I'm so sick of the "bury your gay's troupe." It has homophobic undertones and is so overused. Yes, people die, but must the majority of sapphic romance end in tragedy? It's almost as if the writers didn't know how to conclude this story and said "fuck it we'll make the lesbian die for the sake of sad."
Yes, I understand most people like to judge each lesbian death individually and take context into consideration which is important but at the same time, the lesbian character death toll is so out of hand I wish we'd just at least have a BRIEF break from it. We all know people die in real life but 1) most media is fiction and 2) when it's always the lesbian character who dies, it is sending out the message that happy endings are not for us because at our root, we are a tragic creation.
A few days ago I had a conversation with my friend about my extreme annoyance of literally all of the troupes you mentioned. So this video just made my day.
Really interesting to see it all pointed out in one video. I can honestly say I didn’t think about how troublesome this is until you showed that it’s so widespread. Very problematic for sure. Thanks for the eye opening video!
The trope when there is a show where the lead actress has insane chem with another actress that cause fans to go insane, to then have the execs turn gay one of the characters to quiet the masses. Dead to me, supergirl
These tropes are part of what made me subconsciously feel I couldn't live a happy life as a Q woman and that the consequences of being myself could be death. Sounds dramatic but media becomes part of one's conditioning until the fallacies get exposed. Related to this was my fascination as a teen with bi/q writers such as Virginia Woolf, Edna St. Vincent Millay, Daphné Du Maurier, etc. All their biographies seemed to highlight how their sexualities were a source of pain and isolation. I'm sure this was true, given the times in which they lived, but the dearth of happy stories of out and proud women deeply affected me. Thanks for your work - this was what I needed as a teen in the 90s. 🌈🙂
"Imagine Me & You" isn't a token male film because the wife embraces her queerness an der goes LTR with the woman, while the guy and even all the parents are pretty chill. Compare to "Three of Hearts" or "Kissing Jessica Stein" or even "The Kids are Alright" for films with lesbians involved with men.
People are still mad about Tara, before they were mad about Dana! The male gaze is entrenched in Hollywood, whether the women are lesbian or straight. The tropes that make me nuts were and are demonstrated by the L word, old and new, in which lesbians have sex, anywhere , everywhere, with whoever, stranger or not. They do little else but have sex. Who thinks this is a positive image of any human being? The other is the notion that to be lesbian or gay completely defines a person. I personally feel that I am made up of many parts and qualities and being lesbian is only one of them. When predatory lesbians were mentioned, I thought of Alice, with Phyllis? Cybill Shepherd. I thought it was sickening how she seduced Phyllis, and then when Phyllis was trying to figure out this huge change in her life, Alice just dropped her and didn't even have the guts to tell her.
My hated trope is couple gets married, immediately want a child, break up heartbreak . Referring to Q as F and L word. I see commercials for Brat love Judy, just married, now one want a baby.
@@FaiaHalo hahahah I can totally understand your excitement! They're so talented and charismatic I admire the four of them. Even though, wheein is the one who rules my heart! I'm glad to meet you too
So my sister actually pointed this one out, but in a lot of more recent media that portrays a lesbian relationship, it will be an enemies/rivals to lovers trope. And don’t get me wrong I’m a sucker for rivals to lovers, but it also feels like it goes with the whole thing they do in stuff where if there are 2 girls they aren’t allowed to like each other or something
It's the lack of Q women but also altogether the lack, still today, of women in movie production. :/ Sigh. The other reason we can put aside the 'coming out' trope is that we have to keep coming out during the entirety of our life anyway. There always a time when you have to clear things up, rectify someone, etc.. :3
Blue was one of the most harrowing emotional films I’ve ever seen. And I often feel awkward bc I don’t hate it like most sapphics. I actually think there’s a lot there. Buuuuut those scenes are cringey and the film would’ve benefited tremendously from a a diff director. And a better work environment. The performances are still some of the best I’ve ever seen. Sigh
You don't need to feel awkward for liking it, that's your own personal choice and the film is based on the works of an actual Q woman (I have to censor the word because UA-cam doesn't allow it...) but yeah, *those* scenes are by far the worst in the history of lesbian cinema. It also doesn't help that the crew and cast came forward about poor working conditions whilst it was being filmed so, it hasn't aged well at all. That being said, I agree with you about the emotional rawness from the actors, it's been a while since I watched it but they did a fantastic job.
@@SapphicUnderground thanks for your response! I’m excited to see your review of The World To Come, I’m personally a sucker for period romance and also loved ammonite
Not sure its a trope..but I do hate to see big name media add a lesbian side character (or preemptively start with one) so they won't have to address the mad chemistry their female lead has with other women. (Thinking of Buffy, Once Upon a Time, Supergirl, Pitch Perfect, Glee, etc.) Though I can still apreciate how much of a fight it took just to get a visible lesbian in some of these. On a positive note, there are new shows that did see the opportunity and took it. (Warrior Nun, Legend of Korra, Agatha All Along and She Ra)
The last one is annoyingly true im so tired of this kind of tv shows There always should be at least one guy who has chemistry with the lesbian character, if she is a lesbian there is no way she would feel that way about him but it doesn't matter for directors they just dont take women and their desires seriously neither in real life
I met someone in real life who is happily married to a man but still identifies as lesbian. When I asked her why she didn't use a more appropriate label to identify with, she informed me that she had invested 10 years of her life in being a lesbian and was not about to give all that up. For real
@@dragonfox0598 It was game over. I tend to think that there was some economic motivation too. Coz she mentioned something about moving semi off-grid to live on a farm with him. Said she felt secure and stable now. That conversation left me rather troubled
5:36 I love the show Seinfeld, but the way lesbian characters are portrayed in that show actually hurts. The character George had a fiancé who was described as a lesbian in the show, and she had a female partner. But the show had this thing where the characters basically said they were only attracted to women because of trauma, and they just needed to find a man to make them straight. And both of the women in the relationship between end up with two of the main male characters. It definitely wasn’t great lesbian representation.
I’ve been thinking about your episode on tropes. I just watched a Netflix movie “I Care A Lot” with Rosemund Pike. Very good movie and her love relationship with a woman was part of the show it really was just part of the show. Let us know what you think if you watch it. Thank you, I really enjoy your view points.
Those are definitely some tired tropes - unless the movie uses them to bring something new to the table, the writers should probably move on. There may be some place still for subtext though, in films that aren't strictly about orientation - like Suspiria, for example (though it's so obvious that it's basically text). However, what I really want is more "snobby" (Oscar bait?) lesbian films, at the same level as Call Me By Your Name, Brokeback Mountain, etc. Even if some tropes are present, I want cinematography and sound design and *nuance* that brings me to tears, y'know? Portrait of a Lady on Fire definitely did it, Carol did it, even The Handmaiden did some of it (I know the male gaze in it is contentious, but that film has sumptuous visuals and sound). But I want MORE. GIVE ME BIG-BUDGET, HIGH-CONCEPT, WELL-CONSTRUCTED LESBIAN ART THAT MAKES ME YEARN. Edit: Ohp that comment was longer than I thought! My bad :s
Have you seen the film Pariah? It has a lot of those things that you're talking about (not sure how big the budget was but the cinematography and production is beautiful). It's a film that has been largely slept on but in my opinion but it embodies a lot of the same things we love about Portrait of a Lady on Fire.
@@SapphicUnderground omg yeah!!! That's a fantastic recommendation. I did see it, but only once and pre-Trump... so a lifetime ago. Definitely gonna revisit it this weekend 🤘🤘🤘
I'm so sick of the "bury your gay's troupe." It has homophobic undertones and is so overused. Yes, people die, but must the majority of sapphic romance end in tragedy? It's almost as if the writers didn't know how to conclude this story and said "fuck it we'll make the lesbian die for the sake of sad."
Yes, I understand most people like to judge each lesbian death individually and take context into consideration which is important but at the same time, the lesbian character death toll is so out of hand I wish we'd just at least have a BRIEF break from it. We all know people die in real life but 1) most media is fiction and 2) when it's always the lesbian character who dies, it is sending out the message that happy endings are not for us because at our root, we are a tragic creation.
A few days ago I had a conversation with my friend about my extreme annoyance of literally all of the troupes you mentioned. So this video just made my day.
I think for older people those coming out stories, fighting against your sexuality and society, are still important. Jesus I’m not old… mid 40s 😅
Really interesting to see it all pointed out in one video. I can honestly say I didn’t think about how troublesome this is until you showed that it’s so widespread. Very problematic for sure. Thanks for the eye opening video!
The trope when there is a show where the lead actress has insane chem with another actress that cause fans to go insane, to then have the execs turn gay one of the characters to quiet the masses. Dead to me, supergirl
These tropes are part of what made me subconsciously feel I couldn't live a happy life as a Q woman and that the consequences of being myself could be death. Sounds dramatic but media becomes part of one's conditioning until the fallacies get exposed. Related to this was my fascination as a teen with bi/q writers such as Virginia Woolf, Edna St. Vincent Millay, Daphné Du Maurier, etc. All their biographies seemed to highlight how their sexualities were a source of pain and isolation. I'm sure this was true, given the times in which they lived, but the dearth of happy stories of out and proud women deeply affected me. Thanks for your work - this was what I needed as a teen in the 90s. 🌈🙂
Does ANYBODY in this society want ANY woman to be happy with ANYTHING she does???We need REAL feminism back pronto, or we're doomed
"Imagine Me & You" isn't a token male film because the wife embraces her queerness an der goes LTR with the woman, while the guy and even all the parents are pretty chill. Compare to "Three of Hearts" or "Kissing Jessica Stein" or even "The Kids are Alright" for films with lesbians involved with men.
Loving always all your videos. I'm noticing they are getting a little longer. I really enjoy spending more time with your analysis.💙💙
Thank-you :)
People are still mad about Tara, before they were mad about Dana! The male gaze is entrenched in Hollywood, whether the women are lesbian or straight. The tropes that make me nuts were and are demonstrated by the L word, old and new, in which lesbians have sex, anywhere , everywhere, with whoever, stranger or not. They do little else but have sex. Who thinks this is a positive image of any human being? The other is the notion that to be lesbian or gay completely defines a person. I personally feel that I am made up of many parts and qualities and being lesbian is only one of them. When predatory lesbians were mentioned, I thought of Alice, with Phyllis? Cybill Shepherd. I thought it was sickening how she seduced Phyllis, and then when Phyllis was trying to figure out this huge change in her life, Alice just dropped her and didn't even have the guts to tell her.
If the main character is a girl, make sure she’s married by the end. Or dead. Either way. - Mr. Dashwood, Little Women 2019
My hated trope is couple gets married, immediately want a child, break up heartbreak . Referring to Q as F and L word. I see commercials for Brat love Judy, just married, now one want a baby.
Portrait of a Lady on fire…..Female gaze!!🌷🌷
I know all of the bad examples omg just figured out I'm so traumatized
@@FaiaHalo oww thank you. I really appreciate😻 and yes I am o/ how about you?
I also love the cat!
@@SapphicUnderground Thanks a lot! I'm feeling a very proud mommy🥰
@@FaiaHalo hahahah I can totally understand your excitement! They're so talented and charismatic I admire the four of them. Even though, wheein is the one who rules my heart! I'm glad to meet you too
Damn I couldn’t stand Blue and had to turn it off but The Handmaiden was fuckin *chef’s kiss*
So my sister actually pointed this one out, but in a lot of more recent media that portrays a lesbian relationship, it will be an enemies/rivals to lovers trope. And don’t get me wrong I’m a sucker for rivals to lovers, but it also feels like it goes with the whole thing they do in stuff where if there are 2 girls they aren’t allowed to like each other or something
Intelligent comments…thank you
It's the lack of Q women but also altogether the lack, still today, of women in movie production. :/ Sigh. The other reason we can put aside the 'coming out' trope is that we have to keep coming out during the entirety of our life anyway. There always a time when you have to clear things up, rectify someone, etc.. :3
Blue was one of the most harrowing emotional films I’ve ever seen. And I often feel awkward bc I don’t hate it like most sapphics. I actually think there’s a lot there. Buuuuut those scenes are cringey and the film would’ve benefited tremendously from a a diff director. And a better work environment. The performances are still some of the best I’ve ever seen. Sigh
You don't need to feel awkward for liking it, that's your own personal choice and the film is based on the works of an actual Q woman (I have to censor the word because UA-cam doesn't allow it...) but yeah, *those* scenes are by far the worst in the history of lesbian cinema. It also doesn't help that the crew and cast came forward about poor working conditions whilst it was being filmed so, it hasn't aged well at all. That being said, I agree with you about the emotional rawness from the actors, it's been a while since I watched it but they did a fantastic job.
@@SapphicUnderground thanks for your response! I’m excited to see your review of The World To Come, I’m personally a sucker for period romance and also loved ammonite
Agreed, Eliza. I learned a lot from that film!
3:00 I’m still not over Mika and HG, and I never will be, dammit.
Not sure its a trope..but I do hate to see big name media add a lesbian side character (or preemptively start with one) so they won't have to address the mad chemistry their female lead has with other women. (Thinking of Buffy, Once Upon a Time, Supergirl, Pitch Perfect, Glee, etc.) Though I can still apreciate how much of a fight it took just to get a visible lesbian in some of these.
On a positive note, there are new shows that did see the opportunity and took it. (Warrior Nun, Legend of Korra, Agatha All Along and She Ra)
5:09 literally Ciize and Piglet In Waterboyy, it’s about time we give Ciize the gl storyline she deserves
The last one is annoyingly true im so tired of this kind of tv shows
There always should be at least one guy who has chemistry with the lesbian character, if she is a lesbian there is no way she would feel that way about him but it doesn't matter for directors they just dont take women and their desires seriously neither in real life
Excellent , thank you.
I met someone in real life who is happily married to a man but still identifies as lesbian. When I asked her why she didn't use a more appropriate label to identify with, she informed me that she had invested 10 years of her life in being a lesbian and was not about to give all that up. For real
@@ella-louisewhite7938 Yep. True story
Oh well....once she picked a man it was so over
@@dragonfox0598 It was game over. I tend to think that there was some economic motivation too. Coz she mentioned something about moving semi off-grid to live on a farm with him. Said she felt secure and stable now. That conversation left me rather troubled
5:36 I love the show Seinfeld, but the way lesbian characters are portrayed in that show actually hurts. The character George had a fiancé who was described as a lesbian in the show, and she had a female partner. But the show had this thing where the characters basically said they were only attracted to women because of trauma, and they just needed to find a man to make them straight. And both of the women in the relationship between end up with two of the main male characters. It definitely wasn’t great lesbian representation.
I’ve been thinking about your episode on tropes.
I just watched a Netflix movie “I Care A Lot” with Rosemund Pike. Very good movie and her love relationship with a woman was part of the show it really was just part of the show. Let us know what you think if you watch it.
Thank you, I really enjoy your view points.
Yah, I figured they'd kill her off after it turned out she was a lesbian
Somebody's trolling this channel, deleting comments
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Those are definitely some tired tropes - unless the movie uses them to bring something new to the table, the writers should probably move on. There may be some place still for subtext though, in films that aren't strictly about orientation - like Suspiria, for example (though it's so obvious that it's basically text).
However, what I really want is more "snobby" (Oscar bait?) lesbian films, at the same level as Call Me By Your Name, Brokeback Mountain, etc. Even if some tropes are present, I want cinematography and sound design and *nuance* that brings me to tears, y'know? Portrait of a Lady on Fire definitely did it, Carol did it, even The Handmaiden did some of it (I know the male gaze in it is contentious, but that film has sumptuous visuals and sound). But I want MORE. GIVE ME BIG-BUDGET, HIGH-CONCEPT, WELL-CONSTRUCTED LESBIAN ART THAT MAKES ME YEARN.
Edit: Ohp that comment was longer than I thought! My bad :s
Have you seen the film Pariah? It has a lot of those things that you're talking about (not sure how big the budget was but the cinematography and production is beautiful). It's a film that has been largely slept on but in my opinion but it embodies a lot of the same things we love about Portrait of a Lady on Fire.
@@SapphicUnderground omg yeah!!! That's a fantastic recommendation. I did see it, but only once and pre-Trump... so a lifetime ago. Definitely gonna revisit it this weekend 🤘🤘🤘
with your partner? so you have a girlfriend now? :O
Maybe she meant in the past