You also forgot the evil consipracy to create more Excelsiors regardless of the cost. The Excelsior Mafia of Vulcan Admirals (Bravo Zulu on continuing that joke btw).
I can also see how you would have the galaxy wing as a sector level asset. The main battleship for emergencies bar the Sovereign class isnt just going to be hanging around doing nothing defending a system unless its somewhere like Earth. There also arnt that many of them even if we assume that the Beta Cannon is correct and they are going to go full speed ahead on building more then the initial 6-12.
The Breen have good pilots. Their ships are very maneuverable nog had a difficult time when the USS defiant was being pursued by one before the breen ship was recalled and had to end its pursuit of the defiant in the last episode of DS9
The Breen sounds a lot like the Comanche, Cossacks, or Mongols, basically light cavalry units that excel in raiding. However, I can think of no equivalent for their power dampening weapon. With regard to the "Island Hopping Campaign", the Japanese fortified as much islands as they could, thinking the US would lose men at every island, slowing the US advance. However, the US bypassed those islands they did not need, essentially "hopping over" those islands. However, the US had to take several heavily fortified islands because of their strategic nature -- Okinawa, Iwo Jima, Solomon Islands, Saipan, etc.
Great Video as always - the part about the Jem'Hadar as an occupation or defensive force makes me think why the Dominion didn't create a police/occupation race. Vorta are Admin, Jem'Hadar were the attack. It makes sense to have a race that had a bit of both of them for areas they needed to secure but not crush.
the Dominion had that ' don't make me come over there attitude ' they allowed some self rule as long as worlds did as they were told. that way the Dominion didn't need to waste resources directly controlling every planet.
The Pacific strategy was, "Hit em where they ain't," and "Island Hopping." See bypassing of major bases such as Rabaul for example. It was absolutely NOT the strategy to go and make sure every single enemy base was taken or chase down every enemy asset. Unless you were Halsey. And you thought maybe there was still a freighter with a single seaplane on it. Then you diverted entire fleets to chase after what amounted to nothing. Or made sure the entire fleet sailed through the worse parts of the badlands. For fun.
A lot of the questions shared similarities involving concerns on logistics. Chin'toka does present how important the ability to supply it. I look forward to the Septimus 3 battlespace.
I made it into a video!!!!!!!!!! i was hoping you would include it or respond in the comment section. Thank you for the response! I mixed up the timeline regarding the dominion counter offensive in the south.
Septimus III, proves to the Cardassians, how callous and reckless the dominion will be with the lives of its soldiers and was the tipping point along with the breen entering the war for Damar to become a rebel and launch his rebellion.
There were a ton of galaxy class. Starships in the fleet at the end of the episode a call to arms and that was one fleet not just sector fleet. I just watched it for the first time a second ago from JTV FX. They did a very nice recreation
Do energy dampening fields protect against torpedoes and grenades? 31:55 Why would you need close air support at that point? We've seen that the Constitution-class could stun a big area in "TOS: A Piece of the Action". If you've got orbital coverage it's over once the dampening fields fail.
I find the Founder have questionable writing in the way they act. They act under the impression they don't care about the matters of the Solids and concerns only for their well being, leaving the Volta and Jem hardar to run thing under their control, only given orders from the shadow. But they were ready to send 100 of their infants to the mercy of whoever find them and put themselves in harm way to do secret missions to disturb other government. And we the audience are told the Dominion think in hundreds of years, but they act very rash since their first appear. If they were smarts instead of murder the colonies in gamma quadrant, would welcome them and act friendly, secretly taking over the Aphla quadrant slowly with soft method of trade and economic, only using brute force if a world becomes more stubborn. Like what were they thinking to expect the Defiant crew to act if the game is rigged against them to make them to fail after they abmit to slaughter all of the colonists and explorers unprovoked? So I said the line of Founder thinking is the same wheather or not they were inflict with section 31 vruis regardless.
@@CaptShriver many things hidden in beta canon. And mixed up. Memory-Beta is trying to make sense and attempt to amalgamate FASA material and novel materials relating to the Presidents of the United Federation of Planets. It's very much a mess so I said screw it, FASA material has largely being ignored so I will too.
@@CaptShriver Discovery S1 and 2 were okay. 3 and 4 lost me. Picard S1 wasn't great but watchable. S2 improved and S3 was excellent. Lower Decks, despite the swearing and vulgar humour, is still quite enjoyable and nostalgic. Prodigy is excellent too even if it's more for kids but it was screwed over by the same way they released episodes as Young Justice was on CN. Don't trust networks like that. SNW S1 annoyed me: using images of Jan 6th (which as an Australian, I saw more than what the media reported) and then the Illyrian issue bugged me way too much. S2 improved, with the Illyrian issue being acknowledged and I hope they fix that one day (seriously it makes the hatred of Klingons look like a petty kindergarten dispute, I doubt Roddenberry would've approved of this xenophobia being so blatant and okay with ALL Federation member worlds).
I forgot if you've done a vid covering ships the klingons & romulans were using in the 24th century & have you done vid covering some of the lesser known ships like you did with the 12 lesser known ships of starfleet?
I wonder how news of the USS Voyager survival did for Starfleet and the UFP as a whole as like the USS Enterprise kept out of the war but also losing so much hear how one ship never mean't overcome long odds to the Borg still alive plus making epic discoverys as keeping up Starfleet mission
a federation breakthrough would have ended up like the Free Planets Alliance invasion of the galactic empire in Legend of the Galactic Heroes a complete and utter fiasco beacuse the dominion would have easily intercepted supply vessels and drawn them further into enemy territory and eventually would they would have encountered very large cities as they got into more populated areas.
The term for a disabled ship i believe is "mission kill" i.e. they are no longer capable of completing the mission. This means very pften they can be salvaged or in worst cases ised as parts for other ships.
@venomgeekmedia9886 that would mean the total Cardassian, Dominion, and Breen fleets would total 300. That is to say, they'd have nearly 300 fleets combined.
@geekiusmaximus1882 i think it was an episode or two after that one. Martok mentions that the Klingons have to hold the front line until the Federation and Romulans can find a way to deal with the Breen Energy Dampeners. He complains that the Klingons will be taking 1500 ships against 30,000 and will be outnumbered 20 to 1.
@@Traven158 Honestly if that was the case then there's no way in hell the allies could have possibly one the war, that kinda smells of the writers throwing random numbers around to me...
Jem'hadar are shock troops, Cardassian soldiers are line infantry. Shock troops are best on offense (and are expensive), line infantry are more multirole (and cheap).
okay then were do the breen fight in, i seem them more as shock troops, the jemhadar more equivalent to ww1 german stormtroopers(sturmstruppen) well equipped designed for large scale breakthroughs. whereas i see the breen more as well equipped troops designed for taking out specific targets but limited in the equipment they carry and numbers i guess a bit like a seal team or other special forces unit.
the jem hadar are more your heavily equipped units for large scale breakthroughs and holding large areas, the cardassians are more your standard garden variety cannon fodder, decent enough for normal type operations but not well enough equipped for large scale assaults.
For the Breen to be able to attack the capital of the federation they must have used some tricks to get. I would say at least two federation fleets that would have been guarding the federation capital out of the sol system in order to hit Earth as hard as it did. I'm less a founder was on Earth and was able to get the shields down for Earth's defenses which I think sol station at least in Star Trek the card season 3 was the shield generator for Earth's planetary shields so somehow they must have got them down?
Usually you don’t travel at high warp to get somewhere because you need to get back, if it is known to be a one way trip burning out you warp nacelles isn’t that big a problem.
And casualties of Excelsiors and Mirandas are constantly exaggerated. Operation Return: 3 Mirandas, 1 Steamrunner, 3 Birds of Prey. Chin'toka 1: 1 Miranda, 2 Excelsiors, 2 Akiras, 2 Romulan Warbirds, 3 Birds of Prey, 3 Vor'chas. Chin'toka 2: well the entire fleet so doesn't matter. Cardassia: 1 Excelsior, 2 Mirandas, 1 Bird of Prey, 2 Vor'chas, Romulan flagship. I'd be worried being on a Klingon ship or an Akira rather than a Miranda and Excelsior.
How did the Breen get stopped at Earth? The Breen had an energy dampening weapon. They should have completely wiped out Earth defenses since Starfleet had no defense against it.
They didn't use the weapon until Chintaka. Earth was merely a raid to damage Federation morale. The Breen fully understood that it was very unlikely any of the ships from the Task Force would return. As such, those ships were not even carrying the weapon because they knew the shattered hulls would be salvaged and studied.
1) Complacency, and 2) Orbital Defenses are under the jurisdiction of the Federation member planets during times of peace. Many planets were negligent about defense until it was too late to make big changes before the War.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069look at Betazed. Their own planetary defense systems were obsolete and undermanned. And combined with the Tenth Fleet out of formation of a training exercise and Starfleet Intelligence believing the Kalandra sector was too far from Dominion supply lines to be considered a threat, it's any wonder the planet was in Dominion hands in less than ten hours.
We actually see the stardrive / engineering hull of at least one destroyed Galaxy class starship at the Second Battle of Chin'Toka. So to say that there were none is clearly false. ua-cam.com/video/ECfOA6BBsjw/v-deo.html - 3:30, upper right corner
@@venomgeekmedia9886 It is actually just the engineering hull and the nacelles... neck is gone as well. So I don't think they separated at all. What *is* weird is that the surviving portion of the ship (engineering, nacelles) should logically be the most vulnerable - that is where the warp core, antimatter stores and major plasma conduits would be. If only a portion of the ship survived, I'd rather expect it to be the saucer.
Look... I just think the thumbnail is bad taste. I know I am probably in the minority here and you do you humourwise, also I won't shed a tear for the guy, but... come on he was just killed, I don't have to laugh at him. If he'd been alive, I'd laugh at him. anyway hate me now
You also forgot the evil consipracy to create more Excelsiors regardless of the cost. The Excelsior Mafia of Vulcan Admirals (Bravo Zulu on continuing that joke btw).
I can also see how you would have the galaxy wing as a sector level asset. The main battleship for emergencies bar the Sovereign class isnt just going to be hanging around doing nothing defending a system unless its somewhere like Earth. There also arnt that many of them even if we assume that the Beta Cannon is correct and they are going to go full speed ahead on building more then the initial 6-12.
too many excelsiors is NEVER enough. we need more excelsiors!
The thumbnail wins the internet hahaha
Yes
Venoms thumbnails usually do!
Shouygu! Gerasimov! Send me munitions! The munition: 💥
As soon as I saw it I burst out laughing for how incredibly stupid it is but rather accurate.
That thumbnail... you madlad.
WEYOUN! DAMAR! Where is the ammunition?!
- Thot Pri'gorr
The Breen have good pilots. Their ships are very maneuverable nog had a difficult time when the USS defiant was being pursued by one before the breen ship was recalled and had to end its pursuit of the defiant in the last episode of DS9
The Breen sounds a lot like the Comanche, Cossacks, or Mongols, basically light cavalry units that excel in raiding. However, I can think of no equivalent for their power dampening weapon.
With regard to the "Island Hopping Campaign", the Japanese fortified as much islands as they could, thinking the US would lose men at every island, slowing the US advance. However, the US bypassed those islands they did not need, essentially "hopping over" those islands. However, the US had to take several heavily fortified islands because of their strategic nature -- Okinawa, Iwo Jima, Solomon Islands, Saipan, etc.
Great Video as always - the part about the Jem'Hadar as an occupation or defensive force makes me think why the Dominion didn't create a police/occupation race. Vorta are Admin, Jem'Hadar were the attack. It makes sense to have a race that had a bit of both of them for areas they needed to secure but not crush.
the Dominion had that ' don't make me come over there attitude ' they allowed some self rule as long as worlds did as they were told. that way the Dominion didn't need to waste resources directly controlling every planet.
The Pacific strategy was, "Hit em where they ain't," and "Island Hopping." See bypassing of major bases such as Rabaul for example. It was absolutely NOT the strategy to go and make sure every single enemy base was taken or chase down every enemy asset. Unless you were Halsey. And you thought maybe there was still a freighter with a single seaplane on it. Then you diverted entire fleets to chase after what amounted to nothing. Or made sure the entire fleet sailed through the worse parts of the badlands. For fun.
I guess that makes Chin'toka - Okinawa.
Thumbnail reminds me at a scene from TNG. Romulan Commander: "let us leave the neutral zone, before another.."accident" occurs
Gul Dukat: _Sees the thumbnail_
Gul Dukat: _"SISGUUUUUUUUUUUU!"_
A lot of the questions shared similarities involving concerns on logistics. Chin'toka does present how important the ability to supply it.
I look forward to the Septimus 3 battlespace.
There is such a thing as an optimised ship design for a given task. Excelsior is the perfect multi mission, mid sized cruiser.
I made it into a video!!!!!!!!!! i was hoping you would include it or respond in the comment section. Thank you for the response! I mixed up the timeline regarding the dominion counter offensive in the south.
This was awesome thank you for everything you do I really enjoyed it Love your channel
Thank you. Looking forward to your next offering.
The battle of ChinToka was a real beating. 😂
2:54 Why was that D7 wearing a trench coat?
At the second battle of chin'toka when the defiant is destroyed you see a wrecked warbird behind and what looks like a galaxy class engineering hull
Looks more like a Nebula.
top ten thumbnails
That thumbnail of Yevgeny Prigozhin.... 💀
Septimus III, proves to the Cardassians, how callous and reckless the dominion will be with the lives of its soldiers and was the tipping point along with the breen entering the war for Damar to become a rebel and launch his rebellion.
There were a ton of galaxy class. Starships in the fleet at the end of the episode a call to arms and that was one fleet not just sector fleet. I just watched it for the first time a second ago from JTV FX. They did a very nice recreation
Do energy dampening fields protect against torpedoes and grenades?
31:55 Why would you need close air support at that point? We've seen that the Constitution-class could stun a big area in "TOS: A Piece of the Action". If you've got orbital coverage it's over once the dampening fields fail.
That thumbnail Xd
So that means we get to see Martoks cavalry raid as Sisko#s calls it, covered in depth as part on said video on raids and tactics bejind that.
Ahh! Another question asked. Thank you 👍
lmao that thumbnail
"FFFFOOOUUUNNNNDDDEEERRRR WHERE IS MY JEM'HADAR" - Gul Dukat
Great information as always 😅😅😅😅
Cheers
I find the Founder have questionable writing in the way they act. They act under the impression they don't care about the matters of the Solids and concerns only for their well being, leaving the Volta and Jem hardar to run thing under their control, only given orders from the shadow.
But they were ready to send 100 of their infants to the mercy of whoever find them and put themselves in harm way to do secret missions to disturb other government.
And we the audience are told the Dominion think in hundreds of years, but they act very rash since their first appear. If they were smarts instead of murder the colonies in gamma quadrant, would welcome them and act friendly, secretly taking over the Aphla quadrant slowly with soft method of trade and economic, only using brute force if a world becomes more stubborn. Like what were they thinking to expect the Defiant crew to act if the game is rigged against them to make them to fail after they abmit to slaughter all of the colonists and explorers unprovoked?
So I said the line of Founder thinking is the same wheather or not they were inflict with section 31 vruis regardless.
I lost my private Ship in a accident during the Battle of Chin'toka i can relate.
Given the breen fleet got smoked while leaving earth . I’d show star fleet busting their tails on the way out and getting slowed on the way in
What is really under the BREENS helmet?
Depends on what you define as a Breen. Beta canon says they are multi species of different types.
@@ShannonCarter55 now that is something I did not know. Interesting.
@@CaptShriver many things hidden in beta canon. And mixed up. Memory-Beta is trying to make sense and attempt to amalgamate FASA material and novel materials relating to the Presidents of the United Federation of Planets. It's very much a mess so I said screw it, FASA material has largely being ignored so I will too.
@@ShannonCarter55 I think Star Trek is pretty messed up nowadays anyway. What do you think about modern Star Trek?
@@CaptShriver Discovery S1 and 2 were okay. 3 and 4 lost me. Picard S1 wasn't great but watchable. S2 improved and S3 was excellent. Lower Decks, despite the swearing and vulgar humour, is still quite enjoyable and nostalgic. Prodigy is excellent too even if it's more for kids but it was screwed over by the same way they released episodes as Young Justice was on CN. Don't trust networks like that. SNW S1 annoyed me: using images of Jan 6th (which as an Australian, I saw more than what the media reported) and then the Illyrian issue bugged me way too much. S2 improved, with the Illyrian issue being acknowledged and I hope they fix that one day (seriously it makes the hatred of Klingons look like a petty kindergarten dispute, I doubt Roddenberry would've approved of this xenophobia being so blatant and okay with ALL Federation member worlds).
I forgot if you've done a vid covering ships the klingons & romulans were using in the 24th century & have you done vid covering some of the lesser known ships like you did with the 12 lesser known ships of starfleet?
I wonder how news of the USS Voyager survival did for Starfleet and the UFP as a whole as like the USS Enterprise kept out of the war but also losing so much hear how one ship never mean't overcome long odds to the Borg still alive plus making epic discoverys as keeping up Starfleet mission
a federation breakthrough would have ended up like the Free Planets Alliance invasion of the galactic empire in Legend of the Galactic Heroes a complete and utter fiasco beacuse the dominion would have easily intercepted supply vessels and drawn them further into enemy territory and eventually would they would have encountered very large cities as they got into more populated areas.
You see a broken Galaxy class at the end of the second battle of chintaka.
I thought that was a Nebula.
The term for a disabled ship i believe is "mission kill" i.e. they are no longer capable of completing the mission. This means very pften they can be salvaged or in worst cases ised as parts for other ships.
"Combat ineffective" or "neutralized" generally, but I was Army.
Gonna ignore Martok's line about having to take 1500 ships against 30,000?
Eh, numbers didn’t make sense anyways.
Well actually with each fleet representing about 100 ships. Its not all that unreasonable.
@venomgeekmedia9886 that would mean the total Cardassian, Dominion, and Breen fleets would total 300. That is to say, they'd have nearly 300 fleets combined.
@@Traven15830,000? When where and how?
@geekiusmaximus1882 i think it was an episode or two after that one. Martok mentions that the Klingons have to hold the front line until the Federation and Romulans can find a way to deal with the Breen Energy Dampeners. He complains that the Klingons will be taking 1500 ships against 30,000 and will be outnumbered 20 to 1.
@@Traven158 Honestly if that was the case then there's no way in hell the allies could have possibly one the war, that kinda smells of the writers throwing random numbers around to me...
Combined Order Soldier: "@#$% Remens man! They just came out of the night! WE NEVER STOOD A CHANCE!"😱
Hey venom i have a new series for you outside of Star trek for you.
Can you do the original mobile suit gundam?
I clicked the thumbnail thinking this was a battle in Ukraine 😂
With miranda class starships... wouldn't surprise me...
Will we ever learn who is raiding the Sona convoys? My Latium is still on the Ferengi...
It's a real mystery that ;)
Jem'hadar are shock troops, Cardassian soldiers are line infantry. Shock troops are best on offense (and are expensive), line infantry are more multirole (and cheap).
okay then were do the breen fight in, i seem them more as shock troops, the jemhadar more equivalent to ww1 german stormtroopers(sturmstruppen) well equipped designed for large scale breakthroughs. whereas i see the breen more as well equipped troops designed for taking out specific targets but limited in the equipment they carry and numbers i guess a bit like a seal team or other special forces unit.
@poil8351 the Breen are specialist raiders and skirmishers, high offensive abilities, some stealth, but no staying power
@@trevynlane8094 that is basically how i seem them good for hitting specific targets hard and fast but not hanging around.
the jem hadar are more your heavily equipped units for large scale breakthroughs and holding large areas, the cardassians are more your standard garden variety cannon fodder, decent enough for normal type operations but not well enough equipped for large scale assaults.
For the Breen to be able to attack the capital of the federation they must have used some tricks to get. I would say at least two federation fleets that would have been guarding the federation capital out of the sol system in order to hit Earth as hard as it did. I'm less a founder was on Earth and was able to get the shields down for Earth's defenses which I think sol station at least in Star Trek the card season 3 was the shield generator for Earth's planetary shields so somehow they must have got them down?
Usually you don’t travel at high warp to get somewhere because you need to get back, if it is known to be a one way trip burning out you warp nacelles isn’t that big a problem.
@@chriseash6497 suicide trip definitely a good point.
You didn’t answer how many Excelsiors and Miranda’s there where
Lots...
@@venomgeekmedia9886
Question: How many Miranda’s and Excelsior’s are there
Answer: Yes
And casualties of Excelsiors and Mirandas are constantly exaggerated.
Operation Return: 3 Mirandas, 1 Steamrunner, 3 Birds of Prey.
Chin'toka 1: 1 Miranda, 2 Excelsiors, 2 Akiras, 2 Romulan Warbirds, 3 Birds of Prey, 3 Vor'chas.
Chin'toka 2: well the entire fleet so doesn't matter.
Cardassia: 1 Excelsior, 2 Mirandas, 1 Bird of Prey, 2 Vor'chas, Romulan flagship.
I'd be worried being on a Klingon ship or an Akira rather than a Miranda and Excelsior.
How did the Breen get stopped at Earth? The Breen had an energy dampening weapon. They should have completely wiped out Earth defenses since Starfleet had no defense against it.
Unless the ships sent to Earth didn’t have the Energy Dampening Weapon.
Maybe they didn't want to reveal it yet.
They didn't use the weapon until Chintaka. Earth was merely a raid to damage Federation morale. The Breen fully understood that it was very unlikely any of the ships from the Task Force would return. As such, those ships were not even carrying the weapon because they knew the shattered hulls would be salvaged and studied.
spacedock not to mention various starships eventually arriving including i believe the enterprise e.
so by cities the NORMAL definition for the lower pop end not what are actually metropolitans which we call cities
Ross! Letant! Where are our fucking warbirds!
Putin hired Section 31 to take care of Wagner's leadership.
Why are starfleet so poor in defending their territory with outdated defence systems?
Complacency.
1) Complacency, and 2) Orbital Defenses are under the jurisdiction of the Federation member planets during times of peace. Many planets were negligent about defense until it was too late to make big changes before the War.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069look at Betazed. Their own planetary defense systems were obsolete and undermanned. And combined with the Tenth Fleet out of formation of a training exercise and Starfleet Intelligence believing the Kalandra sector was too far from Dominion supply lines to be considered a threat, it's any wonder the planet was in Dominion hands in less than ten hours.
Off topic yeah, but I HATE that they went and lumped up the Romulan heads. Man dem Rom girls were HAWT.
We actually see the stardrive / engineering hull of at least one destroyed Galaxy class starship at the Second Battle of Chin'Toka. So to say that there were none is clearly false.
ua-cam.com/video/ECfOA6BBsjw/v-deo.html - 3:30, upper right corner
Oh yeah. Weird that it's just a stardrive... I doubt they'd have a chance to separate.
@@venomgeekmedia9886 It is actually just the engineering hull and the nacelles... neck is gone as well. So I don't think they separated at all.
What *is* weird is that the surviving portion of the ship (engineering, nacelles) should logically be the most vulnerable - that is where the warp core, antimatter stores and major plasma conduits would be. If only a portion of the ship survived, I'd rather expect it to be the saucer.
Always figured it was a Nebula.
@@ShannonCarter55 Possibly.
Look... I just think the thumbnail is bad taste. I know I am probably in the minority here and you do you humourwise, also I won't shed a tear for the guy, but... come on he was just killed, I don't have to laugh at him. If he'd been alive, I'd laugh at him. anyway hate me now