My Volvo 740 is Broken...
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- Опубліковано 4 жов 2024
- My Volvo 740 has a hot start issue, in this video I try to find the cause by checking the injectors, but not correctly as they ARE the fault, check out the next installment here;
• Hot Start Issue FIXED ...
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NOTE: The issue was with the injectors after all! I tested them cold in this video but they must have only been leaking when hot! Update video link here and in the description; ua-cam.com/video/JSflBst1qHc/v-deo.html
It could be a shot in the dark but when it's rich on startup it's usually the engine temp sensor.
Good luck from Sweden!
Thanks!
@@Involvod read the resistance at the ecu.... But you probably already know that
Most like Crank Position Sensor if you have one on it matey. Notorious for hot/warm issues
Thanks man!
Look for rpm tach movement at cranking
afaik you won't get injector pulse without crank sensor feed
@@papercutr that's a great point 🤔
Agree. Pain in the arse to change on top of the bellhousing. I find that using a 10mm stubby ratchet spanner is the way to do it, reaching down the back of the engine with your right arm from the left side of the car. Espescially big pain if the little bolt doesn't turn freely.
The normal issue with lots of rough year old is a failed diaphragm in the fuel pressure regulator. Heat soak normally effects coils of wire what you have in your crankshaft sensor fuel injectors and ignition coil. Then go to sensors like coolant temp, mass air flow, and oxygen sensor. Test each sensor before replacing if you're low on funds
Thanks
Hey man!
I had something very similar, my 1990 740GL B230F AW70 started terribly under the correct circumstances, even after I fired the parts cannon at it. Everything from MAF, injectors, and Temp sensors to new ignition leads and a brake booster, nothing seemed to solve it. Eventually, I took it to a local 'Volvo Guru' and he found that there was a minor amount of side-to-side play in my throttle body and replacement of which very likely would have fixed it. I sold the car to a collector before I could try it, but in the end, I tried about 10k worth of repairs to resolve the issue. Otherwise, you could maybe look into replacing or even resetting (Buy unplugging it for a few minutes) your ECU box. This reset actually worked quite well, and made the starting issue far less frequent. Not sure why, must be Bosch Wizardry!
Love your work, hope this helps.
Thanks for sharing! I checked the throttle body today and all seems well. I might try swapping over the ECU and see if it helps 👍
@@Involvod All good man! Best of luck and I look forward to any future updates!
Stay awesome! Cheers.
Hi, I looked at some of the other comments and sadly I do not have anything else to add. I hope you will very soon get the final answer to this and explain us ! 😁
PS : I lately bought a 240, I will say that your channel is one thing that comforted me a lot in my choice because I saw that there is a great Volvo community that's here to help each others and already a lot of videos on particular subjects like yours, so I know if I'm looking for something I can get some help.
Thanks! Congrats on the purchase! The Volvo community is awesome, that's a big reason I got into Volvos as well
Granted it’s a CIS system but I’ve been chasing the exact same, I knew it was pressure leak down & vapour lock, the engine heat boils off fuel in the rail which needs cranking to purge. Finally sorted, someone replaced in the past the main fuel pump (underneath) with a generic Bosch pump that did not have a check valve. Meant that the pump pressure is lost back through pump when off, and the engine heat vapour locked my fuel line. I fitted a generic check value in front of the pump - sorted! (Before I changed injectors, new fuel accumulator for CIS, played with AFI, relays, even wired in a pump primer switch) great channel pal ❤
Thanks for sharing! I did think my problem was just like vapour lock, until it started doing it on cold starts (just warm outside) It's also got a new-ish check valve so should be ok, but you never know with the parts quality of today 😀
question, what kind of pump and check valve did you use? my car is having the same warm start issue, car is 740 GLE 1990 with CIS system/b230e, and im planning to replacing the main fuel pump with merc w124 ones because the pump is generating loud buzz sound and the price of merc main pump is cheaper
@@sirgilang90z the previous owner replaced the under pump with a generic Bosch style, but I grabbed a Halfords one way check valve for £6 and fitted it before the accumulator - this is also the part to look at if having warm start issues. Check the w124 pump does the same pressure as Volvo- should be fine.
I had that issue with the crank sensor that goes on the top front part of the transmission with the bolt that holds it being loose. But it was a sudden fuel flooded condition.
Thanks for sharing!
Crankshaft position sensor
Check for a spark with an old plug when it's playing up to eliminate the ign side have you a suitable noid or led electrical probe to check the injectors are earthing when turning over but I think it will be ign related possible crank sensor
As already mentioned crank sensor at the top back of the engine ? My 240 had this problem and it was the rpm sensor / crank sensor. Especially if the wiring looks compromised. Good luck from Canada
Thanks 👍
MY VOLVO EASY 1985 740D24T ,GREAT WATCHING THE WORK, HOPE ALL THE SURGESTION HELP
It's the bells. Ask not for whom the bell tolls, it tolls for the Volvo.
LOL. Sorry Sledge for rubbing it in but it's too funny. They must be driving you nuts.
Hang in there with Elsa. If you keep eliminating possible causes you must eventually get to the real cause. My 940 auto has for ages been dropping from 4th to 3rd when the weather is hot.
A Volvo wise mechanic said there's a relay for that. I replaced it and now it works. Now I have to work on the air con.
Haha, thanks. Glad you managed to get yours sorted!
Coolant sensor for sure! Measure its oem tolerance and circuit.
I would certainly change those H T leads , they look original . Best practice I think volvo used to say every 50 thou
Just came across a video of the same issue from "Volvo Repair" (1990 Volvo 740 hot start problem solved). His issue was about the same and related to the crank position sensor hanging over the heater core tubes. When he ziptied the cable higher to not be affected by the heat it solved his problem immediately. Seems the cable or connector can be affected by the heat after a while, causing hot start issues. Perhaps this is worth a shot.
Thanks, much appreciated 👍
As some people have already suggested, I'd be looking at the crankshaft position sensor next.
I had that issue with the crank sensor that goes on the top front part of the transmission with the bolt that holds it being loose. But it was a sudden fuel flooded condition. You might be right.
Volvo wins the Rear End Comparison.
By far so!
had the exact same issue, when i bought my 760 turbo. cold ok. hot ok. warm… no go.
changed: crank shaft position sensor and the two temperature sensors at the motor and ever since no problems
also had the same odyssee like you before. maf, iac,…
Thanks 👍 The rpm needle bounces slightly whilst cranking which suggests it's working, but probably wouldn't hurt to replace it at this age!
had the same with mine.
thats why i didn’t thin of the crank position sensor. once replaced the crank time went down and with the temp sensors it works like a charme
Hi. Ssuggest soldering the pump relay and measuring the resistance of the hall sensor at cold and warm temperatures.
Bosch temperature sensor only. As well as the distributor finger.
The worst example would be the failure of the injection controller, it is worth replacing with a working one.
Thanks, very useful!
@@Involvod 👍.
I was reminded of the injector relay in black (nr OEM 1323592) hanging near the fluid reservoir and ignition module
fuel pump relay is classical....the solderings inside break....just resolder them
I initially thought it was the coolant temp sensor but since you said you replaced it, then it could be the crank position sensor. Remember these Volvos have two coolant temp sensors btw, one for the gauge and one for the ECU
Something else I noticed is the RPMs don’t bounce at all while you were cranking it, which suggest the crank position sensor isn’t giving a signal
Thanks, yeah I checked and replaced the sensor for the ECU. The RPM needle bounces very slightly but it's hard to see on the video, I had to zoom in to see it
@@Involvod There is two types of REAR temperatur censor depending of system LH2.2 or LH2.4
@@SpaceShipDeathstar You even changed the ECU, Ignition computer and Ignition module and still would not run?
I wish that I could help Sledge. I'm sure that the Volvo community will come to your aid. Good luck.
Thanks, I appreciate it 😀
If the "warm" starting problem is the only issue I would be looking at the cold start injector (which I guess from Elsa's age she has), the Bosch ones fitted to KE-Jetronic Mercedes can leak fuel into the manifold once the fuel pressure has dropped off.
Thanks man, she's actually too old for it! They fitted them to the LH2.4 cars, this one is LH2.2
Было такое же на моей 940, виноваты были скрутки на датчике положения коленвала. Сам провод от температуры и времени уже устал, так еще его отремонтировали просто скрутив провода и закрыв изолентой. А еще похожее было на Ладе с инжектором GM - датчик температуры нужен был именно GM(другие значения температуры-сопротивления в отличии от оригинальных Лада), на холодную всё хорошо, прогревается и очень плохо заводилась, ЭБУ думал что перегрев и не давал искру.
Thanks 👍
Open and check distributor for oil leaks....its probably not firing well
So she’s obviously getting fuel, so it must be spark.
I agree to replace the crank sensor.
Hello Sledge!😁👍🤗💝 Look, in a hot start there is the following problem: either overflow or no spark ... Look at the crankshaft position sensor, the insulation is short and the sensor itself loses its signal when hot, the tachometer jumps because of it, and the output to the ignition coil comes from the tachometer. .. It may be that the EZK ignition switch has died or its bad mass in the wing ... If the starting injector is leaking, turn it off, try to start without it ... Replace the temperature sensor with the ECU brain, the front one with the tidy, and the far one with the computer between 3 and 4 stands like a cylinder. Well, either there is no residual pressure in the rail when it is hot ... Or when pouring gasoline into the floor, do not pump gas and should start with a purge.
Maybe weak spark. Change the ignition amplifier.
i couldn't really see but does your engine have the 5th (blue) coldstart injector? Some do. The more modern LH2.4 cars don't.
These blue injectors are only for cold starting and they tend to dribble fuel.when they fail. If you have one on the engine just unplug the connector and see if the situation improves.
Other then that: these cars have a sort of amplifier thing-a-mado-dad for the ignition, i think it sits near the left headlight against the inner wheelwell. These can also act up when they get warm up causing a no start condition.
Then there is the infamous fuel pump relais in the back of the fusebox , a rectangular white one. These can have wonky soldering points that can cause a no start when warm.
Crank position sensors are also suspect after so many years of use.
I was also thinking cold start injector. My 1990 740 with LH 2.4 has one, so I presume that earlier ones do too.
Thanks, these LH2.2 cars don't have them. I tried the ignition module from Oly the carb Volvo over in the UK. Maybe it is the crank sensor, would be a logical next thing to try!
That's an odd issue, and I see people post about the same regularly on Volvo forums.
Did you do a compression and leak down test?
Also, have you checked the TPS? We had an issue where a 240 refused to start, because the TPS didn't "click" the idle circuit when at rest.
Otherwise, i'd check for weak spark or timing.
Also have a look at he lambdaprobe voltage. Lastly, always disconnect the battery upon replacing sensors etc, so the ECU resets. My 940 had erratic throttle response/idle due to a bad lambda probe.
After replacing the probe, it was the same issue. Then it was suggested to me, that I disconnect the battery which actually solved the issue immediately.
I cross my fingers that you eventually figure out what the problem might be. :)
Thanks for the tips! 👍
You are definetly not alone. There is more and more of old Volvos with lh.2.4 and ez-k engine management systems that fails when they get old. And always it is the hot start. I had 940 with the variant of this where the engine starts with very low rpm and takes ages to raise up to normal unless I barely crack the throttle and start. Then it ran normal idle every time. I sent the injectors to the repair etc. Car ran absolutely fine but the hot start was bad. I started to use throttle crack during start method and drove it like that three years. Issue got worse for in summers and almost no issue in winters. I'd bet that it is in somewhere in lh or ezk that is sligthly slide out of tune. Due to maybe dried out capasitor etc. With issue that occurs when hot you have to make all measurements in fault state. Othervise you can not do anyting else than guess. It would be nice to measure coil load time and current draw and injector pw during issue and compare these to hot but working start. These both measurements requires oscilloscope wich is a bummer.
Thanks, that's why it's so hard to find out the fault, there's a pattern to it, but sometimes it's intermittent! 😅
I have the same issue on my 240 lh2.4. Thankfully its not getting worse so far. Make sure to make a video in case you find it one day...
You ned to clean the throttle body and have a new gasket. Ground point between engine and chassis replace it with a new one
In my case of not starting, it was a piece of the timing cover, which fell into the timing belt. At the end, it was four teeth wrong. So maybe take a check of the correct timing. God luck!
oh man that sucks,
I'm very curious what the solution will be.
Hopefully you gonna find it soon
Thanks 👍 I'll definitely give an update
Keep it posted sledge if you get it solved, have same problem on 740 b200e past couple years, trying most things that's mentioned, no joy.really annoying. 😒
Will do! 👍
Hello!!! The B200E Motronic is not the same as the B230F... The system is different, I can help you! What problems do you have with the B200E? Poor hot start, cold start, or does not hold idle, or accelerates poorly?
Sounds daft but i had a similar problem with a ford granada, fuel pump was leaking back so i put a in-line none return valve in the fuel line, then to find that the fuel circulation line had blocked up so wasn't returning fuel back to the tank fast enough, which was flooding the engine, also coil packs can be the issue heat expansion can make the circuits open circuit when warm but not sure how the volvo gets it's spark, to test it obviously when it's warm check for a spark or a weak spark at least, can't see these being the issue but just throwing it out there that's all!
Thanks for sharing, definitely food for thought!
Vacuum leak and hot air comes into the intake. Although this Problem might continue on hot start. Had an issue once with a ripped rubber going from MAF to the intake which made it run and start like crap.
Thanks for the tip! 👍
All my suggestions it sounds like you’ve tried, my help is no good, best of luck!
Thanks :D
I can't help because I'm a carby Girl myself. But I can fully sympathise as I've just spent a Year head scratching My carbed 740 estates fuel problems. All fixed now tho as I fitted 4 PWK42mm bike carbs! hehe
Just a thought, try checking things like the fuel cap isn't blocked, all the fuel filters are ok, try blowing air through the fuel lines. things like that can effect the running of a sensor dependant system. Personally I even had to change the fuel pump and filter in the tank. Best of luck Dee
Hmmm carburetor conversion, maybe that's the solution! 😀 Thanks 👍
@@Involvod OK it does work and is a lot of fun, But it is a fair amount of work, and a fair amount of research is needed. But go for it if You like : - )
Looks like the the rpm isnt bouncing when its cranking and not starting. I would check the distributor, the plug on the bottom breaks, and the hall sensor plays up. Its pretty common on 740's
Thanks Neill, I did check that, it bounces very slightly, it's hard to see in the video
Check the resistance of rear temperatur censor from ECU connector disconnected is is easy and for free (check cold, reconnect warm up, disconnect and check again), If OK change Crank position sensor (impulsgivare in Swedish)
Thanks 👍
@@Involvod If it is a thermal problem. Put ECU in the freezer and try, what happends ? or preheat it with a dryer/hairfan ?
@@allt-under-solen luckily I have a spare one I can try so I'll give it a go
How much fuel pressure are you seeing when it primes?
Verify the fuel pressure regulator isn’t passing fuel into the intake via the vacuum port.
02 sensor plugs maybe?
Grounds?
Sounds like a weird electrical issue
Thanks, I'm not sure what the fuel pressure is, I should test it, although it seems like it's over fuelling as the plugs are wet with fuel on start up, hence the smoke
this or maybe the fuel pump check valve. Checking fuel pressure should definitely be the next step
@@Involvod does this car have a 5th injector? (Coldstart injector)
@@DeanofMachines No, the LH2.2 never had them as far as I know
Is the car LH2.2 or LH2.4? If it's 2.2, I'd definitely suspect the hall sensor, particularly if the tach needle is jumping around strangely when trying to start it. If it's LH2.4, I'd suspect the crank position sensor.
Thanks that's really helpful, it's LH2.2, I did notice the needle jump erratically once or twice, so maybe it is the issue!
@@Involvod seems like some people commenting think it is LH2.4 (crankshaft position sensor) but LH2.2 definitely has a Hall effect sensor. The distributor on my '88 740 had a minor oil leak and it was causing the all sorts of issues with the connector to the hall effect sensor. It was super gummed up and causing intermittent issues with warm starts.... the little connector is also VERY delicate and can break, or the sensor itself just gets old and causes all sorts of issues with starts. There is probably some way you can test it before buying a reconditioned one (they're a bit pricey). Good luck. If you do change it out, there is NO youtube content filming the procedure, so I'm sure loads of people would find it useful.
@@evanlewis4857 thanks, I double checked today and I'm definitely getting spark when the fault occurs, but it's also getting way too much fuel, that's why it tries to fire briefly then gets flooded, what a mystery!
crank position sensor_ I had this problem with citroen ax
Thanks!
I know the rev counter needle was twitching, but on my (admittedly kjet) 740 the needle jumps right up and down when cranking. Perhaps it's only gettting an intermittent / weak pulse from the warm sensor which is why it barely moves?
Watching it again, a moment after turning the key the crank sensor jumped up, (still not as high as mine mind) and the engine sounded like it fired ? then it went back to cranking again with barely a twitch out of it.
And/or, it might be worth worth bridging out the fuel pump relay / wiring the pumps direct from a switch temporarily to see if that makes any difference.
Thanks, great points! I'll give it a go
Looks like it is not fuel problem. Very few things can go wrong on the ignition side. My guess is crank position sensor. When they get tired starting gets hard and eventually fails at all.
Thanks
Don’t know these Volvo’s but maybe a vacuum leak somewhere? Rotor and condensor?
I had difficulties starting with one of the Škoda’s. Turned out to be a bad ignition cable. Not that old and looked good, but after changing the problem was over.
Thanks :)
I had a vacuum leak on my distributor vacuum advance diaphragm and when it was cold it would start but when warm it wouldn't it was the same issue. I know you don't have a carb system, but vacuum leak might be the issue. I expect you checked all that anyways but worth a mention.
Too check it just suck the vacuum hose on the dizzy and see if the diaphragm works. I could just keep sucking so knew mine was broken.
Thanks, I don't have a vacuum to the distributor on this, but it could be a leak somewhere though for sure, I didn't find anything yet but they can be sneaky
@@Involvod does your tach bounce when trying to start? watch that when cold and then when warm. If it doesn't then possible hall sensor or relay issue. Another is ignition amp. They are sneaky too, but testable! and keeps your idle hands busy from that merc! hahah
@@killingit2091 haha, yeah it does bounce which is why I didn't suspect it. I tried the ignition module from Oly the carb'ed 740 in the UK, no joy 😏
@@Involvod I'm about to send a link in email that you will most likely find useful if you haven't already found the info mate.
@@killingit2091 thanks, I got it 👍
I can't help as I don't know much about Volvos. I did briefly have a 940 and I wish I had taken more notice of what was under the bonnet. I think someone must have fitted an earlier engine from an Amazon or something. I'm sure it had a pressed tin rocker cover like you would get on a typical overhead valve engine. At the time I just assumed they were all like that.
Haha that's crazy! Would have been funny to see
You have two temp sensors. One for the instrument panel and one for the engine control computer. The one for the instrument panel has no influence whatsoever in this case. The one for the control computer is much more important. It must tell the computer what the engine's temperature is in the particular case in question. If it gives the wrong signal, which is not unusual, the computer mixes fuel and air as if the engine were, for example, ice cold. That is, a very oily mixture that makes it difficult to start. It can of course be the other way around, depending on how the error in the temperature sensor manifests itself. But the result is that the mixture is not the right one for what the engine wants at that moment. The fact that you have an open sports air filter can have an impact. The air becomes colder than intended. The car is designed with air preheating and is supposed to run best with it.
Its positioned under The third cylinder
Thanks for the tips 👍
checked carburetor? maybe it gets to little air maybe the valve is sticking when it is lukewarm
Oke, just to get all facts straight. Elsa is a 1986 with b230f and LH 2.2 ignition system. Since she is an original German car, changes are at some time in her life she has been fitted with an Euro2 emission system. I have the same car as you have. Same color, year, engine-type, automatic, only difference… She’s a he and Isaac is a sedan (saloon). He’s also been living most of his early life in Germany, I have imported the car in 2010 to the Netherlands.
Isaac had an Euro2 pre-heating system retrofitted to him. The goal of this system was to rapidly bring up the catalytic converter to operating temperatures, by adjusting the ignition timing and fuel mixture during cold starts. As far as I remember this system splices (i.a.) in to the wire of the ECT sensor. The grey wire, which leads to pin position 2 on the ECU. There could be a problem were the Euro2 control unit is behaving badly.
Since Elsa is a ‘86 car, crumbling wire insulation can be a real problem. I would check the ECT wiring again, maybe even pulling new ones. This is not that big a job. A short black ground wire, connecting to the inlet manifold and a grey one leading to pin number 2 of the ECU. Pull a single uninterrupted wire from the sensor to the ECU, this way you bypass the connector behind the right shock strut tower. Could be worth a try.
Then the ECT sensor itself, you stated that you already replaced yours. The LH 2.2 system uses the ECT sensor with the light-blue plastic connector housing (Bosch 280130026). As you already have guest by now, going by the amount of comments pointing this out, getting a good new sensor can be a pain sometimes. This is worth looking into and I would advise getting an original Bosch.
The Hall sensor. Even though the tachometer is jumping, they can still be faulty and cause similar starting problems. But the fact that your car only has starting problems with engine or outside ambient temperatures being warm (not cold or hot) makes this a less likely candidate in my opinion. I would measure the Hall sensor or if you have the possibility swap out the complete distributor with the build in Hall for quick testing. Replacing the Hall sensor inside the distributor housing itself is a fiddly job and requires patience and steady hands.
It can be a real challenge sometimes, good you reached out and I hope my input helps somewhat.
Thanks for the info and tips, very helpful 👍 I heard that the hall sensor replacement was tricky, I actually have all the parts to convert it over to a block mounted distributor, do you know if the hall sensor on the 240 distributor has the same parameters and will work? It looks like the same 3 pin plug
@@Involvod Yes they look the same and logic would suggest that Volvo didn’t change the parameters, but I never measured and compared these two. So, sorry can’t help you there.
@@iRoll4ever_740 no worries 👍
In your “Sonax” video you made a remark about the sluggish performance of Elsa on more hilly roads. Well maybe not directly, listening between the lines I thought you did.
This reminded me of something. You stated earlier that you verified the ignition and the presence of spark. However lacking in power can be caused by a lesser quality spark (white color, blue color spark).
I’ve had something similar once, where I noticed less torque then normal while driving. After some searching I found the ignition coil measured slightly out of spec. When cold it measured 9,5 kΩ between the secondary connection and either of the primaries. When warm it rose to somewhere around 13 kΩ. Volvo states it has to be between 6 and 8,5 kOhm. Didn’t seem all that far of, but after changing the coil it started better when warm, picked up more smoothly from idle and had its power back.
What power you may ask... The combination of the earlier b230f with its M-camshaft and an automatic transmission never will be a high performance combo. When I first got my car more than 10 years ago, I found the lack of torque very annoying and started looking for possible solutions. I decided to change the cam in mine and after some testing settled on a T-cam. This cam matches very nicely with an automatic transmission (ZF22). Giving more low-end torque with a better/flatter power output through the higher rpm’s.
I also removed the spring-loaded resistance device mounted in the gas pedal. Volvo fitted this thing in certain years as a fuel economy measure. All I found was that it totally messed up the throttle feel.
Thinking this also concerns Elsa’s performance, or lack thereof, I decided to post this reply here. Hope it helps.
@@iRoll4ever_740 thanks, I appreciate it! I'm going to swap the ignition coil over today as a few other people also suggested it! Someone also offered me a couple of camshafts, a V and a T for the 240, didn't have much interest in the T but I think your right, it would be perfect for the 740!
Trivial question but relevant. What brand ECT have you used, I used a chinese finest sensor a couple months back. It was absolutely shocking, too rich on startup, hard hot/warm starts. I ended up going Bosch for peace of mind, christ it was the single most significant improvement.
I've heard of this happening often! I actually tried a known good used unit, as well as testing the resistance on both to make sure they were within spec! But yeah I think i'd only go with Bosch too
Since you removed the injectors from the fuel rail/head. New o-rings as needed
So when it's hot it's taking longer to start? Hows the cold start? Too much fuel would lead to fuel regular probably, just dumping more fuel then it needs. Not sure if the 740 has an ECU but that could also be an issue. Starting issues are the bane of a mechanics existence, hard to reproduce and a total headache. Could be ECU, could be fuel pump regulator, could be the injectors staying stuck open for too long.
Agreed! Thanks, it takes longer when hot (warm) but now it's started getting worse even from cold start when it's hot outside and it's been left for more than a day... just to make it confusing :D
@@Involvod cuz when it's hot fuel will vaporize/evaporate just from sitting. It's definitely an odd one. Always start with the basics, fuel pressure and go from there.
Exactly the issue my 1996 940 has! I also tried (almost) everything on your list and switched components between my 1996 and 1997 940. (driving me nuts..)
The rev needle bounces slightly on mine as well, BUT : When i measure the sensor, I have a normal 170 ohm reading between pin 2 and 1, but between 2 and 3 it's an open circuit(!) The cable looks still very new and is very flexible still.
I think the sensor has this double circuit just for backup, but I'm not sure..
Can you measure your Crank sensor?
I recently worked on a 940 with a similar issue, on 2 of the pins the reading bounced around when hot. On this car it's a hall sensor on the distributor, i'm not sure how to test it but it might be worth a go! Good luck with yours
@@Involvod Thanks a lot! 👍
Crankshaft position sensor
I had a dodgy new coolant temperature sensor took ages to diagnose
Check valve in fuel pump faulty? Not sure how it would relate to temperature though, but it might. Would be nice if there was a way to monitor the pressure in the rail after resting. Good luck! BTW I ordered one of your shirts! Don't tell the wife I spent US$ 18 on shipping!
Thanks, it's quite a new pump but nothing to say it's not faulty, especially with the quality of parts these days! Thanks for the order, very much appreciated! I hope you like it 😁
on the 240 they're separate, or at least there is a separate check valve next to the main pump underneath the car. 740's might be different idk
@@Bassalicious on this one the check valve is attached to the pump and comes with it
I'm banking on a crank sensor that's on the way out.
Failing crank sensor!
I had a bad connection in the fuse relay block.
Spade to the relay wasn’t getting a consistent connection.
Only gave me problems in hot weather after the car sat in the sun.
When cold started right up.
Might not be your issue, hope ya get it figured out.
Run the car till it’s good and hot. Then check the temp on the relay I’m chattering about. If it’s really hot then somewhere your wiring is poo biscuits
Thanks, what did you do to fix it?
@@Involvod I had to pull the fuse relay block out, ( it doesn’t actually come out, but you can un clip it and pull it up for maintenance),and clean all the terminals. Also replaced the relay that was not getting the good connection. I also keep a couple of the important relays in the glove box, for emergencies.
@@coyotefurtrumpet thanks man, because of UA-cam's new username system I had no idea you were Coyote Fur Trumpet 😄 Hope to see another video from you soon man they were cool
@@Involvod in the process of switching out my heater core hope to post a video of the nightmare soon
What about a compression test? Plus crank shaft position sensor and cam sensor, (common with merc's yes I know it's a volvo) also when was the timing belt changed? check timing positions again.
Verteilerkappe?
While I want to see more of the Mercedes, I'll try to help anyways. I agree this sounds a lot like a sensor related over fuelling issue, but since you've replaced seemingly all of the obvious culprits on that side, have you put a spark tester on it to see if you are actually getting a good strong spark during the long crank no start? Coils can begin to break down and do weird things, especially as they get warm.
Also, I'm not sure off hand what these use for an RPM signal, if its a crank sensor, or something else. When these get weak or start to fail they can cause issues like this, especially when warm. I had an older Mercedes (w124) years ago that would start right up when cold, but as soon as the engine hit 80* on the temp gauge it would run rough and die. I could get it it run but only if I kept the revs up. Soon as it cooled off a bit it would restart without issue, until the sensor got warm again.
Thanks, it is sparking well, as far as I could tell. The RPM sensor is a hall type sensor, I didn't suspect it as the RPM needle does bounce during the hard start situations, but it may not be a bad idea to replace it due to its age anyway!
Change the dizzy cap and rotor arm
How many ECT sensors have you tried? Took three attempts to get one that worked for me and this is exactly the issue I was having. Cold, fine, hot, fine… but eventually it just stopped starting cleanly in the morning. I pulled the rail, looked for seepage, ignition amp as also mentioned can get crusty (dried out thermal paste between it and the heat sink.
I didn’t believe it was the ECT until I took resistance readings from the ecu and… yup… it was dead and only a year old.
hey Phil, did you try 3 different sensors? I´ve been through 2 new ones now, and both measured faulty when I got them (both measured about double the prescribed resistance at 80c). Now I just ordered a bunch and will try to find one that hits the correct resistance
I was about to tell this exact same story! I went through a few ECT sensors and had no end to starting problems until I finally found a good one.
Thanks! I've heard a lot about aftermarket temp sensors for these cars being problematic, I also ordered one for the 940 temp gauge and it had the wrong resistance right out the box.
With this car I actually checked the resistance and replaced it anyway with another one showing good resistance, just in case it was intermittent, same issue 😏
@@Augenatic I did. EPS one worked for me.
@@PhilMakesThings thanks Phil!! will try EPS if none of the ones I ordered are good
Not technically into Volvos, but did you check distributor cap and rotor?
That‘s an initial candidate on hot start issues.
Well worth a look (if worn out)…
Thanks, I replaced them last year. It was on my list of things to check for so long, when I took off the rotor arm it crumbled apart! :O
Have those injectors got the resistor pack in the wiring loom for the injectors as you know those don't have built in one's .
I'm not too sure, i'll have to check!
@@Involvod it could be that it's heating up causing the hot start issue I had got a full turbo setup out of a early 740 turbo and on the loom it had that resistor pack on it .
It kinda looked like a pack of double aa batteries .
@@Andrew-b3j7r thanks, I'll have a look today 👍
@@Involvod LH2.2 non-turbo does not use the resistor pack. That is only on the turbo-charged cars.
@@Schwedenstahl245 thanks 👍
did you change the temp gauge sender or the Fuel injection system temp sensor? There are two different ones in the head . Is the system holding fuel pressure when you turn it off? It should hold for 20 mins...
CPS?
Hi, just wondering, would it be the fuel pressure regulator? Enjoyed the video😊
Thanks, glad you enjoyed it! I did swap it over from the 240, no change sadly
I have a 93..940 2.3 wagon .same color same red block motor. It sit for two years after I sold my mustang .I was going to start driving it again .but it crank but not start. I talked to a Volvo mec. he said to replace that crank sensor on top the belhouseing I did .I turned the it came back to life and runs great.
@@frankzimmerman5608 thanks for sharing!
I ahve a customer with a 740 that keeps a spare fuel pump relay in his glovebox for this very reason.
Does the Volvo have a separate cold start injector? Could that be the troublesome one?
This one doesn't, I think it was on the LH2.4 and maybe some other set ups but not on the LH2.2
Air temp sensor ??
If fitted
Crankshaft position sensor.
Might be daft but have you checked the ignition timing?
Thanks, yeah I gave that a check the other day, all seems good!
my s60 is now being serviced at the local volvo here in Finland. the engine stopped and runs poorly. message on the screen, service the engine system immediately. I changed the vacuum hoses and the fuel filter. after that this happened. I'm guessing dirt in the air hoses
Have you changed the crank sensor?
Not yet, the RPM needle bounces whilst cranking so I put it down as working
I would change it
Is The timingbelt old and stretched?..
Ignition coil , had similar problems ignition coil solved it
Thanks, I'll try it 👍
Is there a valve adjustment issue?
Kompression tested?
Time to check with another ECU? I have a couple for both with and without EGR. Send me the number on the ECU so can i check
Thanks for the offer! I have the same ECU on the 240 so maybe i'll quickly swap it out and see what happens!
Fuel pump
What size fpr did you install? If its a 3 bar its to big, make sure its a 2.5.
Thanks, I just saw this and checked, it's got the 3, but it's been on there long before these issues started, so does my N/A LH2.2 240 (didn't realise) and it runs ok too. Do you know what problems running the 3 could cause?
@@Involvod about 15% more fuel than what the car was designed to have in the rail and injectors. So it'll run real rich. Check your O2 sensor too, make sure it warms up properly or it'll throw too much fuel at startup
@@arche8986 thank for the reply, that's interesting. On my 240 I get about 30 US MPG on a run and the plugs are clean. But in any case I'll get the correct ones for both cars, just a shame they're so expensive!
Have you showed us the spark plugs? How did the old one look? Is the car running rich all the time or is it just during start?
Come to think of it, it might not be a fuel issue. Does the car have an ignition coil? Have you measured that? It might be that temperature affects the electronic properties of ignition components. Do you have a spark tester?
It seems to be only rich on startup, fuel on the plugs, but normally they look ok. I'm getting a good spark when this fault happens I recently managed to double check
@@Involvod OK, so it is fuel then. At least that narrows it down. And it's only at start up since it doesn't run rich when started. Do you have more than one vehicle with this engine? Can you borrow an ECU from another car and test?
@@Involvod Doesn't this car have an rudimental version of diagnostics?
@@jonasbjork6593 I just swapped over the ECU and just need chance to use the car and try it, hopefully it's solved the issue. Sadly these cars don't have the OBD, that came in on the LH2.4, this being LH2.2
ua-cam.com/video/grFc_RbzqHg/v-deo.htmlsi=bZN8DgJh25pkiQXl
This guy talks about his hot start issue at 6:45. He mentions a engine temp sensor behind the manifold. Might fix your problem!