Thank you for this video! I saw Mary's tweets this morning and was a bit confused because I never saw the actual plot of her comic, only specific things being mentioned. Everyone is attacking Netflix and Bo and Jantje without researching first so thank you for taking the time to explain to us this whole thing
Has Mary ever read any of Jean Giraud’s (Moebius) comic books? Of course she has, because he was one of the greatest most influential comic book artists of all time. He used lots of pyramids throughout his work. As far as triangles and eyes go, it’s seen in ancient iconography and the Eye of Providence is everywhere.
In fact, Moebius‘ classic The Incal features a black pyramid (the dark incal) with incredible powers. The Final Incal concluded in 2014. Maybe an inspiration?
Lucas copyright that phrase from Vador to Luke revealing he is his dad. There are copyright from the gesture you do when you size up your image on your pad and phone.
I haven't read her comic but is it identical? The thing is 1899 isn't all that original either. Matrix, Inception, don't worry darling and many other shows have done this already. In fact don't worry darling also used pyramids to escape the dream world and has close-up of eyes and same ideas.
@@jonfreeman9682 No it's not Identical at all. You should read the comic if you have time. It's actually pretty short it would take less than half hour and it's free too she posted on the original tweet thread.
i watched 1899 and just now read black silence (3 chapters) and the similarities are mostly just visual. I mean pyramids, space, face shots, really nothing new, ive seen it in many sci fi movies and comics before. It gets more obvious once you look at the plot: 1899 - people on ship, inter personal and social drama typical of a 1800 storyline, somethings wrong, they are in a simulation and need to break out of the simulation. Black Silence - recruiting a doctor to go on a suicidal space mission, a bit of conflict, people die mysteriously, somethings wrong, try to find out why. No simulation, no class, sexuality or race issues, no family drama (1899 has docs husband and child and fights her dad later bro is in the picture), typical space\planet exploration, lovecraftian sci-fi horror while 1899 is more of a sci-fi simulation mystery with Victoria era vibes. i mean, maybe in the next season it will change a bit, but thats speculation as for now the similarities are so vague and generalized you could lump in any other sci-fi movie with a pyramid made before 2022 (which are a lot)
When I read they were identical I was expecting something which would not even be debatable. That was a big mistake for me because she loses credibility. Given the facts, I can't think how she has a fair and honest position, because for me it is quite clear that both stories are not exactly the same as she claimed. Anyway it was nice from you to take it respectfully and consider her side.
Thank you for addressing this. I agree with you & if she feels her claims have merit, she needs to take the appropriate steps. Meanwhile Baran Bo Odar addressed this on instagram and he said as artists, they would never steal from other artists. I believe him. Like you said, they seem to hold themselves to higher standards when it comes to their work and wouldn’t even repeat their own work when asked.
I guess she didn’t question maybe there’s many shows and comics that have pyramids? Or maybe how her wolf is very similar to Event Horizon and the matrix ? Or maybe humans aren’t that original anymore
Yep and Well, even the matrix wasnt rly an "original".. i was sort of adaption from the book simulacron-3 That also was used for the 13.th Floor. And World on a wire (an old german scifi from the 70s). Also Dark had many concepts in it that we saw before already Dimension/Timetravel / My grandpa is my son etc.... Its just the thing how you write it "new" and use it.
I work in the industry to an adjacent/broader degree, and while there’s the popular saying that “everything’s been done, nothing’s original anymore.” Following that up with “what really counts is your take & execution of a concept, not how original it is”. This I feel is more of a cynical/postmodernist (referring to the trend of thought rather than a specific theory/philosophy/art movement) take It’s more accurate to say that we, as social creatures who can convey & communicate things through art, does so not in insulation of the world. Instead we are influenced, informed, and inspired by the world around us and the things we consume. Both consciously and unconsciously So it’s not that surprising IF similarities can occur in a work completely by accident, a phenomenon that’s been well documented with the release of similar movies throughout the ages (examples usually being genre films of similar-ish story beats seeming to be released not too far from each other, but with clear proof that they were developed separately). I think it’s been coined as “parallel convergence” or something like that *that’s not to say* that a work can’t be plagiarized/“heavily influenced” with minor-to-broad alterations, which is something people in the industry try to be mindful of (permission to discuss/share works or ideas, etc.). After enough degrees of alterations, a work can completely be free from accusations of plagiarism, even IF the reality’s the opposite
This all just makes me sad. She is damaging the name of the most exciting writer/director team in decades without doing any investigation into it..just solely based on Twitter knowledge and outrage. If they copied her, then she copied Alistair Reynolds and countless others. It's all based on images that you can find in hundreds of movies and books throughout pop culture. I'm mad and I'm sad. I want Bo and Jantje to be publicly apologized to!
Well it would be nice if she reached out to them privately and talk it over. Maybe they know her work and didn't realize they took inspiration from her. I don't think they'd would complain about paying some money to her if they did. But it's possible they don't know her work at all.
It would've been more productive to simply point out the similarities and say "Hey, if you like this kind of symbolism, check out my comic book." There. Free advertising, no harm done.
She can reach out privately to them and talk it over. If they say the read her work and borrowed some ideas they will be happy to pay her something and help promote her work. It's a win win. Plus they can borrow ideas from her for next season.
she will never be respected though. this stupid 15 mins of fame is going to cost her whatever credibility she had in the first place. she pretty much cemented her name as synonymous to false accusation. anybody claiming there is an actual similarity in the 2 stories are either LYING or didn't watch the show or read her comic book.
No one is talking about the technological black cube in Tribes of Europa (not Europe), another German scifi Netflix' series. I watched it with German subtitles here in Brazil and had to remind myself 1899 is not from the same creators and the shape would not do what I expected. Not plagiarism
It's not exactly an original trope, they're all "rip offs" of the probe from 2001:a space odyssey. A mysterious black simple geometric shape that's actually technological.
@@johnq4951 I think most people don't know that all media and forms of entertainment uses something previous as source material. Either people are very ignorant of that or are in denial. You can only accuse anyone of plagiarism if the show was 70% similar in various aspects to the comic. Meaning characters have same or extremely similar backgrounds and motivations. The story plot and story arch is the same or extremely similar beat by beat and if the symbolism and art direction are used to support the plot in the same way or very similar. No of that is here.
I'm Portuguese ( so speak portuguese) and all the videos of Brazilian youtubers I've seen who read the book say the same thing as you. thanks for the video.
thank goodness for that. the comic artist crying plagiarism is going to be publicly humiliated with so much evidence IF netflix or the 1899 show creators decide to countersue her for defamation.
Thank you for doing the work to tackle these claims. I'm not convinced she has a case. At all. The only striking coincidence is the pyramids in the eyes. That's it. The black pyramid in her book seems to be in a hot desert, while in 1899 it's in a frozen landscape. I find these claims to be in poor taste.
@@pedrofalk Depois de ver o Twitter dela estou convencido que estas alegações não foram sinceras. Tenho mais que faça do que ler o livro desta indivídua.
The similarities are superficial and can be chalked off to triangles being a popular shape in art composition. So are pyramids, on account of them being pretty simple structures to draw. On Pinterest you can find thousands of similar images to the ones she drew. Now imagine if every single person whoever drew a black pyramid in the desert or wrote a science fiction story revolving around creepy unexplainable things decided to accuse her of plagiarism, lol. Also, the illuminati-style pyramid symbolism is something that was heavily featured in Dark. At this point it feels like a sort of trademark even
I’m Brazilian and, in this case, I don’t think it is plagiarism (neither tons of Brazilian netizens)… Best wishes to the German artists (from a fellow artist and Euro descent who’s rly happy to see more good stuff coming from Europe)!!! And for this fellow Brazilian lady, I hope she reviews her values, attitudes and take the proper responsibility for her acts! God blesses we all ❤
I see influences from Mulholland Drive-“Time to wake up” and Beyond the Black Rainbow-both great films. Doesn’t mean anything. Heck, I created a multiverse indie film titled The Weirdness which had a scene and many themes straight out of Stranger Things although it was created years before. I guarantee you those creators did not steal from my film. Ideas have a way of floating around our “multiverse.” Indie artists feel hurt because their work is not recognized. Maybe that’s where this artist is coming from. Hopefully she will gain a few fans and everyone will move on. I’ll a big fan of Dark and think 1899 is superb.
Black pyramids are actually in other sci-fis. Stargate SG-1 has one, but it has like a couple hundred pyramids throughout the series since the setting has ties to Egyptian mythos.
Having never watched any of your content previously, I was really pleasantly surprised at how fair you were in this-I agree, it must be emotional for her to be convinced that she's been plagiarized, but also ultimately agree that she was not. Thanks for breaking this down!
Portuguese is my first language. Let's do this. TLDR: The translation of the tweets has minor inaccuracies, but they don't really change the overall message and points she makes. - 1st tweet is well translated, although I would use "simply identical" instead of "just identical". - 2nd tweet is well translated. - 3rd tweet is well translated, although "Codes written" would be better translated as "writing in codes". - 4th tweet is well translated. - 5th tweet is well translated, although "I've cried a lot" should be more like "I've cried desperately". - 6th tweet has two misleading translations. "I gave lectures" should be "I gave public talks", which is different from, say, university lectures. And "the business is serious" should be translated as "the matter is serious". The rest of the 6th tweet is well translated. - 7th tweet is well translated. - 8th tweet is well translated. - 9th tweet is well translated except "The Adventures of Pi" should be "The Life of Pi". However, it should be noted that the word "copy" has a somewhat broader meaning than making a perfect word-for-word copy. It's like copying someone's response on a test, even if you change a word to pretend you didn't. - 10th tweet is a bit wonky. "I'll see the procedures I should take" implies legal procedures. And "If there's anything that can be done" should be more like "That's if there's anything that can be done at all." - 11th tweet is well translated.
About S.A.B.I. , this is a concept that existed in a video game/visual novel called Zero Escape: Virtue's Last Reward which released in 2012. Making it a similarity she would have no right to dispute.
Thank you for this. I'm thinking a new show for BBO and JF could be about being falsely accused of something and having social media blow it all out of proportion. They could focus on the nightmare that comes from that, including creators being afraid to produce original material for fear someone else has already thought of it. Wait, is that copying Black Mirror?
I can literally find hundreds of similar images with a person and a pyramid in the background. That is out. The eyes are the biggest similarity and that could literally be coincidence. So that’s a maybe. We would have to see what they had lined up for season 2 to see if anything matches up other than that.
I'm Brazilian and it's baffling how people are attacking Netflix and saying this is a case of plagiarism. Actually... it's not that baffling considering we love to be passionate and proud about the stuff we export to the world like Sepultura and Soccer. But this ain't it. The plot has zero similarities and the photography/panels from the HQ are already VERY derivative of other movies/shows. I don't blame Mary because her judgement is clearly clouded by the feeling of injustice that comes with the delusion that someone stole an idea you thought you had. But she does have to snap out of it and clear the air because this can get very humiliating for her since we're talking about social media. If anything, 1899 looks more like the games 999, Virtue's Last Reward and Zero Time Dilemma than anything else.
If you look at the movies Perfect Blue and Black Swan you see many similarities and still, it's not plagiarism because there are genre tropes, inspiration, themes that are shared by many many works of art.
Nice catch. But Aronofsky has stated that he was aware of Kon's work while or before working on Requiem and BS. So it's like "stretched" homage, as someone wrote once...
also in terms of the Life of Pi thing, the author of Life of Pi wrote a dedication to the Brazilian author of Max and the Cats (the book in question) in the beginning of Pi. The books aren't actually similar at all aside from the premise of a boy being on a boat with a large cat. Max and the Cats deals with themes of Nazism, and the boy is only in the lifeboat for the beginning of the short story.
"I'm tired of crying, etc" really is an attempt to gain attention and make herself look like a victim. Countless Brazilian fans of her comic already debunked her claims.
It’s a pyramid. I don’t know if anyones aware that pyramids have been around since Egyptian times. The triangle has been symbol for ‘earth’ singe 5th century! Characters wake up in sleep pods all the time on space because it takes light years to travel. Everyone who has seen the show and read the comic says they are v different. The Void and Stargate had pyramids and triangles int which eyes way before Black Silence comic. She could get sued for liable if she keeps damaging the names of the creators. Sure there are 3 physical similarities but they are very common symbols
Her images look like she copied / plagiarized Alien or 2001 A Space Odyssey! So for her to accuse the Dark creators and claim she’s a victim of Gringos.... 😑
bruh it's not even suicide its just happening in the simulation they arent dead bruh someday Cristopher Nolan will copyright them for inception and interstellar they are way near plagiarism than this Brazilian comic artist I believe she haven't watched the series in full
She is so incredibly full of s**t for doing this and even tho I never imagined myself being on the side of a huge company like Netflix, the creators of dark are extremely talented people who don't need to plagiarize anything. I hope she will reconsider her statements and i hope Netflix won't take stupid decisions and cancel the future seasons based on this allegation
Agree. And the timing of this is suspicious given that 1899 has become a huge hit globally. Where was her outrage a month ago when that new trailer dropped?
@@masteronionnorth2341 to be fair to her. The trailers didn’t show much. I don’t think that’s an argument. Why would she be angry at a trailer that’s barley showed anything ? I don’t know if they copy her work or not but her watching the full tv series holds more of an argument
@@ha-kh7ef It's suspicious that only after 1899 turns into a huge surprise hit, that she suddenly comes forward with these allegations. Avd many people have read her comic, and said there are no similarities between the two outside of pyramids and triangles. And Pyramids and triangles and eyes have been used in many pieces of work over the years.
Thanks for tackling this so promptly Anthony, suffice to say I wouldn't have responded with as much decorum! She reminds me of Sophia Stewart, who accused James Cameron and the Wachowskis of ripping off a short story, and went on to gather a lot of unearned clout from the more conspiracy minded Black community. Obviously there are some weird similarities, but the comic is basically an Alien/Prometheus rip-off, while 1899 if anything is a rip-off of Dark City, Westworld, and Dark itself - like the pyramid, what is a pyramid but the number three in three dimensions?
ikr. if 1899 copied anything, it's dark itself. watching 1899, i was so tempted to make my theories that 1899 is in the same multiverse as dark, but the show creators said online that those two shows are not linked in any way. i have no respect for people falsely accusing anyone of plagiarism. this woman destroyed what meager reputation she had and now has painted herself in a small corner of irrational mob mentality.
Her case has no merit, the case is as you suggested her story includes standard tropes of the genre. Using a pyramid in a story and spots in the eyes means plagiarism? Can 2001 claim plagiarism mysterious black object. Mary's story is not unique or original.
In the time since this video has been posted and the tweet was uploaded, Jantje acknowledged it's untrue, Lucas Lynggaard Tonnesen (Krester's actor) has even said to look at both, and Mary Cagnin has now removed the original tweet as of this comment, and is now saying that she's having a legal team look into it. But, truthfully, I don't believe it, and more people are noticing that this is a lawsuit waiting to happen, although, it might backfire on her honestly. Not to mention folks have pointed out the similarities between HER work and Dead Space, Event Horizon, Ava's Demon (on the pupil shapes) and the Crow Fishers from Mad Max. Nothing is truly original--you can only be inspired by something at this point. But I saw her original tweet before its deletion, and I stand by it being a baseless claim. This seemed like someone who felt she wasn't getting her due as an artist (fair) and decided to make an allegation based on typical sci-fi concepts on a brand new show by a large corporation to get attention (unfair). I don't like conglomerates as much as the next person, however, I'm not for this. And to see so many people give her support BEFORE researching just shows how everyone is quick to be angry first and ask questions later.
@@jonfreeman9682 No, personally, I don't think so. The comic is about humans trying to find life outside of earth and discover aliens that infect their brains. The synopsis even reads as "In the future, Earth’s days are numbered. A team of astronauts is summoned to reconnoiter a planet that may be the only chance for human beings to survive. Lucas is a renowned exobiologist who finds himself in a difficult situation and his career is on the line. Destiny brings him to Nee, a military woman with quite a reputation, who makes him an offer he can’t refuse. What he doesn’t know is that this mission will change everything he once believed to be true.” Just from this alone, it's not the same. 1899 is about the mind and the experimentation done on it, focusing on dreams and memories, our sexual urges and traumas, it's very Freudian in its themes, in my opinion. And, again, the whole "they stole my triangles!" thing the artist kept saying is nonsense because pyramids is part of sci-fi. It just is. The whole comic is available to read, and I've gone through it, and see nothing similar. Truthfully, it's no different from the same concept of, well, humans trying to find life in space, so it's about as generic as it gets. Just because the last 5-10 minutes of 1899 is now in space and has a multi-racial cast (didn't know we had to ask permission to be diverse in our writing and art) doesn't mean it's plagiarism. lol
Otherland is a sci-fi book series from the late 90s about full VR simulations difficult to distinguish from reality. A black triangular mountain is of particular significance, also pyramids. The title of the third book is Mountain of Black Glass. 1899 did not rip off Otherland.
That is a brilliant series and mind blowing for the 90s. Maybe that series inspired this girl? Thing is sci-fi often borrow ideas from one another and we all draw inspiration from what came before. Like Matrix inspired Inception which inspired this 1899 that we can control dreams and live in a dream world.
@@jonfreeman9682 I wouldn't be surprised if there are a lot of parallels with Otherland in the upcoming seasons. Though if anyone is going to surprise me it will be these creators.
So Black Silence is basically Event Horizon, which is basically Solaris. A lot of Brazilian people unfortunately suffer from victim syndrome. I don't think she or most of the people retweeting watched 1899.
@@HelixOrion i haven't same as you haven't watched 1899 but i know the creators, they will never, they already have an original German show DARK which is enough to trust them
Just as another example, the video game Control also heavily features a black pyramid (though it is inverted), as well as material called Black Rock, which is visually quite similar to the black stuff that starts appearing near the end of season 1 of 1899. I don't think these concepts are unique enough that two or more parties couldn't come up with them on their own.
If 1899 is a ripoff of this comic book Black Silence, then Disney shows like Parrellels and Sulphur Springs and Umbrella Academy are also ripoffs of Dark. Because those shows borrow a ton of stuff from Dark. And Aliens vs Predator also had pyramids as well. Guess she needs to sue Fox/Disney now....
Not to discredit her feelings or anything, but I find it a very hard position to be arguing from. The evidence she uses is all so vague besides symbolism in the imagery. No specific examples, a lot of overly charged emotions, and not a lot of critical analyzation. If her argument were to hold true to the claims she makes visual and symbolic. Her work itself would seem to be discredited as the very ideas surrounding future space travel have all been built off of previous iterations of that genre. For example going into a sort of stasis sleep is something thats been done hundreds of times in popular sci-fi literature, yet somehow her idea for that concept is original? If this were the case every movie or book would be plagiarism because our ideas are shaped by our lived experiences. Without seeing other sci-fi takes on space travel one would think her concept would be far more original instead of coping technology like stasis.
Absolutely! I feel this artist should get her ego checked. Sci-fi isn't supposed to rely on originality for everything. It's about how familiar topics of this genre are utilized in interesting ways. She certainly didn't invent anything.
Yes there are some common themes and Tropes that's difficult to copyright. But what about the multicultural crew on a voyage with triangles in their eyes? And the pyramids and portals. Again I haven't read her work so can't say.
@@jonfreeman9682 she doesn’t have a monopoly on Multinational crews and if I’m being honest HER version is the LEAST ORIGINAL. She took what every sci-fi space movie does, yes multinational, but they all speak the same language just like every other space movie. 1899 was at least original as they made us actually listen in their native language. Also the triangle in the eyes is the symbol for earth and happens when they wake up In 1899, as opposed to when their “infected.” Completely different context from how the triangles appear in 1899. Finally the Pyramid, if one can just draw an ominous black period and that’s enough for it to be plagiarism then holy fuck have I got a bunch of court cases to open up. She doesn’t own imagery, and once again the context in which they appear is different.
Yes gringo generally means anyone outside of Latin America In this case is specifically in accusations to foreigners to being in more power than we Brazilians are and using this power to take credit for something we did
Im brazilian and i can confirm that she is just doing this for clout. She released a website for selling drawing courses in the same time she created this allegation... She just wants attention and play the victim card to gain followers and money. Don't listen to her
Brazilian here: The translation of the tweets are pretty accurate. The first one sounds weird cause it's kind of a slang, she meant something like "today i've discovered about the simmilaties of the two works..." It's not clear if she watched it, but it does sounds like, even in portuguese, that she didn't watch it, but was informed by someone. Other pointers: When she writes "the business is serious" it means "this thing that i'm talking about is serious". "Gringo" is a slang for "foreigners" but mostly americans and europeans (come to think of it, it's for white americans and europeans...), it's not offensive per se, it depends on the context. Nice video!
Thank you for bringing it up to the video. I admit there're some similarities, but the plagiarism claim is a big and risky one, because you have to have more expressions and proofs than "unexplained things happening to the crew". Besides, in the comics those 'eyes with the triangles' are only showed up bc of the mysterious pyramid on the planet. However, in the 1899, the triangle symbol is shown more than the pyramid itself, and they don't mean to be for the same meaning. There're a lot of triangle symbols in show but not related to pyramid itself.
I saw all of season 1. I have not read the comic. Based on what you describe, at best there are some similar themes. These themes are popular in the sci fi -fantasy fiction genre.
it's like the people in support for the fake plagiarism claims have never read books, comics, manga, nor watched sci-fi movies and shows. close-up shots? seriously? having a pyramid constitutes copying? are people this illiterate?
The first tweet I would more directly translate "descobri" as "I discovered" rather than "I found out" that Google translates because in English "I found out" sounds passive and leads Culture Cave to think that someone told Mary about the similarities of 1899 and that she didn't do any of her own research.
I watched 1899 and I liked it. I have watched Dark thrice. Those creators are having some serious skills. But if they are inspired in some way with this comic content then Netflix/ Dark creator's should give the credit to this comic artist also. I cannot believe those images matches with mere coincidence. Only Dark creators knows things for sure. Honesty is something which is not common these days. I don't know complete truth, so this is just my understanding.
I don't get why people are so heated about this. If she thinks she has claim let her try to win it at court. If she wins, she wins. There's a common saying in Brazil, which roughly translates as "Nothing is created, everything is copied". Brazilian people are biased, and you also said you're biased in the video, so let's just grab a popcorn and watch what comes out of this legal battle.(If there will be one).
I like that you can tell that Cagnin was open to other people's interpretations. I think she had some doubts since she told people to come to their own conclusions while reading her story. She knew what she thought, but she was curious to see how other people received it
No but they did take the concept from a short animated film on Netflix from the series love death +robots season 1. The space scene at the end for sure
Black pyramids are pretty ubiquitous. And, while 1899 focused on a black pyramid it switched to a multi-colored pyramid at the end. Made me think of a Rubik's cube but in pyramid form---wonder if Rubik's cube will sue? (Doubt it.) I never noticed the triangles in the eyes in 1899. Will look for them in the re-watch. That's a bit similar, but the triangles are going in different directions. Suicide on the ship is similar---but that has happened in many a sci fi movie and the 1899 characters seemed to be responding to a "tone," not a voice. But, it seems 1899 and Black Silence have completely different plots and premises. I haven't read Black Silence, but, I do not believe Mary Cagnin would recover in a court of law on the grounds of "plagiarism." I look what happened in that "Tardigrade" lawsuit vs. Star Trek: Discovery. #Dismissed
We can’t forget the basic part of this discussion, what is in fact plagiarism? Since “plagiarism” means the practice of taking someone else's work or >>>ideas
Thank you for this, it’s very balanced. I feel for her, it must feel awful thinking someone copied your hard work, but (and the translation could be off here), it doesn’t sound like she actually watched 1899
Complicated is that so focused on talking about the story, which really has nothing to do with it. But giving an example, if you describe a young man with glasses with a scar on his forehead and an owl, you will say HP and not the comic Books of Magic which only has that in common and that was enough. Because the claim is that the visual elements are in the person's head, there is a construction there and the definition must be referenced. because if it were the opposite, the comic artist would be accused of plagiarism.
i read the comic and watch the show and didn't find much similarities. yeah both show and comic have some common sci-fi tropes but that's all. and the image of the pyramid can be found in a huge number of media such as stargate, the void, destiny and even star wars has a lot of pyramids so yeah... the amount of misinformation being spread in twitter is insane tbh
I think its a misunderstanding. The symbols and imagery like pyramids are not original to her to begin with. As for the story beats like voices calling and people in trance, these are tropes very common in horror and scifi media. She used these tropes to tell her own story. 1899 used these tropes to tell another story. However, I do empathise with her and understand that you have to create a media storm to catch the attention of big corporations if you want justice. I hope the matter is resolved to the satisfaction of all the involved parties......
Really enjoyed the show..best ending I've seen in a while.. I hope it turns into a similar show like Raised by Wolves also because that show was chopped at season 2 when it was getting awesome
@@Father_Daniel it was a crying shame .there was so many unanswered questions just goes to show the powers that be haven't a clue what the audience likes 'i only hope netflix or some company picks it up again
Hi, I'm from Brazil, I haven't finished the series or read the comic yet, but I was so intrigued by this whole subject that I ended up in your video. I understood almost everything, I only missed a word or two due to the accent. First, when we use "gringo" it's just our way of naming people from outside the country, most of the time it's not pejorative. I also find it difficult to have been a deliberative copy of her work, but as a Brazilian I understand the despair, because what she said is real, Brazilian artist, especially in the literary department, has a very fucked up life, without attention, without hope and despised by the Brazilian comrades who prefer to read an international work than support the national market. I'm not going to comment yet on what I think about the work itself, but I also wanted everyone to understand that unfortunately Brazilians are a little too emotional. (The 7x1 against Germany shows how easily we break down emotionally, the lack of "emotional intelligence" is one of the biggest criticisms of our sports coaches). So I imagine that when she watched and started seeing similar things, she lost control and went accusing on twitter before thinking about and analyzing it more coldly. But it's not what a bunch of assholes are saying that she's doing it on purpose to get attention or because Brazilians like to pretend to be a victim. Anyway, I will wait for the next developments in this story and I hope that everything will be resolved peacefully and in accordance with the law.
She accuses people of a crime without any real evidence, so I certainly don't feel sorry for her - especially not if she did it for monetary gain, but also no if she was just a little too emotional to think before going on twitter to defame other creators. Being emotional certainly is no excuse for defamation.
@@Lothiril unfortunately, she already has an excuse of being an indie artist against a giant like netflix and all she has to do is performative "crying" to get public sympathy that she simply "made a mistake" instead of owning up to defaming innocent people. i'm asian and i would not tolerate an asian artist pulling a stunt like this acting like a robbed victim. the comic book and the show have nothing in common in the plot or characters.
@@Lothiril hello. I didn’t ask for someone to feel sorry for her or that she doesn’t pay for her acusations (like I said “in accordance with the law”) I just tried to deliberate a little about one of the bigest flawes in many of brazilian people. Because most of the comments were about “brazilians are not honest and etc”. So, read calmly the other texts and don’t but words in my mouth.
@@maggyfrog Same words that I replied to the other person, I use to you 🤷🏼♀️ I think that happened a lack of interpretation in both. And you reafirmed what I said before with the text (a lot of people playing the card “blablabla she she is playing the victim and crying blablabla”. No one knows whats she really intented with the accusation and the things must only be resolved in accordance with the law.
@@Gridboni What words did I put in your mouth? I didn't make any statement about what YOU said, I stated MY own view on her behaviour, in relation to your explanation.
What are the chances to have similar topics or character motivations in sci-fi? I'd say It's pretty unlikely to come with something never seen before. Based on all the evidence shown here, the Brazilian artist's work wasn't a source of inspiration for 1899 and shouldn't be associated with. The author might feel hurt but her ego isn't in the right place.
But did the showrunners for 1899 even know her work? There are tons of writers and graphic artists like her and me who produce books and stories and nobody notices them. Literally millions of writers and artists in this world but we'll never become massive hits.
Considering how you explained the plot of Black silence, it sounds just like a knock off of dead space, sphere, event horizon and other storylines that involve a space exploration team that finds a outer worldly object that drives the team crazy. I dont think she should be one to go on a crusade trying to call out the the Bo and Jantje when she clearly doesnt have an original storyline. shame to try and ride the hype of the show to bring attention to your own work.
ok, this is my opinion. im german, ive watched dark like 5 times. im a crazy tv show devourer. dark caught me like crazy. it had some back to the future references which i liked. i was super hyped for 1899. only keep reading if you watched the full show. for me i have multiple problems. the actors was very cool, the most enjoyment ive had when listening to the native speakers of for me foreign languages. i really liked emily beecham in her way of speaking. now the few things that for me are reasons i didn't fully enjoy it as much as dark. the black pyramid i dont even know why people only know it from a comic. this black pyramid was used in the show "the tribes of europe" where the middle aged ulrich nielsen actor from dark plays it as well. the fact that it was a black material in a shaft like dark was very off putting for me. and the rumors got mixed up for sure imo, the real "copy" was the missing idea of picking another name for the ship Prometheus, and then waking up on the ship with the same name. the concept of waking up on a spaceship after a simulation is a common theme. the music in 1899 didnt catch me for one episode, unlike in dark I've looked up almost every song. the intro song was not a good choice either imo. i have to admit i had it way easier to watch the jonas actor in a new role as captain, than getting caught by this show. all the setting and the cinematogrophy was great for me, i didnt see anything i could critizise. just it didnt hit me as much this time :( and my last point i wanted to get across is that i liked the very very subtle nuances of scifi in dark. it was too few and not too much. in 1899 i found it a little bit too forced.
I don't think it's that hard to come up with an idea to put image of triangle in the eyes of the characters. It's just freaking variation of illuminati symbol. Maybe the illuminati could sue as well 😂.
@@jonfreeman9682Maybe.. I'm a graphic designer, we make make variation of other things all the time. I don't see it as something original from both of them. Just look up the very well known illuminati symbol. Any beginner graphic designer can come up with eye in triangle.
Like you stated in the vidclip, is similar to what i was thinking: maybe some Inspiration was taken from Expanse, when creating Black Silence,@@thecaveofculture....possibly
If she makes a case against 1899, I make a case against her plagiarizing Henki Bilal whole dark sci-fi theme down to the pyramid iconography. With that said: there’s no case there, just nitpicking general dark sci-fi tropes that says more against her than she might think. And the pyramid eyes?! Does she know that the iconography of a inverted triangle means water, and a triangle with a bar in the middle is land/earth?! Not to mention how many times the pyramid/triangle is represented tons of times in minuscule stuff like hearings, the carpet, hairpins, pattern on the shirt, and countless other places? It’s a connecting and reoccurring iconography, and one that is more ancient than the goddamn country of Brazil… This whole thing is just a nobody trying to get eyes on her. P.S. - wow, I didn’t see those two twits before… so vague… well, both have humans, both have people who speak, who have arms, feet, eyebrows… seriously, I hope Mary gets sued out of the world by Netflix (because I’m sure the creators of Dark/1899 are too gentle to pursue this utter nonsense).
Mary is seriously reaching. There isn't any plagiarism happening here. These are two entirely different yet fantastic stories that share a LOT of very common and classic sci-fi tropes. That's it. Nothing more.
The word your looking for is Stasis. Also you are beyond bias. (at least you admit it several times, Respect for that) and after some further research they didnt copy anything lol Brazillian lady is just looking for hype to sell her comic
As far as I can comment on that topic, when I first see the series it made me think of works of Александр Романович Беляев (1884-1942) - russian writer. Then when i checked comic book i actualy ready to copy strike comic book for copyrigt. Wait! Works of Александр Романович Беляев is not any more protected. So sad! Mary Cagnin, who ever you are - SHAME ON YOU!
1899 copied nothing from this book, cherry picking is a well known phenomia for people to "certify" a fake. First watch the show, then look at her book, nothing is the same, the story, the characters, nothing! Cherry picking! Might as well say it also copied Event Horizon, , forget it!
I see it as follows: Maybe the crearors of 1899 came accross this comic and some of the visuals, e.g. the pyramid, got stuck in their mind as a striking visual that they then integrated into their show. But the plot is so far completely different, e.g. no portals in Mary‘s comic, no mysterious kid, no endless loops to go through, no simulation, etc., etc. From the way her posts escalated quickly from acusations against the 1899 createors to then include the whole white race (or whatever is supposed to be included in the term „gringos“… Americans? The creators are German as far as I know.) , she comes off to me as a bitter, slightly hatefull person, who tries to cash in on the success of others. When I look at her imagery and her story, I can also detect a lot of parallels to previous works of sci-fi. It is normal: no work of art is truly original. She simply comes accross a bit jealous and seems to be blowing her own work out of proportions. A tiny bit of paranoia is in there as well. At least she gets to ride on the 1899 wave now: Her name will be known by more people who will also be exposed to her work. So it would suit her well to let it end here… but people like her rarely do.
@@achoquenao3719 OK, thanks for this info. That's what I meant by "paranoia": It sounds to me a bit like: All these evil foreigners are stealing our work and ideas to make money with it. I'm absolutely on the side of the "little people" when they have their work and ideas stolen by big corporations, just because these companies have lawyers, money and power. But in this case, it just feels like there is not enough there for such allegations and Mary is trying to abuse the "Zeitgeist", where you just put some unproven allegations out there and portray yourself as some poor victim, in the hope some online mob will help you to get what you want. I just don't like the way, these posts sound (from whiny touchy-feely to broadly accusing). She could maybe have said something like "They borrowed elements of my work without asking for my permission." And that would have been true and fine... but what she really seems to want, is big drama to sell her own products on the back of a successful TV show. Maybe a good marketing strategy, but none that fits my personal frame of ethics.
LOL pyramids and triangles are among the most common symbols in literature and film. i've never even heard of "black silence" until after i've watched 1899. now i've seen her comic and there is literally nothing in common between the plot or characters of the show and comic. two conpletely different stories. neither of them owns pyramids or triangles or close-up shots of faces. this is so stupid that this has to be explained to adults.
I think I was biased going into 1899 and expecting it to be as good as Dark. I let my speculation become my expectation. That being said... I still think Dark is the superior show.
if you await exactly the same as dark you might be.. because thats the problem with some people. I mean look at Spielberg, He made Jaws, E.T. and Schindlers List for example. 3 total different shows. Here in 1899 you see their "Style" but its complete different. Also we dont know how the Show goes on. After the first season of dark you had the same sayings over it. Dark rly took off with the second season. I rly Like 1899, is it like Dark, No. But why repeat things? They said before it will be different kind of mystery.
Good that they used no Circle or squares yet. Jeez. Everything was already there... Even the Matrix wasnt rly an 100% original story. The World Simulation aspect comes from the book Simulacron-3. And even that dates back to what they also use in 1899. "plato cave allegory".
audiovisual plagiarism is not just taking the whole story, it will use images or characterization of nitendo personas for you the process that can take. Brazil here
I'm interested in how this progresses. Can we compare timelines of release and production to get certain proof? It's clear as day that the stories themselves are nothing alike and the surface level similarities are the use of the same widely used shape but in different ways. Black triangle in iris when they sleep =/= full eye white triangle all the time from infection. Black pyramid of unknown material and black shiny crystals in ice =/= black pyramid in desert. It's clear to me there's nothing solid in favour of plagiarism, maybe there can be evidence solidly against plagiarism.
The thing has 43 issues and the first collection (with issues 1 to 6) came out in 2014 and the last collection (issues 39 to 43) in 2019. In English that is... I am not sure but I guess we can safely assume that she did all the artwork before bo and Jantje were finishing up DARK and had time for a new project. But yeah so far we saw some similarities and I am still certain that if we looked at all those issues page by page we could equally come up with other works that used similar imagery before... I mean... her comparision to Emily Beecham awakening on the spaceship? That is every female character in a spacesuit in a close-up.
If you enjoyed this video, check out our long-form breakdown of the first episode of 1899: ua-cam.com/video/BIxdUHrdv8s/v-deo.html
Thank you for this video! I saw Mary's tweets this morning and was a bit confused because I never saw the actual plot of her comic, only specific things being mentioned. Everyone is attacking Netflix and Bo and Jantje without researching first so thank you for taking the time to explain to us this whole thing
Has Mary ever read any of Jean Giraud’s (Moebius) comic books? Of course she has, because he was one of the greatest most influential comic book artists of all time. He used lots of pyramids throughout his work. As far as triangles and eyes go, it’s seen in ancient iconography and the Eye of Providence is everywhere.
In fact, Moebius‘ classic The Incal features a black pyramid (the dark incal) with incredible powers. The Final Incal concluded in 2014. Maybe an inspiration?
Came here to say this and I'm so glad to see someone else has .
@@essaysandmore Definitely.
She really thought that people would believe that she invented pyramids in sci fi
Some Brazilians did 🤪
You can't copyright colored geometrical shapes. It's universal iconography.
Keep telling yourself that, Euclid lawyers will get in touch! 😡
Lucas copyright that phrase from Vador to Luke revealing he is his dad.
There are copyright from the gesture you do when you size up your image on your pad and phone.
Thats literally just 5% of the copying, you guys have the attention span of a child
@@pup838 really? What exactly is copied then?
@@thalesanastacio760 nothing they are talking poo lol
The fact that she straight up said the show is identical to her comic without watching the actual show is just mind blowing to me.
I haven't read her comic but is it identical? The thing is 1899 isn't all that original either. Matrix, Inception, don't worry darling and many other shows have done this already. In fact don't worry darling also used pyramids to escape the dream world and has close-up of eyes and same ideas.
@@jonfreeman9682 No it's not Identical at all. You should read the comic if you have time. It's actually pretty short it would take less than half hour and it's free too she posted on the original tweet thread.
her 15 mins is almost over
i watched 1899 and just now read black silence (3 chapters) and the similarities are mostly just visual. I mean pyramids, space, face shots, really nothing new, ive seen it in many sci fi movies and comics before. It gets more obvious once you look at the plot: 1899 - people on ship, inter personal and social drama typical of a 1800 storyline, somethings wrong, they are in a simulation and need to break out of the simulation. Black Silence - recruiting a doctor to go on a suicidal space mission, a bit of conflict, people die mysteriously, somethings wrong, try to find out why. No simulation, no class, sexuality or race issues, no family drama (1899 has docs husband and child and fights her dad later bro is in the picture), typical space\planet exploration, lovecraftian sci-fi horror while 1899 is more of a sci-fi simulation mystery with Victoria era vibes.
i mean, maybe in the next season it will change a bit, but thats speculation as for now the similarities are so vague and generalized you could lump in any other sci-fi movie with a pyramid made before 2022 (which are a lot)
where she said she didn't watch the tv show, he didn't say that
When I read they were identical I was expecting something which would not even be debatable. That was a big mistake for me because she loses credibility. Given the facts, I can't think how she has a fair and honest position, because for me it is quite clear that both stories are not exactly the same as she claimed. Anyway it was nice from you to take it respectfully and consider her side.
Thank you for addressing this. I agree with you & if she feels her claims have merit, she needs to take the appropriate steps. Meanwhile Baran Bo Odar addressed this on instagram and he said as artists, they would never steal from other artists. I believe him. Like you said, they seem to hold themselves to higher standards when it comes to their work and wouldn’t even repeat their own work when asked.
Yeah, this is actual slander
This whole debacle might just blow up in her face
If she considers the flipped triangles in the eyes as plagiarism, then she plagiarised the masonic eye by inversing it.
Well she was inspired by other people's work as well
I guess she didn’t question maybe there’s many shows and comics that have pyramids? Or maybe how her wolf is very similar to Event Horizon and the matrix ? Or maybe humans aren’t that original anymore
Yep and Well, even the matrix wasnt rly an "original".. i was sort of adaption from the book simulacron-3 That also was used for the 13.th Floor. And World on a wire (an old german scifi from the 70s). Also Dark had many concepts in it that we saw before already Dimension/Timetravel / My grandpa is my son etc.... Its just the thing how you write it "new" and use it.
I work in the industry to an adjacent/broader degree, and while there’s the popular saying that “everything’s been done, nothing’s original anymore.” Following that up with “what really counts is your take & execution of a concept, not how original it is”.
This I feel is more of a cynical/postmodernist (referring to the trend of thought rather than a specific theory/philosophy/art movement) take
It’s more accurate to say that we, as social creatures who can convey & communicate things through art, does so not in insulation of the world. Instead we are influenced, informed, and inspired by the world around us and the things we consume. Both consciously and unconsciously
So it’s not that surprising IF similarities can occur in a work completely by accident, a phenomenon that’s been well documented with the release of similar movies throughout the ages (examples usually being genre films of similar-ish story beats seeming to be released not too far from each other, but with clear proof that they were developed separately). I think it’s been coined as “parallel convergence” or something like that
*that’s not to say* that a work can’t be plagiarized/“heavily influenced” with minor-to-broad alterations, which is something people in the industry try to be mindful of (permission to discuss/share works or ideas, etc.). After enough degrees of alterations, a work can completely be free from accusations of plagiarism, even IF the reality’s the opposite
@@AD-lh3jk Sure, I mean the movie "Don't worry darling" came out this year, too.
This all just makes me sad.
She is damaging the name of the most exciting writer/director team in decades without doing any investigation into it..just solely based on Twitter knowledge and outrage.
If they copied her, then she copied Alistair Reynolds and countless others.
It's all based on images that you can find in hundreds of movies and books throughout pop culture.
I'm mad and I'm sad.
I want Bo and Jantje to be publicly apologized to!
Well it would be nice if she reached out to them privately and talk it over. Maybe they know her work and didn't realize they took inspiration from her. I don't think they'd would complain about paying some money to her if they did. But it's possible they don't know her work at all.
Mary achieved her goal. She finally got her work recognized. Through a very toxic way that is.
It would've been more productive to simply point out the similarities and say "Hey, if you like this kind of symbolism, check out my comic book." There. Free advertising, no harm done.
She can reach out privately to them and talk it over. If they say the read her work and borrowed some ideas they will be happy to pay her something and help promote her work. It's a win win. Plus they can borrow ideas from her for next season.
she will never be respected though. this stupid 15 mins of fame is going to cost her whatever credibility she had in the first place. she pretty much cemented her name as synonymous to false accusation.
anybody claiming there is an actual similarity in the 2 stories are either LYING or didn't watch the show or read her comic book.
No one is talking about the technological black cube in Tribes of Europa (not Europe), another German scifi Netflix' series. I watched it with German subtitles here in Brazil and had to remind myself 1899 is not from the same creators and the shape would not do what I expected. Not plagiarism
me 2 :D it came to my mind immediately.
It's not exactly an original trope, they're all "rip offs" of the probe from 2001:a space odyssey. A mysterious black simple geometric shape that's actually technological.
People from all parts of "Europa" in a low tech place speaking many languages? Tribes series again. Ideas, just ideas. No harm done
Damn... I forgot about Tribes of Europa.
@@johnq4951 I think most people don't know that all media and forms of entertainment uses something previous as source material. Either people are very ignorant of that or are in denial. You can only accuse anyone of plagiarism if the show was 70% similar in various aspects to the comic. Meaning characters have same or extremely similar backgrounds and motivations. The story plot and story arch is the same or extremely similar beat by beat and if the symbolism and art direction are used to support the plot in the same way or very similar. No of that is here.
I'm Portuguese ( so speak portuguese) and all the videos of Brazilian youtubers I've seen who read the book say the same thing as you. thanks for the video.
thank goodness for that. the comic artist crying plagiarism is going to be publicly humiliated with so much evidence IF netflix or the 1899 show creators decide to countersue her for defamation.
Thank you for doing the work to tackle these claims. I'm not convinced she has a case. At all. The only striking coincidence is the pyramids in the eyes. That's it. The black pyramid in her book seems to be in a hot desert, while in 1899 it's in a frozen landscape. I find these claims to be in poor taste.
@@pedrofalk Depois de ver o Twitter dela estou convencido que estas alegações não foram sinceras. Tenho mais que faça do que ler o livro desta indivídua.
@@pedrofalk Estás a descrever-te a ti?
The similarities are superficial and can be chalked off to triangles being a popular shape in art composition. So are pyramids, on account of them being pretty simple structures to draw. On Pinterest you can find thousands of similar images to the ones she drew.
Now imagine if every single person whoever drew a black pyramid in the desert or wrote a science fiction story revolving around creepy unexplainable things decided to accuse her of plagiarism, lol.
Also, the illuminati-style pyramid symbolism is something that was heavily featured in Dark. At this point it feels like a sort of trademark even
But how do you explain the triangle in the eyes?
@@jonfreeman9682 It's....not that original?
I’m Brazilian and, in this case, I don’t think it is plagiarism (neither tons of Brazilian netizens)… Best wishes to the German artists (from a fellow artist and Euro descent who’s rly happy to see more good stuff coming from Europe)!!! And for this fellow Brazilian lady, I hope she reviews her values, attitudes and take the proper responsibility for her acts!
God blesses we all ❤
I see influences from Mulholland Drive-“Time to wake up” and Beyond the Black Rainbow-both great films. Doesn’t mean anything. Heck, I created a multiverse indie film titled The Weirdness which had a scene and many themes straight out of Stranger Things although it was created years before. I guarantee you those creators did not steal from my film. Ideas have a way of floating around our “multiverse.” Indie artists feel hurt because their work is not recognized. Maybe that’s where this artist is coming from. Hopefully she will gain a few fans and everyone will move on. I’ll a big fan of Dark and think 1899 is superb.
Black pyramids are actually in other sci-fis. Stargate SG-1 has one, but it has like a couple hundred pyramids throughout the series since the setting has ties to Egyptian mythos.
pyramids, triangles... damn, Egyptians should really trademark their stuff, they would be gazillioners by now
Those pyramids have been used in everything. They should collect royalties for image rights.
Having never watched any of your content previously, I was really pleasantly surprised at how fair you were in this-I agree, it must be emotional for her to be convinced that she's been plagiarized, but also ultimately agree that she was not. Thanks for breaking this down!
Portuguese is my first language. Let's do this.
TLDR: The translation of the tweets has minor inaccuracies, but they don't really change the overall message and points she makes.
- 1st tweet is well translated, although I would use "simply identical" instead of "just identical".
- 2nd tweet is well translated.
- 3rd tweet is well translated, although "Codes written" would be better translated as "writing in codes".
- 4th tweet is well translated.
- 5th tweet is well translated, although "I've cried a lot" should be more like "I've cried desperately".
- 6th tweet has two misleading translations. "I gave lectures" should be "I gave public talks", which is different from, say, university lectures. And "the business is serious" should be translated as "the matter is serious". The rest of the 6th tweet is well translated.
- 7th tweet is well translated.
- 8th tweet is well translated.
- 9th tweet is well translated except "The Adventures of Pi" should be "The Life of Pi". However, it should be noted that the word "copy" has a somewhat broader meaning than making a perfect word-for-word copy. It's like copying someone's response on a test, even if you change a word to pretend you didn't.
- 10th tweet is a bit wonky. "I'll see the procedures I should take" implies legal procedures. And "If there's anything that can be done" should be more like "That's if there's anything that can be done at all."
- 11th tweet is well translated.
Achei um BR aqui 💕
@@lisabouvier9232 Não que ele seja br. Provavelmente ele se referiu de que o primeiro idioma que ele aprendeu, depois do inglês, foi português.
@@lisabouvier9232 PT
@@HelixOrion Não
@@HelixOrion nao, primeira lingua é a lingua nativa. Ou ele é BR ou PT ou outros paises de lingua pt
About S.A.B.I. , this is a concept that existed in a video game/visual novel called Zero Escape: Virtue's Last Reward which released in 2012. Making it a similarity she would have no right to dispute.
Thank you for this. I'm thinking a new show for BBO and JF could be about being falsely accused of something and having social media blow it all out of proportion. They could focus on the nightmare that comes from that, including creators being afraid to produce original material for fear someone else has already thought of it. Wait, is that copying Black Mirror?
I can literally find hundreds of similar images with a person and a pyramid in the background. That is out.
The eyes are the biggest similarity and that could literally be coincidence. So that’s a maybe.
We would have to see what they had lined up for season 2 to see if anything matches up other than that.
I'm Brazilian and it's baffling how people are attacking Netflix and saying this is a case of plagiarism. Actually... it's not that baffling considering we love to be passionate and proud about the stuff we export to the world like Sepultura and Soccer. But this ain't it.
The plot has zero similarities and the photography/panels from the HQ are already VERY derivative of other movies/shows.
I don't blame Mary because her judgement is clearly clouded by the feeling of injustice that comes with the delusion that someone stole an idea you thought you had. But she does have to snap out of it and clear the air because this can get very humiliating for her since we're talking about social media.
If anything, 1899 looks more like the games 999, Virtue's Last Reward and Zero Time Dilemma than anything else.
@@natashacindy7179 Haha, you're in for a nice ride! It reminded me a lot of Zero Escape.
Have you even read Black Silence?
@@HelixOrion Have you even watched 1899 to the end?
Sepultura best band ever
vira lata pedindo carinho de gringo
If you look at the movies Perfect Blue and Black Swan you see many similarities and still, it's not plagiarism because there are genre tropes, inspiration, themes that are shared by many many works of art.
Nice catch. But Aronofsky has stated that he was aware of Kon's work while or before working on Requiem and BS. So it's like "stretched" homage, as someone wrote once...
"Gringos" is Just a way to say Foreigner in Brazil, and the translantion os okay
also in terms of the Life of Pi thing, the author of Life of Pi wrote a dedication to the Brazilian author of Max and the Cats (the book in question) in the beginning of Pi. The books aren't actually similar at all aside from the premise of a boy being on a boat with a large cat. Max and the Cats deals with themes of Nazism, and the boy is only in the lifeboat for the beginning of the short story.
"I'm tired of crying, etc" really is an attempt to gain attention and make herself look like a victim.
Countless Brazilian fans of her comic already debunked her claims.
It’s a pyramid. I don’t know if anyones aware that pyramids have been around since Egyptian times. The triangle has been symbol for ‘earth’ singe 5th century! Characters wake up in sleep pods all the time on space because it takes light years to travel. Everyone who has seen the show and read the comic says they are v different. The Void and Stargate had pyramids and triangles int which eyes way before Black Silence comic. She could get sued for liable if she keeps damaging the names of the creators. Sure there are 3 physical similarities but they are very common symbols
But the montage of the pyramid with the shadows are striking maybe? And the close-up of eyes with triangle in the eyes is maybe copied?
Her images look like she copied / plagiarized Alien or 2001 A Space Odyssey! So for her to accuse the Dark creators and claim she’s a victim of Gringos.... 😑
Well it's not gringos as it's German creators. Yes alien is a classic and many sci-fi horror has copied it's pyramids.
bruh it's not even suicide its just happening in the simulation they arent dead bruh someday Cristopher Nolan will copyright them for inception and interstellar they are way near plagiarism than this Brazilian comic artist I believe she haven't watched the series in full
And the Wachowskis can sue both of them and I'am sure someone else can sue them and so on.
Great point.
She hasn't watched the series apparently only a trailer
Nolan's Inception was Inspired by A Japanese Animated movie called Paprika tho.
He was blamed for plagiarism by the fans of the Japanese movie then.
She is so incredibly full of s**t for doing this and even tho I never imagined myself being on the side of a huge company like Netflix, the creators of dark are extremely talented people who don't need to plagiarize anything. I hope she will reconsider her statements and i hope Netflix won't take stupid decisions and cancel the future seasons based on this allegation
😕😕
She couldn’t be more wrong. She just wants attention.
Agree. And the timing of this is suspicious given that 1899 has become a huge hit globally. Where was her outrage a month ago when that new trailer dropped?
@@masteronionnorth2341 to be fair to her. The trailers didn’t show much. I don’t think that’s an argument. Why would she be angry at a trailer that’s barley showed anything ? I don’t know if they copy her work or not but her watching the full tv series holds more of an argument
@@ha-kh7ef It's suspicious that only after 1899 turns into a huge surprise hit, that she suddenly comes forward with these allegations.
Avd many people have read her comic, and said there are no similarities between the two outside of pyramids and triangles. And Pyramids and triangles and eyes have been used in many pieces of work over the years.
How you can say that she is wrong? wrong is your comment
@@takezosan she really doesn’t have much of a case didn’t you pay attention 🤣
Thanks for tackling this so promptly Anthony, suffice to say I wouldn't have responded with as much decorum! She reminds me of Sophia Stewart, who accused James Cameron and the Wachowskis of ripping off a short story, and went on to gather a lot of unearned clout from the more conspiracy minded Black community. Obviously there are some weird similarities, but the comic is basically an Alien/Prometheus rip-off, while 1899 if anything is a rip-off of Dark City, Westworld, and Dark itself - like the pyramid, what is a pyramid but the number three in three dimensions?
ikr. if 1899 copied anything, it's dark itself. watching 1899, i was so tempted to make my theories that 1899 is in the same multiverse as dark, but the show creators said online that those two shows are not linked in any way. i have no respect for people falsely accusing anyone of plagiarism. this woman destroyed what meager reputation she had and now has painted herself in a small corner of irrational mob mentality.
Her case has no merit, the case is as you suggested her story includes standard tropes of the genre. Using a pyramid in a story and spots in the eyes means plagiarism? Can 2001 claim plagiarism mysterious black object. Mary's story is not unique or original.
She likely stole it herself from other writers and movies.
In the time since this video has been posted and the tweet was uploaded, Jantje acknowledged it's untrue, Lucas Lynggaard Tonnesen (Krester's actor) has even said to look at both, and Mary Cagnin has now removed the original tweet as of this comment, and is now saying that she's having a legal team look into it. But, truthfully, I don't believe it, and more people are noticing that this is a lawsuit waiting to happen, although, it might backfire on her honestly. Not to mention folks have pointed out the similarities between HER work and Dead Space, Event Horizon, Ava's Demon (on the pupil shapes) and the Crow Fishers from Mad Max. Nothing is truly original--you can only be inspired by something at this point. But I saw her original tweet before its deletion, and I stand by it being a baseless claim. This seemed like someone who felt she wasn't getting her due as an artist (fair) and decided to make an allegation based on typical sci-fi concepts on a brand new show by a large corporation to get attention (unfair). I don't like conglomerates as much as the next person, however, I'm not for this. And to see so many people give her support BEFORE researching just shows how everyone is quick to be angry first and ask questions later.
So she says it's identical. I haven't read her comic but would you say it's same themes and plot?
@@jonfreeman9682 No, personally, I don't think so. The comic is about humans trying to find life outside of earth and discover aliens that infect their brains. The synopsis even reads as "In the future, Earth’s days are numbered. A team of astronauts is summoned to reconnoiter a planet that may be the only chance for human beings to survive. Lucas is a renowned exobiologist who finds himself in a difficult situation and his career is on the line. Destiny brings him to Nee, a military woman with quite a reputation, who makes him an offer he can’t refuse. What he doesn’t know is that this mission will change everything he once believed to be true.”
Just from this alone, it's not the same. 1899 is about the mind and the experimentation done on it, focusing on dreams and memories, our sexual urges and traumas, it's very Freudian in its themes, in my opinion. And, again, the whole "they stole my triangles!" thing the artist kept saying is nonsense because pyramids is part of sci-fi. It just is. The whole comic is available to read, and I've gone through it, and see nothing similar. Truthfully, it's no different from the same concept of, well, humans trying to find life in space, so it's about as generic as it gets. Just because the last 5-10 minutes of 1899 is now in space and has a multi-racial cast (didn't know we had to ask permission to be diverse in our writing and art) doesn't mean it's plagiarism. lol
Otherland is a sci-fi book series from the late 90s about full VR simulations difficult to distinguish from reality. A black triangular mountain is of particular significance, also pyramids. The title of the third book is Mountain of Black Glass. 1899 did not rip off Otherland.
That is a brilliant series and mind blowing for the 90s. Maybe that series inspired this girl? Thing is sci-fi often borrow ideas from one another and we all draw inspiration from what came before. Like Matrix inspired Inception which inspired this 1899 that we can control dreams and live in a dream world.
@@jonfreeman9682 I wouldn't be surprised if there are a lot of parallels with Otherland in the upcoming seasons. Though if anyone is going to surprise me it will be these creators.
Blatant plagiarism here..... they both copied off the Egyptians
Saying "gringos", in Brazil, generally means white, middle/high class and foreigner.
So Black Silence is basically Event Horizon, which is basically Solaris. A lot of Brazilian people unfortunately suffer from victim syndrome. I don't think she or most of the people retweeting watched 1899.
And Americans have developed the pride syndrome. 😂👌🏻
@@HelixOrion nah fam just watch the series there's no similarity at all, I knew the potential of DARK creators the can never copy
@@AnkitSingh-cs2kc I want valid arguments. You haven't read *Black Silence.*
@@HelixOrion Show runners are German.
@@HelixOrion i haven't same as you haven't watched 1899 but i know the creators, they will never, they already have an original German show DARK which is enough to trust them
Just as another example, the video game Control also heavily features a black pyramid (though it is inverted), as well as material called Black Rock, which is visually quite similar to the black stuff that starts appearing near the end of season 1 of 1899. I don't think these concepts are unique enough that two or more parties couldn't come up with them on their own.
If 1899 is a ripoff of this comic book Black Silence, then Disney shows like Parrellels and Sulphur Springs and Umbrella Academy are also ripoffs of Dark.
Because those shows borrow a ton of stuff from Dark. And Aliens vs Predator also had pyramids as well. Guess she needs to sue Fox/Disney now....
Lack of originality and ideas 😂
she needed attention
dont forget Avatar and Pocahontas... ^^
Not to discredit her feelings or anything, but I find it a very hard position to be arguing from. The evidence she uses is all so vague besides symbolism in the imagery. No specific examples, a lot of overly charged emotions, and not a lot of critical analyzation. If her argument were to hold true to the claims she makes visual and symbolic. Her work itself would seem to be discredited as the very ideas surrounding future space travel have all been built off of previous iterations of that genre. For example going into a sort of stasis sleep is something thats been done hundreds of times in popular sci-fi literature, yet somehow her idea for that concept is original? If this were the case every movie or book would be plagiarism because our ideas are shaped by our lived experiences. Without seeing other sci-fi takes on space travel one would think her concept would be far more original instead of coping technology like stasis.
Absolutely! I feel this artist should get her ego checked. Sci-fi isn't supposed to rely on originality for everything. It's about how familiar topics of this genre are utilized in interesting ways. She certainly didn't invent anything.
Yes there are some common themes and Tropes that's difficult to copyright. But what about the multicultural crew on a voyage with triangles in their eyes? And the pyramids and portals. Again I haven't read her work so can't say.
@@jonfreeman9682 she doesn’t have a monopoly on Multinational crews and if I’m being honest HER version is the LEAST ORIGINAL. She took what every sci-fi space movie does, yes multinational, but they all speak the same language just like every other space movie. 1899 was at least original as they made us actually listen in their native language. Also the triangle in the eyes is the symbol for earth and happens when they wake up In 1899, as opposed to when their “infected.” Completely different context from how the triangles appear in 1899. Finally the Pyramid, if one can just draw an ominous black period and that’s enough for it to be plagiarism then holy fuck have I got a bunch of court cases to open up. She doesn’t own imagery, and once again the context in which they appear is different.
Yes gringo generally means anyone outside of Latin America
In this case is specifically in accusations to foreigners to being in more power than we Brazilians are and using this power to take credit for something we did
Gringos = USA people
If anything this will bring her graphic novel more attention.
Free marketing.
Im brazilian and i can confirm that she is just doing this for clout.
She released a website for selling drawing courses in the same time she created this allegation... She just wants attention and play the victim card to gain followers and money.
Don't listen to her
From the little I know about her work I gotta question whether Robert K. Weiss and Tracy Tormé sued her for stealing from Sliders.
Brazilian here:
The translation of the tweets are pretty accurate.
The first one sounds weird cause it's kind of a slang, she meant something like "today i've discovered about the simmilaties of the two works..." It's not clear if she watched it, but it does sounds like, even in portuguese, that she didn't watch it, but was informed by someone.
Other pointers:
When she writes "the business is serious" it means "this thing that i'm talking about is serious".
"Gringo" is a slang for "foreigners" but mostly americans and europeans (come to think of it, it's for white americans and europeans...), it's not offensive per se, it depends on the context.
Nice video!
Thank you for bringing it up to the video. I admit there're some similarities, but the plagiarism claim is a big and risky one, because you have to have more expressions and proofs than "unexplained things happening to the crew". Besides, in the comics those 'eyes with the triangles' are only showed up bc of the mysterious pyramid on the planet. However, in the 1899, the triangle symbol is shown more than the pyramid itself, and they don't mean to be for the same meaning. There're a lot of triangle symbols in show but not related to pyramid itself.
I saw all of season 1. I have not read the comic. Based on what you describe, at best there are some similar themes. These themes are popular in the sci fi -fantasy fiction genre.
So is it enough to be plagiarism. I guess it's a question of degree.
it's like the people in support for the fake plagiarism claims have never read books, comics, manga, nor watched sci-fi movies and shows. close-up shots? seriously? having a pyramid constitutes copying? are people this illiterate?
The first tweet I would more directly translate "descobri" as "I discovered" rather than "I found out" that Google translates because in English "I found out" sounds passive and leads Culture Cave to think that someone told Mary about the similarities of 1899 and that she didn't do any of her own research.
The trouble is we don't know where 1899 was going after season 1, and now we never will.
I watched 1899 and I liked it.
I have watched Dark thrice.
Those creators are having some serious skills.
But if they are inspired in some way with this comic content then Netflix/ Dark creator's should give the credit to this comic artist also.
I cannot believe those images matches with mere coincidence.
Only Dark creators knows things for sure.
Honesty is something which is not common these days.
I don't know complete truth, so this is just my understanding.
@dehydrated plant I see claims "character with troubled past" is a plagiarism. It was not, it is common trope.
The pyramid shape has been used in sci-fi for a long time. It's not difficult to imagine several people independently using within in their work.
I don't get why people are so heated about this. If she thinks she has claim let her try to win it at court. If she wins, she wins. There's a common saying in Brazil, which roughly translates as "Nothing is created, everything is copied". Brazilian people are biased, and you also said you're biased in the video, so let's just grab a popcorn and watch what comes out of this legal battle.(If there will be one).
I like that you can tell that Cagnin was open to other people's interpretations. I think she had some doubts since she told people to come to their own conclusions while reading her story. She knew what she thought, but she was curious to see how other people received it
No but they did take the concept from a short animated film on Netflix from the series love death +robots season 1. The space scene at the end for sure
Black pyramids are pretty ubiquitous. And, while 1899 focused on a black pyramid it switched to a multi-colored pyramid at the end. Made me think of a Rubik's cube but in pyramid form---wonder if Rubik's cube will sue? (Doubt it.) I never noticed the triangles in the eyes in 1899. Will look for them in the re-watch. That's a bit similar, but the triangles are going in different directions. Suicide on the ship is similar---but that has happened in many a sci fi movie and the 1899 characters seemed to be responding to a "tone," not a voice. But, it seems 1899 and Black Silence have completely different plots and premises. I haven't read Black Silence, but, I do not believe Mary Cagnin would recover in a court of law on the grounds of "plagiarism." I look what happened in that "Tardigrade" lawsuit vs. Star Trek: Discovery. #Dismissed
The pyramid at the end is actually a pyramid version of the Rubik’s cube, it’s called a pyraminx. It is a real product :)
We can’t forget the basic part of this discussion, what is in fact plagiarism? Since “plagiarism” means the practice of taking someone else's work or >>>ideas
Thank you for this, it’s very balanced. I feel for her, it must feel awful thinking someone copied your hard work, but (and the translation could be off here), it doesn’t sound like she actually watched 1899
so...she also half-copied Dead Space. Space explorers find an Inanimate object in space, it 'infects' people and drives them mad. classic.
Isn't that like how Inception "stole" scenes from Akira?
Black Swan also straight up copied scenes from Perfect Blue
@@pocenha They bought the right to use scene from Perfect Blue.
Idk if this is plagiarism then I guess the creators of Control want a word as well
The Evil Within as well probably.
@@uros.u.novakovic also that, true. Probably several more as sell. In Sound Mind maybe if we reach a bit
Guys, should I complete the series first before watching this?
I’m assuming it’s a yes, yeah?
yes
Complicated is that so focused on talking about the story, which really has nothing to do with it. But giving an example, if you describe a young man with glasses with a scar on his forehead and an owl, you will say HP and not the comic Books of Magic which only has that in common and that was enough. Because the claim is that the visual elements are in the person's head, there is a construction there and the definition must be referenced. because if it were the opposite, the comic artist would be accused of plagiarism.
Black Silence and 1899 just copied ARK
i read the comic and watch the show and didn't find much similarities. yeah both show and comic have some common sci-fi tropes but that's all. and the image of the pyramid can be found in a huge number of media such as stargate, the void, destiny and even star wars has a lot of pyramids so yeah... the amount of misinformation being spread in twitter is insane tbh
I think its a misunderstanding. The symbols and imagery like pyramids are not original to her to begin with. As for the story beats like voices calling and people in trance, these are tropes very common in horror and scifi media. She used these tropes to tell her own story. 1899 used these tropes to tell another story.
However, I do empathise with her and understand that you have to create a media storm to catch the attention of big corporations if you want justice. I hope the matter is resolved to the satisfaction of all the involved parties......
Really enjoyed the show..best ending I've seen in a while..
I hope it turns into a similar show like Raised by Wolves also because that show was chopped at season 2 when it was getting awesome
So upset Raised by Wolves was canceled! Especially after the Way season 2 ended, what a shame
@@Father_Daniel it was a crying shame .there was so many unanswered questions just goes to show the powers that be haven't a clue what the audience likes 'i only hope netflix or some company picks it up again
@@a.pkilkenny6466 yes me too! It was such an awesome show and it was just starting to get even crazier where they left us off.
I read the book, its not a plagiat, maybe those 2 drawings but thats it, the plot is not the same at all
Hi, I'm from Brazil, I haven't finished the series or read the comic yet, but I was so intrigued by this whole subject that I ended up in your video. I understood almost everything, I only missed a word or two due to the accent. First, when we use "gringo" it's just our way of naming people from outside the country, most of the time it's not pejorative. I also find it difficult to have been a deliberative copy of her work, but as a Brazilian I understand the despair, because what she said is real, Brazilian artist, especially in the literary department, has a very fucked up life, without attention, without hope and despised by the Brazilian comrades who prefer to read an international work than support the national market. I'm not going to comment yet on what I think about the work itself, but I also wanted everyone to understand that unfortunately Brazilians are a little too emotional. (The 7x1 against Germany shows how easily we break down emotionally, the lack of "emotional intelligence" is one of the biggest criticisms of our sports coaches). So I imagine that when she watched and started seeing similar things, she lost control and went accusing on twitter before thinking about and analyzing it more coldly. But it's not what a bunch of assholes are saying that she's doing it on purpose to get attention or because Brazilians like to pretend to be a victim. Anyway, I will wait for the next developments in this story and I hope that everything will be resolved peacefully and in accordance with the law.
She accuses people of a crime without any real evidence, so I certainly don't feel sorry for her - especially not if she did it for monetary gain, but also no if she was just a little too emotional to think before going on twitter to defame other creators. Being emotional certainly is no excuse for defamation.
@@Lothiril
unfortunately, she already has an excuse of being an indie artist against a giant like netflix and all she has to do is performative "crying" to get public sympathy that she simply "made a mistake" instead of owning up to defaming innocent people.
i'm asian and i would not tolerate an asian artist pulling a stunt like this acting like a robbed victim. the comic book and the show have nothing in common in the plot or characters.
@@Lothiril hello. I didn’t ask for someone to feel sorry for her or that she doesn’t pay for her acusations (like I said “in accordance with the law”) I just tried to deliberate a little about one of the bigest flawes in many of brazilian people. Because most of the comments were about “brazilians are not honest and etc”. So, read calmly the other texts and don’t but words in my mouth.
@@maggyfrog Same words that I replied to the other person, I use to you 🤷🏼♀️ I think that happened a lack of interpretation in both. And you reafirmed what I said before with the text (a lot of people playing the card “blablabla she she is playing the victim and crying blablabla”. No one knows whats she really intented with the accusation and the things must only be resolved in accordance with the law.
@@Gridboni What words did I put in your mouth? I didn't make any statement about what YOU said, I stated MY own view on her behaviour, in relation to your explanation.
What are the chances to have similar topics or character motivations in sci-fi? I'd say It's pretty unlikely to come with something never seen before. Based on all the evidence shown here, the Brazilian artist's work wasn't a source of inspiration for 1899 and shouldn't be associated with. The author might feel hurt but her ego isn't in the right place.
But did the showrunners for 1899 even know her work? There are tons of writers and graphic artists like her and me who produce books and stories and nobody notices them. Literally millions of writers and artists in this world but we'll never become massive hits.
We gonna adress how the alien pyramids in Black Silence OBVIOUSLY copies the Protoss Nexus in Starcraft? LUL
And gringo is a derogatory term we latin Americans use when trash talking north Americans.
But Gringos sounds pretty cool. Like bad assery.
Just another fake twitter controversy
The author got the attention she was clearly craving for though
Did you read the comics? I belive not, right? to say this garbage, you didn't read the comics.
Considering how you explained the plot of Black silence, it sounds just like a knock off of dead space, sphere, event horizon and other storylines that involve a space exploration team that finds a outer worldly object that drives the team crazy. I dont think she should be one to go on a crusade trying to call out the the Bo and Jantje when she clearly doesnt have an original storyline. shame to try and ride the hype of the show to bring attention to your own work.
The music in the intro, is it gnawa music?
Just UA-cam free music lol - Anthony
ok, this is my opinion. im german, ive watched dark like 5 times. im a crazy tv show devourer. dark caught me like crazy. it had some back to the future references which i liked. i was super hyped for 1899. only keep reading if you watched the full show. for me i have multiple problems. the actors was very cool, the most enjoyment ive had when listening to the native speakers of for me foreign languages. i really liked emily beecham in her way of speaking. now the few things that for me are reasons i didn't fully enjoy it as much as dark. the black pyramid i dont even know why people only know it from a comic. this black pyramid was used in the show "the tribes of europe" where the middle aged ulrich nielsen actor from dark plays it as well. the fact that it was a black material in a shaft like dark was very off putting for me. and the rumors got mixed up for sure imo, the real "copy" was the missing idea of picking another name for the ship Prometheus, and then waking up on the ship with the same name. the concept of waking up on a spaceship after a simulation is a common theme. the music in 1899 didnt catch me for one episode, unlike in dark I've looked up almost every song. the intro song was not a good choice either imo.
i have to admit i had it way easier to watch the jonas actor in a new role as captain, than getting caught by this show.
all the setting and the cinematogrophy was great for me, i didnt see anything i could critizise. just it didnt hit me as much
this time :( and my last point i wanted to get across is that i liked the very very subtle nuances of scifi in dark. it was too
few and not too much. in 1899 i found it a little bit too forced.
I don't think it's that hard to come up with an idea to put image of triangle in the eyes of the characters. It's just freaking variation of illuminati symbol. Maybe the illuminati could sue as well 😂.
Well the upside down triangle in eyes is unusual so maybe they did copy her.
@@jonfreeman9682Maybe.. I'm a graphic designer, we make make variation of other things all the time. I don't see it as something original from both of them. Just look up the very well known illuminati symbol. Any beginner graphic designer can come up with eye in triangle.
Cryo-sleep is what the wording you're looking for at 9mins 30 seconds (like Aliens) or avatar like you said
the monolith in 2001 was originally going to be a black pyramid.
The obvious answer is that we're in a simulation.
Event Horizon did it first.
A true sci-fi horror classic.
When was The expanse created and released?
And when was the comic, Black Silence created and released?
Black Silence: 2016
The Expanse: 2011
Come on now, I won't have said it if I didn't know haha - Anthony
Like you stated in the vidclip, is similar to what i was thinking: maybe some Inspiration was taken from Expanse, when creating Black Silence,@@thecaveofculture....possibly
If she makes a case against 1899, I make a case against her plagiarizing Henki Bilal whole dark sci-fi theme down to the pyramid iconography.
With that said: there’s no case there, just nitpicking general dark sci-fi tropes that says more against her than she might think. And the pyramid eyes?! Does she know that the iconography of a inverted triangle means water, and a triangle with a bar in the middle is land/earth?! Not to mention how many times the pyramid/triangle is represented tons of times in minuscule stuff like hearings, the carpet, hairpins, pattern on the shirt, and countless other places? It’s a connecting and reoccurring iconography, and one that is more ancient than the goddamn country of Brazil…
This whole thing is just a nobody trying to get eyes on her.
P.S. - wow, I didn’t see those two twits before… so vague… well, both have humans, both have people who speak, who have arms, feet, eyebrows… seriously, I hope Mary gets sued out of the world by Netflix (because I’m sure the creators of Dark/1899 are too gentle to pursue this utter nonsense).
Mary is seriously reaching. There isn't any plagiarism happening here. These are two entirely different yet fantastic stories that share a LOT of very common and classic sci-fi tropes. That's it. Nothing more.
5:00
The tweet is pretty much saying, today I discovered that my comic book was etc etc.
Okay then GamesWorkshop can sue the shit out of them all. The Big Black Pyramid of the Master of Death Nagash was before them. Warhammer Fantasy.
The word your looking for is Stasis. Also you are beyond bias. (at least you admit it several times, Respect for that) and after some further research they didnt copy anything lol Brazillian lady is just looking for hype to sell her comic
The Expanse 💙
As far as I can comment on that topic, when I first see the series it made me think of works of Александр Романович Беляев (1884-1942) - russian writer. Then when i checked comic book i actualy ready to copy strike comic book for copyrigt. Wait! Works of Александр Романович Беляев is not any more protected. So sad! Mary Cagnin, who ever you are - SHAME ON YOU!
How copy is different than plagiarism, to me is the same.
1899 copied nothing from this book, cherry picking is a well known phenomia for people to "certify" a fake. First watch the show, then look at her book, nothing is the same, the story, the characters, nothing! Cherry picking! Might as well say it also copied Event Horizon, , forget it!
I see it as follows: Maybe the crearors of 1899 came accross this comic and some of the visuals, e.g. the pyramid, got stuck in their mind as a striking visual that they then integrated into their show. But the plot is so far completely different, e.g. no portals in Mary‘s comic, no mysterious kid, no endless loops to go through, no simulation, etc., etc. From the way her posts escalated quickly from acusations against the 1899 createors to then include the whole white race (or whatever is supposed to be included in the term „gringos“… Americans? The creators are German as far as I know.) , she comes off to me as a bitter, slightly hatefull person, who tries to cash in on the success of others. When I look at her imagery and her story, I can also detect a lot of parallels to previous works of sci-fi. It is normal: no work of art is truly original. She simply comes accross a bit jealous and seems to be blowing her own work out of proportions. A tiny bit of paranoia is in there as well. At least she gets to ride on the 1899 wave now: Her name will be known by more people who will also be exposed to her work. So it would suit her well to let it end here… but people like her rarely do.
Just to correct you, Gringo in Brazil is a term to describe foreigners. Any one that is not brazilian is called gringo
@@achoquenao3719 OK, thanks for this info. That's what I meant by "paranoia": It sounds to me a bit like: All these evil foreigners are stealing our work and ideas to make money with it. I'm absolutely on the side of the "little people" when they have their work and ideas stolen by big corporations, just because these companies have lawyers, money and power. But in this case, it just feels like there is not enough there for such allegations and Mary is trying to abuse the "Zeitgeist", where you just put some unproven allegations out there and portray yourself as some poor victim, in the hope some online mob will help you to get what you want. I just don't like the way, these posts sound (from whiny touchy-feely to broadly accusing). She could maybe have said something like "They borrowed elements of my work without asking for my permission." And that would have been true and fine... but what she really seems to want, is big drama to sell her own products on the back of a successful TV show. Maybe a good marketing strategy, but none that fits my personal frame of ethics.
LOL pyramids and triangles are among the most common symbols in literature and film. i've never even heard of "black silence" until after i've watched 1899. now i've seen her comic and there is literally nothing in common between the plot or characters of the show and comic. two conpletely different stories. neither of them owns pyramids or triangles or close-up shots of faces. this is so stupid that this has to be explained to adults.
James Camaron called in and Said they stole from Titanic... The Same time He steels from Pocahontas for Avatar. ;-)
Is anyone disappointed with the 1899 so far? I was overhyped after watching Dark, so it was pretty much inevitable.
Sorry to hear! I wasn't to be honest. I loved it! - Anthony
Not me. Loved it & cannot wait for S2😄
@@thecaveofculture I loved it too. The story is interesting the acting was very good and it looked beautiful.
I think I was biased going into 1899 and expecting it to be as good as Dark. I let my speculation become my expectation.
That being said...
I still think Dark is the superior show.
if you await exactly the same as dark you might be.. because thats the problem with some people. I mean look at Spielberg, He made Jaws, E.T. and Schindlers List for example. 3 total different shows. Here in 1899 you see their "Style" but its complete different. Also we dont know how the Show goes on. After the first season of dark you had the same sayings over it. Dark rly took off with the second season. I rly Like 1899, is it like Dark, No. But why repeat things? They said before it will be different kind of mystery.
No, no it didn't copy that
Good that they used no Circle or squares yet. Jeez. Everything was already there... Even the Matrix wasnt rly an 100% original story. The World Simulation aspect comes from the book Simulacron-3. And even that dates back to what they also use in 1899. "plato cave allegory".
audiovisual plagiarism is not just taking the whole story, it will use images or characterization of nitendo personas for you the process that can take. Brazil here
I'm interested in how this progresses. Can we compare timelines of release and production to get certain proof?
It's clear as day that the stories themselves are nothing alike and the surface level similarities are the use of the same widely used shape but in different ways. Black triangle in iris when they sleep =/= full eye white triangle all the time from infection. Black pyramid of unknown material and black shiny crystals in ice =/= black pyramid in desert.
It's clear to me there's nothing solid in favour of plagiarism, maybe there can be evidence solidly against plagiarism.
The thing has 43 issues and the first collection (with issues 1 to 6) came out in 2014 and the last collection (issues 39 to 43) in 2019. In English that is...
I am not sure but I guess we can safely assume that she did all the artwork before bo and Jantje were finishing up DARK and had time for a new project.
But yeah so far we saw some similarities and I am still certain that if we looked at all those issues page by page we could equally come up with other works that used similar imagery before... I mean... her comparision to Emily Beecham awakening on the spaceship? That is every female character in a spacesuit in a close-up.