This video has definitely helped me a lot. I've just returned to the hobby after i inherited a whole bunch of OO and N gauge (thanks dad) and I've really got the bug. I'm not blessed with space so I'm building an N gauge layout and the idea of a reversing loop appeals.
can you give us an update on the N gauge layout? Btw, i also do not have a huge space. I could hook up 3 bedrooms in my house for a giant layout, but i am first going to start using the master bedroom. (live alone in a simple house, in a simple street in the Netherlands. Not a mansion or anything like that. But when you are alone, you do have some space to use.) My father had built a layout once, on a simple table top. It was OO or HO scale. Im dutch so i guess HO scale. But similar, right? Anyway, i did not take into account the scale that much when i picked up this hobby again 30 years later. (which was roughly half a year ago). And so i bought HO scale. A lot of stuff already, like say 14 locs, rail to cover the master bedroom at least once, perhaps 1.5 times. Carts or wagons or whatever the name you want to give them. The load basically. And so, here is the question: Did you do anything with the OO gauge as well? I believe it is almost similar scale as HO. Either way, if you have build a layout in N gauge it could perhaps help me set it up in HO scale to make it interesting enough.
Thanks for showing your solution to a return loop. I had seen a video on an American DC layout which used a polarity switch unit. That operated in a fraction of a second without interfering with the running of the train. Totally agree about the interest factor.
Hi 00 Bill, I have two reversing loops on my DC layout with bus feeds. Like you I have spent hours trying to get my head around the electrical issues involved. I have mastered it in a similar fashion using relays but without isolating the track. I am just relying on the relays to do all the work. I enjoy your videos, a very informative channel indeed. Regards Alan at Buckland Junction :o)
Hi Bill, Best video i have seen on this subject. I have similar problem that i think is something to do with reverse current. When i turn the power on the engine moves forward for about 4 seconds then the then the safety switch pops on the controller, it then comes back on after a few seconds. I wish I could send you a diagram of the layout as you maybe able to see what it is. Many thanks again for your help. Your layout is still looking great. All the very best Duncan. PS. Its DC.
so to what game did it change you? Super Mario? Dune 2000? Let me guess, Command and Conquer Tiberian Sun. Am i right? Just kidding. We all know it was Train Simulator newest version available on the market, with all the addons. (downloaded from some cheap website or perhaps actually bought from some software supplying website like Steam) (pls take the above as a joke, it was meant as such) But, now lets get a bit more serious. In what way did this actually change the game for you if i may ask? Could you explain?
@@bertjesklotepino I have a large shunting yard and I favoured more sidings instead a turntable. Simply by extending one of the sidings making it a drive through to the other side of the layout and adding a couple of isolator switches I now have a working return loop. Now I can turn a loco round without the need for a turntable. All thanks to Bill. Ok I have to go now, I have a mission to finish in Command and Conquer, 150 acres of OSR to get in on Farming Simulator and a three car DMU to return to Newark from Nottingham in Train Simulator {The newest version available on the market, with all the bells and whistles} and all that before bed. (pls take the above as a joke, it was meant as such)
Very interesting video. You've given me the idea to add a return loop to a layout I'm thinking of building. But just to be clear, with this this method of return loop across an oval, you have to manually stop the train to set the isolation switch and then restart the train on it's journey, right?
Hi Bill I have a similar layout (oval with return loop). What I did was isolate both +ve AND -ve rails on BOTH ENDS of the Return Loop. Then wire the electrical feed to the return loop via a Double Pole Double Throw (DPDT) switch. I really need a diagram to explain but imagine 3 rows of 2 contacts. Contacts 3 and 4 being +ve and -ve wired to the Return Loop. Contact 1 is red (+ve) and also has a joiner wire to contact 6. Likewise contact 2 is -ve with a joiner wire to contact 5. Contacts 1 & 2 are wired to the controller. Operation. Run the train onto the return loop. Stop power. Flip the DPDT switch. Reverse direction on controller and apply power. Train continues onward. Hope this helps.
Always more than one way to skin the proverbial cat. At some point soon I plan to rewire my buses and tidy up my wiring which is a right tangle at the moment. How my loop and other isolators work will be reviewed then but it works fine.
It would be clearer when you introduce the isolator at 2:40 if both rails of the loop were black to the right of the isolator. Similarly at 3:12 the inner rail of the loop should be red and the outer loop, up to the bottom isolator, black. Similarly at 4:39 and 6:21 My return loop had 2 entries on to the main track so the points at either end (as you show at 3:54) but combined with a set of points to a siding part way the loop and, providing you operated the points in the right order, it achieved the same isolating and switching of polarity. But if you had as many power inputs as you then you need extra isolators. Like you say there's more than one way of doing the same thing.
How about - isolate the track going diagonal across the middle on both + and - rails just past the turnouts / points, then feed this section with a DPDT switch to reverse the polarity, another DPDT switch can reverse the rest of the oval, the controller / power supply feeding the two DPDT switches - only two switches, operated at the right time, to achieve a continuous run ? DPDT is a double pole double throw wired in a well known way to reverse the current .
Hi Bill. Most of the other DC reverse loop explanations seem to require a dpdt(?) switch to work but yours doesn’t seem to use this can you explain why this isn’t required?
This video has definitely helped me a lot. I've just returned to the hobby after i inherited a whole bunch of OO and N gauge (thanks dad) and I've really got the bug. I'm not blessed with space so I'm building an N gauge layout and the idea of a reversing loop appeals.
can you give us an update on the N gauge layout?
Btw, i also do not have a huge space. I could hook up 3 bedrooms in my house for a giant layout, but i am first going to start using the master bedroom. (live alone in a simple house, in a simple street in the Netherlands. Not a mansion or anything like that. But when you are alone, you do have some space to use.)
My father had built a layout once, on a simple table top.
It was OO or HO scale.
Im dutch so i guess HO scale.
But similar, right?
Anyway, i did not take into account the scale that much when i picked up this hobby again 30 years later. (which was roughly half a year ago).
And so i bought HO scale.
A lot of stuff already, like say 14 locs, rail to cover the master bedroom at least once, perhaps 1.5 times.
Carts or wagons or whatever the name you want to give them.
The load basically.
And so, here is the question: Did you do anything with the OO gauge as well? I believe it is almost similar scale as HO.
Either way, if you have build a layout in N gauge it could perhaps help me set it up in HO scale to make it interesting enough.
Thanks for showing your solution to a return loop. I had seen a video on an American DC layout which used a polarity switch unit. That operated in a fraction of a second without interfering with the running of the train. Totally agree about the interest factor.
Hi 00 Bill, I have two reversing loops on my DC layout with bus feeds. Like you I have spent hours trying to get my head around the electrical issues involved. I have mastered it in a similar fashion using relays but without isolating the track. I am just relying on the relays to do all the work. I enjoy your videos, a very informative channel indeed. Regards Alan at Buckland Junction :o)
fantastic Bill..mind bending but fantastic
Hi Bill,
Best video i have seen on this subject.
I have similar problem that i think is something to do with reverse current.
When i turn the power on the engine moves forward for about 4 seconds then the then the safety switch pops on the controller, it then comes back on after a few seconds.
I wish I could send you a diagram of the layout as you maybe able to see what it is.
Many thanks again for your help.
Your layout is still looking great.
All the very best
Duncan.
PS. Its DC.
This is a game changer for me, thank you. 👍
so to what game did it change you?
Super Mario?
Dune 2000?
Let me guess, Command and Conquer Tiberian Sun. Am i right?
Just kidding. We all know it was Train Simulator newest version available on the market, with all the addons. (downloaded from some cheap website or perhaps actually bought from some software supplying website like Steam)
(pls take the above as a joke, it was meant as such)
But, now lets get a bit more serious.
In what way did this actually change the game for you if i may ask? Could you explain?
@@bertjesklotepino I have a large shunting yard and I favoured more sidings instead a turntable. Simply by extending one of the sidings making it a drive through to the other side of the layout and adding a couple of isolator switches I now have a working return loop. Now I can turn a loco round without the need for a turntable. All thanks to Bill.
Ok I have to go now, I have a mission to finish in Command and Conquer, 150 acres of OSR to get in on Farming Simulator and a three car DMU to return to Newark from Nottingham in Train Simulator {The newest version available on the market, with all the bells and whistles} and all that before bed.
(pls take the above as a joke, it was meant as such)
You are funny!!!!!
hahaha, thanks anyway@@johnlong3214
Very interesting video. You've given me the idea to add a return loop to a layout I'm thinking of building. But just to be clear, with this this method of return loop across an oval, you have to manually stop the train to set the isolation switch and then restart the train on it's journey, right?
Hi Bill
I have a similar layout (oval with return loop). What I did was isolate both +ve AND -ve rails on BOTH ENDS of the Return Loop. Then wire the electrical feed to the return loop via a Double Pole Double Throw (DPDT) switch. I really need a diagram to explain but imagine 3 rows of 2 contacts. Contacts 3 and 4 being +ve and -ve wired to the Return Loop. Contact 1 is red (+ve) and also has a joiner wire to contact 6. Likewise contact 2 is -ve with a joiner wire to contact 5. Contacts 1 & 2 are wired to the controller.
Operation. Run the train onto the return loop. Stop power. Flip the DPDT switch. Reverse direction on controller and apply power. Train continues onward.
Hope this helps.
Always more than one way to skin the proverbial cat. At some point soon I plan to rewire my buses and tidy up my wiring which is a right tangle at the moment. How my loop and other isolators work will be reviewed then but it works fine.
Could you diagram that?
@@paulbrennan3760 No, but just google model railway 12v dc return loop…..
It would be clearer when you introduce the isolator at 2:40 if both rails of the loop were black to the right of the isolator. Similarly at 3:12 the inner rail of the loop should be red and the outer loop, up to the bottom isolator, black. Similarly at 4:39 and 6:21
My return loop had 2 entries on to the main track so the points at either end (as you show at 3:54) but combined with a set of points to a siding part way the loop and, providing you operated the points in the right order, it achieved the same isolating and switching of polarity. But if you had as many power inputs as you then you need extra isolators. Like you say there's more than one way of doing the same thing.
How about - isolate the track going diagonal across the middle on both + and - rails just past the
turnouts / points, then feed this section with a DPDT switch to reverse the polarity, another DPDT
switch can reverse the rest of the oval, the controller / power supply feeding the two DPDT
switches - only two switches, operated at the right time, to achieve a continuous run ?
DPDT is a double pole double throw wired in a well known way to reverse the current .
Hi Bill. Most of the other DC reverse loop explanations seem to require a dpdt(?) switch to work but yours doesn’t seem to use this can you explain why this isn’t required?