Rise of Moloch is a great game but it could have been excellent. The issue is that you have to spend some time with it to make sure you understand everything well before you start playing otherwise you will bore and annoy your friends with unclear rules. But if you're willing to spend that extra time with it, it is definitely worth it! One of the best 1vsAll games I've ever played. It is a pity CMON rushed its production and kind of began to ignore the game's existence once it was released. This could have become an all time classic but it is still a very good game. Btw I definitely do prefer this over The Others. I do agree with Zee that The Others has a more streamlined rules but this game is a lot more entertaining than The Others once you get the hang of it.
Hey, mate. Any tips for starting the game? Like, tips for helping grasp and getting to the fun/understanding faster and smoother. I feel like BGG is a bit all over the place, but if there are any threads there I should take a look, I’d appreciate it still.
You can play with different characters and also Nemesis can do intermissions differently. But yeah...it’s a CMON, you get the replayability by backing it on kickstarter. Their retail versions make you cry.
You don’t have to play the whole campaign every time, you can pick any of the chapters. Playing with a clever nemesis means no one game is the same. Once the cards go down then the gameplay is sequential but there is no unfair surprises like in the others, The others is a stinking game that is so broken. You need to play this again, change roles , become the nemesis . Rise of moloch is so clever. Hoping for a season 2
It's great to see the Dice Tower give this game a review. I backed out of my original pledge for this (felt guilty as I'd just backed Masmorra and Arcadia Quest inferno). But I recently managed to pick it up second-hand with most of the expansions (only the Dragon missing) and can't wait to get it to the table!
I think this game will appeal a lot to friends that like to have complex character builds like in a robust game of D&D or something. That is who I have found that really loves this game.
The core is all CMON will ever bring to retail. And, I doubt there will be a second print run of the game. CMON made it pretty clear during the Kickstarter campaign that they had no interest in supporting the game at retail. It was basically, "There will be some copies of the core game at retail. We have no idea if we'll print any expansions for retail." It's pretty obvious at this point that they have no interest in bringing the expansions to retail. But, there'll probably be a bunch of the expansions for sale on shelves at the next CMON expo.
I have been waiting/looking forward to this review! The box art, the art on the cards and such is extremely compelling as well as the theme. The only visual downside is the board in my opinion. The gameplay seems fun and I really like the activation (i.e initiative) aspect of it as well as pretty much everything you mentioned. It's a shame that it's hard to play with lower player counts e.g 1v1/1v2. I only play with 2 others people so that is a real bummer. If it weren't for that, I would probably buy this one since I really want a 1vsMany game in my collection.
What do you mean hard to play with lower player counts? I admit that 1vs1 isn't ideal as the one player is controlling all the gentlemen and that is quite demandind (yet it is still playable) but 1vs2 is actually the preferable player count for many people. There was a discussion about it just recently on BGG forum. I personally prefer playing it 1vs4 especially because it truly feels like a role-playing game with every player becoming one of the gentlemen but 1vs2 is excellent as well! Actually... I've never managed to get through the whole campaing when playing 1vs4 because it's hard for me to get the same group back together but I had no problems finishing it when there was 3 of us. Seriously, if that is your only concern then just buy it already. I highly recommend the game and it definitely shines with 3 players as well.
Oh wait now I get it... I answered to your comment before I watched the whole video. Ok so I obviously don't agree with Zee on this one. Definitely well playable with 3 players and as I said already - many people prefer this with only 3 players. I also feel like the replayability is better than Zee says. Personally, I've played the Chapter 1 five times already and the Chapter 2 three times and had a good time everytime. But well.. I am not a guy who owns a ton of games. I have about 6 games in total so I always come back to them. I would argue that each scenario can play out very differently each time you play it. BUT I must admit that the coregame only provides 5 Gentlemen characters and that's what decreases the replayability - the base game should have had more playabale characters but they decided to provide many characters as KS extras for the purposes of selling the game well on the Kickstarter.
Alright. Yeah, after writing my comment I went to BGG to see recommended player counts and you are right. I'm just worried that keeping up with 2 Gentlemen will be too much to keep track of for some people? I don't know when it hits retail, but when it does it will stand between this, The Others and Descent, I think.
Going into retail might be done for. This game was released almost a year ago, and it never was a heavy retail presence game. The expansions I believe never came to retail, and most content was KS exclusive. The KS extras included few more mission, and few expansions with individual campaigns.
Thanks. Still painting up my copy of this. So will be a while before I get to play... have you tried both Nemesis and Gentlemen roles? And which do you prefer and why?
While I am not Zee, I will offer my humble opinion. Both sides are excellent, Nemesis' part is really entertaining. I love controlling the Minions, chaos cards are amazing providing very unique powers. Playing as Gentlemen is amazing especially if cooperating with other people is something you like. I feel like some Gentlemen are quite simple while others provide more interesting strategic powers so it's important choosing a gentleman that suits you better.
Great review. I was tempted by this one, but it was ultimately a pass for me because of the relative similarity to Others. Based on the review, it wouldn't have fit my group's style. A bit of video feedback: I like the way you examine the different aspects of the game (theme, aesthetics, etc) at the end. That's really cool.
I think you've nailed it on the review. Game length I don't mind at the longer length personally though I can see how it would to some, and it helps that I have everything from the Kickstarter (I don't even remember how many campaigns it has with all expansions, plus I have way more characters for the heroes side) so I won't run out any time soon. But you're right that it should ideally be played at full player count. with less players the hero player would just have way too many things to keep track of.
Yeah, pretty much how I felt, except I don't think you highlighted just how bad the rulebook is. It's not just confusing, it has game changing mistakes in it. I backed it, all in, and played it numerous times. Went through the campaign twice, as both the Agents and Gentlemen, and use pretty much all of the content. Buuuuuut, then it sat on the shelf collecting dust. It's sold now, and I don't miss it to be honest. I think it's a wonderful experience, but only once through (as Zee points out). CMON really should've a) made the rulebook better, and most important of all, b) made it cooperative. With a robust AI in place, maybe a single deck of cards to control actions, and some variations to the scenarios it would no doubt still be on my shelf. Without a layer of dust. Oh, for miniature collectors, this is an incredible product. I do miss the miniatures.
the tiles shown are cobblestone with rain they are double sided. The tiles are quite varied especially when the buildings and crates etc are added, the artwork and theme is beautiful throughout.
I wanted to like this game so much, I had a kickstarter copy. The first game was awesome, it came down to the last roll, but from the second game the whole campaign fell apart, and we all agreed that this game is the least balanced 1 vs many game we've ever played. In each following mission one of the sides didn't stand a chance. There are laughable cards in the chaos deck that breaks the game.Minor spoilers from here! For example in one of the scenarios if I remember right one of the evil player's goal is to escape with a character. But there is a card, that can swap the character with a minion, so he can skip the whole map. Yes, it exists, and I guess the playtesters were fine with it. In an other scenario the evil player must escape with a plan or something held by a secret character. It's one thing that this scenario can be broken with the mentioned card again, but the nemesis has a character that can mind control with her attacks, and a nemesis power that can move an enemy twice. This means that Madam Edwarda can walk near the exit, mind control a defender away, and exit on the beginning of the secon turn if I remember right. We just couldn't belive how many ways the balance was broken in this game. Long story short, it has my favourite CMON minis (personal preference ofc.), but I wouldn't play it ever again.
I didn't have as many problems with balance as you did. If both sides pursue a certain strategy, most of the chapters become very even. I player Chapter 1 five times = 3x Gentlemen won, 2x Nemesis won, Chapter 2 four times = 2x Gentlemen, 2x Nemesis. Then there's Chapter 3 and this one is not well balanced, but a few minor changes can make it winnable for Getlemen. Chapter 4 is awesome and again quite nicely balanced and the rest seemed fine as well (however I played them only once). "that can swap the character with a minion" - that card is broken is certain scenarios but that's quite obvious... you can just ban it for certain scenarios and that's it. Generally, I would argue that the Nemesis has the upper hand because of Chaos Cards that Gentlemen can't predict, but that's what makes the game ideal - Gentlemen really need that teamwork to overcome the Nemesis and win.
@@mickkennedy1853 They can be house ruled fairly simply. However, a $100 (MSRP) game shouldn't require looking up other players experiences to see if there's any house ruling needed. If it's being played as a campaign, then the players may never play that mission again. I even like SMOG, but CMON games (particularly, their Kickstarters) are a mixed bag of quality. And, they do a terrible job of supporting their Kickstarted games once they're released.
balance is up and down a bit, - i view it more as a light natured fun storey... and the Nemisis is there to provide a foil for the gentlemen, so get into character and have a jolly good time eh?
You are referring to The World of Smog: On Her Majesty's Service. This is The World of Smog: The Rise of Moloch. They're both set in the same world which was created for a French comic and novel series that I don't think has ever been released. (I guess the creator managed to make a cool setting and got sidetracked by licensing before finishing anything.)
I remember saying that I hope Essen games don't take priority over Rise of Moloch and delay the review. ................ Better late than never I guess?
Rise of Moloch is a great game but it could have been excellent. The issue is that you have to spend some time with it to make sure you understand everything well before you start playing otherwise you will bore and annoy your friends with unclear rules. But if you're willing to spend that extra time with it, it is definitely worth it! One of the best 1vsAll games I've ever played. It is a pity CMON rushed its production and kind of began to ignore the game's existence once it was released. This could have become an all time classic but it is still a very good game.
Btw I definitely do prefer this over The Others. I do agree with Zee that The Others has a more streamlined rules but this game is a lot more entertaining than The Others once you get the hang of it.
I know it is kinda randomly asking but do anyone know a good site to watch newly released series online?
Hey, mate. Any tips for starting the game?
Like, tips for helping grasp and getting to the fun/understanding faster and smoother. I feel like BGG is a bit all over the place, but if there are any threads there I should take a look, I’d appreciate it still.
Rules correction, the nemesis puts their cards for the second row, and the gentlemen on the first row.
You can play with different characters and also Nemesis can do intermissions differently. But yeah...it’s a CMON, you get the replayability by backing it on kickstarter. Their retail versions make you cry.
"Their retail versions make you cry." - How so?
been waiting for this review! THANKS!
You don’t have to play the whole campaign every time, you can pick any of the chapters. Playing with a clever nemesis means no one game is the same. Once the cards go down then the gameplay is sequential but there is no unfair surprises like in the others, The others is a stinking game that is so broken. You need to play this again, change roles , become the nemesis . Rise of moloch is so clever. Hoping for a season 2
Still love the look of it... sort of regret backing out from my pledge.
It's great to see the Dice Tower give this game a review. I backed out of my original pledge for this (felt guilty as I'd just backed Masmorra and Arcadia Quest inferno). But I recently managed to pick it up second-hand with most of the expansions (only the Dragon missing) and can't wait to get it to the table!
...Thank you for posting this...what a great job... well & quickly presentation....
I think this game will appeal a lot to friends that like to have complex character builds like in a robust game of D&D or something. That is who I have found that really loves this game.
FFS CMON! PRINT the expansions for this, and send some to Zee. What the heck!
The core is all CMON will ever bring to retail. And, I doubt there will be a second print run of the game. CMON made it pretty clear during the Kickstarter campaign that they had no interest in supporting the game at retail. It was basically, "There will be some copies of the core game at retail. We have no idea if we'll print any expansions for retail." It's pretty obvious at this point that they have no interest in bringing the expansions to retail. But, there'll probably be a bunch of the expansions for sale on shelves at the next CMON expo.
That's what blows about Kickstarter
The one small critique I have is comparing two games with expansions when you only have one game with the expansions.
What size are the miniatures?
I have been waiting/looking forward to this review! The box art, the art on the cards and such is extremely compelling as well as the theme. The only visual downside is the board in my opinion. The gameplay seems fun and I really like the activation (i.e initiative) aspect of it as well as pretty much everything you mentioned. It's a shame that it's hard to play with lower player counts e.g 1v1/1v2. I only play with 2 others people so that is a real bummer. If it weren't for that, I would probably buy this one since I really want a 1vsMany game in my collection.
What do you mean hard to play with lower player counts? I admit that 1vs1 isn't ideal as the one player is controlling all the gentlemen and that is quite demandind (yet it is still playable) but 1vs2 is actually the preferable player count for many people. There was a discussion about it just recently on BGG forum. I personally prefer playing it 1vs4 especially because it truly feels like a role-playing game with every player becoming one of the gentlemen but 1vs2 is excellent as well! Actually... I've never managed to get through the whole campaing when playing 1vs4 because it's hard for me to get the same group back together but I had no problems finishing it when there was 3 of us. Seriously, if that is your only concern then just buy it already. I highly recommend the game and it definitely shines with 3 players as well.
Oh wait now I get it... I answered to your comment before I watched the whole video. Ok so I obviously don't agree with Zee on this one. Definitely well playable with 3 players and as I said already - many people prefer this with only 3 players. I also feel like the replayability is better than Zee says. Personally, I've played the Chapter 1 five times already and the Chapter 2 three times and had a good time everytime. But well.. I am not a guy who owns a ton of games. I have about 6 games in total so I always come back to them. I would argue that each scenario can play out very differently each time you play it. BUT I must admit that the coregame only provides 5 Gentlemen characters and that's what decreases the replayability - the base game should have had more playabale characters but they decided to provide many characters as KS extras for the purposes of selling the game well on the Kickstarter.
I don't agree with Zee on the player count. I would say it's best at three players when two gentlemen for each player.
Alright. Yeah, after writing my comment I went to BGG to see recommended player counts and you are right. I'm just worried that keeping up with 2 Gentlemen will be too much to keep track of for some people? I don't know when it hits retail, but when it does it will stand between this, The Others and Descent, I think.
Going into retail might be done for. This game was released almost a year ago, and it never was a heavy retail presence game. The expansions I believe never came to retail, and most content was KS exclusive. The KS extras included few more mission, and few expansions with individual campaigns.
Thanks. Still painting up my copy of this. So will be a while before I get to play... have you tried both Nemesis and Gentlemen roles? And which do you prefer and why?
While I am not Zee, I will offer my humble opinion. Both sides are excellent, Nemesis' part is really entertaining. I love controlling the Minions, chaos cards are amazing providing very unique powers. Playing as Gentlemen is amazing especially if cooperating with other people is something you like. I feel like some Gentlemen are quite simple while others provide more interesting strategic powers so it's important choosing a gentleman that suits you better.
I finished painting mine ages ago :P Hehe It's a great game once you understand the rules :D
good video, clear, short and all in you need if you don't know the game. Also critical, really like that. Can better decide now. thx
only like 1 year late with this review... :D
This one-versus-all restructuring of games seems to be a burgeoning new trend. They also did this recently for Kemet with Seth.
Great review. I was tempted by this one, but it was ultimately a pass for me because of the relative similarity to Others. Based on the review, it wouldn't have fit my group's style.
A bit of video feedback: I like the way you examine the different aspects of the game (theme, aesthetics, etc) at the end. That's really cool.
Yep, Others, This, Death may Day. How man 1 vs. Many games are they going to make?
I think you've nailed it on the review. Game length I don't mind at the longer length personally though I can see how it would to some, and it helps that I have everything from the Kickstarter (I don't even remember how many campaigns it has with all expansions, plus I have way more characters for the heroes side) so I won't run out any time soon.
But you're right that it should ideally be played at full player count. with less players the hero player would just have way too many things to keep track of.
Yeah, pretty much how I felt, except I don't think you highlighted just how bad the rulebook is. It's not just confusing, it has game changing mistakes in it. I backed it, all in, and played it numerous times. Went through the campaign twice, as both the Agents and Gentlemen, and use pretty much all of the content. Buuuuuut, then it sat on the shelf collecting dust. It's sold now, and I don't miss it to be honest. I think it's a wonderful experience, but only once through (as Zee points out). CMON really should've a) made the rulebook better, and most important of all, b) made it cooperative. With a robust AI in place, maybe a single deck of cards to control actions, and some variations to the scenarios it would no doubt still be on my shelf. Without a layer of dust. Oh, for miniature collectors, this is an incredible product. I do miss the miniatures.
The art on the map looks so dull. What is that supposed to be for the ground on the outside areas? It looks like grey carpet.
the tiles shown are cobblestone with rain they are double sided. The tiles are quite varied especially when the buildings and crates etc are added, the artwork and theme is beautiful throughout.
@@gasa5251 That's good to know. Looks pretty lame on camera.
I wanted to like this game so much, I had a kickstarter copy. The first game was awesome, it came down to the last roll, but from the second game the whole campaign fell apart, and we all agreed that this game is the least balanced 1 vs many game we've ever played. In each following mission one of the sides didn't stand a chance. There are laughable cards in the chaos deck that breaks the game.Minor spoilers from here! For example in one of the scenarios if I remember right one of the evil player's goal is to escape with a character. But there is a card, that can swap the character with a minion, so he can skip the whole map. Yes, it exists, and I guess the playtesters were fine with it. In an other scenario the evil player must escape with a plan or something held by a secret character. It's one thing that this scenario can be broken with the mentioned card again, but the nemesis has a character that can mind control with her attacks, and a nemesis power that can move an enemy twice. This means that Madam Edwarda can walk near the exit, mind control a defender away, and exit on the beginning of the secon turn if I remember right. We just couldn't belive how many ways the balance was broken in this game.
Long story short, it has my favourite CMON minis (personal preference ofc.), but I wouldn't play it ever again.
I get your frustrations, but these are really just simple problems that can be house ruled.
I didn't have as many problems with balance as you did. If both sides pursue a certain strategy, most of the chapters become very even. I player Chapter 1 five times = 3x Gentlemen won, 2x Nemesis won, Chapter 2 four times = 2x Gentlemen, 2x Nemesis. Then there's Chapter 3 and this one is not well balanced, but a few minor changes can make it winnable for Getlemen. Chapter 4 is awesome and again quite nicely balanced and the rest seemed fine as well (however I played them only once). "that can swap the character with a minion" - that card is broken is certain scenarios but that's quite obvious... you can just ban it for certain scenarios and that's it. Generally, I would argue that the Nemesis has the upper hand because of Chaos Cards that Gentlemen can't predict, but that's what makes the game ideal - Gentlemen really need that teamwork to overcome the Nemesis and win.
@@mickkennedy1853 They can be house ruled fairly simply. However, a $100 (MSRP) game shouldn't require looking up other players experiences to see if there's any house ruling needed. If it's being played as a campaign, then the players may never play that mission again. I even like SMOG, but CMON games (particularly, their Kickstarters) are a mixed bag of quality. And, they do a terrible job of supporting their Kickstarted games once they're released.
balance is up and down a bit, - i view it more as a light natured fun storey... and the Nemisis is there to provide a foil for the gentlemen, so get into character and have a jolly good time eh?
Thanks u for the vide
The title and box art make this look like an expansion to an existing game called The World of Smog.
You are referring to The World of Smog: On Her Majesty's Service. This is The World of Smog: The Rise of Moloch. They're both set in the same world which was created for a French comic and novel series that I don't think has ever been released. (I guess the creator managed to make a cool setting and got sidetracked by licensing before finishing anything.)
I remember saying that I hope Essen games don't take priority over Rise of Moloch and delay the review.
................ Better late than never I guess?
This video was recommended after I watch a playthrough of Masters of the Universe: Class for Eternia.
Good review Zee. I'm glad I sold my copy before I opened it.
So much hand jiggling...
You didn't even play the game did you...
Steampunk is for people that think a toaster is too complex
Steampunk is what happens when goths discover brown.