I've never used yudane for pizza but I think I'll try it next time because it actually seems to improve the quality of the crust. However, I want to take this opportunity to also leave some advice: "par baking". I got the idea from the preparation of modern pinsa which requires a lower oven temperature than pizza. In practice, the base of the pizza is put in the oven without toppings (just with a drop of extra virgin olive oil to avoid excessive swelling in the center of the pizza... in practice to avoid the "pita bread" effect), then proceed to cook the bases for 3-4 minutes and remove them from the oven while still almost completely white but with a light crust. Here you can choose whether to freeze the bases without toppings or eat the pizza immediately by topping it and finish baking. When you decide to eat the pizza, add the toppings (for example tomato sauce and mozzarella for a classic margherita) and finish cooking the pizza for another 3-4 minutes (or in any case until the crust is golden and the mozzarella is melted ). This method has two advantages: 1. The frozen bases are very convenient, you take them out of the freezer, add the toppings and finish cooking them in 3-4 minutes. Being thin they are convenient to put one on top of the other in the freezer and they defrost while you add the toppings so they arrive in the oven ready to be cooked. Much more convenient than frozen dough because they are already almost cooked. 2. Mozzarella does not burn, it does not brown, it does not dry out. It remains nice and soft and stringy like in a good pizzeria. For this reason I also suggest using a classic mozzarella (I know dry mozzarella is a widely used cheese outside Italy but here in Italy only soft and juicy mozzarella is used... obviously for pizza you have to let it drain for a few hours so that it does not release too much liquid on the pizza but a little humidity is necessary to prevent the mozzarella from becoming dry, that is really important for a good pizza). Ultimately, the pizzas I make with my home oven have always been quite similar to modern pinsas (therefore still very good), high hydration -> crunchy crust on the outside -> stringy mozzarella... but not very soft crust on the inside. The cornicione was not perfect... at least if we are talking about Neapolitan style pizza (there are so many good pizzas). I hope that yudane helps me take that last step that I was missing. I hope that my suggestion helps those who want to make pizza at home to keep the mozzarella stringy and to make it more convenient to make pizza whenever you want by freezing the bases. Ps. Don't show pizzas with ketchup-like sauces anymore, part of me is horrified and dies badly 🤣 .... Among other things I tried to make mantou. Obviously they didn't come out very white because I didn't have the right flour on hand but it was a very interesting experiment... I had never steamed but I had a suitable container inherited from my mother that I didn't use and I think that from now on I will try to make steamed food more often. This channel is giving me a lot of new ideas that I hadn't considered and I'm having a lot of fun trying them out, thank you
Freezing the crust also makes it lighter. It pulls moisture out of the crust. John Arena does it for his Sicilian Pizza and is known to have a pizza that looks thick and heavy but is really light and airy.
I find your instruction very clear easy to grasp plus the recipe description is really a big... help.. Congrats for this wonderful perfect knowledge you instill in us... More power to you and hoping you'll have more listeners❤
After watching your Tangzhong vs. Yudane video, I tweak my pizza dough recipe where I bloomed the yeast (milk, honey, and yeast), incorporate both a Tangzhong (water + milk + flour) and Poolish (flour + water + yeast + honey) which was added to my dry ingredients (flour & salt). Note: I also added 35g of butter. Now using the baker's percent starting with 406g of bread flour, I was able to figure out the amount of flour and liquid needed to form each separate part ( yeast the bloom, Tangzhong, and Poolish) needed to create my pizza dough. Cross your fingers because the true test will be on tomorrow when I make the pizza. Thanks for sharing all of your insights!
We bake Pizzas with 80% hydration regularly, it's okay. Personally we prefer that but it may be quite a challenging task for those who are not familiar with kneading a high hydration dough, other than that, the dough in many ways, I think, is better. It enables us to bake the pizza for longer to get that crispier cornicione.
@@NovitaListyani The previous average weight of my pizza dough made in the past was approximately 795g, which I divided to make three pizzas. However, I never made them using a Tangzhong or using a Poolish. So after watching your videos, I wanted to break down the ingredients I used into a baker's percent (1%) which equated to approximately 4.10g for every 1% percent of flour used. From this I was able to calculate the percentage of ingredients to be as follows: the flour (100%) was approximately 409g, the whole milk (79%) was approximately 327g, the sugar (2.4%) was approximately 10g, the yeast (2.4) was approximately 10g, the salt (2%) was approximately 7g, and the butter (8%) was approximately 35g. Note - the Poolish, Tangzhong, and yeast bloom created were made from percentages of the above-noted ingredients. Since I did not know how to break down the liquid from the butter used, I am guessing it raised my hydration to a range between 80% and 82%. Hopefully, this will give you a better insight into the madness of my method. Thanks for your quick response to my messages!
Maybe because we live in a tropical island, if you observe the ingredient list of this video you will see that we use only 0.5% of instant yeast and 3% of salt. A small amount of yeast, given proper long fermentation, can really make the pizza taste even better, so does the salt, but salt also strengthen the gluten network which is a bit weakened by Tangzhong, granted, we are using bread flour with a protein content of >= 13%. Those are the two things that came to my mind after reading your comment.
Did this and will now be making my pizza dough with a yudane from now on. I didn't get much activity for the rises for some reason, but it came out perfectly on my baking steel and my crust was great. I do need to work on stretching my dough as I tend to make it too thin in the middle (and it results in a soppy middle) - that's my own fault with poor technique, though. Thanks! :)
just finished making some! it was really easy to prepare and its the first dough to make friends with my pizza shovel without being too clingy. tastes great obviously. for the record the science talk convinced me to give it a try
The pizza dough came out great using the yeast bloom, the poolish, and the Tangzhong. Both the Tangzhong and Poolish were refrigerated overnight before incorporating them into the dough. Once incorporated I also let the pizza dough cold fermented overnight. Unfortunately, I messed up converting U.S. measurements into grams. So I am not sure what the true hydration amount of the pizza dough really is. In my original recipe, I used 3 1/4 cups of flour and 1 1/3 cups of milk with salt, yeast, and sugar to make the dough. I would also allow it to cold ferment for 72 hrs. In the modified recipe I used 406g of flour, 327g of milk, salt yeast, and honey to make the dough. The Tangzhong and Poolish were allowed to cold ferment for 24 hrs. and once incorporated into the dough, I allowed it to ferment an additional 24 hrs. The taste and texture of the pizza crust of the modified recipe were surprisingly better. So my mistake in converting cups to grams worked out great. Thanks for sharing your videos and baking insight!
There are many factors to consider to get to a ratio for that but here is what I usually do: multiply the volume of Pullman in cm3 by 1/3, you get the amount of dough in grams to start with, adjust up or down accordingly to get the best result. Happy baking 😀
Excited to try these tips! My home pizza game has been slowly improving over the years but I think the yudane might be the missing piece. I always learn something new from your videos and always appreciate your clarity of thought 💛
i tried this today and it actually does make pizza more moist. i noticed my pizzas tend to be dry inside so i gave this a go and am very happy with the results. thanks!
Miamm.... 🤩🤩 j adore la pizza et je fais la pâte maison depuis très longtemps, mais je suis tentée d essayer votre pâte avec du Tangzhong, je me réjouis de voir la différence de la texture de la pâte, merci beaucoup pour ce partage 🙏🙏🙏
That is one way to do it, the problem with this particular method is the evaporation, you may end up losing too much water. Try this: measure all the ingredients before you make the Tangzhong and measure it again after you make it or before you use it, that's the amount of evaporated water. You need to add that much water back to maintain the hydration of the dough.
Thank you for this video. After storing in the fridge for later use, does the dough have to be brought to room temperature first ... and then ferment for 1.5 hours? Or by bringing to room temperature, the dough is also already undergoing the 1.5 hour fermentation so that is no longer needed? Thank you for the clarification.
Yes you can! As it may extend the over all bulk fermentation, you may want to cut down on the instant yeast you use, but the taste will definitely be better!
I was so happy to see that gecko because in India practically every house wall have one or two on them. We in India call them house lizards or "Chipkali" in Hindi language.
@@jayantjolly Actually that was my mistake. It’s not a gecko, it’s an anolis, which is a different species of reptile. They are frequently found in homes and buildings in tropical and subtropical climates.
@@cohoanglervancouverwa6755 As per my information the one on the wall was "common house gecko" which are very common in Asian countries. I think they are also known as moon lizards.
My oven has a 550 degree limit but my grill can heat up to 700+. With a pizza steel the preheated grill works well.( but parchment paper burns black above 550)
Keep in mind her temperature numbers are in celsius and you are referencing fahrenheit. There is no need for parchment paper and parchment paper would degrade the quality of the crust even if a paper existed that would not burn at those temps. Just launch straight on to your steel after it has been preheated for a long time.
one thing I never asked to you before is, at what temp should the tangzhong/yudane ready to be mixed with other ingredients? because I always use it cold from fridge rightaway
You can use it as soon as it cools down to room temperature, if it's too hot, >49°C, it might practically wipe out the yeast. If you use it immediately after it cools down, you will not have that natural flavor and sweetness that a retrograded, overnight tangzhong brings.
@@NovitaListyani yes, but is it really okay to use a cold tangzhong from the fridge? I don't bother to bring it up to room temperature because I aim for a cool dough after done mixing
It depends on where you live, on this tropical island, our room temperature can go as high as 30°C, so, while we are busy with mise en place, its temperature can go up fast, pretty much close to room temperature. We really don't think that much, but if you live in a colder environment, I think it's wise to let it go back to room temperature first considering the impact it may have on your dough.
Pizza is all about the gluten structure ("maglia glutinica"). Does tangzhong weaken gluten? Maybe that's the reason for the stickiness when kneading and the holes when stretching the dough. I make 80% hidration dough with biga (my dough is not as sticky as yours) and I have a 450 ºC oven for pizza baking. I'd love to try adding some tangzhong and see the results, but it worries me that a weak gluten structure won't let the dough come together. I would appreciate it if you could give me have any further info on this. Thanks!
about a year ago i made yudane dough with the intention of making pita bread. then i got lazy and left it in the fridge for so long, that i decided to make a pizza with it. it was so delicious, so now i have been researching how to recreate it intentionally lol.
Mbak, apa ada solusi untuk menentukan ketipisan crust pizza? Saya bikin pizza kadang ketebelan, kadang ketipisan, ketipisan jebol dan nempel gosong ke loyang.
The pizza dough method I saw and would like to try, includes biga, which is a unkeaded, roughly mixed mixture of flour, water and yeast, which is kept for at least a day in a tightly closed container in the fridge. I wonder what would happen if you would use the biga or poolish method, and then add tanzhong/yudane into the mix?
I find this video very interesting. I am going to try it soon. I do have a question….Is there any limitation on time to cold ferment the pizza dough? I seen that you left the other half cold ferment for 24 hrs. Can you let it ferment longer?
Hey ive been making pizzs for a while self thought. If you try let your dough bulk ferment to 5 hours at around 24-26c, ball it then let it proof for another 3-4 hours before baking, I can ensure you your pizza will have more air pockets and much lighter in taste.
hi, how long can i keep the pizza dough the fridge? can i also keep in freezer so i can bake in like a week or month? thanks😊 ive been waiting and your recipe works well for me
16:27 for anyone interested in making a Neapolitan style pizza, consider not using anywhere near this much semolina flour in the top side of the dough. YMMV, but i find it's a better crust when trying to avoid getting much flour on the crust side of the dough, and it seems more authentic to what i see from artisan pizzerias. The bottom is not a big deal because you do want to be able to launch the dough without it sticking.
I am going to test this. I have a local flour that is stone milled on the ranch. It’s 17% protein and still has germ and a small touch of Bran. Which means I get too much oxidation of the bran for long cold fermentation. Acidity helps with this, so my poolish dough is better than my direct dough. It would be even better if I added Ascorbic Acid, but it tightens dough and I already am using flour I shouldn’t because of the amount of protein. But wow is it good. But if I can denature some gluten in 20-30% of the flour, I might have a dough that’s easier to stretch and maybe a bit less chewy.
@@NovitaListyani the dough balls were softer then the other ones when pressed down. But even after 4 days of fermentation they were hard to stretch. Not sure why but I can feel it. It’s taking on colour a bit differently as well. I won’t switch
I made your pizza dough but I left the tangzhong in the refrigerator for about 40 hours. I got side tracker. Everything else was the same. The taste was delicious but I noticed the dough was not completely cooked in the center. I had to take it out of the 500 degree oven after about 9 minutes, it was burning. Can I make one large pizza and put it in 500 degree on the second rack? I think I created a pizza monster. My old Italian Pizza just won't stand up to the taste. Thank you again. I love watching and learning every time. I hope your channel is very successful! Blessings, in Jesus' care, Tooni
Tangzhong in the fridge for about 40 hrs is okay, but 500° fahrenheit /260° C for 9 minutes getting a burning crust with the center not completely cooked makes me wonder how thick is your pizza dough? and how did you bake it, with top or bottom fire and at the bottom, mid or top rack? What's is the hydration? Did you put the dough in the fridge?
Hi, I would try your recipe but can you tell me if you put warm water or cold water (to make the classic pizza recipe not the tangzhong one)? I’ve tried this type of yeast many times and doughs don’t rise… I don’t understand why?! 😕 Thank you
You should get plenty of activity with instant yeast that isn't expired and kept at proper temperature. The water should be somewhere around room temperature but never be above 100°F.
How long approximately are you baking the pizza? Is it possible to use sourdough instead of instant yeast? Amazing this video and your explanation. Tks!!😀
We bake it for 12 minutes (at around 230-250°C) watch here ua-cam.com/video/1R62RANFg4Q/v-deo.html As for sourdough, the acidity in sourdough has a negative effect on the dough when it comes to kneading, we explained the effect of acidity on the dough in our previous video on sourdough, tangzhong dough suffers from similar issues, not due to acidity, but due to the interference of the gluten-starch matrix. So, you may face kneading problem.
We have yet done any baking on gluten free Tangzhong/Yudane bread, but the fact that the core of Tangzhong/Yudane is starch gelatinization and starch gelatinization plays a major role in gluten free bread, there must be way to make it work.
I am making this right now. I followed the instructions, and my tangzhong was very runny. I added a bit more flour to make it look more like yours, and hopefully it will work. My bread flour is 12.7%. It is very humid here, but I have the air conditioning on. I don't know why my mixture was so runny.
120g water 60g bread flour. I adjusted to make it look like yours, and continued with the recipe and it still turned out really good. It was 100 degrees here yesterday and humid, but it shouldn't have made that much difference. Mine was runny. But like I said, I continued and it turned out fine. My final dough was a little more dry, but it still tasted good!
Hmm, bread flour or any flour, for that matter, shouldn't produce a bitter taste. Although you could technically use any flour for making tangzhong, we generally just use the same type as the flour in the recipe we're making. If your tangzhong ends up tasting bitter, then you might want to check if you're making it properly, perhaps it's a little burnt? You could also check if your flour has gone rancid, as that would affect the taste as well.
Oh hey I run a cafe using sourdough for our breads, pizza, pita, etc... I can't tell if my dough is under proofed or over proofed. Sometimes it rises well. Sometimes its dense out of the oven. I can't tell exactly what's going on as I'm not too big into bread... Do you have a video on how to tell if a bread is under proofed or over proofed? Or maybe the starter we use isn't optimal when added to the dough.
And why are we doing sourdough when I have no idea how it works...? It was from original chefs that developed the menu and they aren't with us anymore :( But even when they were here, I feel like they didn't fully grasp sourdough because the product was kind of inconsistent. Sometimes it rose, sometimes it didn't. With that being said, lot of people say we have some of the best vegan food in the world. Maybe Im just being perfectionist. But I also feel like the bread can be a lot better so feel like we are missing a critical step. Please help us out lol
Hmm, pizza and pita are different kinds of doughs but for bread dough, over-proofing usually means that you have a pretty random crumb with the specific volume being simply smaller, it'd be shorter when compared with a properly proofed one, and as for an under-proofed bread, you should be able to spot a dense area at the bottom. We've just released a new video on sourdough: ua-cam.com/video/-T__DFw-awI/v-deo.html You may want to have a look if you're looking into sourdough. Maybe you can find some information in there that you and your team can put into practical use. Don't forget to share with us what you think of it, after watching it ;) Thanks!
hello, I tried this pizza recipe twice and I don't understand why the dough does not rise. I usually use yeast rehydrated in lukewarm water. Wouldn't there be too much salt? why does my dough not rise in the fridge or in the ambient air? Please help !!!
Your investigation into Tangzhong/ Yudane has been wonderful for me. Not only do these facts open doors of possibility in bread making, considering these truths can go a long way in improving sauces and gravies. I had to “stretch” some gravy for a meal of leftovers . Thinking about your video, I made some tangzhong, seasoned it appropriately and added it to the existing gravy. It ended up being one of those meals that are so good, that one feels guilty eating it alone. I don’t know about the rest of your fans, but I’m ready for a sourdough bread made with yogurt and tangzhong. Thanks for all you put into your videos. Your investigations are as delightful as they are thorough.🕊🌹🕊
Getting rid of 1:5 ratio is one of the best things we have done in baking, it does open up many possibilities while at the same time getting all the benefits of breads with partially pre-gelatinized dough. This video is one of such benefits. We'll keep on exploring in this area for a moment as there are some other interesting facts we would like to know more. Thank you always for your kind words 🙏
@@NovitaListyani That 1:5 ratio is totally bogus. It only serves to prove the destructive power of social media when it comes to creating and spreading myths. I think it came about by someone with too many pots on the stove in an effort to keep from burning it as they were doing five other things simultaneously. It makes no other sense to me, to add all that water only to boil most of it away. Thanks again for the “heads up” concerning the facts.
I couldn't agree more. It's kind of absurd to see that this 1:5 ratio even get into the book of a renowned artisan baker. You're right, social media has its negative sides, even some of the best bakers get into the band wagon, subconsciously maybe, simply because it's popular.
@@NovitaListyani There are several areas of endeavor suffering from these types of “popular” misconceptions. (Creating popular misconceptions has become a political art form for one). It seems that algorithmic sorting by words or phrases ,when considering social media, may put “popular “ information at the top of the stack, but it doesn’t necessarily indicate accurate, truthful or axiomatic information. It can be very seductive if one is not prepared to think critically.
I feel blessed every time I watch each of your tutorials. simple explanations that make bread a paradise at hand, able to touch the soul of those who want to learn, congratulations for you Seraphine, for your way of making things easier, and to you Novita for your excellent way of capturing the simplicity of the moment in your productions, Now I can see the bakery with the eyes of a child, thank you
12 minutes baking a pizza is too much, the dough will be hardened. You need to do it in less than 4 minutes with a lot of heat, it will rise more and rapidly, and get crunchy.
I've never used yudane for pizza but I think I'll try it next time because it actually seems to improve the quality of the crust.
However, I want to take this opportunity to also leave some advice: "par baking".
I got the idea from the preparation of modern pinsa which requires a lower oven temperature than pizza. In practice, the base of the pizza is put in the oven without toppings (just with a drop of extra virgin olive oil to avoid excessive swelling in the center of the pizza... in practice to avoid the "pita bread" effect), then proceed to cook the bases for 3-4 minutes and remove them from the oven while still almost completely white but with a light crust.
Here you can choose whether to freeze the bases without toppings or eat the pizza immediately by topping it and finish baking.
When you decide to eat the pizza, add the toppings (for example tomato sauce and mozzarella for a classic margherita) and finish cooking the pizza for another 3-4 minutes (or in any case until the crust is golden and the mozzarella is melted ).
This method has two advantages:
1. The frozen bases are very convenient, you take them out of the freezer, add the toppings and finish cooking them in 3-4 minutes. Being thin they are convenient to put one on top of the other in the freezer and they defrost while you add the toppings so they arrive in the oven ready to be cooked. Much more convenient than frozen dough because they are already almost cooked.
2. Mozzarella does not burn, it does not brown, it does not dry out. It remains nice and soft and stringy like in a good pizzeria. For this reason I also suggest using a classic mozzarella (I know dry mozzarella is a widely used cheese outside Italy but here in Italy only soft and juicy mozzarella is used... obviously for pizza you have to let it drain for a few hours so that it does not release too much liquid on the pizza but a little humidity is necessary to prevent the mozzarella from becoming dry, that is really important for a good pizza).
Ultimately, the pizzas I make with my home oven have always been quite similar to modern pinsas (therefore still very good), high hydration -> crunchy crust on the outside -> stringy mozzarella... but not very soft crust on the inside. The cornicione was not perfect... at least if we are talking about Neapolitan style pizza (there are so many good pizzas).
I hope that yudane helps me take that last step that I was missing.
I hope that my suggestion helps those who want to make pizza at home to keep the mozzarella stringy and to make it more convenient to make pizza whenever you want by freezing the bases.
Ps. Don't show pizzas with ketchup-like sauces anymore, part of me is horrified and dies badly 🤣
....
Among other things I tried to make mantou.
Obviously they didn't come out very white because I didn't have the right flour on hand but it was a very interesting experiment... I had never steamed but I had a suitable container inherited from my mother that I didn't use and I think that from now on I will try to make steamed food more often.
This channel is giving me a lot of new ideas that I hadn't considered and I'm having a lot of fun trying them out, thank you
Freezing the crust also makes it lighter. It pulls moisture out of the crust. John Arena does it for his Sicilian Pizza and is known to have a pizza that looks thick and heavy but is really light and airy.
Please share your experiment results! I'd love to read about whether the yudane helped.
I find your instruction very clear easy to grasp plus the recipe description is really a big... help.. Congrats for this wonderful perfect knowledge you instill in us... More power to you and hoping you'll have more listeners❤
Thank you for your kind words! I'm glad you found the video helpful!
After watching your Tangzhong vs. Yudane video, I tweak my pizza dough recipe where I bloomed the yeast (milk, honey, and yeast), incorporate both a Tangzhong (water + milk + flour) and Poolish (flour + water + yeast + honey) which was added to my dry ingredients (flour & salt). Note: I also added 35g of butter. Now using the baker's percent starting with 406g of bread flour, I was able to figure out the amount of flour and liquid needed to form each separate part ( yeast the bloom, Tangzhong, and Poolish) needed to create my pizza dough. Cross your fingers because the true test will be on tomorrow when I make the pizza. Thanks for sharing all of your insights!
Fingers crossed! Using poolish will surely elevate the aroma and flavor, you need to mind the hydration though. Happy baking!
@@NovitaListyani If I did everything correctly, my hydration is approximately 80%.
We bake Pizzas with 80% hydration regularly, it's okay. Personally we prefer that but it may be quite a challenging task for those who are not familiar with kneading a high hydration dough, other than that, the dough in many ways, I think, is better. It enables us to bake the pizza for longer to get that crispier cornicione.
@@NovitaListyani The previous average weight of my pizza dough made in the past was approximately 795g, which I divided to make three pizzas. However, I never made them using a Tangzhong or using a Poolish. So after watching your videos, I wanted to break down the ingredients I used into a baker's percent (1%) which equated to approximately 4.10g for every 1% percent of flour used. From this I was able to calculate the percentage of ingredients to be as follows: the flour (100%) was approximately 409g, the whole milk (79%) was approximately 327g, the sugar (2.4%) was approximately 10g, the yeast (2.4) was approximately 10g, the salt (2%) was approximately 7g, and the butter (8%) was approximately 35g. Note - the Poolish, Tangzhong, and yeast bloom created were made from percentages of the above-noted ingredients. Since I did not know how to break down the liquid from the butter used, I am guessing it raised my hydration to a range between 80% and 82%. Hopefully, this will give you a better insight into the madness of my method. Thanks for your quick response to my messages!
Maybe because we live in a tropical island, if you observe the ingredient list of this video you will see that we use only 0.5% of instant yeast and 3% of salt. A small amount of yeast, given proper long fermentation, can really make the pizza taste even better, so does the salt, but salt also strengthen the gluten network which is a bit weakened by Tangzhong, granted, we are using bread flour with a protein content of >= 13%. Those are the two things that came to my mind after reading your comment.
Did this and will now be making my pizza dough with a yudane from now on. I didn't get much activity for the rises for some reason, but it came out perfectly on my baking steel and my crust was great. I do need to work on stretching my dough as I tend to make it too thin in the middle (and it results in a soppy middle) - that's my own fault with poor technique, though. Thanks! :)
you dancing and twirling behind the pizza made my day
just finished making some! it was really easy to prepare and its the first dough to make friends with my pizza shovel without being too clingy. tastes great obviously. for the record the science talk convinced me to give it a try
Thank you for the feedback, glad to know that.
I always learn a lot from your videos!! Keep up the good work! I'm looking forward to using your recipe and technique.
The pizza dough came out great using the yeast bloom, the poolish, and the Tangzhong. Both the Tangzhong and Poolish were refrigerated overnight before incorporating them into the dough. Once incorporated I also let the pizza dough cold fermented overnight. Unfortunately, I messed up converting U.S. measurements into grams. So I am not sure what the true hydration amount of the pizza dough really is. In my original recipe, I used 3 1/4 cups of flour and 1 1/3 cups of milk with salt, yeast, and sugar to make the dough. I would also allow it to cold ferment for 72 hrs. In the modified recipe I used 406g of flour, 327g of milk, salt yeast, and honey to make the dough. The Tangzhong and Poolish were allowed to cold ferment for 24 hrs. and once incorporated into the dough, I allowed it to ferment an additional 24 hrs. The taste and texture of the pizza crust of the modified recipe were surprisingly better. So my mistake in converting cups to grams worked out great. Thanks for sharing your videos and baking insight!
Nice done, do you have ideahow to calculate appropriate mold to pullman mold Volyme/ dough mass, what ratio to be used?
There are many factors to consider to get to a ratio for that but here is what I usually do: multiply the volume of Pullman in cm3 by 1/3, you get the amount of dough in grams to start with, adjust up or down accordingly to get the best result. Happy baking 😀
You are an amazing baker, and now my go to, thank you
Thanks so much 😊
Hi, must the tanzhong come to room temperature before use?
No, just use it immediately.
Excited to try these tips! My home pizza game has been slowly improving over the years but I think the yudane might be the missing piece. I always learn something new from your videos and always appreciate your clarity of thought 💛
Thanks 🙏, glad to know that.
i tried this today and it actually does make pizza more moist. i noticed my pizzas tend to be dry inside so i gave this a go and am very happy with the results. thanks!
Hi novita I make fruit vinegar from grapes,pomegranate,
apple.Can I use grape vinegar to make poolish instead of fruit yeast water.
No, you can't use vinegar as a leavening agent. When fruit yeast water turns into vinegar, most of the yeast have died.
@@NovitaListyani thanks novita I got it
I prefer thin crust pizza. Can this dough be rolled out much thinner or would thin crust require a different recipe?
Yes you can do that, there's no need to change the recipe.
@@NovitaListyani Thank you.
Thank you! Total success
Thanks for this video 😊
My pleasure 😀
Miamm.... 🤩🤩 j adore la pizza et je fais la pâte maison depuis très longtemps, mais je suis tentée d essayer votre pâte avec du Tangzhong, je me réjouis de voir la différence de la texture de la pâte, merci beaucoup pour ce partage 🙏🙏🙏
This was a fantastic & well presented video great job! you've got yourself a new subscriber,keep up the good work.
Awesome, thank you!
im used to cook the tangzhong with small fire and make them into a slime alike ... is this the right way ?
That is one way to do it, the problem with this particular method is the evaporation, you may end up losing too much water. Try this: measure all the ingredients before you make the Tangzhong and measure it again after you make it or before you use it, that's the amount of evaporated water. You need to add that much water back to maintain the hydration of the dough.
@@NovitaListyani nice explaination ... will do what your pointers to learn more
Another Great video. I am making Pizza for Friday so just the right video for me. Thank you again for your indepth explanations.
How long was exactly your second fermentation and what is your dough temperature?
ua-cam.com/video/1R62RANFg4Q/v-deo.html around 1.5 hrs, at 28°C, dough temperature is usually around 25-26°C
Thank you for this video.
After storing in the fridge for later use, does the dough have to be brought to room temperature first ... and then ferment for 1.5 hours?
Or by bringing to room temperature, the dough is also already undergoing the 1.5 hour fermentation so that is no longer needed?
Thank you for the clarification.
This is a great video. Thank you. Question: do you think we can use the “stretch and fold” menthol instead of all that hand kneading?
Yes you can! As it may extend the over all bulk fermentation, you may want to cut down on the instant yeast you use, but the taste will definitely be better!
Thank you for this video ❤
Thank you too 🙏
Thanks for the great explanation! My pizza dough will benefit greatly. Also, the cameo appearance by the gecko at 14:53 was hilarious.
Thank you too 🙏
I was so happy to see that gecko because in India practically every house wall have one or two on them. We in India call them house lizards or "Chipkali" in Hindi language.
@@jayantjolly Actually that was my mistake. It’s not a gecko, it’s an anolis, which is a different species of reptile. They are frequently found in homes and buildings in tropical and subtropical climates.
@@cohoanglervancouverwa6755 As per my information the one on the wall was "common house gecko" which are very common in Asian countries. I think they are also known as moon lizards.
Have you tried using a sourdough starter for tangzhong/yudane pizza? I would be interested in finding out more about that.
Yes, but we have not made a video of it yet, will do that soon.
My oven has a 550 degree limit but my grill can heat up to 700+. With a pizza steel the preheated grill works well.( but parchment paper burns black above 550)
You don’t need parchment paper on a pizza steel.
Keep in mind her temperature numbers are in celsius and you are referencing fahrenheit. There is no need for parchment paper and parchment paper would degrade the quality of the crust even if a paper existed that would not burn at those temps. Just launch straight on to your steel after it has been preheated for a long time.
one thing I never asked to you before is, at what temp should the tangzhong/yudane ready to be mixed with other ingredients? because I always use it cold from fridge rightaway
You can use it as soon as it cools down to room temperature, if it's too hot, >49°C, it might practically wipe out the yeast. If you use it immediately after it cools down, you will not have that natural flavor and sweetness that a retrograded, overnight tangzhong brings.
@@NovitaListyani yes, but is it really okay to use a cold tangzhong from the fridge? I don't bother to bring it up to room temperature because I aim for a cool dough after done mixing
It depends on where you live, on this tropical island, our room temperature can go as high as 30°C, so, while we are busy with mise en place, its temperature can go up fast, pretty much close to room temperature. We really don't think that much, but if you live in a colder environment, I think it's wise to let it go back to room temperature first considering the impact it may have on your dough.
I am curious, is there any benefit of using Tangzhong/Yudane in addition to an existing preferment like Poolish to elevate the pizza further?
14:52 gecko in action. Just lovely 🥰 amazing video.
Pizza is all about the gluten structure ("maglia glutinica"). Does tangzhong weaken gluten? Maybe that's the reason for the stickiness when kneading and the holes when stretching the dough.
I make 80% hidration dough with biga (my dough is not as sticky as yours) and I have a 450 ºC oven for pizza baking. I'd love to try adding some tangzhong and see the results, but it worries me that a weak gluten structure won't let the dough come together. I would appreciate it if you could give me have any further info on this. Thanks!
Thanks for sharing🌏🍕🥂🍽️
My pleasure 😊
@@NovitaListyani 🙏
about a year ago i made yudane dough with the intention of making pita bread. then i got lazy and left it in the fridge for so long, that i decided to make a pizza with it. it was so delicious, so now i have been researching how to recreate it intentionally lol.
Thank you for this video and valuable information✨🙏.. But what about sugar?
Mbak, apa ada solusi untuk menentukan ketipisan crust pizza? Saya bikin pizza kadang ketebelan, kadang ketipisan, ketipisan jebol dan nempel gosong ke loyang.
The pizza dough method I saw and would like to try, includes biga, which is a unkeaded, roughly mixed mixture of flour, water and yeast, which is kept for at least a day in a tightly closed container in the fridge. I wonder what would happen if you would use the biga or poolish method, and then add tanzhong/yudane into the mix?
I liked your explanation style, and I liked the lizard :) Thank you
lizard or gecko 🦎
I find this video very interesting. I am going to try it soon. I do have a question….Is there any limitation on time to cold ferment the pizza dough? I seen that you left the other half cold ferment for 24 hrs. Can you let it ferment longer?
Please make more recipes! Can you do a sweet polish roll recipe?
Hey ive been making pizzs for a while self thought. If you try let your dough bulk ferment to 5 hours at around 24-26c, ball it then let it proof for another 3-4 hours before baking, I can ensure you your pizza will have more air pockets and much lighter in taste.
hi, how long can i keep the pizza dough the fridge? can i also keep in freezer so i can bake in like a week or month? thanks😊 ive been waiting and your recipe works well for me
16:27 for anyone interested in making a Neapolitan style pizza, consider not using anywhere near this much semolina flour in the top side of the dough. YMMV, but i find it's a better crust when trying to avoid getting much flour on the crust side of the dough, and it seems more authentic to what i see from artisan pizzerias. The bottom is not a big deal because you do want to be able to launch the dough without it sticking.
Super pizza bake Thanks
I use 65 to 70% hydration.
That’s for Detroit style pizza.
I use 55 to 60% hydration for New York style pizza.
Without tangzhong or yudane.
I am going to test this. I have a local flour that is stone milled on the ranch. It’s 17% protein and still has germ and a small touch of Bran. Which means I get too much oxidation of the bran for long cold fermentation. Acidity helps with this, so my poolish dough is better than my direct dough. It would be even better if I added Ascorbic Acid, but it tightens dough and I already am using flour I shouldn’t because of the amount of protein. But wow is it good.
But if I can denature some gluten in 20-30% of the flour, I might have a dough that’s easier to stretch and maybe a bit less chewy.
I'm quite curious about the outcome of this, would appreciate any updates on this!
@@NovitaListyani the dough balls were softer then the other ones when pressed down. But even after 4 days of fermentation they were hard to stretch. Not sure why but I can feel it. It’s taking on colour a bit differently as well. I won’t switch
Amazing video!! Will be trying today 😊
Hi dear, at which point can I freeze it, and when out of freezer, how to thaw? Thanks
I made your pizza dough but I left the tangzhong in the refrigerator for about 40 hours. I got side tracker. Everything else was the same. The taste was delicious but I noticed the dough was not completely cooked in the center. I had to take it out of the 500 degree oven after about 9 minutes, it was burning.
Can I make one large pizza and put it in 500 degree on the second rack?
I think I created a pizza monster. My old Italian Pizza just won't stand up to the taste.
Thank you again. I love watching and learning every time. I hope your channel is very successful!
Blessings, in Jesus' care, Tooni
Tangzhong in the fridge for about 40 hrs is okay, but 500° fahrenheit /260° C for 9 minutes getting a burning crust with the center not completely cooked makes me wonder how thick is your pizza dough? and how did you bake it, with top or bottom fire and at the bottom, mid or top rack? What's is the hydration? Did you put the dough in the fridge?
Hi, I would try your recipe but can you tell me if you put warm water or cold water (to make the classic pizza recipe not the tangzhong one)? I’ve tried this type of yeast many times and doughs don’t rise… I don’t understand why?! 😕 Thank you
You should get plenty of activity with instant yeast that isn't expired and kept at proper temperature. The water should be somewhere around room temperature but never be above 100°F.
nice! love the look of that crumb!
How long approximately are you baking the pizza? Is it possible to use sourdough instead of instant yeast?
Amazing this video and your explanation. Tks!!😀
We bake it for 12 minutes (at around 230-250°C) watch here ua-cam.com/video/1R62RANFg4Q/v-deo.html
As for sourdough, the acidity in sourdough has a negative effect on the dough when it comes to kneading, we explained the effect of acidity on the dough in our previous video on sourdough, tangzhong dough suffers from similar issues, not due to acidity, but due to the interference of the gluten-starch matrix. So, you may face kneading problem.
Thanks 🙏😉
Love your channel. Can u make a very basic of cakes? Hoping your cake recipe
Luv you
Will try sometime in the future, thanks for your suggestion!
Only the second vid of yours I've watched but now subscribed. Probably a dumb question, but is there any kind of gluten free version of Tangzhong?
We have yet done any baking on gluten free Tangzhong/Yudane bread, but the fact that the core of Tangzhong/Yudane is starch gelatinization and starch gelatinization plays a major role in gluten free bread, there must be way to make it work.
how to choose the tangzhong proportion
There is no simple answer for that, it really depends on what you want to use Tangzhong/Yudane for.
many thanks Novita, I will take a look on that🍃@@NovitaListyani
I am making this right now. I followed the instructions, and my tangzhong was very runny. I added a bit more flour to make it look more like yours, and hopefully it will work. My bread flour is 12.7%. It is very humid here, but I have the air conditioning on. I don't know why my mixture was so runny.
Hmm, that is very unusual. How much flour and boiling water did you use?
120g water 60g bread flour. I adjusted to make it look like yours, and continued with the recipe and it still turned out really good. It was 100 degrees here yesterday and humid, but it shouldn't have made that much difference. Mine was runny. But like I said, I continued and it turned out fine. My final dough was a little more dry, but it still tasted good!
Are you using boiling water?
Can i use All purpose flour for tangzhong? Coz i had a bad experience into breadflour it came out a bit bitter,i dont know why,thank you
Hmm, bread flour or any flour, for that matter, shouldn't produce a bitter taste. Although you could technically use any flour for making tangzhong, we generally just use the same type as the flour in the recipe we're making. If your tangzhong ends up tasting bitter, then you might want to check if you're making it properly, perhaps it's a little burnt? You could also check if your flour has gone rancid, as that would affect the taste as well.
Oh hey I run a cafe using sourdough for our breads, pizza, pita, etc... I can't tell if my dough is under proofed or over proofed. Sometimes it rises well. Sometimes its dense out of the oven. I can't tell exactly what's going on as I'm not too big into bread... Do you have a video on how to tell if a bread is under proofed or over proofed? Or maybe the starter we use isn't optimal when added to the dough.
And why are we doing sourdough when I have no idea how it works...? It was from original chefs that developed the menu and they aren't with us anymore :( But even when they were here, I feel like they didn't fully grasp sourdough because the product was kind of inconsistent. Sometimes it rose, sometimes it didn't. With that being said, lot of people say we have some of the best vegan food in the world. Maybe Im just being perfectionist. But I also feel like the bread can be a lot better so feel like we are missing a critical step. Please help us out lol
Hmm, pizza and pita are different kinds of doughs but for bread dough, over-proofing usually means that you have a pretty random crumb with the specific volume being simply smaller, it'd be shorter when compared with a properly proofed one, and as for an under-proofed bread, you should be able to spot a dense area at the bottom.
We've just released a new video on sourdough: ua-cam.com/video/-T__DFw-awI/v-deo.html
You may want to have a look if you're looking into sourdough. Maybe you can find some information in there that you and your team can put into practical use. Don't forget to share with us what you think of it, after watching it ;) Thanks!
Why not use both Poolish & Yudane?
if climate scientists had your ability to teach we would be on a much better path. thank you for being a teacher.
hello, I tried this pizza recipe twice and I don't understand why the dough does not rise. I usually use yeast rehydrated in lukewarm water. Wouldn't there be too much salt? why does my dough not rise in the fridge or in the ambient air?
Please help !!!
@novita listyani
very beautiful video and nice pet 14:51
That's definitely a lizard on your wall at 14:51 😅GREAT VIDEO! This is priceless Pizz-education. Thanks a ton for sharing!
Uma lagartixa, para ser mais preciso.
How come you dont do taste test after you bake
Might be great for tavern style pizza
Indeed!
Every time I watch your videos, I always tell myself that I can do this. But not really. 😂
Please show us how to make whole wheat flour bread using Tangzhong or Yudane. Thank you
Will try! Thanks for the suggestion!
I need to understand what is the proportion of tangzhong, percentage of moisture and which tangzhong to use in each recipe
Your investigation into Tangzhong/ Yudane has been wonderful for me. Not only do these facts open doors of possibility in bread making, considering these truths can go a long way in improving sauces and gravies.
I had to “stretch” some gravy for a meal of leftovers . Thinking about your video, I made some tangzhong, seasoned it appropriately and added it to the existing gravy. It ended up being one of those meals that are so good, that one feels guilty eating it alone.
I don’t know about the rest of your fans, but I’m ready for a sourdough bread made with yogurt and tangzhong.
Thanks for all you put into your videos. Your investigations are as delightful as they are thorough.🕊🌹🕊
Getting rid of 1:5 ratio is one of the best things we have done in baking, it does open up many possibilities while at the same time getting all the benefits of breads with partially pre-gelatinized dough. This video is one of such benefits. We'll keep on exploring in this area for a moment as there are some other interesting facts we would like to know more. Thank you always for your kind words 🙏
@@NovitaListyani
That 1:5 ratio is totally bogus. It only serves to prove the destructive power of social media when it comes to creating and spreading myths. I think it came about by someone with too many pots on the stove in an effort to keep from burning it as they were doing five other things simultaneously. It makes no other sense to me, to add all that water only to boil most of it away. Thanks again for the “heads up” concerning the facts.
I couldn't agree more. It's kind of absurd to see that this 1:5 ratio even get into the book of a renowned artisan baker. You're right, social media has its negative sides, even some of the best bakers get into the band wagon, subconsciously maybe, simply because it's popular.
@@NovitaListyani
There are several areas of endeavor suffering from these types of “popular” misconceptions. (Creating popular misconceptions has become a political art form for one). It seems that algorithmic sorting by words or phrases ,when considering social media, may put “popular “ information at the top of the stack, but it doesn’t necessarily indicate accurate, truthful or axiomatic information. It can be very seductive if one is not prepared to think critically.
19:24 I think the crust on that pizza doesn't look flexible, but rather hard.
Nice I learn a lot. Thank you so much! Just a note there was a lizard at your back 14:51
A small lizard like that is quite common here, it's harmless and actually good for us.
Can you add a poolish to this recipe ?
Yes
I feel blessed every time I watch each of your tutorials. simple explanations that make bread a paradise at hand, able to touch the soul of those who want to learn, congratulations for you Seraphine,
for your way of making things easier, and to you Novita for your excellent way of capturing the simplicity of the moment in your productions, Now I can see the bakery with the eyes of a child, thank you
14:51 there's a lizard on your wall and it even scurries down! Was that CG or was it a real lizard?
It was a real lizard, quite common here.
5:40 brain blown.. and who else is talking about the walls surface of the pores of the crumb grain... no one.. This girl is next level..
Worked very well with a Detroit-style pizza
Do you have a pizza experiment with sourdough?
Hi Novita , do you think that T.Z, tecnique can function for gluten free breads ? Thanks for your opinión and Best regards
Yes, absolutely
Hello to the little lizard at 14:51
Quite common here, the gecko, the giant version, is getting rare though
Qty of bread flour in final dough missing in ingredients list
I've just found that out too, fixed. Thanks 🙏
Thanks for your sharing! Love to watch your kute lips like Betta Fish!!!
25/30 salt per 1000 grams of flour? Wow!!! It won't be too salty?
Nope. For pizza, 2.5-3% is actually quite a standard www.pizzanapoletana.org/en/ricetta_pizza_napoletana
Have your tried pizza with Tangzhong and sourdough?
Thankyou Novita! I admire your intelligence, I'm starting a channel on pizza making! you should look at the video I posted and tell me what you think
You got the science of tangzhong right, but damn, woman, you don’t need to add this much flour when you’re stretching it.
there is a lizard at 15:11
Who saw the lizard on the wall?? 14:52
12 minutes baking a pizza is too much, the dough will be hardened. You need to do it in less than 4 minutes with a lot of heat, it will rise more and rapidly, and get crunchy.
14:50 salamander time
Your pet newt has escaped
Did you see that freakin lizard/bug run down the wall behind her
Am I the only one who noticed the lizard on the wall behind her?
She is living in Indonesia Lizard are normal .You can't get rid of them 100% .
I've to said that Whichever guy had you is very blissful. Not only you're beautiful AND also knows cooking! 😊🙂
"Better" when it comes to food is a matter of opinion. Science can't answer that. Love the video otherwise.
Thanks for all thèse informations
Um, at 14:50 how are we supposed to look past the lizard crawling on your wall? Did ya'll see that sh!t?
Why is there a lizard 🦎 on the wall? Just wondering 🤔
You are still cute n adorable
55-59% ?? Where are you getting that info from? Absolutely not. They do vary, but never that low. Home cooks should begin at 65%-70% or higher.
AVPN International regulation. It's 55-62% now, of course it's not meant for home baking, that's what this video for.
It doesn’t look particularly good, compared to a sourdough regular method