What i have learnt from running these v8 engines, is that they don't like to be started up and not driven, as they like to soot plugs for fun! If you are going to start the engine then make sure you take it for a drive and get the engine up to full temperature, that way the plugs can self clean. I would do a oil change , valvoline 20w50 is best for these engines as it has the zinc needed too protect the camshaft, also i would add some ametech restore oil (oil additive) which will boost the compression.
I'm sorry but you are talking twaddle. You say it's an SD1 engine. It does not look like it. If it is you've got the wrong length spark plugs. Oil on the outside of them is rocker cover gaskets leaking. Propper tools would get the plugs out. You are supposed to do a compression test with ALL the plugs out & throttle fully open. Get someone who knows what their doing. The 4.6 is probably the worst Rover V8 of all time.
Evening Sheldon, great video as always with top notch narration,, the plugs in the engine should be BPR6ES long reach and NOT NP5HS short reach Plugs. Oil outside on the spark plug means an external leak not rings or valve stems seals, Also if no air is been drawn into the carb's it must be getting air from somewhere else, Try removing the oil filler cap when it's running and see if the RPM increase, Finally oil in the dash pots 3 in 1 viscosity, very important. All the Best.
Glad to see your health improving and you back on the tube! Car looks ace when I saw video 1.....looking forward to seeing this one and will comment if I think I can assist. Julian/USA
Careful Sheldon. I assume you've not passed your test? Technically you are operating a motor vehicle by starting on a public road. Not having a pop, just saying. Don't want you to get into trouble.
Sheldon.. I admire you. You have a great collection of cars. As for your P6. Remove your carbs and the manifold and rebuild them with easily obtained kits. Replace the gasket and the plugs. Replace the dizzy points with an electronic replacement. And as for the smoking, I'd check out your piston rings. Good luck.
That is a classic Rover V8 symptom the static timing is out a few degrees. They don't like much variation running on 4 star / unleaded to the BTDC or they will crank ages and not fire. If the static is OK, the other probable cause is that there's wear in the distributor drive, or baseplate. It should fire before it's completed one full revolution if everything is OK, without all that wheezing and cranking. Check the backlash in the distributor drive. If you can turn the rotor arm more than a degree or so, it's too worn. You'll need to pull it out and maybe renew the gear and roll pin. Same with the baseplate, check it moves smoothly and there's not sloppy wear in the pivot point rivets. If it is a Lucas D8, it's got the original P6B one, and likely well past it's best now. Some pre 1973/4 V8's suffered with worn base plates, causing erratic points gap, the later one with the concentric baseplate are better. SD1 distributors all have electronic ignition. It could be that thin old oil is causing hydraulic lifter delay, and it will be seeping down the valve stems, and it will drink it like a fish past the oil rings. A good healthy engine with correct mixture set doesn't have a great deal of suction at tickover. You'll need to check the carb pistons are free to move their full stroke. If you're using an engine originally from a 4x4, you'll have a fair bit of parts swapping as the water pump is mounted higher, on a different style timing case. The fan won't clear the bonnet with that set up, and you may need to swap the crank drive boss and pully and spacers about to get proper alignment for the drive belts, and it to work the new type concentric oil pump inside the timing cover. Not a simple swap, unless you know what parts will swap over. Looking at the engine serial number will identify exactly what vehicle it was originally fitted to. Pre 1973 build engines have the number and compression ratio stamped on a web at the left rear, above the flywheel. Post 1973 have it on a web next to the dipstick tube. If it's hardly visible on a later engine, it's usually a sign the block has been surface ground to cure warp, or corrosion pitting.
Hiya Brian thanks for the comment helpful as always but there should be alot more suction then that even at tickover as our SD1 is the same engine and that has alot more suction so the nest thing I will be looking into is the vally gasket as if there is a massive air leak that would make alot of sence! But we are going to go over the other things you mentioned as you will see in upcoming videos!
@classic_britain No, they don't suck that much air on tick over. The base of the dash pot piston is barely above the jet bridge at correct tick over. Your engine still has its P6B rocker covers, so if the SD1 has the same, it's got a P5B or P6B engine if you can find the engine number, I should be able to tell you its original build spec, and the exact model it came from the factory in. I used to tune all mine, even worn you could get them to run turbine smooth. With everything set up, nothing worn in the timing, they'll pick up and run from 500rpm to red line with little flutter or lumpy. You can barely hear the 3.5 carb V8 in my 1985 SD1 if you close the bonnet. People mistakenly overfuel the carb and then screw up the air screw to match the fuel. Start with the jet flush with the bridge and screw the fuel screw no more than a half turn, then adjust the air to match, not the fuel. My SD1 would achieve near 40 mpg on a motorway run with ease.
In theory you should be able to remove the spark plugs with one of those fancy "T" handle tools. The advantage of those is that you won't end up over tightening them and they also fit down the holes in the cylinder head. To remove stubborn plugs you will have to get hold of a thin wall plug socket, preferably 1/2" drive. The outside diameter will have to be no larger than 27 mm. I ended up turning the outside down in the lathe to a length of 32 mm so it will reach the bottom of the plug hole without binding on the cylinder head. It's worth also getting a 1/2" universal joint socket as well for the hard to get to plugs.
Some great advice from the hive mind. It's great to see the old girl out in daylight. I would expect those plugs have been in for over 8 years. Also it's only did around 800 miles in the 18 years dad had it and less than 100 since he passed in 2016. As others have said probably worth changing the plugs, two sets in the boot and test for air leaks. Take care mate
Throw in some additives, premium fuel and give it a good blast down the freeway, gently tricking water into the carbs while giving it a good rev will clean out alot of carbon also, my friend is a Rover Guru and runs trans fluid in the SU pistons helps them operate especially in cold weather, keep up the P6 content, love it!.
Strip the carbs and clean them and flush out all the old fuel, new filters and put new petrol in. If that does not improve things then a top end rebuild . Bottom end looks fine from the oil pressure and no knocks. Good luck.
If the engine runs, There can`t be too much wrong, ( Timing / Firing order etc ) I think your problem is contamination from the petrol tank, Enough is getting by the fuel line and carbs to idle, But as soon as you increase the revs the fuel / air cannot meet demand
Hi Sheldon. The engine sounds fine to me and as it has good oil pressure I would give it a good drive to clear itself a bit. Maybe then change the plugs and see how it goes from then ,also I assume you have put a little oil in both dash pots, should help with the running issue. So what if it burns a little oil as long as there isn't clouds of smoke coming out the back just enjoy it as it is for a while.
Glad that you are doing that because in my previous comment that is what I said I would do so once again hope that has helped.Also looking at that you have vacuum leaks all over the place looking at the compression test with a good run that will come up so in my opinion vacuum leaks sorted out and good quality plugs ( bosh not champion) sort out the carbs points condenser dizzy and rotor button leads oil change and all filters happy days in my opinion also check fuel pressure if it is low put an electric fuel pump in it and check the o ring in the fuel changeover valve from main tank to the reserve tank.
Hey man glad to see you back hope you are feeling better love your videos nice rover you got there & glad you still got the firetruck take care you are aprecciated.
I've had dash pot oil issues on an SU in the past, poor start, not revving etc. after replacing a rebuilt head. I'd used too thick viscosity oil in dash pot and when cleaned and replaced with lighter oil it ran perfect. Not saying this is the issue with Sheldon's motor though.
I don't think there's necessarily much wrong with that engine. It just needs setting up right and taken out for a decent run. The plugs could be dirty because it's not been used much for a while, and it may have other small things not quite right like an air leak that's bypassing the intake. Don't jump to conclusions without giving it a thorough going over...
Have you thought about the crank-case ventilation valve (PCV) or maybe even worn piston rings on the oily plugs? I think you mentioned the o rings too.
I know you like the steering wheel. You won't be interested but the minute I see one of those non original type wheels I think someone has pratted around with the car elsewhere, be it on a TR, Jag or P6.
If it's not sucking in the intake to the carb, then you probably have a leak somewhere else (carburettor base gasket? intake manifold? etc) engine shouldn't be tired, compression is good! CAREFULLY spray some brake cleaner around carb base gasket and other suspected leaking areas when running and listen for change of engine note (denoting a leak) Do a full carb clean and rebuild first, before condemning the engine... it's easier to rebuild a carb than swap an engine!
Compression test needs to be done properly! Done after a run, engine warm, important on hydraulic tappet engines, a cold engine may have tappets leaked down that will affect readings. Must have All plugs out Must hold throttle fully open and ignition disabled. Turn engine on starter till comp gauge does not climb anymore, not just 4 turns of crank! Maybe one or more of those plugs you can't get out is bad. Try again to remove them with fully hot engine, use unequal expansion to your advantage. Replace with NGK in boot.....! A bit of oil on plug threads doesn't spell doom! You'll find it easier with manual choke SU to give bit of throttle to start, I noticed you didn't touch gas pedal at all during starting, these old P6 do not have FASD devices like SD1, need a little pedal! It seems, you Want to condemn this engine, I dunno why....
What i have learnt from running these v8 engines, is that they don't like to be started up and not driven, as they like to soot plugs for fun! If you are going to start the engine then make sure you take it for a drive and get the engine up to full temperature, that way the plugs can self clean. I would do a oil change , valvoline 20w50 is best for these engines as it has the zinc needed too protect the camshaft, also i would add some ametech restore oil (oil additive) which will boost the compression.
I'm sorry but you are talking twaddle. You say it's an SD1 engine. It does not look like it. If it is you've got the wrong length spark plugs. Oil on the outside of them is rocker cover gaskets leaking. Propper tools would get the plugs out. You are supposed to do a compression test with ALL the plugs out & throttle fully open. Get someone who knows what their doing. The 4.6 is probably the worst Rover V8 of all time.
Evening Sheldon, great video as always with top notch narration,, the plugs in the engine should be BPR6ES long reach and NOT NP5HS short reach Plugs. Oil outside on the spark plug means an external leak not rings or valve stems seals, Also if no air is been drawn into the carb's it must be getting air from somewhere else, Try removing the oil filler cap when it's running and see if the RPM increase, Finally oil in the dash pots 3 in 1 viscosity, very important. All the Best.
It has a SD1 engine so not sure if that takes the long plugs but funnily enough there are a brand new set of the long kind of spark plugs in the boot!
Glad to see your health improving and you back on the tube! Car looks ace when I saw video 1.....looking forward to seeing this one and will comment if I think I can assist. Julian/USA
Careful Sheldon. I assume you've not passed your test? Technically you are operating a motor vehicle by starting on a public road. Not having a pop, just saying. Don't want you to get into trouble.
Hello most of the oil is on the outside of plugs so could be rocker cover gasket.
Good video.👍
Sheldon.. I admire you. You have a great collection of cars. As for your P6. Remove your carbs and the manifold and rebuild them with easily obtained kits. Replace the gasket and the plugs. Replace the dizzy points with an electronic replacement. And as for the smoking, I'd check out your piston rings.
Good luck.
Love the Rover P6 you now have. I have no clue what is wrong but it is good to have you back on and letting us know what is going on..
That is a classic Rover V8 symptom the static timing is out a few degrees. They don't like much variation running on 4 star / unleaded to the BTDC or they will crank ages and not fire. If the static is OK, the other probable cause is that there's wear in the distributor drive, or baseplate. It should fire before it's completed one full revolution if everything is OK, without all that wheezing and cranking. Check the backlash in the distributor drive. If you can turn the rotor arm more than a degree or so, it's too worn. You'll need to pull it out and maybe renew the gear and roll pin. Same with the baseplate, check it moves smoothly and there's not sloppy wear in the pivot point rivets. If it is a Lucas D8, it's got the original P6B one, and likely well past it's best now. Some pre 1973/4 V8's suffered with worn base plates, causing erratic points gap, the later one with the concentric baseplate are better. SD1 distributors all have electronic ignition. It could be that thin old oil is causing hydraulic lifter delay, and it will be seeping down the valve stems, and it will drink it like a fish past the oil rings. A good healthy engine with correct mixture set doesn't have a great deal of suction at tickover. You'll need to check the carb pistons are free to move their full stroke. If you're using an engine originally from a 4x4, you'll have a fair bit of parts swapping as the water pump is mounted higher, on a different style timing case. The fan won't clear the bonnet with that set up, and you may need to swap the crank drive boss and pully and spacers about to get proper alignment for the drive belts, and it to work the new type concentric oil pump inside the timing cover. Not a simple swap, unless you know what parts will swap over. Looking at the engine serial number will identify exactly what vehicle it was originally fitted to. Pre 1973 build engines have the number and compression ratio stamped on a web at the left rear, above the flywheel. Post 1973 have it on a web next to the dipstick tube. If it's hardly visible on a later engine, it's usually a sign the block has been surface ground to cure warp, or corrosion pitting.
Hiya Brian thanks for the comment helpful as always but there should be alot more suction then that even at tickover as our SD1 is the same engine and that has alot more suction so the nest thing I will be looking into is the vally gasket as if there is a massive air leak that would make alot of sence! But we are going to go over the other things you mentioned as you will see in upcoming videos!
@classic_britain No, they don't suck that much air on tick over. The base of the dash pot piston is barely above the jet bridge at correct tick over. Your engine still has its P6B rocker covers, so if the SD1 has the same, it's got a P5B or P6B engine if you can find the engine number, I should be able to tell you its original build spec, and the exact model it came from the factory in. I used to tune all mine, even worn you could get them to run turbine smooth. With everything set up, nothing worn in the timing, they'll pick up and run from 500rpm to red line with little flutter or lumpy. You can barely hear the 3.5 carb V8 in my 1985 SD1 if you close the bonnet. People mistakenly overfuel the carb and then screw up the air screw to match the fuel. Start with the jet flush with the bridge and screw the fuel screw no more than a half turn, then adjust the air to match, not the fuel. My SD1 would achieve near 40 mpg on a motorway run with ease.
Sheldon looking well dude and back to what you love.
In theory you should be able to remove the spark plugs with one of those fancy "T" handle tools. The advantage of those is that you won't end up over tightening them and they also fit down the holes in the cylinder head. To remove stubborn plugs you will have to get hold of a thin wall plug socket, preferably 1/2" drive. The outside diameter will have to be no larger than 27 mm. I ended up turning the outside down in the lathe to a length of 32 mm so it will reach the bottom of the plug hole without binding on the cylinder head. It's worth also getting a 1/2" universal joint socket as well for the hard to get to plugs.
Also with compression numbers like that the engine I would say is pretty good.
Some great advice from the hive mind. It's great to see the old girl out in daylight. I would expect those plugs have been in for over 8 years. Also it's only did around 800 miles in the 18 years dad had it and less than 100 since he passed in 2016. As others have said probably worth changing the plugs, two sets in the boot and test for air leaks. Take care mate
I would but it's like someone put the plugs in with a airgun LOL
Throw in some additives, premium fuel and give it a good blast down the freeway, gently tricking water into the carbs while giving it a good rev will clean out alot of carbon also, my friend is a Rover Guru and runs trans fluid in the SU pistons helps them operate especially in cold weather, keep up the P6 content, love it!.
Strip the carbs and clean them and flush out all the old fuel, new filters and put new petrol in. If that does not improve things then a top end rebuild . Bottom end looks fine from the oil pressure and no knocks. Good luck.
If the engine runs, There can`t be too much wrong, ( Timing / Firing order etc ) I think your problem is contamination from the petrol tank, Enough is getting by the fuel line and carbs to idle, But as soon as you increase the revs the fuel / air cannot meet demand
Just needs an Italian tune up Sheldon !
He Sheldon, a suggestion for you with the plugs, use a sharpie and number them all so you know where they go back 😂
Hi Sheldon. The engine sounds fine to me and as it has good oil pressure I would give it a good drive to clear itself a bit. Maybe then change the plugs and see how it goes from then ,also I assume you have put a little oil in both dash pots, should help with the running issue. So what if it burns a little oil as long as there isn't clouds of smoke coming out the back just enjoy it as it is for a while.
Hi Sheldon give it a oil change, new plugs and take out for a good run should clear it out. Cheers 🍻
Glad that you are doing that because in my previous comment that is what I said I would do so once again hope that has helped.Also looking at that you have vacuum leaks all over the place looking at the compression test with a good run that will come up so in my opinion vacuum leaks sorted out and good quality plugs ( bosh not champion) sort out the carbs points condenser dizzy and rotor button leads oil change and all filters happy days in my opinion also check fuel pressure if it is low put an electric fuel pump in it and check the o ring in the fuel changeover valve from main tank to the reserve tank.
Hey man glad to see you back hope you are feeling better love your videos nice rover you got there & glad you still got the firetruck take care you are aprecciated.
The plugs will be dirty and sooty if its just sat there running on choke. Best checking them after a good run
Another good video 👍👍👍⭐️⭐️⭐️👏👏👏👏
Decent Oil pressure! nothing wrong with that Engine! all it needs carbs, Balancing then a Good Run .
I would Guess Carb problem ..Check dash pot oil ..hope it helps ..Great looking car in fab condition ..Hope your keeping well
It's not the carb there is zero suction
I've had dash pot oil issues on an SU in the past, poor start, not revving etc. after replacing a rebuilt head. I'd used too thick viscosity oil in dash pot and when cleaned and replaced with lighter oil it ran perfect. Not saying this is the issue with Sheldon's motor though.
I guess i was right mate glad you sorted it out ...
Oil on the outside of the plugs must be coming from above. Probably rocker cover gaskets
I don't think there's necessarily much wrong with that engine. It just needs setting up right and taken out for a decent run. The plugs could be dirty because it's not been used much for a while, and it may have other small things not quite right like an air leak that's bypassing the intake. Don't jump to conclusions without giving it a thorough going over...
Nice one Sheldon, try a good run in it to clear it out .
Worth watching just to look at it 😊
You should fully depress the throttle when doing a compression test
I did off camera and made no odds
@@classic_britain also do a compression test when hot to see if any difference to when cold!
Oh yes, you'll get better results for ast throttle opening and not cutting out, check dashpot oil in SU's and Fit The Air Filter!
Have you thought about the crank-case ventilation valve (PCV) or maybe even worn piston rings on the oily plugs? I think you mentioned the o rings too.
I know you like the steering wheel. You won't be interested but the minute I see one of those non original type wheels I think someone has pratted around with the car elsewhere, be it on a TR, Jag or P6.
Great sparkling video footage 😅
Strip & rebuild the Carbs.
If it's not sucking in the intake to the carb, then you probably have a leak somewhere else (carburettor base gasket? intake manifold? etc) engine shouldn't be tired, compression is good!
CAREFULLY spray some brake cleaner around carb base gasket and other suspected leaking areas when running and listen for change of engine note (denoting a leak)
Do a full carb clean and rebuild first, before condemning the engine... it's easier to rebuild a carb than swap an engine!
Yeah worth a look at the vally gasket
I think if you give it a good service mate it'll be good
Compression test needs to be done properly!
Done after a run, engine warm, important on hydraulic tappet engines, a cold engine may have tappets leaked down that will affect readings.
Must have All plugs out
Must hold throttle fully open and ignition disabled. Turn engine on starter till comp gauge does not climb anymore, not just 4 turns of crank!
Maybe one or more of those plugs you can't get out is bad. Try again to remove them with fully hot engine, use unequal expansion to your advantage.
Replace with NGK in boot.....!
A bit of oil on plug threads doesn't spell doom!
You'll find it easier with manual choke SU to give bit of throttle to start, I noticed you didn't touch gas pedal at all during starting, these old P6 do not have FASD devices like SD1, need a little pedal!
It seems, you Want to condemn this engine, I dunno why....
Hello again the lack of luck on carbs could be pistons no opening in side carb.just an idea
Theres oil around the plugs not on the plugs check the rocker cover before stripping an engine pal
Take the orange oil cover off see if you got any mayonnaise in there
Just go for a drive
Atleast you don't have to remove the cylinder heads to replace the valve stem oil seals
Welcome back! I love the P6s.
Do you find it a pain in the arse tinkering with cars on the roadside?
Nice car; but what about storage is the not a danger it will rust??
All cars rust in time but this one is water tight so it's not at any serious risk
Thought this "New modern" fuel doesn't like standing too long🙃
Have you tuned and synced the carbs, and checked timing?
Yep
Looking at it then leads spark plugs distributor cap rotor arm condenser, and coil all look like toast😢
Why does the car sit like there’s no engine in it? Looks high at the front and low at the back
Hi Sheldon
Grade of petrol maybe?. Weak fuel pump? give it a good drive may be nothing much.
That's won't effect the lack of suction in the carbs
Another possible cause an intake leak.
Yeah that's my next guess