Thanks Michael...I've had no time yet to look into MPEG-H in Nuendo 13, and thanks to your very clear and informative video, I can relax in the knowledge that I'm not missing the boat (since HMS MPEG-4 seems to be moving quite slowly :)
Thanks for the extra info. Did not know about the original software. The panning in MPEG-H starts at head level. So you can pan to the ground. So you need to change the panning setup in Nuendo. Just getting into this but switch groups are very interesting. Same file explicit lyrics off or on.. mood change etc. all in one file. So much to play with and learn. Thanks again for the video and yes level 5 please.
Very useful side-by-side demonstration. I think the question going forward might not be which format you prefer, but what format is required for the people you work for. What of course would be ideal, if there is some reasonable conversion tools. Meaning we could work in Dolby Atmos because that's what in the US is the more common format, but could also create an MPEG-H version to experiment. Or the other way around - build the project as an MPEG-H project to get familiar with the new capabilities, but then have the ability to also convert this to Dolby-Atmos if that's the delivery spec. So maybe one follow-up video could be - how could you setup a project that supports both. Since beds and objects are a common theme, could one setup a project and then beds and objects for either renderer (possibly using direct summing routing)? Maybe some tweaking between them. That would make it a lot less of a gamble to pick. Or if not, how hard to would to be take a project in MPEG-H and just update the routing to switch to the Dolby ATMOS renderer?
Super cool. Nuendo is always cutting edge. Don't know why so many people still use Protools, just because of the old times. Nuendo 13 blows it away. Easily.
Nuendo lacks a couple of things Pro Tools does have. And the amount of routing options in Pro Tools beats Nuendo still. But Nuendo has its strengths too. Unfortunately we still have to use both in audio postproduction for the media, there isn’t a dedicated DAW yet 🙂
Center channel is used. LFE is a different story. The LFE (low frequency effects) has a specific meaning. Unless you are explicitly sending something into the LFE, panners will usually ignore it.
7 mins in and all I'm thinking is why Nuendo didn't learn from Studio One 6.5 and make it easy to implement? Thanks for taking the time to do this video and it will benefit the Nuendo users, but I'll be content with Studio One. Have an awesome day!
Thanks michael . Mine mixed track is about -19 lufs so if i want to release it to streaming platforms will i have to make it more louder like the stereo masters ?
Keep in mind that with Dolby Atmos all channels and objects are condensed to 16 as well, before sending it to the users. This process is just hidden in the encoding stage so producers usually don't are aware.
Great video Michael :) have you noticed any difference in sound quality between Mpeg-h and Atmos ? I have found a massive difference on tidal music with sony 360 vs Atmos and also Atmos sounds so much better on Tidal over Apple music :(
It’s really difficult to compare because it depends on the rendering algorithm and not so much on the standard. I have not tested Tidal but it is very well possible that Tidal has the better algorithm.
@@michaelgwagner I have it on could info that the reason apple sounds worse is that their system can not stream Dolby atmos at anywhere near the band width its supposed to :( And have been just faking it as no one seems to be testing the actual signal that is being decoded lol It sound's pretty good but when you switch to stereo you can hear a difference in the Quality of the Signal :(
yeah tried it. It's a bit clugee. Not my cup of tea. It's been around for years as you said and I decided to not go into it.. Last thing I need to look another broadcast standard. Thanks for the video, but
@@michaelgwagner It’s a common broadcast format that’s been standard for a while. Now that we have wider than 7.1.2 busses (especially 5.1.4) it makes it easy to drop in their tools and additionally author for this format from the Pro Tools environment I guess which see now. Fraunhofer is very innovative! I just need to get some time to play with it.
Thanks Michael...I've had no time yet to look into MPEG-H in Nuendo 13, and thanks to your very clear and informative video, I can relax in the knowledge that I'm not missing the boat (since HMS MPEG-4 seems to be moving quite slowly :)
Thanks! Yes, that is moving surprisingly slow.
Thanks for the extra info. Did not know about the original software. The panning in MPEG-H starts at head level. So you can pan to the ground. So you need to change the panning setup in Nuendo. Just getting into this but switch groups are very interesting. Same file explicit lyrics off or on.. mood change etc. all in one file. So much to play with and learn. Thanks again for the video and yes level 5 please.
Thanks, yes, one of the advantages of MPEG-H is the more useful panning approach.
thank you so much for this !! the question was 2 hours before on my mind :-)
You’re very welcome!
Very useful side-by-side demonstration. I think the question going forward might not be which format you prefer, but what format is required for the people you work for. What of course would be ideal, if there is some reasonable conversion tools. Meaning we could work in Dolby Atmos because that's what in the US is the more common format, but could also create an MPEG-H version to experiment. Or the other way around - build the project as an MPEG-H project to get familiar with the new capabilities, but then have the ability to also convert this to Dolby-Atmos if that's the delivery spec.
So maybe one follow-up video could be - how could you setup a project that supports both. Since beds and objects are a common theme, could one setup a project and then beds and objects for either renderer (possibly using direct summing routing)? Maybe some tweaking between them. That would make it a lot less of a gamble to pick.
Or if not, how hard to would to be take a project in MPEG-H and just update the routing to switch to the Dolby ATMOS renderer?
That’s actually a very good suggestion, Thanks!
Super cool. Nuendo is always cutting edge. Don't know why so many people still use Protools, just because of the old times. Nuendo 13 blows it away. Easily.
Yes, Nuendo is an excellent allround DAW.
Nuendo lacks a couple of things Pro Tools does have. And the amount of routing options in Pro Tools beats Nuendo still.
But Nuendo has its strengths too.
Unfortunately we still have to use both in audio postproduction for the media, there isn’t a dedicated DAW yet 🙂
I love what you do! btw you sound like Arnold Swartzenegger which is a bonus
👍😉
thx for the great video!! liebe Grüße aus Wien!
Thanks! Best wishes back to Vienna!
Why aren't the Center and LFE channels used? Thank you so much for your work.
Center channel is used. LFE is a different story. The LFE (low frequency effects) has a specific meaning. Unless you are explicitly sending something into the LFE, panners will usually ignore it.
7 mins in and all I'm thinking is why Nuendo didn't learn from Studio One 6.5 and make it easy to implement? Thanks for taking the time to do this video and it will benefit the Nuendo users, but I'll be content with Studio One. Have an awesome day!
Nuendo’s implementation is relatively old. The workflow essentially follows Dobly’s design. But I agree that it deserves updating to stay relevant.
thx. why don't we use objects instead of beds which take more channels from renderer?
You can. ;)
Thanks Michael. Which sound card are you using for Dolby atmos on Nuendo? Secondly, is that sound card is copatible with Nuendo 13 on Windows 10?
I'm only working in stereo at the moment. I convert everything into head-tracked binaural. Any audio interface works for that purpose.
Thanks michael . Mine mixed track is about -19 lufs so if i want to release it to streaming platforms will i have to make it more louder like the stereo masters ?
Keep in mind that with Dolby Atmos all channels and objects are condensed to 16 as well, before sending it to the users. This process is just hidden in the encoding stage so producers usually don't are aware.
With MPEG-H the reduction (depending on level) happens at the production stage though.
Great video Michael :) have you noticed any difference in sound quality between Mpeg-h and Atmos ? I have found a massive difference on tidal music with sony 360 vs Atmos and also Atmos sounds so much better on Tidal over Apple music :(
It’s really difficult to compare because it depends on the rendering algorithm and not so much on the standard. I have not tested Tidal but it is very well possible that Tidal has the better algorithm.
@@michaelgwagner I have it on could info that the reason apple sounds worse is that their system can not stream Dolby atmos at anywhere near the band width its supposed to :( And have been just faking it as no one seems to be testing the actual signal that is being decoded lol It sound's pretty good but when you switch to stereo you can hear a difference in the Quality of the Signal :(
Yes, that‘s true. Streaming quality is obviously also a major factor.
Listening with headphones Binuaral sounds MUCH bigger, a bit to my surprise.. even on youtube, with no real DAC and HD600 headphones...
yeah tried it. It's a bit clugee. Not my cup of tea. It's been around for years as you said and I decided to not go into it.. Last thing I need to look another broadcast standard. Thanks for the video, but
My understanding is that this standard is quite popular in Europe.
@@michaelgwagner Gotcha. I started looking at it, but then got busy, but who knows. not sure what I would really use it for.
@@michaelgwagner It’s a common broadcast format that’s been standard for a while. Now that we have wider than 7.1.2 busses (especially 5.1.4) it makes it easy to drop in their tools and additionally author for this format from the Pro Tools environment I guess which see now. Fraunhofer is very innovative! I just need to get some time to play with it.
very Interesting , is mpeg-h rendering done by the end device ?
In principle, yes. It’s similar to Dolby Atmos in that respect.
@@michaelgwagner but Dolby Atmos require serious computing while I suppose mpeg-h can be rendered by the TV own chip ?
@@michaelgwagner also I've seen some possible Live application with mpeg-h for immersive sports broadcast , I don't think its possible with Atmos
You can do Atmos live. And computing requirements are not that different.
@@michaelgwagner but can you do alternative language dubs in atoms where the user can choose between ?
When you say 16 channel limit, you mean 16 channels in TOTAL? i.e. if my bed is 9.1.6 that's it, I cannot have anything else? :O
I just watched at the end, indeed! Crazy to release this kind of tech in this era :P
Yes, this is correct. That's why you usually see people using 5.1.4.
Nuendo support 9.1.6 in dolby atmos
Not at the bed level. ;)