I remember always arguing with my Grandma about speakers. While I was more of a fan of the Creambacks and their slightly more vintage sound, she always loved the brighter sound of the Vintage 30's like the ones used on the first 3 "Decapitated Goat" albums. "Those V-30's are more METAL than your Nana's hip replacement!" she'd say to me. Often times we would get into fist fights over which speaker would be better suited as just a "blender" tone. But I must say, she always stuck to her guns and never compromised her values. I'd always tell her, "Nana, one of these days that brutal death metal tone is gonna kill you!" And then one day...it did. Rest In Peace, Nana. 😢
Jeeeez.... it's hard for me to fathom that 30+ years later I'd be referring to Suffocation's Effigy of the Forgotten as "your grandpa's death metal" lol
Amazing video, thanks! One thing that I like about darker speakers is that we can rise the highs at the amp and get that "gain/distortion effect" that some amps have with that knob, without the guitar sounding thin on a band situation
Yes absolutely thats exactly what I love about dark speakers. We can crank the hell out of the presence knob which gives you this airiness when playing clean, and this huge grind when playing heavy gain. This is why the g12m-65 is my all time favourite speaker
I have the g12m-65 and its an absolute beast of a speaker. The main thing everyone misses is they try to A/B it with a v30 or t75 or H75 and no wonder it sounds super muddy and dark. I like how you changed mic positions to give it a chance, but I believe the real difference is cranking the Presence knob. Since its a dark speaker, you can run super aggressive settings that you wouldn't normally be able to get away with. In high gain metal you can achieve an incredible GRIND that is out of this world. I tried the outro song in drop A on my Tokai explorer with EMG85x bridge pickup, into MXR Sugar Drive as boost, into Egnater Renegade amp, into g12m-65. Unreal tone, so heavy
I much prefer these to greenbacks, which can sound stuffy and broken. Mixes great with v30 and tons of others. All of them a great for slightly different tastes. I got the neo cuz they had the least bass and the cab I was putting them in was too boomy. Your mid knob will actually have an effect if you turn it up or down with these! "Ready mids" I guess. Also I love the weight. I'm a skinny weakling but I can carry this 412 all by myself now. Thanks for the video.
I've been pondering an upgrade to the speakers in one of my 4x12 cabs and the Creamback G12H-75's and V-30's were the top contenders. It was super helpful to hear them A/B'd and has definitely helped me make my decision (going with the Creambacks because I already have a Mesa 4x12 full of V-30s). Awesome video as always!
I did the same thing and replaced half my V-30s with G12H-75 Creambacks. Big improvement! But when I split the wiring and compare the two speaker types, I find myself liking the G12H-75 Creambacks a lot better than my V-30's so now I'm thinking about swapping the other V-30's for H Creambacks or Alnico Creams. More on that as soon as I can afford more Creambacks or Alnico Creams.
Great comparison. You are always spot on with the description of the character of the respective speaker. This is a gift. I still struggle to describe what I hear sometimes. Thank you, Kristian.
I keep falling deeper into the wonderful rabbithole that is guitar speakers and it is a lot thanks to you, sir! With that in mind, I think you almost owe me a speaker by now, considering how many you made me buy! Love these videos, keep'em coming!
Yo, that’s awesome you’re giving away the M one. That was actually my favorite sounding one. I’ve been thinking about trying a creamback out. Love the vids man!
Thank you for staying true to your ideals and showing us how mic position changes for all sorts of speakers - and allowing us to hear the true value in their construction!
I loved how you changed mic positions to explore the sounds for each speaker. This is sorely missing in so many speaker demos/comparisons. My taste in tone is really maturing thanks to you, Kohle!
Always felt the Creambacks were slept on heavily by metal players who only ever want to use V30s. My buddy has a cab with them, and they sound killer with some amps! Good stuff
Huge respect to you for telling us when you're putting filters and EQ on the speakers. So many people neglect that fact, which can be very deceiving for tone seekers like myself
The M version sounds great. Probably the most balanced for less gainy tones and might be a nice match for the iso cab I'm planning to get for home studio use.
Thanks again for another amazing video! G12 Neo was my favourite. It was the most unique. Plus has the benefit of being lightweight as well as being more precise for the Chooga Chooga! Neodymium is strong and makes the attack, punch and speed of the speaker cut through the mix. Love it blended as well! Cheers🍻 and beers 🍺 🤘🏻😎🤘🏻
Great video!! I've always loved the combo of a V30 and the G12H Creamback in my 4x12. They just seem to balance each other out so nicely. Would love to try the G12M. 🤘🤘🤘
The V30 and Creamback M is an amazing combo m very balanced and fat sounding but surprisingly clear. The combo of the creamback M low mids and V30 upper mids is a very full and balanced tone . The top end has a nice bite but is also rounded and smooth. The V30 bass keeps the somewhat loose bass of the creamback in check . It's an amazing pair for vintage tone where you need higher powered speakers. This paring is also very vocal sounding and has alot of Character . It's a good combo to split the difference between vintage and modern but does lean more towards vintage. The creamback M and H paired is Pure vintage .
Some say that the secret/magic-sauce is the G12XC-30 + V30, but i think a + H-75 cream would be interesting to try out. The only one i miss. But i will get it & try it out.
I use and V30 and a g12t-75 at home, was looking at trying out some other speakers. I would probably keep the v30 and pair it with something to compliment it.
one of the best guitar speakers. just so much less grating than the v30. maybe not quite as forward and cutting in a live mix, but there's just so much balance.
Great video!! I love the way you presented each speaker and A/B them. I have a Bogner 2x12 with the V 30 and 65 Creamback. It’s my favorite cabinet! I’m thinking about adding a 65 to my 2x12 EVH!! I look forward to seeing more from you! 👊🏾
I've viewed 10 or so review vids on these speakers to help me decide on a purchase, and your review here is by far, BY FAR, the best review I've seen. G12H it is. You rock, dude.
Interesting... I wasn't liking the tone of the G12m all that much by itself, but in the mix it definitely gels better. I would only dial more treble or presence for extra sizzle, but that's my taste.
Great video, I love your speaker comparisons. Way better than most comparisons on UA-cam where people either don't know how to record properly or where they overproduce the video with post-eq :D keep up the good work!
Yeah, I love the Neo Creamback, myself. I put one in my Marshall DSL20 Combo and mic it off-cone, about midway between cone edge and speaker edge. As the rhythm guitarist, the sound blends quite nicely with the other guitarist. The combo amp is much lighter now, too. 😉
@@lucianorosario5851 Great question. Actually, the speaker really helped with the mud in the low end. To my ears, it tightens up the low end and brings up the hi-mids. I suppose one could still get some nasty zizel, if presence and/or treble are too high.
The M65 seems like it works better with a more Marshall-y circuit or something brighter and more vintage. I have a a M65/V30 combo in a Bogner OS 2x12 and it sounds fantastic!
First of all - great presentation as usual. About a year ago I was looking for a replacement of the Celestion V-type, which was fitted to my Marshall by default and unfortunately raped my ears with exaggerated high frequencies. After a deeper research, I chose G12M Creamback just due to its vintage character. I mainly play classic rock, so this speaker worked best for me. Well, maybe it's time to build a 2x12 cab ;) Anyway, I highly recommend the creambacks M and H.
@@pawekutre4095 Do it bro! I did the same thing… I went from a mesa boogie 4x12 with v-30’s to a repurposed car subwoofer box 2x12 with a Neo creamback and g12m65 creamback. I coated the whole inside of the 2x12 box with bar top epoxy to make it more solid and it’s pure joy. The v30’s were absolutely horrific to my ear holes.
I may be alone on this, but I liked the blend of the Neo with the V30. I could tell when you played an example through the blend that it would translate well in a full mix. That being said, a lot of these are situational, meaning that different speakers and/or mic positions may suit different guitars (6, 7, 8 string-etc) moods, and even different guitar players, depending on the situation. It also never hurts to experiment, if you have time on a project to do so. Thanks Kohle for this amazing video, let the metal and the music flow!
Super curious how different speakers sound in person. Always been interested in the g12m, I like how it pokes less in the highs than some of the other speakers.
My Mesa OS Slant/Straight 412 sounds absolutely fantastic with two H75s in an X pattern with the original 2000s Mesa V30s. I have a M65 in my recto 212, 16 ohms so the brightness of the 16 ohm speaker balances out with the darkness of the more vintage voiced speaker. And the result is a smaller cab that sounds similar to my 412 while providing surprisingly better sounding clean tones. Now I'm watching this to decide on what to put in my new Mark III combo
I have V-30's, and H75's in a Marshall 4x12 as well, and I'll agree that these two speakers belong together. I'm surprised that more people aren't doing this. I'm personally not a fan of either speaker on their own, but together they sound fantastic, and can cover a wide range of music.
According to John Suhr who tested the Neo Creamback it sounds scary close to the old Brit made Greenback. I use a 50 watt Plexi and the 60 watts of the Neo is perfect for my single 12 light rig for clubs. I use a Traynor Y-CX12 cab. It is slightly wider to accommodate my Marshall sitting on it and slightly deeper because they tuned it to give you a 4x12 resonance /thump. I am surprised because the sound doesn't seem at all compromised. It's a proper baltic birch cab. Cab and speaker together was $440.00 USD ..not bad!!!
Bing bong... I've currently got a 212 with a dv77 and v30 that I set up based on an older video from u.. thank u for the idea.. I love it.. I wonder if the creamback in my 412 would make it sound better than 4 regular g12 h 75 old school junkers.. might be exactly what that needs..
The 75H to me always sounded more like a Greenback in a live setting. But I think that's why I prefer the 65M. To my ears the GB and 75H can get shrill at loud volumes, whereas the 65M has a rounded off top end but still has that awesome wood sound of the other two. I'd actually be curious to hear how the 75H and 65M mixed with a G12t-75 instead of a V30. (Never thought I'd use those speakers again but I've actually grown to like them.)
For a while I had my 2x12 loaded with a g12t75 and a g12m65, and it sounded pretty darn good but the g12t75 very aggressively overpowered the creamback. About a year ago I swapped the g12t75 with a Neo creamback and the 2 different creambacks compliment each other way better. The Neo has a bit more upper mids and the m65 has a bit more lower mids and they shine together.
I've got a Hughes and Kettner Duotone combo with a v30 in the cab. It's got a great clean sound but high gain tones can get very harsh and glassy in the high mids unless you really roll off the treble and presence. I wonder weather a creamback would work better in the amp
I have here an Celestion Creamback NEO for combo JCM 50/25. But the combo is out for repairs (tubes and so on ...) ... I might be interresting how the Creamback compares to a G12H Anniversity. Thx for your usable comparsions!
Nice comparison video. I'd like to see your take on 12" speakers versus their 10" equivalent. I know that WGS makes some 10" versions of their classic 12" speakers. Also,can 10" speakers can do metal. I'd like to see your take in this. Thanks for the awesome content.
This video came at a great time, was wondering which CB’s to load in my cab! Always the best content 🤘🏼G12H-75 was my fave but the G12M-65 sounded really amazing as well. I was enlightened at the huge difference between the ceramic and neodymium, great video!
this was the first shootout where I didn't love the neo creamback. in a 2x12 cab, what speaker would you recommend to pair with and compliment the neo creamback? except for the vintage 30
Great Comperation. I always been a fan of a V30 calssic sound, but the G12 Neo sounds a blast! I guess it is a matter of taste after all... Thanks for the great video as always 🤘
Great comparison of those speakers, I learned a lot about the differences between the M and the H version. My favorite from what I heard in this video is the G12M Creamback 😍
I´m a V30 guy, but also have greenback. I make and modify amps ad one of the ones a I modified for a client I put a Neo Cremback and my opinion is the same as yours LOL. It is very attractive because of its weight but it lacks something compared to the other ones right?
This Is my dream video! Creambacks are my favourite speakers. I use the H version in isolaton in my 1x12, and the Neo combined with a greenback in my 2x12. This way they sound fantastic. I also like to use creambacks IRs and blend them with IRs of v30 etc etc... So to me, the One that sound the best Is the H version. It has that fantastic flavour, like a v30 that as something "broken" or "Rotten". Absolutely amazing
Great video as always. Love hearing how much of a difference the speaker makes with the same amp. That G12h sounds sick but crazy how my ear is so used to the v30 given how it’s essentially the gold standard
H Creamback all the way for me! I really love its midrange. I have two of them mixed with two V30s in my Marshall 4x12. Best of both worlds and they sound amazing mixed together. If I only could use one it would be the H Creamback.
I bought a Blackstar cab a while back, just to repair an old Sears Silvertone Guitar Amp for a friend. It came with 2 CELESTION G12P-80 speakers and zero information. Changing out one of the speakers would be interesting.
Gotta love those creambacks! I only have IRs of these types and basically use them in different combinations. Personally I enjoy the Neo, as a blend to add some bite to dark sounding amps or speakers. On the other hand, I have no clue what I'm doing but somehow I get the sounds I enjoy 😋
Thanks for this. Nothing wrong with either speaker, but the air of the Creamback is cool.... Sounds like it transmitted the upper harmonics better too.... Would be a fun speaker to solo with.
H or M for me! Either works well. Btw, you suggestions about which way is better to combine the speakers in a cab? Wanna mix 2 v30s with 2 greenbacks or creambacks! crossways or one line over the other?
I placed the 12m and a creamback alnico in a 2x12 and I think it sounds OK. I am new to all of this and didn't want to join the heard with a vintage 30
Thank you for such a indepth comparison of these speakers . At this time I have Revv quad with V30's and cream back G12H-75 in a X pattern which is a killer combination . However , I have a set of Creamback G12H-75's and two Alnico Cream 90's which I intend to mount in a front loaded cabinet . The Alnicos are superlative , the combination was suggested to me by my Celestion artist rep as a great mix for a quad cab , What do you think ?
Really cool shootout Kristian! Good to educate costumers that there are more variables than just the colour of the back. My favourite was the G12M actually. Maybe a less finished tone but it really resonated with me. Thanks for a great video 🤘👌
Excellent video, thanks. I am thinking of pairing the creamback with V30, but am wondering if it should be the H75 or the M65 creamback or the neo? At the moment I have it paired with a Jensen Lightning, which is 70W and a feel like it has just a tad too much bass for the 2x12 cab and my amps. I am aiming for a balanced, full sound, for clean and distorted sounds as well. Using the cab for practise, live and studio ... if it comes to that. Which do you think would complement the V30 the most, kinda which would best fill the freq ranges that the V30 lacks?
Go for the M-65. It balances the excessive sizzle and provides the lower midbass that the V30 lacks. The 75 is still too forward sounding and would maybe benefit the lower midrange, at best, while adding to the excessive odd order harmonics and upper midrange bark that I personally hate- plus it has zero if the good brilliance that the V30 brings to the table and absolutely is missing any trace of air up top which I do not like. The M-65 has that nice openness but is instead scooped (laid back) where the V30 is excessive in upper midrange presence (the "sizzle") which balances out near perfectly and has that full bodies upper bass and lower midrange warmth that you just don't get with the V30. Try it- I promise you will love it 😊😃
Niobium magnet Jensen Tornado's has a similar scooped midrange. I think it is kind of the character of that type of magnet. I do the same thing mix the Tornado with another speaker to add bass and presence/ Treble.
Hi Kohle, here's my nice comment. Your channel and especially your video on tone (comparing the rectifier with a rockerverb I think) caused me to set out on my personal tone-finding journey. I have thus far bought an ENGL Ironball 20 and two amps on the used market (a Valvestate and a Tiny Terror). Im absolutely loving it and I think it's doing the songs I wrote justice, but maybe one thing I'm still missing is that Creamback G12M-65 in my Marshall cabinet :)
I just wanted to thank you for all the great info ! In the 90s the only way to discover was trial and error it got very expensive so kust a quick THANK YOU !!
Great video and explanation on how the speakers were compared. I had been looking at the Neo Creamback to put in my 4x12 and reduce some weight, so it was great to see the variances in the range and how it performed for metal guitar.
I like the M65-I want that gush. I wonder about mixing the Neo and M65 in the studio-would you be able to balance the two to approach the H75 or go to either extreme?
Informative and entertaining as always, dear Kohle! I'm a fan of the CB H75, have it myself in my small 1x12 coffee and played a Herbert through a 2x12 Coffee loaded with them against some other options (V30/K100, alone and combined) - liked the CB H75 the most. There is something about that added low mid chunk while being not too far from the "rich" sizzling V30 midrange. Great amp and cab choice for this comparison btw, compliment each other very well imo!
Thanks for covering these. I just started looking into swapping out my Seventy/80 and have been watching your videos on several of these. Really stuck on that Veteran 30 and that DV-77 also caught my attention. Was actually reading up on Creambacks.
I was actually looking to get myself a G12H 75 to replace one of the V30s in my Orange cab. I play doom with a lot of high gain fuzz and the V30s sound way too icy. Guess I'll be looking more into the G12M though. Really appreciate these videos.
@@KohleAudioKult Do you think it's still suitable for doomy lo-fi black metal stuff like Hell when combined with a V30? Also, I just tried using that cut at 11.5k for my day to day playing where I just plug my board into a DAW, and man, what a difference! You're really a huge help!
Thing is, you can use that scoop in the Neo's to push the mids on your amp harder. If you find V30's a bit too harsh in the mids with your amp, the Neo's might be just the ticket.
I really don't have a lot of experience with speakers, the only cab i own has 2 v30, 1 g12m-65 and a webber silver wolf, it sound good, butt since the v30s are the newer chinese ones, it can get a little spiky on the top end, maybe another creamback could tame some of those high frequencies.
I remember always arguing with my Grandma about speakers. While I was more of a fan of the Creambacks and their slightly more vintage sound, she always loved the brighter sound of the Vintage 30's like the ones used on the first 3 "Decapitated Goat" albums. "Those V-30's are more METAL than your Nana's hip replacement!" she'd say to me. Often times we would get into fist fights over which speaker would be better suited as just a "blender" tone. But I must say, she always stuck to her guns and never compromised her values. I'd always tell her, "Nana, one of these days that brutal death metal tone is gonna kill you!" And then one day...it did. Rest In Peace, Nana. 😢
🤔💯🤘😅
Dicks out for Nana
Nana knows best \m/
Jeeeez.... it's hard for me to fathom that 30+ years later I'd be referring to Suffocation's Effigy of the Forgotten as "your grandpa's death metal" lol
Dude what the hell
Heard the first chord out of the G12M-65 and instantly thought, that’s my choice. Love the more vintage sound.
Amazing video, thanks!
One thing that I like about darker speakers is that we can rise the highs at the amp and get that "gain/distortion effect" that some amps have with that knob, without the guitar sounding thin on a band situation
Yes absolutely thats exactly what I love about dark speakers. We can crank the hell out of the presence knob which gives you this airiness when playing clean, and this huge grind when playing heavy gain. This is why the g12m-65 is my all time favourite speaker
I have the g12m-65 and its an absolute beast of a speaker. The main thing everyone misses is they try to A/B it with a v30 or t75 or H75 and no wonder it sounds super muddy and dark.
I like how you changed mic positions to give it a chance, but I believe the real difference is cranking the Presence knob. Since its a dark speaker, you can run super aggressive settings that you wouldn't normally be able to get away with.
In high gain metal you can achieve an incredible GRIND that is out of this world. I tried the outro song in drop A on my Tokai explorer with EMG85x bridge pickup, into MXR Sugar Drive as boost, into Egnater Renegade amp, into g12m-65. Unreal tone, so heavy
Which one s your favorite? I'm more than curious! 🤔
I much prefer these to greenbacks, which can sound stuffy and broken. Mixes great with v30 and tons of others. All of them a great for slightly different tastes. I got the neo cuz they had the least bass and the cab I was putting them in was too boomy. Your mid knob will actually have an effect if you turn it up or down with these! "Ready mids" I guess. Also I love the weight. I'm a skinny weakling but I can carry this 412 all by myself now. Thanks for the video.
i like a lot g12m-65 and h75, neo not so much, vintage 30 sounds good
Really liked the G12M after the mic was repositioned
Man check my last video. I have created massive sound with 10 inch speakers.
G12M 65 sounds amazing
Always loved how creambacks sounded! I think it's time to bring them on more records
I've been pondering an upgrade to the speakers in one of my 4x12 cabs and the Creamback G12H-75's and V-30's were the top contenders. It was super helpful to hear them A/B'd and has definitely helped me make my decision (going with the Creambacks because I already have a Mesa 4x12 full of V-30s). Awesome video as always!
I did the same thing and replaced half my V-30s with G12H-75 Creambacks. Big improvement! But when I split the wiring and compare the two speaker types, I find myself liking the G12H-75 Creambacks a lot better than my V-30's so now I'm thinking about swapping the other V-30's for H Creambacks or Alnico Creams. More on that as soon as I can afford more Creambacks or Alnico Creams.
Great comparison. You are always spot on with the description of the character of the respective speaker. This is a gift. I still struggle to describe what I hear sometimes. Thank you, Kristian.
Super badass speaker review. This is the best-sounding representation I have found of these speakers. Ridiculous. You crushed it.
Great to hear that!
I keep falling deeper into the wonderful rabbithole that is guitar speakers and it is a lot thanks to you, sir! With that in mind, I think you almost owe me a speaker by now, considering how many you made me buy!
Love these videos, keep'em coming!
Im digging and deeper and deeper too! It’s so much fun!
I have also fell down the speaker rabbit hole and it find speaker swapping much more effective and much more rewarding then pickup swaps.
Yo, that’s awesome you’re giving away the M one. That was actually my favorite sounding one. I’ve been thinking about trying a creamback out. Love the vids man!
Yeah me too... I want that thing!
Thank you for staying true to your ideals and showing us how mic position changes for all sorts of speakers - and allowing us to hear the true value in their construction!
I loved how you changed mic positions to explore the sounds for each speaker. This is sorely missing in so many speaker demos/comparisons. My taste in tone is really maturing thanks to you, Kohle!
Always felt the Creambacks were slept on heavily by metal players who only ever want to use V30s. My buddy has a cab with them, and they sound killer with some amps! Good stuff
Huge respect to you for telling us when you're putting filters and EQ on the speakers. So many people neglect that fact, which can be very deceiving for tone seekers like myself
Very well made comparison!! It´s interesting to hear the sonic differences.
I have a V30 at home and now i want the G12M-65!!
The M version sounds great. Probably the most balanced for less gainy tones and might be a nice match for the iso cab I'm planning to get for home studio use.
I think this guy can make any speaker work for metal tones. The first Creamback sounded great to me.
Thanks again for another amazing video! G12 Neo was my favourite. It was the most unique. Plus has the benefit of being lightweight as well as being more precise for the Chooga Chooga! Neodymium is strong and makes the attack, punch and speed of the speaker cut through the mix. Love it blended as well! Cheers🍻 and beers 🍺 🤘🏻😎🤘🏻
Great video!! I've always loved the combo of a V30 and the G12H Creamback in my 4x12. They just seem to balance each other out so nicely. Would love to try the G12M. 🤘🤘🤘
The V30 and Creamback M is an amazing combo m very balanced and fat sounding but surprisingly clear. The combo of the creamback M low mids and V30 upper mids is a very full and balanced tone . The top end has a nice bite but is also rounded and smooth. The V30 bass keeps the somewhat loose bass of the creamback in check . It's an amazing pair for vintage tone where you need higher powered speakers. This paring is also very vocal sounding and has alot of Character . It's a good combo to split the difference between vintage and modern but does lean more towards vintage. The creamback M and H paired is Pure vintage .
Some say that the secret/magic-sauce is the G12XC-30 + V30, but i think a + H-75 cream would be interesting to try out.
The only one i miss. But i will get it & try it out.
@@adamwatson6916 Very cool. Appreciate the feedback! 🤘🤘🤘
Isn't the G12H-75 the type of speakers in Tony Iommi's Laney cabs? Same ones he used on "The Devil You Know" and "13"?
Have you tried mixing the Creamback75 and the G12H30 70th Anniversary? They sit really well together.
Is the magnet the only difference between the different revisions??? Huge differences!
I use and V30 and a g12t-75 at home, was looking at trying out some other speakers. I would probably keep the v30 and pair it with something to compliment it.
one of the best guitar speakers. just so much less grating than the v30. maybe not quite as forward and cutting in a live mix, but there's just so much balance.
How does the G12H Creamback compare to the G12H Anniversary, that comes inside all of the EVH 2X12 cabinets? What is the difference?
Haven’t compared them directly. But you might wanna check this out:
ua-cam.com/video/QWHP-rW61qM/v-deo.htmlsi=d9TjoV8u2Lq_zRYJ
Great video!! I love the way you presented each speaker and A/B them.
I have a Bogner 2x12 with the V 30 and 65 Creamback. It’s my favorite cabinet! I’m thinking about adding a 65 to my 2x12 EVH!!
I look forward to seeing more from you! 👊🏾
still amazing how drastic of a difference the speakers make to the guitar tone. well presented as always kohle 🤘
All these speaker videos just show how important they are although we tend to overlook them! Great job!
That’s my gospel! 🤪
I think blending the M version with the Neo version would sound amazing.
Agreed
I've viewed 10 or so review vids on these speakers to help me decide on a purchase, and your review here is by far, BY FAR, the best review I've seen. G12H it is. You rock, dude.
It’s never as simple as it seems. The guitar, pickups, amp, cabinet, effects, musical style all play into the sound.
I mean more towards the V30 but curious about having it combined with the Greenback in a cabinet.
Good idea!
I wonder if pairing the neo with the m would sound good
Interesting... I wasn't liking the tone of the G12m all that much by itself, but in the mix it definitely gels better. I would only dial more treble or presence for extra sizzle, but that's my taste.
Glad I found this one... I am looking into a new cab and one of the culprits is loaded with the creambacks G12M's. I really like it!
Great video, I love your speaker comparisons. Way better than most comparisons on UA-cam where people either don't know how to record properly or where they overproduce the video with post-eq :D keep up the good work!
Yeah, I love the Neo Creamback, myself. I put one in my Marshall DSL20 Combo and mic it off-cone, about midway between cone edge and speaker edge. As the rhythm guitarist, the sound blends quite nicely with the other guitarist. The combo amp is much lighter now, too. 😉
How went that change,the zizel disappear in the gain mode?
@@lucianorosario5851 Great question. Actually, the speaker really helped with the mud in the low end. To my ears, it tightens up the low end and brings up the hi-mids. I suppose one could still get some nasty zizel, if presence and/or treble are too high.
The M65 seems like it works better with a more Marshall-y circuit or something brighter and more vintage. I have a a M65/V30 combo in a Bogner OS 2x12 and it sounds fantastic!
I always find it weird that Marshall only put t75 and v30s in their cabs when part of the that classic Marshall tone is greenbacks h and m.
First of all - great presentation as usual. About a year ago I was looking for a replacement of the Celestion V-type, which was fitted to my Marshall by default and unfortunately raped my ears with exaggerated high frequencies. After a deeper research, I chose G12M Creamback just due to its vintage character. I mainly play classic rock, so this speaker worked best for me. Well, maybe it's time to build a 2x12 cab ;) Anyway, I highly recommend the creambacks M and H.
I can only confirm, for blues, rock and Marshall amps Creamback M is the best choice.
@@pawekutre4095 Do it bro! I did the same thing… I went from a mesa boogie 4x12 with v-30’s to a repurposed car subwoofer box 2x12 with a Neo creamback and g12m65 creamback. I coated the whole inside of the 2x12 box with bar top epoxy to make it more solid and it’s pure joy. The v30’s were absolutely horrific to my ear holes.
I may be alone on this, but I liked the blend of the Neo with the V30. I could tell when you played an example through the blend that it would translate well in a full mix. That being said, a lot of these are situational, meaning that different speakers and/or mic positions may suit different guitars (6, 7, 8 string-etc) moods, and even different guitar players, depending on the situation. It also never hurts to experiment, if you have time on a project to do so. Thanks Kohle for this amazing video, let the metal and the music flow!
I have the Mesa vertical 2x12 I swapped the upper v30 with a Creamback H75. Love it!! Smoothed things out nicely
But the H75 is actually quite bright .... how did it smooth things out ?
@@PK22-b7v Couldn’t tell ya how or why. Just that it did
Super curious how different speakers sound in person. Always been interested in the g12m, I like how it pokes less in the highs than some of the other speakers.
My Mesa OS Slant/Straight 412 sounds absolutely fantastic with two H75s in an X pattern with the original 2000s Mesa V30s. I have a M65 in my recto 212, 16 ohms so the brightness of the 16 ohm speaker balances out with the darkness of the more vintage voiced speaker. And the result is a smaller cab that sounds similar to my 412 while providing surprisingly better sounding clean tones. Now I'm watching this to decide on what to put in my new Mark III combo
I have V-30's, and H75's in a Marshall 4x12 as well, and I'll agree that these two speakers belong together. I'm surprised that more people aren't doing this. I'm personally not a fan of either speaker on their own, but together they sound fantastic, and can cover a wide range of music.
According to John Suhr who tested the Neo Creamback it sounds scary close to the old Brit made Greenback. I use a 50 watt Plexi and the 60 watts of the Neo is perfect for my single 12 light rig for clubs. I use a Traynor Y-CX12 cab. It is slightly wider to accommodate my Marshall sitting on it and slightly deeper because they tuned it to give you a 4x12 resonance /thump. I am surprised because the sound doesn't seem at all compromised. It's a proper baltic birch cab. Cab and speaker together was $440.00 USD ..not bad!!!
Bing bong... I've currently got a 212 with a dv77 and v30 that I set up based on an older video from u.. thank u for the idea.. I love it.. I wonder if the creamback in my 412 would make it sound better than 4 regular g12 h 75 old school junkers.. might be exactly what that needs..
You're a beautiful human Kristian. Thank you for making these speaker videos!
The 75H to me always sounded more like a Greenback in a live setting. But I think that's why I prefer the 65M. To my ears the GB and 75H can get shrill at loud volumes, whereas the 65M has a rounded off top end but still has that awesome wood sound of the other two. I'd actually be curious to hear how the 75H and 65M mixed with a G12t-75 instead of a V30. (Never thought I'd use those speakers again but I've actually grown to like them.)
For a while I had my 2x12 loaded with a g12t75 and a g12m65, and it sounded pretty darn good but the g12t75 very aggressively overpowered the creamback. About a year ago I swapped the g12t75 with a Neo creamback and the 2 different creambacks compliment each other way better. The Neo has a bit more upper mids and the m65 has a bit more lower mids and they shine together.
Have you ever tested parallel vs series wiring for speakers? For example a 2x12 in parallel and series for 4 ohm and 16 ohm.
Recommendation for a 1975 Silverface 100 watt Fender Twin Reverb?
I've got a Hughes and Kettner Duotone combo with a v30 in the cab. It's got a great clean sound but high gain tones can get very harsh and glassy in the high mids unless you really roll off the treble and presence. I wonder weather a creamback would work better in the amp
thinking I might have to get myself a pair of 65's to try for mean tones, and some Neo's for clean tones
Hi ! Thank you so much for the giveaway, I just installed Telegram, how to proceed now ?
It’s a scam from a fake channel!
I have here an Celestion Creamback NEO for combo JCM 50/25. But the combo is out for repairs (tubes and so on ...) ...
I might be interresting how the Creamback compares to a G12H Anniversity.
Thx for your usable comparsions!
Nice comparison video. I'd like to see your take on 12" speakers versus their 10" equivalent. I know that WGS makes some 10" versions of their classic 12" speakers. Also,can 10" speakers can do metal. I'd like to see your take in this. Thanks for the awesome content.
Loved the sound of all 3. The M has to be the better sounding to me. Thanks for the video!
This video came at a great time, was wondering which CB’s to load in my cab! Always the best content 🤘🏼G12H-75 was my fave but the G12M-65 sounded really amazing as well. I was enlightened at the huge difference between the ceramic and neodymium, great video!
I love your explanations for the sounds. Absolutely great.
this was the first shootout where I didn't love the neo creamback. in a 2x12 cab, what speaker would you recommend to pair with and compliment the neo creamback? except for the vintage 30
creamback 65 will fit better with vocals in a mix?
Great Comperation. I always been a fan of a V30 calssic sound, but the G12 Neo sounds a blast!
I guess it is a matter of taste after all...
Thanks for the great video as always 🤘
Great job as always man! I think the G12H was my favorite!
I dig the slight flub of the M, after you moved the mic to brighten it up, sounds killer!
Great comparison of those speakers, I learned a lot about the differences between the M and the H version. My favorite from what I heard in this video is the G12M Creamback 😍
I´m a V30 guy, but also have greenback. I make and modify amps ad one of the ones a I modified for a client I put a Neo Cremback and my opinion is the same as yours LOL. It is very attractive because of its weight but it lacks something compared to the other ones right?
What would you recommend for an open back EL34 Shiva 2x12. V30/H75 or V30/M65 or V30's.
This Is my dream video! Creambacks are my favourite speakers. I use the H version in isolaton in my 1x12, and the Neo combined with a greenback in my 2x12. This way they sound fantastic. I also like to use creambacks IRs and blend them with IRs of v30 etc etc...
So to me, the One that sound the best Is the H version. It has that fantastic flavour, like a v30 that as something "broken" or "Rotten". Absolutely amazing
Great video as always. Love hearing how much of a difference the speaker makes with the same amp. That G12h sounds sick but crazy how my ear is so used to the v30 given how it’s essentially the gold standard
How does the cream back compare to the Eminence CV75?
Any Creamback will be quite a bit darker
What about the 10" creamback ?
H Creamback all the way for me! I really love its midrange. I have two of them mixed with two V30s in my Marshall 4x12. Best of both worlds and they sound amazing mixed together. If I only could use one it would be the H Creamback.
Glad to hear that because I just ordered 2 for my Marshall cab to mix with the v30s
I really like the h version. Some how you always put the content I'm actively looking for out at the right time haha thanks Kohle
I bought a Blackstar cab a while back, just to repair an old Sears Silvertone Guitar Amp for a friend. It came with 2 CELESTION G12P-80 speakers and zero information. Changing out one of the speakers would be interesting.
So much parience doing all those tests for us! Huge thanks!
Watching your videos have helped me find an awesome guitar tone for my band. Thanks!
Hello! Thanks for your videos! In my opinion, V30 is still the best choice, but for modern metal, you can mix H12 into it.
Yup the G12M has an awesome midrange! Thanks for the awesome speaker shootouts!
Gotta love those creambacks! I only have IRs of these types and basically use them in different combinations. Personally I enjoy the Neo, as a blend to add some bite to dark sounding amps or speakers. On the other hand, I have no clue what I'm doing but somehow I get the sounds I enjoy 😋
Thanks for this. Nothing wrong with either speaker, but the air of the Creamback is cool.... Sounds like it transmitted the upper harmonics better too.... Would be a fun speaker to solo with.
H or M for me! Either works well.
Btw, you suggestions about which way is better to combine the speakers in a cab?
Wanna mix 2 v30s with 2 greenbacks or creambacks! crossways or one line over the other?
I placed the 12m and a creamback alnico in a 2x12 and I think it sounds OK. I am new to all of this and didn't want to join the heard with a vintage 30
Thanks for the shootout Kohle. How many total speakers do you have?
Thank you for such a indepth comparison of these speakers . At this time I have Revv quad with V30's and cream back G12H-75 in a X pattern which is a killer combination . However , I have a set of Creamback G12H-75's and two Alnico Cream 90's which I intend to mount in a front loaded cabinet . The Alnicos are superlative , the combination was suggested to me by my Celestion artist rep as a great mix for a quad cab , What do you think ?
Really cool shootout Kristian! Good to educate costumers that there are more variables than just the colour of the back.
My favourite was the G12M actually. Maybe a less finished tone but it really resonated with me. Thanks for a great video 🤘👌
I thought you were the M type of guy Ulf, haha! 😇
Excellent video, thanks. I am thinking of pairing the creamback with V30, but am wondering if it should be the H75 or the M65 creamback or the neo? At the moment I have it paired with a Jensen Lightning, which is 70W and a feel like it has just a tad too much bass for the 2x12 cab and my amps. I am aiming for a balanced, full sound, for clean and distorted sounds as well. Using the cab for practise, live and studio ... if it comes to that. Which do you think would complement the V30 the most, kinda which would best fill the freq ranges that the V30 lacks?
Go for the M-65. It balances the excessive sizzle and provides the lower midbass that the V30 lacks. The 75 is still too forward sounding and would maybe benefit the lower midrange, at best, while adding to the excessive odd order harmonics and upper midrange bark that I personally hate- plus it has zero if the good brilliance that the V30 brings to the table and absolutely is missing any trace of air up top which I do not like. The M-65 has that nice openness but is instead scooped (laid back) where the V30 is excessive in upper midrange presence (the "sizzle") which balances out near perfectly and has that full bodies upper bass and lower midrange warmth that you just don't get with the V30. Try it- I promise you will love it 😊😃
@@HiFiWrightthanks for the info.
@@lorencing no problem. Let me know, if you pull the trigger, about how you end up liking the pairing 👍🏻🤘🏻
Niobium magnet Jensen Tornado's has a similar scooped midrange. I think it is kind of the character of that type of magnet. I do the same thing mix the Tornado with another speaker to add bass and presence/ Treble.
Hi Kohle, here's my nice comment. Your channel and especially your video on tone (comparing the rectifier with a rockerverb I think) caused me to set out on my personal tone-finding journey. I have thus far bought an ENGL Ironball 20 and two amps on the used market (a Valvestate and a Tiny Terror). Im absolutely loving it and I think it's doing the songs I wrote justice, but maybe one thing I'm still missing is that Creamback G12M-65 in my Marshall cabinet :)
Great to hear that! 🤪🤘
I just wanted to thank you for all the great info ! In the 90s the only way to discover was trial and error it got very expensive so kust a quick THANK YOU !!
I feel your pain about back then! You’re welcome!
Great tests, that's exactly what you need to create your sound. I also watched the other videos. Very helpful.
Great video and explanation on how the speakers were compared. I had been looking at the Neo Creamback to put in my 4x12 and reduce some weight, so it was great to see the variances in the range and how it performed for metal guitar.
Please, can you compare v30 with celestion marshall g12 vintage...I think it would be very interesting to do...?
I like the M65-I want that gush.
I wonder about mixing the Neo and M65 in the studio-would you be able to balance the two to approach the H75 or go to either extreme?
If you want the H75 tone, just get one. 🤪
But yeah, the blend of the other two might go into that direction.
Personally I liked the M the most, but I tend to prefer darker tones anyway. Been planning on getting one to blend with my Hesu Demon speaker
Informative and entertaining as always, dear Kohle! I'm a fan of the CB H75, have it myself in my small 1x12 coffee and played a Herbert through a 2x12 Coffee loaded with them against some other options (V30/K100, alone and combined) - liked the CB H75 the most. There is something about that added low mid chunk while being not too far from the "rich" sizzling V30 midrange. Great amp and cab choice for this comparison btw, compliment each other very well imo!
Thanks for covering these. I just started looking into swapping out my Seventy/80 and have been watching your videos on several of these. Really stuck on that Veteran 30 and that DV-77 also caught my attention. Was actually reading up on Creambacks.
I thought there were 4 versions of the Creamback ? Did the AlNiCo version just come out?
I was actually looking to get myself a G12H 75 to replace one of the V30s in my Orange cab. I play doom with a lot of high gain fuzz and the V30s sound way too icy. Guess I'll be looking more into the G12M though. Really appreciate these videos.
Yeah! The M should be way better for what you want!
@@KohleAudioKult Do you think it's still suitable for doomy lo-fi black metal stuff like Hell when combined with a V30?
Also, I just tried using that cut at 11.5k for my day to day playing where I just plug my board into a DAW, and man, what a difference! You're really a huge help!
Thing is, you can use that scoop in the Neo's to push the mids on your amp harder. If you find V30's a bit too harsh in the mids with your amp, the Neo's might be just the ticket.
I really don't have a lot of experience with speakers, the only cab i own has 2 v30, 1 g12m-65 and a webber silver wolf, it sound good, butt since the v30s are the newer chinese ones, it can get a little spiky on the top end, maybe another creamback could tame some of those high frequencies.
I want to hear that Creamback M paired with V30s! 🤘🤘🤘🤘