People always omit the fact that Hank is like the least affectionate person in the world. he wont even hug his own mother in public, and really only shows affection to peggy when shes cooking or wilding out soo much that he's forced to say things and even then he's like.....I'm with you because "you know.... the love"
@@Bosshands Hank gets away with a lot of things because he’s considered the voice of reason and it’s rather sad that instead of his issues being addressed and worked on, everyone else has to work around him or they’re considered the bad guy.
Though with Hank a lot of the affection he could show was probably beaten out of him by his dad Cotton. It's definitely a complex that he constantly struggles with.
@@lucasmartinez5703 Both of Hank’s parents were a mess between Cotton’s untreated PTSD and Tilly’s multiple issues that it’s a wonder Hank managed to have a kid as good as Bobby and as strong a marriage with Peggy that he does.
@@lucasmartinez5703 true but people don’t seem to understand how that effects his relationship with Peggy. They just think she’s a horrible selfish person cuz of her mother and the writers wrote her to be, as opposed to a response to hanks flaws and actions as her husband. I’m just glad reviewed2death made this response, specially so close to squirrel tactics “ 4 times peggy was wrong” video cuz he didn’t seem to get it either and that comment section is just crazy lol
@@phlpcockrell actually no, 2 Twin XL mattresses are the same size of King, twin XL 38(2)x80, king 76x80, a queen is 60x80. A standard twin is 38x75, so if its 2 standard twins it still closer to a regular king, but is almost a square because its 5 inches shorter. If you buy king boxspring or foundation, most of the time its actually just 2 Twin/Twin XL foundations depending on the style, as well as the bed itself. I used to be a mattress and bedding specialist for Ashley Furniture.
I like Hank as a character, and his abnormal behavior is a gold mine for comedy. That said, I won't deny I sometimes wonder why his lack of affection for others didn't prevent Peggy from marrying him in the first place. She must have realized at some point that he wouldn't always be able to give her what she wanted.
I mean to be fair straight women tend to marry men BECAUSE of their general lack of affection. It takes a lot of spiritual and psychological work for any human to even WANT what's good for them to the point of pursuing it, and Peggy is definitely not someone that has done a lot of spiritual and psychological work.
@@newusernamehere4772so she's so repressed that she's a straight housewife?? She needs to be a spiritual and psychoanalytical zealot lesbian to be free?? Wtf😂
I think the main problem is, Peggy *was* being unfair: Bobby wasn't *trying* to one-up her, and Hank wasn't trying to be a jerk. These dummies are just bad at communication.
Peggy has legitimate grevinses with the way Hank takes her for granted sometimes, but her assuming European Boomhauer was gay is an example of one of her biggest personality flaws. Peggy has a tendency to talk past others and put herself at the center of everything, like when she turned Nancy and Mihn against her in the failed school board race by refusing to listen to anyone else's ideas. The whole Ernst thing could have been avoided if Peggy had ever asked her hair stylist, who she apparently sees frequently and is comfortable sharing intimate details of her personal life with, a single thing about himself. Just asking the dude, "Do you have a partner?" Could have saved her some embarrassment.
Idk, when he seductively says "I can think of many things that can be done to HAnK 😏" then it might not be the craziest assumption to make (which is also a classic mis-direction joke, where the gay stereotype is actually into women 🤯🤯). I ain't going to fault Peg for that one, as we all make embarrassing assumptions from time to time.
If you think about it in the Hill house Peggy does have the worst support system when it comes to friends. Hank has three long term friends who moved around him to be with him. They all always talk about how great he is and have told him and shown him he is the leader of their group. If he says they are going to do things they usually do it with no question or very few. He has a job that respects him. His coworkers treat him more like a boss than the real boss. The only none support he has is family with Cotton being a crazed jerk. His mom is nice here and there, but we see growing up she ignored things happening and would disassociate a lot. Now she is still nice, but is a bit messed up now. Bobby has 2 friends that are very loyal. Yeah, Joseph is odd but so is Dale. Most of his classmates love having him around and even strangers find him charming. Hank has a hard time showing love, but it is obvious he does love Bobby. Peggy can get completive (like the video game B plot), but everyone knows she adores Bobby. She openly supports him and flat out tells him she loves him. Peggy has Minh, who treats her more like she is forced to be around. I love Minh, but when it comes to Peggy she treats her like Peggy is far below her and only hangs out with her because of Nancy, she openly mocks Peggy. Nancy does hang out with Peggy, but very little compared to the guys and their friends. Nancy also brushes off Peggy like, yeah maybe they are okay with each other, but they are friends only because their spouses are. Her coworkers have shown to not like her or act like she really isn't a coworker friend. The only one kinda okay is the one reporter, but he was also shown to happily take stuff from her as well. Her parents also was not very supportive. We see her mom pretty much always acts very cold or cruel to Peggy as if nothing she does is right as her dad gives odd speeches that have nothing to do with what is going on (like... is he mentally okay). I feel like Peggy has issues and this super ego is because she created false confidence because she really doesn't get a lot of real praise from anyone. I feel like that is why she goes over the top so much. She is trying to people to notice her and tell her how great she is because she doesn't get that a lot. Yes, she knows Hank loves her, but he doesn't show or tell her and she sees others with their spouses getting lots of love (like Dale always openly loving Nancy and heck even seeing poor sad Bill still being in love with an exwife who hates him even after she left years go). Her friends sometimes feel like friends only because they live in the same neighborhood and when she makes friends outside of the neighborhood she is getting tricked (like the bookstore and the pyramid scheme) or they are never talked about again as if the friend stops talking to her (Carolyn). Peggy has to feel very lonely. That is also another reason why I do think Peggy cheated on Hank at least when they were dating. I have already talked about that a few times though.
Peggy has always been insecure as it relates to being homemaker. This started since at least high school because we see her mom giving her a hard time about not being able to find a husband since she can’t cook and Hank talks about this all the time too. Her reaction was definitely batshit insane but it definitely makes sense and/or invoke sympathy when you understand she just wants affirmation that she’s a good homemaker.
I'd feel some sympathy if it weren't her son. Like don't take your insecurity out on your little boy who isn't trying to dethrone you or anytning. Just suck it up a little.
Like hank hating someone touching his house. Peggy would be the same when someone challenges her role in the house. We see both her mothers pre and post ret con don't give her any validation so as an adult being challenged by bobby was pretty much another person in her life giving her the same thing in her mind. It's why Luanne isn't a threat as she can fix up cars and Peggy never had that interest
Something I've noticed a lot with people criticizing Peggy is that they compare her to their own narcissistic and abusive parents. While I don't consider Peggy to be an abusive parent, she is absolutely a narcissist, so I wouldn't be surprised if the reason she is so reviled is that people are projecting their own experiences onto Peggy because she exhibits similar behavior. That being said, I still don't really like Peggy, especially in this episode. I agree that Hank shares a lot of the blame for how she acted, but Bobby was completely innocent in this entire situation. I really find it hard to sympathize with Peggy because she still made Bobby a target of her rage, when it should have been focused solely on Hank. Also while I can see the symbolism with Hank separating the beds and letting Bobby stay with him, you could argue that it's Peggy's own fault that Bobby was put into that position since she took his room. Bobby was perfectly content with staying on the couch until Hank found him cleaning. Funny enough, I think a much better episode with a sympathetic Peggy is Pregnant Paws, specifically because we are shown a flashback that explains why she is so angry with Hank trying to get Ladybird pregnant. The fact that he refused to do anything to fix his low fertility (especially the bare minimum like wearing boxers) is one of the most selfish things Hank has ever done, so Peggy's rage there is completely justified.
@@megabladechronicles962 I agree entirely with you about the Pregnant Paws situation. Peggy was doing everything she could but Hank was balking at the idea of even wearing boxer shorts and even subtly gaslit Peggy to stop trying because they already had a “miracle” with Bobby and expecting another miracle was “selfish.” Hank didn’t even try to do anything other than wear shorts and sit in a cooler once; he put more effort into Ladybird, an elderly dog, than he did with trying to help get Peggy pregnant.
Yeah for me, it was just her being so wrapped up in her insecurity that she treated Bobby like an enemy instead of her son and didn't stop and maybe cherish the fact that her son and Hank were FINALLY bonding over something. She made it about herself.
@@blackzero786 they both wanted more children, but Hank refused to do anything that could increase his sperm count and shamed Peggy for considering in vitro fertilization
I'm a Peggy apologist from way back, and this is definitely my least favorite Peggy episode. I do really love that you acknowledge that Hank isn't perfect. He's supposed to be a reflection of stereotypical small town Texas values, he's not supposed to be perfect, or even someone to look up to. He's just Hank, and that's why we love him. I feel the same way about Peggy. We all know people like them, that's the entire point.
I agree with a lot of what you said 'but it dose not excuse the actions taken by Peggy. What King of the Hill dose well with Peggy and Hank is show two people from bad childhoods and the effect those upbringings have on their marriage. Hank is emotionally closed off leading to him having a incredibly difficult time expressing his feelings. While Peggy has incredibly low self esteem where she feels the need to seek external validation from outside sources. Neither one is responsible for the other but they do have a responsibility to communicate more effectively and work to improve on those areas. Both Peggy and Hank need to be better partners to each other. They both need to say sorry. Some thing that really happens in KOTH, Hank is usually the one to apologize even with the situation is Peggy's fault, with the most aggress example being "Death and Taxes". What would have made a world of difference would be Peggy's talking to Hank and Bobby about how she is felling. How she treats bobby during this episode is majorly not okay he is a kid who is finally getting praise from a emotionally close off father, whos strongest emotional showing is his disappointment in bobby, and now he is praising him for one of the things that disappointed him. Bobby is the one who I feel bad for in the majority of these episodes of KOTH. He is a kind, sweet ,funny kid, who is good at a lot things 'but is never allowed to truly show off because they aren't considered what he should be good at or a skill of value. Hank seems to only express disappointment in bobby because of what he likes/who he is, where he can only see his value when its applied to something that Hanks likes, and Peggy acts like a child in her tic for tac remarks with him. Both Peggy and Hank love bobby 'but the same things that cause problems in their marriage also cause them to be bad parents to bobby. Often in a way where one parent is on Bobby's side while the other is not. He is the one who deserves better and the one who both Peggy and Hank have a responsibility to be better for. Thank you if you read this whole comment. I love your videos and they have really deepened my apperception for this series.
You nailed it perfectly thank you. It was really just how she treated Bobby in the episode (and in various other instances throughout the series tbh). He just didn't deserve how she was treating him even if we know where she's coming from. Those feelings relate to how I feel about how Hank treats Bobby a lot of times too. I have nothing more to add.
I would say that Peggy felt that Hank was only interested in her cooking because of what happened in the mono episode where she recalled the story of their date when they were “engaged to be engaged” after their long conversation over an imaginary dinner. This stuck in her mind as a happy memory and so she felt like she had to be a good cook and know how to run a household to make her traditionally minded husband happy. Having that balance threatened made Peggy react with hostility and anger, not unlike when she found out that Hank lied about his back so many years ago. Just like Hank, Peggy also requires a sense of stability to help keep her ego in check.
@@caleb1413 Bobby is the only one who is truly innocent in all of this. He’s trying to get a good grade but also is discovering that he can use his new skills to make things for his dad who he greatly admires and is always trying to connect with.
I disagree with the belief that Hank only married Peggy for her value. I believe it is the only hope he has for Bobby to ever get married if he saw value in it.
True, but it’s not like Hank’s helping. Throughout the series, everyone always has to tiptoe around Hank and cater to him, just because of his weird and ignorant social hangups. Mind you, he’s stated in front of Peggy that the only thing women are good for is to be wives, mothers, and homemakers. Yes, Peggy has her moments. She has an ego (I personally like the theory that Peggy’s injuries from the skydiving incident caused her to develop NPD), but let’s not act like Hank hasn’t caused most of the conflicts in the series and probably contributed to Peggy’s deep-seeded insecurities.
New Villain Origin Story Unlocked: Having your Reddit comment read by a smallish-mediumish sized UA-camr about your cartoon opinions and you're mildly irritated by it.
I'm going to give a King Solomon take: Peggy thought Hank was replacing her with Bobby in the bedroom because Hank actually was(though unintentionally and unconsciously) ramping himself up to replacing Peggy in the bedroom with Bobby. That Thanksgiving dinner going off without a hitch would have been the tipping point where Hank would have slipped up and said "I wish you were my wife, Bobby." and it all would have collapsed from there. Bobby is the only innocent one here because he's just trying to pass his class and hang out with his dad. There, nobody's happy. :D
Honestly Peggy brings this on herself. She's said a few times she doesn't like doing housework or being a stay at home mom and when Bobby who actually enjoy's doing this stuff starts doing better then her minor attempts she gets all huffy. I think they took the episode a bit too far by having Hank and Bobby start bonding over it and even sharing the same bedroom but still if Peggy felt so threatened she should have actually started caring about her role as housekeeper. Like usual though she lets her ego get in the way and does something stupid.
One of the greatest headaches of the series is how strong character motivations will contradict other ones. Because you are 100% correct! When Kahn's mom comes to town, Peg happily dumps all the housework on her, making the Goodbye Normal Jeans conflict feel especially out-of-place. This creates a frustrating problem when you try to give everything in series equal weight. You either have to dismiss one aspect as being "poorly written" or twist yourself into knots trying to make it all fit. 🤷♂️
@@Reviewed2Death Yeah even in this episode when Bobby makes Hank new jeans after Peggy ruins them she blames the machine for her poor sewing skills. "It can't make seams this straight".
@@Reviewed2Deathor maybe it’s just the fact that they had multiple writers working on different episodes, and they couldn’t do the bare minimum like actually understanding the characters they’re writing for ( or checking previous episodes before making new ones with contradictions in them) Peggy’s two different moms and her relationships with them is a perfect example here if her attitude towards being a housewife isn’t enough. Or how in this episode she knows how to ride a bike, but seasons later Bobby is trying to teach her to ride a bike because in Montana she apparently only rode a horse.
This is the weirdest episode, I cannot 😂 Edit: I left this comment because I wanted to, not because you told me to. I need you to know that. Although I do love how quiet and peaceful the comment section is right now, let me enjoy it for a spell until the rest of the crew gets here and it turns into nothing but sex jokes and Mario Kart references.
Yeah... that's a no from me. I'm by no means a Peggy hater, but this perspective is disregarding the _actual_ crux of the issue that most people have with this episode. Peggy is insecure, and she's making other people suffer for it. Hank and Bobby have no idea that their actions are making her feel this way, and Peggy, in this particular instance, lacks the cogency to explain why she feels the way she does. Instead, she takes on increasingly silly antics, which don't seem entirely out of the ordinary because her family knows her to be an eccentric. Now, their actions _did_ contribute to this behavior to be sure. Both things can be true. Also, Hank isn't pitting the two against each other, and I think that's a strange read to have on the situation. At every turn, he's trying in the only ways he understands to "let her down gently," or spare her feelings, or find a silver lining to the clouds. Even pulling the beds apart was only so he could have a comfortable night's sleep, and he did it surrepticiously to avoid making a big deal out of it. Logically, if you can't sleep comfortably and there's a way to fix that without being malicious, then you should do it. If I, as the partner, am contributing to that issue, then I _want_ to fix that because your comfort matters more than my ego. What Hank values in _a_ wife and what he values in _his_ wife are two very different things (because _a_ wife is an ideal, and Hank appreciates ideals, while _his_ wife is a real person that he loves), which was shown throughout the series and in this very episode. He's very capable of demonstrating this difference, if only his repressed mind is to realize it's necessary or desired at any given time. It took the damn hairdresser to speak up and tell Hank what was going on, because Hank was too oblivious and optimistic to notice, and Peggy was too insecure to properly communicate, and that can't always be the other person's fault. At some point, if you feel a certain way or want a certain thing, and it isn't being given to you, you need to verbalize that instead of stewing in it. If you _choose_ to suffer in silence, you need to live with that choice instead of making _other_ people suffer for it. Which is a _character flaw_ and not an objectively bad thing about the character or episode. Again, not a Peggy hater and I actually love this episode. I just think that it's better to acknowledge all facets of the interactions we see, and a character doesn't have to be morally correct to be a good character. Also, I'm really not of fan of people calling an episode "bad" because characters do things they don't like. To each their own, but your opinion of a character's morality or sanity doesn't have bearing on the actual _quality_ of the episode itself. Not saying this to anyone in particular, just my perspective on that trend.
I think a much better episode with a sympathetic Peggy is Pregnant Paws, specifically because we are shown a flashback that explains why she is so angry with Hank trying to get Ladybird pregnant.
@@myeeeeehHank has said that he only views marriage as worth something if his spouse (Peggy) was a decent cook, mother and homemaker, in front of said spouse (Peggy). Hank is by far the most problematic character in the show. Everyone always has to tiptoe around him and cater to him.
@oh.s Hank is definitely not the most problematic person on the show. That title belongs to Cotton. Peggy didn’t even want to tell Hank that she was bothered, instead decides to sabotage Bobby multiple times throughout the episode just for bonding with his father.
Growing up my dad made sure I learned Home related shit, like cooking and cleaning. He told me , when I was like 10, learn how to do this do you don't have to find a woman to do them for you .
I think if we look back at the episode where she and Hank were trying to have another child (I think it's season 3, funny enough it's the episode the clip from 7:08 comes from) we can see where Peggy is coming from here, Peggy was jealous of Ladybird because Hank kept trying and doing all these things for Ladybird, and felt like Hank didn't try as much for her and having a baby, and it triggered a level of fear of failure and being not only told "No" but full on stonewalled out of something expected and normal, and when you see her mother, it all makes sense, then of course in this Hank lays it out pretty "Bluntly" even if he himself is deeper and beyond such things, it's just the surface level rationalization he grew up with from Cotton, he "Knows" more than he says but says as he does because it's what he grew up with, "You need a partner to take care of the home duties for you." and that hits Peggy right in the insecurity, again, from how she was raised, she feels like that's all she brings to the table, and so again she feels like the one thing she does (Aside from have children, and as we saw earlier, she can't do that because of Hank's narrow urethra) so in her and Hank's upbringing we see the outdated ideas crashing together in a storm that neither of them truly believe but still fear and hurt over, and the two confront it to find the true meaning, love. In said previous episode, they find that they love Bobby, and it was through their love that they relaxed and had Bobby. Similarly, in this, Hank and Peggy rediscover that it wasn't utility or convenience or arrangement and fear that brought them together, but love. It's just that the preconceived notions and their own repressed upbringings, fears, etc, took the reigns away from rationality and truth and lead them down a pretty bad path. With that said though, I'm still not big on the episode even if I know where the writers are coming from and I like the ideas, it goes a bit too fast and ramps up a bit too much and just feels extra irrational and thus not that fun. I think said prior episode did the job better, better pacing, better stakes, and a very real frustration that gets addressed and resolved in a way that didn't go too far.
Finished the vid and we basically had the same thoughts, you even referenced the exact episode and the points. I do think it does better, but I'm excited to see you talk about that one too.
Honestly, this is one of my favorite episodes because I really see myself in Bobby's position. My mother was also jealous of my relationship with my dad and actively went out of her way to destroy it however she could. I feel a lot of comradarie with Bobby.
What nobody seems to point out because they’re so busy vilifying Peggy for her jealousy of Bobby (except for Reviewed) is that Hank’s emotionally repressive nature more often than not causes a lot of conflict. This episode, for example, has him regard marriage as something where a wife does nothing but household duties instead of how much a couple loves each other and wants to be together. And so many times, everyone else is supposed to cater to Hank being emotionally repressed instead of Hank taking the steps to work on being able to express himself better.
I think about what Peggy would be like if they divorced(wishful thinking). This episode was terribly uncomfortable. It made me question their marriage like in the turtle song episode. Boddy has a good head on his shoulder and it couldve also been a bonding/learning if Peggy's ego wouldn't have got in the way. Hank made no effort to improve his.. emotional ineptitude. "The love" Side note: growing up in a place with plenty of Hanks but it didnt go as far as them sleeping in seperate rooms of the house and hardly ever shoeing affection. That marriage was certainly an observation for me and one i never wanted. The resentment felt between them. I was a housekeeper while the wife worked and the husband did Hank stuff. At least Hank took out the trash without being asked.
It was hard to tell Peggy reacted from Hank while also remembering how Hank has trouble with communicating his emotions. Peggy's jealousy was something that bothered me in the episode, but I couldn't help but find it funny. 😅 It does help to understand how there is conflict between Peggy's and Hank's communication, especially with how Hank has trouble being emotionally expressive.
Your avatar wearing a Peggy wig was something I didn't know I needed in my life (On a more serious note it's always fantastic to see analyses like this one that go the extra mile to read between the lines and don't just write a 5-minute comment from face value. Really does the series' writing proper justice.)
i was confused by how we’ve already gotten a video about goodbye normal jeans and now i am even more confused by the “sexually threatened” thing. this is gonna be a very interesting 30ish minutes
This episode just seems like the writers shitting on Peggy, which became more and more normal as the series went on, until she is straight up an egomaniac by the end. By season 10 various characters just feel like puppets to tell silly jokes with, and not the same characters we journeyed with during the early seasons. I just can't see this episode as anything other than Peggy going completely crazy, because the writers lost touch with their characters.
This video is even funnier than Wendigoon just announcing he is starting up a “talent agency,” despite being a plagiarist that works closely with Internet Historian (fellow plagiarist).
I mean Hank didn’t marry her for her cooking or the way she cleans, he literally has to endure her horrible cooking & always has her back no matter how wrong she is.
every mother I knew growing up including my own would whine about housework so you'd think Bobby doing it all and for school at that would be great for her. if she kept that musing columnist job it might have been a better stress reliever than John freaking Redcorn.
I just like the idea of Bobby's cooking skills being used again in Blood and Sauce and in the upcoming reboot. He seemed to really thrive once he got the hang of it and now Hank and Peggy can checkout his fusion restaurant.
Peggy thinking he’d be alone on thanksgiving is a window into her mainstream thinking. It’s meant to be innocent, and her Peggy world can’t comprehend another world, as she’s Peggy-centric. It’s not a critique about the social norms in Texas in the ‘90s. It’s all about Peggy and her cluelessness about others.
“It’s a show of discordance and disharmony, which is typically not the things you want in your marriage bed.” [Cuts to Bobby and Luanne from THAT episode] This screenshot should be a meme.
It was an odd episode really. Peggy jealous of Bobby and Hank just feeding the flames by praising Bobby and belittling Peggy. I liked the bonding moment between Hank and Bobby as we see the interests Bobby likes is first criticized and judged by Hank but eventually he warms up to it and dare I say enjoys it.
Pregnant Paws was just a better version of this episode that makes me sympathize with and even praise Peggy (which considering my general and personal annoyance with the character is quite a feat). This episode.......much harder.
I mean, if she was a real person she would need to, but she's a character in a show, so no she really doesn't. It's funnier when she isn't a mentally stable adult.
I see where you're coming from and agree. Hank's near constant causal sexism and emotional constipation have been the aspects of him I find the most frustrating. He is 100% in the wrong here for putting Peggy in that position and headspace. As much as I do think Peggy is a horrible human being, she does deserve affection and to feel wanted and needed, and given affection in her marriage. However, while that makes Peggy's actions and downward spiral understandable, it doesn't excuse it. Nor does it not make her look unhinged. This episode definitely makes Peggy look bad, but in all honesty it makes her and Hank both look like a pair of jackasses. No, if there is an episode I say that shows why Peggy is a deplorable human being it is definitely not this one. It's the one where she deliberately and maliciously sabotages Lucky's education and attempt to get a G.E.D. For me, that just makes her a terrible human being, and it's just inexcusable. This one while making Peggy look deranged due to how it is written I would say is less a "Peggy is a narcissist" episode and more of a "Peggy and Hank need fucking marriage counseling cause this relationship is not healthy" episode.
This is my one episode where I really hate Peggy because all series long Peggy has been and will continue to complain at Hank for not being able to connect to Bobby and the one episode (I don’t count the propaniacs because I hate that episode) where Hank finally connects with him she hates him for it and worse she sees Bobby as a threat as if Bobby was going to steal Hank from her how gross can she be
You made a point that I've never considered before, talking about how Hank values specific acts of service to the household as a wife. I admit I was on the hate train for Peg-Leg when I watched this years ago, but no...I change my mind now. I get it.
I also get it. But I'm still on the side of "ok but leave Bobby out of your feelings he's just a boy who's finally bonding with his dad and you know how hard that is for him to do with how emotionally stunted Hank is." If it were just between her and Hank, I'd feel for her more. But she waa too wrapped in her own feelings that she kinda takes it out on Bobby and that's where she loses me.
Oh my god thank you! Finally someone who views this episode for what it’s worth. I am a SAHM in my mid thirties with three kids who lives in a conservative state. My heart breaks for Peggy in this episode. Of course she should have treated Bobby better.
I still think that Peggy should have talked it out with Hank instead of regardless of intention hurting Bobby in the process of her fight with Hank. I understand her motivations and even feel bad for her to a degree but I still do feel like she took things a bit too far. Not to say she is even the only one who has done this but Peggy does tend to over react to situations far more often than most of the other cast outside of maybe Dale but he's meant to be a joke.
On one hand, that's fair in terms of normal relationships and interactions, yeah, and I'd probably agree based on those. But on the other, are you setting the "too far" bar based on real life, or based on the heightened reality in sitcoms? Because KotH is a sitcom no matter what specific plotline an episode's following, and I think when accounting for that, she's not really acting _too_ ridiculous.
@@Idran I mean, I'm judging her based on a mix of a real life and based on how the show sets things up. Like, I'm imagining if you had this same kind of situation but made it Dale and Nancy instead and you'd see Dale in Peggy's situation and everyone would be telling him to just talk to Nancy but he'd refuse. Even by the show's logic, the fact that she never even tried and got shot down makes it hard to really fully be on her side whereas if she did try to talk things out then I'd be more on her side.
@@lucasmartinez5703 Which is what I'm saying is wrong here. Her actions against Bobby aren't justifiable when her problem is with Hank and she never even tried to talk to him.
Only just started watching this video. Though it's ended by the time I've finished so there's that. But Peggy usually goes on the attack any time she feels threatened or her ego is challenged etcetera. I don't think she felt *sexually* threatened by Bobby, not by any measure, and a case can be made to defend her sensitivity perhaps but ultimately I think that *at best* Peggy is responding extremely inappropriately to a legitimate grievance with Hank in this episode. But likewise after 20 years of marriage she should be well used to Hank by now. Overall given just *how* insecure, narcissistic, and generally a terrible person Peggy Hill is however: She gets no sympathy from me in this episode. Especially since Hank is pretty open, I doubt he hadn't said similar things much earlier on in their relationship. Either Peggy believes that her 'role' in the marriage and her value as a wife to Hank is measured solely by how good she is at cooking and cleaning, accepted those terms, and married him anyway then proceeded to not be very good at it for twenty years or she understands that it's deeper than that and therefore that Bobby is no threat to her position and went absolutely vicious regardless. If she'd gone on the attack towards *Hank* and called him out on it, even if she was mean about it or there was some collateral harm to Hank, I'd give her more support. And I'm not at all going to criticise her for going the sex route, or for being frustrated with Hank for rejecting her under those circumstances. Certainly I think she's valid in feeling dismissed and rejected there, even if Hank wasn't interested: Peggy was clearly trying her best and 'deserved' at least some measure of "Yes, I see you, you're beautiful" which Hank has demonstrated himself to be capable of at other points in the show. I really don't like Peggy, wouldn't have married her, etc, but I do think she had legitimate grievance with Hank, even just for how dismissively he treated her when she came back from the salon. Even absent any other context it's a pretty clear indication that she's trying to impress in that domain. Really the only innocent person in the episode is Bobby, who's also getting the most flak which is unfortunate. As an aside for purposes of clarity: I don't think Peggy qualifies as being abusive towards Bobby, really he's one of her few saving graces in that she's usually very loving and supportive towards him in a way that shows a much more flattering side of her, and I even think that her kicking his ass in Bobby Goes Nuts is done more out of genuine care than anything mean-spirited, but this is one of her worst episodes in that respect. Probably her *absolute* worst since the main instance I can think of where she goes really claws out on Bobby outside of it is her jab at him when he's crying over Marie.
Do you really think Hank’s oblivious ass would notice something like that, especially if it was emotional, if nobody bothered to explain what was wrong to him?
Yknow this episode pops up in one of the three koth UA-cam compilations that don’t cut halfway through the ep and zoom into a corner every couple seconds and everytime I see it I have a stronger reaction. I was wondering what you were going to say about it and how long I might have to wait to see it, but lo and behold! The spell worked! Gotta say I love the development you built here to slowly help people understand maybe despite their hatred for Queen peg. I’ve always hated episodes where there’s no real resolution, like the one where Hank just sings a song about her and everything’s ok, I miss when he was openly affectionate instead of some sort of stoic shy anime girl feeling like eye contact is an indirect kiss.
Came to say the "Duet" screenshots. Perfect! The best star trek 1 season episode of all series and maybe one of the best of all time... Definitely in my top 3 episodes
Adults, particularly adults who are raising kids, need to do what's best for those kids, even when it's difficult or painful. Abuse, including emotional abuse, psychological abuse, and so on, is inexcusable. Peggy is awful toward Bobby. When she's not coddling him and infantilizing him, she's deliberately triggering his traumas or encouraging him to do the wrong thing (or things which won't serve him well). Hank is emotionally constipated, but rarely, if ever, deliberately hurts Bobby's feelings or leads him to do things which will harm him. Both parents need serious psych help, but Peggy is far worse.
Hank: "Bobby, I just want you to know...Connie killed your frog." - 'Bobby Slam' "Are you going to come quietly, or do I have to carry you out, baby style?" - 'Husky Bobby' "And Son, if you can't see that...maybe you're the moron." - 'Life in the Fast Lane: Bobby's Saga' "Bobby can live in the doghouse!" - 'Hank's Choice' "Bobby, someday I'm going to die. And when that day comes, THEN you can go to cooking school." - 'Life in the Fast Lane: Bobby Slam' Hank throws Bobby's clothes from the Louisiana adventure out the window, he cuts the practice head in half, makes him smoke, blames Bobby for getting his truck killed by the train, takes him into the woods to play pranks and gaslight him with the Snipe Hunt, and neglects his son in favor of Chip Block. Feel free to call Peggy out for her bad behavior, but pretending she's the only "abusive" parent and that Hank "rarely, if ever" does bad things to Bobby is hilariously false.
Is this the same episode where Peggy calls her self a super woman and Bobby says "I like Superwoman!"? 😂 For some reason, a former friend of mine got *really* annoyed by this scene, so I would constantly quote it to him to get on his nerves! 😆
As an adult, i find it almost impossible to tell anybody that i love them. The only people i can easily say it to are my daughter and my nieces/nephews. My brothers have taken it super personal socmany times
I pretty much agree with you. The reaction from Peggy is pretty over the top, petty and destructive but the entire thing would never have happened if Hank (or even Bobby) was aware enough to see they were really pushing her buttons playing on insecurities and took steps to fix it.
Bro always quick to defend Peggy especially when she’s in the wrong. You have a woman like that in your life my guy? It either has to be your mom or your girlfriend. 🤣🤣
There's really no other characters that need defending tbh. Everyone else is either cartoonishly vile or so obviously in the right, that they don't really warrant making a video on. Am I going to defend Nancy for cheating on Dale? Obviously not. Cotton for making Bobby eat backwash and sit on an ice block?? I'd hope not! Hank for getting Big Willie Lane kicked out of the neighborhood? Everyone knows that was the correct thing to do. It's just that Peggy has the greatest degree of nuance, where she can be seen as both vile and correct. Dale is often villainous but his likability means that he doesn't really need a defense. Bill acts selfishly but the show will punish him for it. I wish the show had given us more characters like Peg...but maybe we can only handle one. 😵💫
11:38 THANK YOU this is what I'm thinking the entire l head people talk about this. Hank said in as many words in multiple eps that he's only married to her because she's useful
People always omit the fact that Hank is like the least affectionate person in the world. he wont even hug his own mother in public, and really only shows affection to peggy when shes cooking or wilding out soo much that he's forced to say things and even then he's like.....I'm with you because "you know.... the love"
@@Bosshands Hank gets away with a lot of things because he’s considered the voice of reason and it’s rather sad that instead of his issues being addressed and worked on, everyone else has to work around him or they’re considered the bad guy.
Though with Hank a lot of the affection he could show was probably beaten out of him by his dad Cotton. It's definitely a complex that he constantly struggles with.
@@lucasmartinez5703 Both of Hank’s parents were a mess between Cotton’s untreated PTSD and Tilly’s multiple issues that it’s a wonder Hank managed to have a kid as good as Bobby and as strong a marriage with Peggy that he does.
@@lucasmartinez5703 true but people don’t seem to understand how that effects his relationship with Peggy. They just think she’s a horrible selfish person cuz of her mother and the writers wrote her to be, as opposed to a response to hanks flaws and actions as her husband. I’m just glad reviewed2death made this response, specially so close to squirrel tactics “ 4 times peggy was wrong” video cuz he didn’t seem to get it either and that comment section is just crazy lol
@@Bosshands i had to unsub from squirrel bc him and his audience and obsessed with shitting on peggy lol
Something about the fact that Hank and Peggy's bed is 2 twins instead of an actual king is so perfect for them
That didn’t even surprise me with them i wouldn’t be shocked in Nancy thought of getting a twin bed with Dale but didn’t due to John redcorn
2 twins is closer to a queen than a king but yes agreed
@@phlpcockrell actually no, 2 Twin XL mattresses are the same size of King, twin XL 38(2)x80, king 76x80, a queen is 60x80. A standard twin is 38x75, so if its 2 standard twins it still closer to a regular king, but is almost a square because its 5 inches shorter. If you buy king boxspring or foundation, most of the time its actually just 2 Twin/Twin XL foundations depending on the style, as well as the bed itself. I used to be a mattress and bedding specialist for Ashley Furniture.
I like Hank as a character, and his abnormal behavior is a gold mine for comedy. That said, I won't deny I sometimes wonder why his lack of affection for others didn't prevent Peggy from marrying him in the first place. She must have realized at some point that he wouldn't always be able to give her what she wanted.
Peggy was raised with the same level of affection, it was initially comfortable for her.
I mean to be fair straight women tend to marry men BECAUSE of their general lack of affection. It takes a lot of spiritual and psychological work for any human to even WANT what's good for them to the point of pursuing it, and Peggy is definitely not someone that has done a lot of spiritual and psychological work.
"some people want to be abused"
@@newusernamehere4772so she's so repressed that she's a straight housewife?? She needs to be a spiritual and psychoanalytical zealot lesbian to be free?? Wtf😂
I'd assume he's the only one who could tolerate her. Also she grew up just as repressed as he did, so be seemed normal
I think the main problem is, Peggy *was* being unfair: Bobby wasn't *trying* to one-up her, and Hank wasn't trying to be a jerk. These dummies are just bad at communication.
Peggy has legitimate grevinses with the way Hank takes her for granted sometimes, but her assuming European Boomhauer was gay is an example of one of her biggest personality flaws. Peggy has a tendency to talk past others and put herself at the center of everything, like when she turned Nancy and Mihn against her in the failed school board race by refusing to listen to anyone else's ideas. The whole Ernst thing could have been avoided if Peggy had ever asked her hair stylist, who she apparently sees frequently and is comfortable sharing intimate details of her personal life with, a single thing about himself. Just asking the dude, "Do you have a partner?" Could have saved her some embarrassment.
Idk, when he seductively says "I can think of many things that can be done to HAnK 😏" then it might not be the craziest assumption to make (which is also a classic mis-direction joke, where the gay stereotype is actually into women 🤯🤯).
I ain't going to fault Peg for that one, as we all make embarrassing assumptions from time to time.
The B plot involving Dale and Bill betting a million dollars is funny
I said 'betcha,' to which you said, and I quote, 'you're on!'
That one’s kinda makes me sad. Almost ruined Dale for me tbh
@@Malevolence460 Almost?
If you think about it in the Hill house Peggy does have the worst support system when it comes to friends. Hank has three long term friends who moved around him to be with him. They all always talk about how great he is and have told him and shown him he is the leader of their group. If he says they are going to do things they usually do it with no question or very few. He has a job that respects him. His coworkers treat him more like a boss than the real boss. The only none support he has is family with Cotton being a crazed jerk. His mom is nice here and there, but we see growing up she ignored things happening and would disassociate a lot. Now she is still nice, but is a bit messed up now.
Bobby has 2 friends that are very loyal. Yeah, Joseph is odd but so is Dale. Most of his classmates love having him around and even strangers find him charming. Hank has a hard time showing love, but it is obvious he does love Bobby. Peggy can get completive (like the video game B plot), but everyone knows she adores Bobby. She openly supports him and flat out tells him she loves him.
Peggy has Minh, who treats her more like she is forced to be around. I love Minh, but when it comes to Peggy she treats her like Peggy is far below her and only hangs out with her because of Nancy, she openly mocks Peggy. Nancy does hang out with Peggy, but very little compared to the guys and their friends. Nancy also brushes off Peggy like, yeah maybe they are okay with each other, but they are friends only because their spouses are. Her coworkers have shown to not like her or act like she really isn't a coworker friend. The only one kinda okay is the one reporter, but he was also shown to happily take stuff from her as well. Her parents also was not very supportive. We see her mom pretty much always acts very cold or cruel to Peggy as if nothing she does is right as her dad gives odd speeches that have nothing to do with what is going on (like... is he mentally okay).
I feel like Peggy has issues and this super ego is because she created false confidence because she really doesn't get a lot of real praise from anyone. I feel like that is why she goes over the top so much. She is trying to people to notice her and tell her how great she is because she doesn't get that a lot. Yes, she knows Hank loves her, but he doesn't show or tell her and she sees others with their spouses getting lots of love (like Dale always openly loving Nancy and heck even seeing poor sad Bill still being in love with an exwife who hates him even after she left years go). Her friends sometimes feel like friends only because they live in the same neighborhood and when she makes friends outside of the neighborhood she is getting tricked (like the bookstore and the pyramid scheme) or they are never talked about again as if the friend stops talking to her (Carolyn). Peggy has to feel very lonely.
That is also another reason why I do think Peggy cheated on Hank at least when they were dating. I have already talked about that a few times though.
Peggy has always been insecure as it relates to being homemaker. This started since at least high school because we see her mom giving her a hard time about not being able to find a husband since she can’t cook and Hank talks about this all the time too.
Her reaction was definitely batshit insane but it definitely makes sense and/or invoke sympathy when you understand she just wants affirmation that she’s a good homemaker.
I'd feel some sympathy if it weren't her son. Like don't take your insecurity out on your little boy who isn't trying to dethrone you or anytning. Just suck it up a little.
Like hank hating someone touching his house. Peggy would be the same when someone challenges her role in the house.
We see both her mothers pre and post ret con don't give her any validation so as an adult being challenged by bobby was pretty much another person in her life giving her the same thing in her mind.
It's why Luanne isn't a threat as she can fix up cars and Peggy never had that interest
True
Something I've noticed a lot with people criticizing Peggy is that they compare her to their own narcissistic and abusive parents. While I don't consider Peggy to be an abusive parent, she is absolutely a narcissist, so I wouldn't be surprised if the reason she is so reviled is that people are projecting their own experiences onto Peggy because she exhibits similar behavior.
That being said, I still don't really like Peggy, especially in this episode. I agree that Hank shares a lot of the blame for how she acted, but Bobby was completely innocent in this entire situation. I really find it hard to sympathize with Peggy because she still made Bobby a target of her rage, when it should have been focused solely on Hank.
Also while I can see the symbolism with Hank separating the beds and letting Bobby stay with him, you could argue that it's Peggy's own fault that Bobby was put into that position since she took his room. Bobby was perfectly content with staying on the couch until Hank found him cleaning.
Funny enough, I think a much better episode with a sympathetic Peggy is Pregnant Paws, specifically because we are shown a flashback that explains why she is so angry with Hank trying to get Ladybird pregnant. The fact that he refused to do anything to fix his low fertility (especially the bare minimum like wearing boxers) is one of the most selfish things Hank has ever done, so Peggy's rage there is completely justified.
@@megabladechronicles962 I agree entirely with you about the Pregnant Paws situation. Peggy was doing everything she could but Hank was balking at the idea of even wearing boxer shorts and even subtly gaslit Peggy to stop trying because they already had a “miracle” with Bobby and expecting another miracle was “selfish.” Hank didn’t even try to do anything other than wear shorts and sit in a cooler once; he put more effort into Ladybird, an elderly dog, than he did with trying to help get Peggy pregnant.
Yeah for me, it was just her being so wrapped up in her insecurity that she treated Bobby like an enemy instead of her son and didn't stop and maybe cherish the fact that her son and Hank were FINALLY bonding over something. She made it about herself.
So it's Hank's fault that Peggy didn't have 2-3 kids before the age of 30? Irony.
@@blackzero786 they both wanted more children, but Hank refused to do anything that could increase his sperm count and shamed Peggy for considering in vitro fertilization
I wonder why they never talked about adoption or becoming foster parents.
I'm a Peggy apologist from way back, and this is definitely my least favorite Peggy episode. I do really love that you acknowledge that Hank isn't perfect. He's supposed to be a reflection of stereotypical small town Texas values, he's not supposed to be perfect, or even someone to look up to. He's just Hank, and that's why we love him. I feel the same way about Peggy. We all know people like them, that's the entire point.
I agree with a lot of what you said 'but it dose not excuse the actions taken by Peggy. What King of the Hill dose well with Peggy and Hank is show two people from bad childhoods and the effect those upbringings have on their marriage. Hank is emotionally closed off leading to him having a incredibly difficult time expressing his feelings. While Peggy has incredibly low self esteem where she feels the need to seek external validation from outside sources. Neither one is responsible for the other but they do have a responsibility to communicate more effectively and work to improve on those areas.
Both Peggy and Hank need to be better partners to each other. They both need to say sorry. Some thing that really happens in KOTH, Hank is usually the one to apologize even with the situation is Peggy's fault, with the most aggress example being "Death and Taxes".
What would have made a world of difference would be Peggy's talking to Hank and Bobby about how she is felling. How she treats bobby during this episode is majorly not okay he is a kid who is finally getting praise from a emotionally close off father, whos strongest emotional showing is his disappointment in bobby, and now he is praising him for one of the things that disappointed him.
Bobby is the one who I feel bad for in the majority of these episodes of KOTH. He is a kind, sweet ,funny kid, who is good at a lot things 'but is never allowed to truly show off because they aren't considered what he should be good at or a skill of value. Hank seems to only express disappointment in bobby because of what he likes/who he is, where he can only see his value when its applied to something that Hanks likes, and Peggy acts like a child in her tic for tac remarks with him. Both Peggy and Hank love bobby 'but the same things that cause problems in their marriage also cause them to be bad parents to bobby. Often in a way where one parent is on Bobby's side while the other is not. He is the one who deserves better and the one who both Peggy and Hank have a responsibility to be better for.
Thank you if you read this whole comment. I love your videos and they have really deepened my apperception for this series.
You nailed it perfectly thank you. It was really just how she treated Bobby in the episode (and in various other instances throughout the series tbh). He just didn't deserve how she was treating him even if we know where she's coming from. Those feelings relate to how I feel about how Hank treats Bobby a lot of times too. I have nothing more to add.
Can we all agree that Bobby will be just fine when he grows up? o:
Yeah, he'll be ok. Hank and Peggy have their own issues but they do a better job than their own parents did.
I would say that Peggy felt that Hank was only interested in her cooking because of what happened in the mono episode where she recalled the story of their date when they were “engaged to be engaged” after their long conversation over an imaginary dinner. This stuck in her mind as a happy memory and so she felt like she had to be a good cook and know how to run a household to make her traditionally minded husband happy. Having that balance threatened made Peggy react with hostility and anger, not unlike when she found out that Hank lied about his back so many years ago. Just like Hank, Peggy also requires a sense of stability to help keep her ego in check.
ya this was a really weird episode, peggy is legit insane
I've found myself saying this about her and Bill. Complete psycho's
@@bresams2917 Bill is actually funny that's the thing.. Peggy just annoys me
I honestly find neither Hank nor Peggy likable in this episode.
@@caleb1413 Bobby is the only one who is truly innocent in all of this. He’s trying to get a good grade but also is discovering that he can use his new skills to make things for his dad who he greatly admires and is always trying to connect with.
26:42 Peggy has always been under ladybird in the pecking order. And u know it
I disagree with the belief that Hank only married Peggy for her value. I believe it is the only hope he has for Bobby to ever get married if he saw value in it.
Peggy does come across as just a little too unhinged in this episode.
True, but it’s not like Hank’s helping. Throughout the series, everyone always has to tiptoe around Hank and cater to him, just because of his weird and ignorant social hangups. Mind you, he’s stated in front of Peggy that the only thing women are good for is to be wives, mothers, and homemakers. Yes, Peggy has her moments. She has an ego (I personally like the theory that Peggy’s injuries from the skydiving incident caused her to develop NPD), but let’s not act like Hank hasn’t caused most of the conflicts in the series and probably contributed to Peggy’s deep-seeded insecurities.
@@oh.s I agree. Hank can definitely be a pain in the ass.
"Everyone hated that baby!" Lmao 😂😂😂
New Villain Origin Story Unlocked: Having your Reddit comment read by a smallish-mediumish sized UA-camr about your cartoon opinions and you're mildly irritated by it.
I'm going to give a King Solomon take: Peggy thought Hank was replacing her with Bobby in the bedroom because Hank actually was(though unintentionally and unconsciously) ramping himself up to replacing Peggy in the bedroom with Bobby. That Thanksgiving dinner going off without a hitch would have been the tipping point where Hank would have slipped up and said "I wish you were my wife, Bobby." and it all would have collapsed from there. Bobby is the only innocent one here because he's just trying to pass his class and hang out with his dad.
There, nobody's happy. :D
Honestly Peggy brings this on herself. She's said a few times she doesn't like doing housework or being a stay at home mom and when Bobby who actually enjoy's doing this stuff starts doing better then her minor attempts she gets all huffy. I think they took the episode a bit too far by having Hank and Bobby start bonding over it and even sharing the same bedroom but still if Peggy felt so threatened she should have actually started caring about her role as housekeeper. Like usual though she lets her ego get in the way and does something stupid.
And then some fans wonder why other fans don't like Peggy and find her annoying.
One of the greatest headaches of the series is how strong character motivations will contradict other ones.
Because you are 100% correct! When Kahn's mom comes to town, Peg happily dumps all the housework on her, making the Goodbye Normal Jeans conflict feel especially out-of-place.
This creates a frustrating problem when you try to give everything in series equal weight. You either have to dismiss one aspect as being "poorly written" or twist yourself into knots trying to make it all fit. 🤷♂️
She reaps what she poorly sews 😂
@@Reviewed2Death Yeah even in this episode when Bobby makes Hank new jeans after Peggy ruins them she blames the machine for her poor sewing skills. "It can't make seams this straight".
@@Reviewed2Deathor maybe it’s just the fact that they had multiple writers working on different episodes, and they couldn’t do the bare minimum like actually understanding the characters they’re writing for ( or checking previous episodes before making new ones with contradictions in them) Peggy’s two different moms and her relationships with them is a perfect example here if her attitude towards being a housewife isn’t enough. Or how in this episode she knows how to ride a bike, but seasons later Bobby is trying to teach her to ride a bike because in Montana she apparently only rode a horse.
This is the weirdest episode, I cannot 😂
Edit: I left this comment because I wanted to, not because you told me to. I need you to know that. Although I do love how quiet and peaceful the comment section is right now, let me enjoy it for a spell until the rest of the crew gets here and it turns into nothing but sex jokes and Mario Kart references.
Yeah... that's a no from me. I'm by no means a Peggy hater, but this perspective is disregarding the _actual_ crux of the issue that most people have with this episode. Peggy is insecure, and she's making other people suffer for it. Hank and Bobby have no idea that their actions are making her feel this way, and Peggy, in this particular instance, lacks the cogency to explain why she feels the way she does. Instead, she takes on increasingly silly antics, which don't seem entirely out of the ordinary because her family knows her to be an eccentric. Now, their actions _did_ contribute to this behavior to be sure. Both things can be true.
Also, Hank isn't pitting the two against each other, and I think that's a strange read to have on the situation. At every turn, he's trying in the only ways he understands to "let her down gently," or spare her feelings, or find a silver lining to the clouds. Even pulling the beds apart was only so he could have a comfortable night's sleep, and he did it surrepticiously to avoid making a big deal out of it. Logically, if you can't sleep comfortably and there's a way to fix that without being malicious, then you should do it. If I, as the partner, am contributing to that issue, then I _want_ to fix that because your comfort matters more than my ego.
What Hank values in _a_ wife and what he values in _his_ wife are two very different things (because _a_ wife is an ideal, and Hank appreciates ideals, while _his_ wife is a real person that he loves), which was shown throughout the series and in this very episode. He's very capable of demonstrating this difference, if only his repressed mind is to realize it's necessary or desired at any given time. It took the damn hairdresser to speak up and tell Hank what was going on, because Hank was too oblivious and optimistic to notice, and Peggy was too insecure to properly communicate, and that can't always be the other person's fault. At some point, if you feel a certain way or want a certain thing, and it isn't being given to you, you need to verbalize that instead of stewing in it. If you _choose_ to suffer in silence, you need to live with that choice instead of making _other_ people suffer for it.
Which is a _character flaw_ and not an objectively bad thing about the character or episode. Again, not a Peggy hater and I actually love this episode. I just think that it's better to acknowledge all facets of the interactions we see, and a character doesn't have to be morally correct to be a good character.
Also, I'm really not of fan of people calling an episode "bad" because characters do things they don't like. To each their own, but your opinion of a character's morality or sanity doesn't have bearing on the actual _quality_ of the episode itself. Not saying this to anyone in particular, just my perspective on that trend.
I think a much better episode with a sympathetic Peggy is Pregnant Paws, specifically because we are shown a flashback that explains why she is so angry with Hank trying to get Ladybird pregnant.
Woman was literally jealous of her own son. She flat out told her hairdresser that the other woman was her son. Peggy was unsympathetic this episode.
@@myeeeeehHank has said that he only views marriage as worth something if his spouse (Peggy) was a decent cook, mother and homemaker, in front of said spouse (Peggy). Hank is by far the most problematic character in the show. Everyone always has to tiptoe around him and cater to him.
@oh.s Hank is definitely not the most problematic person on the show. That title belongs to Cotton. Peggy didn’t even want to tell Hank that she was bothered, instead decides to sabotage Bobby multiple times throughout the episode just for bonding with his father.
And that's why Pregnant Paws runs laps around this episode. Because in that Peggy actually talks with Hank about how he makes her feel.
I feel sorry for all the Spanish classes she taught making them learn bad Spanish language
Growing up my dad made sure I learned Home related shit, like cooking and cleaning. He told me , when I was like 10, learn how to do this do you don't have to find a woman to do them for you .
I think if we look back at the episode where she and Hank were trying to have another child (I think it's season 3, funny enough it's the episode the clip from 7:08 comes from) we can see where Peggy is coming from here,
Peggy was jealous of Ladybird because Hank kept trying and doing all these things for Ladybird, and felt like Hank didn't try as much for her and having a baby, and it triggered a level of fear of failure and being not only told "No" but full on stonewalled out of something expected and normal, and when you see her mother, it all makes sense, then of course in this Hank lays it out pretty "Bluntly" even if he himself is deeper and beyond such things, it's just the surface level rationalization he grew up with from Cotton, he "Knows" more than he says but says as he does because it's what he grew up with, "You need a partner to take care of the home duties for you." and that hits Peggy right in the insecurity, again, from how she was raised, she feels like that's all she brings to the table, and so again she feels like the one thing she does (Aside from have children, and as we saw earlier, she can't do that because of Hank's narrow urethra) so in her and Hank's upbringing we see the outdated ideas crashing together in a storm that neither of them truly believe but still fear and hurt over, and the two confront it to find the true meaning, love.
In said previous episode, they find that they love Bobby, and it was through their love that they relaxed and had Bobby. Similarly, in this, Hank and Peggy rediscover that it wasn't utility or convenience or arrangement and fear that brought them together, but love. It's just that the preconceived notions and their own repressed upbringings, fears, etc, took the reigns away from rationality and truth and lead them down a pretty bad path.
With that said though, I'm still not big on the episode even if I know where the writers are coming from and I like the ideas, it goes a bit too fast and ramps up a bit too much and just feels extra irrational and thus not that fun. I think said prior episode did the job better, better pacing, better stakes, and a very real frustration that gets addressed and resolved in a way that didn't go too far.
Finished the vid and we basically had the same thoughts, you even referenced the exact episode and the points.
I do think it does better, but I'm excited to see you talk about that one too.
Honestly, this is one of my favorite episodes because I really see myself in Bobby's position. My mother was also jealous of my relationship with my dad and actively went out of her way to destroy it however she could. I feel a lot of comradarie with Bobby.
Omg that's horrible and sad at the same time.... I'm so sorry you had to go through that...
What nobody seems to point out because they’re so busy vilifying Peggy for her jealousy of Bobby (except for Reviewed) is that Hank’s emotionally repressive nature more often than not causes a lot of conflict. This episode, for example, has him regard marriage as something where a wife does nothing but household duties instead of how much a couple loves each other and wants to be together. And so many times, everyone else is supposed to cater to Hank being emotionally repressed instead of Hank taking the steps to work on being able to express himself better.
Excellent point
I think about what Peggy would be like if they divorced(wishful thinking). This episode was terribly uncomfortable. It made me question their marriage like in the turtle song episode.
Boddy has a good head on his shoulder and it couldve also been a bonding/learning if Peggy's ego wouldn't have got in the way. Hank made no effort to improve his.. emotional ineptitude. "The love"
Side note: growing up in a place with plenty of Hanks but it didnt go as far as them sleeping in seperate rooms of the house and hardly ever shoeing affection. That marriage was certainly an observation for me and one i never wanted. The resentment felt between them. I was a housekeeper while the wife worked and the husband did Hank stuff. At least Hank took out the trash without being asked.
*shudder* PEGUSSY?!?!? OMG!!! *screaming* 😭😭😭
OH GOD WHY?😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱
Skeleton dad has posted once again.
Skeletons rejoice.
Mine is overjoyed.
I would like to repeat this:
BOBBY HILL IS THE ONLY SANE PERSON IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD!
It was hard to tell Peggy reacted from Hank while also remembering how Hank has trouble with communicating his emotions. Peggy's jealousy was something that bothered me in the episode, but I couldn't help but find it funny. 😅 It does help to understand how there is conflict between Peggy's and Hank's communication, especially with how Hank has trouble being emotionally expressive.
Your avatar wearing a Peggy wig was something I didn't know I needed in my life
(On a more serious note it's always fantastic to see analyses like this one that go the extra mile to read between the lines and don't just write a 5-minute comment from face value. Really does the series' writing proper justice.)
i was confused by how we’ve already gotten a video about goodbye normal jeans and now i am even more confused by the “sexually threatened” thing. this is gonna be a very interesting 30ish minutes
"I didn't know peggy had a brother!" - Bill *hank punches bill in the arm*
This episode just seems like the writers shitting on Peggy, which became more and more normal as the series went on, until she is straight up an egomaniac by the end. By season 10 various characters just feel like puppets to tell silly jokes with, and not the same characters we journeyed with during the early seasons.
I just can't see this episode as anything other than Peggy going completely crazy, because the writers lost touch with their characters.
This was season 7, so do you mean season 7 instead of 10?
This video is even funnier than Wendigoon just announcing he is starting up a “talent agency,” despite being a plagiarist that works closely with Internet Historian (fellow plagiarist).
I mean Hank didn’t marry her for her cooking or the way she cleans, he literally has to endure her horrible cooking & always has her back no matter how wrong she is.
Hey, women love men who can take care of themselves; not just that, but who can take care of the house
I want this channel to get so much bigger. Skull face guy deserves it.
For some reason I thought “ya know… the love” was from I remember mono 😂 oh Hank
you know what you convinced me, I can see why Peggy is the way she is because of Hank
I wish we got a flashback with Cotton interacting with his in-laws that would have been sweet
every mother I knew growing up including my own would whine about housework so you'd think Bobby doing it all and for school at that would be great for her. if she kept that musing columnist job it might have been a better stress reliever than John freaking Redcorn.
I just like the idea of Bobby's cooking skills being used again in Blood and Sauce and in the upcoming reboot. He seemed to really thrive once he got the hang of it and now Hank and Peggy can checkout his fusion restaurant.
Peggy is the absolute worst. I'll watch this show then just flat out give up because she is so too much to tolerate.
Most of the conflict with Peggy is because of Hank, though.
@@oh.s nah she's just a straight up walking ego.
Peggy thinking he’d be alone on thanksgiving is a window into her mainstream thinking. It’s meant to be innocent, and her Peggy world can’t comprehend another world, as she’s Peggy-centric. It’s not a critique about the social norms in Texas in the ‘90s. It’s all about Peggy and her cluelessness about others.
“It’s a show of discordance and disharmony, which is typically not the things you want in your marriage bed.”
[Cuts to Bobby and Luanne from THAT episode]
This screenshot should be a meme.
It was an odd episode really. Peggy jealous of Bobby and Hank just feeding the flames by praising Bobby and belittling Peggy. I liked the bonding moment between Hank and Bobby as we see the interests Bobby likes is first criticized and judged by Hank but eventually he warms up to it and dare I say enjoys it.
Pregnant Paws was just a better version of this episode that makes me sympathize with and even praise Peggy (which considering my general and personal annoyance with the character is quite a feat). This episode.......much harder.
She needs to grow up….
I mean, if she was a real person she would need to, but she's a character in a show, so no she really doesn't. It's funnier when she isn't a mentally stable adult.
Funnier sometimes. Annoying other times. Peggy's very hit or miss for me.
I see where you're coming from and agree. Hank's near constant causal sexism and emotional constipation have been the aspects of him I find the most frustrating. He is 100% in the wrong here for putting Peggy in that position and headspace. As much as I do think Peggy is a horrible human being, she does deserve affection and to feel wanted and needed, and given affection in her marriage.
However, while that makes Peggy's actions and downward spiral understandable, it doesn't excuse it. Nor does it not make her look unhinged. This episode definitely makes Peggy look bad, but in all honesty it makes her and Hank both look like a pair of jackasses.
No, if there is an episode I say that shows why Peggy is a deplorable human being it is definitely not this one. It's the one where she deliberately and maliciously sabotages Lucky's education and attempt to get a G.E.D. For me, that just makes her a terrible human being, and it's just inexcusable.
This one while making Peggy look deranged due to how it is written I would say is less a "Peggy is a narcissist" episode and more of a "Peggy and Hank need fucking marriage counseling cause this relationship is not healthy" episode.
You're not getting away with those lyrics you snuck in thee R2D! 😆
What kind of mother get jealous of her own son
A mother who doesn't have much going for her.
This is my one episode where I really hate Peggy because all series long Peggy has been and will continue to complain at Hank for not being able to connect to Bobby and the one episode (I don’t count the propaniacs because I hate that episode) where Hank finally connects with him she hates him for it and worse she sees Bobby as a threat as if Bobby was going to steal Hank from her how gross can she be
I think Peggy should have expressed her feelings with her hairdresser and he could’ve given advice on how to handle it
She does and he did.
I do hope to see more of your king of the hill episode reviews, because this was actually pretty good
23:03 hilarious considering I’m pretty sure American cheese is more plastic than cheese lmao
Some people are REALLY good at pulling off the exaggerated sarcasm schtick without managing to sound annoying… you’re not one of them.
Oof, thanks for the note! I'll work on that.
“Stains outta my draawwwss” I can’t believe you 😂🤦🏽♂️😂
I just finished the whole master list. More UA-camrs should make master lists. Going for a 3rd round! Keep up the good work 💪
“Ruined by that sea nag with the big feet” 😂
You made a point that I've never considered before, talking about how Hank values specific acts of service to the household as a wife. I admit I was on the hate train for Peg-Leg when I watched this years ago, but no...I change my mind now. I get it.
I also get it. But I'm still on the side of "ok but leave Bobby out of your feelings he's just a boy who's finally bonding with his dad and you know how hard that is for him to do with how emotionally stunted Hank is." If it were just between her and Hank, I'd feel for her more. But she waa too wrapped in her own feelings that she kinda takes it out on Bobby and that's where she loses me.
Oh my god thank you! Finally someone who views this episode for what it’s worth. I am a SAHM in my mid thirties with three kids who lives in a conservative state. My heart breaks for Peggy in this episode. Of course she should have treated Bobby better.
Hank wasn’t emotionally mature enough for marriage.
As a life long king of the hill fan. If Hank praises my steak i might take that as more of a compliment than if it came from Gordon Ramsey
Peggy is insane and Hank is an asshole, Bobby is mostly a great kid. Same ol same ol
I still think that Peggy should have talked it out with Hank instead of regardless of intention hurting Bobby in the process of her fight with Hank. I understand her motivations and even feel bad for her to a degree but I still do feel like she took things a bit too far. Not to say she is even the only one who has done this but Peggy does tend to over react to situations far more often than most of the other cast outside of maybe Dale but he's meant to be a joke.
On one hand, that's fair in terms of normal relationships and interactions, yeah, and I'd probably agree based on those. But on the other, are you setting the "too far" bar based on real life, or based on the heightened reality in sitcoms? Because KotH is a sitcom no matter what specific plotline an episode's following, and I think when accounting for that, she's not really acting _too_ ridiculous.
@@Idran I mean, I'm judging her based on a mix of a real life and based on how the show sets things up. Like, I'm imagining if you had this same kind of situation but made it Dale and Nancy instead and you'd see Dale in Peggy's situation and everyone would be telling him to just talk to Nancy but he'd refuse. Even by the show's logic, the fact that she never even tried and got shot down makes it hard to really fully be on her side whereas if she did try to talk things out then I'd be more on her side.
+rubyrose Peggy does tend to get wrapped up in her own feelings.
@@lucasmartinez5703 Which is what I'm saying is wrong here. Her actions against Bobby aren't justifiable when her problem is with Hank and she never even tried to talk to him.
+ruby rose No I agree. Her quarrel was with Hank and her lashing out at Bobby was unfair. Pregnant Paws handled Peggy much better.
This was a weird ep for sure. Glad your back
its really wild that the Simpsons episode Tennis the Menace had Homer fearing Bart overtaking Homer in terms of sexual dominance
13:00 my neurons activated upon hearing the jojo sfx 😂
Only just started watching this video. Though it's ended by the time I've finished so there's that.
But Peggy usually goes on the attack any time she feels threatened or her ego is challenged etcetera. I don't think she felt *sexually* threatened by Bobby, not by any measure, and a case can be made to defend her sensitivity perhaps but ultimately I think that *at best* Peggy is responding extremely inappropriately to a legitimate grievance with Hank in this episode. But likewise after 20 years of marriage she should be well used to Hank by now.
Overall given just *how* insecure, narcissistic, and generally a terrible person Peggy Hill is however: She gets no sympathy from me in this episode. Especially since Hank is pretty open, I doubt he hadn't said similar things much earlier on in their relationship. Either Peggy believes that her 'role' in the marriage and her value as a wife to Hank is measured solely by how good she is at cooking and cleaning, accepted those terms, and married him anyway then proceeded to not be very good at it for twenty years or she understands that it's deeper than that and therefore that Bobby is no threat to her position and went absolutely vicious regardless.
If she'd gone on the attack towards *Hank* and called him out on it, even if she was mean about it or there was some collateral harm to Hank, I'd give her more support. And I'm not at all going to criticise her for going the sex route, or for being frustrated with Hank for rejecting her under those circumstances. Certainly I think she's valid in feeling dismissed and rejected there, even if Hank wasn't interested: Peggy was clearly trying her best and 'deserved' at least some measure of "Yes, I see you, you're beautiful" which Hank has demonstrated himself to be capable of at other points in the show.
I really don't like Peggy, wouldn't have married her, etc, but I do think she had legitimate grievance with Hank, even just for how dismissively he treated her when she came back from the salon. Even absent any other context it's a pretty clear indication that she's trying to impress in that domain.
Really the only innocent person in the episode is Bobby, who's also getting the most flak which is unfortunate.
As an aside for purposes of clarity: I don't think Peggy qualifies as being abusive towards Bobby, really he's one of her few saving graces in that she's usually very loving and supportive towards him in a way that shows a much more flattering side of her, and I even think that her kicking his ass in Bobby Goes Nuts is done more out of genuine care than anything mean-spirited, but this is one of her worst episodes in that respect. Probably her *absolute* worst since the main instance I can think of where she goes really claws out on Bobby outside of it is her jab at him when he's crying over Marie.
When you said pecking order I imagined MR. Popo from DBZ abridged.
Hank should've realized that Peggy was being threatened as a homemaker instead of encouraging Bobby in the shadows.
Hank doesn't like confrontation. He will avoid it if he can
Do you really think Hank’s oblivious ass would notice something like that, especially if it was emotional, if nobody bothered to explain what was wrong to him?
This is a cartoon. People realize that right?
Okay? and you are still watching it.
@@atomic747 lol i unsubbed.
@@Coneyislandwhitefish But what were you expecting from this channel though?
Cartoons are an art form and art is made to be interpreted and discussed about with others.
Yknow this episode pops up in one of the three koth UA-cam compilations that don’t cut halfway through the ep and zoom into a corner every couple seconds and everytime I see it I have a stronger reaction. I was wondering what you were going to say about it and how long I might have to wait to see it, but lo and behold! The spell worked! Gotta say I love the development you built here to slowly help people understand maybe despite their hatred for Queen peg. I’ve always hated episodes where there’s no real resolution, like the one where Hank just sings a song about her and everything’s ok, I miss when he was openly affectionate instead of some sort of stoic shy anime girl feeling like eye contact is an indirect kiss.
What a treat! I had accepted waiting for it but it was brought to me! My dreams and desires are always marching toward me!
Came to say the "Duet" screenshots. Perfect! The best star trek 1 season episode of all series and maybe one of the best of all time... Definitely in my top 3 episodes
Great video! You said everything I wanted to say in defense of Peggy in this situation!
Adults, particularly adults who are raising kids, need to do what's best for those kids, even when it's difficult or painful.
Abuse, including emotional abuse, psychological abuse, and so on, is inexcusable.
Peggy is awful toward Bobby. When she's not coddling him and infantilizing him, she's deliberately triggering his traumas or encouraging him to do the wrong thing (or things which won't serve him well).
Hank is emotionally constipated, but rarely, if ever, deliberately hurts Bobby's feelings or leads him to do things which will harm him.
Both parents need serious psych help, but Peggy is far worse.
Hank: "Bobby, I just want you to know...Connie killed your frog." - 'Bobby Slam'
"Are you going to come quietly, or do I have to carry you out, baby style?" - 'Husky Bobby'
"And Son, if you can't see that...maybe you're the moron." - 'Life in the Fast Lane: Bobby's Saga'
"Bobby can live in the doghouse!" - 'Hank's Choice'
"Bobby, someday I'm going to die. And when that day comes, THEN you can go to cooking school." - 'Life in the Fast Lane: Bobby Slam'
Hank throws Bobby's clothes from the Louisiana adventure out the window, he cuts the practice head in half, makes him smoke, blames Bobby for getting his truck killed by the train, takes him into the woods to play pranks and gaslight him with the Snipe Hunt, and neglects his son in favor of Chip Block.
Feel free to call Peggy out for her bad behavior, but pretending she's the only "abusive" parent and that Hank "rarely, if ever" does bad things to Bobby is hilariously false.
Is this the same episode where Peggy calls her self a super woman and Bobby says "I like Superwoman!"? 😂 For some reason, a former friend of mine got *really* annoyed by this scene, so I would constantly quote it to him to get on his nerves! 😆
Your college composition instructor past was really shining through when you came across "and really in general."
As an adult, i find it almost impossible to tell anybody that i love them. The only people i can easily say it to are my daughter and my nieces/nephews. My brothers have taken it super personal socmany times
1:41 Huh we now know who really blew up Mega-Lo-Mart
Oh man that’s such a deep cut joke I gotta go watch that episode again 😂7:36
23:07 Venture Bros. reference spotted! Please make more Venture Bros. episode reviews sometime! It's one of my favorite shows.
Fuck yeah brother! My most viewed videos are venture bros clips 😭
Man I love this series reviewed 2 death has an awesome sense of humour and his vids make my day ❤😂
Just wanna say I appreciate the Skyrim music in the background music. Very nice touch 🤌
This was a whole bunch of word salad
No it wasn't? You apparently just can't comprehend simple English very well
Dallas? Salad!
@@Reviewed2Death I think it's assumed I meant your take... I was talking about the comment you were responding to...
I pretty much agree with you. The reaction from Peggy is pretty over the top, petty and destructive but the entire thing would never have happened if Hank (or even Bobby) was aware enough to see they were really pushing her buttons playing on insecurities and took steps to fix it.
Hank and Bobby are pretty oblivious. Peggy just refused to communicate and went overboard in cartoon fashion.
Bro always quick to defend Peggy especially when she’s in the wrong. You have a woman like that in your life my guy? It either has to be your mom or your girlfriend. 🤣🤣
Based on your other comments you definitely just have a weird hate boner for Peggy. Guaranteed you had an ex just like her
There's really no other characters that need defending tbh. Everyone else is either cartoonishly vile or so obviously in the right, that they don't really warrant making a video on.
Am I going to defend Nancy for cheating on Dale? Obviously not.
Cotton for making Bobby eat backwash and sit on an ice block?? I'd hope not!
Hank for getting Big Willie Lane kicked out of the neighborhood? Everyone knows that was the correct thing to do.
It's just that Peggy has the greatest degree of nuance, where she can be seen as both vile and correct.
Dale is often villainous but his likability means that he doesn't really need a defense. Bill acts selfishly but the show will punish him for it.
I wish the show had given us more characters like Peg...but maybe we can only handle one. 😵💫
Honestly I just count this video as a win for the Sum 41 bit. Hell yeah
Love the random sum 41 reference
❤
I enjoy you explaining the other POV that nobody asked for.
Ahh one of my favorite episodes unironically lmao!
11:38 THANK YOU this is what I'm thinking the entire l head people talk about this. Hank said in as many words in multiple eps that he's only married to her because she's useful
That one frame of yuji and mahito getting married is cursed
Mr. 2death, you forgot the other reason to get married, monogamous missionary position sex for the purpose of procreation that is not an act of sin.