And this is what people who don’t know NBA history don’t get. It’s actually because of Jordan though not his fault. Rings culture didn’t become a thing until after Jordan because it was an easy way to capture his greatness. I actually don’t like when people just refer to his rings because it shortchanges his greatness as a player. The rings are the icing on the cake. Remember he retired after “only” 3 rings because he felt he had nothing else to prove. Despite the fact that Bird also had 3 and Magic 5. But he was already considered GOAT by that point. When he came back and won 3 more that just further solidified it.
I saw when Jordan played his first Olympic tournaments . It was team USA against the NBA super Stars and Jordan put on a show and swept the NBA. He hadn't even played his first game in the NBA.
Just think about that. MJ led college player to dominate, not FIBA or another Country's best team, but the best NBA players in the world, even before he was a rookie in the NBA. Lebron couldnt even win gold without Kobe against lesser competition. How is Lebron even remotely close to Kobe, Birdd, Magic, Kareem, Wilt, Oscar, Olajuwan, Curry etc, much less Russell & MJ? Stats? Superteaming for all your easy, league aided chips? Having poor basketball fundamentals? Lebron is not on the planet with the actual top echelon greats...
In one of those games, MJ took a horrible shot to the face. I think it was from Mike Dunleavy, and MJ took it like it was nothing. If a player in today's NBA got hit like that, they would still be rolling on the floor
MJ was so competitive, he said in an interview that his biggest regret was not being able to play until someone knocked him off his throne. He wanted to go out on his shield.
Lebron: most playoff loses all-time ✔, most committed turnovers all-time ✔, most shots taken all-time (but he's pass 1st?) ✔, most missed shots all-time ✔, only player to be Swept in 3 finals series ✔ 7th worst +/- in NBA finals history -86 ✔ 2nd worst NBA finals record all-time 4-6 ✔ that's not a top 5 player all-time
CONT: most flops all time (?) Debatable , but he in there. #1 ring chaser of all time #1 team wrecker for 1 who is considered great. Biggest crybaby of ALL TIME. there are more stats, that he may be in the running for plz feel free to list below. 👇🏿
HIT THE LIKE BUTTON PEOPLE!! This is one of the BEST channels out there. Professional setup, call ins, nice breakdowns, etc. Keep up the good work! MJ=🐐
For all of you that magically forgot who Kobe Bryant was just watch the 2007 State Farm USA Basketball game. Or just pay attention to the final 2 minutes where close games are won. Pay attention to what the announcers say. If you don’t watch then I’ll give you the summary. They said and I quote: “… there was a sense and energy from all the players out there, they knew who the BEST PLAYER ON THE PLANET was… Now you come to close the game and what’s your first option? What’s your only option? And what’s the end result? Kobe Bryant with the lead…” Kobe hit the game winner and out performed Bron. Bron missed the shot to win the game. And Kobe showed up to the finals in 2008, 09, and 10. Lebron didn’t. Stop the disrespect
LeBron couldn't hold kobes jock. Kobe beat 4 50 win teams in one playoff run, MJ didn't beat but maybe one , took him 9 years of playoffs to beat 4. Kobe faced way way more stiff competition than MJ. But Kobe wouldn't exist without MJ. Can't compare them . MJ the goat. But Kobe is as good. LeBron isn't near either of them
I love Bird and I consider Bird the goat SF but I believe many of his teammates in his rookie season were injured the prior year hence the 29 Win season the year prior to Bird’s arrival.
@@Josh-sk5xd I don’t know about that one, seeing as the year before that 29 win season they only won 32 games. The Celtics were on a downward spiral until Larry Legend showed up and not only got the Celtics back to their winning ways but was the catalyst and main cog that culminated in the form of the ‘86 Celtics who were one of the greatest teams of all time. In a team sport, that’s an accolade any player in the goat conversation must have,
@@verbalkint3447 Remember Birds rookie year he had a healthy Tiny Archibald that was recovering from injury the prior year Again, no knock on Bird to me he’s the Goat SF and most definitely impacted the Celtics his rookie season.
To those Wilt and Kareem lovers, there's no disrespect to them as greats in basketball history. However, being the GOAT is not just about stats... It's about impact on the game of basketball itself on top of the person's skills and performance. When you judge the entire package, no player in the history of the game compares to MJ. He took basketball to a worldwide status, along with a style and personality that was electrifying and mesmerizing to people, on top of his elite athleticism and incomparable abilities on the court. He would have crowds of people and kids following him wherever he went. Entire families from everywhere, not just Chicago, would stop what they were doing when the bulls were playing. MJ transcended basketball and created an entire brand of the sport. He inspired nearly ALL of the current NBA stars.... That is what it means to be GOAT...
I agree with a lot of what your saying. I grew up right around the corner from where Bill Russell used to live in Massachusetts. That man went threw hell from getting windows broken, burning crosses on his lawn etc. With the racial climate the way that it was Wilt & Bill didn't have the same opportunities MJ had. Remember at one point those black athletes couldn't sleep in the same hotels, or even enter the same restaurants as there white teammates. It was a different world back then compared to when MJ entered the league.
Respect your opinion but can you imagine wat they would be saying if Wilt was playing today? He was 7’2 athletic version of jirdan but stronger n faster ??? People look at the 60-70’s n talk down on that era ? You give wilt todays technology training shoes therapy etc? 🤦🏻♂️wilt had a 50inch vertical jump ? Wilt could bench press 600 pounds wilt ran the 100 in 10.5 seconds ? Ran the high hurdles shot out long jump I mean he was BO JACKSON before Bo unfortunately he was in the 60’s today he would destroy the entire league GIANIS JOKER EMBID would get demolished n the rest of the league would be getting 50 -25 rbs n 6 blks a night
@@blackeddie154 COME ON DUDE. WILT WAS A CETER CLOSEST TO THE BASKET , AT 7 FEET. WAT U EXPECT HUH STEUPSSSS 🤔 WAS HE MESMERIZING? WAS HE SPECTACULAR?, DID HE LEFT U IN AWE? , WIT HIS MOVES OR SKILLS, SHOOTING ABILTY?LIKE THE ONE AND ONLY, HUH,? U NO WHO AM TALKING ABOUT OK GEE. ITS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE, MIC DROP
🗣️INTERESTING POINT . BUT , I DISAGREE . KOBE HAD SHAQ AS THEE # 1 .KOBE DIDN ' T COME INTO THE LEAGUE HITTING THE GROUND RUNNING . KOBE CAME OFF THE BENCH HIS FIRST 2 PLUS YRS. KOBE. NEVER SHOT 50 % FOR ONE SEASON . KOBE ' S SHOT SELECTION AND DECISION MAKING ISN ' T GREAT . ESPN D🚫ESN ' T EVEN HAVE KOBE IN THE TOP 10 ALL TIME . BUT , I D🟢 . Y👤U AND 👤THERS KEEP OVERRATING KOBE . KOBE CAN ' T BE IN THE G.🐐.A.T. DEBATE . SHAQ HAS A 3 PEAT. BUT, PE👤PLE D 🚫 N ' T PUT SHAQ IN THE G.🐐.A.T. DEBATE .>🎤 🏀🗑️
Shaq, George Mikan, and Bill Russell higher in the Goat debate over scrubs like LBJ, Magic, Bird, and Kareem. Prove me wrong. They got 3 peats, and those other losers only ever managed Back to Back titles. There are levels to this, and those bums aren't on the same one as my boy George Mikan!
I seen one of Wilt Chamberlain stat lines dude records are untouchable! 53 points 34 rebounds 11 blocks 10 steals and 14 assist! Those video games numbers but Air Jordan the Goat! Sports Fitness and Rants is a great channel as well..! Appreciate it your knowledge brother you know your history if you don’t know what you’re talking about real basketball fans can tell right away! God bless brother!
Damn good video ManDown. Even though they say Kobe is a carbon copy of Mike, I still have em at 7. Top 10. MJ, Wilt, Kareem, Magic, Bird, Duncan, Kobe, Hakeem, Shaq, Russell.
@@crharper25 Again I like your team. All good selections except for Shaq. I would take Malone over Shaq. Better free throw shooter, great defender, runs the floor, passes exceptional for a PF. Probably one of the first stretch 4’s Duncan and Barkley all stay no question.
What doesn't get talked about enough is Jordan's motor. He would often finish games with the same effectiveness he would start games with. On the 1992 Dream Team, the greatest basketball players in the world like Magic, marveled at Jordan's ability to stay up for days on end with very little or no sleep, and still go out and dominate on the court the same day. There were some uncanny stories about MJ that indicates that he was probably a superhuman type athlete like Wilt, as opposed to just being a supremely talented athlete who worked hard (Kobe).
As much as I agree with Bobby Knight, the Lebron fanboys won't accept that because they're Gen Z and you know what they say regarding this generation, doesn't respect the past and history and today is the greatest generation ever according to them and they'll never accept that someone was infinitely better than their chosen one. I accept what Mr. Knight said because it's rooted on facts and he gave his criteria on why he choose MJ as his GOAT and his criteria makes sense. He knew it, I knew it, we knew it but the Lebron fanboys will forever be living in their deluded fantasy.
I think the quote that was inscribed in MJ'S statue fully encapsulated the feeling of most basketball fans that consider him the GOAT. "THE BEST THERE EVER WAS. THE BEST THERE EVER WILL BE. - Michael Jordan.
I just look at LeBron like I do Wilt and Shaq. All were great physically but ultimately underwhelmed for the hype. They all NEEDED top level help to actually win, and had lucky things to happen along the way like a teammate hitting a big shot or a key injured opponent. And they all team hopped after a situation wasn't working out. And there was someone better at their relative position during their era. Wilt it was Russell Shaq it was Hakeem & Duncan Lebron it was Kobe
@Ephilly-rz2pb just tired of the LeBron is the GOAT or even #2 bullshit. He's back end top 10 with Wilt and Shaq isn't even in my top 10. These 3 guys had multiple, major flaws and I got tons of research to back it up. Wilt Chamberlain for example has ridiculous video game numbers but only for about 8 seasons. When people say he is the GOAT, I ask to explain because he had HOF teammates his whole career. He blew 3-1 and 3-2 leads and Russell owned him. I always hear that Russell had better teammates. But if you think Wilt is the greatest of all time, then he should've been the difference to win. His scoring went down in all 14 of his seasons from regular season to playoffs. Thats the GOAT? I got similar arguments for Shaq and LeBron
@@SelfResearchedNBAFacts I’m with ya for sure! I honestly would take a prime bird or magic over bron..sheesh I would def take Kobe, Duncan and Kareem over bron. Mikes the goat and it’s never been a debate for me
We know lebroom not competitive he wants it easy as possible...lebum always looking for a SHORT-CUT like stacking his teams or guarding the weak link and passing the ball to someone else to take the last shot...lebum will see a good match ups on his schedule and will sit out n load manage...he is the worst in the nba pathetic
I think of centers like Wilt, Kareem and Shaq as being the most “dominant” players of their eras. I think the greatest “basketball player” of all time has to be a ball handler first. If you don’t have elite ball handling skills it should disqualify you from GOAT convos.
Thank you! I really think many of these Lebron fans have never been real ballers. They don't understand owning the court with the five you came there with or the five you chose when you got there and you keep running win or lose with the same team. I say they are part of the microwave generation. They want it fast and can eat something different everyday, instead of being a part of the home cooking generation. You had to wait for the meal to finish cooking, the meal took time to be ready, it was good, and you could eat leftovers of that same meal for a few days. You stay with your team and build them up, just like you eat a well prepared meal, and feast off of that meal until it's gone. And because Lebron did it by joining teams and without going against the best they have to call the players from previous generations plumbers, unathletic, unskilled, and have to say the competition wasn't as good. And anyone who watches the games can see the skill and athleticism was just as good,if not better.
This is one od tbe reasons that Isaiah Thomas has animosity towards MJ, his college coach acknowledged that MJ was that dude and Zeke couldn't and still can't handle that fact and it must hurt to his core!
I’m glad you said he never competed against Wade. Wade already had a championship! And he knew Wade was an obstacle in the way for him to get a championship.So let’s join forces. Cutting corners.
Ah man, that's dope! Thanks man. I'm watching when we did our post game after the Mavs advanced to the finals to remember what we said about the finals matchup
@@Mandownsports I rarely listen to the game, because the commentary is usually trash. However, when there's shows like yours. It actually makes the game more exciting!
No one has dominated both ends of the court more than wilt chamberlain if we take the team award which is a championship out it's not even close Wilt is the greatest individual player ever
I don't even think it's fair to compare Boston 3 to Miami 3.. A) the celtics put that team together, & B) kg, pp, & ra were getting past their prime. C) dwade, LeBron & Bosh were in their prime, & two top players, were taken from franchises in the already weak east. Then they got ray Allen on top of it. When LeBron says "not 6, not 7." He meant it, with a smile on his face. It's why I find it disgusting kobe gets so dismissed for winning on the team he was basically drafted on, while LeBron tampers to create a super team in order to avoid any serious competition. You could argue, he stacked the deck so far, nobody wanted to play in the east because he made it so uncompetitive. So kobe played in the toughest western conference, with what he was given. While LeBron stacked the deck & turned the weak east even weaker. It's no surprise kobe had a winning finals record for being molded in the fire of thewest, while LeBron has a losing, he never had to go up against the best every year and had to really overcome the competition. This is why over popular belief, I have kobe above lebron.
😮 VC and all the UNC GUYS I like but Vince had a 35" vertical and MJ has a 48" best all time.. VC more creative but MJ best lay package.. he also did it on both ends.. 4.3 40yrd also,..hang time
💯! All FACTS Mel!! Btw that’s how I compare those players. I can compare MJ to Bird, Magic, Zeke, Kobe, Duncan because they did it the hard way, the authentic way. I can only compare Lebron with KD because both went the easy route and when I compare the two, KD comes out on top since KD dusted Lebron when it was even Steven. Even with Curry, Curry was able to do it the authentic way in 2015 & 2022! He got cheated out of another authentic ring in 2016 smh.
Bro I have to tell you something, you have one of the best sports show period. Some of these analyst and ex players are trying to feed us B.S. This all started with LBJ
Jordan had a 48-inch vertical leap compared to Carter's 43-inch leap. Vince averaged 16.7 points his career. How you equate him in any way to MJ is mind-boggling. In fact, how can anyone match six chips, six FMVPs, and zero finals' losses? All of these inferences to Jordan are beyond asinine, and that includes Kobe, who stunk up the 2004 finals. I have to believe MJ laughs at all of these narratives.
Man Down , My brother another fantastic breakdown video on how to compare MJ to everyone else! Nobody has ever or will ever play like Mike because nobody will ever have all the dominant player needs to be great! Love your work and love your smartness in the world of the NBA keep it up brother. Mad respect for you! Chris Klatter
@man down sports I really liked the way you broke this down. It truly shows a methodical breakdown of a lot of aspects normal fans don't truly understand in the goat debate. I love the new age vs tradition comparison. The old skewl way was to maybe bring in a slightly stronger role play, not replace a role player with a known dominate sf,c, or pf.
@@Mandownsports and i hate the longevity argument being even considered as an aspect of the goat debate. I've said it before thats like stating that pete rose .303 batting avg. is the hit king when he out hit ty cobbs (.366 batting avg) when he played almost 530 more games. Who's really the hit king. Ty Cobbs, for sure. like in the same span of 1072 games MJ's point total was 32,292, and Lebron's was only 29,413 in the same amount of games. Plus the misdirected, lol stat that lebron incorporated more teammates might just conclude to the fact he was intimidated to take the shot in the hot seat, where we all know MJ thrived and always wanted to take the shots that would decide the outcome of the game
@@Mandownsports I mean why not? He been with the franchises entire career through the ups and downs until they drafted and put pieces around him to make it work and they were very successful. Even though they won two rings with KD joining him, he still won two without him.
And that’s what sets Lebron and mj and Kobe apart. I feel like Lebron is the privileged one. He doesn’t have that hunger to beat his opps, he becomes part of the opps.
Small criticism, I love your stuff and agree with all your general ideas. “The one percent doesn’t need to work on those skills” I just add they don’t need to work on those skills to skate by to a certain level. Those freak athletes fall into a trap by skating by and then hitting a ceiling. Developing the fundamentals is what would raise that ceiling. It’s often pretty unfortunate.
I don't understand why everyone focuses on individual characteristics and stats. Jordan wasn't the "best" at many individual things or in stat categories. But as the ultimate athlete, the ultimate basketball player, when you put Jordan's characteristic together, in ONE package, ALL his characteristics worked together to make the GOAT. Period. Enough discussion about this. Jordan is the best that has ever been and will ever be. Today's ballers have it easier, they don't face qualified opposition so the game is by its nature, easier. In order to do your flashy moves, you're allowed to travel, carry, foul, and do things that players in the past COULD NOT DO. Today's stats are not legit. They just are not. I don't believe you could put today's player into the 90's and they would succeed. They would have to adjust their game and give up some of their "fancy" moves, or risked getting called on it. Once you give up the "extra" things you can do with the ball and have to play by the rules of basketball, your hands are tied and you play the game within the rules. Every modern player's stats, except Kobe, would drop. Fact.
“There’s a lot of gold dust sprinkled on that guy, MJ” keep spitting gems! Most professionally produced show, takes built on sound logic and facts, great for casuals and ballers alike - keep going
The problem with counting championships is that everyone of them have the same face value but the competitors aren't the same every year, that's why in order to understand who's the best you gotta see them play and evaluate.
Jordan had zero weaknesses. Every single year he came back better stronger smarter faster tougher . Offensively he was PICASSO on defense he was a pitbull . Mentally ? Didn’t accept losing
I love how Kobe is the last and everyone mysteriously leaves out Duncan who had a better total career and is the greatest at his position all time when Kobe was not. Great content although you should have made a mention Detroit did not bow out gracefully but you made the point it was Chicagos turn.
Yeah we 4get Duncan far too often. And you're right, the Pistons didn't bow out gracefully in the moment but at least Isaiah didn't go join Bird in Boston to make sure MJ didn't keep winning. He knew the Pistons run wqs over and he took it on the chin.
I'm a jordan guy but I have to recognize the greats regardless of era but I understand why mj is the goat his performances when it matters is unmatched to me but Boston had a super duper team so I really don't hold not winning against Mr Chamberlain I don't Kno if a player has had so much stacked against him as far as his opponents and it's not about the stats it's more about how dominant he was on both ends of the court you have a great show I like watching you guys are always on point
Great commentary. Lebron did what he did because he did not have the skill or talent to do what the previous greats or some current/future greats are doing. He was the deficiency because his ego stopped him from learning the fundamentals of winning basketball. My personal belief is that LeBron saw and studied what MJ did during those we games MJ played point guard under Doug Collins. MJ’s numbers for those 24 games were better than most if not Lebrons whole career of playing point. Lebron saw the stats MJ generated during those 24 games and made his mind up to make a career doing that to get easy goat status through stats that’s why he never learned to play off ball and insists on playing facilitator everywhere he goes. MJ, zkobe, Olajuwan, Duncan, Bird etc didn’t need players around that filled in for their deficiencies, like Lebron and his system does. So Lebron could never replicate what the actual top greats did because he did not have the skill, the mentality of a winner, nor the necessary humility to be taught, nor the modesty to know what he needed to work on. He is an “aided” athlete, allegedly lol, so that disqualifies him right off. The clumsy movement due to horrible footwork, lack of basic fundamentals are egregious. He doesn’t have the skill to be top 20 much less top 10. Without the media he would be behind so many players in the top 75.
Well said and straight FACTS! I Couldn’t have said it better! Salute! This is why I don’t have Lebron in my top 40! His whole career has been completely manufactured & unauthentic.
@@Mandownsports I’m not even trolling bro lolz I can’t put that dude above even Karl Malone. Lebron has too many holes and weaknesses in his game and he lacks the intangibles among other things. Without the media & Refs/League & him cheating by colluding with Superteams Lebron has ZERO rings etc etc We know dude is on the juice as well and is cheating in that regard also so in my eyes he’s disqualified from even being in the top 40. Once it becomes official that he’s juicing he’s out my top 75. Really deep inside myself I already have him out of the top 75 for just that reason alone.
When you are solo, you have the best channel outside of Old Angry Hoops. Love your content and takes. Phenomenal is also up there! Thanks for stating facts. Lefraud James? Nah.
Main reason why Kobe is number 2 or up there as far as the GOAT: People want to discredit Kobe rings with Shaq but that makes no sense. For years and to this day it was a consensus that Kobe was the closest thing to MJ we’ve ever seen. That comparison was established when Kobe was still in high school. So the most Dominant center in NBA history got to play alongside the closest thing to the GOAT (consensus is MJ) and 3-peats with Coach Phil Jackson. So how does that only discredit Kobe’s rings and not Shaq’s?? Next point… When Shaq left LA, while still between the age of 30-35, he played alongside a TOP 5 Shooting Guard of all time, Dewayne Wade. That’s a fact. He won 1 ring. Let’s be clear… Pau Gasol is NOT a top 5 Center of all time. Kobe made 3 consecutive finals appearances and won 2 rings back to back with him. So where does this logic that Kobe rings don’t count with Shaq because he had Shaq come from? But for Shaq he doesn’t get penalized at all for playing with the closest thing to MJ (Kobe). Shaq clearly deserved that finals MVP on the 2000 ring. No doubt. But 2001, and 2002, they could have been Co-MVPs. Shaq wasn’t hitting big time free throws. Kobe was and just to add, a better free throw shooter than MJ. Kobe was a better 3 point shooter than MJ (rather took more cuz the game evolved). Kobe was just as clutch as MJ. Kobe work ethic, fundamentals, and determination to win was on par with MJ. Shaq had his chance to prove himself when he went to the finals with Orlando in 95. He lost. He got there and he lost until he had 2 of the top 5 Shooting guards in the history of the game. This Kobe disrespect gotta stop.
But ultimately Kobe was not Jordan. I agree that he was instrumental in that 3peat. You look at those series vs the Spurs, it was Kobe who was top dog. They don't get to the Finals without Kobe. Where it falls apart for Kobe a little bit was 2011. Right when Kobe was on the cusp of having legitimate debates between him and MJ, they got swept by Dallas. Jordan just didn't get swept in 4 game series and losing with home court advantage as well. And he had 2 All Stars on his team that year. The rest of his career, he was hurt so that can't be held against him
@@SelfResearchedNBAFacts not understanding where you going on here or the point you’re trying to make. It was already addressed (rather I addressed) that Kobe is a number 2 or deserves to be in the conversation for Goat debates. Not outside of it. This isn’t a “who’s number 1” discussion.
You'll never see this given how old this is, but your observation of Lebron is so accurate. He is a shitty inside passer but due to the 3 second rule he can drive to the hole but needs outside shooters to make him successful.
Paule Pierce, Garnett and Ray Allen didn't set a standard. Allen and Garnett were traded to Boston. Trades happen in the NBA all the time, so it was nothing new. Pierce, Garnett and Allen are all Hall of famers. So bringing them together was meaningful. But they were all past their primes as well. LeBron set the standard by creating the first _player generated_ superteam. And LeBron, Wade and Bosh were each in their athletic primes when they joined forces. That was a distinct way of creating an advantage that spat in the face of every precedent that was previously established in the NBA.
This is what some people don't understand is that MJ is the greatest player to play the game regardless of whether he won any titles or not. The titles were the icing on the cake, but before the first title, people were all ready, saying that he was the greatest they have ever witnessed. So LeBron really can't top that no matter what or path he takes to try eclipse Mike.
Playing with no physicality or opposition only a few times in a finals. KD Russel and Harden were pups. Harden was the 6th man. Sad how they did this with Barkley Drexler Kobe Now Bron that means no matter how great Jordan and #2 has carried the NBA since he left. And he gave up against the Warriors. He had a good enough team to go out swinging like in game one. He doesn’t fight to win he’ll rather fight for stats and accept a run away loss. No Boston traded for Allen Garnet. This is 3 guys openly wanting to play together Carmelo was supposed to go with them.
Aye, Mel, do you know what the craziest thing in all of this? Jordan was undefeated against the league, before he was officially in the NBA! Before the college players went to the Olympics, they played against the NBA stars. Bobby Knight coached that team, when Jordan, Mullin and the rest of that college team, played against Magic, Isaiah and others. Jordan was undefeated against them. So, in his rookie season, I believe they wouldn't vote for him to be an all-star or something like that. It was because of the fact that he beat them before he was officially in the league and they held a grudge against him. Bobby Knight knew he was the greatest! Even before he was officially in the league.
Wilt has to be 2nd greatest if he isnt 1st he was the greatest scorer rebounder and shot blocker and people all he did was dunk but actually scored most of his points on fade away shots
Kareem was amazing, productive, and efficient for many years, but he was past his prime. He played a good amount of years with both the Bucks and Lakers before Johnson was drafted. Kareem was drafted in 69, Magic 79. Magic was the number 1A a lot of the years.
@@Mandownsports and this is coming from a legendary coach. As he said earlier, Jordan had solid fundamentals, athleticism, and sheer will to win. (And even if the two got beef, Zeke has said similar things about MJ, too). Jordan is the GOAT. 🐐
Only 2 players have been called God on the court. Hall Of Famer Player Larry Bird said that about Jordan , and Hall Of Famer Coach George Karl said that about Kobe.
@@Mandownsports hell yeah brother, I was born in ‘86 into a family where The Browns always took precedence (the ‘95 move to Baltimore was basically 9/11 on the tragedy scale for my dad haha) but those late 80s early 90s Cavs teams came damn close. And as a little white kid who loved basketball and could shoot lights out but could barely jump over my own shoe lace, Mark Price was THE GOAT as far as I was concerned. And ironically, the fans of “Cleveland’s chosen one” want to rewrite history and act like MJ never beat anybody, even tho he single handedly erased those great Cavs teams from historical memory. I could go on and on but here’s one way I look at it, my dad passed in ‘96 not long after MJ’s “comeback.” If I could hypothetically give him an update on everything that happened since, that Michael Jordan literally ran off another 3 straight championships in his mid 30s with a completely new roster except for Pippen, but that we drafted a guy who is supposedly “better” than Jordan, and played the same number of seasons for the Cavs as MJ did for the Bulls, but the Bulls still have more 3peats than the Cavs do championships, how does that make any sense? I mean, it’s not like LeBron won 4 or 5 championships for the Cavs, and due to other variables wasn’t able to win AS many for the Cavs. But MJ literally won TWO 3peats in 11 season for the struggling franchise that drafted him. Lebron won ONE championship for the struggling franchise that drafted him, and that was AFTER he left and the franchise was able to accumulate 3 first picks in the entire draft…I mean, I spent almost my entire adult life rooting for Lebron and I could write a 15pg thesis on why he’s not even close to MJ, but I think this comment is long enough
![Chris Langan - The Interview THEY Didn't Want You To See - CTMU [Full Version; Timestamps]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/9miVG2xT5jY/mqdefault.jpg)
Bobby Knight deserves some respect. He really has integrity.
Absolutely 💯
He’s the best coach ever. College at least. Nobody knew the game of basketball, its ins & outs, better than Bobby Knight. Nobody.
@@dazdavis7896 Knight really looked up to Pete Newell.
Bro you are so right. I heard him say the same thing. Jordan college years was better than a lot of NBA players today.
Faces
And leclown tries to say his son is "ready" to play for the flakers
He named the criteria for the GOAT and said Jordan was the top in all area's and this was way b4 the 6 rings
Right ✅️
And this is what people who don’t know NBA history don’t get. It’s actually because of Jordan though not his fault. Rings culture didn’t become a thing until after Jordan because it was an easy way to capture his greatness. I actually don’t like when people just refer to his rings because it shortchanges his greatness as a player. The rings are the icing on the cake. Remember he retired after “only” 3 rings because he felt he had nothing else to prove. Despite the fact that Bird also had 3 and Magic 5. But he was already considered GOAT by that point. When he came back and won 3 more that just further solidified it.
@@Ues2DC I completely agree 💯
@@Ues2DCI agree 10000% my guy
@jayp576 - It was also before LeBron.
Good discussion.🙂 You're right. Bird, Magic, MJ and Kobe took the harder path to earn their championships.
I saw when Jordan played his first Olympic tournaments . It was team USA against the NBA super Stars and Jordan put on a show and swept the NBA. He hadn't even played his first game in the NBA.
Just think about that. MJ led college player to dominate, not FIBA or another Country's best team, but the best NBA players in the world, even before he was a rookie in the NBA. Lebron couldnt even win gold without Kobe against lesser competition.
How is Lebron even remotely close to Kobe, Birdd, Magic, Kareem, Wilt, Oscar, Olajuwan, Curry etc, much less Russell & MJ?
Stats? Superteaming for all your easy, league aided chips? Having poor basketball fundamentals? Lebron is not on the planet with the actual top echelon greats...
@@snakebitten6967 your right
this is the reason why i said if mj had a team to compete in the 80's he would have won a chip in the 80's
In one of those games, MJ took a horrible shot to the face. I think it was from Mike Dunleavy, and MJ took it like it was nothing. If a player in today's NBA got hit like that, they would still be rolling on the floor
FACTS! Magic Johnson said they couldnt do anything with Jordan.
MJ was so competitive, he said in an interview that his biggest regret was not being able to play until someone knocked him off his throne. He wanted to go out on his shield.
Bobby Knight is a top 5 coach and maybe the most respected ever. He was a basketball genius and understood the game on a advance level
Phil never coached any team to a NBA title until MJ. MJ dominated NBA all-star talent even before he put on a NBA jersey
Where was Phil Jackson head coaching job in the NBA before the Bulls job?
Dude, Jordan the college kid dominated the NBA legends, 8 in a row, no loss...
Lebron: most playoff loses all-time ✔, most committed turnovers all-time ✔, most shots taken all-time (but he's pass 1st?) ✔, most missed shots all-time ✔, only player to be Swept in 3 finals series ✔ 7th worst +/- in NBA finals history -86 ✔ 2nd worst NBA finals record all-time 4-6 ✔ that's not a top 5 player all-time
CONT: most flops all time (?) Debatable , but he in there.
#1 ring chaser of all time
#1 team wrecker for 1 who is considered great.
Biggest crybaby of ALL TIME.
there are more stats, that he may be in the running for plz feel free to list below.
👇🏿
Solid points. 👍🏾
😂😂😂
HIT THE LIKE BUTTON PEOPLE!! This is one of the BEST channels out there. Professional setup, call ins, nice breakdowns, etc. Keep up the good work! MJ=🐐
Thank you bro!
@@Mandownsports much respect! 🏀
That comment MR.knight made is one of the comments that’s killing Isiah Thomas today as well!!! That was Thomas college coach.
Right! I thought of that too lol
All facts...because deep down he knows Knight would have loved to have Mike on those Hooser squads over Thomas.
For all of you that magically forgot who Kobe Bryant was just watch the 2007 State Farm USA Basketball game.
Or just pay attention to the final 2 minutes where close games are won. Pay attention to what the announcers say. If you don’t watch then I’ll give you the summary. They said and I quote:
“… there was a sense and energy from all the players out there, they knew who the BEST PLAYER ON THE PLANET was… Now you come to close the game and what’s your first option? What’s your only option? And what’s the end result? Kobe Bryant with the lead…”
Kobe hit the game winner and out performed Bron. Bron missed the shot to win the game. And Kobe showed up to the finals in 2008, 09, and 10. Lebron didn’t.
Stop the disrespect
LeBron couldn't hold kobes jock. Kobe beat 4 50 win teams in one playoff run, MJ didn't beat but maybe one , took him 9 years of playoffs to beat 4. Kobe faced way way more stiff competition than MJ. But Kobe wouldn't exist without MJ. Can't compare them . MJ the goat. But Kobe is as good. LeBron isn't near either of them
Celtics only had 29 wins before Bird got there. They improved to 61 wins with Bird. Not sure how that’s a “ready to go” team. Bird was different
McChalw and Parrish came like a year apart
I love Bird and I consider Bird the goat SF but I believe many of his teammates in his rookie season were injured the prior year hence the 29 Win season the year prior to Bird’s arrival.
@@Josh-sk5xd I don’t know about that one, seeing as the year before that 29 win season they only won 32 games. The Celtics were on a downward spiral until Larry Legend showed up and not only got the Celtics back to their winning ways but was the catalyst and main cog that culminated in the form of the ‘86 Celtics who were one of the greatest teams of all time. In a team sport, that’s an accolade any player in the goat conversation must have,
@@verbalkint3447 Remember Birds rookie year he had a healthy Tiny Archibald that was recovering from injury the prior year
Again, no knock on Bird to me he’s the Goat SF and most definitely impacted the Celtics his rookie season.
@@verbalkint3447 Tiny, Bob MaCadoo, Cowens etc all missed 20+ games that season prior to Bird’s arrival.
To those Wilt and Kareem lovers, there's no disrespect to them as greats in basketball history. However, being the GOAT is not just about stats... It's about impact on the game of basketball itself on top of the person's skills and performance.
When you judge the entire package, no player in the history of the game compares to MJ. He took basketball to a worldwide status, along with a style and personality that was electrifying and mesmerizing to people, on top of his elite athleticism and incomparable abilities on the court. He would have crowds of people and kids following him wherever he went. Entire families from everywhere, not just Chicago, would stop what they were doing when the bulls were playing.
MJ transcended basketball and created an entire brand of the sport. He inspired nearly ALL of the current NBA stars....
That is what it means to be GOAT...
I agree with a lot of what your saying. I grew up right around the corner from where Bill Russell used to live in Massachusetts. That man went threw hell from getting windows broken, burning crosses on his lawn etc. With the racial climate the way that it was Wilt & Bill didn't have the same opportunities MJ had. Remember at one point those black athletes couldn't sleep in the same hotels, or even enter the same restaurants as there white teammates. It was a different world back then compared to when MJ entered the league.
They are all better than lebron.
Damn you could off keep it shorter, but it true and the fanboys can go and ask Jason terry how he school Le flop in the finals 😂😂😂😂
Respect your opinion but can you imagine wat they would be saying if Wilt was playing today? He was 7’2 athletic version of jirdan but stronger n faster ??? People look at the 60-70’s n talk down on that era ? You give wilt todays technology training shoes therapy etc? 🤦🏻♂️wilt had a 50inch vertical jump ? Wilt could bench press 600 pounds wilt ran the 100 in 10.5 seconds ? Ran the high hurdles shot out long jump I mean he was BO JACKSON before Bo unfortunately he was in the 60’s today he would destroy the entire league GIANIS JOKER EMBID would get demolished n the rest of the league would be getting 50 -25 rbs n 6 blks a night
@@blackeddie154 COME ON DUDE. WILT WAS A CETER CLOSEST TO THE BASKET , AT 7 FEET. WAT U EXPECT HUH STEUPSSSS 🤔 WAS HE MESMERIZING? WAS HE SPECTACULAR?, DID HE LEFT U IN AWE? , WIT HIS MOVES OR SKILLS, SHOOTING ABILTY?LIKE THE ONE AND ONLY, HUH,? U NO WHO AM TALKING ABOUT OK GEE. ITS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE, MIC DROP
When you mentioned the top players of that era you forgot Duncan.
Right, I totally forgot Duncan. He is definitely at the top
If you don't have a 3-peat on your resume no discussion for the goat debate. #8#24
Interesting point.😎
🗣️INTERESTING POINT . BUT , I DISAGREE . KOBE HAD SHAQ AS THEE # 1 .KOBE DIDN ' T COME INTO THE LEAGUE HITTING THE GROUND RUNNING . KOBE CAME OFF THE BENCH HIS FIRST 2 PLUS YRS. KOBE. NEVER SHOT 50 % FOR ONE SEASON . KOBE ' S SHOT SELECTION AND DECISION MAKING ISN ' T GREAT . ESPN D🚫ESN ' T EVEN HAVE KOBE IN THE TOP 10 ALL TIME . BUT , I D🟢 . Y👤U AND 👤THERS KEEP OVERRATING KOBE . KOBE CAN ' T BE IN THE G.🐐.A.T. DEBATE . SHAQ HAS A 3 PEAT. BUT, PE👤PLE D 🚫 N ' T PUT SHAQ IN THE G.🐐.A.T. DEBATE .>🎤 🏀🗑️
Shaq, George Mikan, and Bill Russell higher in the Goat debate over scrubs like LBJ, Magic, Bird, and Kareem. Prove me wrong. They got 3 peats, and those other losers only ever managed Back to Back titles. There are levels to this, and those bums aren't on the same one as my boy George Mikan!
@danielgloyd4529 you're delusional except I will agree that LBJ is a scrub compared to Kobe and MJ
I seen one of Wilt Chamberlain stat lines dude records are untouchable! 53 points 34 rebounds 11 blocks 10 steals and 14 assist! Those video games numbers but Air Jordan the Goat! Sports Fitness and Rants is a great channel as well..! Appreciate it your knowledge brother you know your history if you don’t know what you’re talking about real basketball fans can tell right away! God bless brother!
Damn good video ManDown. Even though they say Kobe is a carbon copy of Mike, I still have em at 7. Top 10. MJ, Wilt, Kareem, Magic, Bird, Duncan, Kobe, Hakeem, Shaq, Russell.
That's a good list
@@Mandownsports appreciate it....& it ain't budging. So that means these new players are playing for the 15 spot & down.
Great list. I only disagree with Shaq. I would place Karl Malone.
@@SD80 quick question....so you'd take Malone over Shaq for your team? Because as great as Malone is....I'd take Duncan & Barkley over him.
@@crharper25 Again I like your team. All good selections except for Shaq.
I would take Malone over Shaq. Better free throw shooter, great defender, runs the floor, passes exceptional for a PF. Probably one of the first stretch 4’s
Duncan and Barkley all stay no question.
Jordan is the Goat. 🐐
Kobe is the Junior Goat!
LeBron, not even close.
What doesn't get talked about enough is Jordan's motor. He would often finish games with the same effectiveness he would start games with.
On the 1992 Dream Team, the greatest basketball players in the world like Magic, marveled at Jordan's ability to stay up for days on end with
very little or no sleep, and still go out and dominate on the court the same day. There were some uncanny stories about MJ that indicates that he
was probably a superhuman type athlete like Wilt, as opposed to just being a supremely talented athlete who worked hard (Kobe).
As much as I agree with Bobby Knight, the Lebron fanboys won't accept that because they're Gen Z and you know what they say regarding this generation, doesn't respect the past and history and today is the greatest generation ever according to them and they'll never accept that someone was infinitely better than their chosen one.
I accept what Mr. Knight said because it's rooted on facts and he gave his criteria on why he choose MJ as his GOAT and his criteria makes sense. He knew it, I knew it, we knew it but the Lebron fanboys will forever be living in their deluded fantasy.
I think the quote that was inscribed in MJ'S statue fully encapsulated the feeling of most basketball fans that consider him the GOAT.
"THE BEST THERE EVER WAS. THE BEST THERE EVER WILL BE. - Michael Jordan.
I just look at LeBron like I do Wilt and Shaq. All were great physically but ultimately underwhelmed for the hype. They all NEEDED top level help to actually win, and had lucky things to happen along the way like a teammate hitting a big shot or a key injured opponent. And they all team hopped after a situation wasn't working out. And there was someone better at their relative position during their era.
Wilt it was Russell
Shaq it was Hakeem & Duncan
Lebron it was Kobe
This may be the best analogy I’ve read yet! Good stuff 🙌🏻🙌🏻
@Ephilly-rz2pb just tired of the LeBron is the GOAT or even #2 bullshit. He's back end top 10 with Wilt and Shaq isn't even in my top 10. These 3 guys had multiple, major flaws and I got tons of research to back it up.
Wilt Chamberlain for example has ridiculous video game numbers but only for about 8 seasons. When people say he is the GOAT, I ask to explain because he had HOF teammates his whole career. He blew 3-1 and 3-2 leads and Russell owned him. I always hear that Russell had better teammates. But if you think Wilt is the greatest of all time, then he should've been the difference to win.
His scoring went down in all 14 of his seasons from regular season to playoffs. Thats the GOAT? I got similar arguments for Shaq and LeBron
@@SelfResearchedNBAFacts I’m with ya for sure! I honestly would take a prime bird or magic over bron..sheesh I would def take Kobe, Duncan and Kareem over bron. Mikes the goat and it’s never been a debate for me
Bro, you have some of the best analysis and breakdowns on takes of basketball topics, peace!!!!
Thanks bro
Vince Carter had a 43"vertical Michael Jordan 48
It was whole bunch of DOPE 90s point gaurds
It really is
I could see L.J. at the end of Coach Knight's bench in Olympics.
Allen Iverson would be A terror on the court
To me im taking jordan kobe and iverson over everyone they are the ultimate competitors
We know lebroom not competitive he wants it easy as possible...lebum always looking for a SHORT-CUT like stacking his teams or guarding the weak link and passing the ball to someone else to take the last shot...lebum will see a good match ups on his schedule and will sit out n load manage...he is the worst in the nba pathetic
I think of centers like Wilt, Kareem and Shaq as being the most “dominant” players of their eras. I think the greatest “basketball player” of all time has to be a ball handler first. If you don’t have elite ball handling skills it should disqualify you from GOAT convos.
Of course, I agree
Gretzky was the best player in his respective sport. MJ would have scored 80 pts game to close
Thank you! I really think many of these Lebron fans have never been real ballers. They don't understand owning the court with the five you came there with or the five you chose when you got there and you keep running win or lose with the same team. I say they are part of the microwave generation. They want it fast and can eat something different everyday, instead of being a part of the home cooking generation. You had to wait for the meal to finish cooking, the meal took time to be ready, it was good, and you could eat leftovers of that same meal for a few days. You stay with your team and build them up, just like you eat a well prepared meal, and feast off of that meal until it's gone. And because Lebron did it by joining teams and without going against the best they have to call the players from previous generations plumbers, unathletic, unskilled, and have to say the competition wasn't as good. And anyone who watches the games can see the skill and athleticism was just as good,if not better.
Great analogy!
This is one od tbe reasons that Isaiah Thomas has animosity towards MJ, his college coach acknowledged that MJ was that dude and Zeke couldn't and still can't handle that fact and it must hurt to his core!
I’m glad you said he never competed against Wade. Wade already had a championship! And he knew Wade was an obstacle in the way for him to get a championship.So let’s join forces. Cutting corners.
I'm listening to this while watching the finals! This is one of your best shows to me.
Ah man, that's dope! Thanks man. I'm watching when we did our post game after the Mavs advanced to the finals to remember what we said about the finals matchup
@@Mandownsports I rarely listen to the game, because the commentary is usually trash. However, when there's shows like yours. It actually makes the game more exciting!
@@itznotdatserious99 my dawg 💪 💯
No one has dominated both ends of the court more than wilt chamberlain if we take the team award which is a championship out it's not even close Wilt is the greatest individual player ever
Great show
He is Absolutely Right on point 👌🏽👌🏽👌🏽 MJ 💯🐐
I don't even think it's fair to compare Boston 3 to Miami 3.. A) the celtics put that team together, & B) kg, pp, & ra were getting past their prime.
C) dwade, LeBron & Bosh were in their prime, & two top players, were taken from franchises in the already weak east.
Then they got ray Allen on top of it. When LeBron says "not 6, not 7." He meant it, with a smile on his face.
It's why I find it disgusting kobe gets so dismissed for winning on the team he was basically drafted on, while LeBron tampers to create a super team in order to avoid any serious competition. You could argue, he stacked the deck so far, nobody wanted to play in the east because he made it so uncompetitive. So kobe played in the toughest western conference, with what he was given. While LeBron stacked the deck & turned the weak east even weaker. It's no surprise kobe had a winning finals record for being molded in the fire of thewest, while LeBron has a losing, he never had to go up against the best every year and had to really overcome the competition. This is why over popular belief, I have kobe above lebron.
😮 VC and all the UNC GUYS I like but Vince had a 35" vertical and MJ has a 48" best all time.. VC more creative but MJ best lay package.. he also did it on both ends.. 4.3 40yrd also,..hang time
And Bobby Knight said this before Jordan had any rings. The coaches and players of the past werent really ring junkies like how the culture is now.
💯! All FACTS Mel!!
Btw that’s how I compare those players.
I can compare MJ to Bird, Magic, Zeke, Kobe, Duncan because they did it the hard way, the authentic way.
I can only compare Lebron with KD because both went the easy route and when I compare the two, KD comes out on top since KD dusted Lebron when it was even Steven.
Even with Curry, Curry was able to do it the authentic way in 2015 & 2022! He got cheated out of another authentic ring in 2016 smh.
Great point!
❤Love your shows😊
Salute homie 🫡
Bro I have to tell you something, you have one of the best sports show period. Some of these analyst and ex players are trying to feed us B.S. This all started with LBJ
I appreciate that alot bro. And you're right, the mainstream is definitely feeding us BS
Jordan had a 48-inch vertical leap compared to Carter's 43-inch leap. Vince averaged 16.7 points his career. How you equate him in any way to MJ is mind-boggling. In fact, how can anyone match six chips, six FMVPs, and zero finals' losses?
All of these inferences to Jordan are beyond asinine, and that includes Kobe, who stunk up the 2004 finals. I have to believe MJ laughs at all of these narratives.
Perfect analysis, my dude!!! Love the show with you alone or a panel...
Thanks bro
Bobby Knight passed away in November 2023.
Thanks
I agree with you about the way it was done. I hope it goes back to that
Man Down , My brother another fantastic breakdown video on how to compare MJ to everyone else! Nobody has ever or will ever play like Mike because nobody will ever have all the dominant player needs to be great! Love your work and love your smartness in the world of the NBA keep it up brother. Mad respect for you!
Chris Klatter
My dawg, 🫡 salute. Thanks for the comment
@man down sports I really liked the way you broke this down. It truly shows a methodical breakdown of a lot of aspects normal fans don't truly understand in the goat debate. I love the new age vs tradition comparison. The old skewl way was to maybe bring in a slightly stronger role play, not replace a role player with a known dominate sf,c, or pf.
I try to make some sense of this thing
@@Mandownsports and i hate the longevity argument being even considered as an aspect of the goat debate. I've said it before thats like stating that pete rose .303 batting avg. is the hit king when he out hit ty cobbs (.366 batting avg) when he played almost 530 more games. Who's really the hit king. Ty Cobbs, for sure. like in the same span of 1072 games MJ's point total was 32,292, and Lebron's was only 29,413 in the same amount of games. Plus the misdirected, lol stat that lebron incorporated more teammates might just conclude to the fact he was intimidated to take the shot in the hot seat, where we all know MJ thrived and always wanted to take the shots that would decide the outcome of the game
@@bmanconstable4010 that's a very great example!
You can throw Stephen Curry in the same class as Jordan. Kobe, Magic. Bird and Thomas as for being a number 1, continuing that same standard.
No
@@Mandownsports I mean why not? He been with the franchises entire career through the ups and downs until they drafted and put pieces around him to make it work and they were very successful. Even though they won two rings with KD joining him, he still won two without him.
Kept waiting for you to mention Duncan. Enjoyed your take.
Ahhhh yeah, I definitely forgot to mention Duncan. That was a mistake for sure
And that’s what sets Lebron and mj and Kobe apart. I feel like Lebron is the privileged one. He doesn’t have that hunger to beat his opps, he becomes part of the opps.
Absolutely
Small criticism, I love your stuff and agree with all your general ideas. “The one percent doesn’t need to work on those skills” I just add they don’t need to work on those skills to skate by to a certain level. Those freak athletes fall into a trap by skating by and then hitting a ceiling. Developing the fundamentals is what would raise that ceiling. It’s often pretty unfortunate.
I agree 100%
I don't understand why everyone focuses on individual characteristics and stats. Jordan wasn't the "best" at many individual things or in stat categories. But as the ultimate athlete, the ultimate basketball player, when you put Jordan's characteristic together, in ONE package, ALL his characteristics worked together to make the GOAT. Period. Enough discussion about this. Jordan is the best that has ever been and will ever be. Today's ballers have it easier, they don't face qualified opposition so the game is by its nature, easier. In order to do your flashy moves, you're allowed to travel, carry, foul, and do things that players in the past COULD NOT DO. Today's stats are not legit. They just are not. I don't believe you could put today's player into the 90's and they would succeed. They would have to adjust their game and give up some of their "fancy" moves, or risked getting called on it. Once you give up the "extra" things you can do with the ball and have to play by the rules of basketball, your hands are tied and you play the game within the rules. Every modern player's stats, except Kobe, would drop. Fact.
He was the GSD of basketball players. Not great at just one thing. But really good at everything.
“There’s a lot of gold dust sprinkled on that guy, MJ” keep spitting gems! Most professionally produced show, takes built on sound logic and facts, great for casuals and ballers alike - keep going
Thanks bro, that's a pretty dope compliment
Thank you for shouting out Rod Strickland (my favorite player of all time) I don't think people understand how great that man was
Rod is my favorite as well. I modeled my game after him
This era was created to fabricate superstars.
Great way to put it
Vince Carter isn't more athletic than Mike. Vince could jump but he didn't have Mike's ups or hang time.
I agree. Just trying to make a point. Who was more athletic wasn't that important
The problem with counting championships is that everyone of them have the same face value but the competitors aren't the same every year, that's why in order to understand who's the best you gotta see them play and evaluate.
In what way are the current players are so skilled offensively? There is practically no defence in NBA today!
Jordan had zero weaknesses. Every single year he came back better stronger smarter faster tougher . Offensively he was PICASSO on defense he was a pitbull . Mentally ? Didn’t accept losing
I love how Kobe is the last and everyone mysteriously leaves out Duncan who had a better total career and is the greatest at his position all time when Kobe was not. Great content although you should have made a mention Detroit did not bow out gracefully but you made the point it was Chicagos turn.
Yeah we 4get Duncan far too often. And you're right, the Pistons didn't bow out gracefully in the moment but at least Isaiah didn't go join Bird in Boston to make sure MJ didn't keep winning. He knew the Pistons run wqs over and he took it on the chin.
❤ Dam you broke it down bruh
Yes sir
The league should retire the number 23 #jordan
You know how much ball this Man has seen? This is some super high praise coming from Bon Knight. Serious cosign
I agree
Why do you think Isiah Thomas is so salty?
It's his only way to punch back at a guy that he feels hurt him.
Zeek is a Native Chicagoan....but Mike gets more love from the city than he does.
This statement made Zeke really upset. Lol!😂
Correction! when bird was drafted Boston was last place,....they went from worse to first that first year
Great!
Championships are won by team's no one player has ever won a championship so how can we say Championships determines the greatest player ever
Because thata the only reason they play the game. If they played for stats then I would use stats
I'm a jordan guy but I have to recognize the greats regardless of era but I understand why mj is the goat his performances when it matters is unmatched to me but Boston had a super duper team so I really don't hold not winning against Mr Chamberlain I don't Kno if a player has had so much stacked against him as far as his opponents and it's not about the stats it's more about how dominant he was on both ends of the court you have a great show I like watching you guys are always on point
The Bulls fired Doug Collins and moved up rookie coach Phil Jackson and MJ and he won together..
True
Lebron is proof you cant just cherry pick your way to a championship, might work once in while but he's 4 and 10.
Right ✅️
MJ had the best footwork, the best mid range game ever for a shooting guy. Number 2 is Kobe because he studied Mike!
Great commentary.
Lebron did what he did because he did not have the skill or talent to do what the previous greats or some current/future greats are doing. He was the deficiency because his ego stopped him from learning the fundamentals of winning basketball.
My personal belief is that LeBron saw and studied what MJ did during those we games MJ played point guard under Doug Collins. MJ’s numbers for those 24 games were better than most if not Lebrons whole career of playing point. Lebron saw the stats MJ generated during those 24 games and made his mind up to make a career doing that to get easy goat status through stats that’s why he never learned to play off ball and insists on playing facilitator everywhere he goes.
MJ, zkobe, Olajuwan, Duncan, Bird etc didn’t need players around that filled in for their deficiencies, like Lebron and his system does. So Lebron could never replicate what the actual top greats did because he did not have the skill, the mentality of a winner, nor the necessary humility to be taught, nor the modesty to know what he needed to work on. He is an “aided” athlete, allegedly lol, so that disqualifies him right off. The clumsy movement due to horrible footwork, lack of basic fundamentals are egregious. He doesn’t have the skill to be top 20 much less top 10. Without the media he would be behind so many players in the top 75.
You speaking so many facts
Well said and straight FACTS! I Couldn’t have said it better! Salute!
This is why I don’t have Lebron in my top 40! His whole career has been completely manufactured & unauthentic.
@@Josh-sk5xd top 40! Lol 😆 🤣
@@Mandownsports I’m not even trolling bro lolz
I can’t put that dude above even Karl Malone. Lebron has too many holes and weaknesses in his game and he lacks the intangibles among other things.
Without the media & Refs/League & him cheating by colluding with Superteams Lebron has ZERO rings etc etc
We know dude is on the juice as well and is cheating in that regard also so in my eyes he’s disqualified from even being in the top 40. Once it becomes official that he’s juicing he’s out my top 75. Really deep inside myself I already have him out of the top 75 for just that reason alone.
@@Josh-sk5xd 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
KOBE was actually drafted by the Charlotte Hornets then traded
If you are the best at a sport you are called the MJ of that sport
When you are solo, you have the best channel outside of Old Angry Hoops.
Love your content and takes.
Phenomenal is also up there! Thanks for stating facts.
Lefraud James?
Nah.
Thanks bro
Bobby Knight crushed Isiah! Isiah won him a National Championship! Crushing to say MJ was the greatest player he had ever seen!
If you asked Isiah Thomas about anything Coach said about another player, other than M.J. ,he would give glowing amens to Coach.
Tim Duncan is the best out of all of them in this era.
The way knight be talking about Jordan have Isiah punching the air having nightmares 😆
Main reason why Kobe is number 2 or up there as far as the GOAT:
People want to discredit Kobe rings with Shaq but that makes no sense. For years and to this day it was a consensus that Kobe was the closest thing to MJ we’ve ever seen. That comparison was established when Kobe was still in high school.
So the most Dominant center in NBA history got to play alongside the closest thing to the GOAT (consensus is MJ) and 3-peats with Coach Phil Jackson. So how does that only discredit Kobe’s rings and not Shaq’s??
Next point…
When Shaq left LA, while still between the age of 30-35, he played alongside a TOP 5 Shooting Guard of all time, Dewayne Wade. That’s a fact. He won 1 ring.
Let’s be clear… Pau Gasol is NOT a top 5 Center of all time. Kobe made 3 consecutive finals appearances and won 2 rings back to back with him.
So where does this logic that Kobe rings don’t count with Shaq because he had Shaq come from? But for Shaq he doesn’t get penalized at all for playing with the closest thing to MJ (Kobe).
Shaq clearly deserved that finals MVP on the 2000 ring. No doubt. But 2001, and 2002, they could have been Co-MVPs.
Shaq wasn’t hitting big time free throws. Kobe was and just to add, a better free throw shooter than MJ. Kobe was a better 3 point shooter than MJ (rather took more cuz the game evolved). Kobe was just as clutch as MJ. Kobe work ethic, fundamentals, and determination to win was on par with MJ.
Shaq had his chance to prove himself when he went to the finals with Orlando in 95. He lost. He got there and he lost until he had 2 of the top 5 Shooting guards in the history of the game.
This Kobe disrespect gotta stop.
All facts
@@Mandownsports I know bro. The disrespect is crazy. I appreciate you keeping it real.
@@StCropper for sure. Appreciate the support
But ultimately Kobe was not Jordan. I agree that he was instrumental in that 3peat. You look at those series vs the Spurs, it was Kobe who was top dog. They don't get to the Finals without Kobe. Where it falls apart for Kobe a little bit was 2011. Right when Kobe was on the cusp of having legitimate debates between him and MJ, they got swept by Dallas. Jordan just didn't get swept in 4 game series and losing with home court advantage as well. And he had 2 All Stars on his team that year. The rest of his career, he was hurt so that can't be held against him
@@SelfResearchedNBAFacts not understanding where you going on here or the point you’re trying to make. It was already addressed (rather I addressed) that Kobe is a number 2 or deserves to be in the conversation for Goat debates. Not outside of it. This isn’t a “who’s number 1” discussion.
Mj had a higher vertical leap 48 inches Vince was 43 inches
You'll never see this given how old this is, but your observation of Lebron is so accurate. He is a shitty inside passer but due to the 3 second rule he can drive to the hole but needs outside shooters to make him successful.
Facts
Wonder what Zeke has to say, bet he won't call Bob Knight a lie.
Larry Jordan is the goat, and Johnny Kilroy is number 2. 🙏🏾
Paule Pierce, Garnett and Ray Allen didn't set a standard. Allen and Garnett were traded to Boston. Trades happen in the NBA all the time, so it was
nothing new. Pierce, Garnett and Allen are all Hall of famers. So bringing them together was meaningful. But they were all past their primes as well.
LeBron set the standard by creating the first _player generated_ superteam. And LeBron, Wade and Bosh were each in their athletic primes when they
joined forces. That was a distinct way of creating an advantage that spat in the face of every precedent that was previously established in the NBA.
The Boston BIG3 definitely set a standard of having 3 prime superstars.
Did you mean Miam Big 3? Boston's big 3 were past their primes (all over 30),@@Mandownsports
Michael Jordan and Darrell Griffith own the record of vertical leap in NBA history at 48 inches. Vince Carter's vertical leap was less!
This is what some people don't understand is that MJ is the greatest player to play the game regardless of whether he won any titles or not. The titles were the icing on the cake, but before the first title, people were all ready, saying that he was the greatest they have ever witnessed. So LeBron really can't top that no matter what or path he takes to try eclipse Mike.
How many ppl that MATTERS do u have to get to say and keep saying its Mike smfh..F lebum lovers they kno not what they say or do😂😂
Playing with no physicality or opposition only a few times in a finals. KD Russel and Harden were pups. Harden was the 6th man. Sad how they did this with Barkley Drexler Kobe Now Bron that means no matter how great Jordan and #2 has carried the NBA since he left. And he gave up against the Warriors. He had a good enough team to go out swinging like in game one. He doesn’t fight to win he’ll rather fight for stats and accept a run away loss. No Boston traded for Allen Garnet. This is 3 guys openly wanting to play together Carmelo was supposed to go with them.
Aye, Mel, do you know what the craziest thing in all of this? Jordan was undefeated against the league, before he was officially in the NBA! Before the college players went to the Olympics, they played against the NBA stars. Bobby Knight coached that team, when Jordan, Mullin and the rest of that college team, played against Magic, Isaiah and others. Jordan was undefeated against them. So, in his rookie season, I believe they wouldn't vote for him to be an all-star or something like that. It was because of the fact that he beat them before he was officially in the league and they held a grudge against him. Bobby Knight knew he was the greatest! Even before he was officially in the league.
Yikes!
@Mandownsports Bobby Knight knew what he was talking about! Again, man this was a great segment by you!
Wilt has to be 2nd greatest if he isnt 1st he was the greatest scorer rebounder and shot blocker and people all he did was dunk but actually scored most of his points on fade away shots
Kareem was amazing, productive, and efficient for many years, but he was past his prime. He played a good amount of years with both the Bucks and Lakers before Johnson was drafted. Kareem was drafted in 69, Magic 79. Magic was the number 1A a lot of the years.
Fun fact. MJ had a 48" vert. Vince Carter had a 43" vert.
MJ could also run a 4.38 40. He was just built differently.
10:50. “No-no, no-no, the best guy that ever played the game is Michael Jordan. Don’t even think about anybody else. Not even close.”
-Bobby Knight
@@derrrick7759 he wasn't lying either
@@Mandownsports and this is coming from a legendary coach. As he said earlier, Jordan had solid fundamentals, athleticism, and sheer will to win. (And even if the two got beef, Zeke has said similar things about MJ, too). Jordan is the GOAT. 🐐
Kobe was tired of wanting it more than shaq, shaq became lazy
That's true
Only 2 players have been called God on the court. Hall Of Famer Player Larry Bird said that about Jordan , and Hall Of Famer Coach George Karl said that about Kobe.
Facts
This is a great video. I luv your depth in the sport of basketball
Thanks
Dooood, shout out to Mark Price!
Always shout out to Mark Price! People just don't understand how great he was. I hate he had knee injuries
@@Mandownsports hell yeah brother, I was born in ‘86 into a family where The Browns always took precedence (the ‘95 move to Baltimore was basically 9/11 on the tragedy scale for my dad haha) but those late 80s early 90s Cavs teams came damn close. And as a little white kid who loved basketball and could shoot lights out but could barely jump over my own shoe lace, Mark Price was THE GOAT as far as I was concerned. And ironically, the fans of “Cleveland’s chosen one” want to rewrite history and act like MJ never beat anybody, even tho he single handedly erased those great Cavs teams from historical memory. I could go on and on but here’s one way I look at it, my dad passed in ‘96 not long after MJ’s “comeback.” If I could hypothetically give him an update on everything that happened since, that Michael Jordan literally ran off another 3 straight championships in his mid 30s with a completely new roster except for Pippen, but that we drafted a guy who is supposedly “better” than Jordan, and played the same number of seasons for the Cavs as MJ did for the Bulls, but the Bulls still have more 3peats than the Cavs do championships, how does that make any sense? I mean, it’s not like LeBron won 4 or 5 championships for the Cavs, and due to other variables wasn’t able to win AS many for the Cavs. But MJ literally won TWO 3peats in 11 season for the struggling franchise that drafted him. Lebron won ONE championship for the struggling franchise that drafted him, and that was AFTER he left and the franchise was able to accumulate 3 first picks in the entire draft…I mean, I spent almost my entire adult life rooting for Lebron and I could write a 15pg thesis on why he’s not even close to MJ, but I think this comment is long enough