus breaking the curse. This way Leo realizes that he can be a hero just by being himself, motivating him to protect those he cares about, like the Seven. So when Leo and Calypso sail off into the unknown, he promises on the River Styx that he’ll do anything to protect his friends, which he accomplishes through his sacrifice during the battle with Gaea. With this take, not only Leo and Calypso gain a relationship (romantic or not) out of mutual understanding and empathy, it also subverts the hero trope of getting the girl by having Caleo be platonic, makes Leo’s sacrifice more impactful as it was a way for him to save his loved ones successfully, along with solidifying Leo as a hero, the type of hero who would fall on Calypso’s island in the first place.
Bravo. Couldn’t have said this better.
17:00
U said what I was thinking in my mind
First become friends, best friends and slowly love each other and come in relation
It is the best way of making unbreakable love
So that's what the polls were about. It was an interesting discussion. Still dont 100% agree, but you both raised interesting points. I think we can all agree that Rayna is awesome, so I'm satisfied
@@Unclaimeddemigod Indeed. I still maintain that she is arguably the most powerful demigod in the franchise
You know instead of Rick yeeting calypso into the story, he should have yeeted grover! Leo could have gotten teleported to Grover (the gods may consider Grover weak). Then Leo and Grover could have became friends, and Grover could help Leo realize that he doesn’t need approval from a girl, self love is important. This would have been so much better and then Grover and Percy could have reunited.. omg WHY DIDNT U DO THIS RICK?!
As happy as i am for leo to finally find someone, i dont really love this ship. I agree with all the points you made
I feel like some of the people on the polls, at least one person doesn't like caleo because they wanted Leo (a fictional person) to be their boyfriend lol
I almost feel sorry for Calypso. I don't want to think of her as an afterthought. I don't mind Caleo and it added a surprise/ funny element in HoH
I was waiting for this one
personally, i LOVED the ship at the beginning. but later onwards, just like fran said, there is so little of calypso in the ship, that it just doesnt seem like one y'know.
but i know for a fact that they have tremendous potential, because like cmon, it was just wrong timing for them all the time. leo was pretty self aware about the problems the relationship faced in the dark prophecy, like how he himself said it faced a lot of issues right at the start. other ships, if you look at them (te main ones at least) percabeth literally took 4-5 years to finally get together. frazel had gone from friends to lovers and like that hardly goes wrong, and jasper was just shit so we're not gonna talk about that. even solangelo had time to have a safe space to grow in, and all the while , they had a TEAM to rely on for any kind of problem- relationship or danger based. and since caleo lacked that, because nobody knew anything about them in the slightest, they had to be independent from the very beginning. now i know it might be like, ohh but if they were truly compatible they wouldnt have problems. and thats the thing. they did have problems, but they werent big enough for them to break up. you tell me a couple doesnt fight at all, i wont believe you. (frankly, solangelo is the only ship that feels real at this point, but i wont complain. why pick fights when there cannot be?) everybody goes through disagreements. caleo having no safe space just aggravated that. and like new relationship, tons of fights with monsters, not staying in a single space for more than a night (for calypso especially, considering she didnt move for 3000 years and then suddenly is moving around all the time is A BIG AF CHANGE) but still staying together is just speaking potential.
another thing about the whole age gap thing, i'll have to respectfully disagree with everyone who thinks that that's an issue, because frankly, in her case( because she doesnt age physically) age only refers to her experience of the world. and calypso was ISOLATED from the world for at least 3 millennia? (i think ) her experience count is exactly 0. she didnt know what an apartment was you guys, shes basically a newborn for the modern world. besides that, she had no interaction with mortals in years. so technically, her age is an issue only if you think about it chronologically, because like how in the world can a person age mentally if you are not interacting with anybody?? if her chronological age was ALSO an issue, then i dont see how people can still ship solangelo and frazel without getting the icks. cal is basically just a foetus that swam around the womb, for a long time, thought a lot, and fell in love a couple times. so i dont think its an issue. and besides, she turns mortal afterwards, so problem in the power dynamic. she has awesome windy powers and leo has awesome fire powers.
also, last part, if you've stayed with me this long, i applaud you, because this is just a rant lol, leo did become super stupid in toa. and maybe its because of inexperience of being in a relationship, but that doesnt really excuse being called mamacita, especially if cal didnt like it. but i truly believe that leo can grow through in this relationship and only become better, because its kind of obvious hes stupid about a lot of stuff on the first try. and the entire thing abt leo losing his past story after meeting cal is bull, no offense, because we never got his pov after boo. in BoO, he still gave up his life for the quest, and yelled at gaia that he did it for his mom. so yeah, his past is there, we just cant see it because he doesn't talk about it openly unless its his pov. their character arcs were rushed, true, but we can keep an open mind about character development and give this a try- instead of them having character dev individually, they acn just go through it together as a couple, because in a healthy relationship, you grow and learn together. so i can only hope that after the cal goes to summer camp thing, things go for the better, because we obviously saw leo realising his mistake and regretting it. and maybe see a little bit more of calypso?? cuz she was downplayed yall.
that was all from my side. thank you for listening to my ted talk.
15:20-17:20 exactly my point for Calypso people have several reasons for not liking Caleo; resons related mostly to leo(casually ignoring Calypso)
My only reasons for not liking Caleo
The first time I watched this video I completely disagreed, but after I reread the books I realized how toxic it was and I love Leo but I just don’t think they were right for each other. In TOA especially, it seemed like Leo was putting in a lot more effort
we might not fully agree, but i still enjoyed this, and i totally respect ur opinion!
Vid Idea:
Assigning Percy Jackson, ToA and HoO characters star signs.
This was so fun!!
Cool pfp!
i think it would have been better is leo had brought calypso back the first time on ogygia because then calypso would be able to find herself easier she could get advice from the girls on the argo 2 and the tension between percy annabeth and her would be hilarious
In my opnion, Caleo isn´t THAT toxic but sometimes is REALLY problematic. Talking about the age diference, I agree with you guys, but I don´t understand whay most fans fro the Riordanverse hate the age diference of caleo but don´t complain about it in Sadie Kane and Anubis relationship.
People *do* complain about the age difference in Anubis and Sadie Kane. I've seen people say it's gross and predatory, which is why I apply the same thinking to Caleo. It's gross, forced, and they struggle to work as a couple.
I feel like Caleo is very underrated not my favorite but still a good ship
What if Rick did Chinese mythology? Also I finished Percy Jackson and I liked it
@@Unclaimeddemigod I know it's not gonna happen but it would be Cool if he did like what would he do with the Chinese Gods
i really respect ur opinion n i really love u(i've subscribed ;) but many times in this video i thot that u were kind of making fun of Caleo n the shippers..
(not saying dat cuz i'm a shipper..i really liked the points u put up)
7:45 spoiler for kane chroniclee but
Anubis and sadie are shipped by kane chronicles fanbase and loved everybody likes it more the saide and walt really
Honestly the main part is that Rick Riordan was not writing the characters well
Ok but I feel like the friend things with Calypso would’ve been cool to see, honestly I see it like a Penelope and Wreck it Ralph friendship. Maybe Leo doesn’t need to swear or even mention the river styx and instead to bring Calypso on their side of the war, he saids he can free her from the island. Calypso being the skeptic because she was on the other side before. And him being a demigod.
Calypso : “NEWS FLASH-
Leo : “What?”
Calypso : “ NONE OF US ARE GETTING WHAT WE WANT😭”
Honestly it’s just a funny and fun thought 😂
And Also, I really hope they change things around, one idea I have for Khione, is that instead of a love interest or something, maybe she can be a foil to Calypso, and Also, it can be that Calypso can be a reflection of his Mother or make a better reason why He wants to take her off the island is that Yea their best friends, but he doesn’t want to loose someone in his life. In fact, she make him an actual Selfless Hero who doesn’t want to loose anyone he cares about and even a conflict of other people going through the same thing he went through. Go further into that, make Soemthing changes and I think it will be good. But yea that’s just me.
13:10 that’s exactly what I’ve been saying! :)
well no offense, but are you really going to consider age and immortal dating mortal as a fact in a story based on Greek mythology where literally everyone is dating whoever they like.
as for the age gap and fighting in relationship part let me remind you of Hades kidnapping Persephone and her literally crying for days to go back but slowly she came around and everyone likes them. Also immortal duse loving mortal girl? Hades was intent on keeping Maria di Angelo alive after 2 children , if that's not more than a single fling ,I don't know what is.
In all honesty , it is less forced than Jasper who we don't see how they got around, we only got Piper saying there will be time to get in a relationship with him , while in Caleo's case , they ended up with Calypso kiss Leo before he left Ogygia to save the world(Much like Annabeth kissing Percy when they parted so that Percy could save the world . and another parallel between these two seens is that Percy thought that Annabeth was about to punch him and calyspso said she hated him before she kissed him. And both scenes happen in their respective 4th book)
I don't like Calypso at all because she loved Percy and my heart is with Percabeth. I know she was forced to and stuff but she cursed Annabeth (or was it Percy) and that is just not it💁🏻♀️💁🏻♀️😅😅 I don't like that Calypso got included in the HoO series
I actually felt sorry for her in the first series but I started to dislike her during HoO and ToA
I don't like Calypso but for me, it's not because she loved Percy. I'm a Percabeth fan yes, but if it were real, she wouldn't be able to control those feelings. I don't like Calypso because she is a jerk to Leo and only loved him because he could get her off the island. People say "Oh she was hurt so many times" as an excuse for her rude actions but it can't be excused! You can't excuse being a jerk. I liked her in BotL but in HoO and ToA? I couldn't deal with her. I just couldn't like her. I don't like Calypso and I don't like Caleo and that's my opinion. The person reading this doesn't have to agree. If you like Calypso and Caleo then that's fine. I'm just sharing what I think.
@@LesbianWeirdo Ok I’m sorry but I just can’t help laughing at the irony of you saying how much you hate Calypso with Leo as your profile picture 🤣
@@chloecake12345 lmao I love Leo(not in that way) but I hate Calypso
@@LesbianWeirdo 👏🏼YES👏🏼
Caleo and Solangelo will forever be my favorite ships ❤️
I feel like Caleo is simmered down because of magic and Calypso probably turned 16 when she gave up titan-hood, or she was already still 16 because gods stop aging in their 20s or 30s to keep their youth (I know they can choose forms, im talking about their human disguises and their true form), or because of Ogygia's weird time. In the wiki it even states, "According to Percy, it was difficult to tell whether she was 15 or 16 due to her timeless features, but he found her to be "twice as brilliant" as the stars, and far more beautiful than even Aphrodite herself, for she seemed more natural." So, it isn't the worst ship. LUKABETH AND MEGPOLLO ON THE OTHER HAND, IS JUST PLAIN WEIRD! I feel like Leo and Calypso should get there own book together to tye up some loose ends and toxicity in there relationship. Also, if Calypso is still over 4000 years old, maybe make the book take place when Leo is 18 so it isn't weird. (I know it's stated she is 16 biologically or something (can't remember) but that only makes it a little better)
I argee with a lot of this, but i just finished reading TOA and i noticed Calypso body shames Leo SO MUCH. litterally so damn much for being very underweight. she called him unattractive to his face multiple times. I can see where Leo doesn't respect Calypso. but come on, i do not think she respects him at all either. i truely hope that after TOA off screen, Leo and Calypso break up and just move on, becuase it did not work, honey
I agree. Caleo are terrible toward each other and need to break up. I wanted Calypso to join the hunters, honestly. She doesn't love him. She loves the idea of being saved and loved so much she puts up with him.
if people don't stop asking this i'm throwing my diet coke off a cliff
My mom thinks Annabeth and Luke should’ve gotten together. Her excuse was ‘they’re half god so it’s ok’
I'm the biggest Caleo hater, honestly. It was creative to bring in Calypso, but I don't think it was executed correctly. I kept expecting her to become a hunter, as well, and expecting her to leave because she's been scorned and love only hurt her. She only bickered with him. She only disliked him in HOO and viewed him as an inconvenience. She's not attracted to him. She may love him, but the attraction isn't there.
I guess its fine. We can't really tell if it pedophilia because we dont know if Calypso is 4000 or 16 because of Ogygia's weird time. In the books and wiki it explains that Calypso gave up titan-hood after leaving the island, which probably means she became the age she looks (16). Also, if she did age, wouldn’t she be dead after giving up titan-hood? Also also, Nico is biologically in his 80s, yet is dating Will. I’m not saying I support adult and kid relationships. Also, isn’t Odysseus the pedo for sleeping with Calypso. I know she tried coming onto him in most variations, but he should’ve known better to sleep with her. He didn’t even love her! He did it for his own lustful desires! I think Leo needs his own book, where him and Calypso work things out! (and also maybe Rick should put some indications that she is 16 because she gave up immortality and didn’t die.) Also, it did state they are rude to each other, but think about how many times couples fight but eventually talk through it. It did state in the wiki that some of Leo’s friends said they think it will get better. P.S it is kinda forced. That's why I think Leo needs his own book. BUT, THAT'S JUST A THOERY! A GREEK THOERY!
hi celia remember me from ur 1k q & a i died but ya hi
I feel like Leo only acts the way he does because he dosn't respect Piper or Calypso but to cover up hi's insecurity around people. He shows a grate deal of care for Calypso and hi's friend (have not read all the triles of apollo). Alos Calypso is not curest to fal in love with every man that end upp on her island bud the gods send people she can't help but fal in love with (if i remember corectly long time sens i las read the books). Thats whay Kyone sent Leo to Calypsos island, because she that Calypso would never fall in love with him.
I believe there relationship is most realistic. They bicker... a lot, which is normal for couples.
I don't bicker with my partner like Caleo bickers at all, and I'm a pretty hotheaded person. Most couples don't bicker like they do.
@@JigsawSaysHello idk bro to me it’s a good ship because I believe that Calypso turned 16 after becoming mortal because you know… age gap.
I guess the ship is kinda fine. We can't really tell if it pedophilia because we dont know if Calypso is 4000 or 16 because of Ogygia's weird time. In the books and wiki it explains that Calypso gave up titan-hood after leaving the island, which probably means she became the age she looks (16). Also, if she did age, wouldn’t she be dead after giving up titan-hood? Also also, Nico is biologically in his 80s, yet is dating Will. I’m not saying I support adult and kid relationships. Also, isn’t Odysseus the pedo for sleeping with Calypso. I know she tried coming onto him in most variations, but he should’ve known better to sleep with her. He didn’t even love her! He did it for his own lustful desires! I think Leo needs his own book, where him and Calypso work things out! (and also maybe Rick should put some indications that she is 16 because she gave up immortality and didn’t die.) Also, it did state they are rude to each other, but think about how many times couples fight but eventually talk through it. It did state in the wiki that some of Leo’s friends said they think it will get better. P.S it is kinda forced. That's why I think Leo needs his own book. Also the wiki says "According to Percy, it was difficult to tell whether she was 15 or 16 due to her timeless features, but he found her to be "twice as brilliant" as the stars, and far more beautiful than even Aphrodite herself, for she seemed more natural." So, she might be 16 and didn't age once she hit 16 (maybe her aging process stopped at a certain time like most gods, since gods don't truly age). But, I feel like it's 50/50. People have mixed opinions if it's good or not. Calypso does argue with Leo and jabs him in the kidneys, but arguing is normal in couples and him getting jabbed in the kidneys is probably teasing. It's not like he's getting hit in the ribs with a fist. Besides, Leo is 2 years away from becoming 18, probably is 17-18 by The Sun and The Star, which would cause it to no longer be pedophilia if Calypso is still over 4000. (Age of consent in New York is 17+ I believe)
I think both Leo and Calypso are disrespectful to each other, but couple will be couples. I don't think they are toxic. They just argue a lot. Thats not really toxic compared to other relationships out there.
if there's no respect why are they a couple in the first place? forget about even dating, if you're disrespectful why consider them as a friend?
If they disrespect you, it will only escalate to worse behaviour. It's better to cut the relationship instead of "toughing it out"
I personally think it was a cute ship, sorta toxic, yes, but I think it has potential it just wasn't put on paper the way/the way it was imagined in Ricks head. But I think if the Disney plus series gets that far they could really develope Calypso into a more dynamic character. I feel like it would be hard to do because of her being isolated on and Island and stuff, but if in the show if they gave her a bigger part in the battle and maybe gives important advice in The Battle Of The Labrynth to Percy that sticks with him or something like that. Make references of her show up often and give her her own character.
And about the age thing, for one of wouldn't be like Leo dating Demeter or smth bc Calypso is not a god, but a demi-titan (so like same for Leo). And time doesn't work the same on her island, although in the real-world she is thousands of years old, on her island she is a teen in her own way.
Idk, just my opinion
I don't see why you would ship something you think is toxic, though. We all know it's toxic, so why bother with it? They are disrespectful towards each other and don't seem to actually love each other. Calypso loves that Leo saved her and broke her curse, but she doesn't find him attractive or love him as a person. I say cut off the Hydra head before it multiples and gets worse.
E
*wat*
Tho
bro this is a offical ship between them. the author put them in a relationship. and i dont know why they have to talk about it. and even if the genders were reversed it would still be ok because calypso would still look 15.
It doesn’t really matter what you look like if you have eons of life experience over your life partner (who can’t even legally drink and is barely old enough to legally drive!)
Looks versus actual age matters immensely. You wouldn't be comfortable if a 40 year old was with a 16 year old despite *looking* like a 16 year old.