LMAO YES, they'll design the most outrageous things any human could imagine then someone someone has to build It with the physics of the world, like damn bro.
@@reecerinehart8419 I've studied to be an architect and you'll be actively discouraged and even failed if you "try to be better" well "try to be more practical". You'll constantly be reduing technical drawings and projects because the artsy professor thinks your original design is "boring" they will pester you until you relent and put odd angles and curves into impossible spaces or have the theoretical contractors waste metric tons of 50C or 60C grade portlant cement along with stainless steel structural elements and chemical cement addatives for an ornamental facade that has minecraft physics, and looks as ugly as a badly made rubics cube torn apart by an angry kid.
@@sosig6445 Question, how often does more "antique" building designs get rejected ? Or even presented at all ? Like, like mortice and tenon wood frames, brick arches, vaults, domes, etc, lathe and plaster, adobe, stucco or just anythng that would've been done or possibly common place 80+ years ago ?
In my experience, it is actively discouraged by architecture professors. My team was always trying to present buildings with exactly the methods you describe, and they were considered so "out of style" that we were threatened with failing the course. Please everyone, never hire an architect for anything, it's all marketing. Just learn to do things on your own, get a civil engineer who understands historical buildings and learn to say "No".
Good luck convincing the MBA's to actually hire them. I've made this argument - unsuccessfully - dozens of times. Big corpos just don't get it. Or 99% of them anyway. The few that do are usually crushing their competition.
I have been an PE engineer designer for 30 years and this is spot on. A good engineer has a mental image of making the part with the tools and equipment on hand along with machinable tolerances. They also have a mental image of installing and correct operation. It takes a visual, non linear thinker with some experience on a machine to do good design. From my experience, about 2 out of 10 engineers can do this. The ones that can’t go into management of the people who can. A lot of times a 10 person engineering team will only have two guys/girls that master mind everything.
@@mjcole82sugestion, sell them as a lean manufacturing project. Corporates love the latests industry trend (like lean manufacturing) fun fact. Almost always the "trend" is common sense in an enviroment were that is lacking. Its funny cause when I expained lean manufacturing when is was being introduced in my hospital to my father (ex healthcare manager) he told me, this shit had a diferent name in my times, and it was the exact same thing 😂.
+1. Software Engineer here. Having users of your software involved in the process is fundamental. Likewise for having constant communication with other SE disciplines and parts of the software.
If you're wondering if this is a Half glass full or empty situation, remember that it doesn't matter for an engineer. The glass was made to the wrong specs.
And this is why I love a whiskey glass I got that's perfect for soda. Idk how they made it, but it's the perfect size for longer gaming sessions when I forget it's on my desk.
As a fledgling cnc machinist, I found this extremely entertaining, and I had no idea I needed this type of content on this website. Thanks for making this.
I have a friend that streams some art stuff, and he said those stupid stupid words... "If they just made a *insert here* it would be easier". Immediately pulled up my CAD, sliced my model up, and had a printed prototype in about 6 hours... the shipping from amazon for the parts allows me the day or two to program it....
My dad did CNC. He worked at a company that did government contracts. One of the things he had to make were brass rings. We went to the NASA museum in Huntsville and there was a missile and had brass rings to hold the explosives in place in the head of it. He stood there for a minute then goes "So that's what those rings were for."
yeah that’s because designers typically don’t know what it actually takes to do certain things they think that because it can’t be designed it can just as easily be made, which is where the problem is created. designers need to think in a much more practical way instead of extreme precision in situations where it’s not needed
@@payloadperformance9706then it's a bad designer. I'm a mechanical engineer, but also worked for 8 years in a factory doing almost any standard activities you can think of. But even people around me who didn't know a lot about the machinery. So if someone makes tons of unproducable things, it's just a bad engineer/designer
@@payloadperformance9706 John 3:16-For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life❤️✝️❤
Game development slipped into producing products instead of loving and making games. With corporate ESG ensuring the least talented people get jobs. That's a whole different can of worms but AAA is for sure struggling.
The cupholder doesn't start at the Desing Engineer. It starts in the Design Studio where it is specified to weigh less than a gram, be infinitely stiff, and be able to travel back through time. The Engineer brings it from "literally impossible" to "possible, but difficult" and the fabricator says, "Why are you giving me this incredibly difficult thing?" The fabricator hates the engineer for making his life difficult and the designer hates the engineer for ruining his perfect cupholder.
Are no not a fan of the designers 30 storey upside down pyramid, or a manifold that could be done if we had the budget NASA blew on Atemis and SLS combined for a HVAC unit or Corolla suspension arm? Can be done, should be done, bloody worlds apart.
Look up the dash board cup holder in the Lexus Sc300 for the definition of impossible to possibly but didn't. It's not actually that complex but still a bit wild of a design
For real. If the support feature is still around by the time I get steady income, I'm making a section of my spare cash to just support the creators I love to watch, including Ghost.
I know im really late commenting and that this'll probably never be seen, but I wanted to thank you for essentially single handedly getting me into animation around a year ago! I dont have much to show for it yet but I hope to be able to animate as well as y'all stick fight folks! I hope you're doing alright and thanks again! Good luck man!
I learned all of these problems from an internship at a manufacturing company. The engineers sit high and mighty in their A/C offices while the CNC guys get the weirdest, most impossible instructions on the planet.
...are the machinists not in an air conditioned room too? Because if not, they should quit. It's a lot easier to prove you're a good machinist than fake being a good engineer, they shouldn't have a hard time getting a better job.
@@aluisious Nope, it was a large factory where we built cabinets, doors, shelves, you name it. The CNC milling, edgebanding, and jointer operators had the toughest times with the miscommunication and misunderstanding, with a lot of waste tools that were made for specific jobs and never used again. They showed me drawers of tools for the jointer, some years old that were used once. Anyway, we couldn't have A/C since the factory was so huge.
@@aluisious yeah if my machine shop doesn't have ac I'm going to be suspicious especially if its way above or below 70 degrees as that's the standard to calibrate machinery and measuring tools but for basic repair shops its not as big a deal
I’m a 19 yo machinist and in the little time I’ve been working this type of issue has already happened lots, honestly it’s frustrating. Thanks for this video its amazing, thank you!
That's a really misguided idea of how engineers work, at least from my experience *actually being a design engineer* We go out all the time to do physical work, surveying, measuring, climbing up on top of shit because we can't find a pipe because it wasn't installed according to the drawing and nobody bothered to pass it on. Obviously that's not all engineers, but just my experience. I feel like engineers get shit on more because it's perceived as punching up, while if complaints go the other way it's seen as punching down (which it kinda is). I think there should be a reverse version of this video explaining all the things that are frustrating in the other direction. Like the aforementioned turning up to do a final quality check on the job site only to discover it's been fitted in a completely different way and now you have to redraw the entire thing. Because it seems there is a lot of emphasis on understanding it from the machinists point of view but what about the other way? Like sure, that part with that tiny spigot sticking out looks really fucking stupid, but have you actually seen what it's being used for or fitted to? maybe there is a reason it's not just threaded in. Maybe that surface finish is way too high for the actual purpose, but it's being made that way because it has to comply with a standard in order to be allowed to be used. Maybe that is a really weird size of hole to drill out, but perhaps it has to be that way because there is a really weird connection it's got to fit. If machinists in this case were given more context by designers it would make their job easier and in turn if the people fitting the parts (in this case "man with angle grinder") communicated why they had changed all that pipework around (eg, there's a random pipe that was fitted mid-way through us designing the fitment) instead of giving zero feedback then when we go to survey it will make sense and we can correct for that in the future. TL;DR Communication is everything, instead of assuming one group (engineers, machinists, fitters) are stupid maybe ask why they chose to do it that way. /rant over/
As a teenager majoring in C.N.C operating and part designing this is really accurate,props for going so in depth with engineering and the many annoyances that comes with it
As a design engineer I've seen shit like tap depth=drill depth in a blind hole just months in starting my career and the r&d boys doing the design be like oH iT's cOoL jUsT uSe a sPiRaL fLuTe tAp
As machinist, I can’t tell you how true this is of how designers piss off me and my work colleagues. I’m so happy someone made a video of our untold suffering.
It comes down to respect for other trades/professions. No one tradesperson or engineer knows everything. If you respect and are prepared to ask the expert in their field for advice, you're going to be much better off.
As an engineer, we always have review meetings with fabricators before ever project milestone. Never seen anyone complain about the final designs. It's literally part of the process, but I guess it's in process because my organization is old and they worked out all the kinks a long time ago.
As a software engineer, I can not tell you how true this is: Web Developers without Design Experience VS Designers without any Developer Experience = 🔥
…now you’ve got my conspiracy brain going about why it gets recommended so randomly after so long. Who wants to bet that UA-cam has a “too late, haha, fuck you” clause for content creators where after a certain point, the amount of money that the CC gets for people watching his video DROPS by a lot and UA-cam just gets to keep the lions share? I saw a video a little while ago where a CC said youtube takes 45% plus a little more (The video made $5, he got to keep 2.50) and THIS situation suddenly makes me think, “What if UA-cam has a catch in their contract where if a video is older than a year, then the person who made the video will only get like, 3% of the money made by people watching that video?” Because it would make sense why the algorithm SUDDENLY is throwing out videos at people from channels that haven’t uploaded in awhile; because UA-cam makes more money on them now.
As a mechanical design engineer for 10 years, i approve this video is 100% accurate. Maybe one more point, is to ask the machinist on what’s their available raw material to reduce lead time.
There was a couple things I didn't agree with but they are minor. I have never done a revision to a part when it hadn't been manufactured first or built in any way. In addition to that he said to always use standard radii while that could be true for something like a fillet it wouldn't matter for an exterior corner. I actually thought he was talking about exterior corners until he showed a fillet tool then I realized his picture was a side view and not a top view. Interior corners are something else where we want the corner to be just some amount larger then a standard tool so they can sweep it around and not chatter in the corner. If the radii is standard size they have to undersize the end mill to mill it with a good finish. So the saying always use standard radii isn't true. That's all I got.
@@chillreznov0227 We go through all this engineering and standard core classes in university just to have a dude go online and show us that "somehow" english comp was just not his thing, huh. I am irritated for you bro.
@@chillreznov0227 You can type italics by adding underscores before and after the parts you want italicized. _Example_. The period keeps it from working, but makes it perfect to show what I mean.
I'm not a designer, I'm not a machinist. I assemble. The part where they bolted the glorious part to the wall for a cup holder slayed me. Edit: I'm a machinist now, still dead, but only inside.
Ah, so you're on the team with the dwarf (because _somehow_ , in their infinite wisdom, the designers only left enough space for a child's hand to fix the last piece inside of the assembly)
@@jankington216 I do both assembly and repair work on specific large machines. Both scenarios leave our people hating engineers. The machine being assembled often has various issues. Sometimes there's issues with space for various parts. Sometimes holes are too precise and no longer fit properly due to slight warping from shipping or the combined many tiny imperfections from other assembled parts. I don't understand how something designed for a hose doesn't have enough space to fit the hose. I swear these engineers have special tools they made for their work and didn't think about the assemblers that won't have them or the potential differences in space each site needs.
the art style, the design, the content flow, the pacing, the everything - it's perfect. I'm studying design engineering while also working in a machining shop, and this is how i see it play out all the time. Shit's wild.
As somebody who’s worked as a CNC machinist, I can honestly say well done on explaining why so many machinists get annoyed with engineers/designers… or at least why there is occasional friction. What’s also impressive is it seems like you don’t even have a background in machining but nailed everything. One time the shop I worked at was making a part for the Tesla factory in Fremont, and I was the one who had to deliver the part after it was done. In the drawing it just said “Transducer” at the top, but really it was for a large panel and they asked for tight tolerances. We took the part really serious because, well, it’s Tesla. When I delivered the finished product, which took me forever because driving through Tesla factory was confusing as fuck, I finally found the department that ordered it. The engineers who designed it just placed it on their table with their arms crossed-looking all excited, with me awkwardly standing there. Finally I asked what they were gonna do with it. Well it turns out that it had literally nothing to do with their cars, and they were just gonna use it for their personal speaker box in the garage. Wtf.
they paid for it at the end of the day and if theres extra tolerances not needed they paid for that also. Just consider it the idiot tax and move on with a chuckle
all he's talked about so far is some of the very basic stuff we've learned to keep in mind when designing. is that not normal? if I come up with a design with a bunch of custom sizes I will be scrutinized very closely on why I needed that and prolly not pass
(soon to be) aerospace engineer here, this is engineering 101. The most important things we learned in our engineering class was to not overdo tolerances for basic shit, our teacher had a 3D printer on the rough setting for one project and we had to print and assemble a wing brace retrofit. Most of our class's models didn't fit together the first time because 3D printers always thicken everything a little bit (a 5mm hole might be a 4.5mm hole, a 5mm peg might be 5.5mm peg), so a bunch of people had to file stuff down, but then a few people had the issue of unrealistic thinness where their model would snap in half due to how thin they were. Watching this video in advance probably would have saved most of the class a bunch of time but I'm pretty sure this was meant to be a "learn it the hard way" project to *drill* the point in
First off, buy a 3d printer. It's such a great hobby to do while you go through college. You'll also learn basically all your CAD stuff without even trying. Second, 3d printing has a ton of parameters, and you can drastically change results by tampering with settings. CNC Kitchen does a great job of going in-depth on individual parameters. You can watch those and combine some techniques to build some quite strong and impressive parts. But for things like holes, I almost always drill them (to the final diameter). If there's no requirement to pull parts straight off the printer and into the assembly, use a drill, a tapping set, a woodworking chisel, and some strong glue (epoxy or CA would be my choice). Those tools will allow you to do a ton with 3d printing for tolerances and mechanical fits.
@@SealFredy5 I actually have had the opportunity to get a ton of CAD experience even before graduating high school - I worked with designing CAD files for our robitics team, and we had an aerospace engineering class in our high school which was heavily cad focused
Man... today i found your channel for the first time, watched this video, and instantly fell in love. Little did i know what kind of a rabbit hole i would fall into, your "F you nintendo" video was just a masterpiece
My father was an aerospace engineer in the 1950s & 60s, working on (for example) the TOW Missile Launcher. As a junior engineer, he chose to eat lunch with the machinists rather than the other engineers. He'd bring his designs and get the machinist's feedback. They taught him these same five lessons (pretty much). What amazed him -- he told my brothers and I, years later -- was that none of the other engineers did likewise. He said it was a status problem. Engineers were College-educated, and thought that they were socially superior to trade-school machinists. My dad didn't care about status; he just wanted to design systems that did the job reliably at the lowest cost. Not a social climber, he. Don't be a class-conscious a**hole. Learn from everyone.
lol in my video I said "don't skim in hiring fabricators because they're dirty of the swear, or soaked in coolant" I actually had spilled some coolant on myself as I was editing that, lol
This is being slightly pedantic but your dad was being class conscious by working with the machinists. This is because Marx saw the divide between the working and middle classes as an artificial divide created by the bourgeoisie so that the workers would fight amongst themselves instead of uniting to overthrow the owning class.
@@rykermoorcroft4474 to add to the pedanticism I would say that, given the context, he never actually said don't be class-conscious or even that his dad wasn't class conscious. He specifically said don't be a "class-conscious a**hole" XD
I am a ex-machinist and was moved over to an office together with a engineer some years ago... This video is just so true, the moment the company was moving us together into the same team they just saved a lot of money every day. I showed to him the "real world" and he teached to me how to make technical 3D drawings. Win-win :)
This is my experience too. I work on separate teams than our manufacturers. We send them drafts to get manufacturability feedback, which sometimes works but nothing is as effective as when they come up and you happen to be finishing up a design and just can run through every option and usually converge on some really efficient design changes that are convenient for both parties.
I was fortunate enough to work with a manual machine shop (no CNC) during my first engineering job, and from day 1 every single design would have to get his OK before we made it. It really taught me how to consider manufacturing first and then work in function around that. It's saved me a lot of headache and back-and-forth to work this way, and I use the skills from that job to this day (12 years into my engineering career). CNC can do stuff manual machines can't, obviously, but learning tricks for making things into bricks with holes has made my manufacturing costs way cheaper and usually guarantees I can get the parts quicker and with fewer mistakes.
@@Gecko88 Dude, this is the WORLD WIDE WEB. Not everyone speaks English as a first language. Now if you want to help people learn English Grammar, end it with "I know, English is tricky."
Working as a designer, (13 years experience) I can give 100% approval to that list of bullet points. Sometimes you can't, but if you CAN, follow that friggin' list, that's rock-solid advice.
The lengths I will go in order to respect every bullet point on that list. I have redesigned entire assemblies just for that one part so that it fits those bullet points.
After all this time still one of my favourite videos in UA-cam because it’s so relatable as a design engineer. Also where I work have regular meetings between designers and builders to talk about design ideas and optimal ways of thinking.
I'm a design engineer and work in a machine shop. It has taught me all these things. It helps when you can just go into the back and talk to the machinist and be like "Hey so what size drill bits/taps do we have around this size? That one? cool that's what I'll put in the design." Just makes things go much smoother.
Hence the point about the standard charts. Any shop is going to have most if not all of the nominal sizes on the imperial or metric chart. It's when something very specific that's between sizes with no tolerance room is called for that causes headaches. Sure we can get a tap for 1/4 -23 threads but if your design can accept 1/4-20 we have a drawer full of those and can have the part ready before lunch. Do it the hard way and it's weeks to get the tap and every time your bolt brakes you need custom bolts to make it fit.
It would be way better if you could spend couple months in each position, I'm pretty sure company would have nothing against it. Just talking to machinists does make life easier for everyone, but doesn't do the justice because of how many factors come at play. For example, even a slight difference in material hardness makes a big difference in tool life and overall costs, better designe can drastically decrease production cycle time.
The even scarier combo is when the Machinist and the Designer are the same person, like a designer that's been trained in manufacturing and assembly processes, or a machinist that's been trained in design.
thats just the normal way to teach us in switzerland. designer and machinist go to 4 years of school together and learn both crafts. after that we go both to the same university and make our bachelor and masters. and then see us again in the company 5 years later
ghost gotta be one of my favourite animators on the site, its so unique in the art style and has the fluid movements when it needs it. Whatever this champion puts out in 1-2 years im here for it, even if the content is completely irrelevant to what I would normally enjoy. besides, its nice to know it helps the lad out when you can rewatch the old stuff over and over
As a mechanical engineering student, this is why I'm also taking a machining class as a technical elective. It's very important to not only know HOW to design a part, but also how it's going to be BUILT!
@@VikingRul3s I'm currently working towards a 4 years bachelor's degree in Mechanical Engineering, in Indiana, USA. I may go for my masters afterwards, which is another year.
As an engineer who regularly works with machinists, this is astonishingly accurate. To all you engineers out there, please talk to your fabricators before you release that drawing. That includes, welders, tooling & assembly technicians, and even the painting team if you have one. They will be able to offer very valuable advice to speed things up and keep things inexpensive. You get to go home early. they get to go home early. Bosses are happy. Everyone's happy.
Boss stay`s longer to find more work so you don`t go early too often ^^ But yes you can ask for a lot more money if you let the company make a lot more by preventing as many design iterations as possible.
@@daghanabi in the US: earn an ABET accredited engineering degree. If you want to be a Professional Engineer, you additionally need to pass two certification exams, and work for a number of years under other Professional Engineers.
This is so underrated in every creative engineering field. Downstream workers/customers should make more visits to upstream teams. Could probably save a loot of dollar bills and maybe level up the market fit while at it.
I had no idea I would find something like machining, quality standards, CNCing, tolerances, actually interesting.. Your animations and presentation style through your videos is just amazing. Keep it up man!
Thanks for the donation!! Also this fake comment replying to you is from a bot-- I honestly can't believe I've never seen it before. This is the first time my channel has had bot spam... (comment was deleted)
@@CSGhostAnimation the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming..
I’m at uni for engineering now and there’s a huge emphasis on getting manufacturing experience and being constantly aware that other people are going to have to read and build your designs. Everything we do is based on trying not to have the machine shop guys yell at us lol.
I did landscaping for a big corporation and we had an in house engineer for our repair and maintenance work, one thing I learned very early on was to make friends with him and make sure anything i turned it was clearly documented and prepped to the best of my ability to make repairs as smooth as possible. Somehow, I always got my gear back the fastest out of anyone at the shop. Weird how that works
I'm also in engineering, mechanical, and the sad truth is it's all a giant waste of time. In 5 years AI will be doing the designs and calculations, that's why they're so focused on manufacturing experience now. It's not because of the technologists feelings, if that was the case they would have been making more emphasis to this decades ago. Nope. The truth is engineers are being replaced, just like so many others. AI can design stuff all it wants, but without technologists to operate the systems, AI is useless. *Engineers are just expensive design programs.*
I'm a machinist who is becoming an engineer! It pisses me off working in group projects because of the disconnect and someone has to fix it! Too often the engineers focus on the wrong stuff, and it actually turns out their shooting their own foot haha
I am an engineer, but at the end of my studies I had the fortune of working a lot with a machinist who would make us try to manufacture the shit we drew. Being with him for a year was an invaluable experience
I've always believed that an engineer should have to to spend a certain amount of time on the manufacturing floor to see what's actually happening and how things are being used so they design more effectively.
I worked for a Fortune 500 in the 80's and 90's. My job was to help production take the prototypes and engineered drawings from corporate engineering to the production floor by providing tooling, equipment, jigs and fixtures. More than once I pissed off an "engineer" by telling him his "work of art wasn't practical and we were making these changes in production, revise your drawings."
Yeah one of the things that stuck with me pretty well was, every 0 you add for precision after a decimal, adds at least that many 0's before the decimal on your cost. So say what you mean. Also JUST TALK TO THE MACHINIST. Ask them to give you advice, use the expertise of people who do shit on a daily basis, Why think you know it all when you can leverage someone who actually knows what you need.
I think im actually a hybrid lol. Im studying both CAD and all these machinery. Gotta actually design my own stuff then actually make it myself. Honestly , both of these is a pain 💀. When im in CAD classes , im raging cus there's so many things to press and it actually kinda takes long to design an object (at least that's what I feel as a new student) while when im actually doing hands on cutting. It's just tiring and occasionally stressful cus yeah. Prone to make some calculation errors (afew mm) and yeah , the whole workpiece is kinda like f up 😅
The way it should be done reminded me of when my engineer girlfriend worked with an artist to make some large outdoor sculptures. The artist had no understanding of material strength or wind pressure but was willing to listen. So between the two of them, a beach front sculpture became a reality without going over budget, which is to say out of the artists pocket.
As an engineer that works in aerospace, I vibe with this but in a different way lol. I have to oversee so much crap, and there are some horror stories when our contrators are not closely babysat because they cut corners. Infamously in my field of avionics, Lockheed and Northrup working together on the F-35 did something embarrassingly stupid. These planes are stuffed to the brim with highly sensitive electronics and wiring. They need a special type of insulated, twisted wire to prevent electromagnetic interference between wires and from radio emissions. It's very basic stuff, but do you know what is cheaper? Regular old straight wire, perfectly susceptible to EMI. So during testing, they did what I can only describe as a taking a hyper advanced, 53 uber-gajillion dollar flying supercomputer, and fully wiring it with bargain-bin straight wire. When the adults (paying customers) came back into the room to fly their new 42069 cuckillion dollar death machine, nothing worked. It had to be taken apart and rewired on the contractors' dime, wasted a lot of schedule time, and heavily pissed off the government people overseeing it. This is why we don't let contactors do things without strict oversight lol. People with my job of what is basically "small team of engineers working for paying customer overseeing large team of contracted engineers" have to be very cynical and nitpicky.
Electromagnetic interference [EMC] (and stealth) is the new kid on the block and cuts through everything. The biggest 'problem' is the `mechanoids` who haven't realised that metals are conductive and hence part of EMC design. It's easy to accidentally compromise designs every which way - It's like "what if plastering was part of electrical circuits"
@@prelude12341 you don't work with engineers much do you If you think a single spelling mistake can undermine an engineer's credibility, then boy do I have the Description fields of some ECOs to show you lol
The funnies thing is that by what you say, they could have just fucking grabbed some CAT6 cable (heck maybe 5e?) and even if out of spec, I don't imagine it would make completely ridiculous problems surface, but no let's save some pennies out of the many millions. Sounds like someone at Rolls & Royce looking at the BOM and thinking "hhmmm... We should save money by not clear coating the wood panels!"
I am an applications engineer, now, but started as a machinist. Most everyone I know is in the machining field. Just last night we had this VERY conversation. My solution is simple. Every engineer goes on the shop floor for six months. They will get exposure to the constraints of machining. They will understand the challenges of reading mf print that has 8 datums, with tolerances of .02mm. You made me a subscriber for life. I've also shared this with all of my coworkers. Thanks Sincerely Mr. Freeze
As a machinist this is gold. I've had way too many projects land on my desk without being part of the design process only to have everything you said come true.
As a lead in a machine shop, I had a sign above my desk, featuring a medium looking into a crystal ball, that read "Communicating with Engineers is only a little more difficult than communication with the dead".
As a mechanical engineer, I've dealt with this exact thing. So I'm taking classes I fabricating and machining so I can have a much better understanding of what can be made/made easily
Spend more time on the shop floor and learn to give and take a lot of cussing. I'm talking drunken sailor with 3 ex wives kind of swearing. You will most likely be on the receiving end. Rather than walking around in a daze, look at the tools and ask yourself: "How the Fuck am I going to build this with these tools?" That is after you get back with that left handed screw driver.
Most of this shit should be common sense tbh, if not from an engineering standpoint then from a business standpoint, shouldn't be wasting material makings designs that can't be made, and shouldn't use bits or tapping dies that are only gonna be used once.
Exact same thing I do as an EE. Dad was a lineman so I became a groundman while I studied at school so that I know what really happens on the ground, there’s nothing more that blue collar guys hate more than a pencil pusher that doesn’t know what he’s talking about or hasn’t done it himself
This is amazing. As someone who has worked on both sides of the industry, I absolutely endorse this information. I also laughed my arse off with the leaf thickness; I've been in that exact position, but a good machinist can do absolute miracles, but it's a well known fact that the account of beer of your have to bribe them with is a direct inverse correlation to the material thicknes you want them to work with.
Well depends on that they make having thin ass material and contures on samething well shit better pack same additional beer but just extrem thin starting material is actually pretty easy just make additional tools for the job yeha takes time but saves quite same nerve
Mechanical engineer student here, I really admire all the little details found here that were resonated by my professors. One of them told me a story of how one of her students who went on to work for an aeronautics company submitted a design for a bolt that was going to cost the company millions to make. Apparently she gave them tolerances of .0005mm (Idk how many leading zeroes there were but it was way more than necessary)......for a single bolt I might keep this video on hand for new members of our robotics club because some of them have not the slightest clue on how 3D printing and CNC machining actually works and submit CAD that is damn near impossible to make for what they're asking
yeah got a similar story, not a mech engineer but we had to have mech engineer classes part of our degree. Story of my prof was how someone wanted a form out of sheet metal welded . you could have made the part my just bending average sheet metal and tig welding it but the problem was the designer for some reason wanted so precise welds that you would have to do laser welding and the sheet metal was supposed to be I think 0.01mm thin "because it was mathematically strong enough". The head machinist of the company after reading this basically asked the designer to come down and show him how he would do it cause the head machinist couldnt figure it out... well the designer proceeded to take the drawing and tell them he will come back with something that works XD. Luckily in younger generations most mech engineering training already includes all the 5 mentioned points because the teachers had to learn it the hard way that these teachings are necessary
@@raynaldisugatamawiranata1578 some bacteria yes. There was not much force on the sheet at all yet the solution was still bs and the designers goal was to minimize on weight while increasing surface area but it didnt work for obvious reasons. The problem is that a lot of designers tend to have no practical experience in production so they never question as long as the numbers are right
That's like an order of magnitude more precise than the average machining tools companies can get their hands on Not to mention making a reference to compare it to, which would need to be 10 times as precise for calibrating measurements It would be practically impossible to get an iso 9000 certification for it
I have worked as both a machinist AND engineer (sometimes at the same time...) This is a great list. I would clarify #3 to be sometime like: - "Don't design something near a materials limits unless it's going to be on a spacecraft/aircraft and very microgram counts." - "If the part would be less complex as 2 parts attached together, then it should be 2 parts." (The 2nd one is a bit hard to wrap your head around in theory, but works out in practice)
Navy contracts seem to ignore those points entirely. I hate having to destroy an entire box or circuit board from a limited global supply because a screw or pin broke. The Navy wants damn perfection every time and it's enforced by government contract, so they'll treat shortcuts like treason even if it means months or years of delay and an extra billion dollars from the taxpayer. It's insane
@@bestaround3323 Absolutely. But furthermore it's politicians and brass making stupid decisions without consulting the ones who actually fo the work in order to appease other equally stupid administrators.
@@slutforpotetoes2993 Honestly it goes for the replaceability too. Breaking a stem and replacing a stem (especially if you have a part number) is great. Breaking a stem and replacing the whole damn thing is terrible.
I’m not in the industry, but this was so easy to follow that even I could follow along with it. A comprehensive tutorial all throughout, and a hell of an entertaining one to boot. Well done!
i love the little birds yall gave each other when you were telling us to hire a fabricator. Cause I THINK this was a real life scenario and you added it as an inside joke. love that.
When my favorite animation youtuber posts a video about MY profession (machinist) and nails the explanation of the struggles of my people so thoroughly… all I can do is throw money at you. Genius level intellect sir well done. MILL GO BRRRRRRRRRR
A video on the animation pipeline would be awesome, and pointing out the differences between western and eastern pipelines if there are any. love what you do. Please keep up your awesome work : )
CS Ghost, considering you may not be an engineer or machinist you certainly hit the nail on the head with this video! I have been a Machinist and CNC programmer for the last 15 years and my Father was a Mechanical Engineer. I once had to cut a viewing window on a part that had a +/-.0005" tolerance, the customer only needed this window or slot to see if something was there or not. So yeah I think you just helped save manufacturing, congrats! BTW I also really enjoyed your PC Master Race video as well.
He is definitely a machinist if not an engineer considering his "I spilled some coolant on myself during making of this video as I was moving our EDM machine and f'ed up and spilled some coolant"
@@Flacto-vs6np try to apply soon before AND if possible ask in the interview if you could look at the CAM/CNC department AND the design/engineering department. In my expirience CNC shops are good for a short internship, like 1-2 weeks to get a feeling and understand how the programmers / machinist work (maybe also quality assurance) and a full blown 6 month 35-40h / week internship in a firm you like.
While in school they had us do a two week long summer class about welding. It was pretty much just a way for us to try out the equipment and perform some really bad welds haha. At the end we had a chance to ask the welders some questions and as we were doing engineering I asked "what are some things engineers commonly do that you hate?". Oh man, they had a ton to say about that haha. Eventually the instructors had to tell them to stop as my question had taken up the entire allotted time.
@@sheepsong5681 oh, sadly I don't remember the specifics now. But I do remember the overall theme of the stories I got. Essentially most of the stories revolved around designs that made assembly next to impossible. Welds needing to be done on the inside of closed spaces, welds needing to be done at the seem of two converging walls that only left inches of space, that sort of thing.
Many years ago I designed a crawler track frame. There were some internal welds to the frame. When I pointed that out to the fitter who was tacking it together he was not happy as he had progressed beyond being a “welder”. Then there was the engineering manager. He viewed me as a threat to his position. I had and have no interest in being an engineering manager. Too many anti-personnel departments. I left engineering. Besides SCH E beats W2
I've been a welder for 13-years and this is the main motivation for me now starting to learn designing myself. this "welders eye" is a huge advantage for designing.
@@unibeastbeats Having a practical eye is frequently missing in design engineering. The fact that I had both experience in welding and machining as well as what hardware was available and where to get it was a benefit to the design work I was doing. It is still beneficial for my hobbies.
I work as both a somewhat junior engineer and a novice level fabricator and let me tell you, it's a wild experience. Sometimes (a lot of the time) my senior engineers don't even give coherent designs and are just like... figure it out. This video helps articulate those frustrations.
I was a machinist for about 5 years before I realized I wanted to get into everything behind it. It’s taught me soooo much. What I want to see on a drawing, what I hate, what’s possible, etc. I now have my mechanical engineering degree. At my first internship I learned one thing: if you have the machinist in house and don’t know if something could be made, take it STRAIGHT TO THE MACHINIST to see if it can be made and discuss another way you can make it/ discuss another design that CAN be done. I get people in the office looking for my personal opinion for their prints/ ideas and although I typically have an answer, when I don’t have an answer I say “go to Norm” (our machinist who has over 20 years experience). Working directly with machinists is the best thing any engineer can do. It lowers tension, helps you learn about your company’s capabilities, and gets you out of the cubicle.
I dont know why that is not a mandatory requirement. I got miles ahead of my coworkers simply because I always talked with workers and asked for their advice on how to wield, grind, drill and etc my parts. Their adviced were flawed and had mistakes but gave me overall understanding about what my company can and cant do. While me coworkers doesnt even know those guys names,
Yea like an engineer is going to ASK a lowly machinist what he thinks about the design? I found out years ago some engineers KNOW IT ALL and do not want or need any machinists telling them anything about how to design parts.
@@tailnowag8753King Norm the Machinist sounds like the feudal mecha lord of some hybrid sci-fi fantasy novel. Complete with a big ass chair for his mecha body which in turn is a chair for his organic one.
Go see if the machine shop at your university has any openings for you to help around the shop, or even just shadow some of the machinists. I have a background in ME and ended up falling into becoming a precision machinist at my current job, making metal stamping dies. The lack of hands on, real life, common sense training most engineers are lacking could be resolved with some real world training, plus it's way more fun to actually make the stuff yourself!
Always think about how a part will be manufactured. And always think about how parts will be physically assembled. You don't want to design something that is physically impossible to put together.
@@johnbirkholz994 I’m in a mechanical engineering program at a trade school and we are required to machine shit in the machine shops for classes and for our yearly projects it’s pretty sick
Kinda surprised this hasn't been mentioned yet, but most of the points in this video fall under "design for manufacturability". If you google it you can find some more details and explanations.
was doing the same thing. First project as an undergrad I hit every single one of these stupid issues and it was coming out of tutoring money lol. I decided engineering wasn't for me.
As a mechanical engineering student, I can definitely say that I learned more useful information from a single conversation with a machinist than I did from years of higher education theory. This is legit. One addition I’d have tho is listen to your operators, this includes end users, machinists, assemblers, packagers, maintenance techs, everyone. It’s a Mech Eng job to make their life easier. If they’re complaining abt something then it’s your problem and 9 times out of 10 you can do something abt it
This is really true in any industry - siloing is useful for many reasons, but keeping different departments a complete black box from each other actually damages potential efficiency and LEAN gains. Not knowing what other teams need leads to duplicated efforts, redundency, overdesigning, etc. I was working on a logistics program for our shipping team, and I was all excited about all the things we could do with it, but despite all the effort I put into it, they never used it because they couldn’t find the button to export to Google maps - so hundreds of hours of work and redundant system usage just because i put a button in a place they didn’t see it. It wasn’t until months later that we found out and got things working right.
Study hard go first. That they tell you is valuable, but if you have some kind of lack in your technical understanding. That's not gonna save you. Know your priority.
The sad truth is Mech Eng are going to be completely replaced by the technologists in 5-10 years tops. AI is replacing us and is rapidly becoming more efficient for design. They don't need to pay a team of engineers to do what an AI program can do for less money. Make friends with those "machinists" because chances are they will be engineers longer than us. Source: I am also a Mech Eng student.
I am a CAD/CAM Designer AND Fabricator. This video had me in stitches because I've seen both ends of the spectrum and often have to work with drawings that other people have designed. One of the companies I do work for is only a few doors down from me on the industrial estate ( thank god ). The amount of times I've simply handed them back the drawing and said "No" is staggering, but after 5 years they're finally starting to get it....starting to. Sometimes I'll still get designs from them for tooling they damn well know I don't have, and when you ask them why it turns out there was absolutely ZERO REASON FOR THAT SIZE other than "the designer thought it would work", while disregarding "The Chart". "The Chart" is a godsend, as long as people use it...
@@ClubPenguinMaster88 I swear it’s called AutoCAD Inventor, oh well. But yeah, I had finished five assignments on Inventor that wants me to create a housing bearing for 12” and 6.5”. It sucked when I’m using VDI 🙄 oh btw, I think it was called AutoDesk, I got it mixed up
I applied for a summer job as a tool maker because I thought it would be neat and I didn't want to work at McDonald's. What I didn't realize was how much useful information I was going to learn! Any time I told one of the older workers that I was majoring in engineering, I got valuable advice not far off from what was mentioned in this video! I just hope I will remember it all...
Once you graduate try doing a year in some sort of job-shop manufacturing place. I've spent 3 years as an engineer at a sheet metal fabricator and I think I've absorbed enough manufacturing common sense. I realize now how many headaches I must have given some poor machinist when I did intern work as a designer.
I worked at a company that would regularly have groups of engineer majors and interns come through. The biggest thing I always told them was to listen to your machinists and dont be afraid to ask them production questions. No other engineer will tell you that but a majority of those guys have been with the company for 30+ years and just because you have the degree doesn't mean you know better.
I fully agree. There is a certain level of superiority complex with engineers even interns. When I was interning my favorite people were the guys in the workshop especially the machinist. I even learned and a operated the CNC for a month. It helps massively when designing.
@@Pranav_Bhamidipati They are different skills that doesn't make any sense. Its like saying a F1 driver doesn't deserve to be a driver, because he cannot change tires fast for an F1 car or fix one.
@@PandaMane Yeah, that's just an excuse for bad textbooks and ineffective classroom teaching. If we have to experience everything to understand and learn new things, then, there would be no value in passing down gathered wisdom to the next generations. They would learn through experience anyway.
As a person in the manufacturing space for over a decade.... this is the most hilariously accurate one I have watched in a long time. Also, solid advice. Kudos, sir. Kudos.
I work in automation and I’m on my lunch break watching this. You’re describing everything so perfectly it’s insane I feel like you’re one of my coworkers
I’m studying to become one of these “designers” and just stumbled across this and I gotta say using 3D printers is super awesome but it trains your brain to make crazy cool internal geometry and stuff and so times I have to remind myself that “the drill can’t go in there and then there and in here”😂 great stuff man
I'm glad you've recognized that. As a fellow designer, recognizing the limits of production is insanely important. Sometimes, people oversimplify to the point of wrapping around and overcomplifying the process. The aspect of production that should take THE most effort is the design. There should be zero skimping out on evaluating, reevaluating, and ensuring reasonable design.
And even with 3D printers you can save a lot of time by first deciding what orientation the part should be printed in, and then designing it accordingly.
I had a professor in school who required everyone to CAD from a starting block of stock. Like, you'd extrude a rectangle and then start cutting it down to what you want. It forces you to actually think about the machining process.
@@SaHaRaSquad 3D printing SHOULD require a lot of forethought in design, too! It's vital to know the limits of your printer, and how to optimize according to print time and surface quality.
As someone that did a summer placement doing some design work at a local company, this is 100% what happens. Also if you hear nothing about your design it means that it worked, if someone wants to talk to you about you know you fucked something up lol.
I had a job where my role was effectively to translate between the machinists and the designers. It was waterway engineering rather than a machine shop, but a lot of the principles still apply. Designers would do things like call for materials that don't exist or parts that are functionally impossible to get on site. I remember one project where the design called for several places where a log over 100 feet long should be used. There were not any trees that big on-site and getting someone to deliver a log that size would have been horrendously expensive (let alone maneuvering it to place it in the right spot). We had to kick that back to the designers going "that's not possible". At the same time, the guys on-site implementing the designs were constantly looking for ways to get things done faster and cheaper so they were constantly trying to poke holes in the design for places where the tolerance could be a bit looser. There were so many times the designers let them not follow the design exactly that when they put their foot down on something really needing to be a certain way the guys actually making it would throw a huge fuss. So many times where they would try to do the equivalent of just angle grinding something and I would go "no, that part really needs that tight of a tolerance". A few times, it would be bad enough to make me go "you better hope the state inspector doesn't see you do that".
Im confused how one becomes a designer without the underlying practical machining knowledge. That doesn’t even make sense to me. And on the same thread why wouldn’t machinists be able to make their own designs when they know what is actually possible? It’s really weird to me that this task is split into two people when they are so seemingly intertwined with each other
@@brownie3454 because time is money, and boss won't pay for both time and money they spent on single exclusive person who can do everything. Better split it and make the progress go together
@@brownie3454 1.Because average machinist is dumb as bricks. He knows how to use that drill machine and NOTHING else. He doesnt know how to read schematics properly. Even worse he doesnt want to bother thinking outside of his task. You can go and ask him about best way to drill that thing and what drills we have or need. But in the end that machinist doesnt care about end product. 2. How do you expect designer who spends days covered in specifications, 3d modeling, dealing with consumers and other departments to have time to know everything perfectly? Designer has to know everything knee deep at best. Because he already has to deal with assembly design, how that part is goind to interact with that part, what kind of drivers a we need to order for that machine. All of that has to connect with electrical department, economist has to approve your material list. We need that H12 tolerance for that bearing. Its not designer problem how to do it. You just put that tolerance and request guys to cut it that way. What kind of cutting, which cutters on what speed setting are problems of machinist. 3. Thats why people like me exist. I am meh designer and decent cnc plasma user. I was sent to blue colors to create a bridge between high in the clouds designers and drowning in dirt workers. Technologist and quality assurance personel are responsible for acting as interpreters. You scold designers, chew down info into the bits and feed it to workers. Because after horde cuts, machines and drills all that metal they are going to just drop it. You have to explaing how to assembly it as well.
@@eggl7469 maybe i didnt word my comment accurately. even when split in two, i dont understand how either person gets their position without being able to fill the other position as well. seems like it’s asking for trouble and we end up with complaint videos like this
Can't wait for the next video. I'm sorry to hear about the cancer situation. I honestly thought you quit until some dude in the comments told me about community post. I didn't even know what those where so thanks whoever you are.
There’s an old joke about a mathematician, a physicist, and an engineer being asked to find a volume of a red rubber ball. The mathematician finds the diameter and takes a triple integral. The physicist drops the ball in water and measures the displacement. The engineer looks up the serial number of the ball in his red rubber ball book and sees what it lists the volume as. (In other words, engineers have the ability to look up the specifications of readily available parts, and by golly should they take advantage of it!)
I'm an engineer. I wasn't taught any fancypants maths nor any information that I technically need to know but only once every year or so, just where to look for said information if and when I need it. Physicists hate me. 😂
I wish i could frame a video on my wall lmfao. The animation is so gooood. Im so tired of powerpoint-ass storytime animation stuff, so watching your stuff is so refreshing. Its so expressive, and i really love the contrast between the pixelated animation and the random png's in the video, and of course the humor is not over the top, just perfect amount of informational and funny Really love your videos man!
I like how he talked to a good point of reference like the retiring design engineer and machinist and how he related how annoying that pretty much everybody has to agree on multiple different parts repeating over and over so thanks for the the tips
I just thought about this regarding some German manufacturers like BMW and Mercedes. They boast and are vocal about their engineering solutions necessitating very extreme precision and low tolerance for errors, but this results in extremely high replacement parts cost and higher labor rate, and YET, are relatively UNRELIABLE compared to other PREMIUM brands from SIMILAR PRICE BRACKETS.
My dad's an engineer (designer side of things) and I will occasionally hear little tidbits about the work he does, so its nice to see in more detail what the day to day actually looks like. IIIRC he does more of the assembly side of things and runs a team of designers, so his day gets a lot harder when this design->machinist workflow fails. Most of it is building machinery for food/medicine production so miscommunication about details can prevent a part from being used.
Learned this during my first job in designing products. So much back and forth with the machinists, and eventually the product looked nothing like the original drawing. I was so frustrated with their requested changes. I had no idea before you had to factor in so many variables, not only for when machining the part, but also the production of it. Things like material shrinkage and warp due to thermal differential, cycle time for the part (can literally 4x the cost of a part), etc.. The cool thing is what once you understanding the manufacturing process and requirements, you unlock the ability to make almost anything you want.
Unfortunately people hire brand new engineers out of college and expect them to have a 4 year machinist degree at the same time to save money which leads to mix ups like this.
@@toasty365 That's very true, in a lot of fields too. In my case, the company was well aware I would be learning. Every professional has to start somewhere.
So in France, that's year one.... and you don't need to be the engineer dreaming up the part. Just to take those plans and restrictions on it and pump out the design for the shops. That's a two year program. We understand the jargon of the Engineer, and the jargon of the Machinist. We make sure that the transition happens as smooth as possible instead of making them rage at each other.
@@ForestRaptor I was about to say the same things, I am bewildered this is such a huge issues for many. In France engineering designing, machining, etc degrees all get taught about the other side of things in order to avoid such mistakes. Of course there is much more to learn depending on your field afterwards but at least, you are aware you will need to work together, plan your design, etc. I work an engineering job where I also design, and directly work with machinists. Between someone interested in becoming good, learning more, etc and someone doing it to put meals on a table, the difference is huge in less than a month. But it takes at least 2 years of working experience to get someone independant enough. I urge anyone working in the field to always have "Le Fanchon" nearby, the thing is an Engineer/Machinist/Designer's Bible and holds within all the basics you desesperately need.
Wasn't expecting it, but I really think this could be a super useful learning resource for engineers or even people who are interested in getting into the industry Hope you get commissioned to do more stuff like this, could be super interesting!
Sometimes I felt inferior to my fellow engineering students who got their undergraduate placements at more glamorous engineering firms, while I worked at a fitter machinist workshop. This video gave me a lot of pride in the little machine workshop where I work! I’m also so much more confident around power tools, knowing how a particular part could (or not) be machined, and even painting! All that came from a friend who realised I am an engineering student, who then said I should “learn how to swing a hammer”!
that is HUGE part of the problem, those engineers should be sent to manufacturing departments, not engineering, to get their practice in, to actually see how parts are getting made, what makes them easier or super expensive to make
@@dsfs17987 if your engineering has anything to do with manufacturing you will have to gain some practical experience. But I will never make a drawing/part etc. I`m "only" sorting out principles that might solve a problem and the constraints they need to perform well. As well as some magic with math once the prototypes are finished so they work as expected an only as expected.
@@MrHaggyy Structure optimization? The kind of person I love having as as co-worker, as I'm absolutely trash on the academics side of engineering. Absolutely perfect complimentary type for the building/manufacturing types like me
@@Kalvinjj 😅 I don`t know how many coffees my system admin got from me by now. As I only work with data, algorithms, and simulation I blow up our IT on a regular basis. But i do love our mechanical folks as well. They give me machines I can do my control engineering magic on.
I graduated from university six months ago. Bachelor engineer designer. With the way we were trained, and with this video, I understand that I will really study my specialty only if I find this job. In the meantime, I make money with 3D design. Thank you very much for this video - I saved it and downloaded it :3
This should literally be taught to every mechanical/aeronautical/civil engineering student. Cannot tell you how many times I had machinists laugh in my face and reject prints early on in my career. I actually work on spacecraft now and even then some of this is still applicable.
Here in Germany they started teaching me all this in my Construction Elements class from the second semester onwards. Missing from the video is: Use standard parts wherever possible. That's why my Construction Elements textbook came with a second book just with tables for ISO, DIN and EN parts.
![PC Master Race Explained in 9 minutes [Animated]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/RRY1jrIDhvU/mqdefault.jpg)
![PC Master Race Explained in 9 minutes [Animated]](/img/tr.png)
Dude is like when architects forget that their buildings have to be built.
LMAO YES, they'll design the most outrageous things any human could imagine then someone someone has to build It with the physics of the world, like damn bro.
taking architecture classes ill try to be better
@@reecerinehart8419
I've studied to be an architect and you'll be actively discouraged and even failed if you "try to be better" well "try to be more practical". You'll constantly be reduing technical drawings and projects because the artsy professor thinks your original design is "boring" they will pester you until you relent and put odd angles and curves into impossible spaces or have the theoretical contractors waste metric tons of 50C or 60C grade portlant cement along with stainless steel structural elements and chemical cement addatives for an ornamental facade that has minecraft physics, and looks as ugly as a badly made rubics cube torn apart by an angry kid.
@@sosig6445 Question, how often does more "antique" building designs get rejected ? Or even presented at all ? Like, like mortice and tenon wood frames, brick arches, vaults, domes, etc, lathe and plaster, adobe, stucco or just anythng that would've been done or possibly common place 80+ years ago ?
In my experience, it is actively discouraged by architecture professors. My team was always trying to present buildings with exactly the methods you describe, and they were considered so "out of style" that we were threatened with failing the course.
Please everyone, never hire an architect for anything, it's all marketing. Just learn to do things on your own, get a civil engineer who understands historical buildings and learn to say "No".
the "have someone from another team in your team to make sure your stuff isnt stupid" (point 5) works for almost all professional workspaces
Or countries that has not put all production to cina yet.
Good luck convincing the MBA's to actually hire them. I've made this argument - unsuccessfully - dozens of times. Big corpos just don't get it. Or 99% of them anyway. The few that do are usually crushing their competition.
I have been an PE engineer designer for 30 years and this is spot on. A good engineer has a mental image of making the part with the tools and equipment on hand along with machinable tolerances. They also have a mental image of installing and correct operation. It takes a visual, non linear thinker with some experience on a machine to do good design. From my experience, about 2 out of 10 engineers can do this. The ones that can’t go into management of the people who can. A lot of times a 10 person engineering team will only have two guys/girls that master mind everything.
@@mjcole82sugestion, sell them as a lean manufacturing project. Corporates love the latests industry trend (like lean manufacturing) fun fact. Almost always the "trend" is common sense in an enviroment were that is lacking. Its funny cause when I expained lean manufacturing when is was being introduced in my hospital to my father (ex healthcare manager) he told me, this shit had a diferent name in my times, and it was the exact same thing 😂.
+1.
Software Engineer here. Having users of your software involved in the process is fundamental. Likewise for having constant communication with other SE disciplines and parts of the software.
If you're wondering if this is a Half glass full or empty situation, remember that it doesn't matter for an engineer. The glass was made to the wrong specs.
Optimist: The glass is half full
Pessimist: The glass is half empty
Engineer: The glass is twice as big as it needs to be
@@CSGhostAnimation The glass is currently at 50% rated capacity and holding.
@@stonefish98 Architect says its needs to be 300% more than that
And this is why I love a whiskey glass I got that's perfect for soda. Idk how they made it, but it's the perfect size for longer gaming sessions when I forget it's on my desk.
@@CSGhostAnimationan informatic says: oooh we have 50% more space, it didnt overflow and create a khajidjlion errors
As a fledgling cnc machinist, I found this extremely entertaining, and I had no idea I needed this type of content on this website. Thanks for making this.
one hour ago and already hearted by the creator 🎉 now he better working his ass off on the new upload
machinist and designer is one scary combo, they can literally make anything they want as long as it's in the realm of possibility
I have a friend that streams some art stuff, and he said those stupid stupid words... "If they just made a *insert here* it would be easier". Immediately pulled up my CAD, sliced my model up, and had a printed prototype in about 6 hours... the shipping from amazon for the parts allows me the day or two to program it....
time travel machine
Edit: For those dumbasses that couldn't tell, this was a joke!
@@10054 ... Well... I uhh... shit...
Something something exotic material something something gotta wait for the chemical guys to make that.
@@10054
Something something this breaks causality so it's impossible shid
Blackhole summoning machine.
My dad did CNC. He worked at a company that did government contracts. One of the things he had to make were brass rings. We went to the NASA museum in Huntsville and there was a missile and had brass rings to hold the explosives in place in the head of it. He stood there for a minute then goes "So that's what those rings were for."
LOL
Unintentionally had a hand in making bombs
Think he might have fucked em up?
If you like it, put a ring on it!
Oh boy, I can only imagine his surprise
My sibling is a machinist, and I am a CAD professional, can confirm we are an EXCEEDINGLY dangerous combo
yeah that’s because designers typically don’t know what it actually takes to do certain things they think that because it can’t be designed it can just as easily be made, which is where the problem is created.
designers need to think in a much more practical way instead of extreme precision in situations where it’s not needed
@@payloadperformance9706then it's a bad designer. I'm a mechanical engineer, but also worked for 8 years in a factory doing almost any standard activities you can think of. But even people around me who didn't know a lot about the machinery. So if someone makes tons of unproducable things, it's just a bad engineer/designer
@@lothar654 John 3:16-For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life❤️✝️
@@payloadperformance9706 John 3:16-For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life❤️✝️❤
John 3:16-For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life❤️✝️
Holy shit, I found my new favorite animation channel, but of curse no uploads for two years 😭
Fun fact, game developments do work similar to this. We do really need this to show with our art designers and code engineers, this greatly helps.
Game development slipped into producing products instead of loving and making games. With corporate ESG ensuring the least talented people get jobs. That's a whole different can of worms but AAA is for sure struggling.
@@elimgarak1127 ok but uhh... who asked
@@ALittleBitCheesy *i asked*
@@ALittleBitCheesy Quite a few people. I've given up on anything western produced because of it.
@@duckkingersame
The cupholder doesn't start at the Desing Engineer. It starts in the Design Studio where it is specified to weigh less than a gram, be infinitely stiff, and be able to travel back through time. The Engineer brings it from "literally impossible" to "possible, but difficult" and the fabricator says, "Why are you giving me this incredibly difficult thing?" The fabricator hates the engineer for making his life difficult and the designer hates the engineer for ruining his perfect cupholder.
but everyone hates the environmental qual guy, so they have that to bond over.
Are no not a fan of the designers 30 storey upside down pyramid, or a manifold that could be done if we had the budget NASA blew on Atemis and SLS combined for a HVAC unit or Corolla suspension arm?
Can be done, should be done, bloody worlds apart.
😂😂👍
This should be on a shirt. A really large shirt
Look up the dash board cup holder in the Lexus Sc300 for the definition of impossible to possibly but didn't. It's not actually that complex but still a bit wild of a design
Waiting half a year for an upload is still worth it for this amazing content + he deserves it because UA-cam won’t give him money
vrrrr
Wait... There are smart people in the world!
Thrue
Damn true
For real. If the support feature is still around by the time I get steady income, I'm making a section of my spare cash to just support the creators I love to watch, including Ghost.
I know im really late commenting and that this'll probably never be seen, but I wanted to thank you for essentially single handedly getting me into animation around a year ago! I dont have much to show for it yet but I hope to be able to animate as well as y'all stick fight folks! I hope you're doing alright and thanks again! Good luck man!
I learned all of these problems from an internship at a manufacturing company. The engineers sit high and mighty in their A/C offices while the CNC guys get the weirdest, most impossible instructions on the planet.
...are the machinists not in an air conditioned room too? Because if not, they should quit. It's a lot easier to prove you're a good machinist than fake being a good engineer, they shouldn't have a hard time getting a better job.
@@aluisious Nope, it was a large factory where we built cabinets, doors, shelves, you name it. The CNC milling, edgebanding, and jointer operators had the toughest times with the miscommunication and misunderstanding, with a lot of waste tools that were made for specific jobs and never used again. They showed me drawers of tools for the jointer, some years old that were used once. Anyway, we couldn't have A/C since the factory was so huge.
@@aluisious yeah if my machine shop doesn't have ac I'm going to be suspicious especially if its way above or below 70 degrees as that's the standard to calibrate machinery and measuring tools but for basic repair shops its not as big a deal
I’m a 19 yo machinist and in the little time I’ve been working this type of issue has already happened lots, honestly it’s frustrating. Thanks for this video its amazing, thank you!
That's a really misguided idea of how engineers work, at least from my experience *actually being a design engineer*
We go out all the time to do physical work, surveying, measuring, climbing up on top of shit because we can't find a pipe because it wasn't installed according to the drawing and nobody bothered to pass it on. Obviously that's not all engineers, but just my experience.
I feel like engineers get shit on more because it's perceived as punching up, while if complaints go the other way it's seen as punching down (which it kinda is).
I think there should be a reverse version of this video explaining all the things that are frustrating in the other direction. Like the aforementioned turning up to do a final quality check on the job site only to discover it's been fitted in a completely different way and now you have to redraw the entire thing. Because it seems there is a lot of emphasis on understanding it from the machinists point of view but what about the other way?
Like sure, that part with that tiny spigot sticking out looks really fucking stupid, but have you actually seen what it's being used for or fitted to? maybe there is a reason it's not just threaded in.
Maybe that surface finish is way too high for the actual purpose, but it's being made that way because it has to comply with a standard in order to be allowed to be used.
Maybe that is a really weird size of hole to drill out, but perhaps it has to be that way because there is a really weird connection it's got to fit.
If machinists in this case were given more context by designers it would make their job easier and in turn if the people fitting the parts (in this case "man with angle grinder") communicated why they had changed all that pipework around (eg, there's a random pipe that was fitted mid-way through us designing the fitment) instead of giving zero feedback then when we go to survey it will make sense and we can correct for that in the future.
TL;DR Communication is everything, instead of assuming one group (engineers, machinists, fitters) are stupid maybe ask why they chose to do it that way.
/rant over/
As a teenager majoring in C.N.C operating and part designing this is really accurate,props for going so in depth with engineering and the many annoyances that comes with it
As someone who's not a C.N.C major, i third
As a design engineer I've seen shit like tap depth=drill depth in a blind hole just months in starting my career and the r&d boys doing the design be like oH iT's cOoL jUsT uSe a sPiRaL fLuTe tAp
C.N.C major, I fourth.
As someone whos worked with C.N.C and decided I'm not nearly qualified enough to touch this stuff, I fifth
As someone who only took a year of cnc machining for a certification, i sixth
As machinist, I can’t tell you how true this is of how designers piss off me and my work colleagues. I’m so happy someone made a video of our untold suffering.
It comes down to respect for other trades/professions. No one tradesperson or engineer knows everything. If you respect and are prepared to ask the expert in their field for advice, you're going to be much better off.
As an engineer, we always have review meetings with fabricators before ever project milestone. Never seen anyone complain about the final designs. It's literally part of the process, but I guess it's in process because my organization is old and they worked out all the kinks a long time ago.
my dad got more pissed off at his managers more than the parts he had to make.
Challenge them to a mortal combat
As a software engineer, I can not tell you how true this is:
Web Developers without Design Experience VS Designers without any Developer Experience = 🔥
hope things are going well for you man, still come back to these videos all the time lol.
ah yes my favourite thing, finding new interesting channels that haven’t uploaded in the last year
ghost has been going through some rough shit go easy on him.
@@3SPR1TElaborate please?
@@3SPR1T What happened?
@@basic6735 According to other comments, cancer.
…now you’ve got my conspiracy brain going about why it gets recommended so randomly after so long.
Who wants to bet that UA-cam has a “too late, haha, fuck you” clause for content creators where after a certain point, the amount of money that the CC gets for people watching his video DROPS by a lot and UA-cam just gets to keep the lions share?
I saw a video a little while ago where a CC said youtube takes 45% plus a little more (The video made $5, he got to keep 2.50) and THIS situation suddenly makes me think, “What if UA-cam has a catch in their contract where if a video is older than a year, then the person who made the video will only get like, 3% of the money made by people watching that video?”
Because it would make sense why the algorithm SUDDENLY is throwing out videos at people from channels that haven’t uploaded in awhile; because UA-cam makes more money on them now.
As a mechanical design engineer for 10 years, i approve this video is 100% accurate. Maybe one more point, is to ask the machinist on what’s their available raw material to reduce lead time.
There was a couple things I didn't agree with but they are minor. I have never done a revision to a part when it hadn't been manufactured first or built in any way. In addition to that he said to always use standard radii while that could be true for something like a fillet it wouldn't matter for an exterior corner. I actually thought he was talking about exterior corners until he showed a fillet tool then I realized his picture was a side view and not a top view. Interior corners are something else where we want the corner to be just some amount larger then a standard tool so they can sweep it around and not chatter in the corner. If the radii is standard size they have to undersize the end mill to mill it with a good finish. So the saying always use standard radii isn't true.
That's all I got.
@@jasonmurawski4917 Use standard radius WHERE APPLICABLE. (Caps because cursive doesn't exist on YT comments)
Uggh yeah I got it lol I’m a cnc machinist worked on Nova’s
@@chillreznov0227 We go through all this engineering and standard core classes in university just to have a dude go online and show us that "somehow" english comp was just not his thing, huh. I am irritated for you bro.
@@chillreznov0227 You can type italics by adding underscores before and after the parts you want italicized. _Example_. The period keeps it from working, but makes it perfect to show what I mean.
I'm not a designer, I'm not a machinist. I assemble. The part where they bolted the glorious part to the wall for a cup holder slayed me.
Edit: I'm a machinist now, still dead, but only inside.
I'm a engineer, i still dont like the designer, so arrogant and wont let me speak sh*t
Assemblers aren't exactly in the fray, it's the people who have to take assemblies apart for repair that hate engineers
@@jankington216 there is a field of design theory called “design for maintenancel
Ah, so you're on the team with the dwarf (because _somehow_ , in their infinite wisdom, the designers only left enough space for a child's hand to fix the last piece inside of the assembly)
@@jankington216 I do both assembly and repair work on specific large machines. Both scenarios leave our people hating engineers. The machine being assembled often has various issues. Sometimes there's issues with space for various parts. Sometimes holes are too precise and no longer fit properly due to slight warping from shipping or the combined many tiny imperfections from other assembled parts. I don't understand how something designed for a hose doesn't have enough space to fit the hose. I swear these engineers have special tools they made for their work and didn't think about the assemblers that won't have them or the potential differences in space each site needs.
Happy 2 year anniversary of this amazing video
the art style, the design, the content flow, the pacing, the everything - it's perfect.
I'm studying design engineering while also working in a machining shop, and this is how i see it play out all the time. Shit's wild.
Are the air horns at the end perfect?
Yes
Yupp , studied engineering and am a maschinist, to be fair that is the thing they drilled while studing, tolerances as course as possible.
duck
Im currently studying mechanical engineering, any more tips before i look for somewhere to intern for my final year?
As somebody who’s worked as a CNC machinist, I can honestly say well done on explaining why so many machinists get annoyed with engineers/designers… or at least why there is occasional friction. What’s also impressive is it seems like you don’t even have a background in machining but nailed everything.
One time the shop I worked at was making a part for the Tesla factory in Fremont, and I was the one who had to deliver the part after it was done. In the drawing it just said “Transducer” at the top, but really it was for a large panel and they asked for tight tolerances. We took the part really serious because, well, it’s Tesla. When I delivered the finished product, which took me forever because driving through Tesla factory was confusing as fuck, I finally found the department that ordered it. The engineers who designed it just placed it on their table with their arms crossed-looking all excited, with me awkwardly standing there. Finally I asked what they were gonna do with it. Well it turns out that it had literally nothing to do with their cars, and they were just gonna use it for their personal speaker box in the garage. Wtf.
they paid for it at the end of the day and if theres extra tolerances not needed they paid for that also. Just consider it the idiot tax and move on with a chuckle
@@Redd_Nebula true 😂
all he's talked about so far is some of the very basic stuff we've learned to keep in mind when designing. is that not normal? if I come up with a design with a bunch of custom sizes I will be scrutinized very closely on why I needed that and prolly not pass
@@Redd_Nebula It's a virtue to do the job right, even if you could make more money being crooked
@@group555_ real life is messy.
(soon to be) aerospace engineer here, this is engineering 101. The most important things we learned in our engineering class was to not overdo tolerances for basic shit, our teacher had a 3D printer on the rough setting for one project and we had to print and assemble a wing brace retrofit. Most of our class's models didn't fit together the first time because 3D printers always thicken everything a little bit (a 5mm hole might be a 4.5mm hole, a 5mm peg might be 5.5mm peg), so a bunch of people had to file stuff down, but then a few people had the issue of unrealistic thinness where their model would snap in half due to how thin they were. Watching this video in advance probably would have saved most of the class a bunch of time but I'm pretty sure this was meant to be a "learn it the hard way" project to *drill* the point in
Horizontal expansion should have been corrected in the slicer settings, rather than the model.
First off, buy a 3d printer. It's such a great hobby to do while you go through college. You'll also learn basically all your CAD stuff without even trying.
Second, 3d printing has a ton of parameters, and you can drastically change results by tampering with settings. CNC Kitchen does a great job of going in-depth on individual parameters. You can watch those and combine some techniques to build some quite strong and impressive parts. But for things like holes, I almost always drill them (to the final diameter). If there's no requirement to pull parts straight off the printer and into the assembly, use a drill, a tapping set, a woodworking chisel, and some strong glue (epoxy or CA would be my choice). Those tools will allow you to do a ton with 3d printing for tolerances and mechanical fits.
@@SealFredy5 I actually have had the opportunity to get a ton of CAD experience even before graduating high school - I worked with designing CAD files for our robitics team, and we had an aerospace engineering class in our high school which was heavily cad focused
And I was told almost exact opposite as my teachers required to describe everything what doe not really needs to be described
So you fkrs do learn that sht yet you f clowns still do it jesus fk man
Man... today i found your channel for the first time, watched this video, and instantly fell in love. Little did i know what kind of a rabbit hole i would fall into, your "F you nintendo" video was just a masterpiece
My father was an aerospace engineer in the 1950s & 60s, working on (for example) the TOW Missile Launcher. As a junior engineer, he chose to eat lunch with the machinists rather than the other engineers. He'd bring his designs and get the machinist's feedback. They taught him these same five lessons (pretty much).
What amazed him -- he told my brothers and I, years later -- was that none of the other engineers did likewise. He said it was a status problem. Engineers were College-educated, and thought that they were socially superior to trade-school machinists. My dad didn't care about status; he just wanted to design systems that did the job reliably at the lowest cost. Not a social climber, he.
Don't be a class-conscious a**hole. Learn from everyone.
lol
in my video I said "don't skim in hiring fabricators because they're dirty of the swear, or soaked in coolant"
I actually had spilled some coolant on myself as I was editing that, lol
This is being slightly pedantic but your dad was being class conscious by working with the machinists. This is because Marx saw the divide between the working and middle classes as an artificial divide created by the bourgeoisie so that the workers would fight amongst themselves instead of uniting to overthrow the owning class.
@@rykermoorcroft4474 to add to the pedanticism I would say that, given the context, he never actually said don't be class-conscious or even that his dad wasn't class conscious. He specifically said don't be a "class-conscious a**hole" XD
Dude I’m an engineer and it’s actually the machinists that are the smart ones 100%
@@CSGhostAnimationghost why do you have coolant while recording
As a former machinist who became a design engineer, you’re doing God’s work.
The boss way for "fine I'll do it myself"
What is exactly a design engineer? I am starting university next year and I really want to work for something like that
@@lu011 mechanical engineering would be the designer’s specialty in this case
@@gentlejello thank you
@@lu011 it's the guys who actually design the stuff, the other ones build it
I am a ex-machinist and was moved over to an office together with a engineer some years ago... This video is just so true, the moment the company was moving us together into the same team they just saved a lot of money every day. I showed to him the "real world" and he teached to me how to make technical 3D drawings. Win-win :)
This is my experience too. I work on separate teams than our manufacturers. We send them drafts to get manufacturability feedback, which sometimes works but nothing is as effective as when they come up and you happen to be finishing up a design and just can run through every option and usually converge on some really efficient design changes that are convenient for both parties.
I was fortunate enough to work with a manual machine shop (no CNC) during my first engineering job, and from day 1 every single design would have to get his OK before we made it. It really taught me how to consider manufacturing first and then work in function around that. It's saved me a lot of headache and back-and-forth to work this way, and I use the skills from that job to this day (12 years into my engineering career). CNC can do stuff manual machines can't, obviously, but learning tricks for making things into bricks with holes has made my manufacturing costs way cheaper and usually guarantees I can get the parts quicker and with fewer mistakes.
@@Gecko88 thank you, everyone is now smarter and more enlightened by your pretentious correction of a UA-cam comment.
@@Gecko88 Dude, this is the WORLD WIDE WEB. Not everyone speaks English as a first language. Now if you want to help people learn English Grammar, end it with "I know, English is tricky."
Technical drawings are 2D not 3D ;) -Designer
"I hate engineers to, they always making a nest in the most inconvenient places"
- some guy who got this in their feed because they play TF2
Hope youre doing well, maybe even making the next video. Looking forward to it for sure.
Bro, what?
uhh
Came back to watch it again ❤
@@Bretaxyread the community post
@@Sacraficed ?
Working as a designer, (13 years experience) I can give 100% approval to that list of bullet points. Sometimes you can't, but if you CAN, follow that friggin' list, that's rock-solid advice.
The lengths I will go in order to respect every bullet point on that list.
I have redesigned entire assemblies just for that one part so that it fits those bullet points.
As a machinist, absolutely yes.
Engineer Gaming.
Medic gaming.
Scout Gaming.
Engineer Gaming.
Engineer gaming
Engineer gaming
After all this time still one of my favourite videos in UA-cam because it’s so relatable as a design engineer. Also where I work have regular meetings between designers and builders to talk about design ideas and optimal ways of thinking.
I'm a design engineer and work in a machine shop. It has taught me all these things. It helps when you can just go into the back and talk to the machinist and be like "Hey so what size drill bits/taps do we have around this size? That one? cool that's what I'll put in the design." Just makes things go much smoother.
Hence the point about the standard charts. Any shop is going to have most if not all of the nominal sizes on the imperial or metric chart. It's when something very specific that's between sizes with no tolerance room is called for that causes headaches. Sure we can get a tap for 1/4 -23 threads but if your design can accept 1/4-20 we have a drawer full of those and can have the part ready before lunch. Do it the hard way and it's weeks to get the tap and every time your bolt brakes you need custom bolts to make it fit.
It would be way better if you could spend couple months in each position, I'm pretty sure company would have nothing against it. Just talking to machinists does make life easier for everyone, but doesn't do the justice because of how many factors come at play. For example, even a slight difference in material hardness makes a big difference in tool life and overall costs, better designe can drastically decrease production cycle time.
The even scarier combo is when the Machinist and the Designer are the same person, like a designer that's been trained in manufacturing and assembly processes, or a machinist that's been trained in design.
This is a closer approximation to the differences I saw when changing from mechanical engineering to mechanical engineering technology.
thats just the normal way to teach us in switzerland. designer and machinist go to 4 years of school together and learn both crafts. after that we go both to the same university and make our bachelor and masters. and then see us again in the company 5 years later
There's a term for this person: toolmaker
@@PauperFatCat there are more than just the toolmakers that do this
being a former engineering student gone welder/fabricator, yes
I have literally never been interested in milling and somehow this man just made it fun to learn about it
Exactly. Suddenly I want to be a machinist.
ghost gotta be one of my favourite animators on the site, its so unique in the art style and has the fluid movements when it needs it. Whatever this champion puts out in 1-2 years im here for it, even if the content is completely irrelevant to what I would normally enjoy. besides, its nice to know it helps the lad out when you can rewatch the old stuff over and over
The fact that this guy can make a random topic i didn't know I wanted to know super fun is impressive.
The beauties of *delivery* and *execution*
As a mechanical engineering student, this is why I'm also taking a machining class as a technical elective. It's very important to not only know HOW to design a part, but also how it's going to be BUILT!
It will definitely make you a better engineer. Working with design engineers and planners made me a better machinist.
Hmm, that comment lead me to a question I've always had: Are you from USA and if so, how long is your education?
@@VikingRul3s I'm currently working towards a 4 years bachelor's degree in Mechanical Engineering, in Indiana, USA. I may go for my masters afterwards, which is another year.
@@markmcculfor6113 I see, well then it's very similar to Denmark. Thank you for replying :)
I tried taking machining as an elective in college and was told it was beneath me. I wish I stuck to my guns and took the class anyway.
As an engineer who regularly works with machinists, this is astonishingly accurate. To all you engineers out there, please talk to your fabricators before you release that drawing. That includes, welders, tooling & assembly technicians, and even the painting team if you have one. They will be able to offer very valuable advice to speed things up and keep things inexpensive. You get to go home early. they get to go home early. Bosses are happy. Everyone's happy.
Boss stay`s longer to find more work so you don`t go early too often ^^ But yes you can ask for a lot more money if you let the company make a lot more by preventing as many design iterations as possible.
@@MrHaggyy Yeah, usually you should be able to find something else that needs doing.
How do you become an engineer?
@@daghanabi in the US: earn an ABET accredited engineering degree. If you want to be a Professional Engineer, you additionally need to pass two certification exams, and work for a number of years under other Professional Engineers.
This is so underrated in every creative engineering field. Downstream workers/customers should make more visits to upstream teams. Could probably save a loot of dollar bills and maybe level up the market fit while at it.
I think the best thing I learned from this video was when I - READ THE DESCRIPTION (suprise) - and looked up what Inconel is :D
Bro you're such an underrated UA-camr, you don't ask for a lot but yet, you deliver high quality shit, good job man
why are you purple
@@MsZsc he donated money with his comment (like a boss)
W moment
@@MsZsc How old are you my boy?
@@MsZsc he ate too much paint :(
I had no idea I would find something like machining, quality standards, CNCing, tolerances, actually interesting.. Your animations and presentation style through your videos is just amazing. Keep it up man!
Thanks for the donation!!
Also this fake comment replying to you is from a bot-- I honestly can't believe I've never seen it before. This is the first time my channel has had bot spam...
(comment was deleted)
@@CSGhostAnimation the plague is spreading
+++
@@CSGhostAnimationwhen did you get the thumbnail made? Like on what day exactly?
@@CSGhostAnimation the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming.. the fog is coming..
I’m at uni for engineering now and there’s a huge emphasis on getting manufacturing experience and being constantly aware that other people are going to have to read and build your designs. Everything we do is based on trying not to have the machine shop guys yell at us lol.
I did landscaping for a big corporation and we had an in house engineer for our repair and maintenance work, one thing I learned very early on was to make friends with him and make sure anything i turned it was clearly documented and prepped to the best of my ability to make repairs as smooth as possible. Somehow, I always got my gear back the fastest out of anyone at the shop. Weird how that works
@@kingsly3690 Screw innovation let me copy paste a part from an old volvo and put it in this structurally integral area of this spacecraft
@@kingsly3690 for power transmission systems we mostly “copy”
@@snakedeadly Design me a transmission, don't use any system that's been used before.
I'm also in engineering, mechanical, and the sad truth is it's all a giant waste of time. In 5 years AI will be doing the designs and calculations, that's why they're so focused on manufacturing experience now. It's not because of the technologists feelings, if that was the case they would have been making more emphasis to this decades ago. Nope. The truth is engineers are being replaced, just like so many others. AI can design stuff all it wants, but without technologists to operate the systems, AI is useless. *Engineers are just expensive design programs.*
I'm a machinist who is becoming an engineer! It pisses me off working in group projects because of the disconnect and someone has to fix it! Too often the engineers focus on the wrong stuff, and it actually turns out their shooting their own foot haha
I am an engineer, but at the end of my studies I had the fortune of working a lot with a machinist who would make us try to manufacture the shit we drew. Being with him for a year was an invaluable experience
As a Engineering Technician in the Electronics industry l agree.
I've always believed that an engineer should have to to spend a certain amount of time on the manufacturing floor to see what's actually happening and how things are being used so they design more effectively.
I worked for a Fortune 500 in the 80's and 90's. My job was to help production take the prototypes and engineered drawings from corporate engineering to the production floor by providing tooling, equipment, jigs and fixtures. More than once I pissed off an "engineer" by telling him his "work of art wasn't practical and we were making these changes in production, revise your drawings."
Yeah one of the things that stuck with me pretty well was, every 0 you add for precision after a decimal, adds at least that many 0's before the decimal on your cost. So say what you mean. Also JUST TALK TO THE MACHINIST. Ask them to give you advice, use the expertise of people who do shit on a daily basis, Why think you know it all when you can leverage someone who actually knows what you need.
As someone who has been both a CAD designer and a machinist, I can tell you this video is exactly what a lot of people in the industry need to see.
I thought every engineer learns, to use the lowest accuracy possible for the design 😂
@@TechnoGlobalist it might be true for US engineers
"CAD designer"
lol
@@bootleg8720 Until a better title sticks, that's what most jobs still call it. It's like saying ATM machine.
I think im actually a hybrid lol. Im studying both CAD and all these machinery. Gotta actually design my own stuff then actually make it myself. Honestly , both of these is a pain 💀. When im in CAD classes , im raging cus there's so many things to press and it actually kinda takes long to design an object (at least that's what I feel as a new student) while when im actually doing hands on cutting. It's just tiring and occasionally stressful cus yeah. Prone to make some calculation errors (afew mm) and yeah , the whole workpiece is kinda like f up 😅
The way it should be done reminded me of when my engineer girlfriend worked with an artist to make some large outdoor sculptures. The artist had no understanding of material strength or wind pressure but was willing to listen. So between the two of them, a beach front sculpture became a reality without going over budget, which is to say out of the artists pocket.
What material was the sculpture made from?
@@mahmerkhan1287 titanium xD
Good ending! Yay!
your profile picture is wild my guy, is that your girlfriend ???
Holy fuck, i just found your channel and this shit is amazing, hope your alive, can't wait for the next video
Who here started off knowing nothing about CNC milling, but now can give some advice to a multi billion dollar business?
As a mechanical engineer in design engineering, this vid was a pleasant surprise
i still know nothing about cnc milling
i know alot about cnc's but i didnt know the stuff gets recycled but i still doubt they get recycled cause most companys are cheapskates
Me
@InitialKettle The character "Imposter" from the hit indie game "Among us"
As an engineer that works in aerospace, I vibe with this but in a different way lol. I have to oversee so much crap, and there are some horror stories when our contrators are not closely babysat because they cut corners.
Infamously in my field of avionics, Lockheed and Northrup working together on the F-35 did something embarrassingly stupid. These planes are stuffed to the brim with highly sensitive electronics and wiring. They need a special type of insulated, twisted wire to prevent electromagnetic interference between wires and from radio emissions. It's very basic stuff, but do you know what is cheaper? Regular old straight wire, perfectly susceptible to EMI. So during testing, they did what I can only describe as a taking a hyper advanced, 53 uber-gajillion dollar flying supercomputer, and fully wiring it with bargain-bin straight wire. When the adults (paying customers) came back into the room to fly their new 42069 cuckillion dollar death machine, nothing worked. It had to be taken apart and rewired on the contractors' dime, wasted a lot of schedule time, and heavily pissed off the government people overseeing it.
This is why we don't let contactors do things without strict oversight lol. People with my job of what is basically "small team of engineers working for paying customer overseeing large team of contracted engineers" have to be very cynical and nitpicky.
Electromagnetic interference [EMC] (and stealth) is the new kid on the block and cuts through everything. The biggest 'problem' is the `mechanoids` who haven't realised that metals are conductive and hence part of EMC design. It's easy to accidentally compromise designs every which way - It's like "what if plastering was part of electrical circuits"
You lost all credibility when you spelled Northrop wrong...
@@prelude12341 you don't work with engineers much do you
If you think a single spelling mistake can undermine an engineer's credibility, then boy do I have the Description fields of some ECOs to show you lol
@@brandonthesteele I'll have you know I'm top of my departmint at spelling.
The funnies thing is that by what you say, they could have just fucking grabbed some CAT6 cable (heck maybe 5e?) and even if out of spec, I don't imagine it would make completely ridiculous problems surface, but no let's save some pennies out of the many millions.
Sounds like someone at Rolls & Royce looking at the BOM and thinking "hhmmm... We should save money by not clear coating the wood panels!"
the good ending meme was so funny for a reason i can’t say
Say it
No balls
@@CSGhostAnimation hope you doing well bro
you will get better.
𝐈𝐭 𝐢𝐬 𝐢𝐧𝐞𝐯𝐢𝐭𝐚𝐛𝐥𝐞
You will live a long and happy life.
𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐜𝐚𝐧'𝐭 𝐞𝐬𝐜𝐚𝐩𝐞 𝐲𝐨𝐮𝐫 𝐝𝐞𝐬𝐭𝐢𝐧𝐲.
@@CSGhostAnimationhave you found anymore of your flipnote buddies recently?
@@CSGhostAnimation lol
I am an applications engineer, now, but started as a machinist. Most everyone I know is in the machining field. Just last night we had this VERY conversation.
My solution is simple. Every engineer goes on the shop floor for six months. They will get exposure to the constraints of machining. They will understand the challenges of reading mf print that has 8 datums, with tolerances of .02mm.
You made me a subscriber for life. I've also shared this with all of my coworkers.
Thanks
Sincerely Mr. Freeze
I agree with this! Engineers and machinists should switch places for 6 months!
As a machinist this is gold. I've had way too many projects land on my desk without being part of the design process only to have everything you said come true.
Yeah, just start drilling in and take a left.
As a lead in a machine shop, I had a sign above my desk, featuring a medium looking into a crystal ball, that read "Communicating with Engineers is only a little more difficult than communication with the dead".
As a mechanical engineer, I've dealt with this exact thing. So I'm taking classes I fabricating and machining so I can have a much better understanding of what can be made/made easily
Spend more time on the shop floor and learn to give and take a lot of cussing.
I'm talking drunken sailor with 3 ex wives kind of swearing.
You will most likely be on the receiving end.
Rather than walking around in a daze, look at the tools and ask yourself: "How the Fuck am I going to build this with these tools?"
That is after you get back with that left handed screw driver.
Most of this shit should be common sense tbh, if not from an engineering standpoint then from a business standpoint, shouldn't be wasting material makings designs that can't be made, and shouldn't use bits or tapping dies that are only gonna be used once.
In doing so you are making the lives of us machinists much easier, thank you
Exact same thing I do as an EE. Dad was a lineman so I became a groundman while I studied at school so that I know what really happens on the ground, there’s nothing more that blue collar guys hate more than a pencil pusher that doesn’t know what he’s talking about or hasn’t done it himself
@@Kumquat_Lord get to work and stop whining filthy machinist 💪🏾
This is amazing. As someone who has worked on both sides of the industry, I absolutely endorse this information. I also laughed my arse off with the leaf thickness; I've been in that exact position, but a good machinist can do absolute miracles, but it's a well known fact that the account of beer of your have to bribe them with is a direct inverse correlation to the material thicknes you want them to work with.
Well depends on that they make having thin ass material and contures on samething well shit better pack same additional beer but just extrem thin starting material is actually pretty easy just make additional tools for the job yeha takes time but saves quite same nerve
So the thicker the machinist, the thinner the product
It's 2024 and I'm here on Monday Morning for Motivation. Awesome video.
Mechanical engineer student here, I really admire all the little details found here that were resonated by my professors. One of them told me a story of how one of her students who went on to work for an aeronautics company submitted a design for a bolt that was going to cost the company millions to make. Apparently she gave them tolerances of .0005mm (Idk how many leading zeroes there were but it was way more than necessary)......for a single bolt
I might keep this video on hand for new members of our robotics club because some of them have not the slightest clue on how 3D printing and CNC machining actually works and submit CAD that is damn near impossible to make for what they're asking
yeah got a similar story, not a mech engineer but we had to have mech engineer classes part of our degree. Story of my prof was how someone wanted a form out of sheet metal welded . you could have made the part my just bending average sheet metal and tig welding it but the problem was the designer for some reason wanted so precise welds that you would have to do laser welding and the sheet metal was supposed to be I think 0.01mm thin "because it was mathematically strong enough".
The head machinist of the company after reading this basically asked the designer to come down and show him how he would do it cause the head machinist couldnt figure it out... well the designer proceeded to take the drawing and tell them he will come back with something that works XD.
Luckily in younger generations most mech engineering training already includes all the 5 mentioned points because the teachers had to learn it the hard way that these teachings are necessary
@@dergunter1237what 0.01 mm? As thin as bacteria
@@raynaldisugatamawiranata1578 some bacteria yes. There was not much force on the sheet at all yet the solution was still bs and the designers goal was to minimize on weight while increasing surface area but it didnt work for obvious reasons.
The problem is that a lot of designers tend to have no practical experience in production so they never question as long as the numbers are right
That's like an order of magnitude more precise than the average machining tools companies can get their hands on
Not to mention making a reference to compare it to, which would need to be 10 times as precise for calibrating measurements
It would be practically impossible to get an iso 9000 certification for it
Just curious do aerospace bolts and screws really require high tolerances? Can't you use some regular M* threads?
I have worked as both a machinist AND engineer (sometimes at the same time...) This is a great list. I would clarify #3 to be sometime like:
- "Don't design something near a materials limits unless it's going to be on a spacecraft/aircraft and very microgram counts."
- "If the part would be less complex as 2 parts attached together, then it should be 2 parts."
(The 2nd one is a bit hard to wrap your head around in theory, but works out in practice)
Navy contracts seem to ignore those points entirely. I hate having to destroy an entire box or circuit board from a limited global supply because a screw or pin broke. The Navy wants damn perfection every time and it's enforced by government contract, so they'll treat shortcuts like treason even if it means months or years of delay and an extra billion dollars from the taxpayer. It's insane
@hyronvalkinson1749 Maybe the focus should be on repairablity, reliability, and cost? Instead of precision for the sake of precision?
@@bestaround3323 Absolutely. But furthermore it's politicians and brass making stupid decisions without consulting the ones who actually fo the work in order to appease other equally stupid administrators.
Second one in my brain translation.
Easier to cut it?
Ye..
THEN CUT IT AND SHUSH
@@slutforpotetoes2993 Honestly it goes for the replaceability too. Breaking a stem and replacing a stem (especially if you have a part number) is great. Breaking a stem and replacing the whole damn thing is terrible.
I’m not in the industry, but this was so easy to follow that even I could follow along with it. A comprehensive tutorial all throughout, and a hell of an entertaining one to boot. Well done!
As a designer understanding my own work is a challenge sometimes. Big respect to the machinists out there I could never.
i love the little birds yall gave each other when you were telling us to hire a fabricator.
Cause I THINK this was a real life scenario and you added it as an inside joke. love that.
When my favorite animation youtuber posts a video about MY profession (machinist) and nails the explanation of the struggles of my people so thoroughly… all I can do is throw money at you. Genius level intellect sir well done. MILL GO BRRRRRRRRRR
Idk why mill go brr made me laugh so hard after praising his intelligence😂
I hope it's as good as people say it is, I'm studying to become one and it's some very tough stuff hope it's worth the effort
A video on the animation pipeline would be awesome, and pointing out the differences between western and eastern pipelines if there are any.
love what you do. Please keep up your awesome work : )
Watched this right before I got in the industry (on the design side of things
CS Ghost, considering you may not be an engineer or machinist you certainly hit the nail on the head with this video! I have been a Machinist and CNC programmer for the last 15 years and my Father was a Mechanical Engineer. I once had to cut a viewing window on a part that had a +/-.0005" tolerance, the customer only needed this window or slot to see if something was there or not. So yeah I think you just helped save manufacturing, congrats! BTW I also really enjoyed your PC Master Race video as well.
5/10,000ths tolerance is so far above and beyond that I would of told the idiot to get lost with his nonsense.
He is definitely a machinist if not an engineer considering his "I spilled some coolant on myself during making of this video as I was moving our EDM machine and f'ed up and spilled some coolant"
Im currently studying mechanical engineering, damm i rly needed this vid, cus ill need to look for a place to inter for my final year
He specified in his video on PC building that he had “engineering homework”.
@@Flacto-vs6np try to apply soon before AND if possible ask in the interview if you could look at the CAM/CNC department AND the design/engineering department. In my expirience CNC shops are good for a short internship, like 1-2 weeks to get a feeling and understand how the programmers / machinist work (maybe also quality assurance) and a full blown 6 month 35-40h / week internship in a firm you like.
While in school they had us do a two week long summer class about welding. It was pretty much just a way for us to try out the equipment and perform some really bad welds haha. At the end we had a chance to ask the welders some questions and as we were doing engineering I asked "what are some things engineers commonly do that you hate?". Oh man, they had a ton to say about that haha. Eventually the instructors had to tell them to stop as my question had taken up the entire allotted time.
Ooo what were some of the things they said?
@@sheepsong5681 oh, sadly I don't remember the specifics now. But I do remember the overall theme of the stories I got. Essentially most of the stories revolved around designs that made assembly next to impossible. Welds needing to be done on the inside of closed spaces, welds needing to be done at the seem of two converging walls that only left inches of space, that sort of thing.
Many years ago I designed a crawler track frame. There were some internal welds to the frame. When I pointed that out to the fitter who was tacking it together he was not happy as he had progressed beyond being a “welder”. Then there was the engineering manager. He viewed me as a threat to his position. I had and have no interest in being an engineering manager.
Too many anti-personnel departments. I left engineering. Besides SCH E beats W2
I've been a welder for 13-years and this is the main motivation for me now starting to learn designing myself. this "welders eye" is a huge advantage for designing.
@@unibeastbeats
Having a practical eye is frequently missing in design engineering. The fact that I had both experience in welding and machining as well as what hardware was available and where to get it was a benefit to the design work I was doing. It is still beneficial for my hobbies.
As someone who has worked in mechatronics but never focused on CAD or CNC, this video was really interesting, loving your content bro.
How did you pay to write a comment
x2
me three
@@gugybuby8065 he can
5:52 I'm stealing this one
I work as both a somewhat junior engineer and a novice level fabricator and let me tell you, it's a wild experience. Sometimes (a lot of the time) my senior engineers don't even give coherent designs and are just like... figure it out.
This video helps articulate those frustrations.
You spelt phoenix wrong in your username
@MrAlex3461 my account is like 15 years old haha. Before youtube switched how usernames displayed, I had no idea I spelled it wrong the whole time
@@temporary912 Good way to get unemployed. And in some rural communities that can be enough to force a move or career change.
I was a machinist for about 5 years before I realized I wanted to get into everything behind it. It’s taught me soooo much. What I want to see on a drawing, what I hate, what’s possible, etc. I now have my mechanical engineering degree. At my first internship I learned one thing: if you have the machinist in house and don’t know if something could be made, take it STRAIGHT TO THE MACHINIST to see if it can be made and discuss another way you can make it/ discuss another design that CAN be done. I get people in the office looking for my personal opinion for their prints/ ideas and although I typically have an answer, when I don’t have an answer I say “go to Norm” (our machinist who has over 20 years experience). Working directly with machinists is the best thing any engineer can do. It lowers tension, helps you learn about your company’s capabilities, and gets you out of the cubicle.
I dont know why that is not a mandatory requirement. I got miles ahead of my coworkers simply because I always talked with workers and asked for their advice on how to wield, grind, drill and etc my parts. Their adviced were flawed and had mistakes but gave me overall understanding about what my company can and cant do. While me coworkers doesnt even know those guys names,
Yea like an engineer is going to ASK a lowly machinist what he thinks about the design? I found out years ago some engineers KNOW IT ALL and do not want or need any machinists telling them anything about how to design parts.
@@funone8716 hahaha thats what I was thinking.
Norm is such a powerful name, how is he not king of the office?
@@tailnowag8753King Norm the Machinist sounds like the feudal mecha lord of some hybrid sci-fi fantasy novel.
Complete with a big ass chair for his mecha body which in turn is a chair for his organic one.
I hope we get more engineering videos from you. This was great
YES
This is one of the best videos I've ever seen. Funny, informative and incredibly useful
As someone studying engineering, this was actually surprisingly educational. Learned more from this than the entire CAD course.
Go see if the machine shop at your university has any openings for you to help around the shop, or even just shadow some of the machinists. I have a background in ME and ended up falling into becoming a precision machinist at my current job, making metal stamping dies. The lack of hands on, real life, common sense training most engineers are lacking could be resolved with some real world training, plus it's way more fun to actually make the stuff yourself!
Always think about how a part will be manufactured. And always think about how parts will be physically assembled. You don't want to design something that is physically impossible to put together.
@@johnbirkholz994 I’m in a mechanical engineering program at a trade school and we are required to machine shit in the machine shops for classes and for our yearly projects it’s pretty sick
Kinda surprised this hasn't been mentioned yet, but most of the points in this video fall under "design for manufacturability". If you google it you can find some more details and explanations.
was doing the same thing. First project as an undergrad I hit every single one of these stupid issues and it was coming out of tutoring money lol. I decided engineering wasn't for me.
As a mechanical engineering student, I can definitely say that I learned more useful information from a single conversation with a machinist than I did from years of higher education theory. This is legit. One addition I’d have tho is listen to your operators, this includes end users, machinists, assemblers, packagers, maintenance techs, everyone. It’s a Mech Eng job to make their life easier. If they’re complaining abt something then it’s your problem and 9 times out of 10 you can do something abt it
you need to study dfma
@@maalikserebryakov Yep, this is mandatory study in my course. It should be in every engineering degree quite frankly
This is really true in any industry - siloing is useful for many reasons, but keeping different departments a complete black box from each other actually damages potential efficiency and LEAN gains.
Not knowing what other teams need leads to duplicated efforts, redundency, overdesigning, etc.
I was working on a logistics program for our shipping team, and I was all excited about all the things we could do with it, but despite all the effort I put into it, they never used it because they couldn’t find the button to export to Google maps - so hundreds of hours of work and redundant system usage just because i put a button in a place they didn’t see it. It wasn’t until months later that we found out and got things working right.
Study hard go first. That they tell you is valuable, but if you have some kind of lack in your technical understanding. That's not gonna save you. Know your priority.
The sad truth is Mech Eng are going to be completely replaced by the technologists in 5-10 years tops. AI is replacing us and is rapidly becoming more efficient for design. They don't need to pay a team of engineers to do what an AI program can do for less money. Make friends with those "machinists" because chances are they will be engineers longer than us. Source: I am also a Mech Eng student.
I am a CAD/CAM Designer AND Fabricator. This video had me in stitches because I've seen both ends of the spectrum and often have to work with drawings that other people have designed. One of the companies I do work for is only a few doors down from me on the industrial estate ( thank god ). The amount of times I've simply handed them back the drawing and said "No" is staggering, but after 5 years they're finally starting to get it....starting to.
Sometimes I'll still get designs from them for tooling they damn well know I don't have, and when you ask them why it turns out there was absolutely ZERO REASON FOR THAT SIZE other than "the designer thought it would work", while disregarding "The Chart".
"The Chart" is a godsend, as long as people use it...
We miss you CS Ghost 😢
As a freshman going into aerospace engineering, this answered a lot of questions that I didn't even know I had. Thanks a bunch mate 👍
GL mate, as a senior it's a lot of work but a lot of fun.
Get a part-time job in a machine shop, if you have anything local. Learning the basics of what's feasible is massively useful information.
As a freshman in Aerospace Engineering, I hate myself to model things in AutoCAD Inventor 😂
@@waraftermath4202 AutoCAD or Inventor? Both are very different lol. SolidWorks is nicer either way.
@@ClubPenguinMaster88 I swear it’s called AutoCAD Inventor, oh well. But yeah, I had finished five assignments on Inventor that wants me to create a housing bearing for 12” and 6.5”. It sucked when I’m using VDI 🙄 oh btw, I think it was called AutoDesk, I got it mixed up
I applied for a summer job as a tool maker because I thought it would be neat and I didn't want to work at McDonald's. What I didn't realize was how much useful information I was going to learn! Any time I told one of the older workers that I was majoring in engineering, I got valuable advice not far off from what was mentioned in this video! I just hope I will remember it all...
Once you graduate try doing a year in some sort of job-shop manufacturing place. I've spent 3 years as an engineer at a sheet metal fabricator and I think I've absorbed enough manufacturing common sense. I realize now how many headaches I must have given some poor machinist when I did intern work as a designer.
I worked at a company that would regularly have groups of engineer majors and interns come through. The biggest thing I always told them was to listen to your machinists and dont be afraid to ask them production questions. No other engineer will tell you that but a majority of those guys have been with the company for 30+ years and just because you have the degree doesn't mean you know better.
I would say that if you don't know better, you probably don't deserve the degree.
I fully agree. There is a certain level of superiority complex with engineers even interns. When I was interning my favorite people were the guys in the workshop especially the machinist. I even learned and a operated the CNC for a month. It helps massively when designing.
@@Pranav_Bhamidipati A textbook education is nothing compared to years of real-world experience
@@Pranav_Bhamidipati They are different skills that doesn't make any sense.
Its like saying a F1 driver doesn't deserve to be a driver, because he cannot change tires fast for an F1 car or fix one.
@@PandaMane Yeah, that's just an excuse for bad textbooks and ineffective classroom teaching. If we have to experience everything to understand and learn new things, then, there would be no value in passing down gathered wisdom to the next generations. They would learn through experience anyway.
As a person in the manufacturing space for over a decade.... this is the most hilariously accurate one I have watched in a long time. Also, solid advice. Kudos, sir. Kudos.
I work in automation and I’m on my lunch break watching this. You’re describing everything so perfectly it’s insane I feel like you’re one of my coworkers
This really helped me understand why everything in aerospace is so expensive.
I’m studying to become one of these “designers” and just stumbled across this and I gotta say using 3D printers is super awesome but it trains your brain to make crazy cool internal geometry and stuff and so times I have to remind myself that “the drill can’t go in there and then there and in here”😂 great stuff man
I'm glad you've recognized that. As a fellow designer, recognizing the limits of production is insanely important. Sometimes, people oversimplify to the point of wrapping around and overcomplifying the process.
The aspect of production that should take THE most effort is the design. There should be zero skimping out on evaluating, reevaluating, and ensuring reasonable design.
@@ClubPenguinMaster88 yes yes yes
And even with 3D printers you can save a lot of time by first deciding what orientation the part should be printed in, and then designing it accordingly.
I had a professor in school who required everyone to CAD from a starting block of stock. Like, you'd extrude a rectangle and then start cutting it down to what you want. It forces you to actually think about the machining process.
@@SaHaRaSquad 3D printing SHOULD require a lot of forethought in design, too! It's vital to know the limits of your printer, and how to optimize according to print time and surface quality.
As someone that did a summer placement doing some design work at a local company, this is 100% what happens. Also if you hear nothing about your design it means that it worked, if someone wants to talk to you about you know you fucked something up lol.
I had a job where my role was effectively to translate between the machinists and the designers. It was waterway engineering rather than a machine shop, but a lot of the principles still apply. Designers would do things like call for materials that don't exist or parts that are functionally impossible to get on site. I remember one project where the design called for several places where a log over 100 feet long should be used. There were not any trees that big on-site and getting someone to deliver a log that size would have been horrendously expensive (let alone maneuvering it to place it in the right spot). We had to kick that back to the designers going "that's not possible".
At the same time, the guys on-site implementing the designs were constantly looking for ways to get things done faster and cheaper so they were constantly trying to poke holes in the design for places where the tolerance could be a bit looser. There were so many times the designers let them not follow the design exactly that when they put their foot down on something really needing to be a certain way the guys actually making it would throw a huge fuss. So many times where they would try to do the equivalent of just angle grinding something and I would go "no, that part really needs that tight of a tolerance". A few times, it would be bad enough to make me go "you better hope the state inspector doesn't see you do that".
Im confused how one becomes a designer without the underlying practical machining knowledge. That doesn’t even make sense to me. And on the same thread why wouldn’t machinists be able to make their own designs when they know what is actually possible? It’s really weird to me that this task is split into two people when they are so seemingly intertwined with each other
@@brownie3454 its like managers going to MBA school. School is for losers or state licensed workers.
@@brownie3454 because time is money, and boss won't pay for both time and money they spent on single exclusive person who can do everything. Better split it and make the progress go together
@@brownie3454 1.Because average machinist is dumb as bricks. He knows how to use that drill machine and NOTHING else. He doesnt know how to read schematics properly. Even worse he doesnt want to bother thinking outside of his task. You can go and ask him about best way to drill that thing and what drills we have or need. But in the end that machinist doesnt care about end product.
2. How do you expect designer who spends days covered in specifications, 3d modeling, dealing with consumers and other departments to have time to know everything perfectly? Designer has to know everything knee deep at best. Because he already has to deal with assembly design, how that part is goind to interact with that part, what kind of drivers a we need to order for that machine. All of that has to connect with electrical department, economist has to approve your material list.
We need that H12 tolerance for that bearing. Its not designer problem how to do it. You just put that tolerance and request guys to cut it that way. What kind of cutting, which cutters on what speed setting are problems of machinist.
3. Thats why people like me exist. I am meh designer and decent cnc plasma user. I was sent to blue colors to create a bridge between high in the clouds designers and drowning in dirt workers. Technologist and quality assurance personel are responsible for acting as interpreters. You scold designers, chew down info into the bits and feed it to workers. Because after horde cuts, machines and drills all that metal they are going to just drop it. You have to explaing how to assembly it as well.
@@eggl7469 maybe i didnt word my comment accurately. even when split in two, i dont understand how either person gets their position without being able to fill the other position as well. seems like it’s asking for trouble and we end up with complaint videos like this
Can't wait for the next video. I'm sorry to hear about the cancer situation. I honestly thought you quit until some dude in the comments told me about community post. I didn't even know what those where so thanks whoever you are.
He hearted your comment so he's still active... they say he cooked but this guy when he uploads its a gourmet meal
There’s an old joke about a mathematician, a physicist, and an engineer being asked to find a volume of a red rubber ball. The mathematician finds the diameter and takes a triple integral. The physicist drops the ball in water and measures the displacement. The engineer looks up the serial number of the ball in his red rubber ball book and sees what it lists the volume as. (In other words, engineers have the ability to look up the specifications of readily available parts, and by golly should they take advantage of it!)
Where do I find the red rubber ball book?
Well where would you find it if not at the rubber ball book store?
I'm an engineer.
I wasn't taught any fancypants maths nor any information that I technically need to know but only once every year or so, just where to look for said information if and when I need it.
Physicists hate me. 😂
Just use the volume of a sphere formula you derived in calc-III, don’t have to perform a triple integral every time.
@@captainobvious9188 Mathematician wrote this
100% relatable as a former welder, current designer. Just wanted to mention your voice is super calming for some reason, love the vids!
I wish i could frame a video on my wall lmfao. The animation is so gooood. Im so tired of powerpoint-ass storytime animation stuff, so watching your stuff is so refreshing. Its so expressive, and i really love the contrast between the pixelated animation and the random png's in the video, and of course the humor is not over the top, just perfect amount of informational and funny
Really love your videos man!
for anyone wondering this is like 5-6 usd
@@Azriel_MR no, make them think i'm generous giving 50 usd 🤫
@@Azriel_MRthat’s disappointing.
@@thepurpleman119his low amount donation or the conversion?
@@thepurpleman119-your dad when you were born
this channel is exactly the kind of content i never knew i was looking for. thank you for this :)
Fuck yeah
I like how he talked to a good point of reference like the retiring design engineer and machinist and how he related how annoying that pretty much everybody has to agree on multiple different parts repeating over and over so thanks for the the tips
I just thought about this regarding some German manufacturers like BMW and Mercedes.
They boast and are vocal about their engineering solutions necessitating very extreme precision and low tolerance for errors, but this results in extremely high replacement parts cost and higher labor rate, and YET, are relatively UNRELIABLE compared to other PREMIUM brands from SIMILAR PRICE BRACKETS.
My dad's an engineer (designer side of things) and I will occasionally hear little tidbits about the work he does, so its nice to see in more detail what the day to day actually looks like. IIIRC he does more of the assembly side of things and runs a team of designers, so his day gets a lot harder when this design->machinist workflow fails. Most of it is building machinery for food/medicine production so miscommunication about details can prevent a part from being used.
Sounds like your dad works in the industry I want to work in, designing and making the machines that make things, it’s like industrial Lego 😅
Learned this during my first job in designing products. So much back and forth with the machinists, and eventually the product looked nothing like the original drawing. I was so frustrated with their requested changes. I had no idea before you had to factor in so many variables, not only for when machining the part, but also the production of it. Things like material shrinkage and warp due to thermal differential, cycle time for the part (can literally 4x the cost of a part), etc.. The cool thing is what once you understanding the manufacturing process and requirements, you unlock the ability to make almost anything you want.
Unfortunately people hire brand new engineers out of college and expect them to have a 4 year machinist degree at the same time to save money which leads to mix ups like this.
@@toasty365 That's very true, in a lot of fields too. In my case, the company was well aware I would be learning. Every professional has to start somewhere.
So in France, that's year one.... and you don't need to be the engineer dreaming up the part. Just to take those plans and restrictions on it and pump out the design for the shops. That's a two year program. We understand the jargon of the Engineer, and the jargon of the Machinist. We make sure that the transition happens as smooth as possible instead of making them rage at each other.
@@ForestRaptor I was about to say the same things, I am bewildered this is such a huge issues for many. In France engineering designing, machining, etc degrees all get taught about the other side of things in order to avoid such mistakes. Of course there is much more to learn depending on your field afterwards but at least, you are aware you will need to work together, plan your design, etc. I work an engineering job where I also design, and directly work with machinists. Between someone interested in becoming good, learning more, etc and someone doing it to put meals on a table, the difference is huge in less than a month. But it takes at least 2 years of working experience to get someone independant enough. I urge anyone working in the field to always have "Le Fanchon" nearby, the thing is an Engineer/Machinist/Designer's Bible and holds within all the basics you desesperately need.
This guy it's a scout main 100%
Wasn't expecting it, but I really think this could be a super useful learning resource for engineers or even people who are interested in getting into the industry
Hope you get commissioned to do more stuff like this, could be super interesting!
Just finished this unit two weeks ago in my engineering design course, I'm happy to report that they are in fact teaching this to the new engineers.
Sometimes I felt inferior to my fellow engineering students who got their undergraduate placements at more glamorous engineering firms, while I worked at a fitter machinist workshop.
This video gave me a lot of pride in the little machine workshop where I work! I’m also so much more confident around power tools, knowing how a particular part could (or not) be machined, and even painting!
All that came from a friend who realised I am an engineering student, who then said I should “learn how to swing a hammer”!
that is HUGE part of the problem, those engineers should be sent to manufacturing departments, not engineering, to get their practice in, to actually see how parts are getting made, what makes them easier or super expensive to make
@@dsfs17987 if your engineering has anything to do with manufacturing you will have to gain some practical experience. But I will never make a drawing/part etc. I`m "only" sorting out principles that might solve a problem and the constraints they need to perform well. As well as some magic with math once the prototypes are finished so they work as expected an only as expected.
@@MrHaggyy Structure optimization? The kind of person I love having as as co-worker, as I'm absolutely trash on the academics side of engineering. Absolutely perfect complimentary type for the building/manufacturing types like me
@@Kalvinjj 😅 I don`t know how many coffees my system admin got from me by now. As I only work with data, algorithms, and simulation I blow up our IT on a regular basis. But i do love our mechanical folks as well. They give me machines I can do my control engineering magic on.
I graduated from university six months ago. Bachelor engineer designer. With the way we were trained, and with this video, I understand that I will really study my specialty only if I find this job.
In the meantime, I make money with 3D design.
Thank you very much for this video - I saved it and downloaded it :3
This should literally be taught to every mechanical/aeronautical/civil engineering student. Cannot tell you how many times I had machinists laugh in my face and reject prints early on in my career.
I actually work on spacecraft now and even then some of this is still applicable.
Same, I work in aerospace and the amount of work we have dedicated to backtracking on stupid designs is unfortunate 😂
Here in Germany they started teaching me all this in my Construction Elements class from the second semester onwards. Missing from the video is: Use standard parts wherever possible. That's why my Construction Elements textbook came with a second book just with tables for ISO, DIN and EN parts.
i love how this is like a speeddraw, not really a animation
Its Flipnote inspired
@@YEPitsGOOD yea but he showed the drawing process and sped up, i watched his video on nintendo
@@SOOWOOGEE ik i just like that it its flipnote inspired