My Issue with Team Building in Wuthering Waves
Вставка
- Опубліковано 15 тра 2024
- Team Building in Wuthering Waves Might Be a MASSIVE Problem. While a lot of players will be coming from games like Genshin Impact or Punishing Gray Raven, most players who currently attracted to this game are here for the combat. If the current precedent is that players can solo the hardest content in the game with one character, then what's the point of having a team in the first place? There has to be more to it than that.
@SidneymarZA OG Vid: • What Is The BEST TEAM ...
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
🕹️ Discord ► / discord
🕹️ Twitter ► / iyokuu
🕹️ Twitch ► / iyokuu
🧉 Want that hoodie or shaker I use? Grab it at gamersupps.gg/Iyokuu | Use code Iyokuu
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
#wutheringwaves - Ігри
Also, by no means is this a video me saying I want a 1:1 of Genshin AT ALL. I go through the motions through the entire video and those that watch it (instead of commenting based on the title) will clearly see my perception of things change. I will say, based on some of the questions I've gotten so far though, I don't believe having a "Souls like" single player attraction to the game is a wonderful thing. The ability to do that is great, but that doesn't mean the inability to truly drive/need a team is also great. That goes for a number of reasons both Dev & Player side.
Personally I am hyped for it either way because the gacha rates are better then genshins
Its called Player Freedom
personally i like that team building is not nearly as important as genshin as it provides more flexibility giving you the opportunity to use who you want all the time rather than being forced to use certain teams or get heavily penalized if you dont
I had to say it, this argument is very easy too deconstruct, the points you are making will be fixed when more characters are added, right now it seems bad, but that’s because they have 20 or fewer characters, yes they only have 2 healers but that’s bound to change. comparing a no skill turn based game like hsr too wuwa makes no sense though, seeing as of course if you stand there and take turns swinging without being able to dodge your going to lose. I have no problems either the video overall it’s a good video, but waiting will prove to you it’s good and these points won’t matter.
PS. I hope that last part didn’t sound rude
Whatever WW will give them they will accept even if its trash just to prove the point that they love WW and hates Hyv lmao
Being able to play the characters you want and like, and not being forced into specific characters you don't like the playstyle, just to be able to do the content, is a good thing.
waifu over meta 🗿
Not needing to think about synergies or do anything beyond stick a character in a team and thus removing an entire aspect of a team building game is a bad thing
@@MrFrexys Same could be said with being stuck with the same characters because "they're the optimal teammates for the character you like".
Bennet/Xingqiu/ for a lot of DPS, Gorou/YunJin for Geo teams, Faruzan for Anemo, Kuki for Hyperbloom and maybe more that I missed since I stopped caring about the new team comps in Genshin. Didn't include 5* because the list would just get unnecessarily long, but you get the point.
@@MrFrexys That is such a dumb response, and trying to be smart by mimicking.
Almost like the only "strategy" that exist is team composition.
And tell me, what is the aspect of "team building", when teams are fixed because X character is only really good with Y and Z character? That's no strategy.
If you can use any characters you want, but needs to build them in certain way to make them work well together, that's where the strategy and synergy is at.
Also, this is an action game, not a turn base game like HSR. In an action game, when the skills of the players matters more than the character they use, that leave way more place for strategies... and fun.
@@MrFrexys they are taking a more mastery of numbers approach so if i attain mastery with 1 character i never need to switch but you can if you want to make things easier. I think everyone should have the option to make their own playstyle possible since i am more of a souls player i prefer mastery over team comp and only with arlechhino in genshin am i now somewhat able to consistently play the way i want and prefer.. If WW offers me that experience with every character and even better combat on top of it then i think that is a good thing.
I don't need elemental reactions in WuWa. Its fun to use what characters you like, instead of what characters you should use.
Honestly I prefer it this way. I hated the team building because it felt like I was forced to pull for and play characters I didn't really like that much.
I didn't realize so many people hated building teams.
@@IyoverseLess about just building teams, more about building teams they DON'T WANT to build because they're forced to if they want the character they like to perform better.
Oh you don't like any of the Hydro characters? Well good luck clearing every content with the character you like without the help of Freeze/Bloom/Vape reactions. Might not be the perfect example but you get the point, surely.
@@Iyoverse some people tired of it because sometimes in order to make effective use of let's say character X's kit you need to play them with Y, the problem is 1) it gives you restriction and 2) some people might not want to play character Y
I like building teams but I see both ways as well
@@Iyoverse i think the answers is, this is a gacha game and we all know the only way to get this characters
It appeals to me. I don't need a Genshin clone. If I want Genshin play...I'll play Genshin.
Facts
BASED COMMENT🗣🗣🗣
Facts
If I want to play a single player RPG with no emphasis on getting multiple characters.. I will literally just play 99% of all RPGs. You know, Witcher 3, Cyberpunk 2077, Elden Ring etc. Why is this even a gacha game if it doesn't incentivize you to pull for/invest on multiple characters?
Seems like it should've been a big-budget ARPG instead, makes you wonder why they made it a gacha game 🤔
@@vvverne But it does, though? Intro and outro skills literally incentivizes team play because they give buffs, and if that's not enough, they also help deal with bosses/enemies toughness bar.
Characters also has different roles, and comparing it to those games is just plain stupid as they have different playstyles and designs. If it was just a single character ARPG, I wouldn't be able to play characters like Calcharo, Aalto, Sanhua and many others.
Iyo, I love your videos, but I'm gonna have to hard disagree with what you said at the beginning of the video.
I feel like being able to just use whatever team with whatever character is healthier than being stuck with certain characters for certain team comps.
I dislike Genshin because of the elemental reactions. It was cool at first but then I ended up having to use multiple characters I didn't want to for the best results for the single character I did want to use. So after sometime wishing I could ignore elemental reactions, I just ended up quitting the game.
I agree I feel like since there is no elemental reactions I can focus on what characters that are strong but also appeal to me instead of going to the best option for a certain team comp
Completely agree. It can get bothersome when games force you to play set team combinations bc other team combos are so sub-optimal you can barely clear content with them.
I already have HSR & R1999 for all the sweaty team combos i can handle. I'd appreciate it if i could enjoy a gacha game that would just let me pull who i want, when i want, without needing to stress about team combinations for once. (That game being WuWa obviously.)
+1
Well said, I agree
Good point. I see where you are coming from. I get too stuck in team comps and other things instead of just playing the game.
tbf this was exactly how it was in Punishing Grey Raven and it was sick that way. while there isn't much "team building" it also means you don't have nearly as many "dead" characters (think Yae Miko, who you switch to just to spam skill/burst and never actually use)
I know that Hoyoverse is making more money in the Team Build Market Strategy that they do on Genshin, HSR, ZZZ, that makes players pull to make more Optimal Teamcomps.
But i think Wuthering Waves, having the option to not handcuff you on specific Teams will make the Game more Enjoyable and have more Freedom. And Players or Consumers of their products will have the Freedom to Spend money, to Choose their Favorite Characters with Better Gacha Rates than Hoyo without having the fear that they have to pull a certain Character to make a certain team and make their favorite character not optimal anymore.
Wuthering Waves 80 pity, and 100% Guaranteed Weapon on their Limited Banners + the No Required Teams Concept brings a New Revolution of Better Gacha Environment in the Gacha Space. ❤
I Agree. Since there is no specific Team comps required in Wuthering Waves, i can now have the Freedom to Choose whatever i like and will still be Optimal in every Content.
No wasted Money, Bang for your buck. I can Main Calcharo Solo or Duo with Verina without ever needing to fill the third slot. I'll pull for Jiyan and Yinlin for constellations, i can pull weapons with 100% Guaranteed pity straight up whenever i want.
It is complete Freedom from the handcuffs of Team Building brought by Hoyoverse.
Also i think people shouldn't worry that Wuthering Waves won't have much Sales because they are not copying the Team build business strategy of Hoyoverse that makes them so much money.
Players will most likely pull on Limited Gacha Banners since:
- they lowered the pity to 80 compared to Genshin's 90 pity.
- Since Limited Weapon Banner is 100% Guaranteed, many might pull for it as having SIGNATURE weapons is so satisfying. And now they made it more affordable to consumers instead of scammy genshin limited weapon gacha.
- The two Limited character Dupes in the shop will also help whales and dolphins in their spending as it it'll be more affordable to S6 the characters in Wuwa than to C6 in Genshin.
All in all, Giving better rates, knowing the Kuro Games company cares for their consumers, listens to them, and not scam them in their limited weapon banner, makes the consumer more than happy to spend in this Game. Just my honest opinion.
I hope there aren’t reactions. That part of Genshin never appealed to me - then again I was the one having a blast with Navia’s magical trench shotgun.
There were concerto effects in CBT 1 but they changed it so don't wry
Arlecchino would be great for you then, shes all field time, and because of her mechanic is basicly all dodging and damage you cant even heal her outside her skill. she mostly benafits from buffers.
@@robertlaidlaw4592 arlechinno needs a team to perform well without dying, unless you're a very skilled player and know how to dodge and not get it.
If someone wants to play a solo character safely, I would rather recommend neuvillette, because not only does he have the same solo dmg as arle, but he is also literally unable to die and can hit all the enemies in aoe etc...
Dying is not the Problem for Neuvillette its being hit out of his charge attack. C1 is practically required if you truly want to Solo with him. @@djampoucheukap1742
I like the fact that you don’t need a team, I don’t enjoy constantly switching between characters id rather focus on 1 unit and master their playstyle
Saying you don’t want it to be like Genshin but then saying there should be reactions is two sides of the same coin. Elemental reactions are cool and all, but it practically makes auto attacks utterly pointless in Genshin (unless you’re playing Eula, or a character that infuses their auto attacks with an element.)
This is where WuWa comes in clutch. Because while skills and ultimates do more damage naturally, auto attacks also have meaning.
As for teams being “pointless”. That’s a good thing. People being able to use the characters they want in a team gives the players freedom. This of course is not limited to buffers and healers/shielders. Teams still matter, but the composition is more loosely based.
I feel like you’re making an argument just for the sake of making an argument. I don’t think anyone sees the issue. I think in general people would feel better not being tied to running meta team comps. WuWa is going to be more skill based. Which is what sets itself apart from Genshin or whatever.
I think the team building in Wuthering Waves is perfect. If you don't want to, you don't have to and it has almost no impact. But if you pay attention, you get extra payoff.
The problem with elemental reactions in genshin is that it led to boring character design and repetitive combat. Wuthering Waves is more focused on making the characters themselves the interesting part rather than the elemental reactions as the interesting part because it takes away from the characters. Wuwa also has a combat system that is a lot more complex than genshin despite the fact genshin has reactions, so it evens out in the end.
The ability to play who you want, not who you must, and also the requirement to learn combos and get good with your individual characters, building a skill ceiling, is extremely healthy, in my opinion. It also feels like field time per character is 10 to 15 seconds, which means youll have time to pull off combos/dodges with esch character, so youll be actively playing and comboing with all 3 sequentially, to maximize your damage effects. So thats cool af. Better than swap button skill swap button skill swap button dps repeat
Tbh i ok with that. After Genshin and HSR i'm kinda tired of the whole team building thing. I like the fact that in Wuwa i can choose who i wanna play with.
I agree with you one hundred percent my friend, it was really sad to look at my favorite characters and know that they were useless in certain battles
I think we are abit too used to Genshin's reaction based combat. And when another gacha game comes along, it's hard to see another type of synergy between the characters but, as far as I saw, Wuthering combat system works just fine. The thing is, I don't know how longevity it will have if pretty much is always the same rotation.
I don't know if you've played PGR, but this is similar to that from what we've seen so far. However, in PGR you need mono elemental teams depending on what you're fighting in pain cage and the war zone mode. I'm sure this approach in Wuthering Waves shouldn't be too much of a problem.
Yeah, I played some decent time with PGR (especially during Crimson Alpha wave) and dealt with a lot of the X-team here rules. I liked it, but I can't say I was the biggest fan of it either due to me playing the game about 4yrs after all that stuff was implemented fully, y'know?
Being able to play whoever i want, without feeling "this is wrong" os the best feeling for me. If doing competetive mode or hard mode is the only time i need to think about my team, then it is fine. As someone who has played PGR, the only time i took moment to manage my team is when i do hard content and competitive content
Elemental reaction would ruin the whole "challenge" you have seen what elemental reaction can do in genshin, that allows them to one shot bosses. WuWa focus on challenge, that mean you drain the health slowly. Adding elemental reaction could destroy the whole "challenge"
Also Idk if you know this yet or not. But when a character is in a long animation and you switch to another character. That character STAYS in the field. For example, Encore breath attack or smth. You can literally just switch to another character and Encore stays on the field until she fires her fire breath or smth
@@Chadedit55 Or Calcharo, like Steparu mentioned. He has long animations and playing him solo is like death sentence because you either commit and get hit or dodge and lose DPS.
So we get to use pretty much anyone we want and we dont need to use the same handful of four stars for all time to be effect and meta? Sounds awesome.
Team comps irrelevant, solo Kakarot 👍
Exactly my thoughts 😂
Solo Jianxin 👊
I found a very based man. Kakarot Mains Rejoice!
We solo everything at level 1 🗣️🗣️🔥🔥🗣️
Co-Op, Jinyan and Kakarot .... menacingly walking to bosses across the planet
Imma just solo my favorite character and call it a day 👍🏾
Based, No team comps Bullsheet we solo 🗣️🔥🗣️
You won't need a team but what you need is skill.
Having elemental reactions will force us to play characters we don't like , just like how I don't like xinq, i want to play xianyun and shenhe as dps but their reaction potential is very low.
That's good in my book, very PGR like. And the more different it is to Genshin the better, that's how you create a good alternative to the current titles.
I find it better when a game gives me the option to freely play/pick my characters and I can do well if I perform good in any fight, as to Genshin, it's team building is very very restrictive, if you like playing Tartaglia you NEED a pyro user that can consistently apply pyro as fast as childe applies hydro and let us be honest there are very few pyro characters that apply pyro very fast.
So for me, Elemental Reactions are restricting the entire "build a team" thing by giving you less options to play what you like on a decent level.
Healthy for F2P
I think it's 50/50, but this is a good discussion point forreal.
@@Iyoverse healthy for f2p because they are not force to pull for character just to fulfill reactions and they can just wait to pull on characters they like
@@Iyoverse If a new f2p player starts fresh and gets to the point where he/she wants to do the abyss but requires specific element and team comps that he/she hasn't built yet. Now he needs to grind for two teams and wait for a new banner that his team can benefit from.
I don't think this will be as much of an issue as you're worrying it will be. I get what you're saying, but, I doubt this game is "team building" based regardless. I think we're just too used to how team heavy HSR is right now. Even in PGR there isn't much in the way of team build outside of matching elements.
Then you realize the cooldown for swapping is only 1 second if not lower and you can actually have 3 characters on field at the same time doing damage. The interactions are not forced, like genshin meaning you can play whatever you like and still utlize all the characters to maximum potential IF you are good enough. The game will play much different than genshin.
I like the fact that you can put anyone on the team. In fact, seems like I can make a one man team.
also on thing why do most CCs always base the game mechanics of Wuwa to Genshin? why do they not look first if the mechanics of Wuwa is also base on PGR?
I’ve played both of them and PGR does not feel like WuWa at all to me. It’s weird. PGR feels way more intense and attentive from the get go. WuWa didn’t make me pay attention to it (during CBT2) seriously until end game. Not sure if it was because I had Kakarot (doubt it), but it feels like somewhere in the middle. That’s why I personally compare them that way.
@@Iyoverse the reason why u think the game needs to have something like Genshin's elemental reactions is because you got use to it, Wuwa is like PGR where their elements is just tied to their dmg where there are certain bosses or mobs that are resistant or not to your dmg.
Many gachas have the same elements base attack teams that dont needed reactions.
If Wuwa still tries to implement this reactions then it will only be just be a Genshin clone at that point, then what is the point in playing Wuwa when u are already invested in Genshin right?
It is better to play Wuwa without the comparison in mind because if u still have that u will just be inevitably just comparing both while playing both games.
One thing is that u can play solo character in if you want because you dont need the Reactions.
Elemental reactions were trash and ruined half of the elements, we don’t want it
For the team part. It's "possible" to not need a team to win fights. But the question that comes next is "Can you?". Having a team is a necessity in games like this, but Wuthering Waves just gives you more freedom to do whatever you want.
With the team comps thing, you can choose to follow the right, suggested team comps but again you have the freedom not to.
This is imo one of the greatest things about Wuthering Waves. It doesn't limit your ideas at all.
This sounds good. This way we can just pull who we like and not worry about having to pull characters we don’t like to support characters we do.
The thing is, with Genshin, you probably and most likely struggle, to do open world shit if the character you like is not considered DPS or Sub DPS (at most cases), unless you build them as DPS. Take example, I really like Xiangling. but aside from really weak basic attack, and Guoba's fire, I cannot having her in my screen that long on my screen, because I need to swipe to other unit to support her.. Not to mention her energy issue. That is just example.
elemental reactions have always been terrible and handcuff team building
Favorite character over Meta is still my go to honestly so I'm not dissatisfied that it won't be like Genshin's team building.
dude those solos video you talked about are from veteran ARPG players, they played hardcore shit like sekiros, dark souls, PGR, etc... You cannot use that as a base to design a game man. Majority of base player including my self will suck and I would need to relied on team comp much more than those players. Well team comp in Wuwa at the moment focus less on the elemental side, but still people who suck ass like me will surely need a good sustain unit to function.
I was under the impression that was the target audience. Those type of players who are Souls fans, like myself. Is the game being targeted as just casual gacha players now? PGR wasn't like that so I just want to make sure I have the right info.
@@Iyoverse the hologram bosses are extremely difficult it is most certainly not being targeted for casuals for them specifically as those can one shot you no matter how well built you are with certain attacks. i think the person above was simply saying the only reason the hologram bosses can be soloed is by players taking the time to master the boss attacks and time dodges/parries after MANY failed attempts. its just like souls games once you master it you can make it LOOK easy
Besides the hologram, the game feels a lot more catered to the casual from what i saw in the cbt2. So the devs know that they have to catered the casual more and hardcore if u want sweaty challenge. I think they nailed their target audience lol. More casual(ToA, illusive realm), Hardcore(Hologram)
@@kreide6819 yeah required content imo should be manageable for casual players only optional content should be allowed to be hard for the people who want hard content
I think that's a good thing. It means if you want to play a character, you get to play that character with less distractions, without being forced to spend 50% of your playtime swapping to and activating 3 other characters.
It also means the characters are more self sufficient and playable out of the box and most likely everyone can be your on field damage dealer.
In Genshin, a bunch of characters I would like to play simply cannot be played on field because they are supports and their abilities would not work if they had a damage focused build. It also doesn't help how characters in Genshin deal non elemental damage with their normal attacks unless they have an ability to override that, so characters not designed to be DPS are stuck with the most useless physical damage type which also creates a split scaling issue as their abilities still deal elemental damage.
no, we dont need an elemental reaction mechanic, especially with the dodge and parry mechanic the game will be too difficult to manage and balance. And the element reaction will make it too similar to genshin, something wuwa wants to avoid.
I love that I can play who I want and with whomever I want because I'm not forced to play characters I don't like just to make someone else viable. I hate it in Genshin that if I don't have a good team, the character just feels like crap. (Plus you have to build up the characters you might not even like, and it's such a hassle)
So i dont need to use Xingqiu(i hate his design) to apply fast hydro for my pyro dps to deal more dmg? sounds good to me lol
Forced team building is tactical, but in Gacha Games its a marketing strategy to make players feel forced to pull for a unit to optimize a team. So it's a fun aspect, if it wasn't tied to gambling for the odds of getting the character and even getting the character to the right eX/cX to perform at the level you need for that comp.
i think a better way to look at this is that teams are optional. WuWa is supposed to be skill-based and IMO Genshin is more of strategy (personally, numbers-based, ure just trying to hit a dmg threshold). naturally for a skill-based game like WuWa ur execution should dictate ur effectiveness at the game thats why soloing is possible; in Genshin tho ur effectiveness relies mostly on the planning with ur team comp and builds and less on execution.
personally this is healthier cuz characters get a better expression of their assets; everyone gets some spotlight that could last for like around 10sec unlike Genshin where its better for supports to have less field time. i say "assets" cuz it doesnt stop at just their kits; like i cant enjoy Dori's quirky attack animations without gimping myself, there's also Raiden who has flashy animations and technically uses 2 weapons but arguably her best use case is in the backlines for hyperbloom. there are also some gameplay mechanics that are almost ignored in Genshin like Beidou, Candace, and Yunjin have parries and you would find that they dont really matter outside getting energy. dodging is also discouraged cuz it just doesnt do dmg and doesnt fit Genshiin by design, except for Wanderer where even then his motion values arent worth it. Genshin characters are judged by spreadsheets, WuWa characters are judged by personal skill; u have more freedom to choose to play a particular character u happen to like in WuWa cuz u have more impact on their effectiveness than in Genshin.
also have to consider that the game is just starting, who's to say we're not getting more supports in the future? its also just easier to have more independent characters than dedicated supports at the release of a game to help set everyone at a good foundation to clear content.
This is a good write up to explain the differences. I like this.
I am totally new to wuwa but if it is like pgr, the reason for having a team, even if you don't use 2 of the characters, would be to buff or debuff in order for your dps to deal more damage, kinda like crimson weave and the lightning team where you won't really sub her out for vera or 21 but they can maximize the dmg output. Idk really so correct me if I am wrong but it feels like they are doing smth like that
It's good not having elements. How many team comps do you want but just cant get due to gacha mechanics RNG. Also the reason videos soloing bosses with certain characters are cool is because it's skill based so it is impressive. Especially if they are choosing relatively bad regarded characters.
the benefits of not having that element resonance is that you can build the team the way you want it without needing to be restricted to follow elemental reactions or team combos, they pretty much base this in the previous game PRG and not Genshin.
It mean you FREEDOM to build the team, not needing to follow the team base on element reactions, if you look at Genshin Teams now they are mostly consist of meta teams
Playing trio units that kinda just work together instead of a whole synergy, I really like that
Im still gonna play Genshin and HSR but I also like this so I'll see how it works. If I hate it then yeah that'll suck
So this sounds great, I like this a lot better than Elemental application because it sounds like its a lot less limiting, sure it might reduce the depth of the combat potentially, but that makes it more flexible in terms of who to use without griefing your damage *too much*
Elemental reactions are fun. Until it prevents you from playing the characters you like because the elemental synergies are trash.
You shouldn't worry about the team at the beginning, if you have seen pgr the game that kuro made (the organisation of wuthering waves) it is a heavy team build game
but i believe late game that's where kuro will add more rotation reliant teams to get the maximum output just like in pgr
i think people are missing that things tend to be simpler/easier at launch
I think that team building has it's place, but this seems more like a solo game. If the co op is similar to genshin or tower however then it will be more fun with both players being able to eqaully do cool things that don't need to rely on other characters. One thing I hate in genshin is not being able to damage an enemy because the element is negated or absorbed by the enemy. I want to enjoy my main dps 5 star as long as possible and don't want to have to pull the next best support/sub dps every patch. Supports in genshin have basically more value than any other character in genshin even if you may not like them. No one in genshin actually likes bennett of furina, and only use them because without them you are significantly weaker. Being Strong solo is cool but it may not be healthy for long term success because just as many players will then be tempted to skip banners since they don't need teams
Humbly I disagree I don’t see how giving the players an option to have a full team or just 1 character as a bad thing. If your the type who wants a challenge then just use 1 character and see if u can beat the boss. U wanna mid max yr characters and stats? Go ahead build a full team to maximize ur dps capabilities giving the players OPTIONS is a good thing.
For me, it lowers the 'strategic' aspect of the game. Making it essentially a hack and slash for your favorite character until u get bored of said character. It might result into a shallow combat system/gameplay loop.
@@vvverne it doesn't lower jack shit. If they put a timer like in abyss, soloing will evaporate as a concept as all it is, is stalling with dodges. it will be exclusive to whales (just like nevilette can solo every abyss 12, except hydro immune ones) because of absurd dmg numbers
@@thatalbeeguy I mean I would HOPE the premium hard endgame content would warrant some team building. But I'm talking about the general gameplay, the stuff you would encounter 95% of the time. For a *gacha* game that's building its reputation for leaning towards *harder* difficulty, optional team synergy feels backwards & unnatural.
@@thatalbeeguy I agree with OP, there’s no need for multiple characters. This is basically just pick a character and mindlessly button mash to victory since there’s no pros or cons for general gameplay. In that case you might as well not even differentiate between 5 and 4 star characters, just pick someone and play until you’re bored of them
@@silverknight876 So basically like Genshin, but for some reason they get a pass, I guess.
team building is fun until you are locked or being forced to play certain unit that you just don't want and you either play with this character that you just don't like or feel miserable playing without or benching the character until they release someone you like and can fit on the team.
at the end of the day this is a gacha game and you need to pull for the characters and you not gonna have everything avaiable for you if you can spend money and can pull for all the characters, maybe is better to have a complex team building but at the perspective of f2p or light spender maybe it better to have more option because you not gonna have all the characters to build that many teams anyways and you gonna focus on some characters to rise and i think some people don't wanna spend time rising characters that they dosn't like and never get the chance to rise properly a character that they like just because they dosn't fit on the team.
i think building teams has pros and cons specialy or maybe only for gacha games
The girl from the cutscene for sure got blown up and died lol. You’re not alone on that one. I thought “Yeah she’s gonna die” when I first saw it too 😅.
However, in Tower of Adversity(wuwa's spiral abyss) there are cases when full team of 3 might be needed.
A healer/shielder, a dps to break the poise gauge of a boss with parrying, and a burst dps to frontload as much damage as possible while boss is stunned.
Audio seems to be a bit funky for a little while around 4:00 and 7:28 . I think there were some other places too
One way to introduce the elemental reactions without calling them that is to use the approach from Dragon Age Inquisition. It had combos that happened when a target affected by a status is affected by a trigger. For example, applying spells tagged as Eldritch on enemies affected by Sleep causes bonus Spirit Damage and a Panic debuff. Or applying a rogue skills on stunned enemies causes a damage over time debuff.
So there are way more ways to make team members' skills to interact with each other without elements.
The more I think about this take, the less it makes sense. What you're saying also applies to Genshin, in a slightly different way.
How so? Well, people always claim "Genshin is very f2p, you can clear every content with just 4stars", but I don't see anyone making videos about how 5 stars are a disappointment because 4 stars are enough to clear every content.
In the end people still pull for new characters and the game is doing extremely well, I don't see how that is somehow an issue with WW.
I remember they do have some sort of Spiral Abyss. But the system is like HI3's Dirac Sea weather system where you need specific element, thus you'll need specific team.
I would say star rail is a perfect example of needing a member without elemental reactions.
I like combat in Wuthering Waves because in Wuthering Waves I can use whatever character I like without having to build a specific team or follow a meta team and still be able to clear all content
Honestly, I will spend more time on Wuthering Waves than Genshin because the exploration and combat are very exciting and fast
No Genshit clone please.
Wuthering Waves does good with following its PGR roots.
Isn't it a little too early to guage stuff like this?
Its similar to PGR where you have your Attacker for damage, Support/Amplifier for healing/buff, and Tank for elemental shred
There arent ER but there are abilities that each character has that benefit the team like swapping in and out characters give buffs to team members
I wouldn't want elemental reaction .. but wouldn't mind if they add break effect and call it elemental break
Team building in genshin was a pain, I remember when I started the game which was the launch. I wanted to clear the abyss with my Qiqi yeah A freakin Qiqi because I use to like Qiqi back then, and when I did the abyss qhich was PYRO focus at that time, guess What element I didnt have? Pyro, forced myself to build this characters that I didnt want. That is why I like what kuro did because its not forcing you specific characters for specific contents. You just need two great dps of which you like for the endgame and off you go.
Elemental Reactions in Genshin are dogshit
Not only they restrict your teambuilding way more but also you only need vape and hyperbloom to easily beat everything
I think the problem isn't so much the team building aspect but rather the balance. If the supports give a 10% damage boost, then the teambuilding can still be a good part, it's just that you don't need to engage with it
Hopefully most people dont go all yap and complain why they get rekt'd by bosses after
Please don’t spoil this game with your horrendous takes
Please start a new game+ in life.
Agreed with the comments section. Only thing I didn't see mentioned that will appeal to Iyo based on his video about ZZZ is tactical team combat such as switching out a character during a vulnerable animation (Encore's heavy attack) to make them i-frame through the animation and stack whatever damage you do with the character switching in before switching back to the first character to continue their combos. It seems there are more combos than rotations because of this, which is awesome.
There are very in-depth character switching abilities that are combat tactic focused. Including using swap-in attacks to parry. And swapping out to evade attacks directly.
Reaction are not the way. That is Genshin Stick so leave it there. It is not fun and restrictive. As a PGR player this is the best way to have a fast paced action game. The skill level must matter not how many elemental reactions I can make to do real damage. Here if you have no skill you can have the most powerful build it wont matter you will die and that is what makes this game so exticing the knowing that if I dont practice and get good I die. #Wuwa does not need elemental reactions Kuro knows what they doing and good on them for taking all the smart gameplay from PGR and incorporating it into this open world
It needs a team, outro skill only buff specific type of damage like heavy attack damage from moterfi ( which fit Jiyan ) , Electro and Ult damage from yinlin ( which best for Calcharo ) , Aalto outro buff aero damage ( for aero dps ) , Taoqi buff E damage ( kinda good for Danjin) . And boss and enemy from high lv content very tanky so u need to have a good team and rotation (who should on the field the most who dont .
yall are too conditioned from genshin, you dont need elemental reactions at all, if one is stronger than the other you end up in a situation where people dont pull certain elements cause its reactions suck like geo for instance in genshin. hyperbloom just steam rolls everything in the game right now, you it doesnt matter what element the enemy is with hyperbloom unless they literally are immune too the element
do they have a reasonance ?
its actually great to be able to focus on how enemy reacts or how enemies do their attack so we can focus on parry and perfect dodge. if elemental advantage could be applied, something like burn, freeze, paralyze is enough since it is a fast paced combat. the team building in Wuthering waves has some sort of sustain(shield/heal) and a buffer before switching to main dps. we have outro and intro skills at the same time which will matter later on since each and everyone has their own into and outro.
its not like players hate team building. but its really fun if we could do a different variety of team combos and not getting stuck at specific team because of the so called elemental reactions. each players will have their own unique combos where there is no right or wrong. but ofc there will be meta teams as always. some characters buff specific element, or specific type of attack(heavy, basic atk, etc.) so team building will probably be based on that. all depends on where the source of damage coming from the main DPS. elemental reactions in a fast paced combat might not be a good idea since your focus will be on applying elements rather than the enemy movements. in difficult stages, enemies can kill us in 1 shot. heals does not overpower the damage taken like in genshin so we have to be extra careful unlike in genshin where we just put healer and not worry on anything. -this is where both games will differ. one is on elemental reactions, and another one is focusing on enemy movements and do a dodge/counter/parry to stagger.
as for soloing content. don't forget we have Neuvillette in genshin and Ganyu who could potentially solo abyss floors at C0. on previous abyss we had like Klee solo, HuTao, and so on. just that the current abyss changed that needs more element.
Yinlin can do off-field damage. marks the enemies AOE and any damage hits those marked targets will be damaged by electro something based on Yinlin's Damage. so we will see more of this later on.
oh and last thing, Rover can heal too but needs constellations/copies. i've seen Rexlent healing his main DPS using Rover. not sure if its team wide healing or just on-field.
cheers man~ :) few more days to go
I personally dislike the whole switching aspect of these games I like sticking with one character and mastering the playstyle so WuWa being able to allow such a playstyle is really good to hear
love iyo and respect your take but yeah i think you need to play a bit and know what you're before saying it cuz you dont seem to know the field time or what characters do or how the game will play out respectfuly this was a mess I don't know either and i didn't get prof of anything in the video plus Ive heard from people who played that the only character that doesnt take much time on the field is verina plus the take of you can solo if you want is the same for every game when it comes to strong characters aka if they can do dmg for exemple nuvillette in genshin hu tao yelan i have seen even heizou solo but in this game when you solo it's just a fun chalenge and not a dps check friendly reminder I DO NOT HATE IYO I JUST THINK THIS VIDEO AINT THAT GOOD MMY OPINION PLS DON'T ATK MY ASS FOR HAVING AN OPINION
I ain't gonna attack you for an opinion, but I definitely played the beta then and now. lol
Most of my feelings come from the physical experience of playing the game and while characters take up field time, that doesn't make them suddenly operate in a team together. Right now, it feels more like "swap in/out to get an auto boost on X, then swap back into X to drive the DMG. Repeat."
Where as what I'm looking for in an ARPG is more like... "swap into X, do 1-2-air rise. Swap into Y, do 1-air jump into combo. Swap into Z, do burst and get giga boost. Swap back into X, kill everything."
I don't have a lack of knowledge on playing the game itself. I have a lack on playing it like others played it, but I was still able to clear anything I faced because I'm just naturally good at Souls-like games.
@@Iyoverse"swap into X, do 1-2 air rise. Swap into Y, do 1-air jump into combo. Swap into Z do burst and get giga boost. Swap back into X, kill everything."
But there are already videos on YT, twitter, TikTok people did exactly that in CBT2. You have more freedom in WW to make team comps and do combos like that but you are not forced to do it.
@@Iyoverse I see I did play the cbt1 but not two so I don't really know like I said your comment is clear love it I feel like characters buffing a element or aspect of the game like basic or ultimately dmg is kinda universal which means they're kinda universal supports I don't know if that's a good thing with power creap ,and the feeling of the characters and their importance in your team idk about since I didn't play yet I'll see how it is when i play the game🤝 i saw a vid about swap canceling from ten ten and I think he's way of playing seems more engaging and fast I'd recommend watching it if you didnt great video 👍
Being this is skill based i think ill probably just level the 4 stars/freebies and save my pulls for a few patches until more broken characters get released. Some of the 4 stars look perfectly viable at this stage.
Elements and such is a stain on gaming, as all it does is just "omg red character better against red enemy, and blue against blue". It's one of the most primitive and idiotic ways to make characters unique and fill a niche. Skill in wuthering waves is tied to execution and understanding enemy mechanics, as well as your characters, not "omg this guy has guy has quantum weakness so I will use quantum dps" or "hm so I need to explode so I'll pick one electro and one pyro". You dumb down team building to matching elements instead of utilizing character's kits. Elemental reaction could be thought as an universal passive (aka after attacking enemy with fire, next cryo does twice the damage) from the game design perspective, so not having them can be easily compensated by unique and interesting kits themselves. Being able to solo is just what happens when you don't put a stupid timer on end-game content. If abyss didn't have a timer you could solo with everyone given enough skill (just like here)
Ya really gotta look at things like pgr’s warzone and phantom pain cage, if you don’t use teams in that your points will not be good enough
It doesn’t need elemental reactions, there will be activities where you CAN solo them but it would not be advisable
Let's be honest Genshin doesn't have team building either most meta teams are built on one main DPS and support casts for melt or whatever and most of the time those other characters don't see light of day unless for ER
Yeah, absolutely. It's the elemental system that glues them all together, which is why I mentioned WuWa would benefit from adding some type of mechanic like that into the game. A way that strings characters together in a team unless they plan on releasing team-specific elements/combos shortly after release.
@@Iyoverse It's a system that glues them together to the point that removing/not having one of them is just gimping your damage, making your favorite character worse. Sounds fun.
I'd rather glue together the characters I like, rather than the characters I need.
The main problem is that no matter which characters you have in your team, the characters themselves will all play the same regardless. There is zero variety in how a character can be played.
This video just killed a lot of the hype for me with this realization 😂
This was one of ToF's big problems as well. Basically, if the next character doesn't increase your team's efficiency, there is little reason to pull. Powercreep ends up being a driving force behind character development.
why am i just hearing acheron and furina :,D im so confused, are we talking abt genshin or wuwa (idk any characters in wuwa)
I'm still going to use teams, because then I can look at three really characters at the same time, and I can switch playstyles whenever I get tired of a character. Its just like a fighting game to me. (Like Blazblue Cross Tag Battle!)
I'm very happy that they didn't go with the elemental reaction (concerto effects) route, because it makes the team building much more flexible. There are times where it's ok to play solo, but to use the full potential of the characters it's better to build a team. Also in Tower of Adversity (WW's "Abyss") it's very hard to clear the hardest stages without a team, you can also swap cancel and do more damage when using a team.
For other modes like Hologram, if you have a really strong character you can use it to clear the stage, and that's fine if you're good in the game and also you did a lot of effort to build that character. There's one more mode that's the Illusive Realm where you're forced to use one character, maybe it will change, idk. I think the game is very diverse, so there's a lot of space for experimenting and play it how you like.
Honestly if the game is going to be like this i will just save until a really pretty/cool character comes out and only pull on standard since team building isn’t as important.
I will just max just get max dupes on the character i like a lot basically
You won't. You'll forget about elemental reactions
Yeah you get to be more resourceful you don’t need to build as many characters. Which is good to save money
so far, it looks like the team building from hi3 except for the elemental restrictions. buffer (long) > buffer (short) > dps essentially.
I agree with you. Having elemental reaction or somthing like that will benefit the game on the long run
L take, elemental teams and synergies be can stay in Genshin sorry.
When a games has character that has an effect that can stack up to 100 times they probably don't encourage quick swap.
I just want to play Encore🗿
team building system that you want is the exact reason i stopped playing Genshin
Star rail dont have e reaction and its doing fine tho?
It’s way less about the elemental reaction and more about the concept of gluing the team together. If you watch my content, you see I had similar issues with HSR in the beginning too, when everyone only spoke about hyper carry Bronya or bust.
@@Iyoverse and just like star rail maybe they gonna add more teambuilding mechanism in future hopefully, tbf star rail didnt have team variety untill ruan mei lol
Intro and outro skills are going to be dope this is almost the same with honkai impact 3rd its going to be QTE instead of reactions
i think team building still matters but if u r good enough and know what ur doing u can still get away with not having the best team comp but will see.
intro/outro, set effects, character buffs, path buffs, etc which give huge damage bonuses when you switch lol.. just because there's not a pretty elemental explosion does not mean there's no reason to switch or pay attention to sizable buffs. this just lets you be more flexible with teams, which is absolutely a good thing. there's still synergies that will only get more involved with a bigger roster size down the road.
the argument that good players can solo with characters does not mean teambuilding isn't a big deal. it will be for the vast majority of people, nor does it mean it won't add a ton for good players to kill much more comfortably. your gripe at that point is with boss HP i guess? which is a completely different complaint than teambuilding.
I don’t believe I have a grip with boss HP? Even I’m not sure if I mentioned that.
@@Iyoverse i said that because you mentioned being able to solo bosses, without needing to utilize damage buffs via switching characters. boss HP being low enough to forego team synergy would be the complaint there, not that team synergies aren't important.
i think that it should have ot own system of combat that it revolves around like genshin with elemental reaction and hsr with the break bar right now all it has is parry doing and spam buttons to attack and switching to do the cool outros and intro skills
This comment section is wild. No idea so many people hated the teambuilding in Genshin. Especially the people that felt they HAD to play a certain way, like.... no? I'm a Venti Main, my most Meta team is Morgana, but I don't have Mona and I refuse to pull Ganyu. Guess what? Doesn't make him useless and doesn't mean i suddenly have to play international just because i have everyone needed for it. I can put him on a physical build with Xingqiu, Fischl/Beidou, and Mika, and he'll still clear the abyss. I can put him on a burning team with Baizhu, Bennett, and Kazuha and still clear (in fact, that's probably my strongest team), since I have access to Faruzan and Bennett, I can also do an anemo hypercarry team. I can make a bloom team with dendro mc, barbara, and collei! It'll be scuffed, but it'll clear.
It always confuses me that people feel they have to play a certain way, especially in GENSHIN. People clear the abyss with random teams and starter four stars all the time. Some are harder than others, but if they can do it with those restrictions, you can go make yourself a burning team because you don't like the hydro characters, you can make a taser team because you don't like vape teams. You can use Cryo Eula if you hate physical. You don't like any of the popular supports? Play Yun Jin, Mika, Dori, Chongyun, ANYONE! Genshin is flexible, and all the people saying otherwise are wild. Just because you aren't creative enough to use your resources doesn't mean the game itself is forcing you to be Meta. That's just skill issue.
WuWa is a playstyle focused on switching, dodging, and parrying. Genshin is a playstyle focused on team composition and rotations, with little care towards dodging so long as your characters don't flat out die. They are different games with different playstyles, for different people. I just think it's wild that so many people are saying Genshin is inflexible just because you can solo in WuWa. You can do it in Genshin too, but at significantly higher cost because that's not what the game wants you to be doing? It's like soloing in pokemon black, the experience system is there because they want you to BUILD TEAMS, ANY TEAMS, just so long as you aren't soloing. You can still do it, but with significantly more effort and grinding. You can probably put 4 Main DPSs on your team and figure it out, if you really wanted to. And I'm not talking about whales either, my best friend brought Diluc, Ayato, Alhaitham, and Childe to Abyss once. She's F2P.
You main Childe but hate Kazuha, Bennett, and Xiangling? Fine, hyperbloom: Nahida, Xingqiu, Kuki. Don't like any of them? Dendro MC, Yelan, Raiden. Collei, Kokomi, Lisa. You have OPTIONS. Want to play Freeze Childe? Ganyu, Layla, Kazuha. Still don't like Kazuha? Sucrose. Don't like Ganyu? Kaeya, Ayaka. Don't like Layla? Diona. Taser Childe? Raiden, Dori, Fischl, literally ANYONE.
You aren't bound by meta. I have literally used Sunfire Tighnari to clear Abyss. SUNFIRE. TIGHNARI. With BAIZHU. That team has 3 HEALERS, and I cleared floor 11 with 9 stars and 12 with 6 (bc i was too lazy to keep trying). And my builds are trash. Literal trash. I went until i had all the main stats, then stopped. No care towards the substats.
Like, I know people love dunking on Genshin in favor of WuWa, but they're entirely different games in this aspect. I'm glad the people who hate team building finally got a game, but the people who thought genshin was restrictive are either lazy, uncreative, or plain stupid.