Exactly the kind of experimentation thats so fun/exciting about mixing older classic lenses and good digital cameras. Great and informative video as always!
Thanks so much! We will be shooting our first "hybrid" shoot in Feb, so we'll be able to show something probably in March/April on how it works between 16mm and digital.
Thanks for sharing. Your approach is refreshing in your experience in film and how if, in a modern digital realm done right, can supplant and expand your arsenal. Blackmagic color science seems to design highlights roll off very close to how real film compression works and the colors of cause. Do share in the future videos on your experience with this new tool. Thx😊
Glad you made this video! I am using the Ursa12K with the Laowa OOOM 25-100mm T2.9 S35+ image circle lens but it’s such a heavy package, most people have moved over to using the Sigma/Canon trinity photo lenses. I am moving the OOOM to a GH7 rig to be more run & gun & bring back to the Ursa when using a tripod. Anyways always wondered about using S16 lenses with this camera, so much appreciated 😊
@@Zeidify Yea I’ll for sure be getting whatever BMD make next for a small camera as well. I don’t like the current 6k FF imager, or I’d also own a Pyxis for those run and gun shoots.
@ I like the Micro G2 & Pyxis, both good weight/form factor but no ibis so went for GH7, focal reducer, & video assist. Depends if you run around a lot or not
@@Zeidify Yea, I do run and gun, but it's mostly shoulder mount anyway, I don't like small cameras out in front of you, I want the camera to be stable without a gimbal.
Yeah I wish I had the 12k you have, seems like an awesome package particularly because I have heaps of high quality B4 lenses which I can correct to S16. It's still out of my price range even 2nd hand, but when it comes down a bit or I can save for it it will be 100% perfect for me too. Great to see someone else had the same thought so I can see your experience with it 😊🤙
@@jamesandcamera Hopefully the price will go down eventually. Keep your eyes open on ebay. I got this kit for $4700 USD. Give it a year, they’ll be $3500.
I was looking at this and the varicam lt in s16 crop mode before I went with the super old Sony F900r and some zeiss digiprimes haha that digital film like cameras rabbit hole is deep.
@@NarrowGaugeFilmsLLC It recently took me a day and a half to upscale a 1 hour and 45 min movie from 1080p 30 to 4k 30, Im hopeful for sub 8 hour upscale times as cpus and gpus continue to advance 👍
Nice! Are you shooting with a external recorder via the SDI? also have you checked out the digital praxis cineon log gamma for the f900r? Expands the dynamic range of the camera significantly
Awesome review!! I’ve been looking into this camera for 2 years now. Im in love with the 12k but I shoot a lot of corporate and my Sony a7s3 has been great for the type of work I do. I think I’ll buy it this year regardless. The 12k image is often compared to the ARRI Alexa. This camera is an absolute beast. A true cinema camera in every aspect ✅✅✅
Sweet, would love to see more test footage between the two formats. I've been shooting S16 glass on an Epic Dragon and really like being able to dial in the sensor crop in-camera. A majority of my S16 primes cover 3k and up
@@khyberjones131 Yea I can probably do that at some point, others have said the same thing and I agree for sure. BMD just have a more “filmic” image and camera design over all in this case.
@@NarrowGaugeFilmsLLC Yeah the Reds definitely have a certain look. I actually think the Dragon benefits from shooting cropped down to introduce some noise and softness to bring the image to life a bit more. Always thought the Ursa's (G2 and up) were the best *reasonably priced* digital camera design and sensor that can pretty much do it all, though never fell in love with them. The 12k looks great
Well presented Tyler! I've often thought about a digital solution for my s16 lenses, but it's always been more of a mind game. I've looked at the BMD Micro (4k G2), but never actually tried it. After watching this the 6k mode on the Ursa might slaps the 4k right away, but have you ever tried the Micro as comparison?
@@gewurzbonon9039 The new micro I haven’t used, it’s not a bad idea honestly just kind of an odd package for a shoot. I prefer the bigger camera with the more commercial workflow. I’ve talked to the guys making a mod for the micro and I may be able to test a prototype. Maybe worth getting one to test.
Yep! However, the body style I never liked. It always killed me as a shooter. I need something that can be hand held without some cumbersome rig and go right on a tripod the next second like a studio camera. I wish the UMP 6k would do the same thing, but alas it's S35mm imager, so it doesn't. Plus, there is a big difference between 2.6k and 6k, especially on a CMOS imager, which means you have half the amount of blue and red channels as green channels. At least the RGBW imager has a clever way of retaining full RGB values all the time and retain decent resolution.
Because im very interested in shooting large format the 12k LF is more temping to me, but resolution is something i do not care for if i ever get my hands on it i may shoot 8k between my regular 4k usage
@@TheStoriesWeTell Believe it or not, I almost got a demo camera from them but when I found out it shoots pro res only, I bailed. Pro Res 6k 4444 is 3x more bandwidth than BRAW 5:1 on the UMP in 8k. That’s how good the BRAW codec is. No debayer either because it doesn’t have a bayer pattern. So you’re actually gobbling up way more space on the Kinifinity which is really too bad. I love the cameras they make and what they’re doing but BRAW is super nice, way better than any other raw codec I’ve used. The new 12K Cine FF, ups the quality of BRAW even more with way better compression.
@@raredreamfootage That’s correct, it does indeed, but I’d say the fixed pattern noise occurs later, past the point the noise of the 12K already is too heavy, at least for my taste. I’d also say the 4.6K G2 has a healthy amount more dynamic range. Of course having 6K resolution in S16 mode with the URSA 12K is way better than 2K with the G2 ;-)
Exactly the kind of experimentation thats so fun/exciting about mixing older classic lenses and good digital cameras. Great and informative video as always!
Thanks so much! We will be shooting our first "hybrid" shoot in Feb, so we'll be able to show something probably in March/April on how it works between 16mm and digital.
Your film experience and perspective regarding the Ursa 12K Pro was unique to what I’m used to hearing. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks, ya it's for sure a unique experience due to my workflow.
Working with you guys must be great. You are preparing extensively. Keep it going.
Yea gotta keep the ball rolling. Shooting on film is my passion, but it also can't prevent me from making content.
@19:02 Art Center represent! Graduated in 04 and still love that place.
Very interesting. Been wanting to shoot 16 mm for al long time and this channel might be a nice way to learn before buying stuff.
Thanks for sharing. Your approach is refreshing in your experience in film and how if, in a modern digital realm done right, can supplant and expand your arsenal. Blackmagic color science seems to design highlights roll off very close to how real film compression works and the colors of cause. Do share in the future videos on your experience with this new tool. Thx😊
Interesting information, Tyler! Thanks
Thanks! For sure not for everyone, but absolutely a game changer for our workflows. We should have it out this February for the winter shoot at D&S.
Love this. I want that S16 lens now.
It's so cool! hahah Hard to find, but very cool.
Glad you made this video! I am using the Ursa12K with the Laowa OOOM 25-100mm T2.9 S35+ image circle lens but it’s such a heavy package, most people have moved over to using the Sigma/Canon trinity photo lenses.
I am moving the OOOM to a GH7 rig to be more run & gun & bring back to the Ursa when using a tripod. Anyways always wondered about using S16 lenses with this camera, so much appreciated 😊
@@Zeidify Yea I’ll for sure be getting whatever BMD make next for a small camera as well. I don’t like the current 6k FF imager, or I’d also own a Pyxis for those run and gun shoots.
@ I like the Micro G2 & Pyxis, both good weight/form factor but no ibis so went for GH7, focal reducer, & video assist. Depends if you run around a lot or not
@@Zeidify Yea, I do run and gun, but it's mostly shoulder mount anyway, I don't like small cameras out in front of you, I want the camera to be stable without a gimbal.
@ That’s something I have been struggling with honestly, I find shoulder mounted is very uncomfortable & hurts my back/shoulder
@@Zeidify Ah got ya, yea it can be challenging for sure. So are you using a gimbal.
Yeah I wish I had the 12k you have, seems like an awesome package particularly because I have heaps of high quality B4 lenses which I can correct to S16. It's still out of my price range even 2nd hand, but when it comes down a bit or I can save for it it will be 100% perfect for me too.
Great to see someone else had the same thought so I can see your experience with it 😊🤙
@@jamesandcamera Hopefully the price will go down eventually. Keep your eyes open on ebay. I got this kit for $4700 USD. Give it a year, they’ll be $3500.
I was looking at this and the varicam lt in s16 crop mode before I went with the super old Sony F900r and some zeiss digiprimes haha that digital film like cameras rabbit hole is deep.
@@Calgothits Haha yep! Good choice if you’re ok with 1080p.
@@NarrowGaugeFilmsLLC It recently took me a day and a half to upscale a 1 hour and 45 min movie from 1080p 30 to 4k 30, Im hopeful for sub 8 hour upscale times as cpus and gpus continue to advance 👍
Nice! Are you shooting with a external recorder via the SDI? also have you checked out the digital praxis cineon log gamma for the f900r? Expands the dynamic range of the camera significantly
@@Calgothits Were you using Topaz?
@ Yup, running topaz with a ryzen 9 5900x, 64gb ddr5, rtx 3080.
Awesome review!! I’ve been looking into this camera for 2 years now. Im in love with the 12k but I shoot a lot of corporate and my Sony a7s3 has been great for the type of work I do. I think I’ll buy it this year regardless. The 12k image is often compared to the ARRI Alexa. This camera is an absolute beast. A true cinema camera in every aspect ✅✅✅
Sweet, would love to see more test footage between the two formats. I've been shooting S16 glass on an Epic Dragon and really like being able to dial in the sensor crop in-camera. A majority of my S16 primes cover 3k and up
@@khyberjones131 Yea I can probably do that at some point, others have said the same thing and I agree for sure. BMD just have a more “filmic” image and camera design over all in this case.
@@NarrowGaugeFilmsLLC Yeah the Reds definitely have a certain look. I actually think the Dragon benefits from shooting cropped down to introduce some noise and softness to bring the image to life a bit more. Always thought the Ursa's (G2 and up) were the best *reasonably priced* digital camera design and sensor that can pretty much do it all, though never fell in love with them. The 12k looks great
This camera also works well with 2/3 news super zoom lenses.
@@kennyadvocat Yep! That’s what we were using with an expander.
Well presented Tyler!
I've often thought about a digital solution for my s16 lenses, but it's always been more of a mind game. I've looked at the BMD Micro (4k G2), but never actually tried it. After watching this the 6k mode on the Ursa might slaps the 4k right away, but have you ever tried the Micro as comparison?
@@gewurzbonon9039 The new micro I haven’t used, it’s not a bad idea honestly just kind of an odd package for a shoot. I prefer the bigger camera with the more commercial workflow. I’ve talked to the guys making a mod for the micro and I may be able to test a prototype. Maybe worth getting one to test.
Thats awesome ❤
You're pretty good doing the talking head thing brother.
🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠🤠
Thanks! Been doing it for 20 years! haha :P
BMPCC 4k, 2.6K Super 16 mode, 8ms rolling shutter, just upscale and you got a decent 4K s16 mode, since 2018!!!!
Yep! However, the body style I never liked. It always killed me as a shooter. I need something that can be hand held without some cumbersome rig and go right on a tripod the next second like a studio camera. I wish the UMP 6k would do the same thing, but alas it's S35mm imager, so it doesn't. Plus, there is a big difference between 2.6k and 6k, especially on a CMOS imager, which means you have half the amount of blue and red channels as green channels. At least the RGBW imager has a clever way of retaining full RGB values all the time and retain decent resolution.
@@NarrowGaugeFilmsLLC that's true!
If you want the cleanest shadows, you need to shoot in 12K @ ISO 125.
@@raredreamfootage Oh no doubt, but I’m mostly worried about highlight retention personally. I don’t shoot in the dark.
Because im very interested in shooting large format the 12k LF is more temping to me, but resolution is something i do not care for if i ever get my hands on it i may shoot 8k between my regular 4k usage
@@nestorarranz3179 Yea the 12K FF is very nice, I have shot with it and very impressed.
Kinifinity has a super 16 mode might be interesting to check out
@@haloboy456 Good point, thanks! Sadly they haven’t yet implemented a decent raw compressed codec. Hopefully they will shortly.
@@NarrowGaugeFilmsLLC Prores 4444 is very good, I don't miss the raw that much...
@@TheStoriesWeTell Believe it or not, I almost got a demo camera from them but when I found out it shoots pro res only, I bailed. Pro Res 6k 4444 is 3x more bandwidth than BRAW 5:1 on the UMP in 8k. That’s how good the BRAW codec is. No debayer either because it doesn’t have a bayer pattern. So you’re actually gobbling up way more space on the Kinifinity which is really too bad. I love the cameras they make and what they’re doing but BRAW is super nice, way better than any other raw codec I’ve used. The new 12K Cine FF, ups the quality of BRAW even more with way better compression.
@@TheStoriesWeTell I still think BRAW is more efficient than Prores 4444
Great video!
But what to choose, the 12K or the 4.6K G2? 🙈
Well the 12k is a superior camera in my opinion, having shot with the 4.6k as well.
That's easy, 12K all day long because the 4.6K G2 suffers from fixed patterned noise.
@@raredreamfootage That’s correct, it does indeed, but I’d say the fixed pattern noise occurs later, past the point the noise of the 12K already is too heavy, at least for my taste. I’d also say the 4.6K G2 has a healthy amount more dynamic range. Of course having 6K resolution in S16 mode with the URSA 12K is way better than 2K with the G2 ;-)
At least it's not a Sony. Those things are garbage.
Haha, I'm glad we see eye to eye! :P