Zoom Lock Push Fittings R410A Optimized - A Brazing Alternative
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- Опубліковано 2 січ 2021
- Zoom Lock Push Fittings by Parker Sporlan intrigued me when I first layed eyes on them, I had to test them out. More and more brazing alternatives are being developed and introduced and Zoom Lock Push Fittings are one of them. They come R410a optimized which are non removable and also in a non R410a optimized which is removable.
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#zoomlock #zoomlockpush #hvac - Авто та транспорт
I enjoyed the experience
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These will become very popular, some companies won’t let you take torches up on a roof to do repairs. I know it sound stupid but it is a fire risk that companies won’t let you take the risk. Great video
Woth some time yes they will
Thank you for your demonstration
I have been at a house all day today fixing a Trane tam9 multi stage system tube kit had everything brazed and bi filter in tried pulling a vacuum thought my hoses were bad turns out the system has the non 410a fittings under the house and the house has 2 systems and the other line set has them too thanks for this vid because I didn’t know there are different fittings for 410a until today I’m just a (braze it ,sewage it )kind of guy . Keep up the great vids 👏👏👏👏
Great demonstration!
Good idea, saves time and situations where you might need to acquire a hot permit. Although I dont like the size of them. For residential or small scale jobs, putting those stacked in line hide may be a pain.
nice tool that can be use hard place to braze and many place& regulation about fire etc and other requirements.
thanks for sharing.
and it will be nice to make vacuum test also.
I will try to get that done as well.
I have been relying on propress. Luckily, most modern systems don't last much longer than 10yrs. I believe the O-ring in propress is rated for 10yrs.
Thank you, excellent video and explanation.
My pleasure
A cool test I'd like to see is you using them hooked up to a system outside (like your own house to be easy) where the weather, temperature, season changes, and moisture are all affecting it and soap bubble testing it after a year and then 2 years and such to have update videos showing the progress of the fittings.
Now that's commitment lol
Yes.
External water freezing against that seal... would be a concern outside for me.
Testing in the real world... a good idea!
This is cool, from the same guys that own RLS? I think RLS fittings can hold more pressure thigh and are a little more forgiving with the prep.
P.s being able to still swing the pipe while attached is both awesome and kinda nerve racking haha if you know what I mean
I had a ball valve on a yellow jacket hose leak after no more than a year and it was a real headache when trying to find out why I had shitty decay on a vacuum. Definitely switching to a legit kit like you've demonstrated in other videos
This why we shouldn't use charging hoses for evac 😉. You'll enjoy your new rig
@@HVACKnowItAll was early on in the trade, live and learn.
Seen them@ the supply house would be interested in the longevity of the fitting due to the expansion and contraction of the pipe
Yes. Freezing and thawing cycles, with external moisture....
Show us how that goes.
Too many products are not tested in "all" conditions.
Interesting, definitely very well made. People talk about Shark bites for plumbing but Ive never seen one fail.
I've never used a Shark Bite, time will tell
I have seen them fail.
Share bite does not like extreme cold.
Had a customer who furnace failed in -25C temperature for about a weak. The house froze up. The hot water tank, someone installed it with Shark bite connector. The shark bite fitting blew right off the pipe , so there was full water blowing out the pipe in the basement for days. What a mess!
Also I have been getting a lot of calls for those Shark Bit hot water tank hose connectors , a lot of "Plumbers" are using these days to reduce install time on tanks installation. What we are seeing is the rubber inside them is deterioration over time and customers are seeing black slime in their tubs when they fill up the tub. Everything has there place but if you can avoid them I would.
@@PaulHVAC1 Pro press fittings have the rubber o-rings too. Just built a 100O room hotel in my area, nothing but pro-press. I’m thinking they will fail too.
@@DanO181919 Seems its all about saving money by reducing labor. If they can hire a apprentice to send out with the press tool, they can make more money by the savings on not having as many journeyman doing the work. Basically you can train a monkey to install this quickly. Like I say there is a place for everything. Maybe use it in a area were using a torch is hazardous....but we all know companies will use this for making more profit on cheap labour.
I saw someone use one on galvi after pulling out the collar. You aren't supposed to do that but it was a DIY guy who did it on a weekend emergency because he had no shut-off and just needed something to stop a flood while they waited for the plumber. They 'should' thread the pipe and and put a valve on it but he was in a hurry and wanted something quick and temporary and didn't care as much about reliability.
Great video & clear audio. How has the pressure rig held up over the last 2 months? Did you end up manipulating/twisting the fittings once it was pressurized?
Yes it's much harder to twist once pressurized. It was still holding up about 3 weeks after. Then I needed my gauges back and took them off.
I believe it is a minimum 24" distance for brazing of 7/8 with wet rag, 20" with 3/4 and so on - same as for zoomlock max. Good that it worked. An easy option for DIY. They have leak rate however, .1 oz per year per joint.
Not many DIY guys with an EPA lisc....
This is revolutionary
Certainly reminds me of the Shark Bite plumbing fittings.. which are quite handy in a pinch in emergency situations.. but would not trust them in a pipe that sees any pressures over 100 PSI.
I can't see using these Zoom Lock fittings on larger systems (5 tons and above). And are we not phasing out 410a anyway? Where were these fittings 10 years ago..
Vary nice video 👍
A bit late to the party, but in the field the pipe's gonna need lagging. So are you meant to buy special sections that fit over the elbows then glue and tape them to the insulation that butts up to it? At the risk of sounding like a ludditte, I'm sticking to pipe benders and brazing thanks - this looks like a lot of pissing about.
What's the lifespan of these? I can see that there is a rubber gasket inside. Once the rubber gasket dies, so does the fitting. I know these may be easier to use, but is welding really that much harder to perform for a permanent connection?
Only time will tell how they stand up. The more we take torches out of techs hands the better.
Thanks for the content ! Excellent job of explaining pressure drop / rise vs size or “ real Estate “ of system . Looking forward to viewing more of your instructional videos .
Jayson Perez
B&G Piping Company
UA local 777
P1, MG1 , S2
On your removal test of the zoom lock fittings, would be interested in seeing if a box end wrench would remove the fitting. We say this because in the plumbing industry a push to connect fitting works as a removal tool i.e. sharkbite brand, gator brand, parker brand we DO NOT utilize the plastic REMOVAL tool a 5/8 in to 7/16 in open box end wrench depending on dia of push to connect fitting. Works with better leverage then the plastic disconnect the manufacture tries to sell i.e some water supply SharkBite valves come with a built in disconnect but again different industry. "The wire" portion must play into the locking and unlocking safety factor Our best practice on push to connect fittings if we cant see the fitting in the final install we dont utilize a push to connect - meaning no hiding behind walls or poor access areas.
Some more to think about and test then haha
@@HVACKnowItAll dont understand your comment
@knowitall - You keep mentioning how nitrogen pressure rises with temperature. Are there some gasses that don't?
Can we do copper to aluminum?
Very cool! Wonder if these will be worth using given the price
Can see applications where they'd be handy
How the depth can be measured without that tool? I have 1/4 and 3/8 pipes to connect.
Do they make them them flare ends ?
I would like to see if they hold after years of temp changes and also the elements specially direct sun light during summer days and chilly nights
Call me old school but I’ll stick to brazing
go with soft solder like stay brite 8. brazing weakens the copper pipeline. it even works on r410a systems
what is a 410 ?? compared to the other?
My supplier has them under different name
I was out on a call for a mini split and it had those fittings and it was a few years old and fitting was leaking I would not use them
The fact that it’s only rated to 500 microns worries me. New installs I like to pull to 200 microns and rise below 500 microns. Would this pass a decay test if it’s only rated to 500 microns
According to specs they are rated for 200 microns, where did you read 500?
Thanks for sharing, this video is over a year old. Do you still like these and recommend them? Also, these are rated for pulling a vacuum too, right? And are the o-rings expected to make it to 20 years or 25 years? Or at least 15 or 10, any idea?
Only way to know is to put one in service and watch it. They're new so no one can tell if 25 years is a thing or not.
Good point. It's worth the risk for some jobs I think.
Exact video I was looking for I was just at a supply house and was like that’s cool but skeptical for obvious reasons. I wanna use it for the aluminum to copper fitting from the new home builders using aluminum. Seems like every single one I go to the brazing sucks and always leaks. Thanks for the vid
Will be a while before we see these in Canada. I would have liked to see you pull a vacuum on these fittings.
I will on the next one
They are rated down to 30 microns
That 'scratch pad' is called Scotch Brite.
Also, using the removal tools are pretty much the same as the removal tools that are used with the Sharkbite fittings. The only difference I've noticed is that the little orange plastic removal tools for the Sharkbite fittings are a pain in the @$$ to use, because they actually hurt my fingers when using them, whereas the ones for the ZoomLock don't.
Scotch Brite is a brand name. Not all scratch pads are Scotch Brite.
So your company has used them for about a year and we have had some failures. Now don’t get me wrong i have had some brazing jobs leak too but the main reason we stopped using them is because sometimes the 3/8 fittings don’t grip and slip of right off the rip. We now use RLS. I like the idea just didn’t seam worth the risk.
Please explain "410-A optimized" fitting vs non optimized??? Differences? Application?
410a is for higher pressure refrigerant, use them on 410a systems
Nice sweatshirt, where’s your Bluon hat?🤔😂😂
Thanks haha
Where can you buy these ? Amazon?
My skepticism lies in the fact that soft tubing isn't always round.
Do you not cap off your copper rolls, I was always taught to put a cap or tape over the end so dust and debris does not get in it, I see you have it pointing down so chances are not much will get in there
Because they're hanging nothing is getting in accepted air and moisture, tape won't solve that though haha
No matter the case, protecting your copper pipe is critical.
If not, at least blow it out with nitro before using it. You wouldn't believe the buildup of material from just sitting in a van for a while. I use 5/16" for refrigeration, buy it in a 50' roll. After a while what's left gets stuff in it if it's not capped off. I buy my caps at a local hardware store
Spiders can and will lay eggs in copper hanging like that so the statement nothing is getting in there except air or moisture is not correct and for someone with the screen name HVAC know it all I would expect better this coming from a fellow know it all also you did not show in you video the outside deburring and in the video you can clearly see metal sticking out after you reamed the inside and then when you show the connection the outside of the tubing is deburred WHY and when did you debur the outside was it because when you were practicing you discovered that if it is not prepared properly then it will damage the fitting ie.. tear into the sleeve or rubber ring. So moral of the story is protect you copper properly by preparing properly all tools and copper tubing is tool
Can we use this coupling on a hard pipe and pressure up to
yes and about 800psi
These are quick connect similar to shark bite connect I wonder if the same company make the shark bite made them to !!🤔👍👍👍
Not sure about that one!
Shark bites are for water line, means working pressure is under 280psi max. This ZL push fittings are working at Max 870psi even high. Big differant.
Can u use these on copper to aluminum??
I think only copper but not 100%
What’s the difference in optimized and not optimized for 410?
Higher pressure rating and they are non removable
Elbows are tight . Restrictions? Should make longer radius elbows
I agree, they should!
Man u have a Ford Transit 150? What engine does it have? GAaoline or Turbo Diesel?
Gas
Can you do a vacuum test?
At some point yes
Can you push the pipe too far?
I wanted to try one of these for a coil change out, and I couldn't find them, I emailed Parker and they said they aren't approved yet in Canada :(
How long is the warranty on the fittings?
Looks like 10 years on 410a and 5 for the removable type
@@HVACKnowItAll wooh that’s impressive for 410a. I’d still give a proper braze a lot longer than 10 years but that is still a serious warranty. Longer than most Ac manufacturers
R134a possible?
I believe so, just use due diligence and ensure you keep an eye.
How come they do not make 5/16
Not sure
These could be great for the non professional DIYer who can't braze and doesn't have the equipment. Now I can replace my evap coil.
Sure would suck if it leaked with today's refrigerant prices and you end up eating that cost for a warranty. R- 22 at 1000.00 and 410A at 350.00.
Yes it would, if i uses these in the field it would be tested on smaller stuff.
Same amount of work as brazing if not more
Think outside the box, it depends really. There are some buildings that take a while to gain burn permits if you can even get one on the fly for a repair. Then there are some that have a fire watch afterwards. There are many other factors here where if the fitting does hold over time it could be a benefit. Would I perform an install with these, probably not but in a jam or certain environment, they may prove useful
Tyson man, if you only knew the red tape, permit fees, certification, not to mention all the safety tools and personels you're required just to get that brazing. As Thannos said," all of that for a drop of blood."
Just can't find it in myself to put my trust into these quick fix push on fittings...
Hard radius is trash on refridgerant
2:48 Thats what she said
I'm in the middle of watching this and BAM an add pops up. Now I don't know about u but I think that's rude. LETS BAN ADS
Lol, then UA-cam would fail, that's how we gain from our hard work outline together vids.
Just call it a shark bite
Sorry but dis agree with these fittings, you should however go to the press fit technology with RLS, I know it is expensive but the new future.
I use RLS
These are trash, the copper has to be perfectly aligned in order for it to seal.
Stay away from these fittings if you like pressure testing 2-3 times then end up brazing not worth the wasted time and fustration.
I mean they held pressure for days in my basement
@@HVACKnowItAll but there is expansion and contraction in a working HVAC system that is very different to checking the durability of these fitments in the basement (stable environment)
Its hard enough keeping systems leak free over the long haul without throwing stuff like this in the mix.
Stuff like this will be the future
@@HVACKnowItAll the future is now!
This product is dumb. All this does is bring in the DIY people into our trade. Any way to save money today....like we don't have enough crap to worry about doing our craft. If I see in the field, I'm cutting it out. Why not install flare elbows on every 90 degree or coupling? Because it wouldn't make any sense just like this crap.
Have you worked in buildings or environments where lighting a torch is not allowed? Prodcucts like these are usually born out of necessity and if they work, can be a handy tool in certain applications. A confident tech should never fear a DIYer, they lack execution.
@@HVACKnowItAll to answer your question, yes in research labs and hospital with oxygen lines nearby, which is not normal situation for most techs. In the commercial and industrial refrigeration world, All this product is, is an excuse to be lazy.
When you have a refrigerant leak, will the fitting manufacturer cover the refrigerant and labor bill? 100 percent No. Or how about the cost of the fitting and adding another fitting because your short on copper to cut out the old fitting? 100 percent No.
No one is telling anyone to go buck wild on these, this video is a demo of the product. All I'm saying is they may come in handy in certain applications.
@@HVACKnowItAll im going buck wild
@@grimeyhonkyracing3938 let me know how it goes
That looks horrible to me. I enjoy brazing and I’m not gonna stop , especially to use garbage like this that I don’t trust and never will. Brazing is not hard to do at all and it’s quite fun to me, and if done RIGHT will not leak. Brazing is tested and proven and been around way longer than this trash. That’s just my 2 cents
I also enjoy brazing