Personally, as an average golfer, day job, family, etc etc, I am getting quite annoyed with all this PGA Tour v LiV shit. Millionaires bitching against Millionaires, whilst the top courses in the world are charging me £400+ for a green fee. How is all this helping me? Rahm growing the game? How? He gets 459 million quid and Pebble Beach now wants 650 dollars for one round. How is the average golfer benefitting from this?
Zero benefit.....the average golfer is getting hammered financially, whether it be club membership, green fees, equipment or a bucket of balls at the driving range.
@VG32123 totally agree mate. Someone down the line has to pay for Jon Rahms fee, and 20 million so ian Poulter can hack around like a 6 handicap. Who pays? We do. Like you said, higher fees, unaffordable green fees
Personally, as a latinamerican, I'm very exited too see LIV Golf grow the game and play tournaments around the world (Asia, Australia, and hopefully South America in the future). USA and Europe have had a monopoly of almoust all the golf events for too long. Vamos equipo Torque!!
I'm a Stingers supporter merely for the fact that they are South African players . I always look for their names first. I always want them to win the team comp. Exactly the same as you guys supporting Man u or Liverpool. I'm proud of the South African players and Stingers GC. That's why I love LIV
Hopefully Rick & Guy will soon understand that LIV golf is not aimed at their generation of golf fan. It is aimed at the next generation of golfers and supporters. And it also gives supporters outside of the US & Europe a chance to see world class golfers up close. Current PGA champions don’t come to Australia to play but LIV golfers do.
100% correct....Oz used to have a big summer golf tour, but the PGAT killed that...LIV will own golf fans outside the US....LIV Adelaide sold out in a day....its now a big EVENT
I love this podcast, but I think this is definitely their biggest miss. LIV is going for the NEXT generation, not necessarily THIS generation; if kids grow up watching it as a team sport more often, that view will literally change in one generation. Give it 8-10 years and no one will think twice about a team-based golf league.
There's already been tours all over the world these selfish pigs are just in it for themselves imagine if nicklaus palmer and player did this in the 60s golf would be nonexistent
Well, three of the Majors are IN the U.S....and the other is run by the R&A Club. The Players is PGA. The FEDEX cup is PGA...all American. Then you have other tournaments around the world. That's not changing. The PGA will provide all the competitive golf, and they can then retire with LIV...I guess. And why not? I think Rham would have taken that money to retire even.
@@mossbergshockwave623 - Fair comment but i will correct you there ... Let’s be reminded that GOLF greats like Jack Nicklaus, Gary Player, Arnold Palmer, Lee Trevino and their other mates who way back then played tournaments under the PGA of America (founded in 1916) in 1960 began the process of breaking away and in 1975 the organization they created achieved full independence from the PGA of America and was named the "PGA Tour." The coming of LIV Golf is no different … In reality PGA tour is a SUNSET tour. Changing of the Guards !!
I think at 10 minutes in you hit a really big point that resonates especially with me as an Aussie, with LIV we get to see some of the best golfers in the world (and some past big name players, albeit past their prime) teeing it up all around the world, even on some people’s home courses. For far too long the PGA has had a stranglehold on the world’s best players, hosting most events (and 3 of the majors) in the US. It is great to see the LIV events played around the globe, just like the greats of yesteryear used to. When I was young the world’s best used to play in Australia in our summer, but now with the year round demands of the PGA we only get that chance when we host the Presidents cup. I love the USPGA and the DP tour, but I now enjoy LIV as well. I don’t see why people feel the need to choose sides.
Guy, a serious question for you: Does it "mean" more to win the PGA's John Deer Classic than the LIV JCB event? Which one will you watch? Aside from The Major Championships, all professional golf tournaments are essentially exhibitions that don't really "mean" anything. We watch them to be entertained on a Sunday afternoon.
@@J_B17you can watch an entire round on like 4hrs instead of 12-14hrs, all to the top players at LIV play in every event whereas you can turn on a pga tour event and honestly not recognize a single name on the leader board and hence not care, and with a shotgun start every player is playing in the same weather conditions (how many rounds have you seen decided by having no wind in a morning session then blowing a gale for the later tee times).
For those asking how LIV is growing the game, have a look at the LIV promotion tournament in Abu Dhabi. Players from Thailand, Australia, Chile, Bermuda, France, South Africa, China, Japan, Paraguay, Singapore, Italy, England, Argentina, New Zealand NOT just the US. It is growing the game whether you want to believe it or not.
That's all fine and dandy, but that's not why Jon went to LIV. I would respect all the LIV-joiners a lot more if they just admitted - "This is a fuck ton of money, I can set my family up for generations". This ruins golf going forward imo; LIV is boring to me, not sure what it is, and now the PGA tour is getting depleted of talent which is also boring. I think I'll just be watching the majors.
Not sure why the growing the game is rubbished so quickly. The PGA tour sold there souls to fed ex and ruined the old order of merit. They've then shortened the season and moved mjors to suit there TV. They've crippled the European tour. Personally I'm happy that someone else is bullying them with money. At least liv play around the world and are growing the game in that way. America won't come out of America. To me growing the game is not losing tour's like the euro protour but all there both care about is the top guys. In my opinion liv will become the world tour but 8n a different format. 8/10 events around the world for the top 50 or so, plus the majors. The PGA tour for the rest of the players. I think that would be good in a way but the money still won't filter down enough. All media outlets are against liv because there all in bed with America. Its your jobs to push the liv tour as a positive for world golf. Unfortunately all they push is there own narrative, especially sky sports who w9ny have any bad word said about Rory who is also the PGAtours voice. Funny that.
@@johnblanks650 You made some valid points about the monopoly of the PGA tour and a need to challenge it.. I just still can't be bothered to tune into LIV.
I think the same arguement can be made for youtubers in the golf space and if they are growing the game. LiV has been growing massivley in Asia. The event is hosted in different countries and more pple are seeing pros they would have never seen in their life. How is that not growing the game. LiV is slowly growing
UA-camrs are growing the game more than the PGA to be fair. LIV is growing it to new countries, You Tube in countries where golf is already apopular sport and PGA doesnt grow it all.
@@lollylegs3632 which is a fair assessment but how many years has it taken. Look at wer Rick started and how long it has taken for him to be where he is. It takes time. The liv angle has to be we are making it a global game. They have tournaments in america, asia, europe and australia. Its a matter of time before they have a south african leg of the tournament. Imagine number of pple in these continents who have never seen these pros. PGA has to wake up
I enjoy the shotgun start, allows you to watch everything without having to spend 10 to 12 hours. The team adds a bit more element, but doesn't get exciting in the same way, especially since team members are all over the course. Like the concept though.
I was wondering if LIV could introduce a 4the round, where the teams play as one entity in a scramble type of format. I think it would promote the Team aspect.
But don't great golf courses tell a story in their layout? Take The Brabazon at the Belfry, a relatively easy start before you hit SI 1 on the 6th, then to be hot with a long carry over water on the Par 3 7th, then there is no let up with the tough 9th, followed up by the risk reward of 10, all coming to a conclusion with the amazing 18th. It's a course that is meant to be played in that order. Please be aware, this is just a conversation and my POV, i'm not arguing. My apologies, but I'm finding I have to add this disclaimer more and more these days!!
@@block19row13 It is one of the disadvantages of shotgun, but for the last day they put the top 6 golfers starting on the first hole the last day, so the likely winner starts on one, but finished on 18. For the other days, think it means much less.
Personally, i think John masterfully negotiated a massive contract... "I don't need the money....I not interested... I could retire now and be fine" all while never talking negative about LIV or the players that went.
Being from Australia LIV is the only reason i started playing golf again after about 9 years. Because there was free access on youtube and could see all the big names playing and got myself keen to see if can still do it. There is no acess to this level of golf unless paid for streaming apps. This year i've since joined back up to a golf club, back off scratch and now paying for kayo so can watch some if the US PGA tour also. This is 100% only because of LIV.
Although I kind of agree with you about the teams not being super important. I think you’re comparing it to the wrong thing. I keep hearing these football arguments which are big team sports as comparisons. I think what LIV intended was that it be more like an F1 team. I’ve always been a fan of Bryson, so I followed him at LiV. I’m not a massive crushers fan per se but if I was watching the teams final, I want the crushers to win because I’m rooting for Bryson’s team. In the same vein I kind of see Smash as the “rival” because of the koepka beef. There are only 4 players to a team that you could switch the team you root for. Like in F1 when Daniel went from redbull to McLaren, you saw a lot more orange hats at events. Netflix fans supporting Ricciardo so people did follow their favourite driver. It’s not like anyone was a die hard fan of the red bull or Mercedes brand that they have an affinity to those teams. They aren’t location based and no one seems to care. Teams just have to develop some sort of identity. Some story that makes you want to back them.
Cycling is the same. You have riders you like, you have bike manufacturers you like and you support where you like. If there was a "Team Callaway" or "Team Ping", you might find people gravitate towards teams based on the clubs you like.
If you want emotions, watch how Cam Smith won the tournament but missed a birdie putt for this team to win the event. He didn't care about winning the event, he knew he was. His only focus was on his team. That's real emotion Rick
You could tell all that by watching him? He's obviously faking the whole thing none of these players give a damn about competition they already got their money for nothing.
@@mossbergshockwave623you think kobe or MJ didn't care to win because they got paid up front? Every professional athlete in team competition gets guaranteed contracts up front, win or lose. What a dumb take.
@@xslash10xthey cared to win and be nba champions. They grew up dreaming to win that trophy. LIV doesn’t have that and currently the tournaments don’t really matter. Basically the same level as the Netflix cup thing with the F1 drivers golfing.
@@xslash10xnot a dumb take. Team sports is not the same as golf. Golf is you Vs the course. Team sports you can be dropped and sit on the bench. You need to play together to win. You need to depend on others. They get paid up front because they're paid to use their skills to enable the team. In golf, I could lose every game now and who cares? You get to go again next week. In team sports you lose, you might not make the next tournament/round etc. Might not win the league etc
Per R&A Global Golf Participation 2023 report, more people actually play golf outside of Europe/US. Thanks to Liv, it is taking world class golfers to regions which otherwise will not get to see them (ie Asia). If Liv is able to have more events internationally ex Europe/US, that will be massive in growing the game globally.
You’re spot on, I think it’s about time sport isn’t hogged by America and Europe. And the amount of people I’ve seen playing golf because liv has caught their interest is nuts.
You say that yet it is and will continue to be ignored even with John Rahm in its ranks. They struggle to attract sponsors, tv deals and most importantly fans! They are attracting players who are willing to sell their legacy and future for cash.
But each signed player changes that, fans follow the talent, that's why PGAT gets more eyes than DPWT. It's not courses, it's not tournaments (majors aside), it's players - when LIV has the preponderance of top players, fans will follow, and sponsors follow fans.
I like all the players you mentioned , but I don't watch LIV golf because these events don't have a legacy or history to them yet . Maybe in the future they will .
I personally started playing golf because LIV was on tv (in Australia). I know the names of way more Liv players than PGA players. On the course today I let a group play through and they were all talking about Rahm going to LIV. They have infinite money, they're gunna be the main pro golf circuit within a few years.
The team dynamic makes it's great when you have players from your country playing and winning. As a South African, I enjoy seeing the Stingers smashing the USA teams...it gives me an extra reason to watch and encourages the young guys on the local tour to push to be selected, possibly in an auction setting like the IPL
The DP world tour and the PGA tour created this when they shafted the top players and did a complete U turn and the DP world punished their players and pushed them away. Both Pelley and Monahan need to go sooner rather than later. And the lack of ranking points is disgusting!
Why can't they make their own ranking? If they don't want to play 4 rounds and have cuts, have a three tournament day ranking. A music ranking, with shorts even. PGA Tour players can't get THOSE rankings. They'd probably suck at wearing shorts while listening to Kanye's music. 2c.
At 59 and a 14 HC I welcome the LIV , it's fun and lively and being able to play all over the world it a nice touch. The PGA ( TWGA) needed good shake down and I'm sick of seeing them " all hail TW) it's old already! The are lots of other great players we don't get to see - I don't watch it anymore. The LIV format is great with the shotgun start and 3 day format. Love your show , it get lots of great tips that help. Thanks guys.
If I had the choice of watching Professional golf events or UA-cam golf channels, I would choose UA-cam every time. Nothing to do with finance, its just more entertaining... a more satisfying watch.
Those quotes from Jon Rahm were pre June 6th. From June 6th onward PGA players will no longer trust PGA leadership. Now it's every man for himself. Those who say LIV is crap, I've watched every tournament since its inception. It's a better broadcast and all players must play. I watch PGA tournaments and the top players don't have to show up. Those who say LIV is not going to work are the same people who said in year 2000 the internet is a fad.
All players playing is the biggest thing and Rick & Guy constantly miss this point. In Full Swing coverage of the Waste Management, they said "6 of the world's top 10 are here" like it was a massive thing. We should be like "is that all???"
Exactly, lets say 2 billion has been spent when they have over $700B, that's like having $100,000 and throwing away $300. They don't care about return on investment.
As someone who started playing golf at the beginning of 2023, having had little knowledge or experience of LIV/PGA events, the only golf tournaments I knew of were the majors. I also have no bias toward either tour, but if I were to go and watch an event that wasn't a major in person, I'd 100x would rather go to a Liv event than a PGA event. The vibe of the tournament in Australia looked epic!! Personally, I hate watching any golf on TV other than Augusta. I'd much rather watch UA-cam golf. The best golf video I've seen is the Bryson vs Phil match. They need to make golf more enjoyable to watch for fans, and even have more matchplay tournaments where we have more access to players, their thoughts while shooting, a bit of banter etc. I find watching golf like watching test match cricket... Golf needs format changes like what happened in cricket (50 overs, and 20/20 games).
You two are getting more and more short sighted as time goes by. The future of LIV golf doesn't lie with the likes of you (or me!), it lies with the kids of today who are currently 7, 8 or 9 yrs old etc. In 10 yrs time, they will have grown up with LIV golf...........it will mean something to them (much more than it does for us).
Call me a boring old fart but i grew up looking forward to the Masters, Open and Ryder Cup. I agree with Rick in the fact that the amount of money thrown around now is unsettling and is a turn off for me personally.
Masters, open, and the ryder cup are easily the best. And i'd almost argue they are more elevated now. I think LIV takes away from the norm PGA events but elevates the majors. Tbh most of the non majors on the PGA are just bleh
Golf has always been a game of tradition. It was not like other sports. It was truly performance based. Money changes everything, especially people. Sometimes not for the better. I'm so turned off by it all, I don't watch any golf on TV anymore. I was a person who attended multiple tour events each year. I'm so done.
As a lover of golf. I personally like watching LIV. Aside from majors and maybe 2 other PGA events, the LIV tournaments are way more exciting to watch. The only thing that the PGA can hope for is Tiger staying healthy and playing lots of tournaments.
It's crazy how shortsighted people are about LIV. Everyone is so used to the golf format of the last 60 odd years they cannot see past the end of their noses. The next generation of golfers (some not born yet) will grow up up with this golf format. Given time, this may be the future of golf. Maybe not in its current iteration, but something different from how we currently digest golf. Times are changing. .
If you don't think the fans don't embrace the team aspect then you should never watch The Ryder Cup. Bryson is my guy and if he is off his game I am still pulling for The Crushers. I cannot watch the PGA anymore. For me it is too long and too boring. I have no doubt that people still like the PGA and that is great but don't try to figure out LIV. Just watch it or not that is your call. As far as growing the game would not bringing in a new league in itself be growing the game? PGA wants to grow the game only if they can control the game.
One thing I would love from your channel would be some consistency, on the one hand a podcast (very good by the way) with Bryson which has a soft tone about LiV and now a hard tone that you don't get the teams side, cant see it benefiting the game etc. The reality is this is all about money and is no different to any other sport or industry including UA-cam. Some may suggest that your soft tone with Bryson was about ensuring his engagement so to create great content and so make more money. Anything new in the market and creates change, this is happening and only time will tell what the outcome is.
$20 for a bucket of range balls $60 to walk 18 holes $75 for a dozen golf balls $750 for a driver $750 for woods/hybrids $2000 for irons $1000 for wedges and a putter $300 for a golf bag $250 for golf shoes $300 for golf clothes $250 for a range finder $20 for golf tees $40 for food and drinks per round Golf ain't cheap
Yeah! Why work hard. Imagine LIV Hospital and Health care, where doctors get to play video games and work three days a week, in shorts while listening to music!! For ten times more money even! Who would say no to that.
No golfer plays 38 weeks, Tiger in his time played like 18-22 weeks that’s it. And if playing 18-22 weeks a year is too much for LIV players screw them, let them try working 50-52 weeks a year.
@jorgecgonzalez9976 which is why LIV works. You know all of those big names will be at every event (barring injury). You don't turn a GP on and wonder which drivers will actually be taking part
Great show gents - think the real growth is outside the US and UK from a LIV perspective. Rahm moves the proverbial needle in Continental Europe, Cam Smith and Leishman in Australasia, Niemann etc in South America, Louis and Schwartzel in SA. If LIV get Hideki across then Japanese eyes will follow. Golf is a global game, 3 of the 4 majors in the US is stunting global growth imho. On the teams they are also aligned to those geographies (Ripper is Aus, Stingers is SA etc) and will build fan bases in those geographies. Mostly though, am simply stunned by the mismanagement of an entire sport and infrastructure by Monahan and Pelley 🤦♂️
Rick- don't really think the team deal works is based on you being at one event. You remind of Blockbuster thinking Netflix was not a threat. The players are into the team deal because they make more money...its that simple. I dont recall hearing you saying TW's ridiculous simulator league teams were bad???
People talking about Rahm changing his tune and going back on his own words seem to forget that Jay Monahan has since announced he was cosying up with PIF and LIV without any input from the players, leaving many players wondering why they were being loyal to the PGA. That announcement would have changed his thinking a lot and the thinking of many other players. Why would you stay loyal to the PGA if even the PGA isn't staying loyal to the PGA?
The most important reason professionals are leaving the PGA and joining LIV is the PGA has mistreated the players. The PGA is a corrupt non-profit that hides and embezzles money. Liv is treating their players with dignity and that's the biggest difference.
Over the past couple of years, there has been a substantial rise in golf fees. The golf course in my vicinity, where my son and I used to frequently play, used to charge $55 per round. However, today, the cost has escalated to $95. This increase is quite significant, especially considering that there hasn't been a noticeable improvement in the course itself. #rollbackgolfprices
I firmly believe that part of the contract with LIV, includes that the players must make mandatory statements such as: “it’s good for the game of golf”, “Grow the game of golf”, “Future of golf”.
The PGAT’s house is collapsing. Waxhovia announced today that 2024!will be last year they sponsor the Charlotte, NC tournament. I believe Wachovia is headquartered inCharlotte, so that’s a big deal!
Personally think a bit part of him joining LIV is the PGA tour is all about Tiger and Rory even though in my opinion he’s the best player in the world, I think Rahm wants to be the man
PGA Tour getting what they deserve. Alot of us outside the US and UK will embrace LIV bringing golf back to our shores and making it more of a world game not just the North American golf Tour. Besides we get the four majors anyway. Week to week you got the PGA, LIV, DP WORLD etc etc so you have choices of what you want to see and let's be honest who actually knows half the players on a PGA leaderboard these days anyway?
I loved the LIV event i went to. The shot gun start made it amazing! I am not able to do a regular pga event with my health issues. I can go out for 4 hours and see everyone who is playing by setting on one hole. The smaller crowd sizes made is so easy to chat with players. Everyone who went with us agreed We will be back !
I really enjoy this podcast and have listened to every ep, but just a bit of criticism, say what you want about LIV lads, it's making up about 85% of the content on this podcast at the moment, and it's basically the same conversation every time.
I had largely quit watching PGA, and quit reading the golf industry publications that provide cover and support. I watch more golf - beyond the majors - because of what LIV has brought to the game. Also, the comparison to racing is a good one. I root for the Crushers because I like Bryson DeChambeau and I have come to like his teammates because of his efforts to market them on UA-cam. In racing, I root for the Andretti Family, as well as Ganassi and Penske because I feel like I know them from watching for many years. It will take time, but someone might root for the RangeGoats after Bubba Watson retires because they were a fan of his and he is still an owner or captain. We will see, but for me, I am happy to have LIV because it has allowed me to enjoy regular golf events - plus their end of year team competition is fun to watch. Also, LIV’s Promotions tournament - happening this weekend - is providing great drama and is worthy of more attention.
I love liv. Im australian went to Adelaide, everyone that went loved it and ive already got tickets for next year. Happy to watch more great players join.
I agree with Rick, Golf is being priced out of reach for the Man in the street. My membership has increased 25% in 2 years and I am now considering giving it up, having played since a kid. Many clubs are going to have a huge shock coming the Covid bubble is about to burst and with an average age at my club of 58 they are going to be screwed.
Inflation and supply & demand combined. Like any business, they'll charge as much as people will pay in a free market. That has zero to do with Jon Rahm's wages
Rick a lot has to do with more and more players getting fed up with the PGA tour and how they have no plan for the future not to mention how they don't bother to communicate whatever plan to the players. The question of moving now becomes "why not and why stay loyal to the PGA tour. What is the PGA doing for me now to turn down hundreds of millions to join LIV who clearly has a plan and look after it's players"
It should all work out like it was set up to in the beginning. LIV right from the start tailored thier schedule around all the big events so players could go play them on off weeks. PGA and DP made a huge mistake for viewership with the bans but likely that will be resolved soon.
And now live golf, live as in broadcast live, can be viewed free on UA-cam and on an app, anywhere, and replayed at anytime afterwards. That's Growing the game, all around the world, instead of needing to pay for view. LIV is also networked on several hundred channels worldwide.
@@mr.harmon6907 There were some really good rap songs in the 80s...some were clever or funny, some dealt with social issues etc....but since then it's rare. All music is being attacked by Autotune, and here comes AI, which will certainly encourage laziness and damage creativity. Progress sometimes, is really it's opposite IMO...I don't think I'm saying that because I turned 60 this year, I still listen to today's music and watch today's movies etc....and appreciate good product...but it's becoming more and more rare. Tiger going for the green at the Canadian Open from a bunker over water, with a 6-iron to cover 205 yards...all fronted by that lake, for no reason with a one shot lead, other than to prove what he could do. This is not going to happen again. There was Jack, and then Tiger, and now....I think we'll celebrate whoever signs the first Billion $$ contract with LIV....that's where we're at.
With the team aspect and player thing. As an Aussie I go for the Ripper GC but my favourite player is Bryson so I Follow my team and follow my player it's a win win for me
I'm a fan of watching Rick Shiels videos, they're entertaining to me. Its so funny to watch someone like Rick that has a closed mind attempt to argue their views when they're completely feeling based. He mainly watches PGA big tour events, but no other tours, DP, LPGA etc. Maybe he's just not a golf fan in general. He's made a great living being a club pro off of actual golf fans and the golf industry. Yet he cant understand how a 6 year old can grow up watching a LIV team from that age on. And be a legacy fan? It like trying to argue or discuss something with a gal friend that knows they're absolutely incorrect based in logic. But still have to be ignorant just because. All the while broadcasting from Dubai. This is one of the most disappointing ways to see Rick Shiels. It's so funny too that he just dropped a video taking Dechambeus tips. Super hypocritical if you ask me.
This is exactly what I thought watching this video... He's just had his golf swing fixed by Dechambeau and didn't even know he'd had a broken hand... It's incredible that he's not really a fan of golf but seems to think his opinion should matter to fans... My son is 18 this month and chasing the dream of becoming a tour pro... He truly doesn't care which tour he plays on however he realises he'd be financially better off even coming last on LIV for a year lol
With all due respect to one comment you made. If you were to go back and watch 3 scenarios. One you spoke on bryson making an important putt for crushers to win. Watch their final round of the year and you can see it meant a LOT. Second Adelade was the best golf product of the year outside of the masters (so much fun and decades of Australians letting lose because they finally got their big event. Aussie pga wasn't it). And lastly. For the sheer emotion. Danny Lee coming from the grave and getting a win in that fashion was incredible. Now I'm not biased. I love the pga tour, specifically the Marque events but there is a place. I think the pga tour is too long and if scheduling works out they can both exist. Kinda like having two Starbucks right next to each other in a small town. Doesn't make sense. And LIV travels around the world so I see that as a positive. I'm a hopeful person and I hope it helps the game. Just hard whenever you make a change because kf the uncertainty. Fingers crossed
TBH...I watch more UA-cam golf than I do PGA/DP golf (outside of the majors) the short form exhibition format of the game is the way forward and what people are consuming, Rick being one of them and profiting from the direction of the game! We just need to accept it and enjoy it. I certainly am!
Didn’t the PGA jump into bed with the same people who own LIV? So if both tours are funded by the same source why not choose where you prefer to play and people shouldn’t judge these guys.
Regarding rolling back the ball, now there are going to be "pre-roll back" versions of the ProV1 that are sold almost as a black market ball. But regarding the equipment, it's the same as when they got rid of square grooves.
I just realised the other day someone asked if I watched Liv- my first thought was actually no. But, I also don’t watch PGA week to week, the coverage is tragic except if you are tuned in for ads. What I do is watch more highlights of Liv than a run of mill pga tournament. A lot more because I like the big name players more. As for growing the game- in US and UK Liv isn’t growing the game and doesn’t need to. In other places where these tournaments are held mexico, austrailia Asia etc- It is. australians for sure love liv.
Rick, you don't think the team aspect of LIV is a draw for the fans. Lol, the amount of team merchandise LIV sells at events is insane!!! Team aspect is great!
Remember how quick the PGA Tour dropped the Western Open for the Fed Ex cup/BMW. The western was the oldest and possibly rig]chest tournament on tour for $$$$$. These guys play golf for money and to take care of their families. Good on you players.
There’s no way you two watch a random PGA event over a LIV event. These players are moving because of money yes, but also but the rest you get over summer and the shorter rounds. LIV is growing the game of golf whether you like it or not.
I'd much rather watch the lowest PGA Tour event than the highest LIV event. I don't like 3 days of play. I don't like shotgun starts. I don't like teams. I don't like that LIV players can wear shorts. I hate everything LIV does. So, you're wrong. There is a way that people would watch a random PGA Tour event over a LIV event.
@@NC-1861 and I bet you’re also collar shirts at all golf courses, if you’re not a member you can’t play, no 2 balls on weekends. Very old fashioned, golf is moving on and you should try and keep your with it. As far as the lowest PGA event is concerned, if no top 20 players are playing then I couldn’t think of anything more boring to watch haha.
@rinorzeqiri7450 If you love golf, its not boring to watch if no big names are playing. I have no problem with non-members playing as long as they take care of the course. And I don't know what you mean by no 2 balls on weekends.
@@NC-1861 and that’s exactly why LIV is helping the sport grow because they’ve got people like myself who would much rather play than watch, watch a few LIV events as they’re shorter and the line up is full of top names. As a casual I’ve got no interest in watching a tour event with no big players playing.
There is an opportunity presenting itself here for golf to reach out and grow worldwide .That is what JR has recognised.The PGA has missed the boat big style by being too protectionist and not taking the opportunity to export their Brand beyond a few co- sanctioned events .
Team golf can one hundred percent be very interesting if done right. There are many formats of team golf where you can mix in the events. Collegiate and high school golf are super fun and works. If there are 5 or 6 events where they player match play, scramble, best ball, alt shot, etc. If the goal of the tournament was to win as a team rather than win as an individual, people would tune in and slowly build fandom for the team rather than the individual.
I'm surprise nobody in LIV has thought about forcing teams to be located or related to a city. That's the number one reason most fans of any sport will support a team.
My own view is that the teams will be franchised to corporates. Team Nike, Adidas etc. Hence why Rahm gets equity....but...I do agree with you, that would be better for the fan
It helps, but it isnt necessary either. There are plenty of people that support Lakers that aren't from LA, or Manchester United that aren't from Manchester.
Proud to say that I have watched every LIV event. Playing on a college golf team was the best days of my golfing life. Memories that will last forever. I truly believe this will thrive in LIV, also.
Would like to see Rick and Guy play some rounds with the Titleist TruFeel golf ball. I’ve been told that the compression will be lowered to limit the ball distance and that the TruFeel ball will be very similar to the rollback standards.
hypocritical quotes aside, I actually think this was a brilliant move by Rahm. He knew before this the Liv players wouldn't be able to play the Ryder Cup (or at least greatly suspected), so he waited until after the Ryder Cup on "home turf" to make his decision. In that time the he has won the Master's (gets lifetime invite), and the PGA and LIV have started trying to make an agreement to work together. So with an agreement on the horizon that will likely allow players to compete in both leages and maybe play in Ryder Cup by the time it comes around again (especially in Europe), Rahm has now taken his massive cash out, and will likely still be able to be to play pretty much whatever events he wants. What a win for him! 👏👏
Some don’t like how disingenuous he was with his comments against LIV and the format and the money. And now he calls the same thing “innovative.” It’s just phony. Now he’s just a shill and his words about anything are meaningless.
Maybe it's time for a UA-cam golf tour, I would watch that over LIV all day!!! I would definitely tune in to the PGA when Tiger is playing but if there was a UA-cam tour, I wouldn't miss any of that.
Unless it was a scramble, it wouldnt last long at all. No preferred lies, gimmes or breakfast mulligans, most would score 80+. Maybe if it was along the lines of a BDS can a hole it would work ?
Rick has been talking about wanting to do "YT Masters" with fellow YT golf creators, just couldn't swing it this year. It does sound like big logistic task to have enough cameras etc for 18 holes (or however many they're spread out over) to make it worthwhile to watch
I get the sense that most people have never watched a PGA event on TV. It is completely unwatchable. It's boring, but even if you wanted to watch, they only show 2 or 3 players and the ads get in the way. They don't show the first two days so you don't see the cut anyhow. You only see the last two days while LIV shows all 3 days. As to Guy's arguments, they all apply to PGA. What does it matter if someone wins a PGA event? Doesn't mean squat. LIV with the shotgun start means there's always something going on and I've started watching golf again.
Personally, as an average golfer, day job, family, etc etc, I am getting quite annoyed with all this PGA Tour v LiV shit. Millionaires bitching against Millionaires, whilst the top courses in the world are charging me £400+ for a green fee. How is all this helping me? Rahm growing the game? How? He gets 459 million quid and Pebble Beach now wants 650 dollars for one round. How is the average golfer benefitting from this?
Zero benefit.....the average golfer is getting hammered financially, whether it be club membership, green fees, equipment or a bucket of balls at the driving range.
@VG32123 totally agree mate. Someone down the line has to pay for Jon Rahms fee, and 20 million so ian Poulter can hack around like a 6 handicap. Who pays? We do. Like you said, higher fees, unaffordable green fees
100% agree with this post. This is exactly how I fell as well.
This should be pinned on all golf channels
@Bech285 you know it's the truth mate. The big boys make more money, and we carry the cost!!!
Personally, as a latinamerican, I'm very exited too see LIV Golf grow the game and play tournaments around the world (Asia, Australia, and hopefully South America in the future). USA and Europe have had a monopoly of almoust all the golf events for too long. Vamos equipo Torque!!
This has aged well 😂
5:00
They’re both so funny, anytime anything positive about LIV to be said, they have to qualify it with “and I’m not a big fan”
Guys, we know lol
I'm a Stingers supporter merely for the fact that they are South African players . I always look for their names first. I always want them to win the team comp. Exactly the same as you guys supporting Man u or Liverpool. I'm proud of the South African players and Stingers GC. That's why I love LIV
As an aussie... Same with the rippers gc!!!
Hopefully Rick & Guy will soon understand that LIV golf is not aimed at their generation of golf fan. It is aimed at the next generation of golfers and supporters. And it also gives supporters outside of the US & Europe a chance to see world class golfers up close. Current PGA champions don’t come to Australia to play but LIV golfers do.
100% correct....Oz used to have a big summer golf tour, but the PGAT killed that...LIV will own golf fans outside the US....LIV Adelaide sold out in a day....its now a big EVENT
I love this podcast, but I think this is definitely their biggest miss. LIV is going for the NEXT generation, not necessarily THIS generation; if kids grow up watching it as a team sport more often, that view will literally change in one generation. Give it 8-10 years and no one will think twice about a team-based golf league.
Absolutely right. It's like 20/20 cricket is aimed at the youngsters
It’s not about golf its just Saudi domination as they have so much money to try to ruin mainstream events
What Rick doesn't get is that pro golf is in the entertainment business.....TV broadcast of golf is old tech....LIV understand streaming is the future
The PGA tour is mainly played in the US, LIV is going around the world. This is how you grow the game outside of the US
There's already been tours all over the world these selfish pigs are just in it for themselves imagine if nicklaus palmer and player did this in the 60s golf would be nonexistent
@@mossbergshockwave623who else should they be in it for?
Well, three of the Majors are IN the U.S....and the other is run by the R&A Club. The Players is PGA. The FEDEX cup is PGA...all American. Then you have other tournaments around the world. That's not changing. The PGA will provide all the competitive golf, and they can then retire with LIV...I guess. And why not? I think Rham would have taken that money to retire even.
@@mossbergshockwave623 - Fair comment but i will correct you there ... Let’s be reminded that GOLF greats like Jack Nicklaus, Gary Player, Arnold Palmer, Lee Trevino and their other mates who way back then played tournaments under the PGA of America (founded in 1916) in 1960 began the process of breaking away and in 1975 the organization they created achieved full independence from the PGA of America and was named the "PGA Tour." The coming of LIV Golf is no different … In reality PGA tour is a SUNSET tour. Changing of the Guards !!
@@robl7559 yeah but that was so not noticeable then they didn't kick them out of the tour or anything.
I think at 10 minutes in you hit a really big point that resonates especially with me as an Aussie, with LIV we get to see some of the best golfers in the world (and some past big name players, albeit past their prime) teeing it up all around the world, even on some people’s home courses.
For far too long the PGA has had a stranglehold on the world’s best players, hosting most events (and 3 of the majors) in the US.
It is great to see the LIV events played around the globe, just like the greats of yesteryear used to.
When I was young the world’s best used to play in Australia in our summer, but now with the year round demands of the PGA we only get that chance when we host the Presidents cup. I love the USPGA and the DP tour, but I now enjoy LIV as well.
I don’t see why people feel the need to choose sides.
Guy, a serious question for you: Does it "mean" more to win the PGA's John Deer Classic than the LIV JCB event? Which one will you watch? Aside from The Major Championships, all professional golf tournaments are essentially exhibitions that don't really "mean" anything. We watch them to be entertained on a Sunday afternoon.
All pro sports is in the entertainment industry
John Deere classic and its not close. Just don't like the LIV format. That round Bryson put in was pure class tho
how many fed ex cup points does the liv event provide?
You do realise that merikah is not the center of the universe right?
@@epicragegaming2016who cares about the Fed Ex cup. It's a terrible setup to call "playoffs"
You talk about not seeing the team golf vibe, but yet we're excited for the TGL league.
Stop talking sense lol
I’ve watched more LIV golf in the past year than any other year of golf. The format works better for me, as a spectator, than the standard PGA format.
In what was is it better? I can’t get behind it at all, do not like it
@@J_B17you can watch an entire round on like 4hrs instead of 12-14hrs, all to the top players at LIV play in every event whereas you can turn on a pga tour event and honestly not recognize a single name on the leader board and hence not care, and with a shotgun start every player is playing in the same weather conditions (how many rounds have you seen decided by having no wind in a morning session then blowing a gale for the later tee times).
15 of the last 30 major winners are now on LIV, Thats serious fire power
For those asking how LIV is growing the game, have a look at the LIV promotion tournament in Abu Dhabi. Players from Thailand, Australia, Chile, Bermuda, France, South Africa, China, Japan, Paraguay, Singapore, Italy, England, Argentina, New Zealand NOT just the US. It is growing the game whether you want to believe it or not.
Well said , new faces is the hope for all Professional Golfers .
That's all fine and dandy, but that's not why Jon went to LIV.
I would respect all the LIV-joiners a lot more if they just admitted - "This is a fuck ton of money, I can set my family up for generations".
This ruins golf going forward imo; LIV is boring to me, not sure what it is, and now the PGA tour is getting depleted of talent which is also boring.
I think I'll just be watching the majors.
Not sure why the growing the game is rubbished so quickly. The PGA tour sold there souls to fed ex and ruined the old order of merit. They've then shortened the season and moved mjors to suit there TV. They've crippled the European tour. Personally I'm happy that someone else is bullying them with money. At least liv play around the world and are growing the game in that way. America won't come out of America. To me growing the game is not losing tour's like the euro protour but all there both care about is the top guys. In my opinion liv will become the world tour but 8n a different format. 8/10 events around the world for the top 50 or so, plus the majors. The PGA tour for the rest of the players. I think that would be good in a way but the money still won't filter down enough.
All media outlets are against liv because there all in bed with America. Its your jobs to push the liv tour as a positive for world golf. Unfortunately all they push is there own narrative, especially sky sports who w9ny have any bad word said about Rory who is also the PGAtours voice. Funny that.
On the Pat Macafee show, he says the money was a big part of his decision of why he joined.
@@johnblanks650 You made some valid points about the monopoly of the PGA tour and a need to challenge it.. I just still can't be bothered to tune into LIV.
It's time for the stuffiness of the PGA Tour to step aside and let the excitement of watching LIV golf. It's like watching the Ryder Cup every week.
I think the same arguement can be made for youtubers in the golf space and if they are growing the game. LiV has been growing massivley in Asia. The event is hosted in different countries and more pple are seeing pros they would have never seen in their life. How is that not growing the game. LiV is slowly growing
UA-camrs are growing the game more than LIV hands down.
UA-camrs are growing the game more than the PGA to be fair. LIV is growing it to new countries, You Tube in countries where golf is already apopular sport and PGA doesnt grow it all.
@@lollylegs3632 which is a fair assessment but how many years has it taken. Look at wer Rick started and how long it has taken for him to be where he is. It takes time. The liv angle has to be we are making it a global game. They have tournaments in america, asia, europe and australia. Its a matter of time before they have a south african leg of the tournament. Imagine number of pple in these continents who have never seen these pros. PGA has to wake up
I enjoy the shotgun start, allows you to watch everything without having to spend 10 to 12 hours. The team adds a bit more element, but doesn't get exciting in the same way, especially since team members are all over the course. Like the concept though.
I was wondering if LIV could introduce a 4the round, where the teams play as one entity in a scramble type of format. I think it would promote the Team aspect.
Shotgun start is so much better
But don't great golf courses tell a story in their layout? Take The Brabazon at the Belfry, a relatively easy start before you hit SI 1 on the 6th, then to be hot with a long carry over water on the Par 3 7th, then there is no let up with the tough 9th, followed up by the risk reward of 10, all coming to a conclusion with the amazing 18th. It's a course that is meant to be played in that order.
Please be aware, this is just a conversation and my POV, i'm not arguing. My apologies, but I'm finding I have to add this disclaimer more and more these days!!
@@block19row13 It is one of the disadvantages of shotgun, but for the last day they put the top 6 golfers starting on the first hole the last day, so the likely winner starts on one, but finished on 18. For the other days, think it means much less.
I hate shotgun style
Personally, i think John masterfully negotiated a massive contract... "I don't need the money....I not interested... I could retire now and be fine" all while never talking negative about LIV or the players that went.
He did talk negatively of LIV. They quote him in the first 2 minutes of this pod.
Being from Australia LIV is the only reason i started playing golf again after about 9 years. Because there was free access on youtube and could see all the big names playing and got myself keen to see if can still do it. There is no acess to this level of golf unless paid for streaming apps.
This year i've since joined back up to a golf club, back off scratch and now paying for kayo so can watch some if the US PGA tour also. This is 100% only because of LIV.
Although I kind of agree with you about the teams not being super important. I think you’re comparing it to the wrong thing. I keep hearing these football arguments which are big team sports as comparisons. I think what LIV intended was that it be more like an F1 team. I’ve always been a fan of Bryson, so I followed him at LiV. I’m not a massive crushers fan per se but if I was watching the teams final, I want the crushers to win because I’m rooting for Bryson’s team. In the same vein I kind of see Smash as the “rival” because of the koepka beef. There are only 4 players to a team that you could switch the team you root for. Like in F1 when Daniel went from redbull to McLaren, you saw a lot more orange hats at events. Netflix fans supporting Ricciardo so people did follow their favourite driver. It’s not like anyone was a die hard fan of the red bull or Mercedes brand that they have an affinity to those teams. They aren’t location based and no one seems to care. Teams just have to develop some sort of identity. Some story that makes you want to back them.
Cycling is the same. You have riders you like, you have bike manufacturers you like and you support where you like. If there was a "Team Callaway" or "Team Ping", you might find people gravitate towards teams based on the clubs you like.
Yup, kind of like a racing team
If you want emotions, watch how Cam Smith won the tournament but missed a birdie putt for this team to win the event. He didn't care about winning the event, he knew he was. His only focus was on his team. That's real emotion Rick
You could tell all that by watching him? He's obviously faking the whole thing none of these players give a damn about competition they already got their money for nothing.
@@mossbergshockwave623 What Chuck is describing is exactly what happened. You're misinformed.
@@mossbergshockwave623you think kobe or MJ didn't care to win because they got paid up front? Every professional athlete in team competition gets guaranteed contracts up front, win or lose. What a dumb take.
@@xslash10xthey cared to win and be nba champions. They grew up dreaming to win that trophy. LIV doesn’t have that and currently the tournaments don’t really matter. Basically the same level as the Netflix cup thing with the F1 drivers golfing.
@@xslash10xnot a dumb take. Team sports is not the same as golf. Golf is you Vs the course. Team sports you can be dropped and sit on the bench. You need to play together to win. You need to depend on others. They get paid up front because they're paid to use their skills to enable the team. In golf, I could lose every game now and who cares? You get to go again next week. In team sports you lose, you might not make the next tournament/round etc. Might not win the league etc
RAHMBOOOOOOO! Good on you Rahmbo
Per R&A Global Golf Participation 2023 report, more people actually play golf outside of Europe/US. Thanks to Liv, it is taking world class golfers to regions which otherwise will not get to see them (ie Asia). If Liv is able to have more events internationally ex Europe/US, that will be massive in growing the game globally.
You’re spot on, I think it’s about time sport isn’t hogged by America and Europe. And the amount of people I’ve seen playing golf because liv has caught their interest is nuts.
Rahm, DJ, Cam, Brooks, Bryson - imho 5 of the world's top ten. LIV getting hard to ignore.
You say that yet it is and will continue to be ignored even with John Rahm in its ranks. They struggle to attract sponsors, tv deals and most importantly fans! They are attracting players who are willing to sell their legacy and future for cash.
@@gallzyrmall pretty much true but mid career, get paid more to work less to spend more time with your family. It's a no brainer.
But each signed player changes that, fans follow the talent, that's why PGAT gets more eyes than DPWT. It's not courses, it's not tournaments (majors aside), it's players - when LIV has the preponderance of top players, fans will follow, and sponsors follow fans.
In time. the corrupt OWGR will become laughable and ignored
I like all the players you mentioned , but I don't watch LIV golf because these events don't have a legacy or history to them yet . Maybe in the future they will .
I personally started playing golf because LIV was on tv (in Australia). I know the names of way more Liv players than PGA players. On the course today I let a group play through and they were all talking about Rahm going to LIV. They have infinite money, they're gunna be the main pro golf circuit within a few years.
The team dynamic makes it's great when you have players from your country playing and winning. As a South African, I enjoy seeing the Stingers smashing the USA teams...it gives me an extra reason to watch and encourages the young guys on the local tour to push to be selected, possibly in an auction setting like the IPL
Dont let the PGA fanboys dampen that enjoyment. I'm a Ripper fan myself without much success. 2024 is our year!
@@lollylegs3632 😂 we only have half a team atm! Maybe minwoo and Jason day could join Ripper
I see the LIV bots are alive and well
@@pauli5818 these are exactly the two guys I'd love to see join the team!
Same here, watched Burmeister at Houghton and Blair Athol, was happy with him winning those tourneys, especially in courses I play often
LIv golf Adelaide 2024 sold out in 15 minutes and team Ripper is massively popular in Australia as is team Stinger in South Africa
The DP world tour and the PGA tour created this when they shafted the top players and did a complete U turn and the DP world punished their players and pushed them away. Both Pelley and Monahan need to go sooner rather than later. And the lack of ranking points is disgusting!
The corruption of the OWGR is criminal....the board must be sued
I would watch LPGA before I flip pass a liv "tournament"
@@mossbergshockwave623 what does that even mean? The ladies are good to watch, from 150 in they are unreal
@@LaineDavies yeah I know I watch them but I would never watch a "liv tournament"
Why can't they make their own ranking? If they don't want to play 4 rounds and have cuts, have a three tournament day ranking. A music ranking, with shorts even. PGA Tour players can't get THOSE rankings. They'd probably suck at wearing shorts while listening to Kanye's music. 2c.
Someone please offer rick 100 million to announce for LIV
At 59 and a 14 HC I welcome the LIV , it's fun and lively and being able to play all over the world it a nice touch. The PGA ( TWGA) needed good shake down and I'm sick of seeing them " all hail TW) it's old already! The are lots of other great players we don't get to see - I don't watch it anymore. The LIV format is great with the shotgun start and 3 day format. Love your show , it get lots of great tips that help. Thanks guys.
If I had the choice of watching Professional golf events or UA-cam golf channels, I would choose UA-cam every time. Nothing to do with finance, its just more entertaining... a more satisfying watch.
So true!
Ability to stop the video and come back to it whenever you feel like it, i.e. it not being inflexible to your schedule is a huge plus for me.
Those quotes from Jon Rahm were pre June 6th. From June 6th onward PGA players will no longer trust PGA leadership. Now it's every man for himself. Those who say LIV is crap, I've watched every tournament since its inception. It's a better broadcast and all players must play. I watch PGA tournaments and the top players don't have to show up. Those who say LIV is not going to work are the same people who said in year 2000 the internet is a fad.
What I find crazy is that in many cases, the same people who think LIV is a joke were really excited about TGL.
These two are just parroting the anti-LIV media, if Rory was to go to LIV the narrative would change over night lol@@Chris54321
Well said. There’s no reason for any of them to stay after the merger. LIV will be the elite world tour sooner than later. My bold prediction.
All players playing is the biggest thing and Rick & Guy constantly miss this point. In Full Swing coverage of the Waste Management, they said "6 of the world's top 10 are here" like it was a massive thing. We should be like "is that all???"
Liv production quality better ? You must be joking
$500 million to PIF is like a $60 round of golf to someone with $100k in the bank.
Exactly, lets say 2 billion has been spent when they have over $700B, that's like having $100,000 and throwing away $300. They don't care about return on investment.
As someone who started playing golf at the beginning of 2023, having had little knowledge or experience of LIV/PGA events, the only golf tournaments I knew of were the majors. I also have no bias toward either tour, but if I were to go and watch an event that wasn't a major in person, I'd 100x would rather go to a Liv event than a PGA event. The vibe of the tournament in Australia looked epic!! Personally, I hate watching any golf on TV other than Augusta. I'd much rather watch UA-cam golf. The best golf video I've seen is the Bryson vs Phil match. They need to make golf more enjoyable to watch for fans, and even have more matchplay tournaments where we have more access to players, their thoughts while shooting, a bit of banter etc. I find watching golf like watching test match cricket... Golf needs format changes like what happened in cricket (50 overs, and 20/20 games).
You two are getting more and more short sighted as time goes by. The future of LIV golf doesn't lie with the likes of you (or me!), it lies with the kids of today who are currently 7, 8 or 9 yrs old etc. In 10 yrs time, they will have grown up with LIV golf...........it will mean something to them (much more than it does for us).
Call me a boring old fart but i grew up looking forward to the Masters, Open and Ryder Cup. I agree with Rick in the fact that the amount of money thrown around now is unsettling and is a turn off for me personally.
Masters, open, and the ryder cup are easily the best. And i'd almost argue they are more elevated now. I think LIV takes away from the norm PGA events but elevates the majors. Tbh most of the non majors on the PGA are just bleh
@@laronda10 maybe all this other golf including LIV will mean something when I'm dead and buried!
Less is more as far as I'm concerned!
Golf has always been a game of tradition. It was not like other sports. It was truly performance based. Money changes everything, especially people. Sometimes not for the better. I'm so turned off by it all, I don't watch any golf on TV anymore. I was a person who attended multiple tour events each year. I'm so done.
LIV has a nice format. In Valderrama was amazing. Please visit one event and then talk about what it is.
As a lover of golf. I personally like watching LIV. Aside from majors and maybe 2 other PGA events, the LIV tournaments are way more exciting to watch. The only thing that the PGA can hope for is Tiger staying healthy and playing lots of tournaments.
Liv is a joke the players already got their money they literally could careless about playing competition it's just golf with buddies.
😂😂😂😂😂 you bot
@@DocOoccc thanks
@@mossbergshockwave623 that is an interesting look on it. Even though they have $ now I think they really competitive guys still want to win
Rick, How can you say a Golfer, “deserves” upwards of $500 million dollars?
It's crazy how shortsighted people are about LIV. Everyone is so used to the golf format of the last 60 odd years they cannot see past the end of their noses. The next generation of golfers (some not born yet) will grow up up with this golf format. Given time, this may be the future of golf. Maybe not in its current iteration, but something different from how we currently digest golf. Times are changing. .
F1 has always been a team sport at its core. Golf is at it's heart a game of individuals competing
If you don't think the fans don't embrace the team aspect then you should never watch The Ryder Cup. Bryson is my guy and if he is off his game I am still pulling for The Crushers. I cannot watch the PGA anymore. For me it is too long and too boring. I have no doubt that people still like the PGA and that is great but don't try to figure out LIV. Just watch it or not that is your call. As far as growing the game would not bringing in a new league in itself be growing the game? PGA wants to grow the game only if they can control the game.
One thing I would love from your channel would be some consistency, on the one hand a podcast (very good by the way) with Bryson which has a soft tone about LiV and now a hard tone that you don't get the teams side, cant see it benefiting the game etc. The reality is this is all about money and is no different to any other sport or industry including UA-cam. Some may suggest that your soft tone with Bryson was about ensuring his engagement so to create great content and so make more money. Anything new in the market and creates change, this is happening and only time will tell what the outcome is.
Who's watching this after Rick as announced he's joined LIV? 🙄😂
$20 for a bucket of range balls
$60 to walk 18 holes
$75 for a dozen golf balls
$750 for a driver
$750 for woods/hybrids
$2000 for irons
$1000 for wedges and a putter
$300 for a golf bag
$250 for golf shoes
$300 for golf clothes
$250 for a range finder
$20 for golf tees
$40 for food and drinks per round
Golf ain't cheap
Even if you divide this total by 2, it still comes out pricey for us average people.
14 Weekends at LIV and 38 at PGA easy choice! 🙂
Or another way of thinking, wins a few million on PGA, or gets handed 600 million dollars for a few years hitting a ball
Yeah! Why work hard. Imagine LIV Hospital and Health care, where doctors get to play video games and work three days a week, in shorts while listening to music!! For ten times more money even! Who would say no to that.
No golfer plays 38 weeks, Tiger in his time played like 18-22 weeks that’s it. And if playing 18-22 weeks a year is too much for LIV players screw them, let them try working 50-52 weeks a year.
@jorgecgonzalez9976 which is why LIV works. You know all of those big names will be at every event (barring injury). You don't turn a GP on and wonder which drivers will actually be taking part
Great show gents - think the real growth is outside the US and UK from a LIV perspective. Rahm moves the proverbial needle in Continental Europe, Cam Smith and Leishman in Australasia, Niemann etc in South America, Louis and Schwartzel in SA. If LIV get Hideki across then Japanese eyes will follow. Golf is a global game, 3 of the 4 majors in the US is stunting global growth imho. On the teams they are also aligned to those geographies (Ripper is Aus, Stingers is SA etc) and will build fan bases in those geographies. Mostly though, am simply stunned by the mismanagement of an entire sport and infrastructure by Monahan and Pelley 🤦♂️
I literally just watch the majors. I think the average golf fan does the same. Nothing really changes.
I'm a single man with no family. Hell, I'd be happy to play for 5 million/yr just because I love the game. LIV-Do you want to contract me?
Rick- don't really think the team deal works is based on you being at one event. You remind of Blockbuster thinking Netflix was not a threat. The players are into the team deal because they make more money...its that simple. I dont recall hearing you saying TW's ridiculous simulator league teams were bad???
People talking about Rahm changing his tune and going back on his own words seem to forget that Jay Monahan has since announced he was cosying up with PIF and LIV without any input from the players, leaving many players wondering why they were being loyal to the PGA. That announcement would have changed his thinking a lot and the thinking of many other players. Why would you stay loyal to the PGA if even the PGA isn't staying loyal to the PGA?
The most important reason professionals are leaving the PGA and joining LIV is the PGA has mistreated the players. The PGA is a corrupt non-profit that hides and embezzles money. Liv is treating their players with dignity and that's the biggest difference.
Couldn't agree more.
You’re wrong.
The PGA is finished. I’m watching Liv now it’s free to watch and you get the best players
Over the past couple of years, there has been a substantial rise in golf fees. The golf course in my vicinity, where my son and I used to frequently play, used to charge $55 per round. However, today, the cost has escalated to $95. This increase is quite significant, especially considering that there hasn't been a noticeable improvement in the course itself. #rollbackgolfprices
I firmly believe that part of the contract with LIV, includes that the players must make mandatory statements such as: “it’s good for the game of golf”, “Grow the game of golf”, “Future of golf”.
Shocker they want to promote their brand. Sorry to be negative...but that's part & parcel, you will naturally promote your brand vs obvious criticisms
I HEARD ALSO...... RORY FOR 1 BILLION DOLLERS! 😂😂❤❤
The PGAT’s house is collapsing. Waxhovia announced today that 2024!will be last year they sponsor the Charlotte, NC tournament. I believe Wachovia is headquartered inCharlotte, so that’s a big deal!
Try telling your wife you turned down 500 million dollars, theres your answer
Personally think a bit part of him joining LIV is the PGA tour is all about Tiger and Rory even though in my opinion he’s the best player in the world, I think Rahm wants to be the man
Rahm has the most wins, top 5’s, top 10’s, since 2016.
PGA Tour getting what they deserve. Alot of us outside the US and UK will embrace LIV bringing golf back to our shores and making it more of a world game not just the North American golf Tour. Besides we get the four majors anyway. Week to week you got the PGA, LIV, DP WORLD etc etc so you have choices of what you want to see and let's be honest who actually knows half the players on a PGA leaderboard these days anyway?
I loved the LIV event i went to. The shot gun start made it amazing! I am not able to do a regular pga event with my health issues. I can go out for 4 hours and see everyone who is playing by setting on one hole. The smaller crowd sizes made is so easy to chat with players. Everyone who went with us agreed We will be back !
I really enjoy this podcast and have listened to every ep, but just a bit of criticism, say what you want about LIV lads, it's making up about 85% of the content on this podcast at the moment, and it's basically the same conversation every time.
I had largely quit watching PGA, and quit reading the golf industry publications that provide cover and support. I watch more golf - beyond the majors - because of what LIV has brought to the game. Also, the comparison to racing is a good one. I root for the Crushers because I like Bryson DeChambeau and I have come to like his teammates because of his efforts to market them on UA-cam. In racing, I root for the Andretti Family, as well as Ganassi and Penske because I feel like I know them from watching for many years. It will take time, but someone might root for the RangeGoats after Bubba Watson retires because they were a fan of his and he is still an owner or captain. We will see, but for me, I am happy to have LIV because it has allowed me to enjoy regular golf events - plus their end of year team competition is fun to watch. Also, LIV’s Promotions tournament - happening this weekend - is providing great drama and is worthy of more attention.
LOVE the podcast.
Easier to listen than any other. Thank you
Xander, Cantlay and Finau after the Sentry Tournament of Champions. Will make you question who has the better roster?
They still will whinge, it's what they've been conditioned to do
I love liv. Im australian went to Adelaide, everyone that went loved it and ive already got tickets for next year. Happy to watch more great players join.
I agree with Rick, Golf is being priced out of reach for the Man in the street. My membership has increased 25% in 2 years and I am now considering giving it up, having played since a kid. Many clubs are going to have a huge shock coming the Covid bubble is about to burst and with an average age at my club of 58 they are going to be screwed.
Inflation is real
Not for wages it isn’t
Inflation and supply & demand combined. Like any business, they'll charge as much as people will pay in a free market. That has zero to do with Jon Rahm's wages
Rick a lot has to do with more and more players getting fed up with the PGA tour and how they have no plan for the future not to mention how they don't bother to communicate whatever plan to the players. The question of moving now becomes "why not and why stay loyal to the PGA tour. What is the PGA doing for me now to turn down hundreds of millions to join LIV who clearly has a plan and look after it's players"
And Caddies, and LIV is free to air on UA-cam, and networked on stations all over the world, the PGA dropped the ball because of their protectionism
I hate to see Rahm leave. I’m a huge fan and will miss seeing him play at PGA events.
It should all work out like it was set up to in the beginning. LIV right from the start tailored thier schedule around all the big events so players could go play them on off weeks. PGA and DP made a huge mistake for viewership with the bans but likely that will be resolved soon.
And now live golf, live as in broadcast live, can be viewed free on UA-cam and on an app, anywhere, and replayed at anytime afterwards. That's Growing the game, all around the world, instead of needing to pay for view. LIV is also networked on several hundred channels worldwide.
And with the shotgun start its a digestible amount of time to watch, and we get to see the entire event from start to finish.
@@matthewh8548As long as you continue to restrict the field sizes to around 48 contracted players.
If the networks accepted LIV golf, it would become more popular.
They might. We might. We love rap music now, and hum along to the F word all the time. Then go to church of course.
Rap music has been a terrible watered down, vulture culture product, for quite some time. If a deal isn’t figured out, golf will become the same.
@@mr.harmon6907 There were some really good rap songs in the 80s...some were clever or funny, some dealt with social issues etc....but since then it's rare. All music is being attacked by Autotune, and here comes AI, which will certainly encourage laziness and damage creativity. Progress sometimes, is really it's opposite IMO...I don't think I'm saying that because I turned 60 this year, I still listen to today's music and watch today's movies etc....and appreciate good product...but it's becoming more and more rare. Tiger going for the green at the Canadian Open from a bunker over water, with a 6-iron to cover 205 yards...all fronted by that lake, for no reason with a one shot lead, other than to prove what he could do. This is not going to happen again. There was Jack, and then Tiger, and now....I think we'll celebrate whoever signs the first Billion $$ contract with LIV....that's where we're at.
With the team aspect and player thing. As an Aussie I go for the Ripper GC but my favourite player is Bryson so I Follow my team and follow my player it's a win win for me
I'm a fan of watching Rick Shiels videos, they're entertaining to me. Its so funny to watch someone like Rick that has a closed mind attempt to argue their views when they're completely feeling based. He mainly watches PGA big tour events, but no other tours, DP, LPGA etc. Maybe he's just not a golf fan in general. He's made a great living being a club pro off of actual golf fans and the golf industry. Yet he cant understand how a 6 year old can grow up watching a LIV team from that age on. And be a legacy fan? It like trying to argue or discuss something with a gal friend that knows they're absolutely incorrect based in logic. But still have to be ignorant just because.
All the while broadcasting from Dubai. This is one of the most disappointing ways to see Rick Shiels. It's so funny too that he just dropped a video taking Dechambeus tips. Super hypocritical if you ask me.
This is exactly what I thought watching this video... He's just had his golf swing fixed by Dechambeau and didn't even know he'd had a broken hand... It's incredible that he's not really a fan of golf but seems to think his opinion should matter to fans... My son is 18 this month and chasing the dream of becoming a tour pro... He truly doesn't care which tour he plays on however he realises he'd be financially better off even coming last on LIV for a year lol
@wastefulungratfuls Wishing your Son the best of luck! Hopefully he has tons of fun and success 👊🏽
With all due respect to one comment you made. If you were to go back and watch 3 scenarios. One you spoke on bryson making an important putt for crushers to win. Watch their final round of the year and you can see it meant a LOT. Second Adelade was the best golf product of the year outside of the masters (so much fun and decades of Australians letting lose because they finally got their big event. Aussie pga wasn't it). And lastly. For the sheer emotion. Danny Lee coming from the grave and getting a win in that fashion was incredible. Now I'm not biased. I love the pga tour, specifically the Marque events but there is a place. I think the pga tour is too long and if scheduling works out they can both exist. Kinda like having two Starbucks right next to each other in a small town. Doesn't make sense. And LIV travels around the world so I see that as a positive. I'm a hopeful person and I hope it helps the game. Just hard whenever you make a change because kf the uncertainty. Fingers crossed
Here in Florida golf has doubled in the past 3 years.
Here in Central Florida it is true.
Same in uk everyone I know is playing golf or taken it up
TBH...I watch more UA-cam golf than I do PGA/DP golf (outside of the majors) the short form exhibition format of the game is the way forward and what people are consuming, Rick being one of them and profiting from the direction of the game! We just need to accept it and enjoy it. I certainly am!
Didn’t the PGA jump into bed with the same people who own LIV? So if both tours are funded by the same source why not choose where you prefer to play and people shouldn’t judge these guys.
Regarding rolling back the ball, now there are going to be "pre-roll back" versions of the ProV1 that are sold almost as a black market ball. But regarding the equipment, it's the same as when they got rid of square grooves.
I just realised the other day someone asked if I watched Liv- my first thought was actually no. But, I also don’t watch PGA week to week, the coverage is tragic except if you are tuned in for ads. What I do is watch more highlights of
Liv than a run of mill pga tournament. A lot more because I like the big name players more. As for growing the game- in US and UK Liv isn’t growing the game and doesn’t need to. In other places where these tournaments are held mexico, austrailia Asia etc- It is. australians for sure love liv.
Agree with the LIV team comments, They need to add four 4v4 team shootout events in the schedule. 3 during the season and a final event...
Rick, you don't think the team aspect of LIV is a draw for the fans. Lol, the amount of team merchandise LIV sells at events is insane!!! Team aspect is great!
He is purposely ignoring facts like that, he's media now, biased and BS are king
Remember how quick the PGA Tour dropped the Western Open for the Fed Ex cup/BMW. The western was the oldest and possibly rig]chest tournament on tour for $$$$$. These guys play golf for money and to take care of their families. Good on you players.
Commenting before this video is deleted.
Where do our future stars build there reputation. You do understand these players on liv will get old.
There’s no way you two watch a random PGA event over a LIV event. These players are moving because of money yes, but also but the rest you get over summer and the shorter rounds. LIV is growing the game of golf whether you like it or not.
😅😅
I'd much rather watch the lowest PGA Tour event than the highest LIV event. I don't like 3 days of play. I don't like shotgun starts. I don't like teams. I don't like that LIV players can wear shorts. I hate everything LIV does. So, you're wrong. There is a way that people would watch a random PGA Tour event over a LIV event.
@@NC-1861 and I bet you’re also collar shirts at all golf courses, if you’re not a member you can’t play, no 2 balls on weekends. Very old fashioned, golf is moving on and you should try and keep your with it. As far as the lowest PGA event is concerned, if no top 20 players are playing then I couldn’t think of anything more boring to watch haha.
@rinorzeqiri7450 If you love golf, its not boring to watch if no big names are playing. I have no problem with non-members playing as long as they take care of the course. And I don't know what you mean by no 2 balls on weekends.
@@NC-1861 and that’s exactly why LIV is helping the sport grow because they’ve got people like myself who would much rather play than watch, watch a few LIV events as they’re shorter and the line up is full of top names. As a casual I’ve got no interest in watching a tour event with no big players playing.
There is an opportunity presenting itself here for golf to reach out and grow worldwide .That is what JR has recognised.The PGA has missed the boat big style by being too protectionist and not taking the opportunity to export their Brand beyond a few co- sanctioned events .
Golf is already worldwide lol
Big style 🤙
What? Golf is already global. How does LIV do that exactly? This is 100% about money.
Team golf can one hundred percent be very interesting if done right. There are many formats of team golf where you can mix in the events. Collegiate and high school golf are super fun and works. If there are 5 or 6 events where they player match play, scramble, best ball, alt shot, etc. If the goal of the tournament was to win as a team rather than win as an individual, people would tune in and slowly build fandom for the team rather than the individual.
I'm surprise nobody in LIV has thought about forcing teams to be located or related to a city. That's the number one reason most fans of any sport will support a team.
My own view is that the teams will be franchised to corporates. Team Nike, Adidas etc. Hence why Rahm gets equity....but...I do agree with you, that would be better for the fan
Wouldn't you have to live there?
It helps, but it isnt necessary either. There are plenty of people that support Lakers that aren't from LA, or Manchester United that aren't from Manchester.
Proud to say that I have watched every LIV event. Playing on a college golf team was the best days of my golfing life. Memories that will last forever. I truly believe this will thrive in LIV, also.
Guy is crying that Rahm has joined LIV!!
😂 ridiculous isn’t it😂
this is the most relaxed rick has ever looked
Human rights record of Saudi Arabia vs Dubai? #samesame
Would like to see Rick and Guy play some rounds with the Titleist TruFeel golf ball. I’ve been told that the compression will be lowered to limit the ball distance and that the TruFeel ball will be very similar to the rollback standards.
hypocritical quotes aside, I actually think this was a brilliant move by Rahm. He knew before this the Liv players wouldn't be able to play the Ryder Cup (or at least greatly suspected), so he waited until after the Ryder Cup on "home turf" to make his decision. In that time the he has won the Master's (gets lifetime invite), and the PGA and LIV have started trying to make an agreement to work together. So with an agreement on the horizon that will likely allow players to compete in both leages and maybe play in Ryder Cup by the time it comes around again (especially in Europe), Rahm has now taken his massive cash out, and will likely still be able to be to play pretty much whatever events he wants. What a win for him! 👏👏
Some don’t like how disingenuous he was with his comments against LIV and the format and the money. And now he calls the same thing “innovative.” It’s just phony. Now he’s just a shill and his words about anything are meaningless.
Yeah he's probably worth that I'm happy for him hope he does well when your a good golfer you deserve the time you put into your game
PGA tour is America dominant…. LIV is a world tour….. that’s how it grows the game as it’s everywhere for everyone
Maybe it's time for a UA-cam golf tour, I would watch that over LIV all day!!! I would definitely tune in to the PGA when Tiger is playing but if there was a UA-cam tour, I wouldn't miss any of that.
Unless it was a scramble, it wouldnt last long at all. No preferred lies, gimmes or breakfast mulligans, most would score 80+. Maybe if it was along the lines of a BDS can a hole it would work ?
Rick has been talking about wanting to do "YT Masters" with fellow YT golf creators, just couldn't swing it this year. It does sound like big logistic task to have enough cameras etc for 18 holes (or however many they're spread out over) to make it worthwhile to watch
Rick, do a test with highest compression ball vs lowest and see how different your numbers are.
I get the sense that most people have never watched a PGA event on TV. It is completely unwatchable. It's boring, but even if you wanted to watch, they only show 2 or 3 players and the ads get in the way. They don't show the first two days so you don't see the cut anyhow. You only see the last two days while LIV shows all 3 days. As to Guy's arguments, they all apply to PGA. What does it matter if someone wins a PGA event? Doesn't mean squat. LIV with the shotgun start means there's always something going on and I've started watching golf again.
I am with Rick. I am very very worried with the future of golf😢
Hooray!!! Great News!!!