"aggressive work practices" I'm going to email my old boss and let him know he wasn't risking my life and fingers for profit, he just had aggressive work practices.
One of my Indian friend who is in Import Export business (Import actually) with China owns 4 warehouses, 2 in China and the other 2 in India. According to him the work Chinese labour would do in 1 say without even asking, Indians would do in 3 days and that too with strict monitoring. This is the case of whole of East Asia and ASEAN is also pretty much similar. Now you can weep about it if you want.
@@arminius6506 China does not have unions because it's a workers paradise. India has unions. Modi should make special economy zones where there are no unions.
Saying cheap prices are the only thing that matters is an oversimplification. People want cheap cars but not at the cost of reliability, tech, and all the conveniences they're used to. Just look at which trim level is typically the volume mover for car models. Usually it's the middle one, not the cheapest one.
Certainly in the UK, the biggest challenge is going to be getting enough electricity to charge them all. A litre of petrol is about 8.9 kWh. Electric cars are about twice as efficient, so you need about 4 or 5kWh of electricity to replace each litre of petrol currently sold. We collect about £2bn per month in petrol tax at a rate of 52.95p/litre, so about 4bn litres sold per month, or about 20TWh of electricity that would be required to replace it. Current annual demand (2021 figures) is 334.2TWh or about 28TWh per month (more in winter, less in summer), so we would need to double that. Also we would need to double grid capacity, and likely more than double capacity in residential areas.
@@katrinabryce Considering that people will not switch all at once to EVs it's not really a serious issue. Gradual improvements are not really that difficult to accomplish. You also have to keep in mind that trucks have no hope of being replaced by EVs and they represent a bit under half of all fuel used. (I'm assuming you used petrol as a generic term here). A more serious issue for me is the demand for fast charging which is a much bigger deal. You can definitely accomodate the slow rampup in production of energy but you can't really say the same for the electrical grid. Considering fast charging will be most in demand in cities where electrical infrastructure upgrades are going to be most expensive and it's not looking good for EVs in such places.
@@katrinabryce I expect them to introduce an electricity tax at some point on EV's. I can't think they will just let fuel duty revenue they are coming in go but I'm not sure hwo they would even do that as people would charge at home a lot of the time if they could. Could just tax all electricity but it's already very expensive or just tax public charge points but that would just put people off using them unless they had to. Or just charge from a normal socket point. Might just charge you for the miles you did in tax every MOT or something, that would be easier although doing all of this will just keep people from moving around so much which has it's negatives and advantages I guess.
I was in China over Easter 2023. I had a look at some of their EVs which were in display in a shopping centre. They looked quite impressive, and priced the same as an equivalent petrol car ($40k for a luxury car).
I would not trust any Chinese car with out a couple years of on the road reviews. It's always about the show... but no go in China. What I mean is I've been to China a couple times and I'd ask about all these car brands I'd never heard of. My Chinese friends would tell me nobody wants to buy a Chinese car.. they are junk.
@@HandFromCoffin Well that's the thing: China is so far ahead on EV's that we have those road reviews now. Also strangely enough that never stopped anyone from buying a Tesla, even though they score 1980's safety ratings, illegal and dangerous 'autopilot' beta software, spying on your data, no parts available, etc etc etc. The reality is people only knock Chinese vehicles because of Tucker Carlson-syndrome.
Still they are tariffs and Chinese market would get differential pricing nonetheless so pricing in Chinese market cannot be used as reference. EU for instance is very protective with their automobile manufacturing
@@nehcooahnait7827 BYD's latest entry to the EU market, the Dolphin, can be a reference. While the tariffs, shipping, handling and brokerage added ~€10k to the EU price compared to the Chinese home market where it's priced very modestly (~€16k), they also enlarged the vehicle and upsized the battery and motor, so that 1. the EU customers can get more for the extra they paid; 2. it gets to compete in a different category. A lot of options in the toolbox when you have the competitive edge. I imagine this will be a standard practice among Chinese EV exports.
Chinese companies are targeting Hungary for their EU manufacturing base, CATL is building a new plant their, NEO is building a plant to build their chargers and BYD was also looking for such opportunities in Hungary.
Do you know what’s going on in Debrecen? I have heard that people are not happy and protesting against building the factory, this was a few months back and since then I have not came across news about this
Using Europe as a Chinese car company export boom is a bad example since the local dealership in the region hike up the price so much that not much people is buying it. Example for export boom are more suitable for region like Oceania, Southeast Asia ect. BYD ranked 1st in Israel, Thailand, Malaysia ect. 2nd place in Australia and New Zealand behind Tesla. What make it more impressive is that they've only been in those country for less than a year and they've already achieved this much
Yes, electric cars in China are cheaper domestically, but I find that they can be 1 or 2 times more expensive in Europe, which makes them less competitive
@@HermanWillems umm, from the Chinese perspectives it’s much safer to build factories in China because the gov supported them. Whereas the west became increasingly hostile to Chinese investment lately.
There's a huge gap in the UK market for a cheap & cheerful EV that frankly only the Chinese are capable of filling. Their latest sub-£10 EVs, like the BYD Seagull & Wuling Bingo, would be an instant hit if they were launched here. They would disrupt the market, just as the original Mini did in 1959. As someone that barely drives 3,000 miles a year, a £35k+ EV makes absolutely zero sense. However a basic, £10k EV, even one with limited range, WOULD make sense, especially if you kept your existing (& fully depreciated) ICE car as back-up for those occasional long drives. TBH, for me, the cost of running a tiny EV would be negligible for half the year as my existing solar array could feed the car's battery for nowt. I think it is wrong for the West to continually bash China as being somehow 'evil'. They're only doing what we've done umpteen times in the past 300 years. Until such time as WWIII breaks out, I'd happily buy stuff from China. It benefits me & it benefits them. Simples!
@@BungieStudios China self-evidently & increasingly DOES drive Chinese cars as do us Brits. You would not trust your life in a Chinese car but presumably are just fine & dandy living in a country plagued by out-of-control Fentanyl deaths, weekly school shootings & mall shootings, devastating tornadoes & hurricanes, extreme weather events & (and this is one for the next 20 years) lethal acts of Far-right domestic terrorism. Oh, and I think you'll find you ALWAYS get what you pay for. It's one of the basic tenets of western Capitalism.
@@BungieStudios you are delusional if you think that Chinese doesn't use their EV cars, when they are selling more EVs than Germany and only are behind Tesla.
I was just coming back from China and was riding in a lot of these cars. The Xiao Peng P7 looks really well made and I wish they'd export more to europe. I think we will see much more chinese cars on european streets in the future. They are adapting and improving FAST. Not just with cars.
Speed of iterations in China are about 2x the speed of improvements coming out or South Korea. In 23 years as a driver, I drove approx 250 different cars, with 6 of them exceeding 50,000 km. BYD taxi from just 7 years ago compared with what BYD makes today makes you think are they the same company? Xpeng, Zeekr, Nio, BYD, Hongqiao, Ora, Smart (yes, Smart is now a Chinese brand running on Chinese platform), Polestar (Geely again), Tesla - all these upstarts are up-ending the established vendors from anywhere in the world. This goes especially for brands like Ford - Mustang Mach-E can compete with Tesla on panel gaps, but not with range or quality of software. Sodium-Ion batteries are going to change the whole world - 1000 km range at 60-70% weight of conventional Model Y brand are a game changer and a death bed for majority of ICE vehicles. What does this mean for western brands? Tesla will continue to kill it. Mercedes Group will skyrocket. The rest? Adapt (new technology), Scale (improve) or become irrelevant.
The name of the modern car company Tesla is a reference to the world's first electric car that was invented by Nikola Tesla in the 1930s. ua-cam.com/video/EorF01qUnak/v-deo.html
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(1) @6:02. Nope. Their prices go from around US$5000 to US$150,000. For example, the best selling luxury EV in 2022 was the HiPhi X. It sells for around $100,000 for the base model. And now, we have the BYD Yangwang U8 and U9. The U8 is selling for around $150,000. And is an instant best seller. (2) @1:11. EVs and New Energy Vehicles (NEVs) are not the same thing. EVs are pure electric while NEVs include both EVs and plug in hybrids.
Really, this is a story about how slowly the leading car manufacturers were at adopting EV and how buyouts have ultimately hurt innovation. Now new players are seeing opportunity to take a bite in the global market share. Short sightedness.
They are not short sight. Traditional cars needs completely supply chain to stand in market. So its hardly new comemer to come in unless big govt's hidden pushing it such American govt are supporting Vietnam Vinfast car to born.
A bite sure but not a very big one. Cars are the second largest single purchase many in the West ever make; most people are going to put their trust in known, established brands rather than a small startup. Even if the price is amazing Chinese brands will need to convince buyers they're reliable, safe and have sufficicent infrastructure to support their vehicles. Look at what happened to Yugo or Renault when it tried to enter the US market
@@fuckduncan3754 French car is a bit out of American's vassal supporting custom so it has not future in US market. Look at US market , Who is flourished is all US vassal's car brand japan , Korea and the new comer Vietnam's Vinfast. Its not what you think. Who will buy a unkonwn ,unestablished car brands? But American hidden vassal support system will make this Vietnam car flourish in its market soon. Like they had done award to Korea car decades ago. So don't think Chinese car would enter US market. They know your hidden rogue system well. They aren't interested in.
This is mostly due to GM, one of their customer, kept on having their car Chevy bolt recalled multiple times due to potential fire issue, costing LG Chem a huge amount of market share.
LG made batteries are time bombs. They must be heavily subsidized by the Korean government to survive this long by probably providing aggressive pricings to EV makers
@@tooltalk Lie,the truth is that LG's batteries are not competitive in China, and their technology is far behind CALT. LG's battery technology lags far behind BYD's. Which LG battery is comparable to BYD's Blade battery? Why is there far more Western media coverage of BYD's blade battery than LG's battery?
It's the batteries that really add to the cost. Now if China could push a standard battery pack, they could ship cheap cars with the battery pack, a separate market of competition, in which they could also compete. But local safety compliance testing and certification can and will make some markets less palatable to penetrate, let alone the quick flip of any trade sanctions, hence splitting the car and battery side into two, becomes even more prudent.
@@ravenkk4816 His brain has somehow detached from the existence of the global resource prices f.e. LI. Maybe some words like "standard battery pack" make it easier for delusions to break free? I don't know. I don't know even where to get those "standard BS packs" for free ... Hehehehe I hate it so much, when these scammers even don't give concrete information where to get the actual hardware/software/unicorns/snake-oil. The get dumber and dumber, I think, heheheheh:)
@@ravenkk4816China, as a major producer and consumer of electric vehicles, has the potential to lead the way in establishing a standard battery pack for the industry. By doing so, China could not only benefit its own domestic market but also promote the adoption of electric vehicles in other countries, such as the EU. After all, carmakers make cars. Odd how they seized the chance to make every battery pack hard/impossible to replace, and all very custom. At least China has an opportunity to shake the market up and capitalize upon that natural transition by forcing it thru consumer demand and prices will do that. Might see a price war on such a battery pack, which would, for China, be easier to ride out and with that, suit them economically far better.
Even with local safety compliance you're always rolling the dice of ten million in perfect conditions with batteries which can prevent cascades several orders of magnitude more rare. Sodium batteries are almost as dangerous but with their extra mass present less of a catastrophic outcome. At least sodium gives you some warning before going poof into a fire that can be easily be controlled by bathing the area in inert gas like Krypton after the area is cleared. How many fire trucks have that capability?
@@miinyoo Battery issues would be for battery makers to deal with. Carmakers would just be making cars with standard battery compartments and what brand/make of battery you marry that up with will ultimately come down to you, or dealers, who will offer a choice. Equally, some better battery tech comes along, well, standard battery pack specs so, be easier to upgrade later on. Something of a win for the eco tickboxing.
Tbh i cant wait for my 10k EV in europe. Im holding out buying a car because i expect a flood of chinese evs. Even got a xiaomi phone and diched the korean brands.Very happy with my decision.
Working in the automotive sector and can comfirm, the chinese are going apeshit with their development. They've got really big and advanced EV production.
There's a mistake at 9:25 where you put Slovenia in the 4th place by value of imported Chinese EVs. The number you put in the graph is like 1,5 Billion USD for Slovenia, which is unrealistic considering the country's population is around 2.1 million. I checked our govt' statistical office and for 2022 the imports amounted to 6.564.297 EUR (similar number in USD). This accounts for all vehicles imported from China, either PHEV, HEV and BEV, without electric scooters and mopeds (another 2,5 million EUR roughly).
Wonderful episode. I follow this market very closely and I still learned from watching your video. Just one correction, Chinese EV exports in 2022 was $20.09 billion, not $20.9 billion. This was BEVs only, PHEVs would add another $2.5 billion. In February 2023, 3 of the top 5 EV sellers in the world were Chinese, BYD, SGMW and GAC. BYD, the largest, was bigger than the next three (Tesla, SGMW and GAC) combined. Also, your data on battery market share was quite old, BYD has since passed LG.
I think BYD will become the world's largest automaker in a few years. Geely is also very competitive and needs to strengthen the development of global markets. Tesla has good technology, but the model update speed is too slow. I don't think cars can be completely analogous to the iPhone. The market cannot be occupied simply by relying on a few explosive models. Different people have very different demands for cars. Tesla pursues extreme cost control, but sacrifices some experience and diversity, which may also become an stumbling block for Tesla's development.
Total vehicle sales of Telsa and BYD from January to March in Chinese market. Tesla：137,429； BYD：552,076； Subdivided vehicle models（Price Unit: 1000 RMB）: Sedan: Tesla Model 3（Price Range: 231.9-331.9） = 42,782； Sedan: BYD Han（Price Range: 209.8-331.8） = 37,817； Sedan: BYD Seal（Price Range: 212.8-289.8） = 19,573； Sedan: BYD Qin Plus（Price Range: 99.8-165.8） = 79,239； SUV: Tesla Model Y（Price Range: 263.9-363.9） = 94,647； SUV: BYD Tang（Price Range: 282.8-342.8） = 32,525； SUV: BYD Frigate 07（Price Range: 202.8-289..8） = 17,927； SUV：BYD Song Plus（Price Range: 154.8-218.8） = 102,826； SUV：BYD Song Pro（Price Range: 134.0-159.0） = 38,589； SUV：BYD Yuan Plus（Price Range: 134.0-162.0） = 62,528； MPV：Denza D9（Price Range: 335.8-445.8） = 24,161； Not on Sell: BYD YangWang U8 （Price Range: 1098.0） = 13,000+；（Pre-Oders in 2 days）
@@jxl594 These were Chinese reliability surveys filled out in China. They are either accurate or not accurate. Are you saying they were not accurate? I’m not making any assumptions about their accuracy. I’m just trying to understand your point.
@@adamesd3699 The sales data shows that the prices and sales volume of BYD's high-end models are comparable to Tesla's, and it is not true that BYD only occupies the low-end market. In addition, new models such as BYD Seal and Denza D9 were recently launched and have also achieved good sales. BYD is actually eating into Tesla's market share.
In Israel some Chinese brands were successful although not in a consistent way. They sold well in the medium to large crossover segment in which they had the highest price advantage. Ora and Leapmotor failed here because of the tax structure on conventional cars (small cars have lower tax rate so EVs are uncompetitive in this segment). Regarding Tesla, they are shipped from China right now and it shows in the graph but are going to be from Germany when Giga Berlin is at full capacity. Tesla sold mostly model 3 here as the model Y is still too expensive.
The shortage of cars boosted the EV specially from China and if regulations will allow this will grow drastically in the coming years, no one can compete with Batteries 🪫 from China, scale and local government push, and this is the no1 cost factor in every EV car, and the advantage they will leverage…
@Formosan i don't know anything about scooters so can't say. Taiwanese stuff in general is rare here except the ubiquitous Taiwanese chips inside almost any high end electronics device
@@BetterLifeCreations Of course other countries can compete with China once China is blocked the price from other countries falls as volume increases you can see how US tariffs work well in boosting domestic companies, US steel went up after placing tariff on Chinese Steel. There is no doubt that Tariffs work its just a matter of actually doing it.
Economic margin wise, you might have missed the benefit these EV firms got in the form of Carbon Credits and that market is gonna be ridiculously profitable for them.
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Here in Oslo, Norway I barely see any Chinese cars. Mostly see Teslas, German, Korean, and Japanese cars. I heard in a podcast that dealers here barely sell any Chinese cars. The savings does not make up for the lower quality and an aggressive China for the average consumer.
That's because the local dealership in the Europe hike up the price of the Chinese car a lot. They're doing very good in places like Australia, New Zealand, Thailand and Israel
@@yoppindia that won't happen when sodium battery is on the market. Pretty sure BYD seagull is using sodium battery. I think zeekr car too with CATL new sodium battery.
it's more like it stole the the front design from the Mini. Inside the controls also look chrome and a bit similar to a Mini. The back though looks quite different.
There is nothing wrong with the government providing the incentives to research and promote new technologies. We had been there. Every year some agencies dole out millions in research money.
Like you said, Tesla seems to be going for volume. It's interesting to see where they will go with pricing. Even after their price cuts they still have large margins, and they continue to work on cost reduction in vehicle manufacturing. I've read rumors the Model 3 is actually more expensive to build than the Y due to improvements in manufacturability with the Y.
Going for volume will undercut Tesla's whole brand tho. At that point they're just another EV player. Tesla's whole schtick was to be the Apple of the car world. Without their premium identity, what do they have to sell themselves with that other companies don't?
@@ArawnOfAnnwn I think u hv no idea what u're talking abt. Tesla doesn't need a premium identity when it's beating the Toyotas and Hondas of this world with such a wide margin that it still has room to cut prices to fulfill its mission statement. Do u think their mission statement is to protect their premium identity ? Read it and you might learn something ....
Overall this is a very good analysis. However, there are several things I'd like to point out. First, this video focus too much on Europe market, however Chinese manufactures pays a lot attention on Asean countries and BRI countries. Second, China car exports really took off after the covid lockdown lifted, numbers increased dramatically after the reopen. Third, the car export is currently limited by logistic and China started building large numbers of ships for car transport. We will see big increase when the logistic problem solved.
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While I have no doubt that Chinese EVs will be eating European EVs in developing market for breakfast, I wonder if their businesses are sustainable long term. EVs are complicated and expensive, profitability might be a long and winding road, which requires even more subsidies. As the size of the companies increase to reduce cost from economic of scales, so will the weight of the subsidies. That asides, it's annoying that instead of building mass transit network and transport infrastructure like China, the developing world is buying Chinese EVs and build more roads. That's going to cost more down the line.
EV's are far less complicated than ICE cars and increasingly no more expensive (everywhere in Europe the TCO of an EV is already below that of a comparable ICE model - the slightly higher purchase price is more than offset by the savings in fuel and maintenance). Most developed country governments (the US one is the big exception) are winding back their subsidies as no longer needed.
@@autohmae ICE cars less complex? Dozens of internal exploosions a second, wildly varying torque demanding very complex transmissions, FAR more moving parts. You're kidding.
@@autohmae What? ICE engines less complex? Yeah maybe a simple two stroke... Yet a modern ICE in your car is much more complex than a battery powered EV. I mean the tolerances and materials used. The air fuel mixture! The oil! All the moving parts working in unison over bumps and in different atmospheres. It is insane how complex a modern car is and that doesn't include things like the exhaust flow or catalytic converter. Ugh... Transmissions are insane! Sorry man I think you're over complicating EVs somehow. It is because we've been using ICE engines for 100 years that we can make the damn things so well. Battery technology or chemistry really held back electric cars. Now however thst is changing. I hope I get to see iron oxide magnets get incorporated into stuff. They - in theroy - can make the strongest permanent magnets which can revolutionize a lot of industries! Make a lot things more efficient or wickedly powerful small motors.
What of the video's I have seen where apartment and condo buildings in China will not even allow some of those EV brands to park inside due to spontaneous battery disassembly issues?
BYD batteries are exploding even when the car is not charging and is simply parked for hours BYD are having unpredictable and unexpected random seat belt clip explosions happening in the interior of these cars? It looks like when an iPhone explodes in someone's pocket? BYD have major issues with collision air bags not deploying what so ever.....even in very serious accidents! This is a major recall issue..... Yet the CCP is hiding this from everyone across the world! People's safety is highly at risk! I will never ever ever ride in a Chinese electric car! I don't care about how good the claims are; I don't care what awards they get nominated for; I don't care how much people tell me they love their BYD and how awesome it is........ nothing is going to change my mind when I've seen footage of thousands of these cars spontaneously combusting within seconds! You literally have no time to escape the vehicle before BOOM! The electrical fires are so rapid and so intense that it's miracle that people haven't been more seriously injured or killed? Like every single one of these incidents people are lucky to escape with their lives from what looks like a minor fender bender or not even a crash at all ...... Simply driving along the highway and nekminit you see smoke? You got seconds to pull over and exit the vehicle before your life is in danger! These EV explosions are so violent that they remind me of seeing an electrical sub station explosion? And that isn't an exaggeration either. Btw I'm not anti ev either, I'm anti Chinese EVs because they are dangerous and none of us realise is yet? We are all blinded by the sparkle and jazz of marketing of new EVs but neglect to keep in mind that China is a communist country that will 100% control the narrative, hide the problems so that they can sell more and more to the west to make more money! They don't care about reputation that means....... the Chinese are exploiting the policies imposed on us by the UN climate BS. They know western countries are "forced" to purchase electric cars, and because there truely is only 1 other competitor on the stage (let's be honest Tesla are the only company succeeding in this space - they also don't need to keep dual production lines in operation as ICE production starts declining i.e. 1 factory) so China has got a massive advantage by selling us poor quality EVs with no incentive to improve the quality at all..... And all incentive focused on keeping maximum production output! Safety, China couldn't give a shit about safety it's all about profit!
@@shane864 Ask the fire services of New York City about e-bikes. 220 e-bike fires last year and a few were fatal. Scale that up to Tesla sized batteries. And some of those brands of Chinese EV will be safety deficient. Doubt many gasoline tanks catch fire spontaneously in ones garage if they are not running.
Now those plans are beginning to come to fruition. The latest news from XPeng is that it is now selling two of its models in Europe! The XPeng G9 SUV and the XPeng P7 sedan can now be ordered in the countries of Denmark, Norway, the Netherlands, and Sweden. These are a few of the hottest EV markets in the world.
The refreshed P7 is very nice. G9 might be a bit too pricy. But that new G6 just unveiled at the Shanghai Auto Show will be the key vehicle to see if Xpeng will survive and become a profitable company.
There are a "lot" of chinese SUVs in Norway. But few people are gambling on them. They cost 60k-75k. And for that price you can get something from a more reputable and well known brand.
I have a two year old one from a very reputable European brand who was mentioned in this video, and even though it's very good mechanically, it has had a lot of electronics/software bugs. Even though I have been extra unfortunate with 12+ visits to the workshop, it seems like other owners have troubles with them of varying rate. My friend with a Chinese car(also mentioned in the video) bought slightly later, have had no such bugs, and have worked perfectly. It seems like this is the general experience with that brand.
@@MalawisLilleKanalChinese simply is in the EV game longer and in with greater government support early on I think many European brand enter the ev game later than chinese one
They didn't expect people will buy their cars for 60K+, the price are just showing to the consumers in China, saying:"see, the foreigners are buying the same car with a double/triple price". It's all about branding.
Meanwhile, in Taiwan, we have to wait for Foxtron (Foxconn Honhai) to introduce their vehicles in the markets, although they have the model T circulating, we still need to see them supplying other segments. It would be also interesting to bring Stellantis into this conversation.
The traditional car industry is at a very similar point as they were in the late 60's/early 70's when Japan started to export cars to the US/UK and Europe. And later also the Korean brands. I forced traditional car makers to adapt. This time the traditional car industry has reacted too slowly IMO. I think a number of traditional car brands will go bankrupt. Then Chinese car industry might scoop up their production infra, adapt them to BEV production and conquer the European car market with good value for money BEV's.
Agree. In the 1970s Japanese cars were reliable and generally had good engines, but the design was awful. In addition, they were only competitive with regards to petrol engines, not with diesel (so only competed in 60% of the market, in diesel's heydays) Now Chinese cars look good too. Only drawback is lack of established dealerships. I think MG and BYD can make massive inroads into the market, and gain a large market share faster than the Japanese makers ever did.
Here in America, GM has been perpetually broke for 20+ years, Chrysler is effectively no more, and Ford is whining they can only survive with huge subsidies due to their "investment" into electric, even though they have hardly any electric vehicles to offer. This, despite focusing almost exclusively on the high-end, high-margin SUV market. If people love trucks and trucks make tons of money, where has all that money gone? American car companies suck. I've had no reason to buy American since GM ruined Saturn. It seems surreal, but yes, I do think there's a real possibility that local American brands may disintegrate. They have mismanaged themselves into oblivion and are no longer big enough to be "too big to fail."
There's a big difference. Chinese cars suck in build quality. I've seen many videos of BYD batteries just catching fire as in spontaneously combusting. Parked vehicles are just catching on fire. The Teslas have way fewer instances of that problem.
@@Waccoon You don't know anything about car companies. They're not broke. They all made billions in net profits in 2022 and have billions in liquidity.
@@dannydaw59 no actual data on that, just rumours and anecdotes (and a lot of vested interest from ICE makers, Tesla and established car makers). MG (Chinese) has 4% market share of UK car market, and it gets pretty good scores for reliability and 7 year warranty (joint highest with Kia).
Very good video. While brief, it dived deeply into aspects that many 'Why China is so good at EV' articles/videos didn't. For instance, it is rarely mentioned that China's EV development can be dated back to early 2000s, not 2010s. 2010s was, at the video correctly identified, where this development is on the next gear, rather than its origin. Still, a few points I'd like to add. 1. The development got its ups and downs. It's not just 'throw some money year after year and it's done'. There are setbacks. There are adjustments. The subsidy fraud thing was actually quite serious then. There were others as well, like how to determine to best form of subsidy - it it consumer? Some form of quotas? Should it focus on big, advanced luxurious cars? Or should it be general? This is actually quite a journey and show the smart adaptation of the Chinese government 2. Speaking of the fierce internal competition, Tesla occupies an important role here. Tesla has been considered the best brand in China for a long time. So, in order to cut a share in the market, Chinese EV companies ha木 to directly compete against Tesla. This spurs great product development. They tried to chase Tesla in certain performance metrics, while developing new edges (like software integration, which is very very good). They also dominate the lower-end markets which is more price-sensitive. I think right now, Tesla is still considered the best, but BYD is a very close second. and 5 years ago this would sound ridiculous. That's what the competition has done. 3. The help on EV is far beyond just consumer subsidy. One thing: infrastructural buildup like charging stations, laws and regulation, suppression of ICE vehicles etc. China is basically leaps and bounds ahead of all countries, even European ones, in this regard. The infrastructural buildups is especially important - Imagine cutting 90% of gas station and see how it affects the ICE car market. 4. There's an underlying strategic logic behind China's massive and sustained investment in EV. The basic idea is that newcomers are hard to challenge established ones in existing market. The only way for China to get ahead of the technologically advanced west is to get into new products like EVs. That way, all countries have the same starting point, and in this case with smart policies and subsidies + a huge internal market, China could be very successful - and it did. This sort of thinking can date back even before 2000s - and in the early 2000s China decided to experiment and test out different fields and see which one is worth further developing - and EV is one of them, and the rest is history.
I know chinese car manufacturers are investing a lot to actually manufacture here in Brazil. BYD is buying a former Ford factory while GWM bought a former Mercedes factory and will make mostly hybrid vehicles there (meanwhile importing).
I think it should be mentioned that Chinese already secured the supply chain, and investing alot in it , including the the RnD , which make CATL growing so large than any energy company.. definitely advantage that the German and Americans didn't have
I watched a bunch of videos of the Shanghai auto show showing off the EVs and the cars that are available in China. Wow were they competitive and very impressive. I've seen China's car's back in 2019, and knowing that their backseats are larger and normally the vehicles are more spacious, it only entices me more to spend my money on a Chinese car if it's ever available.
@@BionicBurke No I've done the research on gasoline vehicles and articles written about burned EVs in China. There have been some fires but they're not really that significant according to data. There was 3000 some vehicles that burned and between 2020-2022, there was around 86 vehicles, and there are over 2 million EV's with BYD having more burnings but they sell 5x the amount of vehicles than Tesla. While at that, there are pretty much non-existent videos of the exported vehicles from China that have burned. China is also moving away from ternary batteries to lithium ion phosphate which was said to be a factor. By the time it comes to my country, I'm sure they will have worked out more kinks and it will be safe to drive. I will give them a chance especially knowing that they're more spacious, technologically packed, more economically competitive, and they look so good.
@@Lena-vw6ye your problem is trusting data out of China instead of your own eyes. There are safe EV options out there... none are BYD. It's the NEW blade batteries that are going up like crazy, not their older cars.
They deleted my reply pointing you to evidence. How classic. I bet the channel name is keyword blocked. The channel is the other s word for snake with za on the end. His video on BYD should be all the truth you need.
@@BionicBurke No, someone already debunked his video. I believe it was Car Viking or something like that. He broke down his video and I don't really watch anti-China channels like that because their only mindset and goal is 1 thing to attack and belittle and that's not really the truth.
In my country, even the Wuling Mini Air EV was selling very well. Thousands of units have been sold. With 100% battery the distance can be 300 Km. It is suitable for commuters in urban areas. The issue regarding battery life will probably be resolved in the next few years.
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Driving a BYD is courting death. I definitely prefer non-copied cars with working airbags, that don't catch fire and don't start failing apart after 6 months.
That is why I suggest waiting to buy an EV. I compare it to when the "flat screen" replaced the CRT. The first ones where mainly plasma and cost thousands for the status of a 43" flat TV. Now you can buy a much better modern flat screen for a fraction of the cost. Much the people buying Tesla now, those early adopters overpaid for the status symbol item that soon will become mainstream.
Yeah, the early adopter tax is huge for early EV adopters, not only financially, but also with the shortage of fast chargers, extremely lacking right to repair laws, etc. I'd much rather go with a mature hybrid car platform. Hybrid Camrys and Accords are around 30k each and are already proven to last hundreds of thousands of miles. There are even cheaper and equally reliable options that are the default taxi/Uber cars for a reason.
They are the ones paving the way for the rest of us. They pay to build the economies of scale that enables prices to come down. If they didn't buy them, prices would never come down. That is why government subsedises these new technologies early on, they incentivise people to buy these things and stuff like solar panels to create a growing market in which prices can come down. Once prices come down to reasonable levels the market takes over and the growth pushes prices down further.
@@baronvonlimbourgh1716 Absolutely agree, this is why I don't want to be the one paying to pave the way. I will wait for the leaps in technology and the market forces to take over.
@@Mink510 Where? Last time I looked, a Tesla was going for approx 1.5x the sticker price used when compared to a similar IC type car. Even if the cars where the same price, I know I can get 10+ years out of my V6, , I know people replacing/repairing EV batteries after 5 years at costs of tens of thousands. Not cheaper, yet.
@@VoidOfDarkness9 This is not the case which can be checked by real statistics. Its a racist smear promoted by a person who makes a living producing content for the anti Chinese segment of western racists called serpentza (captain apartheid) and probably a few Tesla stock holders. BYD in fact have the safest least likely to burn battery which makes this campaign really illustrate the desperation in western racists.
Western import restrictions and a few vehicle battery fires are all it's going to take to kill this wave. I'm skeptical they will be able to meet north American safety and quality standards while still hitting a viable price point that will overcome consumer aversion to Chinese made vehicles.
China alone took up 26% of Tesla's global sales 2022. Thatz why Tesla is opening a second factory there. General Motors sold more cars in China than US in 2022. American EV market is not as important as China's.
@FTD the average car price in the US is 50k. It's about 1/4 that in china. Sometimes, it's not about the number of units, but rather the premium you can collect.
@@MorRobots politics is more likely to be the blockade, Chinese firms never stop showing their “ingenuities” around regulation and NAFTA. As long as they can produce the vehicles in North America instead of import from China.
If you actually watched the video, you'd know that leading Chinese brands already have affordable cars with 5 star EuroNCAP safety ratings being sold in Europe. They are also being very well received in the UK and Australia. The main challenge they would face in the US is ignorance and willful disregard of facts displayed my most Americans
@@teoengchin I did watch the video. One car passed the EuroNCAP standards, and it was the top end of the market sector. Chinese equipment manufacturing at cut rate costs has never yielded good results when it comes to quality, reliability, and durability. All of those factors take time to be properly assessed. It took KIA 20 years to manufacture a decent vehicle. The first Japanese cars were also shit and Japan did not have a reputation for poor quality goods. China on the other hand has only very recently managed to produce goods on their own that are slightly better that crap. China has a huge QA problem, particularly when there is no third party QA entity ensuring they don't produce crap. When a China based company is offering vehicles at a fraction of the price, well bellow the BOM cost of other manufactures... yeah something smells like 2 week old rice. Look I'm not about to convince you otherwise, I just hope Xi and the CCP actually pay you for your efforts here.
In the West we fundamentally underestimated China for the first decade of this century, which I would attribute to a neo-colonial/racist mentality that poor or 'underdeveloped' countries fundamentally exist to provide us with cheap labor and are incapable of improving socioeconomically to the degree that Western countries improved in the 20th century. I was a child between 2000-2010 and I remember that basically the only impression of China that I was exposed to (by teachers who had visited, the media, popular discourse) was that it was the world's factory, severely polluted, and generally an industrial subsidiary of our society. As it turns out China was not just sitting on the unprecedented flood of Western capital, investment, manufacturing capacity/technology and trade integration that was occurring, but rather learning, developing, and growing. Now China has a whole new set of problems, that of an overly-industrialized society with too many people, demographic issues, and major growing pains. I think that the US is correct strategically to reshore industry, compete on next-generation technology, and upgrade our infrastructure. But we as humans now face global, civilizational problems. I wish we could work together instead of sticking with the petty nationalism from previous centuries.
Without a decent network of dealers this wont be easy. Tesla was a different story since 1. they actually offered something new and 2. doing that they had a lot of help from the media. And still I would not bet that they survive the next 10 years since most of the old brands offer EVs now and there are a lot of disappointed Tesla-owners who realised what sort of crap they bought.
Nah, if I have option of spending 60k on Tesla / VW, or 15k on Chinese car, Chinese car will win big time. Price makes miracles and if Chinese companies will be willing to sell spare parts and provide repair manuals, existing car repair shops can take over dealership role.
@@borek772 Just that a 15K car cant be the same as a 60K car. It just cant. Forget this business-blabla and look at the technical facts. Salaries and scale are factors but they are not the only ones. Also the old brands have lot of know-how in optimisation/ production so they can compensate for higher salaries to a certain point.
@@joansparky4439 Uhm, yep. I've never seen a hype train go faster than media pushing Tesla's mediocre-to-bad crap. Even today Tesla's absolute dogsh*t repairability and upsell scam are kept out of autoblogs. And how crappy the media are is shown by Dutch magazine Autoweek, which whines and cries about BYD's cars screaming "What data do they send to their Chinese overlords huh!" as a downside. But Tesla's privacy policy of "Hahaha stoopid eurotrash, there is no privacy, we OWN you" is never even mentioned. The fact that outside of the US you can't enforce the Tesla upsell-scam? Never mentioned. While this means that if ANY Tesla owner has an accident, they will be left thousands out of pocket because they have to pay the upsell price, but insurance only pays the real price.
Actually, just to be clear, the top selling car is a joint venture between Wuling, SAIC and GM. Further, VW is the top selling brand in China with all its various models/ventures.
@@elc6895 You are saying that including 2023, BYD has surpassed VW. However, doesn't VW own Audi and Porshe etc.? Are those included in the total, because those two brands in particular are popular in China.
@@Storm4155 your earlier comment was on brand, BYD has overtaken VW brand in Q1 but don't think so on VW group. No easy feat for anyone to beat VW brand, it has long and very strong footing in China. VW is definitely trying to wrangle back their brand lead in their biggest market. As for Wuling, it's no longer the top selling model in China but their sales is still strong. Very competitive markets, good for consumers.
Was in Australia and went to the BYD store in Sydney - these cars are awesome. Also saw tons of Chinese brands in the Middle East. Expect Japanese & Korean brands to lose a ton of share, if not everyone else
I don’t think Chinese EV will ever go into US market, National Security will just destroy all the effort any manufacturer put in. I think they will just stick with Xiaomi model, everywhere but US.
The Chinese should not try to reinvent the wheel. The Japanese and Koreans tried to build decent conventional cars over and over again as long as it took them to get there and then some. After that they made experiments like the much easier to build EVs and of course they succeeded since after all ... they are just much easier to build. If you can build a great combustion-car you can build a great battery-car. Its as simple as that. Also the Chinese dont have the long breath of the Jap./Kor. since in their economy there is a new fcking thing going on every four years wich is poison to long lasting projects like building up a car-brand.
If your running out of ideas, perhaps a video on the power semiconductor industry that enabled the ability to make EVs due to the technology advancements of insulated gate bipolar transistors (IGBTs), IGCTs, thyristors, and gate turn-offs (GTOs) . It wasn't long ago that semiconductors could not handle such energy. The industry is not just because one man decided it was so, it was because of his vision and the timing of the industry to produce the components.
China is increasingly making its presence felt in the global market by expanding its production and export of electric vehicles (EVs), and there are indications that they may focus on airplanes in the future. Meanwhile, our politicians are engaged in competitive campaigns to secure re-election.
Aerospace is a much harder market to crack, the total amount of learned capital is at least an order of magnitude greater than in cars. It's also unlikely to see a "leapfrog" technology (like electrification) that allows new participants into the market.
In Australia in the past six months the perception of EVs has been taking a hit. Higher electricity prices, rapidly inflating insurance policy prices for EVs, poor resell potential, and looming restrictions in parking lots and apartment buildings due to the fire risks. Firefighters were even talking about boycotting EV fires because of the risk of heavy mental contamination as the new asbestos level health threat. Our government says we have to spend a trillion in tax payers money to build up our grid to support replacing ICE vehicles with all EVs.
Kinda old data though. The most impressive parts are really in 2022 and 2023, especially for BYD. The stepping up from cheaper EVs to higher end is very strong.
What happens when your Chinese EV needs parts and service? Accidents happen every day and when electrical parts stop working and you need a trained tech with access to replacement parts or you have a useless pile of scrap metal. If Harbor Freight is typical, then parts are simply not available.
it feels like whoever first figures out how to male a car without a single LCD panel in the cabin will make a killing lol remember buttons? the things you can safely press while driving a car ?
You forgot the most important part - expired LiFePo batteries patent. This is the key reason why they start massively export the vehicles. Before they ignored these patents but they could not export. Now they can export without royalty.
@@Sam-kv3iv LMAO, there are some dumbass who believe that Winnie pooh can't exist in China, even if they only need to search the vlogs on the Internet to see how many there are in the Shanghai Disney store.
@@lordlee6473 Taiwanese engineer owns the patent and he set up factory in China. By the way some Canadian company claim LiFe was their invention which seems unlikely.
Two weeks ago i bought a Tesla Model Y in Montreal Canada and it's coming in from China. I'm not sure if Canada imposes tariffs for cars coming in from China.
I have been anticipating the shock that the Chinese auto industry is going to give the rest of the world for about 5 years. I suspect we will see torrid decade for European manufacturers from 2025. The advent of the EV is the most disruptive event in the car industry in the last 50 years and China is well placed to take advantage of it.
In 2014, China launched its policy encouraging people to purchase EV cars. I knew it will on trend. Been holding BYD and Tesla stock since Nov 2014. I haven't sold any shares of them until today.
Because European are reluctant doing , Chinese tech are the same tech they taught the Chinese do. Nothing more advance than them , just a good pricing. The same Japan factory in EU. No one asking for Japan tech there.
We need more smaller EV's. Not the tanks Tesla makes, so I am pretty happy with the Chinese competetion. Even if the cars aren't actually better, if they are cheaper the European and US brands need to catch up... Unless we ban them because "China is Scary"
I am seeing plenty of BYD on the road here in Sydney. 80% of all EVs are imported from China. Too many drone brains brainwashed by American media and their politicians.
Because EV does not have complicated engines and transmissions, its reliability is improved, and its repair and maintenance are extremely simple. I think this is why BYD is not eager to export their hybrid vehicles before they have fully established a service system in overseas markets. BYD also produces good hybrid car
The BS6 getting a *one star safety rating* was a sales disaster, but the BS6 was a traditional ICE vehicle. The engine blocks of ICE vehicles make them inherently more dangerous. However, the Chinese manufactures of EVs will have it much easier this time because EVs are fundamentally safer than ICE vehicles. EVs are more stable due to their lower center of gravity, are able to have safer crumple zones and stronger cages, and are radically less combustable than ICE vehicles.
The main reason chinese buy electric is because the registration fee which in some cities is more than the car itself is free for EVs. BYD has had a lot of issues with battery safety which will be an export concern.
In the decades past China learnt from Singapore and Mr Lee Kuan Yew, now the Singapore government ought to learn from the People's Republic regarding national support for the EV market - this should have been easier for a little city state like us, instead we're now lagging behind
How’s that different from US. I bought a car in 2017 and got both federal tax credit and state rebate, total up to $9000; and sticker to drive on car pool lane. I wish we have more affordable EV choices in US like China.
What's crazy is how the Chinese figured out how to get good design, the BYD Seagul is probably one of the sexiest small cars I've seen while it's rather hard to get a good looking small car...
I wouldn't expect decent quality or after-market service, plus...you know...all the coal-fired power plants China is building...China is a global fraud operation.
@@sirfer6969 BYD just massively arrived in Europe so we'll have the answer soon I guess.... I've seen and seated inside a Han and an Atto 3 and they both felt like good cars at first glance... but yeah the Seagull will probably be more on the "lowcost side" probably just like the future Tesla Model 2....
Jon. Thank you for doing the Vingroup video. Can you do one on the rare earth (Neodymium and Praseodymium) used in making the REE permanent magnets vs the ferrite magnets and innovations in China with regards to EV powertrain magnets?
Tesla is busy to make a motor without all those materials you mention. But to just make a reluctance motor + hairpins made out of aluminum. So a motor without rare earth elements, and without copper !!!! imagen that!
@@SunnySzetoSz2000 Well i drive the Tesla Model 3 RWD LFP version. It uses around 130Wh/km most efficiënt EV on the market. And ADAC from Germany just said the Model 3 from their research is one of the most reliable cars in Germany. Its a pretty damn good car. He does deliver the best EV's.
They already were. They were going after the bus market and were running a big bus factory in California and doing well because they had an early mover advantage. So Congress banned all government purchases of BYD buses for “security” reasons, but mainly due to lobbying by Proterra and New Flyer. So I think Chinese companies have been intentionally avoiding the US auto market to avoid being Huaweid, as you pointed out.
Even Asianometry neglected some of the most important factors, many Chinese cities restrict ICE cars on road one working day every week by the last number on the plate. This makes many middle and uper class buy another EV for commuting. And the city I live completely forbids any ICE vehicle transport cargo downtown, this made all companies and personal doing businesses with cargo transportation completely changed their fleets. All taxes changed into EV of course. In China taxes are bought by the drivers as investment...
I'm skeptical for a couple reasons. First and foremost is that battery tech is already well optimized, and you need much much better battery tech for widespread adoption. We haven't been seeing much innovation for the better part of a decade now. Another big reason is in order to establish a presence in the US market, China would need to do what Japan did 50 years ago - put the plants in the US, closer to customers. Margins are just too thin for most cars just just build in the home country and export. There are other problems, lots of them.
I thought battery r&d was going quite well actually. They gone from the old fashion nickel cobalt lithium (that are expensive, rare) to lithium iron phosphate. They are researching method to make this chemistry even better and now are rolling out sodium battery later this year. I thought it was a pipe dream but it’s actually happening
Euro manufacturers focus on Mid and luxury market? China for low cost? Which is easier to do? Change from making Luxury to making cheap or for cheap to upgrade to luxury? Looking at the level of equipment in the 10 to 12000USD BYD Seagull ... I suspect the luxury EV market is in for a huge shackeup when the Chinese launch their luxury brands with the tight costing structures that they have developed for their currently affordable cars.
There have also been reports of a evergrande-style downfall now that the governement subsidies are ending - including BYD. I've seen reports of large number of cars abandoned out in the sticks by companies who produced non-functional cars just to pocket the subsidies. And also about BYD having terrible quality control and worse customer support. All in all, I'm doubtful they will amount to much in the international market.
They made several smelters in Indonesia. After the state banned the export of nickel and bauxite raw materials. The islands of Sulawesi and Halmahera have the world's largest nickel reserves.
they will be, given the size of the market and the fact they have leading tech. the industry just needs consolidation. price wars are happening now, in the next 5 years i expect to size the number of makers downsized.
The fact that China started late in all this, but that it has this development is nothing less than a miracle. What China needs is just time, which is precisely what the US is trying to take away from it.
I find it somewhat strange that your analysis did not consider the current automotive price wars in China and how most Chinese car manufacturers are currently selling cars at a loss. Do you think this will lead to high market consolidation over the next few years? And how might this affect exports?
They might find ground. But they will have a uphill battle. It is incredibly difficult for new brands to establish themselves. It takes several decades normally. But Tesla is a outlier. Also the fact it is Chinese will be a huge hindrance. Many nations around the world increasingly have a negative view of China according to various studies. People are willing to buy a lot from China. But a car is something else entirely.
Chinese imports will decimate the European vehicle industry. Besides dominating the material costs, the average Chinese worker own a 2-wheeled vehicle while the average Western worker own one of 4-wheels. The Total Cost of Ownership TCO of a humble car such as a Honda Civic is $10k US per year, more than the salary of a average Chinese worker. Vehicles are used on average one hour (5%) per day. When most people on a society own such expensive, but low-use overhead (more true of US than Europe) that society has a big inefficiency and a higher cost of living. When you factor in the infrastructure such as roads, parking spaces for businesses and garages for homes needed to support owning cars, it is no surprise that Western jobs get moved to Asia.
BYD = Bonfire You Drive. They keep lighting up all over the place like Trash bins in a riot. There's even been high end models where the airbags do not deploy during incidents.
"aggressive work practices" I'm going to email my old boss and let him know he wasn't risking my life and fingers for profit, he just had aggressive work practices.
I had a job like that, I had a very aggressive absentee policy.
😂😂
welcome to newspeak
One of my Indian friend who is in Import Export business (Import actually) with China owns 4 warehouses, 2 in China and the other 2 in India. According to him the work Chinese labour would do in 1 say without even asking, Indians would do in 3 days and that too with strict monitoring. This is the case of whole of East Asia and ASEAN is also pretty much similar.
Now you can weep about it if you want.
@@arminius6506 China does not have unions because it's a workers paradise. India has unions. Modi should make special economy zones where there are no unions.
Cars are getting very expensive in the UK and the rest of Europe. If they can come over and offer an EV for say £15k they will sell a lot of units.
Anything china involve will cheap like cake, solar, smartphone, now ev
Saying cheap prices are the only thing that matters is an oversimplification. People want cheap cars but not at the cost of reliability, tech, and all the conveniences they're used to. Just look at which trim level is typically the volume mover for car models. Usually it's the middle one, not the cheapest one.
Certainly in the UK, the biggest challenge is going to be getting enough electricity to charge them all.
A litre of petrol is about 8.9 kWh. Electric cars are about twice as efficient, so you need about 4 or 5kWh of electricity to replace each litre of petrol currently sold. We collect about £2bn per month in petrol tax at a rate of 52.95p/litre, so about 4bn litres sold per month, or about 20TWh of electricity that would be required to replace it. Current annual demand (2021 figures) is 334.2TWh or about 28TWh per month (more in winter, less in summer), so we would need to double that.
Also we would need to double grid capacity, and likely more than double capacity in residential areas.
@@katrinabryce Considering that people will not switch all at once to EVs it's not really a serious issue. Gradual improvements are not really that difficult to accomplish. You also have to keep in mind that trucks have no hope of being replaced by EVs and they represent a bit under half of all fuel used. (I'm assuming you used petrol as a generic term here).
A more serious issue for me is the demand for fast charging which is a much bigger deal. You can definitely accomodate the slow rampup in production of energy but you can't really say the same for the electrical grid. Considering fast charging will be most in demand in cities where electrical infrastructure upgrades are going to be most expensive and it's not looking good for EVs in such places.
@@katrinabryce I expect them to introduce an electricity tax at some point on EV's. I can't think they will just let fuel duty revenue they are coming in go but I'm not sure hwo they would even do that as people would charge at home a lot of the time if they could. Could just tax all electricity but it's already very expensive or just tax public charge points but that would just put people off using them unless they had to. Or just charge from a normal socket point. Might just charge you for the miles you did in tax every MOT or something, that would be easier although doing all of this will just keep people from moving around so much which has it's negatives and advantages I guess.
I was in China over Easter 2023. I had a look at some of their EVs which were in display in a shopping centre. They looked quite impressive, and priced the same as an equivalent petrol car ($40k for a luxury car).
I would not trust any Chinese car with out a couple years of on the road reviews. It's always about the show... but no go in China.
What I mean is I've been to China a couple times and I'd ask about all these car brands I'd never heard of. My Chinese friends would tell me nobody wants to buy a Chinese car.. they are junk.
@@HandFromCoffin
Well that's the thing: China is so far ahead on EV's that we have those road reviews now.
Also strangely enough that never stopped anyone from buying a Tesla, even though they score 1980's safety ratings, illegal and dangerous 'autopilot' beta software, spying on your data, no parts available, etc etc etc.
The reality is people only knock Chinese vehicles because of Tucker Carlson-syndrome.
Still they are tariffs and Chinese market would get differential pricing nonetheless so pricing in Chinese market cannot be used as reference. EU for instance is very protective with their automobile manufacturing
@@nehcooahnait7827 BYD's latest entry to the EU market, the Dolphin, can be a reference. While the tariffs, shipping, handling and brokerage added ~€10k to the EU price compared to the Chinese home market where it's priced very modestly (~€16k), they also enlarged the vehicle and upsized the battery and motor, so that 1. the EU customers can get more for the extra they paid; 2. it gets to compete in a different category. A lot of options in the toolbox when you have the competitive edge. I imagine this will be a standard practice among Chinese EV exports.
China cars burn really well. Just look on youtube. Burning cars everywhere.
Chinese companies are targeting Hungary for their EU manufacturing base, CATL is building a new plant their, NEO is building a plant to build their chargers and BYD was also looking for such opportunities in Hungary.
Do you know what’s going on in Debrecen? I have heard that people are not happy and protesting against building the factory, this was a few months back and since then I have not came across news about this
Yes Hungary because it's the most corrupt country in EU. They chose that country for that. So they can bribe their way .
In Malaysia, Chinese EV maker BYD is gradually building a presence, it seems a few more Chinese brands are coming in the near future too.
Im seeing a lot geely cars here in the philippines.
Poor Malaysian Those car Made by Animal Communist for Animal to drive
yes tesla cant even compete now
Using Europe as a Chinese car company export boom is a bad example since the local dealership in the region hike up the price so much that not much people is buying it. Example for export boom are more suitable for region like Oceania, Southeast Asia ect. BYD ranked 1st in Israel, Thailand, Malaysia ect. 2nd place in Australia and New Zealand behind Tesla. What make it more impressive is that they've only been in those country for less than a year and they've already achieved this much
Yes, electric cars in China are cheaper domestically, but I find that they can be 1 or 2 times more expensive in Europe, which makes them less competitive
@@dttth7192 Then those companies need to setup factories in Europe just like all other brands do....
@@HermanWillems the problems is that europe politics make it not very friendly to invest in there
@@starman275 so a full on Dictator is more friendlier than a democractic society who care about human worker rights?????
@@HermanWillems umm, from the Chinese perspectives it’s much safer to build factories in China because the gov supported them.
Whereas the west became increasingly hostile to Chinese investment lately.
There's a huge gap in the UK market for a cheap & cheerful EV that frankly only the Chinese are capable of filling. Their latest sub-£10 EVs, like the BYD Seagull & Wuling Bingo, would be an instant hit if they were launched here. They would disrupt the market, just as the original Mini did in 1959. As someone that barely drives 3,000 miles a year, a £35k+ EV makes absolutely zero sense. However a basic, £10k EV, even one with limited range, WOULD make sense, especially if you kept your existing (& fully depreciated) ICE car as back-up for those occasional long drives. TBH, for me, the cost of running a tiny EV would be negligible for half the year as my existing solar array could feed the car's battery for nowt. I think it is wrong for the West to continually bash China as being somehow 'evil'. They're only doing what we've done umpteen times in the past 300 years. Until such time as WWIII breaks out, I'd happily buy stuff from China. It benefits me & it benefits them. Simples!
Simples! Written by a Chinese bot.
@@BlueRidgeBubble Says the Far-right nut-job bot!
Not even China drives Chinese cars. I would not trust my life with these automobiles. Sometimes you get exactly what you pay for.
@@BungieStudios China self-evidently & increasingly DOES drive Chinese cars as do us Brits. You would not trust your life in a Chinese car but presumably are just fine & dandy living in a country plagued by out-of-control Fentanyl deaths, weekly school shootings & mall shootings, devastating tornadoes & hurricanes, extreme weather events & (and this is one for the next 20 years) lethal acts of Far-right domestic terrorism. Oh, and I think you'll find you ALWAYS get what you pay for. It's one of the basic tenets of western Capitalism.
@@BungieStudios you are delusional if you think that Chinese doesn't use their EV cars, when they are selling more EVs than Germany and only are behind Tesla.
I was just coming back from China and was riding in a lot of these cars. The Xiao Peng P7 looks really well made and I wish they'd export more to europe. I think we will see much more chinese cars on european streets in the future. They are adapting and improving FAST. Not just with cars.
What chinese cities do you recommend visiting to witness such developments for a first time visitor ?
@@k-cShanghai, Shenzhen, but any of the tier 1 cities.
No way am I buy a Chinese car.
@@richardchristy5408 People said that to Japanese cars in 70s too 😂😂😂
@@directxxxx71 Japanese cars of the 70s rarely spontaneously combust.
Speed of iterations in China are about 2x the speed of improvements coming out or South Korea. In 23 years as a driver, I drove approx 250 different cars, with 6 of them exceeding 50,000 km. BYD taxi from just 7 years ago compared with what BYD makes today makes you think are they the same company? Xpeng, Zeekr, Nio, BYD, Hongqiao, Ora, Smart (yes, Smart is now a Chinese brand running on Chinese platform), Polestar (Geely again), Tesla - all these upstarts are up-ending the established vendors from anywhere in the world. This goes especially for brands like Ford - Mustang Mach-E can compete with Tesla on panel gaps, but not with range or quality of software. Sodium-Ion batteries are going to change the whole world - 1000 km range at 60-70% weight of conventional Model Y brand are a game changer and a death bed for majority of ICE vehicles.
What does this mean for western brands? Tesla will continue to kill it. Mercedes Group will skyrocket. The rest? Adapt (new technology), Scale (improve) or become irrelevant.
The name of the modern car company Tesla is a reference to the world's first electric car that was invented by Nikola Tesla in the 1930s.
ua-cam.com/video/EorF01qUnak/v-deo.html
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(1) @6:02. Nope. Their prices go from around US$5000 to US$150,000.
For example, the best selling luxury EV in 2022 was the HiPhi X. It sells for around $100,000 for the base model.
And now, we have the BYD Yangwang U8 and U9. The U8 is selling for around $150,000. And is an instant best seller.
(2) @1:11. EVs and New Energy Vehicles (NEVs) are not the same thing.
EVs are pure electric while NEVs include both EVs and plug in hybrids.
Here is a short intro video of the HiPhi X, the best selling luxury EV for 2022. (It's around US$100,000) :
ua-cam.com/video/MLffQ9ESSTI/v-deo.html
I'll give you 50 for it
Really, this is a story about how slowly the leading car manufacturers were at adopting EV and how buyouts have ultimately hurt innovation. Now new players are seeing opportunity to take a bite in the global market share. Short sightedness.
Yep like Kodak and digital photography...
They are not short sight. Traditional cars needs completely supply chain to stand in market. So its hardly new comemer to come in unless big govt's hidden pushing it such American govt are supporting Vietnam Vinfast car to born.
A bite sure but not a very big one. Cars are the second largest single purchase many in the West ever make; most people are going to put their trust in known, established brands rather than a small startup. Even if the price is amazing Chinese brands will need to convince buyers they're reliable, safe and have sufficicent infrastructure to support their vehicles. Look at what happened to Yugo or Renault when it tried to enter the US market
@@fuckduncan3754 French car is a bit out of American's vassal supporting custom so it has not future in US market. Look at US market , Who is flourished is all US vassal's car brand japan , Korea and the new comer Vietnam's Vinfast. Its not what you think. Who will buy a unkonwn ,unestablished car brands? But American hidden vassal support system will make this Vietnam car flourish in its market soon. Like they had done award to Korea car decades ago. So don't think Chinese car would enter US market. They know your hidden rogue system well. They aren't interested in.
There's some lagging data. LG isn't #2 anymore, they have lost second place to BYD, and I don't think they're ever getting it back.
This is mostly due to GM, one of their customer, kept on having their car Chevy bolt recalled multiple times due to potential fire issue, costing LG Chem a huge amount of market share.
LG made batteries are time bombs. They must be heavily subsidized by the Korean government to survive this long by probably providing aggressive pricings to EV makers
@@lordlee6473 Each dime Korean govy paid , its American govt hidden paid.
>> There's some lagging data. LG isn't #2 anymore, they have lost second place to BYD, and I don't think they're ever getting it back.
@@tooltalk Lie,the truth is that LG's batteries are not competitive in China, and their technology is far behind CALT.
LG's battery technology lags far behind BYD's.
Which LG battery is comparable to BYD's Blade battery? Why is there far more Western media coverage of BYD's blade battery than LG's battery?
It's the batteries that really add to the cost. Now if China could push a standard battery pack, they could ship cheap cars with the battery pack, a separate market of competition, in which they could also compete.
But local safety compliance testing and certification can and will make some markets less palatable to penetrate, let alone the quick flip of any trade sanctions, hence splitting the car and battery side into two, becomes even more prudent.
What are you talking about? Why they need to ship a standard battery pack?
@@ravenkk4816 His brain has somehow detached from the existence of the global resource prices f.e. LI. Maybe some words like "standard battery pack" make it easier for delusions to break free?
I don't know. I don't know even where to get those "standard BS packs" for free ... Hehehehe
I hate it so much, when these scammers even don't give concrete information where to get the actual hardware/software/unicorns/snake-oil. The get dumber and dumber, I think, heheheheh:)
@@ravenkk4816China, as a major producer and consumer of electric vehicles, has the potential to lead the way in establishing a standard battery pack for the industry. By doing so, China could not only benefit its own domestic market but also promote the adoption of electric vehicles in other countries, such as the EU.
After all, carmakers make cars. Odd how they seized the chance to make every battery pack hard/impossible to replace, and all very custom.
At least China has an opportunity to shake the market up and capitalize upon that natural transition by forcing it thru consumer demand and prices will do that.
Might see a price war on such a battery pack, which would, for China, be easier to ride out and with that, suit them economically far better.
Even with local safety compliance you're always rolling the dice of ten million in perfect conditions with batteries which can prevent cascades several orders of magnitude more rare.
Sodium batteries are almost as dangerous but with their extra mass present less of a catastrophic outcome. At least sodium gives you some warning before going poof into a fire that can be easily be controlled by bathing the area in inert gas like Krypton after the area is cleared. How many fire trucks have that capability?
@@miinyoo Battery issues would be for battery makers to deal with. Carmakers would just be making cars with standard battery compartments and what brand/make of battery you marry that up with will ultimately come down to you, or dealers, who will offer a choice.
Equally, some better battery tech comes along, well, standard battery pack specs so, be easier to upgrade later on. Something of a win for the eco tickboxing.
Tbh i cant wait for my 10k EV in europe. Im holding out buying a car because i expect a flood of chinese evs. Even got a xiaomi phone and diched the korean brands.Very happy with my decision.
It's going to be hard because importing and shipping cars to Europe are expensive. Maybe they'll find a way
@@Rex-ww4cw The way is BRI.
i love selling my data to china at the cost of a shittier phone ! ! !
@@Rex-ww4cw The way is Chinese companies setting up factories in the EU. CATL is already doing it.
Boom in more ways than you expect
Kinda like the way the Seagull looks. Would definitely consider it at that price in the US for a commuter vehicle.
impossible for the Chinese EVs to come to the US given the trade barriers the US erected.
I know that brand. Mazda.
Working in the automotive sector and can comfirm, the chinese are going apeshit with their development. They've got really big and advanced EV production.
There's a mistake at 9:25 where you put Slovenia in the 4th place by value of imported Chinese EVs. The number you put in the graph is like 1,5 Billion USD for Slovenia, which is unrealistic considering the country's population is around 2.1 million. I checked our govt' statistical office and for 2022 the imports amounted to 6.564.297 EUR (similar number in USD). This accounts for all vehicles imported from China, either PHEV, HEV and BEV, without electric scooters and mopeds (another 2,5 million EUR roughly).
Wonderful episode. I follow this market very closely and I still learned from watching your video. Just one correction, Chinese EV exports in 2022 was $20.09 billion, not $20.9 billion. This was BEVs only, PHEVs would add another $2.5 billion.
In February 2023, 3 of the top 5 EV sellers in the world were Chinese, BYD, SGMW and GAC. BYD, the largest, was bigger than the next three (Tesla, SGMW and GAC) combined. Also, your data on battery market share was quite old, BYD has since passed LG.
I think BYD will become the world's largest automaker in a few years. Geely is also very competitive and needs to strengthen the development of global markets. Tesla has good technology, but the model update speed is too slow. I don't think cars can be completely analogous to the iPhone. The market cannot be occupied simply by relying on a few explosive models. Different people have very different demands for cars. Tesla pursues extreme cost control, but sacrifices some experience and diversity, which may also become an stumbling block for Tesla's development.
@@adamesd3699 Learn some Chinese, then do data analysis on your own.
Total vehicle sales of Telsa and BYD from January to March in Chinese market.
Tesla：137,429；
BYD：552,076；
Subdivided vehicle models（Price Unit: 1000 RMB）:
Sedan: Tesla Model 3（Price Range: 231.9-331.9） = 42,782；
Sedan: BYD Han（Price Range: 209.8-331.8） = 37,817；
Sedan: BYD Seal（Price Range: 212.8-289.8） = 19,573；
Sedan: BYD Qin Plus（Price Range: 99.8-165.8） = 79,239；
SUV: Tesla Model Y（Price Range: 263.9-363.9） = 94,647；
SUV: BYD Tang（Price Range: 282.8-342.8） = 32,525；
SUV: BYD Frigate 07（Price Range: 202.8-289..8） = 17,927；
SUV：BYD Song Plus（Price Range: 154.8-218.8） = 102,826；
SUV：BYD Song Pro（Price Range: 134.0-159.0） = 38,589；
SUV：BYD Yuan Plus（Price Range: 134.0-162.0） = 62,528；
MPV：Denza D9（Price Range: 335.8-445.8） = 24,161；
Not on Sell: BYD YangWang U8 （Price Range: 1098.0） = 13,000+；（Pre-Oders in 2 days）
@@jxl594 These were Chinese reliability surveys filled out in China. They are either accurate or not accurate. Are you saying they were not accurate? I’m not making any assumptions about their accuracy. I’m just trying to understand your point.
@@adamesd3699 The sales data shows that the prices and sales volume of BYD's high-end models are comparable to Tesla's, and it is not true that BYD only occupies the low-end market. In addition, new models such as BYD Seal and Denza D9 were recently launched and have also achieved good sales. BYD is actually eating into Tesla's market share.
I visited the local Lotus dealer at the weekend, the cars looked great, good value.
In Israel some Chinese brands were successful although not in a consistent way.
They sold well in the medium to large crossover segment in which they had the highest price advantage. Ora and Leapmotor failed here because of the tax structure on conventional cars (small cars have lower tax rate so EVs are uncompetitive in this segment).
Regarding Tesla, they are shipped from China right now and it shows in the graph but are going to be from Germany when Giga Berlin is at full capacity. Tesla sold mostly model 3 here as the model Y is still too expensive.
The shortage of cars boosted the EV specially from China and if regulations will allow this will grow drastically in the coming years, no one can compete with Batteries 🪫 from China, scale and local government push, and this is the no1 cost factor in every EV car, and the advantage they will leverage…
@Formosan i don't know anything about scooters so can't say. Taiwanese stuff in general is rare here except the ubiquitous Taiwanese chips inside almost any high end electronics device
BYD was the 4th best selling car in israel last month.
@@BetterLifeCreations Of course other countries can compete with China once China is blocked the price from other countries falls as volume increases you can see how US tariffs work well in boosting domestic companies, US steel went up after placing tariff on Chinese Steel. There is no doubt that Tariffs work its just a matter of actually doing it.
Everyone is talking about the problem with Chinese cars, or not buying Chinese cars, but the future market sales will tell us the answer.
The BS6. I'm still laughing...
Economic margin wise, you might have missed the benefit these EV firms got in the form of Carbon Credits and that market is gonna be ridiculously profitable for them.
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Here in Oslo, Norway I barely see any Chinese cars. Mostly see Teslas, German, Korean, and Japanese cars. I heard in a podcast that dealers here barely sell any Chinese cars. The savings does not make up for the lower quality and an aggressive China for the average consumer.
Lower quality? And, aggressive China? Who's prolonging the war in Ukraine by supplying arms and money to the detriment of your fellow countrymen??
@@len-pp7jc
Obvious wumao. Go back to your side of the firewall
That's because the local dealership in the Europe hike up the price of the Chinese car a lot. They're doing very good in places like Australia, New Zealand, Thailand and Israel
And horrible winter, when battery capacity will drop by 50%
@@yoppindia that won't happen when sodium battery is on the market. Pretty sure BYD seagull is using sodium battery. I think zeekr car too with CATL new sodium battery.
謝謝！
Funky Cat is a great name. But it doesn’t really look like a Porsche.
it's more like it stole the the front design from the Mini. Inside the controls also look chrome and a bit similar to a Mini. The back though looks quite different.
There is nothing wrong with the government providing the incentives to research and promote new technologies. We had been there. Every year some agencies dole out millions in research money.
Like you said, Tesla seems to be going for volume. It's interesting to see where they will go with pricing. Even after their price cuts they still have large margins, and they continue to work on cost reduction in vehicle manufacturing. I've read rumors the Model 3 is actually more expensive to build than the Y due to improvements in manufacturability with the Y.
Going for volume will undercut Tesla's whole brand tho. At that point they're just another EV player. Tesla's whole schtick was to be the Apple of the car world. Without their premium identity, what do they have to sell themselves with that other companies don't?
@@ArawnOfAnnwn do you consider Apple low volume?
@@ArawnOfAnnwnApple might be the "premium" brand but they still have volume. They sold the most phones in China 2022
Tesla will be focus on premium software, tesla will be big data company, than car manufacturer
@@ArawnOfAnnwn I think u hv no idea what u're talking abt. Tesla doesn't need a premium identity when it's beating the Toyotas and Hondas of this world with such a wide margin that it still has room to cut prices to fulfill its mission statement. Do u think their mission statement is to protect their premium identity ? Read it and you might learn something ....
Overall this is a very good analysis. However, there are several things I'd like to point out. First, this video focus too much on Europe market, however Chinese manufactures pays a lot attention on Asean countries and BRI countries. Second, China car exports really took off after the covid lockdown lifted, numbers increased dramatically after the reopen. Third, the car export is currently limited by logistic and China started building large numbers of ships for car transport. We will see big increase when the logistic problem solved.
Good points.
去年订购了四艘汽车运输船
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They think of their market is the prime target. They still think of themselves as the center of the world. but the world is changing.
While I have no doubt that Chinese EVs will be eating European EVs in developing market for breakfast, I wonder if their businesses are sustainable long term. EVs are complicated and expensive, profitability might be a long and winding road, which requires even more subsidies. As the size of the companies increase to reduce cost from economic of scales, so will the weight of the subsidies.
That asides, it's annoying that instead of building mass transit network and transport infrastructure like China, the developing world is buying Chinese EVs and build more roads. That's going to cost more down the line.
EV's are far less complicated than ICE cars and increasingly no more expensive (everywhere in Europe the TCO of an EV is already below that of a comparable ICE model - the slightly higher purchase price is more than offset by the savings in fuel and maintenance). Most developed country governments (the US one is the big exception) are winding back their subsidies as no longer needed.
ICE cars are more complex, but we have over 100 years of experience building ICE cars at volume/scale
@@autohmae ICE cars less complex? Dozens of internal exploosions a second, wildly varying torque demanding very complex transmissions, FAR more moving parts. You're kidding.
@@autohmae Wrong wrong wrong.
@@autohmae What? ICE engines less complex? Yeah maybe a simple two stroke... Yet a modern ICE in your car is much more complex than a battery powered EV. I mean the tolerances and materials used. The air fuel mixture! The oil! All the moving parts working in unison over bumps and in different atmospheres. It is insane how complex a modern car is and that doesn't include things like the exhaust flow or catalytic converter. Ugh... Transmissions are insane!
Sorry man I think you're over complicating EVs somehow.
It is because we've been using ICE engines for 100 years that we can make the damn things so well. Battery technology or chemistry really held back electric cars.
Now however thst is changing. I hope I get to see iron oxide magnets get incorporated into stuff. They - in theroy - can make the strongest permanent magnets which can revolutionize a lot of industries! Make a lot things more efficient or wickedly powerful small motors.
What of the video's I have seen where apartment and condo buildings in China will not even allow some of those EV brands to park inside due to spontaneous battery disassembly issues?
Man imagine how scaredyou'll be when you learn how explosive gas is!
I think you're talking about chevy bolt in America
Yes this is true. So many BYDs are exploding all over China
BYD batteries are exploding even when the car is not charging and is simply parked for hours
BYD are having unpredictable and unexpected random seat belt clip explosions happening in the interior of these cars? It looks like when an iPhone explodes in someone's pocket?
BYD have major issues with collision air bags not deploying what so ever.....even in very serious accidents! This is a major recall issue..... Yet the CCP is hiding this from everyone across the world! People's safety is highly at risk!
I will never ever ever ride in a Chinese electric car! I don't care about how good the claims are; I don't care what awards they get nominated for; I don't care how much people tell me they love their BYD and how awesome it is........ nothing is going to change my mind when I've seen footage of thousands of these cars spontaneously combusting within seconds!
You literally have no time to escape the vehicle before BOOM!
The electrical fires are so rapid and so intense that it's miracle that people haven't been more seriously injured or killed? Like every single one of these incidents people are lucky to escape with their lives from what looks like a minor fender bender or not even a crash at all ...... Simply driving along the highway and nekminit you see smoke? You got seconds to pull over and exit the vehicle before your life is in danger!
These EV explosions are so violent that they remind me of seeing an electrical sub station explosion? And that isn't an exaggeration either.
Btw I'm not anti ev either, I'm anti Chinese EVs because they are dangerous and none of us realise is yet? We are all blinded by the sparkle and jazz of marketing of new EVs but neglect to keep in mind that China is a communist country that will 100% control the narrative, hide the problems so that they can sell more and more to the west to make more money! They don't care about reputation that means....... the Chinese are exploiting the policies imposed on us by the UN climate BS. They know western countries are "forced" to purchase electric cars, and because there truely is only 1 other competitor on the stage (let's be honest Tesla are the only company succeeding in this space - they also don't need to keep dual production lines in operation as ICE production starts declining i.e. 1 factory) so China has got a massive advantage by selling us poor quality EVs with no incentive to improve the quality at all..... And all incentive focused on keeping maximum production output! Safety, China couldn't give a shit about safety it's all about profit!
@@shane864 Ask the fire services of New York City about e-bikes. 220 e-bike fires last year and a few were fatal. Scale that up to Tesla sized batteries. And some of those brands of Chinese EV will be safety deficient. Doubt many gasoline tanks catch fire spontaneously in ones garage if they are not running.
Now those plans are beginning to come to fruition. The latest news from XPeng is that it is now selling two of its models in Europe! The XPeng G9 SUV and the XPeng P7 sedan can now be ordered in the countries of Denmark, Norway, the Netherlands, and Sweden. These are a few of the hottest EV markets in the world.
The refreshed P7 is very nice. G9 might be a bit too pricy. But that new G6 just unveiled at the Shanghai Auto Show will be the key vehicle to see if Xpeng will survive and become a profitable company.
Ford, General Motors, and Toyota used to laugh at Tesla and China.
Now they are 10 years behind in the EV industry and trying to catch up.
There are a "lot" of chinese SUVs in Norway. But few people are gambling on them. They cost 60k-75k. And for that price you can get something from a more reputable and well known brand.
I have a two year old one from a very reputable European brand who was mentioned in this video, and even though it's very good mechanically, it has had a lot of electronics/software bugs.
Even though I have been extra unfortunate with 12+ visits to the workshop, it seems like other owners have troubles with them of varying rate.
My friend with a Chinese car(also mentioned in the video) bought slightly later, have had no such bugs, and have worked perfectly. It seems like this is the general experience with that brand.
@@MalawisLilleKanalChinese simply is in the EV game longer and in with greater government support early on
I think many European brand enter the ev game later than chinese one
They didn't expect people will buy their cars for 60K+, the price are just showing to the consumers in China, saying:"see, the foreigners are buying the same car with a double/triple price". It's all about branding.
That is the tariffs at fault unfortunately
@@jackchou1425lol. That’s truck load of BS. GTFOH
LOOOOOL The Qin line made me fall on the floor laughing!
Meanwhile, in Taiwan, we have to wait for Foxtron (Foxconn Honhai) to introduce their vehicles in the markets, although they have the model T circulating, we still need to see them supplying other segments. It would be also interesting to bring Stellantis into this conversation.
納智捷還活著嗎？
These going to be bursting into flames here??
The traditional car industry is at a very similar point as they were in the late 60's/early 70's when Japan started to export cars to the US/UK and Europe. And later also the Korean brands. I forced traditional car makers to adapt.
This time the traditional car industry has reacted too slowly IMO. I think a number of traditional car brands will go bankrupt. Then Chinese car industry might scoop up their production infra, adapt them to BEV production and conquer the European car market with good value for money BEV's.
Agree. In the 1970s Japanese cars were reliable and generally had good engines, but the design was awful. In addition, they were only competitive with regards to petrol engines, not with diesel (so only competed in 60% of the market, in diesel's heydays) Now Chinese cars look good too. Only drawback is lack of established dealerships. I think MG and BYD can make massive inroads into the market, and gain a large market share faster than the Japanese makers ever did.
Here in America, GM has been perpetually broke for 20+ years, Chrysler is effectively no more, and Ford is whining they can only survive with huge subsidies due to their "investment" into electric, even though they have hardly any electric vehicles to offer. This, despite focusing almost exclusively on the high-end, high-margin SUV market. If people love trucks and trucks make tons of money, where has all that money gone?
American car companies suck. I've had no reason to buy American since GM ruined Saturn.
It seems surreal, but yes, I do think there's a real possibility that local American brands may disintegrate. They have mismanaged themselves into oblivion and are no longer big enough to be "too big to fail."
There's a big difference. Chinese cars suck in build quality. I've seen many videos of BYD batteries just catching fire as in spontaneously combusting. Parked vehicles are just catching on fire. The Teslas have way fewer instances of that problem.
@@Waccoon You don't know anything about car companies. They're not broke. They all made billions in net profits in 2022 and have billions in liquidity.
@@dannydaw59 no actual data on that, just rumours and anecdotes (and a lot of vested interest from ICE makers, Tesla and established car makers). MG (Chinese) has 4% market share of UK car market, and it gets pretty good scores for reliability and 7 year warranty (joint highest with Kia).
Very good video. While brief, it dived deeply into aspects that many 'Why China is so good at EV' articles/videos didn't. For instance, it is rarely mentioned that China's EV development can be dated back to early 2000s, not 2010s. 2010s was, at the video correctly identified, where this development is on the next gear, rather than its origin.
Still, a few points I'd like to add.
1. The development got its ups and downs. It's not just 'throw some money year after year and it's done'. There are setbacks. There are adjustments. The subsidy fraud thing was actually quite serious then. There were others as well, like how to determine to best form of subsidy - it it consumer? Some form of quotas? Should it focus on big, advanced luxurious cars? Or should it be general? This is actually quite a journey and show the smart adaptation of the Chinese government
2. Speaking of the fierce internal competition, Tesla occupies an important role here. Tesla has been considered the best brand in China for a long time. So, in order to cut a share in the market, Chinese EV companies ha木 to directly compete against Tesla. This spurs great product development. They tried to chase Tesla in certain performance metrics, while developing new edges (like software integration, which is very very good). They also dominate the lower-end markets which is more price-sensitive. I think right now, Tesla is still considered the best, but BYD is a very close second. and 5 years ago this would sound ridiculous. That's what the competition has done.
3. The help on EV is far beyond just consumer subsidy. One thing: infrastructural buildup like charging stations, laws and regulation, suppression of ICE vehicles etc. China is basically leaps and bounds ahead of all countries, even European ones, in this regard. The infrastructural buildups is especially important - Imagine cutting 90% of gas station and see how it affects the ICE car market.
4. There's an underlying strategic logic behind China's massive and sustained investment in EV. The basic idea is that newcomers are hard to challenge established ones in existing market. The only way for China to get ahead of the technologically advanced west is to get into new products like EVs. That way, all countries have the same starting point, and in this case with smart policies and subsidies + a huge internal market, China could be very successful - and it did. This sort of thinking can date back even before 2000s - and in the early 2000s China decided to experiment and test out different fields and see which one is worth further developing - and EV is one of them, and the rest is history.
I know chinese car manufacturers are investing a lot to actually manufacture here in Brazil. BYD is buying a former Ford factory while GWM bought a former Mercedes factory and will make mostly hybrid vehicles there (meanwhile importing).
I think it should be mentioned that Chinese already secured the supply chain, and investing alot in it , including the the RnD , which make CATL growing so large than any energy company.. definitely advantage that the German and Americans didn't have
Brazil can become a center for EV tech if things go well there:)
I watched a bunch of videos of the Shanghai auto show showing off the EVs and the cars that are available in China. Wow were they competitive and very impressive. I've seen China's car's back in 2019, and knowing that their backseats are larger and normally the vehicles are more spacious, it only entices me more to spend my money on a Chinese car if it's ever available.
There have been more videos of them on fire than actually driving. They are going up so often the great firewall can't stop the flood of videos.
@@BionicBurke No I've done the research on gasoline vehicles and articles written about burned EVs in China. There have been some fires but they're not really that significant according to data. There was 3000 some vehicles that burned and between 2020-2022, there was around 86 vehicles, and there are over 2 million EV's with BYD having more burnings but they sell 5x the amount of vehicles than Tesla. While at that, there are pretty much non-existent videos of the exported vehicles from China that have burned. China is also moving away from ternary batteries to lithium ion phosphate which was said to be a factor. By the time it comes to my country, I'm sure they will have worked out more kinks and it will be safe to drive. I will give them a chance especially knowing that they're more spacious, technologically packed, more economically competitive, and they look so good.
@@Lena-vw6ye your problem is trusting data out of China instead of your own eyes. There are safe EV options out there... none are BYD. It's the NEW blade batteries that are going up like crazy, not their older cars.
They deleted my reply pointing you to evidence. How classic. I bet the channel name is keyword blocked. The channel is the other s word for snake with za on the end. His video on BYD should be all the truth you need.
@@BionicBurke No, someone already debunked his video. I believe it was Car Viking or something like that. He broke down his video and I don't really watch anti-China channels like that because their only mindset and goal is 1 thing to attack and belittle and that's not really the truth.
A very good video on EVs, thanks for the great effort. Bravo!
In my country, even the Wuling Mini Air EV was selling very well. Thousands of units have been sold. With 100% battery the distance can be 300 Km. It is suitable for commuters in urban areas. The issue regarding battery life will probably be resolved in the next few years.
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Driving a BYD is courting death. I definitely prefer non-copied cars with working airbags, that don't catch fire and don't start failing apart after 6 months.
That is why I suggest waiting to buy an EV. I compare it to when the "flat screen" replaced the CRT. The first ones where mainly plasma and cost thousands for the status of a 43" flat TV. Now you can buy a much better modern flat screen for a fraction of the cost. Much the people buying Tesla now, those early adopters overpaid for the status symbol item that soon will become mainstream.
Yeah, the early adopter tax is huge for early EV adopters, not only financially, but also with the shortage of fast chargers, extremely lacking right to repair laws, etc. I'd much rather go with a mature hybrid car platform. Hybrid Camrys and Accords are around 30k each and are already proven to last hundreds of thousands of miles. There are even cheaper and equally reliable options that are the default taxi/Uber cars for a reason.
They are the ones paving the way for the rest of us. They pay to build the economies of scale that enables prices to come down.
If they didn't buy them, prices would never come down.
That is why government subsedises these new technologies early on, they incentivise people to buy these things and stuff like solar panels to create a growing market in which prices can come down. Once prices come down to reasonable levels the market takes over and the growth pushes prices down further.
Teslas are cheaper than average car in the US
@@baronvonlimbourgh1716 Absolutely agree, this is why I don't want to be the one paying to pave the way. I will wait for the leaps in technology and the market forces to take over.
@@Mink510 Where? Last time I looked, a Tesla was going for approx 1.5x the sticker price used when compared to a similar IC type car. Even if the cars where the same price, I know I can get 10+ years out of my V6, , I know people replacing/repairing EV batteries after 5 years at costs of tens of thousands. Not cheaper, yet.
0:05: Man, that is one angry car.
Seagulls are nasty birds
Saw a few BYD stores in Shanghai and they looked really neat. I hope to see more of them overseas.
+McNibbler Considering so much video of BYD EV burning i wouldn't be so excited for that Brand till it fixes it's Quality Assurance.
@@VoidOfDarkness9 This is not the case which can be checked by real statistics.
Its a racist smear promoted by a person who makes a living producing content for the anti Chinese segment of western racists called serpentza (captain apartheid) and probably a few Tesla stock holders.
BYD in fact have the safest least likely to burn battery which makes this campaign really illustrate the desperation in western racists.
Western import restrictions and a few vehicle battery fires are all it's going to take to kill this wave. I'm skeptical they will be able to meet north American safety and quality standards while still hitting a viable price point that will overcome consumer aversion to Chinese made vehicles.
China alone took up 26% of Tesla's global sales 2022. Thatz why Tesla is opening a second factory there. General Motors sold more cars in China than US in 2022. American EV market is not as important as China's.
@FTD the average car price in the US is 50k. It's about 1/4 that in china. Sometimes, it's not about the number of units, but rather the premium you can collect.
@@MorRobots politics is more likely to be the blockade, Chinese firms never stop showing their “ingenuities” around regulation and NAFTA. As long as they can produce the vehicles in North America instead of import from China.
If you actually watched the video, you'd know that leading Chinese brands already have affordable cars with 5 star EuroNCAP safety ratings being sold in Europe. They are also being very well received in the UK and Australia. The main challenge they would face in the US is ignorance and willful disregard of facts displayed my most Americans
@@teoengchin I did watch the video. One car passed the EuroNCAP standards, and it was the top end of the market sector. Chinese equipment manufacturing at cut rate costs has never yielded good results when it comes to quality, reliability, and durability. All of those factors take time to be properly assessed. It took KIA 20 years to manufacture a decent vehicle. The first Japanese cars were also shit and Japan did not have a reputation for poor quality goods. China on the other hand has only very recently managed to produce goods on their own that are slightly better that crap. China has a huge QA problem, particularly when there is no third party QA entity ensuring they don't produce crap. When a China based company is offering vehicles at a fraction of the price, well bellow the BOM cost of other manufactures... yeah something smells like 2 week old rice.
Look I'm not about to convince you otherwise, I just hope Xi and the CCP actually pay you for your efforts here.
Late last year I spent a week in Ecuador... I saw lots of GREAT WALL and BYD cars.
In the West we fundamentally underestimated China for the first decade of this century, which I would attribute to a neo-colonial/racist mentality that poor or 'underdeveloped' countries fundamentally exist to provide us with cheap labor and are incapable of improving socioeconomically to the degree that Western countries improved in the 20th century. I was a child between 2000-2010 and I remember that basically the only impression of China that I was exposed to (by teachers who had visited, the media, popular discourse) was that it was the world's factory, severely polluted, and generally an industrial subsidiary of our society. As it turns out China was not just sitting on the unprecedented flood of Western capital, investment, manufacturing capacity/technology and trade integration that was occurring, but rather learning, developing, and growing. Now China has a whole new set of problems, that of an overly-industrialized society with too many people, demographic issues, and major growing pains. I think that the US is correct strategically to reshore industry, compete on next-generation technology, and upgrade our infrastructure. But we as humans now face global, civilizational problems. I wish we could work together instead of sticking with the petty nationalism from previous centuries.
Without a decent network of dealers this wont be easy.
Tesla was a different story since 1. they actually offered something new and 2. doing that they had a lot of help from the media. And still I would not bet that they survive the next 10 years since most of the old brands offer EVs now and there are a lot of disappointed Tesla-owners who realised what sort of crap they bought.
*lot of help* from media? Is this how it's going down into the files? Talk about revisionist history.. LOL!
Nah, if I have option of spending 60k on Tesla / VW, or 15k on Chinese car, Chinese car will win big time. Price makes miracles and if Chinese companies will be willing to sell spare parts and provide repair manuals, existing car repair shops can take over dealership role.
@@borek772 Just that a 15K car cant be the same as a 60K car.
It just cant. Forget this business-blabla and look at the technical facts. Salaries and scale are factors but they are not the only ones. Also the old brands have lot of know-how in optimisation/ production so they can compensate for higher salaries to a certain point.
@@joansparky4439
Uhm, yep. I've never seen a hype train go faster than media pushing Tesla's mediocre-to-bad crap.
Even today Tesla's absolute dogsh*t repairability and upsell scam are kept out of autoblogs.
And how crappy the media are is shown by Dutch magazine Autoweek, which whines and cries about BYD's cars screaming "What data do they send to their Chinese overlords huh!" as a downside.
But Tesla's privacy policy of "Hahaha stoopid eurotrash, there is no privacy, we OWN you" is never even mentioned.
The fact that outside of the US you can't enforce the Tesla upsell-scam? Never mentioned. While this means that if ANY Tesla owner has an accident, they will be left thousands out of pocket because they have to pay the upsell price, but insurance only pays the real price.
@@joansparky4439 you are saying they did not recieve a litteral shit ton of free advertising for over a decade?
Actually, just to be clear, the top selling car is a joint venture between Wuling, SAIC and GM. Further, VW is the top selling brand in China with all its various models/ventures.
You might want to check the latest data
@@elc6895 You are saying that including 2023, BYD has surpassed VW. However, doesn't VW own Audi and Porshe etc.? Are those included in the total, because those two brands in particular are popular in China.
@@Storm4155 your earlier comment was on brand, BYD has overtaken VW brand in Q1 but don't think so on VW group. No easy feat for anyone to beat VW brand, it has long and very strong footing in China. VW is definitely trying to wrangle back their brand lead in their biggest market.
As for Wuling, it's no longer the top selling model in China but their sales is still strong. Very competitive markets, good for consumers.
Not even China drives Chinese cars. Still, this will be interesting to observe over time.
Was in Australia and went to the BYD store in Sydney - these cars are awesome. Also saw tons of Chinese brands in the Middle East. Expect Japanese & Korean brands to lose a ton of share, if not everyone else
I wouldn’t buy a Chinese car or motorcycle ever. I don’t care about the price.
@@Viking380good for you. Just do it.
@@Viking380 no harm done.
@@Viking380 who cares
@@Viking380 believe me I purchase Mercedes and BMW cars since the early 90s. I just got an MG ZS. It’s an awesome little SUV for just 17000 Euros
I don’t think Chinese EV will ever go into US market, National Security will just destroy all the effort any manufacturer put in. I think they will just stick with Xiaomi model, everywhere but US.
The Chinese should not try to reinvent the wheel. The Japanese and Koreans tried to build decent conventional cars over and over again as long as it took them to get there and then some. After that they made experiments like the much easier to build EVs and of course they succeeded since after all ... they are just much easier to build. If you can build a great combustion-car you can build a great battery-car. Its as simple as that. Also the Chinese dont have the long breath of the Jap./Kor. since in their economy there is a new fcking thing going on every four years wich is poison to long lasting projects like building up a car-brand.
Honestly it would be cheaper for me to purchase a rechargeable Chang Li pick up truck than renting a car for over three weeks in the EU.
I don't want a car with freaking facial recognition. Having a smartphone recording everything I do is enough thank you!
Well I actually don't want a car at all...
If your running out of ideas, perhaps a video on the power semiconductor industry that enabled the ability to make EVs due to the technology advancements of insulated gate bipolar transistors (IGBTs), IGCTs, thyristors, and gate turn-offs (GTOs) . It wasn't long ago that semiconductors could not handle such energy. The industry is not just because one man decided it was so, it was because of his vision and the timing of the industry to produce the components.
China is increasingly making its presence felt in the global market by expanding its production and export of electric vehicles (EVs), and there are indications that they may focus on airplanes in the future. Meanwhile, our politicians are engaged in competitive campaigns to secure re-election.
Aerospace is a much harder market to crack, the total amount of learned capital is at least an order of magnitude greater than in cars. It's also unlikely to see a "leapfrog" technology (like electrification) that allows new participants into the market.
@@philsburydoboy C919
@@philsburydoboy C919 has received more than 1000 orders.
Go ahead and buy a Chinese EV your funeral
In Australia in the past six months the perception of EVs has been taking a hit. Higher electricity prices, rapidly inflating insurance policy prices for EVs, poor resell potential, and looming restrictions in parking lots and apartment buildings due to the fire risks. Firefighters were even talking about boycotting EV fires because of the risk of heavy mental contamination as the new asbestos level health threat. Our government says we have to spend a trillion in tax payers money to build up our grid to support replacing ICE vehicles with all EVs.
Kinda old data though. The most impressive parts are really in 2022 and 2023, especially for BYD. The stepping up from cheaper EVs to higher end is very strong.
What happens when your Chinese EV needs parts and service? Accidents happen every day and when electrical parts stop working and you need a trained tech with access to replacement parts or you have a useless pile of scrap metal. If Harbor Freight is typical, then parts are simply not available.
Thank you for posting the story!
it feels like whoever first figures out how to male a car without a single LCD panel in the cabin will make a killing lol
remember buttons? the things you can safely press while driving a car ?
If Chinese cars showed up in Minneapolis they would be scratched if left out.
As Japanese cars once were. It didn't stop the Japanese, and won't stop the Chinese.
@@kenoliver8913 Japan never wanted to rule the world in the 70's. They have the best cars
How come theres none of these in Canada?
You forgot the most important part - expired LiFePo batteries patent. This is the key reason why they start massively export the vehicles. Before they ignored these patents but they could not export. Now they can export without royalty.
IP (Patents being one example) are monopoly ploys for the benefit of a few at the cost of the rest and socially destructive.
Who owns this “patent”? All I know is China dominates in EV batteries. If there were infringement, it’s gonna be against Chinese battery makers. GTFOH
@@lordlee6473 i thought Chinese mods couldn't use UA-cam in china because xi jing pooh banned it there
@@Sam-kv3iv LMAO, there are some dumbass who believe that Winnie pooh can't exist in China, even if they only need to search the vlogs on the Internet to see how many there are in the Shanghai Disney store.
@@lordlee6473 Taiwanese engineer owns the patent and he set up factory in China. By the way some Canadian company claim LiFe was their invention which seems unlikely.
Two weeks ago i bought a Tesla Model Y in Montreal Canada and it's coming in from China. I'm not sure if Canada imposes tariffs for cars coming in from China.
Canada does have a tariff.
Peugeot ... No China
Once red Winnie the Pooh 🤡 readying the invasion of Taiwan - there goes chinese export. Right on the path of russian warship 🤬
@Ro Herms Because Tesla just announced that they will export EVs from China to Canada
@Ro Herms The rep at the Tesla store confirmed it to me.
Should really try to seperate BEV from Plug-In Hybrid whenever possible. The focus should be on the BEV.
Coming? It's already started, I'm in NZ and I've had a BYD in my driveway for 6 months
Guess he talks more about Europe, and especially USA but I think in USA it will be very hard for Chinese cars to enter 😀
@@lkrnpk Agreed, probably not much point even trying in the current geopolitical climate. The rest of the world will buy plenty
Do you own a fire extinguisher?
I have been anticipating the shock that the Chinese auto industry is going to give the rest of the world for about 5 years. I suspect we will see torrid decade for European manufacturers from 2025. The advent of the EV is the most disruptive event in the car industry in the last 50 years and China is well placed to take advantage of it.
In 2014, China launched its policy encouraging people to purchase EV cars.
I knew it will on trend.
Been holding BYD and Tesla stock since Nov 2014. I haven't sold any shares of them until today.
Me voy, eres genial. Me arrepiento de no haber comprado acciones de BYD.
Why would it be strange for chinese company to do "joint venture" or "technology transfer" happening when building a factory in europe?
Because European are reluctant doing , Chinese tech are the same tech they taught the Chinese do. Nothing more advance than them , just a good pricing. The same Japan factory in EU. No one asking for Japan tech there.
We need more smaller EV's. Not the tanks Tesla makes, so I am pretty happy with the Chinese competetion. Even if the cars aren't actually better, if they are cheaper the European and US brands need to catch up... Unless we ban them because "China is Scary"
I’m 99% sure they’ll be banned
The ora good cat( hou mau) scored highest in its category in the European NCAP safety test.
My mother has recently purchased a BYD Atto 3. 5 star NCAP safety, tested in 2022. She's happy with it. Great value for money.
First comment on the channel the moment the video goes live....
Yeah, no bot or paid shilling going on here.
When the car breaks, what is access to parts like? What about access to mechanics who are knowledgeable about the brand?
I am seeing plenty of BYD on the road here in Sydney. 80% of all EVs are imported from China. Too many drone brains brainwashed by American media and their politicians.
Because EV does not have complicated engines and transmissions, its reliability is improved, and its repair and maintenance are extremely simple. I think this is why BYD is not eager to export their hybrid vehicles before they have fully established a service system in overseas markets. BYD also produces good hybrid car
@@dimimen EV rarely need any regular maintaince，that's one of the biggest advantages EV has over ICE cars
The BS6 getting a *one star safety rating* was a sales disaster, but the BS6 was a traditional ICE vehicle. The engine blocks of ICE vehicles make them inherently more dangerous. However, the Chinese manufactures of EVs will have it much easier this time because EVs are fundamentally safer than ICE vehicles. EVs are more stable due to their lower center of gravity, are able to have safer crumple zones and stronger cages, and are radically less combustable than ICE vehicles.
Byd... Nice car, too bad it catches fire every now and then...
The main reason chinese buy electric is because the registration fee which in some cities is more than the car itself is free for EVs. BYD has had a lot of issues with battery safety which will be an export concern.
In the decades past China learnt from Singapore and Mr Lee Kuan Yew, now the Singapore government ought to learn from the People's Republic regarding national support for the EV market - this should have been easier for a little city state like us, instead we're now lagging behind
Singapore is a tiny island nation. It does not need lots of EVs
Learn from Stalin commie CCP? 😂🤣😂🤭
@@larryc1616 hi kid, I really don't know what you are happy about? Don't you know that the Chinese are more free and safe than you?
How’s that different from US. I bought a car in 2017 and got both federal tax credit and state rebate, total up to $9000; and sticker to drive on car pool lane.
I wish we have more affordable EV choices in US like China.
What's crazy is how the Chinese figured out how to get good design, the BYD Seagul is probably one of the sexiest small cars I've seen while it's rather hard to get a good looking small car...
I wouldn't expect decent quality or after-market service, plus...you know...all the coal-fired power plants China is building...China is a global fraud operation.
@@sirfer6969 BYD just massively arrived in Europe so we'll have the answer soon I guess.... I've seen and seated inside a Han and an Atto 3 and they both felt like good cars at first glance... but yeah the Seagull will probably be more on the "lowcost side" probably just like the future Tesla Model 2....
😂😂China invited a large number of Europeans as design directors.
I dunno about the Seagull but a lot of the larger Chinese car manufacturers - both ICE and EVs - use European design shops. It shows.
@@hi4806 invited...payed a large sum of money😊
I was talking to a Chinese mechanic in Melbourne, Australia. He has a BYD as a courtesy car, so i asked him about it. He said DON'T buy it.
Okay, don't buy it. I hope BYD will not go bankrupt without you not buying their cars.
i would 100% buy an electric car from China if the price was right and it passed US safety tests
I'm sure NCAP is better
Jon. Thank you for doing the Vingroup video. Can you do one on the rare earth (Neodymium and Praseodymium) used in making the REE permanent magnets vs the ferrite magnets and innovations in China with regards to EV powertrain magnets?
Tesla is busy to make a motor without all those materials you mention. But to just make a reluctance motor + hairpins made out of aluminum. So a motor without rare earth elements, and without copper !!!! imagen that!
@@HermanWillems only if they really have that......Tesla said lots of things, many not deliver
@@SunnySzetoSz2000 Well i drive the Tesla Model 3 RWD LFP version. It uses around 130Wh/km most efficiënt EV on the market. And ADAC from Germany just said the Model 3 from their research is one of the most reliable cars in Germany. Its a pretty damn good car. He does deliver the best EV's.
BYD might get Huaweid in the US markets.
what's that burning smell?
Most likely
@@affgaan a Tesla.
They already were. They were going after the bus market and were running a big bus factory in California and doing well because they had an early mover advantage. So Congress banned all government purchases of BYD buses for “security” reasons, but mainly due to lobbying by Proterra and New Flyer. So I think Chinese companies have been intentionally avoiding the US auto market to avoid being Huaweid, as you pointed out.
@@alastairward2774 that's obvious
Even Asianometry neglected some of the most important factors, many Chinese cities restrict ICE cars on road one working day every week by the last number on the plate. This makes many middle and uper class buy another EV for commuting. And the city I live completely forbids any ICE vehicle transport cargo downtown, this made all companies and personal doing businesses with cargo transportation completely changed their fleets. All taxes changed into EV of course. In China taxes are bought by the drivers as investment...
I'm skeptical for a couple reasons. First and foremost is that battery tech is already well optimized, and you need much much better battery tech for widespread adoption. We haven't been seeing much innovation for the better part of a decade now. Another big reason is in order to establish a presence in the US market, China would need to do what Japan did 50 years ago - put the plants in the US, closer to customers. Margins are just too thin for most cars just just build in the home country and export. There are other problems, lots of them.
Really they only did that to get around protectionist tariffs. Moving anything anywhere is cheap nowdays
I thought battery r&d was going quite well actually. They gone from the old fashion nickel cobalt lithium (that are expensive, rare) to lithium iron phosphate. They are researching method to make this chemistry even better and now are rolling out sodium battery later this year. I thought it was a pipe dream but it’s actually happening
Chine seems to know US market are for their vassal's state brand such Korea , Japan or the new comemer Vietnam. So they aren't intertested in.
If BYD sales are more than Tesla, how is the market capitalization less than Tesla?
Euro manufacturers focus on Mid and luxury market?
China for low cost?
Which is easier to do? Change from making Luxury to making cheap or for cheap to upgrade to luxury?
Looking at the level of equipment in the 10 to 12000USD BYD Seagull ... I suspect the luxury EV market is in for a huge shackeup when the Chinese launch their luxury brands with the tight costing structures that they have developed for their currently affordable cars.
I'm diggin' that Funky Cat! Now they just need a pick-up called the Cat Daddy and they're set!
There have also been reports of a evergrande-style downfall now that the governement subsidies are ending - including BYD. I've seen reports of large number of cars abandoned out in the sticks by companies who produced non-functional cars just to pocket the subsidies. And also about BYD having terrible quality control and worse customer support.
All in all, I'm doubtful they will amount to much in the international market.
Where do they get lithium, cobalt, manganese and nickel?
They made several smelters in Indonesia. After the state banned the export of nickel and bauxite raw materials. The islands of Sulawesi and Halmahera have the world's largest nickel reserves.
Chinese car companies still need to become profitable. Subsidies can't flow forever.
they will be, given the size of the market and the fact they have leading tech. the industry just needs consolidation. price wars are happening now, in the next 5 years i expect to size the number of makers downsized.
The fact that China started late in all this, but that it has this development is nothing less than a miracle. What China needs is just time, which is precisely what the US is trying to take away from it.
BYD have long been profitable 😊
With local governments running out of money, the consolidation period has begun. Inevitably, the grain will be separated from the chaff.
@@erikue832 Which companies are consolidating?
I find it somewhat strange that your analysis did not consider the current automotive price wars in China and how most Chinese car manufacturers are currently selling cars at a loss. Do you think this will lead to high market consolidation over the next few years? And how might this affect exports?
selling cars at a loss ? where is your source？
They might find ground. But they will have a uphill battle. It is incredibly difficult for new brands to establish themselves. It takes several decades normally. But Tesla is a outlier.
Also the fact it is Chinese will be a huge hindrance. Many nations around the world increasingly have a negative view of China according to various studies. People are willing to buy a lot from China. But a car is something else entirely.
IPhone seems pretty popular for an assembled in China product.
They will just buy a dead brand and revive it. Or start a new one. Seems to have worked well with MG and Polestar.
you are right. NATO, G7 are following the US interest. #decoupling
@SmartElectricCar I know but people take car brands so seriously.
@SmartElectricCar you don't go 60 miles an hour in an IPhone.
Chinese imports will decimate the European vehicle industry. Besides dominating the material costs, the average Chinese worker own a 2-wheeled vehicle while the average Western worker own one of 4-wheels. The Total Cost of Ownership TCO of a humble car such as a Honda Civic is $10k US per year, more than the salary of a average Chinese worker. Vehicles are used on average one hour (5%) per day. When most people on a society own such expensive, but low-use overhead (more true of US than Europe) that society has a big inefficiency and a higher cost of living. When you factor in the infrastructure such as roads, parking spaces for businesses and garages for homes needed to support owning cars, it is no surprise that Western jobs get moved to Asia.
BYD = Bonfire You Drive.
They keep lighting up all over the place like Trash bins in a riot. There's even been high end models where the airbags do not deploy during incidents.