Eingentlich ist beides was du geschrieben hast ein normales messer welches länger ist. Bei dieser Waffe muss Lange oder Langes ebenfalls groß geschrieben werden. Geben tut es das mit s oder ohne. Auch gibts das als ein Wort, Langmesser was aber auch eine waffe der Indianer bezeichnet.
@P Ciprian Aaaam, no. A scimitar is different weapon from the saber, mostly because the handle and pommel shape (early sabres had small cross-like guards, small ball-like pommels, and maybe curved handles, while later variants had knuckleguards, and the blade was a bit more straight). Scimitars are actually a group of swords, encompassing shamsirs, kilijs, pulwars, tulwars, shotels, kirpans, and nimchas. They differ quite much, but the assimmetric pommel(minus the shotel), and heavily curved blades seems semi-common. Only the kilij seems to have false edges, while sabres of the medieval ages usually had them. Cutlasses seems to have either no or very small pommels, knuckle guards that usually merge with the pin of the tang, S like guards, and sometimes baskethilts, seemingly the halved versions. They may also have completely straight variants. A katana is a fuckin' katana. You may call it a japanese bastard sword, but it's not a cutlass. It doesn't have a knuckle guard, the crossguard is small and oval shaped, the handle is straight (denying ergonomy btw), and they all seem to have that weird cross-like pattern grip coverage. Their construction is also very different, as cutlasses were used from the reinesance periods, when metalurgy had a boom, while japan was still using medieval and worse smithing techniques even in the modern ages. A machete doesn't have a crossguard, the blade is top heavy, and never has a false edge. They also don't have a pommel, as the handle covers the tang, and it's can be riveted as well. Messers can, and usually have curved blades, the differences are named in the video, so is the falchion's. Watch it. The two swords he shown were messers btw, he even told you. Lastly, it seems to me that you think swords are designated simply from their blades, which is wrong. Swords are made up of a blade, a crossguard, a handle, and a pommel, which all are reference ponts when designating them.
@@StormBringare At least when it came down to single edged swords. Plus there was the whole thing about blade length. The swordsmiths tended to stick with certain lengths, whereas the knifemakers could basically do what they wanted seeming as at first, legally, the only difference between a sword and a knife was the shape of the handle.
Shadiversity made a series about falchion and messer. Difference is mostly in grip, falchion has sword grip (because it was made and sold by swordmaker), messer has riveted knife grip (since it was made and sold by knifemaker).
And let's not forget the fact that the periods of regular use also dictated the general blade dimensions(not just thickness but also presence or absence of distal taper) of falchions and messers, as well as prominence of the implementation of a point/tip on the blade. It's a shame that some sword types don't get as much attention from a scholarly view. As far as I know only James Elmslie has given the falchion and messer sword types any thorough study. I suppose that's mainly why there is so much confusion as to what falchions and messers were/are.
Every video in existence with more than 1000 views has dislikes. Doesn't matter if you save kittens or work on curing cancer, somebody is going to dislike it.
Im Not being " a hater " in the slightest But this is the skal video I've be waiting for. I feel like its been forever since we got just a regular video. Personally, I'm not a fan of the live streams or the let's play etc. If you're doing them, some people must like them, but itd be cool if we could still get like 1 or 2 videos like this per month. I've see a whole bunch of skallagrim notifications but they're were always live streams, vr let's plays, etc. These are the type of videos that won me over, and it just feels like its been forever since we got one thats all.
in this last month, with cristmast and all, he put on 14 video, of this 2 are vr let's play and 4 from lives all the other 8 video are his classic video: swords tests sword review hema historic autencity in videogame
Last month I put up the video on partial sharpening of sword blades, the Darksword Armory testing and review, the video about the high end messer, historical accuracy in Assassin's Creed Odyssey, and the ones about strength in sword fighting, longsword techniques, and leather / bone armor. Sounds like you might have missed a lot?
@@Skallagrim I watched some of them. This is the just first video in a long time that had that spark though, thats all I'm saying. Armor, video games accuracy, I skip those videos personally. Must have been a soft spot because your cronies came to bat lol.
I personally love his live streams. I try to make it to every one, but there's been a few I've had to miss. As for "his cronies coming to bat," I'll skip the mild offensive nature of that comment and just say that his scrutiny of fantasy weapons and video game weapons are extremely popular. He himself has said he's not sure why that is, but they are. And his actual HEMA type videos, though widely requested, get much fewer views. (I wish they didn't because I love those too, and his sparring videos). Then again, I am a fan of Skallagrim and have been for a long time so, anything he puts out, I will watch.
Shad did a great video series on the modern classification and distinction of the Messer and Falchion which Skallagrim did a good job of summarizing. Great content as always Skallagrim
Yes, but it having that name gives wrong implications. Whether the developers actually THINK that's what a falchion looks like or not, the fact that Skall felt the need to clarify it means that more than a few people DO think it's an actual falchion.
@@alphaxtitania5597 This has historical precedent, though, several mythical swords have names which are words used to describe a sword, such as Caliburn, Caladbolg, and Lævateinn.
Really awesome, that you checked the german grammar and pronunciation. Most people do not do that. That shows again how much effort you put in your videos.
Honestly, I find the Kriegsmesser to be an incredebly gorgous weapon somehow... It just kinda looks elegant for a sword that size I think. Anyone else?
I main hand one when not using spears or polearms. I adore them and find they working incredibly well when switching between Longsword, saber, and messer techniques. Guaranteed to throw your opponent for a loop.
I mean the Falchion in fire embelm is not *a* Falchion, it is a named weapon. Why it's called that, who the hell knows, but it's not like there's 10 of them kicking around in a game.
Actually two different named weapons. The Falchion belonging to Chrom is the same one that once belonged to the hero - king Marth while the Parallel Falchion is a separate sword that has time travel powers. Notably when the Falchion is empowered by the titular Fire Emblem it becomes the Exalted Falchion, a more powerful form that has different properties than the Falchion. Now why Nintendo and Intelligent Systems decided to name what appear to be arming swords after a different style of sword is beyond me.
that's the weirdest part. It's a sword NAMED Falchion. I guess it's like how Geralt's horse is named Roach. But in that case it would be more like if it's named Donkey. Frankly it's just confusing and I also have no idea why they did this.
Id love a commonly confused classification series, this was super helpful and knowing more about say a saber vs a cutlass or a cutlass vs a scimitar would be awesome too
Also Hanger. I mostly call mine a hanger, basically the same concept. "Swords are being misnamed." Well, actually, most of them are just called "Swords." Even Katana is just Japanese for Sword. Arming swords, Longswords, broadswords, bastard swords... Most of them were just called a "Sword." if you want to get technical.
@@mancubwwa Yes, and Most of them were called Swords. A saber is a class of Sword. You can get more specific, but when you get to "That's not a Fachion, it's a Messer" you're splitting hairs. You know what sei Germans called Dussaks when they got to Czecheslovakia? "Messers." A Shamshir, Talwar, Dhao, Cutlass, Hanger, or Katana could all be called Sabers, so could they be called Swords. In fact, if you look up Hanger on Wikipedia, you'll be re-directed to Cutlass.
I really like how the messer, especially your example, looks. I don't know what it is about Germanic blades but they had a unique style and look that I appreciate. Thanks for the video.
Yeah, like the others are saying, Falchion is the name of Naga's tooth. The type of sword is never mentioned, though it is likely a longsword due to it's two-handed grip and near one-handed blade.
I think it's important to note that the falchion (and glaive as well) have the archaic definition of simply meaning sword, though the usage has changed. I think in fantasy lore which draws inspiration from older writings the term falchion might be used interchangeably with sword. Fantasy is kind of unique in that a lot of words get used with their archaic definitions quite commonly.
Or in fairness you could use this as an example of why strict yes or no definitions don't work in history or biology, cuz historically sword making didn't have a trading standards body and neither does mother nature
5:20 Here in the Iberian península we've found various types of messers, we didn't called them messers obviusly but there are equivalents spread all over europe. Also, as far I'm concerned, one handed messers are called langes messers
Matt easton said in one of his videos, that the biggest diffrence between falcoins and messers are that falcions has more of a common swordsmithingprocess with a normal swordshilt, while the messer is often smithed as a knife, with most of them fulltanghilts
I've always just looked at the grip and pommel to tell the difference. Messers in my experience always have a knife grip and pommel construction where as falchions have sword hilt construction. I was always led to believe that Messers came about by the knife makers guild who used a loophole in the manufacturing laws for sword making by making swords with knife hilt construction to then sell them as "knives" at lower prices then swords to undercut the competition (sword makers guild).
Going by Wikipedia, the biggest difference is in the hilt; a messer is technically a knife, and the hilt construction often reflects that. I have also heard it tossed around (with no confirmation) that this construction and terminology may be a way of manipulating sword bans in the interest of keeping a blade for self defense.
Skall is German, though I believe he said something about his German being rusty due to not using it much. (And he also apparently doesn't like his German side/heritage, for whatever reason. Oh well, I guess that just means more gothic plate for me.)
@@LurkerDaBerzerker He is definitely not german. His german is not rusty, he has an accent. A scandinavian one. After researching he is norwegian or sweden and worked in germany for a while where his german is from.
Arsino Meteor Then I don't get why he says he doesn't identify with his heritage, if he is identifying with his heritage? (Scandinavian/Norwegian) (I would like to ask where you got this info from, considering he has said himself he was born in Germany during a livestream?)
Hmn. Shad made some very lenghty videos on this topic, and the baseline there was "Messer and Falchion are the same swords, just with different handle constructions".
my only proper reference for falchion before this video was critical role, and I always assumed the main part was the clip end and curved blade, this is really interesting, love your work
1:33 I believe those are a type of 'langseax' a larger, more developed version of the 'seax' (I could be wrong) but I don't think those are falchions. Maybe the langseax is a precursor to the falchion?
I personally think its bit more complex over all. Would you call for example knife or dagger with no riveted handle with scales, but peened construction sword suddenly just because of the handle? I think basicly criteria Skall listed applies to historical specific germanic sword we call messer, but its confusing since it just means "knife" but its not really that more confusing how in china word dao means both knife, and sword sized objects. But we sort of need list of criteria today classifying the messers i doubt people back then cared that much like german guy who ends up with english falchion likely would call it just messer or sword some english falchions even have the nagel. But i would personally say both falchions, and messers are type of sword
I think it is the most helpfull to see the Messer as a literall long version of a Mushroom knife. Many people (especially older ones) have these kind of small knifes. More modern ones are foldable but the older ones look basically exactly like a messer just smaller and without the guard.
Im sure there is a vid somewhere from a person who is considered an expert in Falchion/Messers who said that there have been examples found of the same type of blade being used on both swords, but as you clearly say the only determinable difference between the two is the handle and crossguard and thats what determines whether it is a Falchion or Maesser
@@acediadekay3793 from what i gathered over the years, he is born in norway and moved to canada. because of his accent i originally thought hes from germany but i think he actually never lived there.
@skallagrim As a german myself i congratulate you fir your proper pronounciation of the word "nagel". It is much apreciated that you try to pronounce words of forein languages in a proper way. For your interest: your r sounds still a little to english. Try a rolling scottish r if you want that shoult nail it more.
To defend the Falchion from FE (aside from the fact it's a fantasy game) it doesn't purport to be a Falchion it's the Falchion (Or Parallel Falchion) it's a name rather than a type.
Oh Shadiversity did this once. I remember coming away with the impression that there was a large amount of overlap(possibly it was just the handle?). Now I wonder if there even is a commonly agreed upon definition.
If a messer's nail is pointing up instead of down, is that more preferable? I would assume catching is better than deflecting, but I would like to know. If they dont make them that way would that be an upgrade hypothetically?
Skall, shadiversity already made a video on this and even brought out a classification system for single egged medieval swords, I think you should check it out. In the end the only true difference is in the handle and pommel
I feel the need to clarify that part regarding German grammar. German is a highly synthetic language (comparable to Greek, really, though more so, even), meaning it tends to form new words not so much by invention, but by compounding two or more words and/or word components (such as prefixes, suffixes etc.) to convey a related meaning; so the words used for the Messer would be Kriegsmesser; langes Messer or Langmesser; grosses Messer or Grossmesser. The two latter names, each with two variants, are not really because of a definitive or indefinite sentence structure ("a[n]" versus "the"), but rather based on whether you are saying "long knife or "longknife," so to speak, and likewise "great knife" or "greatknife." The reason for this difference lies in that German is also a highly declined language, i.e. adjectives, nouns etc. have multiple forms, which we call declension (being a type of conjugation). So "long knife" entails _declining_ the adjective "long" (lang) to fit the noun "Messer," so in the nominative "a long knife" is "ein langes Messer" and "the long knife" is "das langes Messer," but as a compound, the adjective "lang" gets attached to "Messer" and becomes "ein Langmesser" and "das Langmesser," so it's not declined (which simplifies the declension, really); this is done, because it would be practically impossible to decline a noun formed out of more than a couple of words that way. Can you imagine declining a noun consisting of, say, 4 nouns, possibly of different grammatical genders?
I think it depends on the time period. In modern german yes, but back in the days even the longsword was called „Das lange Schwert“ instead of „Das Langschwert“.
@@juandelata True but Shad's is far more informative, especially because of his collaboration/consultation with James Elmslie on his work on falchion and messer typology. I enjoy Skallagrim's work but to be quite frank, nothing he said in this video isn't anything that can't be found upon a cursory web search for falchions and messers. However, it does aggregate the commonly shared information so it's still a video worth watching but I believe that anyone who wants to really get substantial information about falchions and messers should watch Shad's video series on the topic because of its thoroughness as well as its presentation of information not found in most other discussions on the matter.
Im a fan of his, and CR. This channel is *great*, for, in addition to interesting historical combat context and interesting tool reveiws, a way of dealing with a little more accurate D&D combat and weapon descriptions.
@@ColtNomad just a tip, be wary of weights, most swords are ok, some of the maces and axes are overwight, its not as bad as earlier editions (pathfinder lists a heavy mace as 8lb which is the equivelent of a sizable sledgehammer
Talks about Falchion vs Messer, holding a sword that could be also considered a cutlass... God I am that nerd... lets call them Dadao and heavy scimitar choppas, sabers most Japanese swords slashers, rapier - chinese straight swords pokers, estocks , semanches(?) Straight chisel tip "ninja" sword as armor piercing.
Question: Did pirates primarily used Falchion swords? The style you showed here are similar, at least the hilt area of them. I'm curious if they used them or they are just similar swords but not actual Falchion.
Yeah, there have been some theories about the origins of the "messer" sword. One of the more plausible theories is that knife-making guilds wanted to get into the sword market, so they started making really long knives (hence why the messer sword has a somewhat knife-like grip).
well that depends on the type of messer. the "messer" that you cut bread with is translated as "knife" the "messer" that is really just a flachion with a knife hanlde is usually refered to as a "knoif" proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apocalypsesurvivalist.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2014%2F10%2FRubberKnife2.jpg&f=1 you call this a knife. proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse3.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.m0pZ7fy7i4u9mm_nMkqR6QHaEL%26pid%3D15.1&f=1 this is a knoif.
Started wondering about this subject recently when I started watching campaign 2 of Critical Role. Travis Willingham’s character in that, the half-orc Fjord, wields what’s called a falchion but - since there’s no such weapon in the D&D 5th Edition ruleset - is mechanically a longsword, which in the game is a weapon that can be wielded either with one hand or both (with 5e simplifying the difference to just “you roll a d10 for damage instead of a d8”). What this has meant for both how the DM describes the weapon as Fjord unlocks more of his class’ powers (he’s a Hexblade Warlock, so an Eldritch being is giving him power via the sword) and how the various fan artists have interpreted it... the sword’s appearance in fan art tends to end up looking like some kind of falchion/kriegsmesser/scimitar hybrid. You can really see what I mean in the new animated intro the show has - just search for “Critical Role intro Mighty Nein” and you’ll find it, thumbnail should have a huge red dragon looming over the party.
I think distinguishing from a Falchion and a Messer is a matter of how long/big the guard is. I've noticed recently in my very, very short time observing and telling apart sword types that a Messer generally has a smaller guard than a Falchion does.
0:15 I did that to an author he fixed it on the next book, he thought a broadsword was this huge two-handed weapon like a zweihander on steroids. It is good to advocate for accuracy.
The facial expressions in 2:10 are a thing of beauty... "Im afraid im going to have to chop you, old sport." "That you do, it seems. Mighty dreadful, i'll just get out my ol whacker. Lets Seee what we can do about this." Blue horses dialog meanwhile might be "You fucker, hadnt you pranced up to us with that knife weilding knob on your back, Id get oats tonight..."
Da Dao is not just means“big knife”，it also means a tpye of polearm which has a single edge blade on it--just like a glaive--in Chinese martial arts and ancient Chinese army.When we talk about the Chinese martial art only using a single edge sword（without shield or twin knives），it calls “单刀”（Dan Dao，one knife）.
You know, some of those falchions from those old paintings remind me a lot of what used to be called scimitars in popular media. I've also seen that style of sword used a lot as "pirate swords" in cartoons and games for kids.
I recently discovered that the italian word Falcione does not mean Falchion, but Glaive. Storta (which by the way means "crooked") as you said is the right word for Falchion.
I would like to have seen some mention of the distinctly English “Wakefield” falchions, or hangers. They are a little like a falchion, and a little like messer.
You get a thumbs up for getting right and explaining the german grammar on the example of: "ein langes Messer" and "das lange Messer"
And pronouncing it all without much of an accent, to boot!
Eingentlich ist beides was du geschrieben hast ein normales messer welches länger ist.
Bei dieser Waffe muss Lange oder Langes ebenfalls groß geschrieben werden. Geben tut es das mit s oder ohne.
Auch gibts das als ein Wort, Langmesser was aber auch eine waffe der Indianer bezeichnet.
I think he used to live in München
Bin Schweizer übrigens
They've got curved swords. Curved. SWORDS!
Yes, but was it a scimitar, a saber, a flachion, a messer, a cutlass, a machete, or something else?
A shamshir.
Whiterun guard : *sweats profusely*
Have I told you about my knee?
Only the Lefthanded Elves will ever know.
@P Ciprian Aaaam, no. A scimitar is different weapon from the saber, mostly because the handle and pommel shape (early sabres had small cross-like guards, small ball-like pommels, and maybe curved handles, while later variants had knuckleguards, and the blade was a bit more straight).
Scimitars are actually a group of swords, encompassing shamsirs, kilijs, pulwars, tulwars, shotels, kirpans, and nimchas. They differ quite much, but the assimmetric pommel(minus the shotel), and heavily curved blades seems semi-common. Only the kilij seems to have false edges, while sabres of the medieval ages usually had them.
Cutlasses seems to have either no or very small pommels, knuckle guards that usually merge with the pin of the tang, S like guards, and sometimes baskethilts, seemingly the halved versions. They may also have completely straight variants.
A katana is a fuckin' katana. You may call it a japanese bastard sword, but it's not a cutlass. It doesn't have a knuckle guard, the crossguard is small and oval shaped, the handle is straight (denying ergonomy btw), and they all seem to have that weird cross-like pattern grip coverage. Their construction is also very different, as cutlasses were used from the reinesance periods, when metalurgy had a boom, while japan was still using medieval and worse smithing techniques even in the modern ages.
A machete doesn't have a crossguard, the blade is top heavy, and never has a false edge. They also don't have a pommel, as the handle covers the tang, and it's can be riveted as well.
Messers can, and usually have curved blades, the differences are named in the video, so is the falchion's. Watch it. The two swords he shown were messers btw, he even told you.
Lastly, it seems to me that you think swords are designated simply from their blades, which is wrong. Swords are made up of a blade, a crossguard, a handle, and a pommel, which all are reference ponts when designating them.
@P Ciprian Skal did specify in the video that he currently doesn't own a Falchion so what he held was just for demonstration only ;)
Mick: That's not a knoif. THAT'S a knoif!
Germans: Hold mein beer.
halt mein bier
@@prismaticc_abyss also bei uns in Franggn könnd mer scho soung "Hold mei Bia"
He ordered "three beers." Germans order "sree Biers."
Einmal drei Bier bitte ;)
Lars Rühle Oa Maß, bitt‘schön
I just can't get over how good the Albion Knecht looks, such a cool looking sword
Jeff K same way with the town guard side sword man
except that it doesnt have a pommel
Richard Graf true, you can’t end thine opponent rightly
Falchion or messer. 'Not a legal loophole for owning a sword, but for making a sword. '
indeed, if it wasn't for the German guild system, we probably wouldn't have the Messer as a weapon.
So it was basically knifemakers that wanted to grab some of the sword market?
@@StormBringare At least when it came down to single edged swords. Plus there was the whole thing about blade length. The swordsmiths tended to stick with certain lengths, whereas the knifemakers could basically do what they wanted seeming as at first, legally, the only difference between a sword and a knife was the shape of the handle.
Whenever I see someone who knows this nuanced fact, it just makes my day.
@@StormBringare exactly that
Shadiversity made a series about falchion and messer. Difference is mostly in grip, falchion has sword grip (because it was made and sold by swordmaker), messer has riveted knife grip (since it was made and sold by knifemaker).
Don't forget about our good friend James G. Elmslie
And let's not forget the fact that the periods of regular use also dictated the general blade dimensions(not just thickness but also presence or absence of distal taper) of falchions and messers, as well as prominence of the implementation of a point/tip on the blade.
It's a shame that some sword types don't get as much attention from a scholarly view. As far as I know only James Elmslie has given the falchion and messer sword types any thorough study. I suppose that's mainly why there is so much confusion as to what falchions and messers were/are.
Yeah, that's what I pointed out.
@@Skallagrim True!
@@Skallagrim omg! OMG! I was noticed by great Skall!
For some reason it makes me happy to hear you speaking German.
Greetings from Germany ^^
Danke, Ebenso
(Thanks, same to you)
XD
Nein, jetzt erst richtig gelesen, LMAO
Obviously, you can spam r1 with falchion.
Press "F" to pay respects
For both this meme and the meme in the comment i am replying to.
That’s literally my ds1 build
Moonlightblade + falchion + elite knight set + darkwood grain ring.
I forgot who popularized that build but boy was it cancer to fight against
@@ShrympyRS *sweats nervously*
You mean cmw + falchion + fast roll + sexy elite knight set? I fucking loved that shit!
How does this have dislikes? It's informative and entertaining. I love this channel.
Every video in existence with more than 1000 views has dislikes. Doesn't matter if you save kittens or work on curing cancer, somebody is going to dislike it.
@@Skallagrim It's stupid and shows how childish mankind really is. I don't know, maybe i'm looking too far into it.
Im Not being " a hater " in the slightest
But this is the skal video I've be waiting for. I feel like its been forever since we got just a regular video. Personally, I'm not a fan of the live streams or the let's play etc. If you're doing them, some people must like them, but itd be cool if we could still get like 1 or 2 videos like this per month. I've see a whole bunch of skallagrim notifications but they're were always live streams, vr let's plays, etc. These are the type of videos that won me over, and it just feels like its been forever since we got one thats all.
He needs to do what makes money. Like he said a long time ago his HEMA videos don't always bring in money.
in this last month, with cristmast and all, he put on 14 video, of this 2 are vr let's play and 4 from lives
all the other 8 video are his classic video:
swords tests
sword review
hema
historic autencity in videogame
Last month I put up the video on partial sharpening of sword blades, the Darksword Armory testing and review, the video about the high end messer, historical accuracy in Assassin's Creed Odyssey, and the ones about strength in sword fighting, longsword techniques, and leather / bone armor. Sounds like you might have missed a lot?
@@Skallagrim I watched some of them. This is the just first video in a long time that had that spark though, thats all I'm saying. Armor, video games accuracy, I skip those videos personally.
Must have been a soft spot because your cronies came to bat lol.
I personally love his live streams. I try to make it to every one, but there's been a few I've had to miss. As for "his cronies coming to bat," I'll skip the mild offensive nature of that comment and just say that his scrutiny of fantasy weapons and video game weapons are extremely popular. He himself has said he's not sure why that is, but they are. And his actual HEMA type videos, though widely requested, get much fewer views. (I wish they didn't because I love those too, and his sparring videos).
Then again, I am a fan of Skallagrim and have been for a long time so, anything he puts out, I will watch.
Shad did a great video series on the modern classification and distinction of the Messer and Falchion which Skallagrim did a good job of summarizing. Great content as always Skallagrim
Isn't Falchion the actual name of the sword and not the type of sword though?
You are correct
yes, thats why the F is capitalized.
Yes, but it having that name gives wrong implications. Whether the developers actually THINK that's what a falchion looks like or not, the fact that Skall felt the need to clarify it means that more than a few people DO think it's an actual falchion.
@@alphaxtitania5597 This has historical precedent, though, several mythical swords have names which are words used to describe a sword, such as Caliburn, Caladbolg, and Lævateinn.
@@alphaxtitania5597 I feel as though the majority of people will look at falchion in Fire Emblem and know right away that that's not a real sword
Sword nerds are the best kind of nerds
And do you know why? Because swords are awesome, full stop.
As much as I like swords, I generally prefer chain weapons like flails with polearms in a close second.
Hahaha sword nerds unite, except those nerds that overworship anime & katanas.
@@CJ_F0x swords!!!
@@EL_DORADO-db4gl SWOOOOOOOOORDSSSZZZ
Really awesome, that you checked the german grammar and pronunciation. Most people do not do that. That shows again how much effort you put in your videos.
Honestly, I find the Kriegsmesser to be an incredebly gorgous weapon somehow... It just kinda looks elegant for a sword that size I think.
Anyone else?
It is--
I main hand one when not using spears or polearms. I adore them and find they working incredibly well when switching between Longsword, saber, and messer techniques. Guaranteed to throw your opponent for a loop.
I mean the Falchion in fire embelm is not *a* Falchion, it is a named weapon.
Why it's called that, who the hell knows, but it's not like there's 10 of them kicking around in a game.
I guess you haven't tried using cheats. I make sure to arm Eirika with at least 2 Falchions everytime.
I remember that in one of the games there were 2 Falchions, cause time travel. Still the same sword.
Actually two different named weapons. The Falchion belonging to Chrom is the same one that once belonged to the hero - king Marth while the Parallel Falchion is a separate sword that has time travel powers. Notably when the Falchion is empowered by the titular Fire Emblem it becomes the Exalted Falchion, a more powerful form that has different properties than the Falchion. Now why Nintendo and Intelligent Systems decided to name what appear to be arming swords after a different style of sword is beyond me.
I am immediately reminded of Caliburn/Caladbolg. Both were the names of mythical swords, but are also believed to have been generic words for "sword".
that's the weirdest part.
It's a sword NAMED Falchion.
I guess it's like how Geralt's horse is named Roach.
But in that case it would be more like if it's named Donkey. Frankly it's just confusing and I also have no idea why they did this.
The yatamessaber has returned!
Id love a commonly confused classification series, this was super helpful and knowing more about say a saber vs a cutlass or a cutlass vs a scimitar would be awesome too
Also Hanger. I mostly call mine a hanger, basically the same concept. "Swords are being misnamed." Well, actually, most of them are just called "Swords." Even Katana is just Japanese for Sword. Arming swords, Longswords, broadswords, bastard swords... Most of them were just called a "Sword." if you want to get technical.
0:38 "This thing." I'd call that a yataghan.
@@Psiberzerker well some were called sabers. Usually curved ones as oposed to straight ones were both were in use...
@@mancubwwa Yes, and Most of them were called Swords. A saber is a class of Sword. You can get more specific, but when you get to "That's not a Fachion, it's a Messer" you're splitting hairs. You know what sei Germans called Dussaks when they got to Czecheslovakia? "Messers." A Shamshir, Talwar, Dhao, Cutlass, Hanger, or Katana could all be called Sabers, so could they be called Swords. In fact, if you look up Hanger on Wikipedia, you'll be re-directed to Cutlass.
@@Psiberzerker Schwert, Säbel
I really like how the messer, especially your example, looks. I don't know what it is about Germanic blades but they had a unique style and look that I appreciate. Thanks for the video.
Yeah, like the others are saying, Falchion is the name of Naga's tooth. The type of sword is never mentioned, though it is likely a longsword due to it's two-handed grip and near one-handed blade.
It it cuts, Grog use.
Only that Fjord is the one using a falchion, not Grog xD
Wow,wow i thought Grog was an Orc beer?
I think it's important to note that the falchion (and glaive as well) have the archaic definition of simply meaning sword, though the usage has changed. I think in fantasy lore which draws inspiration from older writings the term falchion might be used interchangeably with sword. Fantasy is kind of unique in that a lot of words get used with their archaic definitions quite commonly.
Both, your knowledge about the German grammar and your pronunciation amaze me every time! Well done!
Falchion is better because they have pommels that are bigger to be thrown
You are comparing knives with swords
If you aren't certain about the, just use both!
WHY WHY WHY IS NOWHERE SAFE
GET A LIFE
You again! Silver chariot,slice this boi up
Hello there again.
@@micohazakin8576 is that a jojo reference? :p
But what about a Falchion that thinks it's trapped in a Messer's body
"my halberd identifies as a longsword so you have to allow me to use it in HEMA"
I used to be a Falchion, now I'm a Messer.
More people pander to me now.
Or in fairness you could use this as an example of why strict yes or no definitions don't work in history or biology, cuz historically sword making didn't have a trading standards body and neither does mother nature
Did you just assume that sword's classification?
Oh...you went _there._
*slow clap*
Oh you cheeky devil
5:20 Here in the Iberian península we've found various types of messers, we didn't called them messers obviusly but there are equivalents spread all over europe.
Also, as far I'm concerned, one handed messers are called langes messers
One's pinned, ones riveted. One has a pommel, one doesn't.
of course, we all know which one is more useful.
(on the sidenote messers look usable aswell)
And the third is made out of a Devine Dragons fang
Matt easton said in one of his videos, that the biggest diffrence between falcoins and messers are that falcions has more of a common swordsmithingprocess with a normal swordshilt, while the messer is often smithed as a knife, with most of them fulltanghilts
What I want to know is...
Where did you get that dope-ass shirt?!
Hearing you pronounce german words warms my heart :) It's almost flawless!
I've always just looked at the grip and pommel to tell the difference. Messers in my experience always have a knife grip and pommel construction where as falchions have sword hilt construction. I was always led to believe that Messers came about by the knife makers guild who used a loophole in the manufacturing laws for sword making by making swords with knife hilt construction to then sell them as "knives" at lower prices then swords to undercut the competition (sword makers guild).
Going by Wikipedia, the biggest difference is in the hilt; a messer is technically a knife, and the hilt construction often reflects that. I have also heard it tossed around (with no confirmation) that this construction and terminology may be a way of manipulating sword bans in the interest of keeping a blade for self defense.
Pretty well pronounced German there for the most part :D
He’s scandinavian. As much as I know those languages are rather simillar.
@@AAAAAAAA-vd6zv they are indeed. I knew norwegians who learned and spoke german without any accent
Skall is German, though I believe he said something about his German being rusty due to not using it much.
(And he also apparently doesn't like his German side/heritage, for whatever reason.
Oh well, I guess that just means more gothic plate for me.)
@@LurkerDaBerzerker He is definitely not german. His german is not rusty, he has an accent. A scandinavian one. After researching he is norwegian or sweden and worked in germany for a while where his german is from.
Arsino Meteor Then I don't get why he says he doesn't identify with his heritage, if he is identifying with his heritage?
(Scandinavian/Norwegian)
(I would like to ask where you got this info from, considering he has said himself he was born in Germany during a livestream?)
skall has been fighting his demons so hard lately he bust two knuckles god daymnnn,awesome video keep it up
Hmn. Shad made some very lenghty videos on this topic, and the baseline there was "Messer and Falchion are the same swords, just with different handle constructions".
my only proper reference for falchion before this video was critical role, and I always assumed the main part was the clip end and curved blade, this is really interesting, love your work
Did you ever heard of the Emslie Typology? James Elmslie has an interesting take on the matter.
This was a fantastic video. I'm a bit late because the semester began, but it was worth the wait. Just excellent.
Knappe, man bringe mir das lange Messer! Schneller! Oder wollt ihr dass ich einen Knauf nach euch werfe?! - German Skal
Die Knaufwurf: die tötlichste Waffe des Mittelalters und der Renaissance.
1:33 I believe those are a type of 'langseax' a larger, more developed version of the 'seax' (I could be wrong) but I don't think those are falchions. Maybe the langseax is a precursor to the falchion?
Basically:
Falchion = Sword hilt
Messer = Knife hilt
Blade shape and size is irrelevant since both can have either.
I personally think its bit more complex over all. Would you call for example knife or dagger with no riveted handle with scales, but peened construction sword suddenly just because of the handle? I think basicly criteria Skall listed applies to historical specific germanic sword we call messer, but its confusing since it just means "knife" but its not really that more confusing how in china word dao means both knife, and sword sized objects. But we sort of need list of criteria today classifying the messers i doubt people back then cared that much like german guy who ends up with english falchion likely would call it just messer or sword some english falchions even have the nagel. But i would personally say both falchions, and messers are type of sword
I think it is the most helpfull to see the Messer as a literall long version of a Mushroom knife. Many people (especially older ones) have these kind of small knifes. More modern ones are foldable but the older ones look basically exactly like a messer just smaller and without the guard.
shad's five part mini-series on the difference between the two
Great rundown, and bonus points for the German grammar lesson!
I have your sword mod in Skyrim!
Im sure there is a vid somewhere from a person who is considered an expert in Falchion/Messers who said that there have been examples found of the same type of blade being used on both swords, but as you clearly say the only determinable difference between the two is the handle and crossguard and thats what determines whether it is a Falchion or Maesser
Skall you missed an opportunity to collaborate with Shad on this Falchion topic
Did he cover it too? I don't have the time to keep up to date with what everyone else is doing, so no idea.
@@Skallagrim Yep, I'd definitely suggest part three of the series as the previous parts covers more commonly known stuff.
I actually thought this was a @Shadiversity video when I first saw it in my feed.
Skall, your bumper music. It always makes me feel I've just found a treasure map and I'm gearing up for some epic quest.
your german is not bad my dude!
he is half german, half norwegian but he lives in Canada now, If I remember correctly.
@@acediadekay3793 from what i gathered over the years, he is born in norway and moved to canada. because of his accent i originally thought hes from germany but i think he actually never lived there.
@@FirebladeXXL he is definitely not german native. You can hear a scandinavian accent when he speaks german
@@ArsinoMeteor i mean his english accent.
@@FirebladeXXL Yeah I know, but this accent is more like a germanIC accent, like languages like german, norwegian and so on
Shadversity's falchion and messer video series really opened my eyes on this subject.
A dull practice sword is called "Buttermesser"
The Italian Storta at 1:37 looks like it was designed in the art deco period. Italian styling really is something.❤
How about the Dark Souls falchion? 10/10, would dual-wield again?
Dual-wield? Pffft, stick Darkmoon Blade on and 2-hand that bish.
Very good pronunciation of all the German terms. And great explanation of the German grammar thing. Overall very interesting video. Vielen Dank!
The messer
AKA
The dank shank.
@skallagrim
As a german myself i congratulate you fir your proper pronounciation of the word "nagel". It is much apreciated that you try to pronounce words of forein languages in a proper way.
For your interest: your r sounds still a little to english. Try a rolling scottish r if you want that shoult nail it more.
To defend the Falchion from FE (aside from the fact it's a fantasy game) it doesn't purport to be a Falchion it's the Falchion (Or Parallel Falchion) it's a name rather than a type.
Still, thats like naming a trumpet the Legendary Saxophone
@@minte1972 Bitch don't you wanna be the wielder of the legendary Saxophone?
@@DragonXZero Fair
If it called falchion. IT CAN KILL A DURAGON
We all know Skall can't resist making pointless criticisms of fantasy swords in general.
Oh Shadiversity did this once. I remember coming away with the impression that there was a large amount of overlap(possibly it was just the handle?). Now I wonder if there even is a commonly agreed upon definition.
Kriegmesser ftw.
Thanks Skal. I've been trying to explain this very subject for years.
I just got done watching 'Alec steele' finish/making a 'Falchion' and was like "gotta consult ' *ende* of all men RIGHTLY*
If a messer's nail is pointing up instead of down, is that more preferable? I would assume catching is better than deflecting, but I would like to know. If they dont make them that way would that be an upgrade hypothetically?
Skall, shadiversity already made a video on this and even brought out a classification system for single egged medieval swords, I think you should check it out. In the end the only true difference is in the handle and pommel
I feel the need to clarify that part regarding German grammar.
German is a highly synthetic language (comparable to Greek, really, though more so, even), meaning it tends to form new words not so much by invention, but by compounding two or more words and/or word components (such as prefixes, suffixes etc.) to convey a related meaning; so the words used for the Messer would be Kriegsmesser; langes Messer or Langmesser; grosses Messer or Grossmesser. The two latter names, each with two variants, are not really because of a definitive or indefinite sentence structure ("a[n]" versus "the"), but rather based on whether you are saying "long knife or "longknife," so to speak, and likewise "great knife" or "greatknife."
The reason for this difference lies in that German is also a highly declined language, i.e. adjectives, nouns etc. have multiple forms, which we call declension (being a type of conjugation). So "long knife" entails _declining_ the adjective "long" (lang) to fit the noun "Messer," so in the nominative "a long knife" is "ein langes Messer" and "the long knife" is "das langes Messer," but as a compound, the adjective "lang" gets attached to "Messer" and becomes "ein Langmesser" and "das Langmesser," so it's not declined (which simplifies the declension, really); this is done, because it would be practically impossible to decline a noun formed out of more than a couple of words that way. Can you imagine declining a noun consisting of, say, 4 nouns, possibly of different grammatical genders?
Shad has a good series about this topic. Id advise to watch it.
Please make a video about Seax (Scramasax) knives
It would be "Das Langmesser" because "Das Lange Messer" would only be a long knife. Same with "Großmesser" and "Großes Messer"
I think it depends on the time period. In modern german yes, but back in the days even the longsword was called „Das lange Schwert“ instead of „Das Langschwert“.
Actually he said the long knife. His translations were correct.
@@bloodfrog8657 Yeah but you also say longsword in english instead of long sword so.
Das cool.
More of this kinda stuff skal! Also made me wonder about covering messer and buckler if it was a thing
Definitely a thing 😁
Shadiversity made a whole series about it already.
But hey, this one's shorter
@@juandelata True but Shad's is far more informative, especially because of his collaboration/consultation with James Elmslie on his work on falchion and messer typology.
I enjoy Skallagrim's work but to be quite frank, nothing he said in this video isn't anything that can't be found upon a cursory web search for falchions and messers. However, it does aggregate the commonly shared information so it's still a video worth watching but I believe that anyone who wants to really get substantial information about falchions and messers should watch Shad's video series on the topic because of its thoroughness as well as its presentation of information not found in most other discussions on the matter.
Thank you for clearing up the fire emblem situation. I have lost count of how many times I've had to explain that one
Any Critical Role fans here for the falchion talk?
Im a fan of his, and CR. This channel is *great*, for, in addition to interesting historical combat context and interesting tool reveiws, a way of dealing with a little more accurate D&D combat and weapon descriptions.
well i was a sword nerd before critical role but yeah
@@elgostine also yeah, swords and other historical weapons are interesting
I was a CR fan first but because of d&d I have started looking into medieval and all of historical weaponry, combat, and even food.
@@ColtNomad just a tip, be wary of weights, most swords are ok, some of the maces and axes are overwight,
its not as bad as earlier editions (pathfinder lists a heavy mace as 8lb which is the equivelent of a sizable sledgehammer
You should probably look up the Elmslie typology. Messer and Falchion is pretty much the same, the hilts is what differs.
Talks about Falchion vs Messer, holding a sword that could be also considered a cutlass... God I am that nerd... lets call them Dadao and heavy scimitar choppas, sabers most Japanese swords slashers, rapier - chinese straight swords pokers, estocks , semanches(?) Straight chisel tip "ninja" sword as armor piercing.
Question: Did pirates primarily used Falchion swords? The style you showed here are similar, at least the hilt area of them. I'm curious if they used them or they are just similar swords but not actual Falchion.
Messer? This means knife in german
Yeah, there have been some theories about the origins of the "messer" sword. One of the more plausible theories is that knife-making guilds wanted to get into the sword market, so they started making really long knives (hence why the messer sword has a somewhat knife-like grip).
Ja so ist das
Aber sowas von mein lieber Freund Messer heißt das hier
well that depends on the type of messer.
the "messer" that you cut bread with is translated as "knife"
the "messer" that is really just a flachion with a knife hanlde is usually refered to as a "knoif"
proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apocalypsesurvivalist.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2014%2F10%2FRubberKnife2.jpg&f=1
you call this a knife.
proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse3.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.m0pZ7fy7i4u9mm_nMkqR6QHaEL%26pid%3D15.1&f=1
this is a knoif.
Jes
4:10 I like that top blade seems like something I can make easily just a little bit less extravagant handle
11 minutes of pure pedantry. Gets a like from me!
Started wondering about this subject recently when I started watching campaign 2 of Critical Role. Travis Willingham’s character in that, the half-orc Fjord, wields what’s called a falchion but - since there’s no such weapon in the D&D 5th Edition ruleset - is mechanically a longsword, which in the game is a weapon that can be wielded either with one hand or both (with 5e simplifying the difference to just “you roll a d10 for damage instead of a d8”).
What this has meant for both how the DM describes the weapon as Fjord unlocks more of his class’ powers (he’s a Hexblade Warlock, so an Eldritch being is giving him power via the sword) and how the various fan artists have interpreted it... the sword’s appearance in fan art tends to end up looking like some kind of falchion/kriegsmesser/scimitar hybrid. You can really see what I mean in the new animated intro the show has - just search for “Critical Role intro Mighty Nein” and you’ll find it, thumbnail should have a huge red dragon looming over the party.
I'll be honest I never knew the difference between a messer and falchion, let alone what a messer was. Thanks for the video
Skall, iam proud of you for bringing up the German grammar, greetings from Germany!
I think distinguishing from a Falchion and a Messer is a matter of how long/big the guard is. I've noticed recently in my very, very short time observing and telling apart sword types that a Messer generally has a smaller guard than a Falchion does.
Do you know about the Elmslie typology of Falchions and Messer? Shad made a video about it a year or so ago.
3:27 Suddenly the Ashbringer doesn't seem so far fetched after all
The Messer is probably my favorite historical sword. I just like the look of it and its utility.
a messer is literally just a falchion with a knife grip.
0:15 I did that to an author he fixed it on the next book, he thought a broadsword was this huge two-handed weapon like a zweihander on steroids. It is good to advocate for accuracy.
Thanks for clearing this one out.
It was pretty messered up before your explanation.
The facial expressions in 2:10 are a thing of beauty...
"Im afraid im going to have to chop you, old sport."
"That you do, it seems. Mighty dreadful, i'll just get out my ol whacker. Lets Seee what we can do about this."
Blue horses dialog meanwhile might be "You fucker, hadnt you pranced up to us with that knife weilding knob on your back, Id get oats tonight..."
Da Dao is not just means“big knife”，it also means a tpye of polearm which has a single edge blade on it--just like a glaive--in Chinese martial arts and ancient Chinese army.When we talk about the Chinese martial art only using a single edge sword（without shield or twin knives），it calls “单刀”（Dan Dao，one knife）.
Kriegsmesser is one of my favorites youve got on here. Love hearing about it and seeing it
2:39 Nice to see a shoutout to a museum in my home city.
I have to say your vids are very well done and extremely enjoyable, keep it up.
You know, some of those falchions from those old paintings remind me a lot of what used to be called scimitars in popular media. I've also seen that style of sword used a lot as "pirate swords" in cartoons and games for kids.
I recently discovered that the italian word Falcione does not mean Falchion, but Glaive. Storta (which by the way means "crooked") as you said is the right word for Falchion.
3:18. I'm actually descended from John Conyers, Skall. Thank you so much for pointing out his sword.
That top picture of a peasant's defense knife 8:50 reminds me of Aragorn's hunting knife.
I would like to have seen some mention of the distinctly English “Wakefield” falchions, or hangers. They are a little like a falchion, and a little like messer.
Could you do a video on the possible evolution of langseax to the falchions or at least it's influence on it ?
10:30 why were they used more for battlefield purposes?