VERY interesting info! It also tells me that when the DCOEs were developed/used, someone knew their stuff - to the point of proper carbs for the build design. Thanks!
Your channel just recently showed up in my suggested feed. I’ve had the stock carb,Webber 2bb( 40/40 or 44/44?) on stock intake,also Holley 390 and same 4bbl intake. Never occurred to me that the dividers of the 4bbl intake eats up quite a bit of area,so flow is probably down all across the board. This was in the late 90’s. Also I heard the factory 2.3l 4bbl intake was the best at the time. I had heard the d port heads were better also. I in America.
Thanks for the 4bbl comparison video. I ran the Holley / Offenhauser combination for many years, The stock #6299 Holley did not perform well, after re -jetting and delaying the secondary opening it did some better. I later swapped out the OFFY and installed a Spearco manifold and with no changes to the carb it was noticeably more responsive. the Spearco manifold orientates the carb opposite the Offy. Fuel bowls front/back to Offys side /side and the Spearco is not a dual plane manifold.
Had a 390cfm Holley & Swaymar inlet manifold on a 3.0 v6 Essex with Burton stage 2 heads & Kent v63 fast road cam back in the day. I found it was to much carb for that engine. Ran much better on the street & made more power with a re jetted Webber 38 DGAS. Thanks again for a another great test.
Interesting, a friend had a similar setup, though he cast his own inlet manifold for the 390 Holley on the V6, his was about 3100cc and had a "fast road" cam of some sort, I think from Piper. It was a long time ago but I think the heads were allegedely RS3100 but with some work done . Engine had Howe exhaust manifolds and pointless ignition. I believe at best it produced 180hp at the rear wheels which seems like a lot for that engine...
there is something in the pipeline, but in terms out outright power there is little difference between efi and dcoe webers, only when you have really wild cams does EFI start to pay off in terms of performance at part throttle and lower down the rev range.
i have a manifold sitting under my milling machine waiting for me to get round to it, i think the biggest problem is trying to take out teh port divider, easy at the manifold end not so further up
it was a near stock head, just a bit of blending around valve seats, i dont know the exact cam specification because it was a kent grind but for someone else, it was an oval racing cam so something like gts2/3
Hi mate really enjoy your videos on these pinto engines been watching for while. I have mk2 road rally car hopefully picking up pinto next week. It’s running down draft with standard bottom end. Looking at maybe mild porting on the head. Is it worth fitting a mild cam or will it make the car less drivable with little gain running standard compression etc.
If you put a 2" spacer between the carb & intake manifold and used a single plain instead of a dual port offy manifold, l'm positively sure the 39 Holley will have better top end figures & better drivability compared to the 3 webers
Do you have a source for the dgas throttle shafts and linkage I've been having trouble finding what I need for them so I am reduced to the 32/36 witch is a good carb it's just not a 38
@@PenguinMotors 40 over 22r with a 20r head in a 4x4 need the low end power and mid range the 32/36 doesn't have enough to me dyno may say differently but I liked the way it preformed
one of the best things about the 32/36 is its midrange flexibility. you can improve the 32/36 by reworking the throttle spindles and opening the venturi from 26/27mm out to 27/28
@@PenguinMotors I'll have to look in to that I've also heard of guys taking the 32 linkage and with some fab work make a 38 progressive with with the linkage of the 32 I like the idea of it but have to kill a carb to do it I haven't seen dyno numbers but it does seem to work nice as the primary was allways week and sluggish the you hit the secondary and had a dead pot I never could get read of with jets the 38 never had that problem just runs rich at idle and seems to lean out around 5800 thanks for listening to me ramble I don't know as much as I would like to and that why I watch channels like you thanks for your patience and time
YES power will go up. even a bog standard pinto will give about 3bhp more on 45's than 40's, id guess you'd see 7-8 bhp more on the big carbs. BUT 40's will be nicer to drive lower down in the rev range
@@PenguinMotors thanks for the reply. I guess I was more wondering if it was an issue being on 40’s rather than the 45’s as it was built up 20 yrs ago with the 40’s ( original Italian 40 webers ) I’m lead to believe. I think it’s in need of a bit of fettling with the carbs. Love the vids by the way. 👍🏼
VERY interesting info! It also tells me that when the DCOEs were developed/used, someone knew their stuff - to the point of proper carbs for the build design.
Thanks!
Your channel just recently showed up in my suggested feed. I’ve had the stock carb,Webber 2bb( 40/40 or 44/44?) on stock intake,also Holley 390 and same 4bbl intake. Never occurred to me that the dividers of the 4bbl intake eats up quite a bit of area,so flow is probably down all across the board. This was in the late 90’s. Also I heard the factory 2.3l 4bbl intake was the best at the time. I had heard the d port heads were better also. I in America.
Thanks for the 4bbl comparison video. I ran the Holley / Offenhauser combination for many years, The stock #6299 Holley did not perform well, after re -jetting and delaying the secondary opening it did some better. I later swapped out the OFFY and installed a Spearco manifold and with no changes to the carb it was noticeably more responsive. the Spearco manifold orientates the carb opposite the Offy. Fuel bowls front/back to Offys side /side and the Spearco is not a dual plane manifold.
Thanks that backs up my feelings on the setup I tried
Had a 390cfm Holley & Swaymar inlet manifold on a 3.0 v6 Essex with Burton stage 2 heads & Kent v63 fast road cam back in the day. I found it was to much carb for that engine. Ran much better on the street & made more power with a re jetted Webber 38 DGAS. Thanks again for a another great test.
Interesting, a friend had a similar setup, though he cast his own inlet manifold for the 390 Holley on the V6, his was about 3100cc and had a "fast road" cam of some sort, I think from Piper. It was a long time ago but I think the heads were allegedely RS3100 but with some work done . Engine had Howe exhaust manifolds and pointless ignition. I believe at best it produced 180hp at the rear wheels which seems like a lot for that engine...
Very interesting! Thanks!
Did you also test 40 DCOEs, 48 DCOEs and 44 IDFs on this engine?
No because it was part of a magazine article I didn’t test any other carbs on that particular engine.
What would you tell us about 44IDF vs 45 DCOE?
i have done that test once as an article for a car magazine, i cant show the results yet but soon i will be able to
hi grant how about cutting the holley inlet manifold separators out , more air more power as you say ?? .keep the good vid`s coming
Yes I will one day, I even moved the Holley manifold to my machine room but it’s at the bottom of a long list of stuff to do
that would be good to see in a vid , are you going to gues the increase in power ??!!!!@@PenguinMotors
If am right I remember David Vizard suggesting a really well developed pinto could just about utilise a 350 cfm holley which I think is a twin choke
I think it could but the offenhauser manifold is not the way to go
@@PenguinMotors It certainly could it looks a complicated affair
Super conclusion. Love it...👌
Can you do a video of Fords pinto EFI engine compared to Webber carbs what are the advantages and gains between them in performance and reliability
there is something in the pipeline, but in terms out outright power there is little difference between efi and dcoe webers, only when you have really wild cams does EFI start to pay off in terms of performance at part throttle and lower down the rev range.
Is there any way the divider in the offenhauser could be machined out and the Holley retested?
i have a manifold sitting under my milling machine waiting for me to get round to it, i think the biggest problem is trying to take out teh port divider, easy at the manifold end not so further up
What was the rally cam and the head spec on this video ?
it was a near stock head, just a bit of blending around valve seats, i dont know the exact cam specification because it was a kent grind but for someone else, it was an oval racing cam so something like gts2/3
I have one of the Wiand intakes if you want to test it. I also have a Crane Cam performance cam. I am running 2.3L now so I can't use them.
it would be great if i could do a test on that intake
@@PenguinMotors I am in the US; you will have to give me a shipping address.
@@cmsracing units 16b 17a lancaster way business park. ely. cambridgeshire. CB6 3NW united kingdom
@@PenguinMotors Do you want the cam too? I can give you all the info. on it.
why not? if its easier you can drop me an email, penguinmotors@outlook.com regards graham
very interesting, poor old holley
so, is it a 28/36, or 38dgas i want for a road-going 2.1 cortina, very mild cam fitted
Use a 32/36
@@PenguinMotors thankyou
Hi mate really enjoy your videos on these pinto engines been watching for while.
I have mk2 road rally car hopefully picking up pinto next week. It’s running down draft with standard bottom end. Looking at maybe mild porting on the head. Is it worth fitting a mild cam or will it make the car less drivable with little gain running standard compression etc.
FR30/ BP134 will give more power/torque right through the Rev range
If you put a 2" spacer between the carb & intake manifold and used a single plain instead of a dual port offy manifold, l'm positively sure the 39 Holley will have better top end figures & better drivability compared to the 3 webers
I think what it really wants is a normal dual plane manifold, I will try again if I can find one for sensible money
Do you have a source for the dgas throttle shafts and linkage I've been having trouble finding what I need for them so I am reduced to the 32/36 witch is a good carb it's just not a 38
unless you have a v6 engine dont bother with the 38 carb you will not get any more power from it
@@PenguinMotors 40 over 22r with a 20r head in a 4x4 need the low end power and mid range the 32/36 doesn't have enough to me dyno may say differently but I liked the way it preformed
one of the best things about the 32/36 is its midrange flexibility. you can improve the 32/36 by reworking the throttle spindles and opening the venturi from 26/27mm out to 27/28
@@PenguinMotors I'll have to look in to that I've also heard of guys taking the 32 linkage and with some fab work make a 38 progressive with with the linkage of the 32 I like the idea of it but have to kill a carb to do it I haven't seen dyno numbers but it does seem to work nice as the primary was allways week and sluggish the you hit the secondary and had a dead pot I never could get read of with jets the 38 never had that problem just runs rich at idle and seems to lean out around 5800 thanks for listening to me ramble I don't know as much as I would like to and that why I watch channels like you thanks for your patience and time
What would a standard 32/36 have done?
Just about the same as the 38 Dgas
I have a standard 2l pinto with an fr32 cam and 40 dcoe’s.
Would there be any power improvement with 45 dcoe’s?
YES power will go up. even a bog standard pinto will give about 3bhp more on 45's than 40's, id guess you'd see 7-8 bhp more on the big carbs. BUT 40's will be nicer to drive lower down in the rev range
@@PenguinMotors thanks for the reply.
I guess I was more wondering if it was an issue being on 40’s rather than the 45’s as it was built up 20 yrs ago with the 40’s ( original Italian 40 webers ) I’m lead to believe.
I think it’s in need of a bit of fettling with the carbs.
Love the vids by the way. 👍🏼
I had a 500CFM two barrel Holley on my pinto
Come on boys , let’s make some noise !