Only 1 in 10,000 guitar players every make more money than what they spend on equipment. If you don't enjoy playing, you're in the wrong business. Play because you enjoy playing, and who knows, good things might happen. And if they don't, you've still enjoyed yourself. Win, win.
This is a loser mentality. There are plenty of guitarists making money that barely know their instrument. Difference is, what they do know makes money. Too many guitarists worry about shredding and not worrying about playing and writing songs.
I am sure there were better bass players around, but In 1962, The Rolling Stones hired Bill Wyman because he had his own amplifier. You just never know.
I was recommended by another guitarist for an audition once. He couldn't do the gig due to previous commitments. It was an established "oldies" band. The drummer/music director loved me. When I showed up for the audition, I plugged in my Laney AOR 100 and Marshall 4x12 cabinet and the drummer and I jammed the audition material. I nailed it to a "T". When 1 of the singers (they had 5) came in, he looked at my very long hair and my half stack. After introducing himself, he thanked me for coming and apologized for wasting my time, his time, and the drummer's time. The drummer, as I was packing up, was asking the singer what was so wrong that he didn't give me a chance to play for him. I turned, looked at them both, thanked them for considering me, and said "No big deal, I'm used to it: then walked out. 2 years later, the blues band I was in opened for them. We got along great until my band proceeded to destroy the headliner and win their audience in the process. As we were loading out, I overheard the singer I'd met at the audition tell the drummer that he thought I "was too heavy metal" for them, based on 1st impression. They never let us open for them again, but we had them open a 12 city tour for us. Never judge a book by its cover, and NEVER think you're so great that you can't/won't be humbled!
The Van Halen brothers, Eddie and Alex were't very impressed by David Lee Roth but they let him join the band because he had his own P.A. equipment. The rest is history.
Yeah that was the first time Dave tried out as their singer. At the time he couldn't sing in key so they passed. He formed his own band Red Ball Jet and they were rivals to Mammoth. They weren't the musicians Mammoth was by far but Dave was a great front man even back then. Red Ball Jet eventually fizzled out and Mammoth couldn't get a gig because they couldn't draw well, so eventually Dave finally joined the band, changed the name to Van Halen and the rest is History!
Last year I auditioned for an original alt rock/metal girl band, knew 10 songs perfectly but didn't get the gig cause i was a guy. But the bassist asked me to join her cover band and I did. One year later they asked me to replace the other guitarist for 2 shows at Atenas Rock festival in CUBA. I had the time of my life ! SHOW UP and be ready. You never know!
@@toneranger Eh... If you can find the members, I think it can be a great way to start out? A lot of women struggle to stand up for themselves/take up space when they're doing something new they're not confident in. There's a whole thing where women literally get worse at chess when playing against men. There are also a LOT of men who can be kinda crappy/condescending to women unless they shut that down hard, which is difficult to do when you're "new". Building some confidence and building familiarity with a thing before exposing oneself to that can make everything after that a lot easier.
@@toneranger Counterproductive to what? It's a major selling point for female-based acts. The point is to get shows and get audience. This is one of many routes that can get you there.
Sorry, bro. We went with the guy in a penguin costume with an electric banjo, mostly because he has a fog machine and plays a mean harmonica. Guitar? We can teach him.
Thats the great thing about music, if you're using time to build up relationships with musicians and grow up, it doesnt mean that it's wasted time when the band could of went with a more pro bloke and shit. I know, battles are there and it's better to pick em wisely, but to see the potential rather than being pessimistic about it just for the sake off being real. Many great things happen when a bunch of someones fake it til they make it.
The whole 'dime a dozen' thing is very real and musicians can be insulated from this if they aren't putting themselves out there constantly. It's like going through middle school, maybe you're a top 3 student. Then in high school, you're only top 10. Then in college, you find you're largely unremarkable among countless other smart kids, most of whom have well off families and a wealth of contacts that will basically guarantee they are more successful than you, regardless of whether you're smarter than them or not. Helps you understand how big the world is in a way.
And then you graduate and you find out your local college happens to be below average in the world wide scene, so even though you where slightly above average at graduation, you are pretty much nothing out there in the world. Internet is wonderful but it made competing with the whole planet .... real.
Sounds like me. 8th in HS grad class of 780. Local State college, skipped a year for good ACT scores. Got hammered in premed due to poor study habits, low morale and yes, everybody is damn smart and many are very dedicated. It was a wake up call, and it helped motivate me to excel later in my work life. Did well. Retired at 57.
I auditioned for a band and got the gig almost immediately. I asked afterwards why they picked me. I'm not a flashy player, just solid. They said 1) because they never had a guitarist set up as quick as I did. I had a 4x12 cab and a rack that included my tube amp, and a pedal board. Plugged in 3 or 4 cables, got my levels set...ready to go. 2) I played not a single note more than was what was required for the 4 songs they wanted me to play at the audition. Seriously, not one. 3) Once the 4 songs were over and I immediately broke down my rig and was gone as quickly as I had arrived. I learned a long time ago, bands hate the incessant noodling, and so do I. I'm here to play songs, not give a sweep picking demo. Also, being quick in, quick to be ready to go, and quick out shows you come prepared in all areas, not just knowing the songs and how to shred.
Guitarists (I'm one) should stop noodling and showing off. It's fucking annoying when band members are discussing song arrangements, what song you just all played, constructive critique, sounds levels etc and the guitarist is noodling AND not paying attention.
This is true one of many difference between professional musician and a wanker 😂 from over 35 years playing proffesionly i can say yes set up Quick be ready no fiddling with stupid shredding or other crap plug in turn ya amp on set the level and be ready not a note nothing just be ready. Same goes for studio work after all you have fiddled with the amp settings for years turn the cunt on set the volume be ready talk when nessasary play when required thats it its not rocket science after all you may of spent years practicing so you should be ready. Why waist time and show of your bedroom youtube skills at the audition nobody cares and they will roll eyes and think ffs another bedroom player. Step up be professional if you are at the level.
Your point number 2 is exactly the reason why you need to no just study Steve Vai, EVH, Satch, Guthrie Govan, etc. You also need to study the things that made Andy Latimer, George Harrison, David Gilmour, Steve Rothery, etc. such experts at their craft.
George Lynch (Dokken) tried out for Ozzy. He was eliminated pretty quickly because he had cut his hair and no longer had the “look”. Randy Rhoads’ parents had a music school. Randy told George if he didn’t get the job, he could teach there. Another fun fact. George wasn’t used to playing other musician’s music. Warren DeMartini helped him learn the songs for the tryout. Yet another fun fact. Warren DeMartini was sleeping on Jake E Lee’s couch. Jake was in Ratt. When Jake got the Ozzy job, he recommended Warren to Ratt.
Jake taught Warren things and they learned from eachother. Funny that in the days of Mickey Ratt (or proto-Ratt) George did a little playing with Stephen Pearcy and the band, but his solo I heard on the Mickey Ratt Era demo compilation was pretty bad imo. Anyway, the Osbournes would have shafted George like they did with others so George was saved a lot of grief by Jake taking the bigger blows.
Ozzy and Sharon then proceeded to pay Jake minimum wages, and coerce him out of his song writing credits on Bark at the Moon. Now he's sleeping on a friend's couch with no money. Maybe George is lucky he didn't have to deal with those greedy clowns.
It’s also a good example of being nice to your competition and not letting your envy turn you into a petty bitch. A disgruntled musician might’ve mocked Randy Rhodes for having parents who owned a music school/middle class and missed out on a teaching opportunity. Or saw Warren as being “the rival” and burned that bridge by the time they could use a hand.
This applies even to the most boring professions in the planet. As an standard office drone I can't tell you how many times we were after an interview "yes, he knows his stuff, but I don't think he'll fit in the team".
Oh, I so agree wirh you.Over the years I've been at different times the protagonist of this story or one of the guitarists who ranked above him, both as a musician and as a regular dude putting my college degree to use working in a normal office job.
Until everyone in your own band decides to start their own band, and everyone in those bands starts their own… soon, no more bands. Just a bunch of individual guys with “band members wanted” ads
Yes, but there are thousands of new band that gets started each year, and only a tiny fraction of them will manage to have an album out, and an even more tiny fraction of those will find a sufficient audience to meet success (and I'm just talking about having some gigs in small show venues, not playing in a giga stadium). It's waaaaay easier to make it if you join a band that already has it's discography established and a fanbase that reaches out over 100 000k people (at least in your own country) then starting from nothing and only having a tiny portion of chance (yes, because you also need luck at this point, no matter good you are) to make it...
I was a sound engineer for the later half of the 00s and early 10s and kept preaching this to anyone who'd listen. Unfortunately, most kids wouldn't listen, even my own band, cuz they already knew everything. Nothing seemed to hold people back more than constant praise and excited shouts of amazement. When you think you're already awesome, you lose sight of what gets you to your goals.
Man oh man what I would have given for 2 things when I was 20. 1- someone in the know, explaining this to me just like you did. 2- (and most importantly) the ability to really hear it and take it to heart.
Number 2 is crucial. As kids, we think we know everything. I thought I was pretty hot stuff, as one of only a handful of aspiring guitarists in my rural high school. I moved to the big city after graduating and quickly discovered that not only was I not great... I was very mediocre. 40-some years on, I'm still far from a virtuoso, but I've managed to make a living from music all along (a crappy living, but still...). Now, at 60 years old, I'm in the twilight of my career but I'm still out there, gigging regularly and entertaining a wide range of audience types... restaurants, bars, theaters, festivals and so on. Importantly, I still enjoy it.
I played in several metal bands for 3 decades. It was my skill level that got me into my first act. I had terrible stage presence. I'd move and be active but i wasn't actually engaging and entertaining. Over time i started playing less technically flashy and started concentrating on working the crowd. I realized that its not how badass i think i am on the fretboard but how much of a people business music really is. That change made me sought after by many bands. Take care of yourself. Workout. Don't eat like crap. Don't talk shit about other bands and musicians. I'm naturally competitive but the business is not a competition. If you do you will burn bridges and alienate half your following. Remember. You are a public figure so be courteous. Be gregarious and even boisterous but never be a douche. Be friendly and fun but don't get out of control. Its easy to go too far when you're in "character". Remember. All the worlds a stage.
True. I played out and no one cared until I played Hotel California- despite first playing a complex V, II, I Jazz progression, after a few simple chords to a song that reminded them of better years did they only then tell me how great I was!
This is a good lesson that applies to all careers or disciplines/hobbies. Sometimes the most talented never get noticed or catch a break, other times people may feel threatened. Makes you really wonder how many guitar geniuses there are that never got to make it due to politics or external factors beyond their control. it's a tragedy for the development of music, really.
Am convinced that creativity and ingenuity has been stifled by the growth of monopolistic corporations and the death of mom and pops Most executives are not very smart. A young whipper snapper would scare them and they wouldn’t hire them in order to protect their own livelihood in the corporate model.
I’m convinced that there is a place for every musician. Just be true to yourself, work on your weaknesses, play a lot, and you will find that where you fit in is where you belong.
@@akeeperofoddknowledge4956Yeah. All 3 of them preferred to stay in their hotel rooms to read books, rather than partying with groupies, drinking, and doing drugs. What are the odds!😆
in the 80s and 90s this is not true. However it can be today because of the internet. There is a lady named Maluka had just about given up on music after attending Schools including Berklee. She ended up doing a song from video game the Witcher 3 and it went viral. She found a niche. I am a average sax player and below average guitar player( but getting better). I hope to create my own sound and put here on UA-cam.
OMG- I had this happen. I am pretty well known where I am from, however at one point I moved to another state and decided to audition for band. I play but don't sing. I nailed it as far as performance and they were very impressed. I was 90% sure I got it. I found out a couple days later they chose somebody else. They guy literally said "between us you were by far the best as far as your playing, but we really need a strong harmony/backup singer and this other guy has that ability. It was a powerful lesson. However it paid off- they liked my playing so much they actually started spreading my name around and got me hooked up with another band very quick. I still stay in touch with that band I auditioned for to this day (several years later) It prompted me to start expanding my skill set
Same. After years of playing with annoying bandmates because there’s at least always that one guy. I got tired of it. I’ll jam here and there but I no longer commit to the bs. In my studio I am on my own terms which is awesome. I’ll still show up and do a show here or there at a family gathering but that’s it.
Geeez….that takes so much balls and bravery….! Get out of your parent’s garage and perform without the gadgets. Music is the most social of the arts and getting on stage is where the real magic happens, not in your safe little comfort zone like a sequestered man child. Challenge yourself and grow!
This explains Robert Trujillo getting the gig after partying all night before the audition with Lars and doing the audition with a massive hangover. Being cool to party with and performing well with a hangover was important to Metallica.
"performing well with a hangover was important to Metallica". Yeah maybe that would had made sense in the era before. But Robert auditioned for Metallica when James just came out of a Rehab. I'm not really sure if the most important thing at that time was to get a bassplayer that could party hard.
I always found his hiring humorous, because they recorded him meeting with the band. He showed up with no equipment, and they provided him with some. Ironic considering Dave Mustaine got the job with no try out just because he showed up with his own gear. It was also funny that Newsted replaced Trujillo with Ozzy. It was like baseball teams making a trade.
Nah... In the Some Kind Of Monster scene James, Lars and Kirk simply state they felt Rob was driving them rather than the other way round and that they admired he played just as hard with his fingers and he reminded them of playing with Cliff. That's why he got the gig!
I used to play a lot of emergency shows with other bands because the drummer was in trouble or sick or injured. Plus I`m a singing drummer. I was straight Rock n Roll but quickly realized I needed to learn Country & Blues too. Country music isn`t as easy on drums as one might assume.
Holy cow. This advice crosses over into so many industries and career paths! UA-cam can be a mystery--I have nary an idea why this showed up on my feed. I cannot sing, cannot dance, have no rhythm, and no way can I even pretend to play any instruments! But I loved listening to this story and that manager's explanations. Cheers!
Roth can sing though . And we all get older . To me .. music is a gift to be enjoyed . Even playing on ones own . To play with others is extra .. then you can't loose . Gigging is for fun too . If people enjoy it . Better . Money . Well its not a good career choice . But . These days.. no need for a deal just ... well thats another story . Online etc
Yea it's always been more than just playing ability. Just being able to play doesn't mean you can write a song at all much less write good songs that mean something to people. Then add in the look and demeanor/stage presence and such. A lot of the best song writers are indeed average players and session musicians can often play the best but either can't or don't write songs at all and/or don't want to even be up in front of people. Great break down
Finally someone with proper comment. Even playing instrument is overrated. Michael Jackson was writing song by beatboxing into dictaphone and real musicians then played instruments to mimic the beatbox. Having creativity and having something to say beats being the best instrument player every, single, time!!!
That part about telling the sound guy to turn his channel down, so that he could unplug his guitar felt a little too specific to be just a random, made up story... ;-) For what it's worth, personally, I think he would have been a better choice than the one they ended up with!
@@TheArtofGuitar Hey Mike! It's me Jeffrey formerly of Subnormal. 😉 I was a finalist in their CYR cover contest and my cover of Anno Satana is still on their playlist. I didn't get a call 😢 My own fault for being an obscure video game composer and not putting myself more out there. Check out my cover. I rarely do covers but this is one turned out cool! ua-cam.com/video/IkISMftUhag/v-deo.htmlsi=zaKP1LGmN8ZWGENW By the way we saw SP at a tiny venue in Iowa with Kiki and she absolutely crushed it. They played gossamar and it was incredible. Really happy for the current state of SP. 🤘 Forgot to mention I actually said to my friend at the time that I thought you would make a great addition to the band too!
Sounds like a true story, well relayed. I'm 72. Still remember being the only player who could copy dazed and confused( didn't realize Page even plays it differently live gig to gig) I was right there, thank God I met my wife ha ha. The second guitar player in that last band never gave up. We've been friends since elementary school. He got really good and makes pennies submitting tunes to BMI. 2 years ago I bought some new gear (God, all I had in the 60's was a fuzz!, lol) and am happy hearing something on the radio and spending a week figuring it out and playing for my own pleasure. These daze you need to be an 'entertainer'..you better hit the gym, learn how to move and have the genetics as well as the good fortune and talent...Great advice, great video...now I know I made the right decision in 1971!
I started up my own band last week after trying to get into different bands the past few months. I said screw it, I'm tired of applying for jobs, I'll start my own business and let the resumes come to me. Instant success and I get to pick and choose my band of misfits rather than trying to merge into some already preexisting social club full of arrogant pricks. Worked like a charm🤘🏻
I would like to do that myself, except I don't want to have to deal with "managing" the band, i.e., getting gigs, scheduling rehearsals, all that stuff. Usually the founder of the band is going to be the one responsible for that stuff.
This channel is the real School of Rock, and yes, learning the chops is just barely the beginning .. if you are socially awkward, people don't care how good you play, there's no connection with the audience. For me, that is harder than learning the guitar.
That may be true in a live setting but not online. There are many awkward/shy guitarists on UA-cam who play at an extremely high level, and are rewarded with millions of subs and views. At the end of the day, great unique music will win out (btw I say this not in an argumentative tone, but in a hopeful one 🙏)
What the industry pros want is a great front man that knows how to move and connect with the audience. Forget mastering an instrument, those days are gone.
I feel you. I’m autistic, so it’s really hard for me to be able to speak to other people. Mostly from previous trauma of screwing up, I’m scared that I’ll do it again and make the other person uncomfortable. I also have a blinking tic when I’m anxious, so that’s a lot of fun. I’ll probably just sticking to the social media thing, and start a channel when I’m skilled enough (instagram, tik tok, and probably Twitter after a while too). That way, I can have the best of both worlds.
Elton John didn't make the cut for King Crimson but went on to an amazing solo career, Les Claypool formed Primus after not getting the call back from Metallica, Slash would have never been in Guns N Roses had Poison not passed over him, Stephen Stills didn't make the cut auditioning for The Monkees , George Lynch got passed over by Ozzy , so if you dont get the call back don't despair you're in good company and fate may have something much bigger in store for you
Hah, never heard that about Stills trying out for the Monkees. He was (and is) a hell of a player, and looked alright back then. Maybe not funny enough.
I think Slash said in an interview that they offered him the job but he didn't think their stage look was something he would want to adopt. So he said no, not them.
Any feed on this..I am 64, started with buddy of mine in the 70's.. played for 40 years together, 5 piece contry rock to rock and lots of originals, went well, not too well educated musics but our motto was "It's not how much you know how to play...but how you play what you know" I loved this vid
Even you have to hear music that sucks. People listen to music you think sucks. And they like it. My motto is you should at least give a full listen sometimes. I have actually become a fan of some music that was considered music that sucked. By doing that I have also become a better musician.
@@TheArtofGuitar I was fortunate to not be too terribly out of style back in my day, but everything you said about needing to bring more than chops to the gig is spot on. I remember one audition where the band's pub-person spiked my long hair about 2 feet off my skull lol!
You know, this somehow is helping me get over my crushing rejection 13 years ago. Being 19 and an aspiring bassist, and getting to audition to play in a band with a bunch of other people you look up to, only to lose to a guy who was good friends with the guitarist, had a big van, and had more experiece. Ive carried that resentmet with me for fucking years. This actually is helping me heal.
I feel like back in the 70s. You could pretty much look like whatever didn’t matter as long as the music was good but nowadays your look and general vibe is just as important as the music if not more in many cases.
I am not so sure about that. Have you seen photographs of actual bands back then. Maybe 80s metal bands. Hoo boy, I look at the photos of some of those early 80s metal bands and man, they looked dorky. The 90s weren't friends to anyone either. Think Anthrax wearing bermuda shorts.
A lot of huge top 40s songs featured female vocalists that were average or in some cases below average in looks. Now the looks come first (especially for women) and the rest is all secondary.
I’m 58 and been playing since seeing Van Halen on Fair Warning tour. About 20lbs overweight but play very well. Same here.. nobody wants an old fat shredder in their band. 😂🤣
How cool. Join my band man. My vox are only just ok, I'm 63 and I'm looking for a voice like Halford. I've already got a name, COB, for Cranky Old Bastards. I've tried to float this idea to a friend also in his 60s but he is into his folky gear. I wanna rock, and blow out ear drums like I did as a young man, but feel that young and pretty is the flavor these days. Those I am not.
so the choices are: 1. be good looking or change your look to fit the band 2. be rich or well connected 3. start your own band 4. stay a bedroom guitarist and post your stuff on the internet
There's also - do the legwork on your instrument and local music scene connections first and build more connections to gradually grow a steady line of work. It can take years, but it happens to many as long as consistency is strived for. I genuinely don't care about fame so long as I'm able to make enough money doing what I am here to do
Remembering a key to this video will take you very far in life. Don’t say okay and hang up. Or text them back. Ask the questions. Find the truth. Act on that truth in the future. Excellent video.
A great lesson. Also aplies to many other arts and even some sports. Reminded me of stories about racing teams. The drivers where sometimes people that had (maybe) bit less talent, but could grant acess to sponsors and conections. It's a big world, great talent becames just a basic requirement, what else do you bring to the table.
When I started learning guitar, my intentions were always to create my own songs. Covers are good to have fun, but I want to be myself and see my full capabilities
Funnily enough I find it easy to write my own songs than learn others…😂 I’ve got it all back to front…but they are different skills, technically I’m lacking but creativity is never a issue
Same here! Many years ago, I had my own songs and started to look for people to form a band. I met a drummer who was good but he wanted to play covers. I told him that I didn't mind playing covers but that I didn't want to just be a cover band and he said: "You know what? People don't care about you and your songs. People want to go out, hear songs they already know and have fun!". It's like you said. Covers are fun but personally, I write songs because I want to tell MY stories. By the way, I ended up finding another drummer.
As a guy who spent many decades in the music industry, I found this video to be one of the best I’ve seen for upcoming musicians to understand. You basically described the difference between being a session player, and being an “entertainer”. For instance, I know vocalists and guitarists in Nashville that can absolutely wipe the floor with most of the players in the touring bands that you see these days. The thing is, some of them don’t have any interest in working with other people on a tour or being in the spotlight. They just wanna walk into the studio, put down their tracks and go home at the end of the night and get paid. And they do that exceedingly well, and don’t care if anybody knows who they are. Most of them are only known and respected by other musicians in fact, and that’s enough for them. But one of the things people sometimes forget when they say they want to be in the music business, is the last word of the phrase that they’ve just said. “Business”. When you are part of a live band that’s supposed to go out and entertain, you are a product, a commodity, not just a skill set. Great job getting that message across. I don’t think anybody could’ve done any better!
Coming from a classical backround, I find this preferable to professional orchestra auditions, where the early rounds are done blind from behind a curtain. I hear stories of a position in a mid-level regional orchestra opening up then immediately getting 200+ applicants, most with graduate degrees in performance. Professors who I consider greater players than I'll ever be talk about losing count of how many auditions they took after around 50. Once you win a job, there's usually a probationary period, after which your peers vote on you before it becomes official. I've met so many people gunning for an orchestra job working themselves to the bone, usually to the point that they become synical about music, which makes me question if it's even worth it at that point. A system that takes being a solid player as a prerequisite, then evaluates you on your professionalism, your ability to make connections, and your ability to cultivate a personal brand, pushes you to take a more rounded approach that leaves you space to still enjoy playing music, as opposed to everyone practicing 8+ hours a day to be 1% better than the next guy just for a chance at a gig.
There is a ton of wisdom in this video. What you described is applicable to any serious career, not just music. While I am an average guitarist at best, I recognized that I had to change my perspective and work with the talents I DO possess. Turns out I am a pretty good bass player... 😀
Success as a great guitarist is fleeting. I have known a few. The most successful were fabulous songwriters. So don't use bar chords and parallel motion, use common tones(learned in theroy). Write great songs and understand publishing and publishing law. I know a guy who wrote 5 songs which made to classic rock rotation and he is still living off those royalties. It's one thing to be a great guitarist, the money for a long term future is in the publishing of songs.
When I lived in the LA area back in the 80s I played guitar for awhile and according to friends I was good. But never let it get to me. So when some would say to try out for some big band and said that I was not interested because the competition was tough. Also, knowing what rock bands wanted in the looks department I would not make the cut because I surely was not the pretty boy. Like you said, the caliber of player at that level were a dime a dozen. Then the hired gun and studio players are in an entirely different galaxy. Spoke to a professional bassist at that high level recently, had a good talk about the music scene, and the realities of it all. Knowing back then that it was not an easy life, I never did pursue it as a profession. Ended up working for the fire department which was my dream career.
This is the brutal reality of the industry folks. As much as I would love do this full time, I’ve realized that it’s not for everyone. However, I still play because I love the guitar and music. That’s all that matters to me regardless if I’m successful or not.
I walked away from the whole scene very young.. about 18yo because I knew I didn't want to travel around playing the same stuff over, and over, and over, and over.. and I would have filled the monotony with whatever I could get my hands on.. and become part of the statistics very early. So I chose self preservation
@@warthogA10 I also gave up on 'making it' quite young cuz I really just got tired of dealing with other musicians. I'm sure I could have found better people in time if I really stuck with it, but man you can easily wade through countless people who are just assholes, divas, slackers, unreliable, uncommitted, addicts, etc. Felt like I should just life a more normal life and keep playing guitar as a hobby. Which I have for like 20 years.
My dad was on the Johnny Canales show and that is equivalent to the Mexican MTV. I learned a little from him. I do not want to get up on stage and shred guitar. I might take a good gig singing, but all the points you make are extremely helpfull to put it in an easy manner for the benefit of the majority. I would rather teach professionals how to overcome their hurdle than try to compete with any shredding guitar because NO ONE knows what I have gone through to be able to say I am the fastest guitar player on the planet and no one contend. At the end of the day your video gives insight that all can benefit even as a refresher course. BRAVO🎉🎉🎉🎉❤
You really are a great storyteller. Enjoyed this very much. Of course the moral of this story is find a great songwriter and vocalist, start your own band, and then you can dress like Coldplay.
I can relate. When I was a young gun, I was a local singer, around home I was considered pretty good. I was a soloist in choir, I'd played in bands for a few years and I was making headway on the guitar, too. I saw a band in town, they were excellent, super polished but I didn't really know any of the music they were doing. Later I learned, it was all 70's stuff, the Who, Jethro Tull, BTO, stuff like that and this was 1990 and I'm 18 year old. I somehow kept hitting it off with the drummer, who was epic and who I'm still friends with to this day and he mentions that they're in the market for a new singer. I tell him all about myself but the stuff I was doing was all 80's rock, which was all knew (Tesla, White Lion etc) and he said they were going to have a tryout. I hitchhiked like 150 miles to where they were from and it was a disaster. They wanted me to sing Joe Lynn Turner, Rainbow's 'Stone Cold'...and I had never even heard the song. Then they wanted me to try some Lepplin, again, off my radar. On top of that, there was this other dude there that was familiar with all the material and I felt like a big waste of time. The long story short is that, I convinced them to let me stay on as a roadie and over the next year, I learned all the material and slowly worked my way on stage. Never made a dime but got a lot of crazy stories out of it. One of the craziest years of my life.
I wanted to say to you Sir that you have told the honest truth about the "politics" of the music business. Thank you. I am a now retired 75yo pro Blues player. Honestly I have been there too and done that so to speak. Your story touched my career path too. In the end I have my music and my memories. Others have rightfully replaced me and I am happy for them. The show goes on 🙂
Truer words... To all the aspiring rock gods out there, take the story in this video to heart. It's not only about talent. It's also about relatability, punctuality, dependability, attitude, a willingness to adapt, respect (both on and off stage) for your bandmates and others on the bill and a whole host of other factors. All of these are, to a great degree, within your control. Your looks and wealth... less so. But those last two aren't always the most important, so work on what you can improve. And most of all, have fun.
Great vid, its a hard truth a lot people need to face; talent will only get you so far. I watched another youtube performance the other day and the singer was one of the most talent mfers I had ever seen. But he was around 50 and balding, so no mainstream appeal. no one in the comments had seen or heard of this guy, but 90% were commending this rando on his sick pipes Its the death of the "natural" music star we have witnessed in the past and present. I no longer wonder how the top50 pop songs of the past decade are written by like one swedish dude but performed by 30 different people. You see its stranglehold in all facets of music nowadays, theres no more "imperfect" songs anymore, theyre all overedited and autotuned to be 100% pure. the same goes for the image of the performer, as if they were taking pointers from wrestling kayfabe. anyone who doesnt check those boxes isnt seen as marketable to the mainstream and will have to be 100% self supporting, which is impossible unless your dads a tennis pro or whatever
This is spot on. Live music is about connecting with THE AUDIENCE, not about impressing other musicians. This is why live performers of the highest level care far more about the total identity of a player- the feel, the vibe, the energy, the look, the personality- because THAT is what an audience connects with, not just the chops. Great chops are both the bare minimum nowadays. It's everything that comes after that matters most to an audience. There's nothing wrong with this. Live music is entertaining and inspiring people. I don't think I've EVER heard Billy Gibbons play a single fast 16th note run or blast of notes- in fact, the faster the song, the less notes he plays! On the otherhand, Eddie Van Halen could play 100x more notes sometimes- but both of them equally connect with their audience because of how strong their unique identity and personality shines through.
Great story, and good point -- but there are two sides to this story: 1. The A Side. Popular art is not about the art at all, but what surrounds it (mainly sex appeal, but also things that people love to be around: hype, fanfare, glitz, the spotlight, attention, personality, night life, celebrity, money, the fast lane, daring, freedom, success), and most of all, effortlessness -- if you even hint that you are 'trying', that will be your death knell. 2. The B Side. In spite of the cynicism, people first love the 'sound' of a new act. Now, this 'sound' may come naturally, and if it succeeds, then great, the fans are happy and the artists are happy. But... if what you do naturally does not catch on, then you have two choices: quit or experiment. We will follow the experimentation path. There you are, trying out new sounds, and all of the sudden one hits. Great, right? WRONG. You HATE IT! And now you are stuck with it. This leads to artist dissatisfaction all the way up to suicide, no matter how rich it has made you. Your fatal flaw gets back to the musician in your story -- you were a true artist, and not some egotistical schlock looking to cash in on his sex appeal or his connections or his social collateral. In my experience as an artist and gauging what people like and don't like, I think that the public loves to see an artist suffer, so they will gravitate to whatever the artist hates the most and make him do it over and over and over and over again. It isn't sadistic, it is more primal than that (maybe it gets all the way back to cosmic survival, who knows)... 3. The C Side (Bonus Wisdom): The industry is a business. It will copy whatever is selling, and what sells has had the hype and the fanfare and the glitz and the spotlight and the attention already, and the artist has already painstakingly forged a new path, struggling through rejection and criticism and ridicule, which merely copying avoids -- since the path has already been blazed by someone else, making that sound popular. The problem is, THEIR art will be real, while yours will be cheap knock-off fare, or, at best (and more artistically satisfying), you contribute and expand the genre (where a 'genre' is just a mass of copycat work). In the end, as artists, the original trailblazers will be more satisfied, having endured the real pain of turning innovation into acceptance. 4. The D Side (Extra Bonus Wisdom): Relating to effortlessness, the public will love your silliest work. I don't know what that would mean in Death Metal, but you get the idea. This is because your silliest work is your most effortless, and that was what matters. The lesson? What you think the littlest of will be your most promising work.
It depends though. Many many bands need competent but not necessarily out-of-this-world level of skill. So as long as a guitarist can achieve the level, or has the potential, then the other factors mentioned can really help a band get exposure, a bigger audience and more money. And lots of bands struggle for money and practise venues at the beginning. Do you really think that even someone like Van Halen would have been nearly as successful if he looked like a trogolodyte?
@@steves1015 You're right, it does depend. It depends on what that band thinks is important. And if looks, connections, and family wealth is priority over musical ability - then that tells you all you need to know about what those people value and the kind of BS you're going to be dealing with in the future with that group of individuals. Spoiler: it's not fun! Does all that other stuff help? Sure but it's not priority over musical ability unless you're putting together a "show band" that plays with backing tracks turned up louder than any instrument on stage. It's true: People can spend thousands on efforts to look and sound "better" (stage lights, laptops w/tracks, high end gear, etc), use family connections to land gigs that take the local musicians years to get into, and hide musical shortcomings behind a facade of smoke and mirrors. If that's your thing, cool but just realize that isn't a band; it's an act. Btw, I play professionally and I will tell you that looking like a troll doesn't stop people from having a career in music. There are countless not-good-looking people in this industry who are making a living. Good looks are always a plus, but not a deal breaker for a band serious about music or even for the majority of people in the crowd. Playing your instrument well, taking decent care of yourself, and being a team-player with a good attitude is much more important than looks, money, or connections. And that's because, at the end of the day, relying on looks, wealth, and connections will only get you so far without talent/skill that allows you to stand out from the rest. Unless of course, you're looking for an acting gig. Some people are.
Exactly it's about the sound first. Like how Whitesnake is basically hard blues rock with a keyboard instead of an organ. David Coverdale was in deep purple, and it shows.
People have social motives for doing stuff so it's sometimes really unfair how they will treat you. Looks and likeability acting like they want you to is more important than having the skill and getting the job done. In my city this local band i knew the guitarist from they paid 400€ for mastering their record with this well known mastering engineer that everyone here uses and thinks is the best. The record came out sounding harsh in the 3k 5k area with honky low mids in 200 to 450 hz area. I made a remaster in fl studio with the stock EQ of one track on the CD and send the wav file to the guitarist. He was like "What did you do to this, How it sounds so good?" And i was paid 0€ so it goes to show that mastering guy is only something couse he's got the social points. The problems on that record started in the mix. That mixer is also well known and appreciated here. I once worked with an singer who had a project she had recorded the backing track with that guy. She sends me the tracks and they all have lots of digital clipping! Sound was awful! And people think that engineer is great!
It’s all industries to some extent. The one that baffles me is songwriting. Why do these “artists” hire professional songwriters? Can they really not do it? Then you hear the song they purchased and it’s like…you hired someone to write this turd for you? I’ll write you a turd for half the price…but I don’t know anyone and nobody knows me, so that’s why they pay the “professional” to do it.
@@elosoguapo8137 My cousin is well known artist and since he got sober he has been hiring a songwriter. I'm not close to him but i tried to encourage him to start writing again. He's own stuff was better but the new stuff sells so he does not care
Love this!! These situations are so multi faceted. Havent been in one myself yet, but I've observed and learned so far from an outside perspective. You need to be and do more than just know how to play your instrument, it's not always what you know it's also who you know. (A little sad but true). You need to be the whole package, not just one ingredient in the recipe, and yet have some room left for self improvement in all of the areas mentioned, you need to be able to grow, both as a person and as a musician.
If you’re referring to the live performance setting (on a stage), then yes agreed, these things are absolutely critical. The beauty is that we live in a time when you CAN be shy and be heard. There are lone bedroom guitarists with zero flare/moxy who make incredibly unique music, and get millions of subscribers and views. Amazing music will find a way to win at the end of the day. As long as it’s great, fresh and unique, and not just a direct copy of someone else
Absolutely nailed it. Most of my good connections have been made because people see value in a YT channel. Not because I'm the best anything. Half-tempted to make a reaction to this lol. There's so much wisdom here.
yeah same here. All the problems he had about not knowing the right people and all would have been solved. You never know how well connected (especially GOOD) cover bands tend to be, my dad played in one for years and still knows people even though he hasn't played in a decade.
Playing ecoustic guitar is just a hobby for me, i am very happy with my ability with the time i have put in. I love the singing more and lean into that when i play, i busk alot, and the reason is to get live music on the streets,i make a few quid, meet lots of interesting people,and it is usually alot of fun! I feel sorry for musicians spending years and tears trying to get recognised, i am happy singing covers and making people smile.........I also play guitar whilst riding a uni cycle, and was recently featured on our local weather forecast...
Good video! Being someone who's done this for more years and most of the guys watching this have been alive, I've come to realize that just being a good player and knowing the material is about 10% of what you need to do. I've been on both sides where we've auditioned people and where I've been auditioned and the most important thing is to be someone who is comfortable to hang out with. The next part is can you play well enough and if you make it that far, can you be someone who adds to the music and doesn't detract by overplaying. Most people won't understand this because they approach the music nowadays is sort of like being a really good fancy juggling act. We've had tons of great players come in to audition who basically just wore us out because of their acrobatic approach to music. One of the things that a producer I work with had said sort of jokingly is that if a bass player shows up for a country gig with a six-string bass we always want to send him home because every time someone does that they overplay and they don't play for the songs. You need to play for the band and not yourself. The other part is that sometimes these cattle calls are looking for something specific so they never actually say that. I showed up for a cattle call for Sheila E who I'd actually known from before and they didn't care how I played They just wanted to know if I could dance on stage. That one was annoying as hell, but I think you'll get the drift. The other thing is that if you're playing music to make money, you're in the wrong business.. good luck👍
I don't even care about bands and such and just want to learn guitar cause I want to - but this story was so well-crafted and so wonderful to listen, I stayed till the end and just wanted to hear where it goes. Amazing!
This is all completely spot on. I only figured all that stuff out after I quit playing bass. It took a while, but I realized that I never fit in with most musicians, I’m not a lot of fun on tour, stuck in a van for 18 hours with 3 people I’d never talk to outside of music, and I can’t wear the right clothes for the gig. And I can’t sing at all. I can’t believe I was actually a working musician for 20 years.
Ha. The truth is decent bass players are hard to find. You want a job playing music? Learn the bass and leave the guitar to the guys in the unemployment line.
Some gig tales from a boomer 😮 Even in semi-pro situations and definitely in pro situations - do not noodle! I subbed with a large jazz ensemble a while back. It was basically old-school swing and some latin dance rhythm guitar playing from charts. One of the musicians busted on me little bit simply for warming up 10 minutes prior to the downbeat. Also, make sure that you have very solid time - way more important than flash.
My 2.0 version left the band scene entirely. Spent 40 years at NASA, built lots of space flight hardware, and played local music theater shows on the side before retiring last month. Chasing after bands is for the young.
Very tasty conversation. My guess is that a lot of guitar players may be a little introverted and maybe spent a little too much time alone with their guitars during their formative years. Good insight!
Aiming to be someone you would like to work with is something that helps I think. After dealing with absolute egos over many years this helped me greatly. Learning who not to be and what not to do is valuable thing. It's true that chops is important but who wants a pain in the butt shredder causing problems?
Man! This happened to me too last month. I tried out for this new rock band in chicago, they were a 3 piece 1 female singer 1 female drummer and a male bass player. I tried out , played 4 songs with them, things went good at the audition . Then a day after, I found out that they picked someone else. Someone who had the look. This kinda stuff happens, You just gotta move on.
I remember a friend of mine started a band when we were in our late teens; there wasn't much of a music scene where we were so they didn't get far, but their bassist was *incredible*. They played two or three shows with him, and then found a replacement who wasn't nearly as good and I couldn't work out why, but when I asked he said that the original bassist was an awful person to be around. When I started a band myself about ten years later I found the same problem: I couldn't just find people who can play, but rather had to look for people who I could both work with and have fun with, along with trusting them with my vision for the band. What a lot of people don't grasp is that the audience only have to put up with a difficult band member for a short time, and they *always* see them at their creative best. Meanwhile, the rest of the band has to spend far more time with them, especially if they want to take the band seriously.
At least you're honest. I like that. A lot of dudes were like, "Clickbait!" I had to explain that that's Orianthi the guitarist I talk about in the story. hehe.
Story form is such an under utilized and refreshing way to convey....many things, concisely to you audience. Thank you for the reminder of how powerful this mode of teaching/learning is.
Dude! In a social media world where everybody's just teaching, licks and riffs and measures, it's refreshing to see an actual professional musician, explaining what it can be like when you are working to be a professional musician. I've been playing performing and recording for over 40 years and I've been that guy that was perplexed and couldn't figure out why he didn't get the gig early on and I've also been the guy that beat out the other guys because later on I did have a look I did have the field I did have the language and most of the parts that I needed to make myself attractive not just as a guitarist, but as a member of a team, and as a member of an entertainment organize. It can certainly be frustrating and I think it's really good that you did this video just to help people understand that being technical and academic and skilled is not necessarily all that's left for or sought after always keep in mind that video killed the radio star :-)
This whole build-up story is hilarious with how specific it is... "On your way to the audition, you stop by a sandwich shop. The sandwich has too much mayo and there isn't enough ham and lettuce.."
New school here, it's not really cheating to use the resources that are abundant. From what I observe currently, the musician world still greatly values players who have good ears, chops, and sight-reading skills-have gotten plenty of gigs because of it. But I still developed a lot of those skills by utilizing my resources (Music school, records, actual sheet music, and of course YT videos). Sorry that we don't have to use antiquated methods anymore? Maybe you'll be glad to know that students of music still transcribe stuff though? The path to being a good player hasn't really changed-we just have better stuff nowadays to optimize it.
The manager could have softened the blow by simplifying the message. He could have said "yea, dude, you were absolutely the best player at the audition, hands down, but there's more to it than just technical ability and we went with someone who was a better fit, overall."
Yeah, but I would want to know more than just an executive summary. I liked hearing about the female player's connections, Thor's charismatic onstage presence and cargo shorts' golf club / studio.
@@RogueReplicant You're right, the details matter. He could have given the summary up front though and not get it pried out of him. But, also, he's a band agent, not a therapist, so I'm really not judging. It was a cool story, all around, yes.
When I get rejected for a job, I don’t care about feelings. I want to know why I didn’t get the job so so I know what I can improve. But most just don’t even bother yo contact me. Impressed the manager took the time to tell him in detail.
Best reaction to a courtesy call is "thank you for the opportunity and if you ever need a player in the future keep me in mind." Believe me it actually works. Just be positive and continue to improve
Great story. If you want to join the show it helps to look and act the part. Playing crisp and dynamically for the song will get you further than trying to impress someone with your best heat. You gotta bring as much to the table as possible.
When I was learning guitar my dad told me that the best thing I could do was to sit in with a couple people better than me. He told me then you are trying harder. He played a few instruments but was good on a clarinet. He told me that he would sit with guys in Harlem during the day and try and keep up with them.
Attitudes like that are exactly the kind of thing that will prevent you from getting farther. Modelers are an entirely accepted gear choice these days in the professional world. They sound amazing and are way more convenient than lugging around some 80lb amplifier and a giant pedalboard that you're having to track down faults with every few weeks.
Tx, much appreciated. Good for you for having the courage to find out why you weren’t picked, and for adapting. Becoming “well rounded” usually pays off… career-wise & otherwise. Good vibes ur way & Keep On Truckin
Started a band. Left it because playing to me is a hobby. When things got serious. I knew it was time to go. I had a child to support and a full time well paying job. I still remember telling Herman the guitar player that was the first to join me, I was done. That was one of the worst feeling break-up experiences in my life. I was going to hold them back because I didn't share the dream. I love playing but already had a job. To this day I never want playing to become a Job. Just a hobby I freely share
I was in a cover band that played parties, pubs and weddings, we did multiple gigs a week. It turned into a job and I ended up leaving. The reality is that most people in most places want to hear the same material and much as I love Folsom Prison Blues, if you play it too many times it does get old
Only 1 in 10,000 guitar players every make more money than what they spend on equipment. If you don't enjoy playing, you're in the wrong business. Play because you enjoy playing, and who knows, good things might happen. And if they don't, you've still enjoyed yourself. Win, win.
This is a loser mentality. There are plenty of guitarists making money that barely know their instrument. Difference is, what they do know makes money. Too many guitarists worry about shredding and not worrying about playing and writing songs.
nuff said!
It is the same with many fields of endeavor; knifmaking in particular is a "you better do it for love" field.
@@firemarshal2629 Hell yeah dude. I see too many people think it's all about skill. It's a part of it, but it's also about what you said
💯
I am sure there were better bass players around, but In 1962, The Rolling Stones hired Bill Wyman because he had his own amplifier. You just never know.
The quality of Pink Floyd’s light show was apparently one of the factors that got them signed, according to Norman Smith.
DLR got into Van Halen cause he had a PA
Ozzy got the Sabbath gig solely because his dad went into debt to buy him a PA system.
Wow these stories are hilarious!!
I‘m not sure if it was Lennon or McCartney who said that Pete Best was a better drummer, but Ringo was a better Beatle.
I was recommended by another guitarist for an audition once. He couldn't do the gig due to previous commitments. It was an established "oldies" band. The drummer/music director loved me. When I showed up for the audition, I plugged in my Laney AOR 100 and Marshall 4x12 cabinet and the drummer and I jammed the audition material. I nailed it to a "T". When 1 of the singers (they had 5) came in, he looked at my very long hair and my half stack. After introducing himself, he thanked me for coming and apologized for wasting my time, his time, and the drummer's time. The drummer, as I was packing up, was asking the singer what was so wrong that he didn't give me a chance to play for him. I turned, looked at them both, thanked them for considering me, and said "No big deal, I'm used to it: then walked out. 2 years later, the blues band I was in opened for them. We got along great until my band proceeded to destroy the headliner and win their audience in the process. As we were loading out, I overheard the singer I'd met at the audition tell the drummer that he thought I "was too heavy metal" for them, based on 1st impression. They never let us open for them again, but we had them open a 12 city tour for us. Never judge a book by its cover, and NEVER think you're so great that you can't/won't be humbled!
Great story! And singer probably saved you a headache from having to deal with him 😂
The Van Halen brothers, Eddie and Alex were't very impressed by David Lee Roth but they let him join the band because he had his own P.A. equipment. The rest is history.
"they weren't impressed by David Lee Roth" That's probably what they told him, couldn't possibly be what they thought.
"Eddie and Alex were't very impressed by David Lee Roth"
That's because he didn't do the split and jump, he just sang....
Yeah that was the first time Dave tried out as their singer. At the time he couldn't sing in key so they passed. He formed his own band Red Ball Jet and they were rivals to Mammoth. They weren't the musicians Mammoth was by far but Dave was a great front man even back then. Red Ball Jet eventually fizzled out and Mammoth couldn't get a gig because they couldn't draw well, so eventually Dave finally joined the band, changed the name to Van Halen and the rest is History!
@@maxrico6660and he still can’t sing in tune!!!!
@@deependguitar777 Has he ever ??
The music business is a popularity contest, not a talent show.
this is life in general.
You still have to be able to play, but being top in skill alone won't get you the spot.
💯🎯
@@Brokeninc Spot on! :)
@@BiscuitDelivery No, since the digital age you can get away with sub-par skills if you're popular enough.
Last year I auditioned for an original alt rock/metal girl band, knew 10 songs perfectly but didn't get the gig cause i was a guy. But the bassist asked me to join her cover band and I did. One year later they asked me to replace the other guitarist for 2 shows at Atenas Rock festival in CUBA. I had the time of my life ! SHOW UP and be ready. You never know!
Well done. The whole idea of "Girl Bands" is just counter productive
That’s sick!
@@toneranger
Eh...
If you can find the members, I think it can be a great way to start out?
A lot of women struggle to stand up for themselves/take up space when they're doing something new they're not confident in. There's a whole thing where women literally get worse at chess when playing against men.
There are also a LOT of men who can be kinda crappy/condescending to women unless they shut that down hard, which is difficult to do when you're "new".
Building some confidence and building familiarity with a thing before exposing oneself to that can make everything after that a lot easier.
Dude, right on! 😆🤘
@@toneranger Counterproductive to what? It's a major selling point for female-based acts. The point is to get shows and get audience. This is one of many routes that can get you there.
Count yourself lucky if you even get an explanation.
@@CommercialForest Ghosting is the norm
LOL. Yeah, let alone a break down of the band's second and third choices.
Yeah this is definitely a story for education purposes only
@@abbeyna01yes that never happens. Maybe years later once you are in another band and run into the manager backstage.
@@sinenkaari5477that goes for every profession
Sorry, bro. We went with the guy in a penguin costume with an electric banjo, mostly because he has a fog machine and plays a mean harmonica. Guitar? We can teach him.
That must have been a Flaming Lips audition.
Thats the great thing about music, if you're using time to build up relationships with musicians and grow up, it doesnt mean that it's wasted time when the band could of went with a more pro bloke and shit. I know, battles are there and it's better to pick em wisely, but to see the potential rather than being pessimistic about it just for the sake off being real. Many great things happen when a bunch of someones fake it til they make it.
Exactly, it always happens. They hire the posers…..l
Guitar ? We'll just use a backing track and we'll teach him how to be a guifakist.
Until you said banjo I was seeing Les Claypool in my mind's eye.
The whole 'dime a dozen' thing is very real and musicians can be insulated from this if they aren't putting themselves out there constantly. It's like going through middle school, maybe you're a top 3 student. Then in high school, you're only top 10. Then in college, you find you're largely unremarkable among countless other smart kids, most of whom have well off families and a wealth of contacts that will basically guarantee they are more successful than you, regardless of whether you're smarter than them or not. Helps you understand how big the world is in a way.
And then you graduate and you find out your local college happens to be below average in the world wide scene, so even though you where slightly above average at graduation, you are pretty much nothing out there in the world.
Internet is wonderful but it made competing with the whole planet .... real.
Sounds like me. 8th in HS grad class of 780. Local State college, skipped a year for good ACT scores. Got hammered in premed due to poor study habits, low morale and yes, everybody is damn smart and many are very dedicated. It was a wake up call, and it helped motivate me to excel later in my work life. Did well. Retired at 57.
Thankfully they took the rigor out of stem
I auditioned for a band and got the gig almost immediately. I asked afterwards why they picked me. I'm not a flashy player, just solid. They said 1) because they never had a guitarist set up as quick as I did. I had a 4x12 cab and a rack that included my tube amp, and a pedal board. Plugged in 3 or 4 cables, got my levels set...ready to go. 2) I played not a single note more than was what was required for the 4 songs they wanted me to play at the audition. Seriously, not one. 3) Once the 4 songs were over and I immediately broke down my rig and was gone as quickly as I had arrived.
I learned a long time ago, bands hate the incessant noodling, and so do I. I'm here to play songs, not give a sweep picking demo. Also, being quick in, quick to be ready to go, and quick out shows you come prepared in all areas, not just knowing the songs and how to shred.
Guitarists (I'm one) should stop noodling and showing off. It's fucking annoying when band members are discussing song arrangements, what song you just all played, constructive critique, sounds levels etc and the guitarist is noodling AND not paying attention.
This is true one of many difference between professional musician and a wanker 😂 from over 35 years playing proffesionly i can say yes set up Quick be ready no fiddling with stupid shredding or other crap plug in turn ya amp on set the level and be ready not a note nothing just be ready. Same goes for studio work after all you have fiddled with the amp settings for years turn the cunt on set the volume be ready talk when nessasary play when required thats it its not rocket science after all you may of spent years practicing so you should be ready. Why waist time and show of your bedroom youtube skills at the audition nobody cares and they will roll eyes and think ffs another bedroom player. Step up be professional if you are at the level.
The incessant noodlers are spreading rapidly here on UA-cam. Male and female. They don’t know how to work as a team in a band.
Your point number 2 is exactly the reason why you need to no just study Steve Vai, EVH, Satch, Guthrie Govan, etc. You also need to study the things that made Andy Latimer, George Harrison, David Gilmour, Steve Rothery, etc. such experts at their craft.
George Lynch (Dokken) tried out for Ozzy. He was eliminated pretty quickly because he had cut his hair and no longer had the “look”. Randy Rhoads’ parents had a music school. Randy told George if he didn’t get the job, he could teach there. Another fun fact. George wasn’t used to playing other musician’s music. Warren DeMartini helped him learn the songs for the tryout. Yet another fun fact. Warren DeMartini was sleeping on Jake E Lee’s couch. Jake was in Ratt. When Jake got the Ozzy job, he recommended Warren to Ratt.
Jake taught Warren things and they learned from eachother. Funny that in the days of Mickey Ratt (or proto-Ratt) George did a little playing with Stephen Pearcy and the band, but his solo I heard on the Mickey Ratt Era demo compilation was pretty bad imo.
Anyway, the Osbournes would have shafted George like they did with others so George was saved a lot of grief by Jake taking the bigger blows.
@@haliaeetus8221 true....anyone who worked for Sharon got screwed she is a mobster
Ozzy and Sharon then proceeded to pay Jake minimum wages, and coerce him out of his song writing credits on Bark at the Moon. Now he's sleeping on a friend's couch with no money. Maybe George is lucky he didn't have to deal with those greedy clowns.
The saga! Thanks
It’s also a good example of being nice to your competition and not letting your envy turn you into a petty bitch.
A disgruntled musician might’ve mocked Randy Rhodes for having parents who owned a music school/middle class and missed out on a teaching opportunity. Or saw Warren as being “the rival” and burned that bridge by the time they could use a hand.
This applies even to the most boring professions in the planet. As an standard office drone I can't tell you how many times we were after an interview "yes, he knows his stuff, but I don't think he'll fit in the team".
It’s not about who’s best; it’s about who’s right.
Occasionally they may also think "I know my stuff, I don't think I'll fit the team".
Yeah and the old…she’s very pretty, we can teach her the job
Oh, I so agree wirh you.Over the years I've been at different times the protagonist of this story or one of the guitarists who ranked above him, both as a musician and as a regular dude putting my college degree to use working in a normal office job.
So true. IME, almost nothing in life is decided on merit alone. Sports teams, jobs, college applications, etc. There’s ALWAYS other factors.
Great reason to start your own band instead of joining someone else's
easier said than done lil bro starting a band is NOT easy at all 💀💀
Until everyone in your own band decides to start their own band, and everyone in those bands starts their own… soon, no more bands. Just a bunch of individual guys with “band members wanted” ads
Yes, but there are thousands of new band that gets started each year, and only a tiny fraction of them will manage to have an album out, and an even more tiny fraction of those will find a sufficient audience to meet success (and I'm just talking about having some gigs in small show venues, not playing in a giga stadium).
It's waaaaay easier to make it if you join a band that already has it's discography established and a fanbase that reaches out over 100 000k people (at least in your own country) then starting from nothing and only having a tiny portion of chance (yes, because you also need luck at this point, no matter good you are) to make it...
Tell that to Robert Trujillo.
If this experience doesn't motivate you...nothing will.
I was a sound engineer for the later half of the 00s and early 10s and kept preaching this to anyone who'd listen. Unfortunately, most kids wouldn't listen, even my own band, cuz they already knew everything.
Nothing seemed to hold people back more than constant praise and excited shouts of amazement. When you think you're already awesome, you lose sight of what gets you to your goals.
Man oh man what I would have given for 2 things when I was 20.
1- someone in the know, explaining this to me just like you did.
2- (and most importantly) the ability to really hear it and take it to heart.
Number 2 is crucial. As kids, we think we know everything. I thought I was pretty hot stuff, as one of only a handful of aspiring guitarists in my rural high school. I moved to the big city after graduating and quickly discovered that not only was I not great... I was very mediocre. 40-some years on, I'm still far from a virtuoso, but I've managed to make a living from music all along (a crappy living, but still...). Now, at 60 years old, I'm in the twilight of my career but I'm still out there, gigging regularly and entertaining a wide range of audience types... restaurants, bars, theaters, festivals and so on. Importantly, I still enjoy it.
I played in several metal bands for 3 decades. It was my skill level that got me into my first act. I had terrible stage presence. I'd move and be active but i wasn't actually engaging and entertaining. Over time i started playing less technically flashy and started concentrating on working the crowd. I realized that its not how badass i think i am on the fretboard but how much of a people business music really is. That change made me sought after by many bands.
Take care of yourself. Workout. Don't eat like crap.
Don't talk shit about other bands and musicians. I'm naturally competitive but the business is not a competition. If you do you will burn bridges and alienate half your following.
Remember. You are a public figure so be courteous. Be gregarious and even boisterous but never be a douche. Be friendly and fun but don't get out of control. Its easy to go too far when you're in "character". Remember. All the worlds a stage.
EVH
Great advice 🤘😎
@@rogiemac hell yeah
Great comment!!
True. I played out and no one cared until I played Hotel California- despite first playing a complex V, II, I Jazz progression, after a few simple chords to a song that reminded them of better years did they only then tell me how great I was!
This is a good lesson that applies to all careers or disciplines/hobbies. Sometimes the most talented never get noticed or catch a break, other times people may feel threatened. Makes you really wonder how many guitar geniuses there are that never got to make it due to politics or external factors beyond their control. it's a tragedy for the development of music, really.
A freaking men!
@@TheArtofGuitarLots of Musician drama out here on Long Island! As always, it’s about Connections!
This is one of the Best Videos ever! Cruel Reality of the Business!
I'm ugly but I go busking.
Am convinced that creativity and ingenuity has been stifled by the growth of monopolistic corporations and the death of mom and pops
Most executives are not very smart. A young whipper snapper would scare them and they wouldn’t hire them in order to protect their own livelihood in the corporate model.
I’m convinced that there is a place for every musician. Just be true to yourself, work on your weaknesses, play a lot, and you will find that where you fit in is where you belong.
Take a page from RUSH. They're a band of misfits but stayed true to themselves. I think things turned out alright for them 😂
Yes and own it. What ever it is that makes you you
…One preacher said, if no one wants to listen to me, I’ll go preach to the cows
@@akeeperofoddknowledge4956Yeah. All 3 of them preferred to stay in their hotel rooms to read books, rather than partying with groupies, drinking, and doing drugs. What are the odds!😆
in the 80s and 90s this is not true. However it can be today because of the internet. There is a lady named Maluka had just about given up on music after attending Schools including Berklee. She ended up doing a song from video game the Witcher 3 and it went viral. She found a niche. I am a average sax player and below average guitar player( but getting better). I hope to create my own sound and put here on UA-cam.
OMG- I had this happen. I am pretty well known where I am from, however at one point I moved to another state and decided to audition for band. I play but don't sing. I nailed it as far as performance and they were very impressed. I was 90% sure I got it. I found out a couple days later they chose somebody else. They guy literally said "between us you were by far the best as far as your playing, but we really need a strong harmony/backup singer and this other guy has that ability. It was a powerful lesson. However it paid off- they liked my playing so much they actually started spreading my name around and got me hooked up with another band very quick. I still stay in touch with that band I auditioned for to this day (several years later) It prompted me to start expanding my skill set
This is a reminder that your music is not the product in modern times, you are the product.
So sad.
Depends on your musical niche and approach to marketing. Can't really compare say Ashlee Simpson and Slipknot even though they both qualify as music.
That could never happen to me because I never would play outside my little home studio 😂
Besides my Heart Tribute I agree. Haha.
Same. After years of playing with annoying bandmates because there’s at least always that one guy. I got tired of it. I’ll jam here and there but I no longer commit to the bs. In my studio I am on my own terms which is awesome. I’ll still show up and do a show here or there at a family gathering but that’s it.
Good comment - I have played lots of paid gigs over the years but now just want to write my own music and record it.
I’m the same way…
Prefer teaching my daughters and being a home body.
Geeez….that takes so much balls and bravery….! Get out of your parent’s garage and perform without the gadgets. Music is the most social of the arts and getting on stage is where the real magic happens, not in your safe little comfort zone like a sequestered man child. Challenge yourself and grow!
This explains Robert Trujillo getting the gig after partying all night before the audition with Lars and doing the audition with a massive hangover. Being cool to party with and performing well with a hangover was important to Metallica.
"performing well with a hangover was important to Metallica". Yeah maybe that would had made sense in the era before. But Robert auditioned for Metallica when James just came out of a Rehab. I'm not really sure if the most important thing at that time was to get a bassplayer that could party hard.
@@Atlas65True, that would maybe fly in the 80's when the musicians were still kids. But certainly not in a band of their caliber, no f'n way
Although this vid certainly confirmed my ADD, it was a cute story...
I always found his hiring humorous, because they recorded him meeting with the band. He showed up with no equipment, and they provided him with some. Ironic considering Dave Mustaine got the job with no try out just because he showed up with his own gear.
It was also funny that Newsted replaced Trujillo with Ozzy. It was like baseball teams making a trade.
Nah... In the Some Kind Of Monster scene James, Lars and Kirk simply state they felt Rob was driving them rather than the other way round and that they admired he played just as hard with his fingers and he reminded them of playing with Cliff. That's why he got the gig!
“Drummer went off and got married and the bass player is on his third DUI or something…” 😂😂😂 sounds about right
It should be reversed - the bass player would get married and the drummer would get the DUIs.
I should have known we'd never get far. 😉
Summer of 69: “🎶Jimmy quit and Jody got married, should’ve known we’d never get far🎶”
I used to play a lot of emergency shows with other bands because the drummer was in trouble or sick or injured. Plus I`m a singing drummer. I was straight Rock n Roll but quickly realized I needed to learn Country & Blues too. Country music isn`t as easy on drums as one might assume.
Loved the way the whiny rant became a real pearl of wisdom.
Very generous of you
Whiny rant is a little strong
btw- it does suck that you worked for it and are more deserving than some mediocre player who has probably worked more on his look than his chops
Holy cow. This advice crosses over into so many industries and career paths! UA-cam can be a mystery--I have nary an idea why this showed up on my feed. I cannot sing, cannot dance, have no rhythm, and no way can I even pretend to play any instruments! But I loved listening to this story and that manager's explanations. Cheers!
It don’t matter what you do as long as you look good doing it. - David Lee Roth
Roth can sing though . And we all get older . To me .. music is a gift to be enjoyed . Even playing on ones own .
To play with others is extra .. then you can't loose . Gigging is for fun too .
If people enjoy it . Better . Money .
Well its not a good career choice .
But . These days.. no need for a deal just ... well thats another story .
Online etc
well dave some of us look like Mr Bean , so much for a sex life
@@BrianRay-y7l does miss bean exist?
Yea it's always been more than just playing ability. Just being able to play doesn't mean you can write a song at all much less write good songs that mean something to people. Then add in the look and demeanor/stage presence and such. A lot of the best song writers are indeed average players and session musicians can often play the best but either can't or don't write songs at all and/or don't want to even be up in front of people.
Great break down
Finally someone with proper comment. Even playing instrument is overrated. Michael Jackson was writing song by beatboxing into dictaphone and real musicians then played instruments to mimic the beatbox. Having creativity and having something to say beats being the best instrument player every, single, time!!!
Sounds like this actually happened. Sorry for your loss Mike!
Hey, just because I didn't get the SP gig.. haha.
@TheArtofGuitar did you actually audition? Can't tell if yr joking!
That part about telling the sound guy to turn his channel down, so that he could unplug his guitar felt a little too specific to be just a random, made up story... ;-)
For what it's worth, personally, I think he would have been a better choice than the one they ended up with!
@@ceebee491I need to know as well
@@TheArtofGuitar
Hey Mike! It's me Jeffrey formerly of Subnormal. 😉
I was a finalist in their CYR cover contest and my cover of Anno Satana is still on their playlist. I didn't get a call 😢
My own fault for being an obscure video game composer and not putting myself more out there.
Check out my cover. I rarely do covers but this is one turned out cool!
ua-cam.com/video/IkISMftUhag/v-deo.htmlsi=zaKP1LGmN8ZWGENW
By the way we saw SP at a tiny venue in Iowa with Kiki and she absolutely crushed it. They played gossamar and it was incredible. Really happy for the current state of SP. 🤘
Forgot to mention I actually said to my friend at the time that I thought you would make a great addition to the band too!
This is great advice. It's actually excellent advice for actors too. Getting roles often has nothing to do with your acting chops.
Sounds like a true story, well relayed. I'm 72. Still remember being the only player who could copy dazed and confused( didn't realize Page even plays it differently live gig to gig) I was right there, thank God I met my wife ha ha. The second guitar player in that last band never gave up. We've been friends since elementary school. He got really good and makes pennies submitting tunes to BMI. 2 years ago I bought some new gear (God, all I had in the 60's was a fuzz!, lol) and am happy hearing something on the radio and spending a week figuring it out and playing for my own pleasure. These daze you need to be an 'entertainer'..you better hit the gym, learn how to move and have the genetics as well as the good fortune and talent...Great advice, great video...now I know I made the right decision in 1971!
I started up my own band last week after trying to get into different bands the past few months.
I said screw it, I'm tired of applying for jobs, I'll start my own business and let the resumes come to me. Instant success and I get to pick and choose my band of misfits rather than trying to merge into some already preexisting social club full of arrogant pricks.
Worked like a charm🤘🏻
Good luck.
That's what I'd probably do. That's what I had to do with my current business........so why not with a band, if I ever went that way 🤷♂
I would like to do that myself, except I don't want to have to deal with "managing" the band, i.e., getting gigs, scheduling rehearsals, all that stuff. Usually the founder of the band is going to be the one responsible for that stuff.
@@EricT43 very true, someone has to manage the band until you can afford to pay someone to manage it for you.
This channel is the real School of Rock, and yes, learning the chops is just barely the beginning .. if you are socially awkward, people don't care how good you play, there's no connection with the audience. For me, that is harder than learning the guitar.
That may be true in a live setting but not online. There are many awkward/shy guitarists on UA-cam who play at an extremely high level, and are rewarded with millions of subs and views. At the end of the day, great unique music will win out (btw I say this not in an argumentative tone, but in a hopeful one 🙏)
Literally said noone ever. socially awkward or not if you can play you can play. People WILL love you.
What the industry pros want is a great front man that knows how to move and connect with the audience. Forget mastering an instrument, those days are gone.
The part about social awkwardness is why I myself may never succeed lol also I look funny too
I feel you. I’m autistic, so it’s really hard for me to be able to speak to other people. Mostly from previous trauma of screwing up, I’m scared that I’ll do it again and make the other person uncomfortable. I also have a blinking tic when I’m anxious, so that’s a lot of fun. I’ll probably just sticking to the social media thing, and start a channel when I’m skilled enough (instagram, tik tok, and probably Twitter after a while too). That way, I can have the best of both worlds.
Elton John didn't make the cut for King Crimson but went on to an amazing solo career, Les Claypool formed Primus after not getting the call back from Metallica, Slash would have never been in Guns N Roses had Poison not passed over him, Stephen Stills didn't make the cut auditioning for The Monkees , George Lynch got passed over by Ozzy , so if you dont get the call back don't despair you're in good company and fate may have something much bigger in store for you
Hah, never heard that about Stills trying out for the Monkees. He was (and is) a hell of a player, and looked alright back then. Maybe not funny enough.
I think Slash said in an interview that they offered him the job but he didn't think their stage look was something he would want to adopt. So he said no, not them.
That's one of the GREATEST educational videos I've seen in a longtime!!! Thank you!
Any feed on this..I am 64, started with buddy of mine in the 70's.. played for 40 years together, 5 piece contry rock to rock and lots of originals, went well, not too well educated musics but our motto was "It's not how much you know how to play...but how you play what you know" I loved this vid
Don't have a dream to be a rock star. Love playing music even when it sucks.
Amen!
Even you have to hear music that sucks. People listen to music you think sucks. And they like it. My motto is you should at least give a full listen sometimes. I have actually become a fan of some music that was considered music that sucked. By doing that I have also become a better musician.
I'd rather be a musician than a rockstar!
"Purple sparkle V" and "Sense of style" are two things I never, NEVER expected to hear in my life.
True but women get away with that sort of crap.
Dude, this should be a mandatory video for any young players wanting to join a band. Good stuff!
Well..pass it around then...hehe:)
@@TheArtofGuitar I said "young" haha! The youngest I know these days are my teenage kids lol
I can see many of all ages benefitting, but I may be biased. 🤣.
@@TheArtofGuitar I was fortunate to not be too terribly out of style back in my day, but everything you said about needing to bring more than chops to the gig is spot on. I remember one audition where the band's pub-person spiked my long hair about 2 feet off my skull lol!
You know, this somehow is helping me get over my crushing rejection 13 years ago. Being 19 and an aspiring bassist, and getting to audition to play in a band with a bunch of other people you look up to, only to lose to a guy who was good friends with the guitarist, had a big van, and had more experiece. Ive carried that resentmet with me for fucking years. This actually is helping me heal.
I feel like back in the 70s. You could pretty much look like whatever didn’t matter as long as the music was good but nowadays your look and general vibe is just as important as the music if not more in many cases.
Amen!!
It was always important. How people present themselves directly reflects their commitment level, imo.
Yeah, a lot of musicians had the perfect face for radio back in the 70s, lol. Then MTV came along and screwed it up, haha.
I am not so sure about that. Have you seen photographs of actual bands back then. Maybe 80s metal bands. Hoo boy, I look at the photos of some of those early 80s metal bands and man, they looked dorky. The 90s weren't friends to anyone either. Think Anthrax wearing bermuda shorts.
A lot of huge top 40s songs featured female vocalists that were average or in some cases below average in looks. Now the looks come first (especially for women) and the rest is all secondary.
I feel your pain. I'm 64 years old, and can still hit every note like Rob Halford. Is there a band that wants me as their front man? Nope.
I'm 53. I'd join forces with ya.
I hope that's not your eye in the PFP. That doesn't look like a 64 year old's eye. Believe me I know.
Looks like the makings of Geriatric Priest. 😅
I’m 58 and been playing since seeing Van Halen on Fair Warning tour. About 20lbs overweight but play very well. Same here.. nobody wants an old fat shredder in their band. 😂🤣
How cool. Join my band man. My vox are only just ok, I'm 63 and I'm looking for a voice like Halford. I've already got a name, COB, for Cranky Old Bastards. I've tried to float this idea to a friend also in his 60s but he is into his folky gear. I wanna rock, and blow out ear drums like I did as a young man, but feel that young and pretty is the flavor these days. Those I am not.
so the choices are:
1. be good looking or change your look to fit the band
2. be rich or well connected
3. start your own band
4. stay a bedroom guitarist and post your stuff on the internet
Yes, this is pretty much correct. And it applies to everything in life. Not just music.
Exactly. 100%
Become a studio musician/hired gun? You will still need to network, but the look won't be as important and if you have your own gear....
It's just a simple fact of life that guitarists are a dime a dozen, so you have to bring more than just your guitar.
There's also
- do the legwork on your instrument and local music scene connections first and build more connections to gradually grow a steady line of work.
It can take years, but it happens to many as long as consistency is strived for. I genuinely don't care about fame so long as I'm able to make enough money doing what I am here to do
Remembering a key to this video will take you very far in life. Don’t say okay and hang up. Or text them back. Ask the questions. Find the truth. Act on that truth in the future. Excellent video.
A great lesson. Also aplies to many other arts and even some sports. Reminded me of stories about racing teams. The drivers where sometimes people that had (maybe) bit less talent, but could grant acess to sponsors and conections. It's a big world, great talent becames just a basic requirement, what else do you bring to the table.
When I started learning guitar, my intentions were always to create my own songs. Covers are good to have fun, but I want to be myself and see my full capabilities
Funnily enough I find it easy to write my own songs than learn others…😂 I’ve got it all back to front…but they are different skills, technically I’m lacking but creativity is never a issue
Same here!
Many years ago, I had my own songs and started to look for people to form a band. I met a drummer who was good but he wanted to play covers. I told him that I didn't mind playing covers but that I didn't want to just be a cover band and he said:
"You know what? People don't care about you and your songs. People want to go out, hear songs they already know and have fun!".
It's like you said. Covers are fun but personally, I write songs because I want to tell MY stories.
By the way, I ended up finding another drummer.
Same!
Playing covers is for learning only. After that you move on to your own stuff.
It wasn’t really my intention to write my own songs, but once I realized that I could, it became my only reason for playing.
As a guy who spent many decades in the music industry, I found this video to be one of the best I’ve seen for upcoming musicians to understand. You basically described the difference between being a session player, and being an “entertainer”. For instance, I know vocalists and guitarists in Nashville that can absolutely wipe the floor with most of the players in the touring bands that you see these days.
The thing is, some of them don’t have any interest in working with other people on a tour or being in the spotlight. They just wanna walk into the studio, put down their tracks and go home at the end of the night and get paid. And they do that exceedingly well, and don’t care if anybody knows who they are. Most of them are only known and respected by other musicians in fact, and that’s enough for them. But one of the things people sometimes forget when they say they want to be in the music business, is the last word of the phrase that they’ve just said. “Business”.
When you are part of a live band that’s supposed to go out and entertain, you are a product, a commodity, not just a skill set. Great job getting that message across. I don’t think anybody could’ve done any better!
Coming from a classical backround, I find this preferable to professional orchestra auditions, where the early rounds are done blind from behind a curtain. I hear stories of a position in a mid-level regional orchestra opening up then immediately getting 200+ applicants, most with graduate degrees in performance. Professors who I consider greater players than I'll ever be talk about losing count of how many auditions they took after around 50. Once you win a job, there's usually a probationary period, after which your peers vote on you before it becomes official. I've met so many people gunning for an orchestra job working themselves to the bone, usually to the point that they become synical about music, which makes me question if it's even worth it at that point.
A system that takes being a solid player as a prerequisite, then evaluates you on your professionalism, your ability to make connections, and your ability to cultivate a personal brand, pushes you to take a more rounded approach that leaves you space to still enjoy playing music, as opposed to everyone practicing 8+ hours a day to be 1% better than the next guy just for a chance at a gig.
There is a ton of wisdom in this video. What you described is applicable to any serious career, not just music. While I am an average guitarist at best, I recognized that I had to change my perspective and work with the talents I DO possess. Turns out I am a pretty good bass player... 😀
Success as a great guitarist is fleeting. I have known a few. The most successful were fabulous songwriters. So don't use bar chords and parallel motion, use common tones(learned in theroy). Write great songs and understand publishing and publishing law. I know a guy who wrote 5 songs which made to classic rock rotation and he is still living off those royalties.
It's one thing to be a great guitarist, the money for a long term future is in the publishing of songs.
The-Art-of-Guitar, your content has a special place in my heart
When I lived in the LA area back in the 80s I played guitar for awhile and according to friends I was good. But never let it get to me. So when some would say to try out for some big band and said that I was not interested because the competition was tough. Also, knowing what rock bands wanted in the looks department I would not make the cut because I surely was not the pretty boy.
Like you said, the caliber of player at that level were a dime a dozen. Then the hired gun and studio players are in an entirely different galaxy. Spoke to a professional bassist at that high level recently, had a good talk about the music scene, and the realities of it all. Knowing back then that it was not an easy life, I never did pursue it as a profession. Ended up working for the fire department which was my dream career.
The mediocre Nashville “session” guys. They all sell gear to pay the bills. Tory Slusher humiliates them.
Good choice
I heard that the Beatles got rid of Pete Best because he was too good looking. John and Paul wanted a chance with the girls too, so they hired Ringo!
@@psychonaut689 nah they got rid of him because he kinda sucked
This is the brutal reality of the industry folks. As much as I would love do this full time, I’ve realized that it’s not for everyone. However, I still play because I love the guitar and music. That’s all that matters to me regardless if I’m successful or not.
Its actually not for anyone. Except a few masochists.
I walked away from the whole scene very young.. about 18yo because I knew I didn't want to travel around playing the same stuff over, and over, and over, and over.. and I would have filled the monotony with whatever I could get my hands on.. and become part of the statistics very early.
So I chose self preservation
@@warthogA10 I also gave up on 'making it' quite young cuz I really just got tired of dealing with other musicians. I'm sure I could have found better people in time if I really stuck with it, but man you can easily wade through countless people who are just assholes, divas, slackers, unreliable, uncommitted, addicts, etc. Felt like I should just life a more normal life and keep playing guitar as a hobby. Which I have for like 20 years.
My dad was on the Johnny Canales show and that is equivalent to the Mexican MTV. I learned a little from him. I do not want to get up on stage and shred guitar. I might take a good gig singing, but all the points you make are extremely helpfull to put it in an easy manner for the benefit of the majority. I would rather teach professionals how to overcome their hurdle than try to compete with any shredding guitar because NO ONE knows what I have gone through to be able to say I am the fastest guitar player on the planet and no one contend. At the end of the day your video gives insight that all can benefit even as a refresher course. BRAVO🎉🎉🎉🎉❤
I can hear Frank ... " THAT'S LIFE!!" ... No stress, keep on playing>>>>✌✌No destination.
You don't know how much i needed this, thank you so much
You really are a great storyteller. Enjoyed this very much. Of course the moral of this story is find a great songwriter and vocalist, start your own band, and then you can dress like Coldplay.
I got the moves like Jagger and the threads of Coldplay. 🤣
I can relate.
When I was a young gun, I was a local singer, around home I was considered pretty good. I was a soloist in choir, I'd played in bands for a few years and I was making headway on the guitar, too.
I saw a band in town, they were excellent, super polished but I didn't really know any of the music they were doing. Later I learned, it was all 70's stuff, the Who, Jethro Tull, BTO, stuff like that and this was 1990 and I'm 18 year old. I somehow kept hitting it off with the drummer, who was epic and who I'm still friends with to this day and he mentions that they're in the market for a new singer. I tell him all about myself but the stuff I was doing was all 80's rock, which was all knew (Tesla, White Lion etc) and he said they were going to have a tryout.
I hitchhiked like 150 miles to where they were from and it was a disaster. They wanted me to sing Joe Lynn Turner, Rainbow's 'Stone Cold'...and I had never even heard the song. Then they wanted me to try some Lepplin, again, off my radar. On top of that, there was this other dude there that was familiar with all the material and I felt like a big waste of time.
The long story short is that, I convinced them to let me stay on as a roadie and over the next year, I learned all the material and slowly worked my way on stage.
Never made a dime but got a lot of crazy stories out of it. One of the craziest years of my life.
I wanted to say to you Sir that you have told the honest truth about the "politics" of the music business. Thank you. I am a now retired 75yo pro Blues player. Honestly I have been there too and done that so to speak. Your story touched my career path too. In the end I have my music and my memories. Others have rightfully replaced me and I am happy for them. The show goes on 🙂
Truer words...
To all the aspiring rock gods out there, take the story in this video to heart. It's not only about talent. It's also about relatability, punctuality, dependability, attitude, a willingness to adapt, respect (both on and off stage) for your bandmates and others on the bill and a whole host of other factors. All of these are, to a great degree, within your control. Your looks and wealth... less so. But those last two aren't always the most important, so work on what you can improve. And most of all, have fun.
This was really good- so relatable. I loved it
Great vid, its a hard truth a lot people need to face; talent will only get you so far. I watched another youtube performance the other day and the singer was one of the most talent mfers I had ever seen. But he was around 50 and balding, so no mainstream appeal. no one in the comments had seen or heard of this guy, but 90% were commending this rando on his sick pipes
Its the death of the "natural" music star we have witnessed in the past and present. I no longer wonder how the top50 pop songs of the past decade are written by like one swedish dude but performed by 30 different people. You see its stranglehold in all facets of music nowadays, theres no more "imperfect" songs anymore, theyre all overedited and autotuned to be 100% pure. the same goes for the image of the performer, as if they were taking pointers from wrestling kayfabe. anyone who doesnt check those boxes isnt seen as marketable to the mainstream and will have to be 100% self supporting, which is impossible unless your dads a tennis pro or whatever
Rick Beato has a different POV on “imperfect”. I agree with him.
You’re a great story teller
This is spot on.
Live music is about connecting with THE AUDIENCE, not about impressing other musicians. This is why live performers of the highest level care far more about the total identity of a player- the feel, the vibe, the energy, the look, the personality- because THAT is what an audience connects with, not just the chops. Great chops are both the bare minimum nowadays. It's everything that comes after that matters most to an audience.
There's nothing wrong with this. Live music is entertaining and inspiring people. I don't think I've EVER heard Billy Gibbons play a single fast 16th note run or blast of notes- in fact, the faster the song, the less notes he plays! On the otherhand, Eddie Van Halen could play 100x more notes sometimes- but both of them equally connect with their audience because of how strong their unique identity and personality shines through.
Great story, and good point -- but there are two sides to this story:
1. The A Side. Popular art is not about the art at all, but what surrounds it (mainly sex appeal, but also things that people love to be around: hype, fanfare, glitz, the spotlight, attention, personality, night life, celebrity, money, the fast lane, daring, freedom, success), and most of all, effortlessness -- if you even hint that you are 'trying', that will be your death knell.
2. The B Side. In spite of the cynicism, people first love the 'sound' of a new act. Now, this 'sound' may come naturally, and if it succeeds, then great, the fans are happy and the artists are happy. But... if what you do naturally does not catch on, then you have two choices: quit or experiment. We will follow the experimentation path. There you are, trying out new sounds, and all of the sudden one hits. Great, right? WRONG. You HATE IT! And now you are stuck with it. This leads to artist dissatisfaction all the way up to suicide, no matter how rich it has made you. Your fatal flaw gets back to the musician in your story -- you were a true artist, and not some egotistical schlock looking to cash in on his sex appeal or his connections or his social collateral. In my experience as an artist and gauging what people like and don't like, I think that the public loves to see an artist suffer, so they will gravitate to whatever the artist hates the most and make him do it over and over and over and over again. It isn't sadistic, it is more primal than that (maybe it gets all the way back to cosmic survival, who knows)...
3. The C Side (Bonus Wisdom): The industry is a business. It will copy whatever is selling, and what sells has had the hype and the fanfare and the glitz and the spotlight and the attention already, and the artist has already painstakingly forged a new path, struggling through rejection and criticism and ridicule, which merely copying avoids -- since the path has already been blazed by someone else, making that sound popular. The problem is, THEIR art will be real, while yours will be cheap knock-off fare, or, at best (and more artistically satisfying), you contribute and expand the genre (where a 'genre' is just a mass of copycat work). In the end, as artists, the original trailblazers will be more satisfied, having endured the real pain of turning innovation into acceptance.
4. The D Side (Extra Bonus Wisdom): Relating to effortlessness, the public will love your silliest work. I don't know what that would mean in Death Metal, but you get the idea. This is because your silliest work is your most effortless, and that was what matters. The lesson? What you think the littlest of will be your most promising work.
If the band you're auditioning for cares more about looks, connections, and your daddy's money... you don't want to be in that band. Problem solved.
It depends though.
Many many bands need competent but not necessarily out-of-this-world level of skill.
So as long as a guitarist can achieve the level, or has the potential, then the other factors mentioned can really help a band get exposure, a bigger audience and more money. And lots of bands struggle for money and practise venues at the beginning.
Do you really think that even someone like Van Halen would have been nearly as successful if he looked like a trogolodyte?
@@steves1015 You're right, it does depend. It depends on what that band thinks is important. And if looks, connections, and family wealth is priority over musical ability - then that tells you all you need to know about what those people value and the kind of BS you're going to be dealing with in the future with that group of individuals. Spoiler: it's not fun!
Does all that other stuff help? Sure but it's not priority over musical ability unless you're putting together a "show band" that plays with backing tracks turned up louder than any instrument on stage. It's true: People can spend thousands on efforts to look and sound "better" (stage lights, laptops w/tracks, high end gear, etc), use family connections to land gigs that take the local musicians years to get into, and hide musical shortcomings behind a facade of smoke and mirrors. If that's your thing, cool but just realize that isn't a band; it's an act.
Btw, I play professionally and I will tell you that looking like a troll doesn't stop people from having a career in music. There are countless not-good-looking people in this industry who are making a living. Good looks are always a plus, but not a deal breaker for a band serious about music or even for the majority of people in the crowd.
Playing your instrument well, taking decent care of yourself, and being a team-player with a good attitude is much more important than looks, money, or connections. And that's because, at the end of the day, relying on looks, wealth, and connections will only get you so far without talent/skill that allows you to stand out from the rest. Unless of course, you're looking for an acting gig. Some people are.
And then when you refuse to form a network of musicians and refuse to improve your looks and still find no band would hire you, then what?
Exactly it's about the sound first. Like how Whitesnake is basically hard blues rock with a keyboard instead of an organ. David Coverdale was in deep purple, and it shows.
No worries, there are plenty of great cover bands out there
People have social motives for doing stuff so it's sometimes really unfair how they will treat you. Looks and likeability acting like they want you to is more important than having the skill and getting the job done. In my city this local band i knew the guitarist from they paid 400€ for mastering their record with this well known mastering engineer that everyone here uses and thinks is the best. The record came out sounding harsh in the 3k 5k area with honky low mids in 200 to 450 hz area. I made a remaster in fl studio with the stock EQ of one track on the CD and send the wav file to the guitarist. He was like "What did you do to this, How it sounds so good?" And i was paid 0€ so it goes to show that mastering guy is only something couse he's got the social points. The problems on that record started in the mix. That mixer is also well known and appreciated here. I once worked with an singer who had a project she had recorded the backing track with that guy. She sends me the tracks and they all have lots of digital clipping! Sound was awful! And people think that engineer is great!
It’s all industries to some extent. The one that baffles me is songwriting. Why do these “artists” hire professional songwriters? Can they really not do it? Then you hear the song they purchased and it’s like…you hired someone to write this turd for you? I’ll write you a turd for half the price…but I don’t know anyone and nobody knows me, so that’s why they pay the “professional” to do it.
@@elosoguapo8137 My cousin is well known artist and since he got sober he has been hiring a songwriter. I'm not close to him but i tried to encourage him to start writing again. He's own stuff was better but the new stuff sells so he does not care
Love this!! These situations are so multi faceted. Havent been in one myself yet, but I've observed and learned so far from an outside perspective.
You need to be and do more than just know how to play your instrument, it's not always what you know it's also who you know. (A little sad but true).
You need to be the whole package, not just one ingredient in the recipe, and yet have some room left for self improvement in all of the areas mentioned, you need to be able to grow, both as a person and as a musician.
If you’re referring to the live performance setting (on a stage), then yes agreed, these things are absolutely critical.
The beauty is that we live in a time when you CAN be shy and be heard. There are lone bedroom guitarists with zero flare/moxy who make incredibly unique music, and get millions of subscribers and views.
Amazing music will find a way to win at the end of the day. As long as it’s great, fresh and unique, and not just a direct copy of someone else
That is why the more auditions you do, the better you get at your craft and at knowing yourself, even if that hurts!!
This has opened my eyes.. seriously
Absolutely nailed it. Most of my good connections have been made because people see value in a YT channel. Not because I'm the best anything.
Half-tempted to make a reaction to this lol. There's so much wisdom here.
The moment he turned down the Eagles / ZZ Top band, I knew he was done like dinner
yeah same here. All the problems he had about not knowing the right people and all would have been solved. You never know how well connected (especially GOOD) cover bands tend to be, my dad played in one for years and still knows people even though he hasn't played in a decade.
Playing ecoustic guitar is just a hobby for me, i am very happy with my ability with the time i have put in.
I love the singing more and lean into that when i play, i busk alot, and the reason is to get live music on the streets,i make a few quid, meet lots of interesting people,and it is usually alot of fun! I feel sorry for musicians spending years and tears trying to get recognised, i am happy singing covers and making people smile.........I also play guitar whilst riding a uni cycle, and was recently featured on our local weather forecast...
Good video! Being someone who's done this for more years and most of the guys watching this have been alive, I've come to realize that just being a good player and knowing the material is about 10% of what you need to do. I've been on both sides where we've auditioned people and where I've been auditioned and the most important thing is to be someone who is comfortable to hang out with. The next part is can you play well enough and if you make it that far, can you be someone who adds to the music and doesn't detract by overplaying. Most people won't understand this because they approach the music nowadays is sort of like being a really good fancy juggling act. We've had tons of great players come in to audition who basically just wore us out because of their acrobatic approach to music. One of the things that a producer I work with had said sort of jokingly is that if a bass player shows up for a country gig with a six-string bass we always want to send him home because every time someone does that they overplay and they don't play for the songs. You need to play for the band and not yourself. The other part is that sometimes these cattle calls are looking for something specific so they never actually say that. I showed up for a cattle call for Sheila E who I'd actually known from before and they didn't care how I played They just wanted to know if I could dance on stage. That one was annoying as hell, but I think you'll get the drift. The other thing is that if you're playing music to make money, you're in the wrong business.. good luck👍
I don't even care about bands and such and just want to learn guitar cause I want to - but this story was so well-crafted and so wonderful to listen, I stayed till the end and just wanted to hear where it goes. Amazing!
This is all completely spot on. I only figured all that stuff out after I quit playing bass. It took a while, but I realized that I never fit in with most musicians, I’m not a lot of fun on tour, stuck in a van for 18 hours with 3 people I’d never talk to outside of music, and I can’t wear the right clothes for the gig. And I can’t sing at all. I can’t believe I was actually a working musician for 20 years.
Ha. The truth is decent bass players are hard to find. You want a job playing music? Learn the bass and leave the guitar to the guys in the unemployment line.
Some gig tales from a boomer 😮 Even in semi-pro situations and definitely in pro situations - do not noodle! I subbed with a large jazz ensemble a while back. It was basically old-school swing and some latin dance rhythm guitar playing from charts. One of the musicians busted on me little bit simply for warming up 10 minutes prior to the downbeat. Also, make sure that you have very solid time - way more important than flash.
My 2.0 version left the band scene entirely. Spent 40 years at NASA, built lots of space flight hardware, and played local music theater shows on the side before retiring last month. Chasing after bands is for the young.
NASA sounds fuckin awesome! I’m a mechanical engineer in battery tech, hoping to transition to aerospace soon haha
Very tasty conversation. My guess is that a lot of guitar players may be a little introverted and maybe spent a little too much time alone with their guitars during their formative years. Good insight!
Aiming to be someone you would like to work with is something that helps I think. After dealing with absolute egos over many years this helped me greatly. Learning who not to be and what not to do is valuable thing. It's true that chops is important but who wants a pain in the butt shredder causing problems?
Man! This happened to me too last month. I tried out for this new rock band in chicago, they were a 3 piece
1 female singer 1 female drummer and a male bass player. I tried out , played 4 songs with them, things went good at the audition . Then a day after, I found out that they picked someone else. Someone who had the look.
This kinda stuff happens, You just gotta move on.
you can't be a 50 year old white guy and audition for the Surfragettes
I remember a friend of mine started a band when we were in our late teens; there wasn't much of a music scene where we were so they didn't get far, but their bassist was *incredible*. They played two or three shows with him, and then found a replacement who wasn't nearly as good and I couldn't work out why, but when I asked he said that the original bassist was an awful person to be around. When I started a band myself about ten years later I found the same problem: I couldn't just find people who can play, but rather had to look for people who I could both work with and have fun with, along with trusting them with my vision for the band.
What a lot of people don't grasp is that the audience only have to put up with a difficult band member for a short time, and they *always* see them at their creative best. Meanwhile, the rest of the band has to spend far more time with them, especially if they want to take the band seriously.
just came here for the thumbnail, tbh
At least you're honest. I like that. A lot of dudes were like, "Clickbait!" I had to explain that that's Orianthi the guitarist I talk about in the story. hehe.
@@TheArtofGuitar What part of the story did you mention relate to Orianthi?
@@KennysmelleI’m not sure yet
I got booted from a band in high school cause some other guitarist had a PA and his dad was a photographer for the local paper
Was he/she a better player?
Yep, that's life sometimes. Isn't always fair and sometimes sucks.
Story form is such an under utilized and refreshing way to convey....many things, concisely to you audience. Thank you for the reminder of how powerful this mode of teaching/learning is.
Dude! In a social media world where everybody's just teaching, licks and riffs and measures, it's refreshing to see an actual professional musician, explaining what it can be like when you are working to be a professional musician. I've been playing performing and recording for over 40 years and I've been that guy that was perplexed and couldn't figure out why he didn't get the gig early on and I've also been the guy that beat out the other guys because later on I did have a look I did have the field I did have the language and most of the parts that I needed to make myself attractive not just as a guitarist, but as a member of a team, and as a member of an entertainment organize. It can certainly be frustrating and I think it's really good that you did this video just to help people understand that being technical and academic and skilled is not necessarily all that's left for or sought after always keep in mind that video killed the radio star :-)
This whole build-up story is hilarious with how specific it is...
"On your way to the audition, you stop by a sandwich shop. The sandwich has too much mayo and there isn't enough ham and lettuce.."
Old school here, having to figure songs out by ear, constantly rewinding the tapes to learn the riffs, we didn’t have the UA-cam video cheat videos
Mostly we didn't learn the songs properly though, nobody told us about open tunings back then...
New school here, it's not really cheating to use the resources that are abundant. From what I observe currently, the musician world still greatly values players who have good ears, chops, and sight-reading skills-have gotten plenty of gigs because of it. But I still developed a lot of those skills by utilizing my resources (Music school, records, actual sheet music, and of course YT videos). Sorry that we don't have to use antiquated methods anymore? Maybe you'll be glad to know that students of music still transcribe stuff though? The path to being a good player hasn't really changed-we just have better stuff nowadays to optimize it.
The manager could have softened the blow by simplifying the message. He could have said "yea, dude, you were absolutely the best player at the audition, hands down, but there's more to it than just technical ability and we went with someone who was a better fit, overall."
Yeah, but I would want to know more than just an executive summary. I liked hearing about the female player's connections, Thor's charismatic onstage presence and cargo shorts' golf club / studio.
@@RogueReplicant You're right, the details matter.
He could have given the summary up front though and not get it pried out of him. But, also, he's a band agent, not a therapist, so I'm really not judging.
It was a cool story, all around, yes.
When I get rejected for a job, I don’t care about feelings. I want to know why I didn’t get the job so so I know what I can improve. But most just don’t even bother yo contact me. Impressed the manager took the time to tell him in detail.
Best reaction to a courtesy call is "thank you for the opportunity and if you ever need a player in the future keep me in mind."
Believe me it actually works. Just be positive and continue to improve
Yeah, but that wouldn't have helped the guy as much as learning where he was falling short.
Great advice, it is rarely just about skill. Vibe is always important. On or off stage.
Great story. If you want to join the show it helps to look and act the part. Playing crisp and dynamically for the song will get you further than trying to impress someone with your best heat. You gotta bring as much to the table as possible.
When I was learning guitar my dad told me that the best thing I could do was to sit in with a couple people better than me. He told me then you are trying harder. He played a few instruments but was good on a clarinet. He told me that he would sit with guys in Harlem during the day and try and keep up with them.
This was enjoyable, sir.
“You grab your modeler” I threw up in my heart…where it counts.
Attitudes like that are exactly the kind of thing that will prevent you from getting farther. Modelers are an entirely accepted gear choice these days in the professional world. They sound amazing and are way more convenient than lugging around some 80lb amplifier and a giant pedalboard that you're having to track down faults with every few weeks.
Tx, much appreciated.
Good for you for having the courage to find out why you weren’t picked, and for adapting.
Becoming “well rounded” usually pays off… career-wise & otherwise.
Good vibes ur way & Keep On Truckin
This was really well done storytelling and SO accurate!
Started a band. Left it because playing to me is a hobby. When things got serious. I knew it was time to go.
I had a child to support and a full time well paying job.
I still remember telling Herman the guitar player that was the first to join me, I was done. That was one of the worst feeling break-up experiences in my life. I was going to hold them back because I didn't share the dream. I love playing but already had a job. To this day I never want playing to become a Job. Just a hobby I freely share
I was in a cover band that played parties, pubs and weddings, we did multiple gigs a week. It turned into a job and I ended up leaving. The reality is that most people in most places want to hear the same material and much as I love Folsom Prison Blues, if you play it too many times it does get old
The distinction between having fun and having a job is important.
1:53
Always the bass players...
But hey, where there's smoke, there's fire, right? 😉
I just play bass in a church band. It’s a good steady gig.
I’ve played in rock bands, bar, bands, and full on heavy metal bands, and I’ve learned that my skin is not thick enough to play in a church band!
@@armoredsaint6639more drama in the church worship group for sure.
2000 years of gregorian chants can't be wrong
Great Insight For Remainder Of The Year, And New Year Approaching, In An Echoe whisper ( I , Also heard , But never give up regardless!!)..
Many truths compresed into this video. Thanks for creating this.