Garbage in means Garbage out! The truth about most cheap line output (High-Low) converters (LOC's)
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- Опубліковано 15 лют 2022
- Part 2 supplemental video here • The UGLY truth. Cheap ...
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When i say "Most" i really mean MOST. I don't need to test them all to know this. But since i only tested a couple in this video, i really want to test more of them for you guys to prove my point. Visit my Instagram channel and give me a follow. Soon i will post up a few follow up video's and even live stream some more testing here: / meade916
Do you really want to amplify garbage? if not, look for a quality LOC or other means of factory integration. Most of the time LOC's are a cheap and easy way to get some quick beat into your ride. But it don't have to be distorted! You can have easy and clean if you know what you are doing or know someone who does!
Thanks for watching if you did!
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#LOC #Amplifier #Distortion - Авто та транспорт
UPDATE VIDEO 2 here: ua-cam.com/video/6RZlWVblRUg/v-deo.html
When i say "Most" i really mean MOST. I don't need to test them all to know this. But since i only tested a couple in this video, i really want to test more of them for you guys to prove my point. This is not about our favorite "reputable" brands, it is about the cheap stuff everyone insists on using...because they are cheap. Also, even if the brand you choose is clean, do yourself a favor and install it correctly. Buy a scope (or even better a DD-1 distortion detector) and learn how to use it correctly. 99% of the youtube "teachers" should not be teaching. They should be learning. Visit my Instagram channel and give me a follow. Soon i will post up a few follow up video's and even live stream some more testing here: instagram.com/meade916
Damn Steve another great video, appreciate your honesty & knowledge, I’m always learning some thing new here on the channel, keep it up Brother.
I never knew there was a gain on mine I got it from skyhighaudio and the audio coming out is great
Those that know, know. That's for putting out practical information that can help the masses! This is one of the big reason budget systems are always blowing up, budget LOCs.
I used an lc2i pro to hook up an amp
could it be that the LOC is overvolted on the input?
A tiny little LOC like that putting out 10V clean?! That's a damn good product!
I really am thankful to have found your video man. I made a huge research to buy my beginner equipment to change my cards sound system (2015 Honda Civic Si) and after going to several places i found this guy who sold me the idea of him being a pro, winning competions, etc and he was trying to set my gains in my amp by ear using them just as volume (amp that was hooked to a line out converter) and the audio quality i was getting was horrible!! even for me a beginner i could tell the audio quality was worst than my stock audio.
From the beginning told him i wanted my amp hooked directly to my stock head unit that is pre amplified and he sold me the idea that the line out converter (random brand) was the way and at some point he made me doubt my ear (thinking the audio i was getting was trash) but now looking at your video it MAKES TOTAL SENSE! i was getting a crappy DISTORTED AMPLIFIED signal!!!
THANK YOU SO MUCH!
If i dont want to spend the money in a SMD DD1, would an oscilometer work good enough for me to set my gains myself?
You truly know your stuff Steve. Thanks for over a decade of sharing your knowledge and builds.
Great video! I started putting systems in my cars at about 17, thought I knew what I was doing. Didn't really know until mid 30s how little I really knew!😆 Lots of your videos and others I finally learned the way. There's a reason some people blow subs all the time and some people have never blown one! The LC2i is a good one too, I have confirmed that with the DD1 myself, and like yours had to turn it down cause the voltage was a bit too high. Another product I was impressed with lately was the mid level Rockford amps (punch) I got a couple and they have input clip and output clip lights on them for setup. They both matched the DD1 spot on, I was happy to see that. Glad your passion for car audio has lead to so many fantastic products that make it easier to have great results!
Steve, been watching you for at least 17 years brother, took a long time off from the woofers but it’s time to get back into it. Awesome to see how your shop and knowledge had grow over the years. Appreciate you for sharing all the facts behind the scenarios. Best wishes in the future my man.
That's absolutely unreal. The last time I used a line output converter was over 20 years ago the old PAC converters that didn't even require power back then. I thought they were decent but what do I know lol. Thanks for the info
I have used a couple of the cheapO LOCs WAY back in the day and was never really satisfied with the sound. It's only been in the last few years that I understood how they worked and why they sounded so flat. It's good to see a demo of such a simple and overlooked piece of equipment that will quite literally kill the sound of ANYTHING you hook up to it
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picked up a cheap LOC for my V70 mk2 build. I was constantly clipping and it was driving me crazy adjust the amplifier, stereo and eq on my phone trying to get rid of it until I remember that cheap LOC. It was clipping the RCA at 1.8v! Replaced it for a more expensive one, but same story. Finally tossed it out and got an aftermarket HU, problem solved! 5v clean RCA all the way
Steve this was an awesome video and explanation of how an loc works. Also plugging your loc brand was epic. Great quality equipment and it does the job correctly. Much respects and continue success my guy. ✌
My 2018 Honda CRV has a good stock system with the fronts having good mids and highs. So I just installed 2 12" CVRs with a Kicker CXA 800.1 with high or low input rca in. I just tapped to the radios speaker connection out from the radio harness and installled a bass knob in between new rca cables I did and mine bumps good for everything stock except for the amp and sub. Also I like tuning by ear. Úsúally I under gain my amp and during the listening period, I adjust the gain higher when needed and I make sure I can't hear any clipping or distórtion. Love your videos and wow pure dístortion from those converters.
WOW !! Beautiful work here !! Was looking at the specs on one of these LOC's in walmart about 2mths ago, ended up walking away thinking "it's got to be a piece of crap", and now here's Steve reporting on the exact piece of shit i was looking at, lol !
Chuck the oscope on the low level out and see if it is dirty and if it’s square or another wave form putting off the equipment
When I said square I meant chopped
Good one bro. Keep up the great content 👍. I've been here for at least ten yrs.
That was a very interesting lesson Steve. I appreciate your bad ass content! Been watching your shit for years!
Here to support the algorithm and mention 5 Star Car Stereo has a video from 5 years ago on this exact topic and guess what... cheap LOCs sucked back then.
Let me also add. No knock against SMD Tools, I own quite a few of them and rely on them all the time, they are MUST HAVE TOOLS and do everything they claim very well.
This Really explains a LOT I used a high low pass back in 04' to keep my factory radio options but I always blew subs and kept thinking its was the Amp or how the speakers were wire🙆♂️🤦♂️
Hey thanks Steve this is something I can and will use. Thanks for your time bud
Wow, great thing I took mine out when I threw in my new head unit, but still super helpful information that I never knew
"Choosing the right line output converter is the key to your success and your happiness" ~ Dalai Lama---but also Steve.
This makes me wonder about the difference in Hi Input and Low inputs on an Amp that has them, if they are doing the same thing.
Been waiting for this all day !!!!
Man thanks for dropping knowledge people really need to know what they doing if they want to be in car audio
Ended up figuring this out when I worked at best buy and the most common LOC we used was the cheapo $15 ones. I was like "man, I'm getting instant distortion with this, but the source is clean, what gives" but once I used a better one (like the kicker keyloc or audio control lc2i) it was fine. I never recommended the cheap ones ever again, might be fine at first but then it's continuously having people coming back for warrenty work, and neither the customer or the installer want that
Update, now I would like to get a DD-1 more than ever so I can test this on the LOC's I think are good. My cheap multimeter with oscilloscope likely won't detect this distortion hmm
Damn..when Steve is on PUBG, that's his setup? Baller!
Wow... This is great Info, I didn't think that LOCs were this bad... And I quite often said"set by ear"... I now think a tool would reap more info
Damn that HLC-2 gives better output voltage then my AudioControl LC7i. I'm impressed!
Great video! Lots of great information here. I usually use/recommend AudioControl products for LOC, but after seeing your SMD LOC I will definitely be recommending it as well. It is nice and small, and does the job great!
i have my own LOC....and it's a great product.....and even I RECOMMEND the Audiocontrol! I am a die hard AC fan for decades :)
who wants to see the most in depth video about these LOC's that you have seen so far? I'm about to make someone look dumber than he already looks. I have the results back from very thorough AP (Audio Precision) testing. Some of you guys should probably start letting go of that dude's sack before i post it to save some face. lol SMH
Good video and advice. Thx for posting and sharing your knowledge. Have a blessed life!!
Excellent tech tip Steve. Thanks.
Soo many of these on the market that its going to be impossible to test them all. Maybe get some of the most sold ones of amazon/ebay, just to show peoble what not to buy.
Props for still giving us variety in the content in a busy workshop, Even had time to turn the CNC machines off! I don`t mind the buzzing from those, that`s the sound of income ;)
I’m using one from eBay. I can’t say about the details your going in but it was chosen as it has a built in Auto On for my stock stereo (Volvo life) only benefit of Volvo stereo is it doesn’t go loud enough to distort with its built in amp.
Then using the Rockford Fosgate built in clip detector on the amp, it seems pretty loud and clean! Loud enough for my taste at 1440 rms
Thanks i went with a Kicker KeyLOC seems those put out super clean signal and you know i set the gains and crossover with my DD-1 and CC-1.
Hi , whats the clean voltage you getting from your keyloc?
Honestly I've been into car audio for roughly 7 years now and I'm getting to the point where if it doesn't say SMD or it's not something Steve Meade would run in his whip, then I don't want it!
Then you don’t know much about these devices do ya? Customers who don’t know use smd and he doesn’t design these parts he sticks his name on it and markets the things. Who would use a line out converter anyway? Does your deck not have rca outputs? You’ll probably just fry your stock deck using these. You can buy the insides of these for $6 look it up. He puts his name on it and sells to people like you for what now?139.99? Ya this test he’s running is bs to cause the input to his loc is to high. The signal won’t be good it’s just trickery. They do use step downs in these to idiot proof them. Just do some homework.
Sir I also have seen the same thing with ground loop isolators. When I got the dd1 when it came out. I was testing all kinds of things lol. I even tested a old Sony Walkman 🤣.
I used an line output converter in my jeep for a few months. Swapped from a weak amp to a bit stronger amp. Started having issues with the amp not staying on. Checked my power wire and had no issue. Checked ground and it was fine. Sitting there trying to think what could be wrong as I smelt smoke. Shut my truck off immediately but noticed popping coming from my subs and back speakers. Quickly removed my radio and saw smoke coming from the line output converter. Cut it out and popped it apart to see the circuit board was black and still hot. Somehow it shorted or something and caught fire. I no longer trust line output converters after that. I spent the time to hook everything up correctly amd have had zero issue since then
I've been looking at LOC's for a while and haven't been able to settle on one, I think I may just have now! that is not just a great LOC, but it looks great, super powerful AND compact! (and no, I'm not trying to give it free advertising, the video already showed all of what I just said! :) )
I was so excited to see this crazy crazy system first time not having a deck an using those but 8k rms about to have 10k rms
Nothing but truth and knowledge right there!
Finally someone who know how to do it good vid
Not the video we asked for, but the video we needed 😂
Ty very much for this video. I went to a shop an they hook these up an they told me it was my deck. So i bought new deck for them to say i needed new wire. I just gave up. So ty for ur help an tip they give me hope.
Dirty before even 1v on the cheapo 1.... Love the design of yours!
I had the 2 channel version of the blue one. With a DD1 it was always distorted. I threw it out and ran rca cables under the carpet to the back of my suburban. DD1 saved the day!!!
What about testing the LC2 audio control? Compared to yours?
Awesome video man!!
Dang I need to check my Hi-Lo converter. I paid like 9 bucks for it off ebay. Prob a distortion machine.
Those pulleys at first glance - I thought I was looking at my black speed skate LaBata wheels from the early 80's hahahah. White lettering too!
I know it's all about the savings but, some electronics don't have proper shielding and this can cause distortion, in most cases engine noise can be heard from speaker. Takes a lot of fine tuning to make these cheap components work up to sound quality standards. They make great starter components for the enthusiast plus they won't be missed due to cheap price when sold with the car and can give others an enjoyable experience.
Definitely some good shit! Luckily when buddies want their a system installed I always recommend aftermarket head unit capable of producing at least 4v pre outs and definitely none of that bs cca wire regardless if they're running a simple setup or not.
Ive done the same tests on the Scosche LOC with multiple O scopes and even a DD1+ and did not have the same problems shown here. No distortion at all if you know the HU limit. You might not get 2V but you can get a clean signal.
Perfect demo !! ♡♡ AMAZING PRODUCT!!
Wish products like these were around back when I was huge into Car Audio. Now only really into Home Theater and casual 2Ch plus subs.
learned a lot steve, thanks a ton!!!
The lows are hella deep on that outro beat. Damn!!
Excellent video
I've never used them but some of the amplifiers that I own have speaker level inputs. I'm curious if those are any good since they're directly in the amp.
Yep, haven't used one in a long time..moved exclusively to audio control.
great choice!
Most of those conventers is a piece of coil,potentiometer and few capacitors.There will be drop of quality between car stereo and amp.If you do not have new car with fancy LCD head unit just buy new Pioneer, Clarion and hook up via RCA.Otherwise active conventer which is designed to filter out unwanted distortion.
Thanks for video. I think I will get some ocsiloscope or distortion meter for myself.
Ah wonder Wah they gon find wrong this time Mr. Meade
Great products and even better data. 🇻🇮🇻🇮🇻🇮
I had an audiopipe line output converter. It got smoked when I fed a 15 volt, 40hz signal to it. I smelt something burning but I couldn't BELIEVE it was the line output converter. I think that same Audiopipe line output converter blew my little 20watt baby receiver.
Now I use Nippon America, much more reliable.
Garbage in, garbage out
Any other suggestions to do the correct way of 3/4 myth? I honestly cannot invest into SMDs or Osciloscopes for my 150-250$ setup, but I KNOW what clipping might cause to my sub or my speakers. Is there another good "rule of thumb" to finding out the maximum volume before clipping/distortion (for headuits). I currently set my AMPs with the "SQUARE ROOT OF RMS*OHMS" AC Voltage
Great video.
So when setting gains on the amps which is better -5db or 0db test tones? I got the usb test tones from d'amore
Good pro tip very educational
never had a chance to get an SMD sub, are they ever coming back?
Great video
Fantastic!!.ive always wondered.
That's Dope. Thanks for the video smd!
Any idea what kind of quality the speaker level converters built into some amps generally are?
I have an old Rockford I used to use, but blew a MOSFET and haven't fixed it. Replaced it with a cheap Wally world amp years ago.
About to install an older JL Audio amp in a 2007 Colorado with factory headunit.
I need that beat!! That shits 🔥
Dang, I forget what I have in my car but it doesn't sound crappy, but I wonder what it could sound like. This is on my list of things to replace!!!
Great video!!
Test the audiocontrol for us
video 3 coming up
@@meade916 what about the Lc2?
@@meade916 please test the audiocontrol dm 810
Thanks for the info. I suspected as much nothing "less than true line output" from a good head unit can give you quality sound. The junk and distortion coming out of most cheapo factory head units cannot be discretely filtered.
one could also attach scope probes to the output of the LOC's and route them into the scope ch2 to see what they look like visually. interesting comparison, the ~10V output of the dmaore looks nice!
already did. I may upload that "supplemental" video tonight. Peep my community page for a photo of one of them...
@@meade916 awesome! i just saw it on instagram. good to see. appreciate your content/forum since the 4x18" in the civic! :)
im so interested in this, but really struggling to understand what to do when does not have equipment like this to test. is there a work around? or a type of guide. thanks for the information you shared in the video.
@meade916 quick question is there a definitive way to identify the distortion point on a vehicle that has a volume control with no numerical value? Example Mercedes Benz harmon Kardon NTG systems etc when using an LOC to send signals to aftermarket amp(s), just received my DD1+, CC1 and AMM1 very excited!!!
Dang! I'm glad I saw this.
Thanks for doing a video for something so basic.
part two here: ua-cam.com/video/6RZlWVblRUg/v-deo.html
Makes me wonder about PAC brand line converters. I had been running one for years.
I have the blue one. Not going to lie I only bought because I got on clearance about 6 years ago from Walmart for like $3, and it had "a lot of controls."
I saw a video doing the same kind of tests. Audiocontrol and a few other brands put out good voltage and no distortion. Would hooking up a dsp to a cheaper line converter give a good signal. I have a ds18 dsp im going to Lexus screen but it only has rca inputs so I'm going to need a line converter, i already bought a cheaper stinger one but I'm thinking the power from the dsp will give it good voltage/ signal..your thoughts?
I’m gonna use my factory head unit on my f150. Would a Kicker LOC be any good?
Rookie question… If I want to run a sub amp and a separate mids/high amp, would I buy 2 of these? One for each amp?
What is the loudest 5.25 speaker I can use? At the moment, using diamond audio can't go with 6.5 means more work. I have a Lincoln MKT .
So me and my buddy used a SMD DD1 on a cheap truconnex (metra) brand loc and it clipped at the same volume as the Sony stereo we tried. 🤔 So is metras $15 loc just as good as these?
My opinion, the only one useable for a factory radio, that most likely has bass roll off, is one of the Audiocontrol devices with accubass.
Can’t go wrong with audio control 💪🏾
Audio control with that accubass is🔥. I have a 22 venue, great head unit. All set with smd. People really think I’m all aftermarket.😭
If you didn't have it so close to the head unit clipping point would the LOC still distort right away?
Edit: Nevermind just watched part 2. I have lp72 and I feel like it's doing the same thing even being powered. On the oscilloscope it looks pretty clean though but I don't have one of your nifty smds and as you showed it could still be clipping. Maybe I'll have to get one
I noticed when i used those, i have to keep the gains low on the amp for my subs but its okay cause my speakers are powered off the factory amp so i dont need much bass, otherwise it sounds like crap if i set higher, i can't replace my factory radio since its integrated into the cars systems so my options are limited
i bought a dd1 and thanks for your product btw, but i have no signal coming out the rca before the amp. i went back and looked at the specs on my kenwood head unit and its a 2v pre_out. i read the specs on your detector and it says 1.27Vrms so that means i am losing .8V from deck if its putting out a 2v pre-out. so going to go buy a 4v head unit so i am not going back and forth with volume and gains to find the high volume limits in my system. i do have audio and it sounds pretty good but i want to know when distortion comes in still
My brand new kenwood excelon 705 has dirty out at subout. Only .7v subwoofer barely move and sound like crap already. Amp gain all the way down and stereo sub control at 0. Is this a common problem for some headunit? It's rated at 5v out but I need to max volume and turn sub volume max just to get 5v. With every thing max you can only go up to volume 5 out of 35 and distort already
that's crazy thanks to show always learning here whit 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
Im glad I got the Audi Control LC7i
I seen where you done the kicker one. It seems like it done very well. Would you recommend the kicker one or the IC2 one. Kicker is 20 bucks ic2 is 100 which one would you recommend. Going in a car with 2 sundown e 12s just want some good bass only using a rp-1500 on them
Kicker 47Keyloc is incredible, I have it in my car.
Nice explain 👍👍