It’s amazing that in this day and age, a major car manufacturer hasn’t figured out how to properly seal an oil pan that would not potentially cause a major issue. Totally baffling.
Subaru just doesn’t give a shit. There’s no reason to put a boxer in a modern cheap car, it’s just a worse design than an i4. But they don’t it because they can’t do any better. Stop buying these things, you already know it’s going to have a stupid problem in advance.
This could be a disastrous problem for Subaru/Toyota. The biggest selling point of these cars is their track/autocross ability and the biggest upside to them not being turbo'd is that NA cars should be more reliable... If it's gonna have a known failure Id like to actually at least make power before it breaks. 🤣
I mean it's a pretty simple fix and then they're perfectly reliable. It just got blown out of proportion because of toyota not staying true to warranty. If subaru did the same with all their previous issues with the EJ engines, then they would've been sued 100 times over. It's very likely that almost every performance car, the first few model years will have some occasional catastrophic issues. Don't buy the first model year, or don't complain.
@@Toymonkeyjr thats fair. Disasterous was too strong of a word. My concern is mote about the perception of the warranty than the actual failures. Lots of buyers who may have been considering buying one and tracking it are now going to have second thoughts and consider another car instead when they would not have had this story never happened.
the RTV issue could almost completely avoided by using anaerobic sealant like permatex 51845 where ever possible. Anaerobic only cures where it is clamped between 2 machined surfaces. any extra just oozes out and mixes with the oil and is drained out next oil change. only downside to anaerobic is it cant be use on sheet metal stuff like stamped steel oil pans- for those you still need RTV. but anything machined like the timing cover, block halves, aluminum oil pans, oil pump etc anaerobic works flawless with zero chance of using too much.
Funny enough, I just started work for a Subaru dealer 2 months ago. Silicone must still be a factory issue because in the past 3 weeks theres been about 4 or 5 2022 N/A Outbacks coming in with lower oil pans leaking through the silicone, some techs are thinking it set for too long before being installed
@@07wrxtr1 Welp, may as well wait for GR corolla(or Yaris if you live outside of the US) Or maybe the rumored MR2 if it does ever come out. Since that's actually made by Toyota lmao.
Isn't the "gold standard" for RTV to bolt the pan down immediately after application to hand tight, then cure to spec before torquing to final torque? I waited a few days to torque to spec but I was waiting on parts anyways.
I feel like people are making a bigger issue out of this than it really needs to be. Like every car has its own issues, there is no perfect completely “bulletproof” car. For example ND Miatas were blowing up transmissions on stock power during autotocross and track use. (Heck they still are, many are falling out of warranty now too) Nissan Zs burn oil… I can go on. Yet, why is no one crying a river and foaming at the mouth for those design flaws? It’s the first year production run of the 2nd gen, I bet you this will be fixed and no issue going forward. I’m pretty sure Toyota has been eating the repair bill ultimately in the end. I’m glad these cars even being made. Given there is no lightweight rwd coupes on the market. At this rate we won’t have any sports cars how much enthusiasts complain.
@@lawnmower6591 Every production car has its flaws and issues especially in the first model year. The first gen 86/BRZ had a similar issue that was later corrected. Then when the facelift or kouki model came out was eliminated entirely. I wouldn’t let all this stuff sway you away from buying one of these cars. I’d argue there’s a higher chance you may not have issues at all. My 2017 has been a great car and experience 🤷🏻♂️
I knew a problem was going to arise with this new 2nd BRZ/GR86 Gen for the first few years of production. Guess I’m going to have to wait a couple years of production until they sort out all the common problems, issues, and bugs. Safest bet is to wait until the refresh model but I and no one want to wait that long.
Worked at toyota in australia when they first came out. there was a heap of "soft" recalls that weren't know about. Tail lights not being tightened enough was one for example.
Until excess RTV issue can be resolved, I think Subaru should replace the oil pan with an oil pan with larger plug size that has been moved directly under the oil pickup tube, so the strainer can be inspected and/or cleaned out during oil change.
Someone else argued the strainer should be placed at the bottom of the pick up where debris can still fall down rather than at the top where it currently is and debris gets stuck.
@@CMAutohaus I thought about that earlier and it is an option. The only problem I see with that option is screen surface area. It would have to be at least equal strainer surface area. If you look at current screen/strainer, there a top horizontal screen and 4 vertical walls of screen. Also if the screen was at the bottom with large surface area, you would be in the same position of having to drop headers and pulling pan to clean strainer. However, it is an option.
I have misfires in 3 cylinders on a 2023 GR86 with 4500 miles, that's never been redlined, and has the rev warning set at 4500 RPM. No error codes but my OBD2 scanner seems to indicate a few misfires during the last 10 cycles... Typically maybe one to two. I hope the engine isn't permanently damaged. Car seems to drive fine.
Spot on about working directly with corporate. That’s how I got a new crankshaft on my 2009 Honda CBR1000RR for a known crank whine issue. The dealer didn’t want to perform the tests, so I called and emailed corporate.
Its even tougher in the US auto industry where dealer technicians are literally getting paid half of their normal wage on warranty jobs Like why even try to do a good job when you are getting half your normal wage. Why not just pretend you cant duplicate the customer concern and more on to the next repair ticket.
@@CMAutohaus Wow, half rate? That is the worst incentive if I ever saw one! No wonder so many people complain of cars never being the same after warranty work. Is it the manufacturer only paying half rate or is the dealer service manager pocketing the half?
algorithm recommended this to me. You have an audio issue with this video. Sound only coming through right channel, except for the DINNNNG. Other than that, great video. Worked at toyota for a bit and they had recalls that weren't acknowledged (the tail lights for example).
Hey if oil is leaking out. At least you know some oil is still in there. That's what all the Land Rover owners say anyway. Nice oil patch under my Land Rover on my drive too so. Honestly though I would rather a small oil leak than excess RTV clogging up the oil pickup or if any of this gets into a oil gallery. RIP
It may be worth a potential buyers time to research RTV use as an engine sealant, in particularly, the degradation over time induced by temperature cycling. It appears to me, based on my research, it would not be the sealant of choice. It also explains increased oil use over time. One may also want to research the effects of oil consumption in an engine. All was very intresting from a technical perspective.
@@CMAutohaus I used to work for BBB Auto Line. An arbitrator has some leeway to decide what is relevant to a claim and a judge would use rules of evidence under that jurisdiction.
My 22 wrx went in for warranty at 57k miles because the upper oil pan was leaking. That job requires them to pull the motor. I told them to check the pickup and they called me to tell me there was a bit in there. All fixed under warranty.
I luv the BRZ, but the engineering side of me would not let me proceed with my order for the 2023. It was officially canceled today, so there will be an xtra one on the market. I wish all of you the best of luck with your BRZ/GR86. Again, thanks for the great video.
Excellent video. On 1st gen of BRZ/86, did you see RTV engine failure only in early years of gen 1, i.e. 2013, 2014? Have you seen this failure in later years of gen 1, i.e. 2019, 2020? Hoping to hear no failure seen in later years of gen 1 as Subaru should have RTV application process locked down in production by then. Thanks.
Thank you for the kind words. In my experience, it seems like the Kouki 1st gens dont have this issue and the RTV issue with the Zenki cars was caused by technicians - not the factory
The RTV issue on early first-gen was from technicians incorrectly performing the valve spring recall - anything produced MY15+ wouldn't have had that issue as the valve springs were updated by then 😊 So to be clear, no RTV issues from factory throughout the life of the first-gen. It's difficult to say they should have the process locked down for second-gen since it is a different motor to the first-gen cars - same family but 2.4L now. If you're keen on buying one I'd honestly wait 1-2 years or so for them to sort out any warranty issues that pop up.
@@tomh434 You are absolutely correct. But to be more alittle more specific, the 1st gen valve springs were updated during the 2013 model year. Meaning every 2014 has the updated valve springs, and a lot of 2013’s have them as well. For the 2013’s you would need to check each car’s VIN individually before buying. A quick few minutes to save $$$ is probably worth it to buyers who are looking for the best deal on a FRS/BRZ. I have a 2013 with the newer springs from factory that never had a recall issued.
Yes Subaru needs to fix this issue. These are modern times and it’s ridiculous that they are having manufacturing issues like this. Just like the stupid head gasket thing that they tried to ignore before finally addressing it. Not smart
The thing is, even tiny worms of silicone can break free and they are actually worse because they can go up suction tubes easier than large worms of silicone. Also, it can take a couple of years for this to happen, so if you see the silicone in the borescope you can't tell the customer they are OK because it could happen next week or 12 months from now. I had a Toyota Celica that it didn't happen to for FOUR years then it did and killed the engine due to oil starvation (note that the low oil pressure light NEVER came on!!!)... My 6th Toyota I owned but they wouldn't do anything so it was the last too.
@@GreatGrandmasterWang the intake oil SCREEN catches the worms of gasket and THAT clogs and causes oil starvation to the pump and everything downstream. So it's a problem before the oil filter. Note I learned the hard way to make sure all the varnish was out of the head oil passages on a rebuild one time. The shop that did the valve seats and machined the deck had solvent tanked the head but evidently not long enough or hadn't blown it out well either. So the varnish became small flakes off the head areas and washed down into the oil pan. Picked up the car, everything looked fine and started driving home. Oil pressure light came on 20 miles down the road. The shop that did the head job wouldn't take any responsibility so I had it hauled home and dropped the pan and found the varnish flakes just totally covering the oil pickup screen! This was anotherToyota Cellica (yes, I liked them) with 162k miles and it has always had good oil changes and showed great oil pressure prior to this but it was enough to wipe the bearings, pulled a main and it was trashed. So a head job I farmed out instead of doing myself cost me a whole engine rebuild (note that I drove that car another 200k AFTER the rebuild and finally the rear end went out so I moved on, good car) What was REALLY bad and why I'd had the head job done 'professionally' instead of doing it myself was my wife was pregnant and about to pop... So as I had the engine pulled out hanging on the hoist she came outside to tell me I needed to take her to the hospital, it was time. Delayed the rebuild a couple of days. Why did that bullet proof 22R engine need a head? Well, my wife raced it and a week before she'd sheared the OHC in half RIGHT INSIDE THE MIDDLE BEARING! So the front two cyl were running and the back two were dead! She told me the car had started running rough and had no power, hahaha. And that's why I had to buy a salvage yard head and have it reworked (and a shop do the job instead of me since I was snowed under with other work)
I got a 2013, I'm using thicker oil + larger pick-up for better oil pressure + baffles with flaps + I overfill the tank slightly. I did over 30 time attack events on the track, revving to 7800 RPM, I never had a problem!
Thicker oil will exacerbate any issues caused by a blocked screen because of turbulence? Overfilling is probably fine as you super don't want to even be a milliliter under filled with these but yeah..
You think Toyota/Subaru will resolve this issue for their 2023 models? Maybe it’s too late if they already started production for 2023 before realizing this issue?
If im not mistaken this same issue already existed with the gt86 and brz, but wtf that was in 2017 and its already 2023 and this still exist same sealant issue in the same part, i dunno but maybe im mistaken
I saw your video on Tiktok about this! and it being my achievable dream car it kind of stirred me away from it sadly :( maybe the 2023 model will fix this?
With all due respect, i think this is getting into the territory of content creation rather than actual problem highlighting; there is no such thing as clear used oil or clean filter if the oil ran the range. I have worked with AMG and commercial benz vehicles and there is always debris and impurities especially with thinner oils. Rtv is overblown and will not cause engine failure unless you are extremely pushing the car on track with the wrong oil, but yet again , many causes of failure can kick in at this point way before RTV starts getting in the picture.
This is an old problem. My 13 got blown up after the Subaru techs did the valve spring recall. The pick up tube was completely clogged and blew the bearings within 400 miles. Subaru claimed it wasn’t their fault and I went back and forth with them for 6 months. No luck. Loved the car but will never buy a Subaru again.
What a great video! Love the information you provided here. Very helpful. Curious if there is a benefit when they switched over to silicone sealant instead of a traditional metal or paper gasket? Hoping it wasn't just cost related
@@saulespino2510 Ive never owned a "Subaru." I used to own a Series 1.0 FRS which I used to compete in time attack. Right now my fleet consistes of: 2015 Tacoma Xrunner, 1994 R33 Skyline, 1985 AE86
Not only I'm worried about excess sealant, I am also worried about how YT is shutting down every comment I attempt to make, with 3rd party independent article and photos associated with that incident featured in 0:21 of this video. There is no more freedom of speech/expression on YT.
Make me wonder Toyota should’ve opt’d for the inline 4 or force Kaizen on Subaru I was expecting better or at least addressing the flaws of the FA engine.
force kaizen? Every single car manufacturer kaizens their vehicles, just to a lesser or more extent. This is a RTV issue, nothing to kaizen other than dial back the RTV on the assembly robot. Toyota wanted lower CG, that's why they went with Subaru (plus Toyota is majority share holder), so no they wouldn't have wanted an inline 4.
BRZ owners. Call your Subie dealer and tell them you want a visit to drop the oilpan to inspect for RTV silicone. It's considered a diagnostic procedure and will cost you NADA Your welcomed
Have you done this yourself? Unless there is a real failure (ie smoke from tail pipe, noise, oil consumption) to my knowledge, the dealer will not do a tear down.
@@CMAutohaus my subie service guy said it is a diagnostic service for rtv sil they drop it pick my car up for no charge. I have had no problems w the car. Glad I didn't get an 86 even though I love that cool blue 86.
My car failed after getting the valve spring recall done. Tons of silicon buildup in the pickup and my car starved for oil and engine failed on the freeway. Subaru refuses to fix even though I paid them $2500 for the full engine reseal :(
Questions; What is the oil pressure switch/alarm set at? Also what is design oil pressure for the 2.4L boxer? Wished subaru had fixed RTV problem and glad they put in larger surface area screen, but they should have put on oil pan cover that allowed for easy cleanout during oil change and installed an oil pressure gauge as opposed to switch. Thanks for video.
The oil pressure switch is useless in a Subaru: you can have oil pressure with 1 qt of oil in the engine. I use to see this all the time on schedule maintenance. Subaru's oil consumption spec is 1 qt in 1,300 miles. So if you followed the 6 month 7500 mile oil change spec and never topped off your oil, I'd normal to only have 1 qt of oil left in your engine come oil change time - no warning lights. Saw it all the time.
Im curious as to why issues like this still pop up, when engines have been manufactured for so many decades now with robots. Wouldn't the correct application of sealant have some sort of standard practice by now?
I imagine it depends on the gap between the pan and the element it sits up against, as well as other factors like the size of the lip etc. So I would guess it's not just that it's by a robot, because the robot wouldn't be aware of those factors - it would be the amount of silicon it's been told to apply... which might be too much for the specs mentioned above.
@@Briguy288 I mean, you could say that about any mistake :) Things get missed. For something like this, hidden away in a hard to see place, I assume it's possibly something the QA inspectors didn't pick up on. Once it causes an issue for people they would become aware of it. Anything is possible though - maybe there is a malfunction with one of the robots that the nozzle puts out too much silicon, who knows really.
I was scared at first. But with the warranty I should be fine. I asked their service department if I can pull the pan to inspect, if I do I void the warranty. Oh well I just daily and do some 'spirited' driving. Subaru however will let you pull the pan and not void the warranty. It's still sketchy but we will see! If your social media names are on your car, they will search for anything! Rip them stickers off before taking it in lol
"I asked their service department if I can pull the pan to inspect, if I do I void the warranty." This isn't true. You could pull the pan and look. The laws covering warranties say they have to prove something you did caused a problem before they can deny it. If you screwed the job up and leaked all the oil out, then they wouldn't have to cover it.
This is what I did to my 2014 Scion FRS. I used a machine that pumps boiling hot diesel thru the oil filter area using a supplied adapter. At the bottom of the oil pan; another adapter was installed where the drain plug goes. The pressure of the diesel will remove anything on the engine including debris of silicone, metal, engine gunk, even carbon soot.
I have a question... Does the risk of this silicone breaking off increase with engine temp. For example, if someone is at a track day seeing excess temps, would the risk of all the silicone breaking of increase ?
I think the short answer is to pull the oil pan and check yourself. I actually already have Gen2 customers asking to remove the oil pan, clean the oil strainer, and remove excess silicone as a service. Dont risk it, not that much labor time to remove and reseal the lower oil pan.
@Arun kumar I used to have a Gen1 I ran in time attack (86Drive Challenge). Very first things I did: Reseal oil pan/check oil pick up, Bluemoon oil pan baffle, Jackson oil cooler kit, ARP wheel studs
@@Arunkumar-bg5xk Any premium 0w20 is fine with an oil cooler. 5w30 has been recommended for forced induction guys. Never track your car w/ out can oil cooler
This is much worse than BMW gasket failure problem What happens when the parts that the silicone deteriorates to the point that everything it's supposed to seal start leaking (cams, valve covers, etc)? Also there's so much silicone that the RTV problem seems to be the gift that keeps giving. How often do you need to clean out the drain pan?
If RTV is used to seal several joints in the motor assembly, is it possible that the over-application of sealant in other joints could lead to future catastrophic failures as serious as this one?
Any info or rumors as to whether the RTV issues have been addressed with the “2024” BRZ or GR86? Any input is appreciated. I am ordering a 2024 BRZ Limited. I will not be tracking the car or pushing it extremely. I am retired and just want a fun car for my daily driver (under 5k miles per year).
well, I had my eyes set on the toyota twin, but if they're being pissy and selective about the warranty, I'd rather go with the brz. It seems like toyota won't honor it if you remove the oil pan to clean the crap out, at least from what i've read. Rather not wait until the engine seizes to take advantage of the warranty IF they even honor it. I was never planning to track or drive terribly hard either, just a fun daily that i can enjoy driving every day. Or is it worth to bite the bullet and risk voiding if it means i don't need to worry about the RTV down the road? Idk man, still gonna wait until at least the '23 model year, maybe one more to be sure.
In my experience, Subaru has be far kinder to its customers. I've seen miracles happen during my time as a dealer tech ie. a car with 60k miles get bought back.
I actually want the get the 2nd Gen 86 for myself to keep forever But since that video poped up how the dudes engine blew I was very worried As you cleared it up I now know why it did. Now I am still considering getting the 1st Gen 86 over the 2nd Gen Because a Dealer wanted to sneakly sell me a Rent 86 for the full price of a new one. I still dont know man.
@@CMAutohaus ill keep that option in mind It's just that I'm worried about its engine durability from the design perspective. Never had a boxer engine myself. And I did took the worst time to buy a car with interest charges been too high (7.1%)
I dont recommend Subaru cars to anyone. I dont believe in Subaru of America's morals, how they treat their employees, or the build quality of their cars.
Dont be. They are wonderful cars, I want one myself. But the key is regular preventative maintenance and measures like borescope and oil filter inspections
I asked Toyota Canada if they would be addressing the RTV issue in the GR86. This was their response. I guess there is not an issue in Canada. lol. "Thank you for your recent correspondence. We are so delighted to hear of your interest in our Toyota vehicles. At this time, we do not have any information to conclude that the Canadian Toyota GR86 engine is experiencing the issue you have brought to our attention. We assure you that customer satisfaction is a priority and would like the opportunity to clarify our position. Firstly, Toyota Canada Inc. and Toyota Motor Sales, U.S.A. (TMS) are separate business entities, as such, our vehicle offerings, recalls and warranty enhancements will differ. With that in mind, we should explain that the terms and conditions of recalls imposed by TMS are valid for vehicles which were manufactured for the US market, our vehicles are not identical. We have noted your request and would like to explain that Toyota Canada Inc., as the distributor, is not involved in the retail sale of vehicles. To discuss the conditions of a purchase, it will be necessary for you to speak with the sales department at the Toyota dealership of your choice. "
Is Subaru pulling the same type of "alleged" BS? If not, probably less of a headache to get the Subaru BRZ version, instead. (Even though I know the Toyota badged version is different in some ways.)
I personally dont own one of these chassis, but our shop services majority of these in the greater Bay Area. The key with the big oil pressure drops on right turns is the stickier the tire and the more skilled the driver, the bigger oil pressure drops.
It's not the boxer engine design it's Subaru's build quality etc. I have owned several Porsche's and never had any major problems with their engines. I put well over 100k miles on a couple of them. Toyota should have put one of their 4 cylinders in the thing to begin with.
many of the places just doing a cork gasket would be super cheap, easy and more reliable. I wonder why they keep preferring RTV on all areas, what is the mfg cost benefit?
Apparently it saves a ton of cost just to have the robot silicone everything instead of having PNs for a bunch a gaskets The kicker is that Subaru uses basically the same engines across their model lines, so it wouldnt be that many PNs
Yes. But you'd have to pay out of pocket then hope the technician takes pride in his work - under the flat rate system, you are paid by how fast you do a job, not how well you do it which is why so much work that comes out of dealerships is half ass or downright dishonest. Fun example: 2006 legacy cabin filters are a bit of a pain to replace because of all the interior clips - I used to work with a tech who would just straight throw the cabin filter away and flag the labor time because FLAT RATE!
@@CMAutohaus How is it being handled here? I am thinking of getting the GR86, but now i dont know. The Honda Civic Type R 2023 looks quite appealing too.
It’s amazing that in this day and age, a major car manufacturer hasn’t figured out how to properly seal an oil pan that would not potentially cause a major issue. Totally baffling.
"Baffling" lol...punny
the really amazing part is that plenty of guys with little knowledge in comparison to an OEM can seal a pan better in their garage
Subaru just doesn’t give a shit. There’s no reason to put a boxer in a modern cheap car, it’s just a worse design than an i4. But they don’t it because they can’t do any better. Stop buying these things, you already know it’s going to have a stupid problem in advance.
@@aluisious how is it worse
@@roboticunclephil overly complicated for what it is
This could be a disastrous problem for Subaru/Toyota. The biggest selling point of these cars is their track/autocross ability and the biggest upside to them not being turbo'd is that NA cars should be more reliable... If it's gonna have a known failure Id like to actually at least make power before it breaks. 🤣
Its what make a Subaru...a Subaru
Their engines have been unreliable for a good long time and sales are only increasing so I doubt this is going to hurt them in the long run.
I mean it's a pretty simple fix and then they're perfectly reliable. It just got blown out of proportion because of toyota not staying true to warranty. If subaru did the same with all their previous issues with the EJ engines, then they would've been sued 100 times over. It's very likely that almost every performance car, the first few model years will have some occasional catastrophic issues. Don't buy the first model year, or don't complain.
@@Toymonkeyjr thats fair. Disasterous was too strong of a word. My concern is mote about the perception of the warranty than the actual failures. Lots of buyers who may have been considering buying one and tracking it are now going to have second thoughts and consider another car instead when they would not have had this story never happened.
@@Bones12x2 Everyone I know who wants one is still trying to get one lol, this hasn't stopped them at all. just something to be anxious about.
engine colonoscopy was not what I was expecting to watch today
My assitant had the same sentiments while we were filming
My right ear really enjoyed this
Apologies for the sound!
With all the money they spend fixing these, wouldn't the extra cost of using an actual gasket be worth it?
That’s my question.
Ridiculously informative!
Thanks for the kind words. We do our best!
the RTV issue could almost completely avoided by using anaerobic sealant like permatex 51845 where ever possible. Anaerobic only cures where it is clamped between 2 machined surfaces. any extra just oozes out and mixes with the oil and is drained out next oil change. only downside to anaerobic is it cant be use on sheet metal stuff like stamped steel oil pans- for those you still need RTV. but anything machined like the timing cover, block halves, aluminum oil pans, oil pump etc anaerobic works flawless with zero chance of using too much.
Thanks for inspecting my car! Glad I’m in the clear 😅
So many chances for commentary that would get me in trouble with HR.
Toyota should have used their G16E engine for the latest gen GR86…help spread the cost of it around and up the performance of the car.
Funny enough, I just started work for a Subaru dealer 2 months ago. Silicone must still be a factory issue because in the past 3 weeks theres been about 4 or 5 2022 N/A Outbacks coming in with lower oil pans leaking through the silicone, some techs are thinking it set for too long before being installed
Its what makes a Subaru - a Subaru
@@CMAutohaus I'll never own another subaru product... we're done!! Toyota/Lexus for now on... after I'm done with this 370z...
@@07wrxtr1 GR86 is a Toyota product lol. Toyota also owns a large stake in Fuji Heavy Industries (Subaru).
@@07wrxtr1 Welp, may as well wait for GR corolla(or Yaris if you live outside of the US) Or maybe the rumored MR2 if it does ever come out. Since that's actually made by Toyota lmao.
Isn't the "gold standard" for RTV to bolt the pan down immediately after application to hand tight, then cure to spec before torquing to final torque? I waited a few days to torque to spec but I was waiting on parts anyways.
I feel like people are making a bigger issue out of this than it really needs to be. Like every car has its own issues, there is no perfect completely “bulletproof” car. For example ND Miatas were blowing up transmissions on stock power during autotocross and track use. (Heck they still are, many are falling out of warranty now too) Nissan Zs burn oil… I can go on. Yet, why is no one crying a river and foaming at the mouth for those design flaws?
It’s the first year production run of the 2nd gen, I bet you this will be fixed and no issue going forward. I’m pretty sure Toyota has been eating the repair bill ultimately in the end. I’m glad these cars even being made. Given there is no lightweight rwd coupes on the market. At this rate we won’t have any sports cars how much enthusiasts complain.
I hope ur right bro. I still want to get the 86 in Jan of next year.
@@lawnmower6591 Every production car has its flaws and issues especially in the first model year. The first gen 86/BRZ had a similar issue that was later corrected. Then when the facelift or kouki model came out was eliminated entirely. I wouldn’t let all this stuff sway you away from buying one of these cars. I’d argue there’s a higher chance you may not have issues at all. My 2017 has been a great car and experience 🤷🏻♂️
@Christian Medrano thank you bro. I'll keep you updated.
I knew a problem was going to arise with this new 2nd BRZ/GR86 Gen for the first few years of production. Guess I’m going to have to wait a couple years of production until they sort out all the common problems, issues, and bugs. Safest bet is to wait until the refresh model but I and no one want to wait that long.
Yeah I was surprise to see them be this "reliable" as a first model year...until now.
Worked at toyota in australia when they first came out. there was a heap of "soft" recalls that weren't know about. Tail lights not being tightened enough was one for example.
@@Mr_jz_12 Agreed. You had to manually sift through the TSBs or tech tip news letters to find them.
have fun waiting then
@@Sinancan93 Rude but ok. Have fun spending money on a brand new ticking bomb car engine.
How you don't have more subs is mind boggling
Appreciate the kind words! Just doing my best to produce quality, informative content.
The Trueno in the back is what had my attention for most of the video lol
Someone noted the grey 85 Trueno in pt1. Knew I had to have this one in the background for pt2.
love the old ae86 behind you, id love to have one of those one day
I was really hoping that when you looked in the oil pan with the borescope we'd see Sponge Bob having a party in there!
Like when spongebob left and the jellyfish were having a rave in his house. I know - one can only dream...
Until excess RTV issue can be resolved, I think Subaru should replace the oil pan with an oil pan with larger plug size that has been moved directly under the oil pickup tube, so the strainer can be inspected and/or cleaned out during oil change.
Someone else argued the strainer should be placed at the bottom of the pick up where debris can still fall down rather than at the top where it currently is and debris gets stuck.
@@CMAutohaus
I thought about that earlier and it is an option. The only problem I see with that option is screen surface area. It would have to be at least equal strainer surface area. If you look at current screen/strainer, there a top horizontal screen and 4 vertical walls of screen. Also if the screen was at the bottom with large surface area, you would be in the same position of having to drop headers and pulling pan to clean strainer. However, it is an option.
I have misfires in 3 cylinders on a 2023 GR86 with 4500 miles, that's never been redlined, and has the rev warning set at 4500 RPM. No error codes but my OBD2 scanner seems to indicate a few misfires during the last 10 cycles... Typically maybe one to two. I hope the engine isn't permanently damaged. Car seems to drive fine.
toyobaru needs to address and issue a recall. cars with less than 13000 miles shudnt b dying
There have been lawsuits for oil consumption also for Subaru chain engines in the past.
Lol toyobaru
Spot on about working directly with corporate. That’s how I got a new crankshaft on my 2009 Honda CBR1000RR for a known crank whine issue. The dealer didn’t want to perform the tests, so I called and emailed corporate.
Its even tougher in the US auto industry where dealer technicians are literally getting paid half of their normal wage on warranty jobs
Like why even try to do a good job when you are getting half your normal wage. Why not just pretend you cant duplicate the customer concern and more on to the next repair ticket.
@@CMAutohaus Wow, half rate? That is the worst incentive if I ever saw one! No wonder so many people complain of cars never being the same after warranty work. Is it the manufacturer only paying half rate or is the dealer service manager pocketing the half?
This video loves my right ear
algorithm recommended this to me. You have an audio issue with this video. Sound only coming through right channel, except for the DINNNNG. Other than that, great video. Worked at toyota for a bit and they had recalls that weren't acknowledged (the tail lights for example).
Thanks for the watch and sorry about the audio!
A fair take. A lot of articles are trying to make the car look like a live grenade.
Hey if oil is leaking out. At least you know some oil is still in there.
That's what all the Land Rover owners say anyway. Nice oil patch under my Land Rover on my drive too so.
Honestly though I would rather a small oil leak than excess RTV clogging up the oil pickup or if any of this gets into a oil gallery. RIP
It may be worth a potential buyers time to research RTV use as an engine sealant, in particularly, the degradation over time induced by temperature cycling. It appears to me, based on my research, it would not be the sealant of choice. It also explains increased oil use over time. One may also want to research the effects of oil consumption in an engine. All was very intresting from a technical perspective.
A handwritten note with a signature might mean something to a judge or an arbitrator if it goes that far...
As a technical we are taught that repair orders are legal documents. I still wouldnt take the chance on something handwritten.
@@CMAutohaus I used to work for BBB Auto Line. An arbitrator has some leeway to decide what is relevant to a claim and a judge would use rules of evidence under that jurisdiction.
Thanks for the information! Also, please balance the sound next time as the sound is coming from the right ear only...
Noted and will do! Apologies for the sound!
@@CMAutohaus love the content that you do man!
Now there is no sound at all...
@@HyadumHH Sound is from right side only, Check your headphones/speakers
@@CMAutohaus It is only on the right side only. Disorienting when listening through headphones.
My 22 wrx went in for warranty at 57k miles because the upper oil pan was leaking. That job requires them to pull the motor. I told them to check the pickup and they called me to tell me there was a bit in there. All fixed under warranty.
I luv the BRZ, but the engineering side of me would not let me proceed with my order for the 2023. It was officially canceled today, so there will be an xtra one on the market. I wish all of you the best of luck with your BRZ/GR86.
Again, thanks for the great video.
Wow I wish Subaru saw your comment that you just canceled. Should be a BIG red flag for the company.
Excellent video. On 1st gen of BRZ/86, did you see RTV engine failure only in early years of gen 1, i.e. 2013, 2014? Have you seen this failure in later years of gen 1, i.e. 2019, 2020? Hoping to hear no failure seen in later years of gen 1 as Subaru should have RTV application process locked down in production by then. Thanks.
Thank you for the kind words. In my experience, it seems like the Kouki 1st gens dont have this issue and the RTV issue with the Zenki cars was caused by technicians - not the factory
The RTV issue on early first-gen was from technicians incorrectly performing the valve spring recall - anything produced MY15+ wouldn't have had that issue as the valve springs were updated by then 😊
So to be clear, no RTV issues from factory throughout the life of the first-gen.
It's difficult to say they should have the process locked down for second-gen since it is a different motor to the first-gen cars - same family but 2.4L now. If you're keen on buying one I'd honestly wait 1-2 years or so for them to sort out any warranty issues that pop up.
@@tomh434 You are absolutely correct. But to be more alittle more specific, the 1st gen valve springs were updated during the 2013 model year. Meaning every 2014 has the updated valve springs, and a lot of 2013’s have them as well. For the 2013’s you would need to check each car’s VIN individually before buying. A quick few minutes to save $$$ is probably worth it to buyers who are looking for the best deal on a FRS/BRZ. I have a 2013 with the newer springs from factory that never had a recall issued.
My right ear found this very informative.
Yes Subaru needs to fix this issue. These are modern times and it’s ridiculous that they are having manufacturing issues like this. Just like the stupid head gasket thing that they tried to ignore before finally addressing it. Not smart
I think that's why Toyota is testing their 3 cyl in this chassis - Subaru life lol
The thing is, even tiny worms of silicone can break free and they are actually worse because they can go up suction tubes easier than large worms of silicone. Also, it can take a couple of years for this to happen, so if you see the silicone in the borescope you can't tell the customer they are OK because it could happen next week or 12 months from now.
I had a Toyota Celica that it didn't happen to for FOUR years then it did and killed the engine due to oil starvation (note that the low oil pressure light NEVER came on!!!)... My 6th Toyota I owned but they wouldn't do anything so it was the last too.
Excellent point. Noted.
Wouldn’t the oil filter catch them?
@@GreatGrandmasterWang the intake oil SCREEN catches the worms of gasket and THAT clogs and causes oil starvation to the pump and everything downstream. So it's a problem before the oil filter.
Note I learned the hard way to make sure all the varnish was out of the head oil passages on a rebuild one time. The shop that did the valve seats and machined the deck had solvent tanked the head but evidently not long enough or hadn't blown it out well either. So the varnish became small flakes off the head areas and washed down into the oil pan. Picked up the car, everything looked fine and started driving home. Oil pressure light came on 20 miles down the road. The shop that did the head job wouldn't take any responsibility so I had it hauled home and dropped the pan and found the varnish flakes just totally covering the oil pickup screen! This was anotherToyota Cellica (yes, I liked them) with 162k miles and it has always had good oil changes and showed great oil pressure prior to this but it was enough to wipe the bearings, pulled a main and it was trashed. So a head job I farmed out instead of doing myself cost me a whole engine rebuild (note that I drove that car another 200k AFTER the rebuild and finally the rear end went out so I moved on, good car)
What was REALLY bad and why I'd had the head job done 'professionally' instead of doing it myself was my wife was pregnant and about to pop... So as I had the engine pulled out hanging on the hoist she came outside to tell me I needed to take her to the hospital, it was time. Delayed the rebuild a couple of days.
Why did that bullet proof 22R engine need a head? Well, my wife raced it and a week before she'd sheared the OHC in half RIGHT INSIDE THE MIDDLE BEARING! So the front two cyl were running and the back two were dead! She told me the car had started running rough and had no power, hahaha. And that's why I had to buy a salvage yard head and have it reworked (and a shop do the job instead of me since I was snowed under with other work)
I got a 2013, I'm using thicker oil + larger pick-up for better oil pressure + baffles with flaps + I overfill the tank slightly. I did over 30 time attack events on the track, revving to 7800 RPM, I never had a problem!
Thicker oil will exacerbate any issues caused by a blocked screen because of turbulence? Overfilling is probably fine as you super don't want to even be a milliliter under filled with these but yeah..
@@Ch3mG33k Well you would never want anything blocking the screen and while at it do some upgrades instead of doing just an inspection.
You think Toyota/Subaru will resolve this issue for their 2023 models? Maybe it’s too late if they already started production for 2023 before realizing this issue?
Who knows? But I'm not optimistic. Subaru/Toyota historically have liked to keep these issues "hush hush"
If RTV is in your oil filter than you have more issues that that, the strainer should stop RTV from even getting to your oil filter.
Some pieces are thin or small enough to pass through, but I 100% agree. Dangerous for RTV to pass through the strainer
If im not mistaken this same issue already existed with the gt86 and brz, but wtf that was in 2017 and its already 2023 and this still exist same sealant issue in the same part, i dunno but maybe im mistaken
Excess RTV in gen1 was dealer technician caused. In Gen2 it is a factory defect
Awesome video!!!
Glad you enjoyed it
I saw your video on Tiktok about this! and it being my achievable dream car it kind of stirred me away from it sadly :( maybe the 2023 model will fix this?
2024 possibly. Hopefully late 2023 models the factory will have fixed the RTV issue.
Just get a base model Camaro or Mustang (before they take away the manual transmission for the base model next year).
that trueno in the back 👀😍
If you all fix the RTV gasket before engine detonated, there won’t be a recalls for this car. Not enough to prove
Im sure I wont fix every one in the entire world, much less the Bay Area.
Im so screwed..... I'm going to have to basically drop the oil pan and header to check for oil sump blockage every time I do an oil change
I'd try every 10k miles until we get more data on the RTV situation
With all due respect, i think this is getting into the territory of content creation rather than actual problem highlighting; there is no such thing as clear used oil or clean filter if the oil ran the range. I have worked with AMG and commercial benz vehicles and there is always debris and impurities especially with thinner oils. Rtv is overblown and will not cause engine failure unless you are extremely pushing the car on track with the wrong oil, but yet again , many causes of failure can kick in at this point way before RTV starts getting in the picture.
This is an old problem. My 13 got blown up after the Subaru techs did the valve spring recall. The pick up tube was completely clogged and blew the bearings within 400 miles. Subaru claimed it wasn’t their fault and I went back and forth with them for 6 months. No luck. Loved the car but will never buy a Subaru again.
What a great video! Love the information you provided here. Very helpful. Curious if there is a benefit when they switched over to silicone sealant instead of a traditional metal or paper gasket? Hoping it wasn't just cost related
It was entirly cost related unfortunatly. During my time at Subaru we saw plenty of cost cutting throughout the chassis
@@CMAutohaus Do you own a Subaru? Would like to know what you drive now.
@@saulespino2510 Ive never owned a "Subaru." I used to own a Series 1.0 FRS which I used to compete in time attack.
Right now my fleet consistes of: 2015 Tacoma Xrunner, 1994 R33 Skyline, 1985 AE86
I peep the dream girl sticker on his welding machine
Hellz yeah. We need some sort of motivation!
watching with headphones. You have your audio set to the right side only
Not only I'm worried about excess sealant, I am also worried about how YT is shutting down every comment I attempt to make, with 3rd party independent article and photos associated with that incident featured in 0:21 of this video.
There is no more freedom of speech/expression on YT.
my right ear loved this
If someoneplans on tracking their BRZ/86. Is it worthwhile to drop the pan and try to cut away and remove any silicone that has squished out?
Absolutely worth it. Jackson racing Gen2 oil cooler kit is also out now
It's wild how true the Subaru oil leak memes really are.
"Truuuuu" - 2Chainz
Thank you for the information 🙌🏻
Thank YOU for the watch!
my right ear enjoyed this video
Make me wonder Toyota should’ve opt’d for the inline 4 or force Kaizen on Subaru I was expecting better or at least addressing the flaws of the FA engine.
Its what makes a Subaru...a Subaru
force kaizen? Every single car manufacturer kaizens their vehicles, just to a lesser or more extent. This is a RTV issue, nothing to kaizen other than dial back the RTV on the assembly robot. Toyota wanted lower CG, that's why they went with Subaru (plus Toyota is majority share holder), so no they wouldn't have wanted an inline 4.
BRZ owners. Call your Subie dealer and tell them you want a visit to drop the oilpan to inspect for RTV silicone. It's considered a diagnostic procedure and will cost you NADA
Your welcomed
Have you done this yourself? Unless there is a real failure (ie smoke from tail pipe, noise, oil consumption) to my knowledge, the dealer will not do a tear down.
@@CMAutohaus my subie service guy said it is a diagnostic service for rtv sil they drop it pick my car up for no charge. I have had no problems w the car. Glad I didn't get an 86 even though I love that cool blue 86.
My car failed after getting the valve spring recall done. Tons of silicon buildup in the pickup and my car starved for oil and engine failed on the freeway. Subaru refuses to fix even though I paid them $2500 for the full engine reseal :(
Questions; What is the oil pressure switch/alarm set at? Also what is design oil pressure for the 2.4L boxer?
Wished subaru had fixed RTV problem and glad they put in larger surface area screen, but they should have put on oil pan cover that allowed for easy cleanout during oil change and installed an oil pressure gauge as opposed to switch.
Thanks for video.
The oil pressure switch is useless in a Subaru: you can have oil pressure with 1 qt of oil in the engine. I use to see this all the time on schedule maintenance. Subaru's oil consumption spec is 1 qt in 1,300 miles. So if you followed the 6 month 7500 mile oil change spec and never topped off your oil, I'd normal to only have 1 qt of oil left in your engine come oil change time - no warning lights. Saw it all the time.
@@CMAutohaus Thank you
Always wanted to test drive the same model car. Impressive
Thank you!
It’s what makes a Subaru, a Subaru🔥
Great video man, Gen 1 here tho :P
Im curious as to why issues like this still pop up, when engines have been manufactured for so many decades now with robots. Wouldn't the correct application of sealant have some sort of standard practice by now?
I imagine it depends on the gap between the pan and the element it sits up against, as well as other factors like the size of the lip etc. So I would guess it's not just that it's by a robot, because the robot wouldn't be aware of those factors - it would be the amount of silicon it's been told to apply... which might be too much for the specs mentioned above.
@@MKu64 but wouldn't they have figured out how much before going into production?
@@Briguy288 I mean, you could say that about any mistake :) Things get missed. For something like this, hidden away in a hard to see place, I assume it's possibly something the QA inspectors didn't pick up on. Once it causes an issue for people they would become aware of it.
Anything is possible though - maybe there is a malfunction with one of the robots that the nozzle puts out too much silicon, who knows really.
Robot? Mistake? Its Skynet bro...
@@Briguy288 why not just use an actual gasket instead of using toothpaste lol
Updated news. Toyota is covering the engine under warranty
For that guy yes. But how many other will have to fight for their warrenty claims
@@CMAutohaus agreed. hopefully it sets precedence for others who have the same issue and they’ll cover them all
I contacted Subaru BRZ customer service and they were NOT aware of the issue. Please make a call.
Why would I have to buy a sport car to worry about it all the time
Agreed. At this point it seems like an accusump system is the answer - which is a ridiculous ask for the casual track/ autox enthusiast
@@CMAutohaus ma man
I was scared at first. But with the warranty I should be fine. I asked their service department if I can pull the pan to inspect, if I do I void the warranty. Oh well I just daily and do some 'spirited' driving. Subaru however will let you pull the pan and not void the warranty. It's still sketchy but we will see!
If your social media names are on your car, they will search for anything! Rip them stickers off before taking it in lol
"I asked their service department if I can pull the pan to inspect, if I do I void the warranty."
This isn't true. You could pull the pan and look. The laws covering warranties say they have to prove something you did caused a problem before they can deny it. If you screwed the job up and leaked all the oil out, then they wouldn't have to cover it.
@@quademasters249 that's what I thought! But I guess Toyota wants to fight us every way they can
:/ Im scared for my gr86 now
same ):
@@Zaratium can’t you both just get it checked out?
@@Barbwire710 i’ve heard it’s a $500 fee just to get it checked out :/
We are offering Bay Area customers a FREE borescope and oil filter inspection with purchase of an oil change for a limited time.
@@Zaratium wtf where do you live to be costing 500 just to inspect it?
This is what I did to my 2014 Scion FRS. I used a machine that pumps boiling hot diesel thru the oil filter area using a supplied adapter. At the bottom of the oil pan; another adapter was installed where the drain plug goes. The pressure of the diesel will remove anything on the engine including debris of silicone, metal, engine gunk, even carbon soot.
Im sorry, but that sounds terrible and I would NOT recommend anyone do that.
@@CMAutohaus I did it and is been working good so far. Even took the car to The Tail Of The Dragon and performed flawlessly
Thanks for the detailed video and all the advice! How does one "cut the filter open"?
Hack saw is the brute force way, but they make specific oil filter "cutter" or "inspection" tools.
I have a question... Does the risk of this silicone breaking off increase with engine temp. For example, if someone is at a track day seeing excess temps, would the risk of all the silicone breaking of increase ?
I think the short answer is to pull the oil pan and check yourself. I actually already have Gen2 customers asking to remove the oil pan, clean the oil strainer, and remove excess silicone as a service.
Dont risk it, not that much labor time to remove and reseal the lower oil pan.
@@CMAutohaus what about gen 1 ?
@Arun kumar I used to have a Gen1 I ran in time attack (86Drive Challenge). Very first things I did: Reseal oil pan/check oil pick up, Bluemoon oil pan baffle, Jackson oil cooler kit, ARP wheel studs
@@CMAutohaus thanks for all the info ? What oil did you run ? Will the Motul 300v 0w40 be ideal for the time attack ?
@@Arunkumar-bg5xk Any premium 0w20 is fine with an oil cooler. 5w30 has been recommended for forced induction guys.
Never track your car w/ out can oil cooler
They were offering free track days with the purchase of a GR86 😂. "Hear is your free ticket to void your warranty, sir."
This is much worse than BMW gasket failure problem
What happens when the parts that the silicone deteriorates to the point that everything it's supposed to seal start leaking (cams, valve covers, etc)?
Also there's so much silicone that the RTV problem seems to be the gift that keeps giving. How often do you need to clean out the drain pan?
These cars are still too new to see how often you have to clean the strainer. I'd like to drop another pan in one year.
If RTV is used to seal several joints in the motor assembly, is it possible that the over-application of sealant in other joints could lead to future catastrophic failures as serious as this one?
Absolutly
@@CMAutohaus :(
I wished they didn’t put a boxer engine… the car looks really clean it’s a shame
@@crazymonkey60123 it's not the engine's fault if it isn't assembled correctly
Is this a quality control issue rather than a design flaw issue?
Well put. Yes seems more like a QC issue as excess RTV is applied and also in the wrong places
Is it going to take a huge class action lawsuit to get Subaru to fix this?
Possibly. Theres been a few class action lawsuits against Subaru in the past.
Why doesn’t subaru use a gasket? How do they not know about this issue. A gasket is like $40
Any info or rumors as to whether the RTV issues have been addressed with the “2024” BRZ or GR86? Any input is appreciated. I am ordering a 2024 BRZ Limited. I will not be tracking the car or pushing it extremely. I am retired and just want a fun car for my daily driver (under 5k miles per year).
No official response, although Im sure Toyota/Subaru is aware of the issue as they made some updates on the later 2023s.
@@CMAutohaus thank you so much replying. I appreciate you and your channel.
well, I had my eyes set on the toyota twin, but if they're being pissy and selective about the warranty, I'd rather go with the brz. It seems like toyota won't honor it if you remove the oil pan to clean the crap out, at least from what i've read. Rather not wait until the engine seizes to take advantage of the warranty IF they even honor it. I was never planning to track or drive terribly hard either, just a fun daily that i can enjoy driving every day. Or is it worth to bite the bullet and risk voiding if it means i don't need to worry about the RTV down the road? Idk man, still gonna wait until at least the '23 model year, maybe one more to be sure.
In my experience, Subaru has be far kinder to its customers. I've seen miracles happen during my time as a dealer tech ie. a car with 60k miles get bought back.
Can you also use blackstone oil analysis? Send your oil to see what materials are in it?
yes
I actually want the get the 2nd Gen 86 for myself to keep forever
But since that video poped up how the dudes engine blew I was very worried
As you cleared it up I now know why it did.
Now I am still considering getting the 1st Gen 86 over the 2nd Gen
Because a Dealer wanted to sneakly sell me a Rent 86 for the full price of a new one.
I still dont know man.
If you want a gen2 get the Subaru variant as they actually honor the engine warrenty
@@CMAutohaus ill keep that option in mind
It's just that I'm worried about its engine durability from the design perspective.
Never had a boxer engine myself.
And I did took the worst time to buy a car with interest charges been too high (7.1%)
Can you should a video of which are the Subaru to buy. The most reliable ones. Looking forward to it.
I dont recommend Subaru cars to anyone. I dont believe in Subaru of America's morals, how they treat their employees, or the build quality of their cars.
Dang I put a deposit on a GR86 last week. Now I’m nervous 😓
Dont be. They are wonderful cars, I want one myself. But the key is regular preventative maintenance and measures like borescope and oil filter inspections
@@CMAutohaus You're not too far from me Ezekiel. I'll have to pay you a visit t least once to check that out. Thanks man
Gen 2 have the real problem.
I asked Toyota Canada if they would be addressing the RTV issue in the GR86. This was their response. I guess there is not an issue in Canada. lol.
"Thank you for your recent correspondence. We are so delighted to hear of your interest in our Toyota vehicles.
At this time, we do not have any information to conclude that the Canadian Toyota GR86 engine is experiencing the issue you have brought to our attention.
We assure you that customer satisfaction is a priority and would like the opportunity to clarify our position. Firstly, Toyota Canada Inc. and Toyota Motor Sales, U.S.A. (TMS) are separate business entities, as such, our vehicle offerings, recalls and warranty enhancements will differ. With that in mind, we should explain that the terms and conditions of recalls imposed by TMS are valid for vehicles which were manufactured for the US market, our vehicles are not identical.
We have noted your request and would like to explain that Toyota Canada Inc., as the distributor, is not involved in the retail sale of vehicles. To discuss the conditions of a purchase, it will be necessary for you to speak with the sales department at the Toyota dealership of your choice. "
Is Subaru pulling the same type of "alleged" BS? If not, probably less of a headache to get the Subaru BRZ version, instead. (Even though I know the Toyota badged version is different in some ways.)
It does seem like Subaru of America is far more willing to help than Toyota is.
@@CMAutohaus
I genuinely appreciate the honest reply. Thank you.
do you encounter the engine oil pressure drop on right turn when on track?
I personally dont own one of these chassis, but our shop services majority of these in the greater Bay Area. The key with the big oil pressure drops on right turns is the stickier the tire and the more skilled the driver, the bigger oil pressure drops.
Thanks for the detailed explanation, it all makes sense now 😑
Glad you found this useful!
@@CMAutohaus heard of any of the same issues with the FA24T? new Wrx?
@@jasoncee666 Good question. Not quite sure if the two share similarites like place of manufacturer, failure rate, ect But you bring up a great point
Should I be worried if I only use my car as a daily? I don't plan on ever tracking it.
Still has risks. I rarely worked on track cars during my time at the dealership which means 99% of issue were with street/daily driver cars
It's not the boxer engine design it's Subaru's build quality etc. I have owned several Porsche's and never had any major problems with their engines. I put well over 100k miles on a couple of them. Toyota should have put one of their 4 cylinders in the thing to begin with.
Should the 2022 wrx owners be concerned having the fa24?
Good question. Not quite sure if the two share similarites like place of manufacturer, failure rate, ect But you bring up a great point
Shiet, I may as well just save up not just for the car but an engine swap as well.
Great info! BTW You don't look old enough to have been around as long as you've stated...lol.
Thanks! Im 32 this year, started training when I was 15. Its the "Asian aging" thing - we never look our age
So I'm guessing the new BRZ is subject to the same thing.
Correct
Thanks for this Ezekiel!
Glad you found this useful!
thanks
Thank YOU for the watch!
Certified toyota moment
Fighting an engine failure warranty case. Oh what a feeling!
many of the places just doing a cork gasket would be super cheap, easy and more reliable. I wonder why they keep preferring RTV on all areas, what is the mfg cost benefit?
Apparently it saves a ton of cost just to have the robot silicone everything instead of having PNs for a bunch a gaskets
The kicker is that Subaru uses basically the same engines across their model lines, so it wouldnt be that many PNs
@@CMAutohaus Just another example of the robots actually making things worse
Contact the ABM area business manager for the brand.
Watching you, master Ferrari technician here. 🤣
No such thing for Toyota/Subaru. Contacting corperate directly as a consumer is protocall.
300k on my 5.0 mustang " no issues
Im right there with you. They dont make Toyota's like they used to.
Can't I just take the 86 to a toyota dealer and tell them to drop the oil pan and reseal?
Yes. But you'd have to pay out of pocket then hope the technician takes pride in his work - under the flat rate system, you are paid by how fast you do a job, not how well you do it which is why so much work that comes out of dealerships is half ass or downright dishonest.
Fun example: 2006 legacy cabin filters are a bit of a pain to replace because of all the interior clips - I used to work with a tech who would just straight throw the cabin filter away and flag the labor time because FLAT RATE!
@@CMAutohaus damn. How common is the RTV issue? I still want to get the 86 next year.
@@lawnmower6591 Every single vehicle is affected by excess RTV applied from the factory. Every. Single. One.
@CM Autohaus damn. I'm asking a few others and they're telling me to not really worry about it. Hopefully everything comes out good.
I just got a 2023 86? Do we know if they made any changes yet to fix this issue?
Answered in pt 2 ua-cam.com/video/MkfcPK2CcEw/v-deo.html
Crazy part is most first world countries there is legislation to protect consumers from this sort of shit from car manufactures
Yeah I forgot which article it was, but in the EU this is being handled differently than for us in the USA.
@@CMAutohaus How is it being handled here? I am thinking of getting the GR86, but now i dont know. The Honda Civic Type R 2023 looks quite appealing too.
@@MoreCharactersThanNeeded if only someone couod figure to take that CTR engine and drivetrain and drop it in the GR86, it would be the perfect car.
@@Arunkumar-bg5xk a joint venture between Honda, Subaru and Toyota. Honda drivetrain, Subaru chassis and Toyota design of the next gen GR86