Thank you SO much to all the channel's supporters (Patreon, GitHub, UA-cam), and especially to PiShop.us, who sponsored this video. Check them out at www.pishop.us
@@jamesm5192 According to a few users across various forums, there is no management engine in RPis; this is as the ARM chips themselves that are used in the Pis (so far) haven't had a management engine. However, the GPU cores may or may not *sort of* act as a management engine in some cases, as far as I'm aware.
@@boneappletee6416 Right, so far it is just some random users on message boards. Since this video featured the co-founder, I figured we could get a more authoritative answer.
"shortages" bs... shortages for raspberry pi but 1000000 clones without shortage where do they find chips? Or risc v which are abundant as well and ok which also is a different instruction set but like PRODUCTIONWISE it needs the same facilities so where is the shortage? they just inflate the price by decreasing availability. Also if the shortage is real (which it is not but lets suppose it is) to the point where something that costs $20 now sells for $120+ then why not just increase production? I mean its not like we are talking about bleeding edge nanometer production here as with the flagship x86 CPUs there are many places and tooling in reasonable prices that could facilitate an increase in production. So there is no excuse.
I was never an angry customer, a sad one. I'm glad he supported the Pi centric SMBs, and his price & supply strategy is a great business ethic. Thanks for doing this interview
@@sylviam6535 Cause he catered to businesses and resellers who scooped up 99% of the pi's then resold them or used them to make money off people for 5x the price.
@@orangehatmusic225 Funny how people like you get real salty about profits. We live in an economy that survives and thrives on profits, not charity. Get over it.
neither was i. i started using ESP32's instead of Linux running Raspberry Pi's. For things that are compute intensive, i use a cluster of ESP32s daisychain networked over high speed serial ports
Jeff Geerling has that Anton Chigurh vibe and physiognomy whereas Upton is more or less Jason Statham's visage as well as buccal attributes. I think they feature in a nerdy Scifi, action, scary dong-in-mouth erotic movie.
Eben is such a pure soul. When asked about the legacy of Raspberry Pi, the first thing that pops into his head was how happy he is that through this journey he got to meet most of his heroes and would like someone from the future generations to feel the same way about Raspbery Pi as a company/orgnaization. I love this community and Eben, if you are reading this, keep on doing what you are doing. All of us hobbyists cannot be more thankful to you ♥
I feel like the real legacy of the Pi will be retro tech tear down videos in the year 2067. I predict the vast majority of the units will still be working along happily, and some old fart like me will be talking about how the Pi changed the maker world.
I've always had the greatest respect for Eben, and this interview just cemented that. From keeping small businesses who rely on Pis afloat, to not raising prices, to keeping Pis out of scalpers hands... anyone who is upset at Raspberry Pi or Eben at this point just doesn't understand the actual difficulties faced in industry over the last three years. Fantastic job on this Jeff.
A great interview. Someone once said that the aim of the interviewer is to ask all the questions that you didn’t know you would ask if given the opportunity. You definitely did that.
The funny thing was, on the plane home, and while editing this video, I thought of about 10 more questions I *wish* I would've asked. Well, good for a follow up in the future!
Given Eben's adoration of the BBC Micro -- shared by so many of us of a certain age -- I really wish they'd do a special edition Pi 400 8GB in BBC Micro colours: pebbled beige case, black keys, red-orange function keys, brown arrow keys.
@@JeffGeerling My Pi400 Keyboard is my daily PC so is getting a few keyboard keys that are less responsive. A mech keyboard that can take the Pi400 PCB is on my wish list.
@ tom gidden and it must have an expansion slot for a plug-in add-on double power second processor -one made my 1982 BBC B sprint instead of jog along. (I started programming in1969, then built 2 sbc computers from scratch in 1977)
I'm definitely of that age... 40+ something now. The first time I heard the "duuuuuuurrrrr-di" of the BBC Micro I was hooked. It's something I'd love to pass onto my 6 year old, but unfortunately she's more I interested in her tablet running Minecraft and Roblox, something about running away from a Piggy... Anyway, my hope is, that in 30+ years, I hope she has the same admiration I had for the BBC, the C64, the Amiga, and can pass on the nostalgia to the next generation. That's what will make us grow and evolve and be better. Unless AI kills us of first.
What a fabulous interview. I'm so impressed by Eben; he's brilliant, articulate and most of all personable! There's a genuineness to him that's rare to find in many people these days, let alone someone of his acumen and level of success. Thank you, Jeff, for doing this.
When it comes to the Pi Pico, I think it's saving grace was the PIO features! Without that, it would've just been another microcontroller that got lost in the sea of other cheap microcontrollers.
The pico w is a miracle board. I used a pi zero for a project but didn't like the long boot times. Turns out that a pico is actually capable of handling all the time critical tasks better and boots in seconds. Did I mention cheaper? Did I mention smaller? Amazing board.
And/or vice versa.... I use SiLabs micros and such... but they're not OpenCV compatible and really can't Linux... It's either "somebody strapped Linux to an Arduino" or... "somebody gave you IO with a SBC"
Thanks Jeff for a fantastic interview. You let the person and personality show through. You can tell how dedicated Eben is to the Raspberry Pi and it's community. Mucho Kudo's
@@paultruzzi911 Did you listen to what was said? Did you hear the numbers mentioned and the reasons behind their decisions? Clearly not, or more likely, you just deliberately ignored them to try and stir up bad feeling. Either that or you're just an idiot.
Thanks for coming over here to do the interview Jeff! It was an amazing discussion, I found it very interesting 😊 I grew up on Raspberry Pi - it was my first computer and I’ve since had many more raspberry pis 😂
Without Raspberry Pi i would have never found my love for Linux and my Love for Computers. I would not work in the field, if Raspberry Pi wasn't there.
i think for me its the other way around, i love linux, and for years i wanted to try a raspberry pi, but never had use for it. after i bought it i have a thousand uses for it, so when it available ill by one more :) maybe even an cm4 just to play.
@@gearboxworks I'm not a fan of the company itself anymore, but there's literally dozens upon dozens of things you can do with a Pi, if not hundreds. You can host your own website, host your own search engine, learn programming, set up a media server, host your own VPN, turn it into a smartphone, learn cluster computing. Honestly, there's so many things to do with a Pi that I've barely done a fraction of them.
@@liquidmobius Oh, okay. I was thinking you meant you could do so many things with a Pi you could not do with a regular computer/server. If you meant “there are thousands of uses for a computer/server” then sure, I think there are tens of thousands of things you can do with one, likely more. But I just do those things with an x86 computer with lots of RAM running a hypervisor like Proxmox, and lots of VMs and/or containers. So much easier than running a bunch of Pis.
@@liquidmobius - I can’t seem to find your reply to me where you were (likely rightly) saying my reply sounded sarcastic. I did not mean it to be sarcastic so rather than let others read it and think the same I’m going to include that reply below this paragraph. -- Re-reading my comment I can definitely see how it could have I been interpreted as sarcastic, please, except that I was asking questions without an agenda. I was honestly interested in your stated use-cases for the Pi that I had not previously envisioned and that were not something I could do with other larger computers. But I when you answered with usage I could do with a regular computer and that were not unique to an SBC like the Pi I responded with disappointment, which it appears you interpreted as me being sarcastic. Given that that was likely my fault, please accept my apologies. I am aware of a few things for which the Pi is uniquely suited for, but not many so when you said “thousands” I was really intrigued to learn more. Again, it was my disappointment that you were referring to things I could do with other computers as opposed to things the Pi is uniquely capable of. Finally, the last thing I want to do is create drama from my comments. I plan to start posting videos about home labs and I was just looking for more ideas on how to use a Pi in ways I cannot just use virtual machines and containers on a Proxmox server for. P.S. Also, to be clear, my mention of x86 was not antagonistic to ARM, it was just my way of referring to the type of computers that most people typically run servers on today, nothing more.
So good to have Eben himself explain directly what the challenges and subsequent solutions to Pi availability have been over this past crazy 3 years or so. I've always admired his vision and was afraid that he had strayed from it (having read varions press articles) but it's clear that he is doing the very best he can by all interested parties. Thanks Jeff for asking the right questions. Awesome stuff as ever.
You are being too generous, he didn't do the best he could for ALL parties. He did the best he could for OEMs and users got any leftovers. That isn't doing the best for ALL parties. You noticed, he never mentions the split; was it 99:1, 90:10?
I loved this interview. I watched it twice. :) I appreciated hearing Ebon's explanation for the shortages and the very human physical reaction he had when you brought up some people stating that they would never purchase a Pi again because of the shortages. He has always been an interesting and truly good human being.
The PI being out of stock and the Pico being plentiful has actually been very interesting. We're discovering that the Pico is a really capable computer that we have overlooked because the PI was available. Reading some sensors and posting the numbers to a server was typically a job for a full blown PI but really a Pico WiFi can do it for a lot cheaper and a lot less power. I really appreciate my PI more now and will use it as a proper computer or a proper server and give the job of running a single program to the Pico. Really that's what a Pico is, something to run a single program from boot up. Where as a PI is a general purpose computer similar to a PC in that it has an operating system and can run a bunch of programs at the same time.
@@somethingsomething464 There was the PIC from Microchip. They were popular in the 1990's for 'chipping' a PlayStation so it thought pirated CDs were genuine. Technically things like the Z80 and 6502 were micro controllers that needed a few support chips. The radical part was fitting memory, storage and IO into the package meaning you no longer needed data and address pins, they could be used for IO. Your typical 1980 microprocessor had 40 pins and none of them did anything useful, then along came the PIC and prity much all it's pins did something you could use, like turn on an LED or read a sensor. The amazing thing about a Pico is that it's about 100 times more powerful than a Z80 or 6809 from the 1980's yet it's still a little chip that you turn on an LED and read a sensor like a PIC.
Just got a Raspberry Pi 4 8GB to upgrade my current 2GB model today! Got it from the last Adafruit restock and unfortunately the shipping and other fees to Europe made it very overpriced...
Nice! I hope stock improves around the globe too, so we don't have to do this complicated dance of ordering from other countries just because they're available there!
@@AndrewAHayes Consider back ordering from RapidOnline UK. I ordered an 8GB in January and received it four days later. I was so surprised I back-ordered another 3 to build a K3S cluster, and they arrived in four weeks. I don't know if I was just lucky, but I figured I could always cancel the order if I found them somewhere else quicker.
Eben Upton and the Pi Foundation demonstrated great skill and integrity in managing one of the greatest crises ever to come out of left field. So nice to see Jeff Geerling get the chance to sit down with the great man and have a really excellent conversation!
They already said the Pi 5 would definitely NOT be coming out in 2023. On the other hand that doesn't eliminate a variant of the zero, compute module, or pico, or perhaps even a more efficient version of an older existing model or even a new version of the 4 with even more RAM or a new storage option.
As someone who benefits from smaller vendors at work that use embedded pi’s in their specialized devices, the prioritization was VERY appreciated. As an enthusiast it is difficult but understandable.
If you have a choice between keeping companies in business by getting them product, or getting product to hobbyists, the former is always the right choice. This man’s decision kept people employed. I can wait a little longer to get Pis for my projects.
I was one of the lucky few who ordered a Oi Zero 2 on release day and it been running the Octopi installation on my 3D printer since. I recall checking a month later and couldn't find anyone selling one, and according to Rpi locator they only turn up in the UK rarely, so I was lucky. For what it it, its a great little board and I look forward to it becoming more generally available.
This shortage has left me without a pi since 2020. I volunteer at one of the foundation's own code clubs and we don't have a single board, and are relying on microbit devices
I suspect you're being a bit over dramatic. If the members of a Raspberry Pi club don't have a single Pi between them, it's clearly not a club with any interest in Raspberry Pis.
Sadly I only had to get my pi4 8gb ram from a scalper but other then that they been pretty good for me I do need more pi zeros tho :( 2 down one left 😢 there amazing devices to mess around with hopefully zeros are back in stock soon
Jeff I enjoyed your interview with Eban Upton. My son who worked with RPis both professionally and then as a hobbyist started me on them. I was able to do a few projects with lots of help. I never bothered to investigate the history of the company but learned lots from your interview. A job well done.
@@edwardharman1153 Indeed, I still in awe of how those wizards coded the likes of Elite with such limitations. My first computer was a ZX81 and it started a career path that I continue to this day :)
Ha, that interview was a surprise to me, I had no idea David was going to be at Pi HQ, otherwise I would've tried to align my schedule better :) - we've met virtually a couple times, but as with most others outside of St. Louis, never met in person!
@@JeffGeerling After seeing your video, you talk about different things than David. Even though you were slower than David, I don't feel like it was the same. It is always great to have different angles on a subject.
As someone who also cut his computing teeth on the BBC Micro, AND was lucky enough to work with with Sophie Wilson straight out of uni, I enjoyed every minute of that interview! Throughout, I kept thinking of an old Rory Gallagher line: this guy sounds as if he has eight bollocks 😅
I work in a tech company… My boss unexpectedly came to the and saw me watching this video… and he asked me WHY THE HELL ARE YOU LOOKING AT SOME ACTOR INTERVIEW??? YOU SOULD AT LEAST BE WATCHING A TECH VIDEO… fortunately I managed to have a conversation before he could reach his office and send me a warning email for watching a Jason Statham video…
Thanx Jeff for bringing the Pi community the inside info. Great interview and I can never be angry at the RPi foundation. Every company took a great hit worldwide because of Covid! 👌
Hearing him talk about the shortage, the business priorities, and the effect on people was IMMENSELY helpful in calming my anger at the company; even if it was hard to understand through his Miley Cyrus level of vocal fry. Looking forward to buying more Raspberry Pi's and thank you to Jeff for doing this interview.
amazing that this started out as a way to get children to learn to code, and then parents got hold of their children's Pi and remembered their own childhood with amiga's, spectrums, and BBC micros. the kids never saw the Pi again as parents took over for "safety" reasons like with train sets and Scalextric. its the industrial uses of the Pi that has amazed me, with a £90 Pi basically replacing a £4000 PLC in industrial uses.
That's the really shitty thing. They've become so expensive that most parents won't buy a Pi for their kids, which was literally the target demographic of the Pi to begin with.
After waiting for a cm4 for over a year I finally got a second hand Intel NUC. I am very happy about the versatility of it and I don't need to thinker or worried about performance.
Phenomenon example of an intelligent interview when the interviewer and interviewee are so passionate about the subject matter. Truly entertaining to watch
Fantastic interview; definitely enjoyed that and a lot of what was said aligned with what I thought was happening (although talking about prioritising some of the OEM customers wasn't quite what I thought). Also glad you asked about RISC-V. You should try to get in touch with Alex Bradbury about it, I know he was working on Risc-V at one stage. I suspect internally there is some RISC-V designs, but still probably some time away from actual silicon.
As for RiscV in class A, I think that another alternative like the Power core is better, it already has optimizations at some level including linux kernel, and it doesn't have the licensing costs, in addition to being a very mature ISA with decades of history.
9:26 I was an angry customer. I never said "I'll never use a pi again" though - never *really* angry at RasPi (was a bit till this was explained here). I would have bought one if they became available. I was just mostly mad at scalpers selling used pis at premium NEW prices and frustrated that half the projects I wanted to do with a pi, I couldn't. I ended up having to do something else or abandoning the projects completely. That said, this was cathartic and much needed. Thank you Jeff and Eben for this video.
Did they tell you about the history of that Sony factory? Not only does it make Sony products and also the RPi range but it was once home to a product from Sir Clive Sinclair. The Sinclair C5 was made there back when the factory made washing machines. Failed in Wales!! (OK, showing my age a bit now)
Regardless of who paid for the trip, it certainly seems like they're on a bit of a "media tour" with all the interviews that have popped up over the last couple of weeks.
This trip was actually in the plans for the past 6 months, though my surgery and recovery delayed it a bit. I don't know about the other interviewers, but for me it was a long-planned event, just kept getting delayed :(
Think it's more of the globe opening up as travel restrictions lifted, with an appropriate amount of lag for logistical travel planning. Timing is good, as ~6 month from when chip shortage blog was posted. In another 6 months, will be fascinating to look back and see how stock prognostics materialized.
I have a new respect for Jason Statham now. Between all his work in action flicks, how did he have the time to co-found the development of Raspberry Pi?
Quite a lot of anger in the community I've seen actually stems from the day that the raspberry pi official social media account instantly blocked a load of long time customers for querying the post which delightfully announced they had hired an ex surveillance cop
That whole situation (seems like the perfect storm that had shockwaves through Mastodon, Twitter, and Reddit all at once) was a good lesson in how *not* to do PR.
I respect that he's straightforward with it, and he's got a point. At my last job, we worked with a company (ProDataKey, or PDK, out of Utah! Give 'em a lookup!) that employed Raspberry Pis in their products, and their stuff was REALLY nice. They're probably one of these smaller companies that he's talking about, I was on a first-name basis with their support team (not because of their products, but because of the approach that company took towards their approach and quality-control of installing access control infrastructure - i was not a fan), and they were all great. Definitely a smaller company, but definitely a good one. So I can see that argument. I'm also glad he's not corporate-speaking to us, and being pretty blunt, like, "Yeah, we went for the industrial market." I get that. But at the same time, I can't imagine that the folks at AdaFruit or SparkFun or the like couldn't also move 3,000+ units pretty reliably. Like, THOSE businesses matter, too, homeslice. >:/
This is on of the most interesting vids you have done. Not to say the others aren't good, but this one was excellent. Thank you. Or since you are in the UK, Cheers!
A great interview Jeff. Eben is the antithesis of most entrepreneurs these days. He's not in it for the money and the fame, but because he genuinely wants to provide affordable ways for everyday people to get into computing, programming and electronics etc. The fact that they didn't hike prices, they tried to be equitable to their customers and still provide really long term support for their products speaks volumes.
I was lucky enough to get some pis before the shortage. The device and the software has been solid for me. Some of the most fun I've had with computers. Opened me up to many ideas, like interfacing the GPIO with relays to control things, IOT, home networking, NAS.... many things I would not have bothered with if not for the pi and the FOSS community around it (thanks Jeff for being a champion here). Business choices must be tough. Glad someone else has to make the call and gamble their money on it. I could still use a couple more pis. And even more so, if any of mine should happen to fail, not having another to replace it would hurt.
Personally I've largely given up with RPI. I still have some and if I want to mess around with some physical projects I'd go to them but for anything that doesn't need GPIO then it's going to sit as a VM or container on a cheap 2nd hand intel box. The biggest problem for me was their complete PR failure of treating the hobbyist as an irrelevant community and anyone who even politely asked about future availability found themselves facing insane levels of aggression (if not actual hate) from RPI business - they forgot where they came from, and what they were supposed to represent - education and hobbyist - and went for profits on sales to business. Interesting also recently to note that some businesses that were using RPI in their products have also ditched. them in favour of other SBCs which are more widely available.
Whoever printed that shirt deserves a shout-out. Either you applied a ton of post production or this is one of the most vibrant shirt I have ever seen xD
Its funny that when I look back on the thing that got me started in automation and programming, it can all be traced back to me playing around with raspberry pis. Who would have thought that me buying a few single board computers would lead me down the path I'm on now regarding data analytics, automation, and most importantly, python. Crazy stuff.
I've given up on Raspberry Pi. I get the feeling they got a taste of success and don't care about the hobbiest market now. Their are lagging in technology, and when you can finally get one you have to pay a lot. I've had some success with Orange Pi now. Its a real shame.
Eben addressed that concern (though not the 'lagging in technology' bit), and love or hate the decision, I think I understand the reasoning behind it. I think by the end of this year, a lot of us will be excited again, because instead of paying $50 for an SBC that mostly works, we'll be able to spend $35 for an SBC that definitely works.
Agreed. Raspberry Pi started out as a foundation selling computers for hobbyists and children, but now the founder says he'd prefer to keep selling to businesses over the average hobbyist and that "businesses are just people"...well, for the smallest of small businesses I'd agree, but the companies buying up entire production runs of Compute Module 4s or setting up giant compute clusters are not small family businesses. At a certain size, business is not "just people". The business side is more lucrative and they can sell higher volumes at once. I see why that's appealing to them, but it completely nullifies their original goal of providing cheap computers for hobby and educational purposes. Prioritizing businesses over those original markets shows the their true nature. Actions speak louder than words. If they actually wanted to prioritize the hobby and educational markets they wouldn't even be making Compute Modules during a shortage.
Great video Jeff. The innovation in the SBC space has accelerated and advanced alternatives based on Rockchip, NXP, Nvidia have emerged, improved and removed some of the market dependence on Pi. This factor combined with the advanced AIoT features, TOPS and performance for prices similar to the Pi4 running Linux (Debian), windows11 and Android changes how makers, students and industrial customers select SBC platforms.
Thanks for this. This level of transparency, with great explanation of the thought process, is what we need from more companies. This guy got a new fan.
Eben, on the very slim chance you read this, as someone who works in the technology side of higher education, who has seen the most amazing projects come through based on the Pi, and as a Beeb owner - I can categorically tell you that yes - the Pi will and already has that affection you speak of. It bought back that idea of “general hackery” similar to the 70s and 80s that the computer industry practically lost for 30 years and as already led to legions of new computer engineers doing things and pushing boundaries that they absolutely wouldn’t be without the mighty Pi.
It'd be one thing if they weren't available for like six months or a year, but it's been three solid years since we've been able to buy one. If that's not abandoning the maker community and everyone who made the company so successful in the first place, then I don't know what is.
Yep. I keep making the same comment on every video: I've been waiting 3 years for an authorized seller to have one in stock... :( It looks like they are about to get caught up... but I wonder how much business they lost by having none available and how many competitors will become a better Pi alternative.
Damn right. Not to mention making it ridiculously expensive for somebody to get into the community, especially kids or people who don't want to commit a ton of money right away. One could argue that the introduction of multiple different versions of the 4 was the nail in the coffin.
@@heyitismyusername doesn't help that the mainstream community rarely talks about alternatives, meaning some people are under the impression that there's no new SBCs to even buy that'll be compatible.
If they already abadoned diy market for oem/corporate, they might have as well floated prices to maximise profits, which would allow them to expand production capacity and secure more wafer allocation for newer products. Literally, what he said is 'we proritised big orders, deal with it' but in PR-speech
What a great interview Jeff. You got a lot out of him that we've never heard before. I hadn't ever heard him acknowledge the scalping and he actually admitted he wished he would have controlled the "commercial partners" by grilling them on what they need the Pis for much earlier. The RISC-V answers were also very interesting. He was just bragging about how RP2040 was a completely new platform and how impressed he was that people jumped on board. RISC-V is also a relatively new platform and people are definitely jumping right into that one too. I suppose his argument would be it's still ARM based (and he kind of mentioned that). Although I disagree with some of the things he said I actually like him better after the interview. He manned up to some mistakes that I've been griping about for years. That goes a long way with me. He said he has no regrets about not letting the commercial customers go under but you can tell he does regret not vetting the commercial customers better and earlier and that also goes a long way with me. This year's first quarter being their worst ever checks out. We'll see if he can hit these late year numbers on the Pi Zero (and I keep trying to tell people we're almost exclusively talking about Pi Zeros and maybe some Pi 4s). I'm honestly more sad these days than I am angry with them. Except for maybe the cameras part. He just straight up said "I never feel bad about that and taking the margin from that". They should feel bad about the camera not being open source though and more open. That's probably the worst thing he said though and everyone knows that the official accessories are pure margin / vendor lock-in anyways. At the end of the day mistakes were made and he at least owned up to a lot of those!
This man is a legend, I still have a raspberry pi 1model B(256 MB), it's limited resources is what make me love it as it drives me to optimize the code as possible as I can even though I didn't touch it for years now. Thanks Jeff
The thing I’m most excited about is Picamera2 moving out of beta; when it does happen I can move forward with my GPS PPS disciplined time lapse camera.
I've been a long time Pi user, having ordered my first Pi about 6 minutes after sales first opened for the original model. I have a project on the shelf waiting for a Raspberry Pi 4. It will use DPI at custom clocks so I don't know if any other SBC that is capable of doing this, and even if some do their lack of open documentation is a showstopper. I've had a 4Gb Pi 4 (it will be my first Pi 4) on backorder now for about 14 months, and no sign of the order being fulfilled any time soon. As a hobbyist I find this frustrating, but it's just the reality. I'm pleased with the way raspberry pi foundation has handled the shortage and just hope I'll be able to get my hands on one soon!,
Lucky the shortage is over, there is surplus on many components now, I hope RP can catchup with the demand this year like most other companies. Was there ever a shortage of RP2040?
There wasn't a shortage, but there was a slight delay in getting the chip (separate from the Pico) shipping in volume; Eben mentioned that was one thing he was sad they couldn't deliver sooner (to help with the microcontroller shortage sooner).
@Jeff Geerling I travelled to Nottingham yesterday to collect a TV Jeff stopped twice 95 miles there 4 different accents I couldn't believe it and I'm brittish. PS Jeff thank you for all your videos, you sir are amazing
Certainly have fond memories of my BBC Micro 32K, not so fond a time getting burgled and it getting stolen.. :( But it did get replaced with a Master Compact, that floppy drive was a big upgrade for me, after having used cassette tape. Later getting a A3000, so was of course an early user of a RISC machine.. :) It was an amazing machine at the time, the OS even though parts of it were initially written in BASIC was super fast & way ahead of Windows & Mac. I always remember it's party trick of been able to format a floppy drive, at the same time as copying files to it. I always thought it not taking off across the pond was a missed opportunity. Even if you look at screenshots of the 1987 Risc OS, I think it still looks amazing, I wish I aged that well.. :) Remember this was when Windows 2.0 was released.. Yuck!!
Been moving away from RsPi's They ditched there initial costumer base to make more provide of from "Here we sell you a Box now give us money". And the price is still at 180€ for a Pi4 .... so yeah f**it RsPi is dead for small projects
Make sure to follow rpilocator.com - for the past month now, there have been multiple Pi 4 models popping up at MSRP at retailers around the world. The price never went up from retailers, but you had to have a lot of patience until recently (many people backordered on Digikey too, and would eventually get a shipment even of CM4).
@@JeffGeerling Yeah i know that list. Also i am on waiting lists since May 2021 but the shops don't get any RsPi's sooo they can display the price at 50~60€ but in reality you can't get a unit for that price :(
@@JeffGeerling Come on how could you not tell this guy was full of crap half the time? You're a very nice guy but he could barely look at you when you asked him some of your "tougher" questions. Also, I'm surprised you didn't push back when he mentioned that they've kept their original pricing this whole time. Are you kidding me??? What a load of garbage. Just like Nvidia this company no longer cares about the consumers that got them to where they are today. Their priority is selling to enterprises/businesses and when they feel like it they'll throw consumers some crumbs.
On community anger. I've definitely been a little pissed about not being able to get a pi, AND I think that it was the right call, letting people who bet their livelihoods on the pis stay at the front of the line.
Hi Jeff, first thanks for another great video and fantastic interview, very interesting.. I got into the PI just before the pandemic so I had a couple of Pi4 and Pi3. My 3 runs 24/7. I believe that we only touch the surface of what these units can do. I will say my only wish is I was 30 or 40 years younger, as I wish I would be around in 40 years to see where all this is going. Thanks again Jeff and congratulations on your trip as well.
Thank you SO much to all the channel's supporters (Patreon, GitHub, UA-cam), and especially to PiShop.us, who sponsored this video. Check them out at www.pishop.us
Do RPIs have management engines like Apple and Intel and AMD CPUs?
@@jamesm5192 According to a few users across various forums, there is no management engine in RPis; this is as the ARM chips themselves that are used in the Pis (so far) haven't had a management engine. However, the GPU cores may or may not *sort of* act as a management engine in some cases, as far as I'm aware.
@@boneappletee6416 Right, so far it is just some random users on message boards. Since this video featured the co-founder, I figured we could get a more authoritative answer.
"shortages" bs... shortages for raspberry pi but 1000000 clones without shortage where do they find chips? Or risc v which are abundant as well and ok which also is a different instruction set but like PRODUCTIONWISE it needs the same facilities so where is the shortage? they just inflate the price by decreasing availability.
Also if the shortage is real (which it is not but lets suppose it is) to the point where something that costs $20 now sells for $120+ then why not just increase production? I mean its not like we are talking about bleeding edge nanometer production here as with the flagship x86 CPUs there are many places and tooling in reasonable prices that could facilitate an increase in production.
So there is no excuse.
I was surprised there was no mention of the Rockchip 3588.
From Transporter to co-founder of Raspberry Pi 🔥
🤣
Needs to transport more of these into production and then to retail outlets.
1 second into the video and I was like Jason Statham?!
I loved him in crank😂
27:02
I was never an angry customer, a sad one. I'm glad he supported the Pi centric SMBs, and his price & supply strategy is a great business ethic. Thanks for doing this interview
The anger came from how long the shortages have lasted.
@@sylviam6535 Cause he catered to businesses and resellers who scooped up 99% of the pi's then resold them or used them to make money off people for 5x the price.
@@orangehatmusic225 Funny how people like you get real salty about profits. We live in an economy that survives and thrives on profits, not charity. Get over it.
neither was i. i started using ESP32's instead of Linux running Raspberry Pi's. For things that are compute intensive, i use a cluster of ESP32s daisychain networked over high speed serial ports
This strategy is what caused the supply problem. But he blames his mistake on a political ideology
This is straight up the highest quality video I’ve seen with Eben. Good work Jeff.
Jeff Geerling has that Anton Chigurh vibe and physiognomy whereas Upton is more or less Jason Statham's visage as well as buccal attributes. I think they feature in a nerdy Scifi, action, scary dong-in-mouth erotic movie.
Eben is such a pure soul. When asked about the legacy of Raspberry Pi, the first thing that pops into his head was how happy he is that through this journey he got to meet most of his heroes and would like someone from the future generations to feel the same way about Raspbery Pi as a company/orgnaization. I love this community and Eben, if you are reading this, keep on doing what you are doing. All of us hobbyists cannot be more thankful to you ♥
Eben seems like a genuinely good person!
I feel like the real legacy of the Pi will be retro tech tear down videos in the year 2067. I predict the vast majority of the units will still be working along happily, and some old fart like me will be talking about how the Pi changed the maker world.
@@LanceCSTCuddy We can hope 🤞
I've always had the greatest respect for Eben, and this interview just cemented that. From keeping small businesses who rely on Pis afloat, to not raising prices, to keeping Pis out of scalpers hands... anyone who is upset at Raspberry Pi or Eben at this point just doesn't understand the actual difficulties faced in industry over the last three years. Fantastic job on this Jeff.
A great interview. Someone once said that the aim of the interviewer is to ask all the questions that you didn’t know you would ask if given the opportunity. You definitely did that.
The funny thing was, on the plane home, and while editing this video, I thought of about 10 more questions I *wish* I would've asked. Well, good for a follow up in the future!
Yeah, great job @JeffGeerling.
Sounds like a honest response
Given Eben's adoration of the BBC Micro -- shared by so many of us of a certain age -- I really wish they'd do a special edition Pi 400 8GB in BBC Micro colours: pebbled beige case, black keys, red-orange function keys, brown arrow keys.
Ditto, a proper retro Pi 400 (but using modern switches, modern Pi guts) would be quite amazing.
@@JeffGeerling My Pi400 Keyboard is my daily PC so is getting a few keyboard keys that are less responsive. A mech keyboard that can take the Pi400 PCB is on my wish list.
@ tom gidden and it must have an expansion slot for a plug-in add-on double power second processor -one made my 1982 BBC B sprint instead of jog along. (I started programming in1969, then built 2 sbc computers from scratch in 1977)
I'm definitely of that age... 40+ something now. The first time I heard the "duuuuuuurrrrr-di" of the BBC Micro I was hooked. It's something I'd love to pass onto my 6 year old, but unfortunately she's more I interested in her tablet running Minecraft and Roblox, something about running away from a Piggy... Anyway, my hope is, that in 30+ years, I hope she has the same admiration I had for the BBC, the C64, the Amiga, and can pass on the nostalgia to the next generation. That's what will make us grow and evolve and be better. Unless AI kills us of first.
@@StuStones Ah yes, those green pigs, in less than a decade she could be making virtual worlds in Unreal 10.
And keep in mind he's doing all this ON TOP of filming Fast and Furious and giant shark movies!
Well, he is the Transporter after all.
😂😂😂
And he’s married to Immortan Joe’s favourite wife!
Didn't know that Jason Statham did computers
I was thinking the exact same thing myself
Came to comment the same.
At least this will make casting blockbuster Raspberry Pi docudrama easy
@@hjf3022 dont give Hollywood an idea 🤣
What a fabulous interview. I'm so impressed by Eben; he's brilliant, articulate and most of all personable! There's a genuineness to him that's rare to find in many people these days, let alone someone of his acumen and level of success. Thank you, Jeff, for doing this.
When it comes to the Pi Pico, I think it's saving grace was the PIO features! Without that, it would've just been another microcontroller that got lost in the sea of other cheap microcontrollers.
The pico w is a miracle board. I used a pi zero for a project but didn't like the long boot times. Turns out that a pico is actually capable of handling all the time critical tasks better and boots in seconds. Did I mention cheaper? Did I mention smaller? Amazing board.
The pico w has revolutionized my projects and blown the door wide open on the amount of things I try just for the sake of trying. I love it.
Great software ecosystem for it, too.
And/or vice versa.... I use SiLabs micros and such... but they're not OpenCV compatible and really can't Linux...
It's either "somebody strapped Linux to an Arduino" or... "somebody gave you IO with a SBC"
I agree, that's really a fantastic feature + for the rest its quiet well equipped
"We have had alot of fruit companies. Apricot, Tangerine, Acorn...I might have forgotten one there. Oh well..."
Just savage.
🍎
Acorns really are fruits btw (the subs say otherwise).
@@Retodon8 I was talking about Apple.
@@Dem0n1337 I know, I was referring to the video’s subs.
Thanks Jeff for a fantastic interview. You let the person and personality show through. You can tell how dedicated Eben is to the Raspberry Pi and it's community. Mucho Kudo's
No, not dedicated the the community, but to the OEMs. If there is extra supply then the community will get some.
@@paultruzzi911 Did you listen to what was said? Did you hear the numbers mentioned and the reasons behind their decisions? Clearly not, or more likely, you just deliberately ignored them to try and stir up bad feeling. Either that or you're just an idiot.
Thanks Jeff - So glad to be an enabler for things like this - Eben is an amazing speaker, such a great interview
Thanks for coming over here to do the interview Jeff! It was an amazing discussion, I found it very interesting 😊
I grew up on Raspberry Pi - it was my first computer and I’ve since had many more raspberry pis 😂
Without Raspberry Pi i would have never found my love for Linux and my Love for Computers.
I would not work in the field, if Raspberry Pi wasn't there.
i think for me its the other way around, i love linux, and for years i wanted to try a raspberry pi, but never had use for it. after i bought it i have a thousand uses for it, so when it available ill by one more :) maybe even an cm4 just to play.
@@davidzuijdwijk6806 - What are some of the uses you have found for it? Just curious because I haven’t discovered (m)any (due to lack of m.2 SSD.)
@@gearboxworks I'm not a fan of the company itself anymore, but there's literally dozens upon dozens of things you can do with a Pi, if not hundreds. You can host your own website, host your own search engine, learn programming, set up a media server, host your own VPN, turn it into a smartphone, learn cluster computing. Honestly, there's so many things to do with a Pi that I've barely done a fraction of them.
@@liquidmobius Oh, okay. I was thinking you meant you could do so many things with a Pi you could not do with a regular computer/server.
If you meant “there are thousands of uses for a computer/server” then sure, I think there are tens of thousands of things you can do with one, likely more.
But I just do those things with an x86 computer with lots of RAM running a hypervisor like Proxmox, and lots of VMs and/or containers. So much easier than running a bunch of Pis.
@@liquidmobius - I can’t seem to find your reply to me where you were (likely rightly) saying my reply sounded sarcastic. I did not mean it to be sarcastic so rather than let others read it and think the same I’m going to include that reply below this paragraph.
--
Re-reading my comment I can definitely see how it could have I been interpreted as sarcastic, please, except that I was asking questions without an agenda.
I was honestly interested in your stated use-cases for the Pi that I had not previously envisioned and that were not something I could do with other larger computers.
But I when you answered with usage I could do with a regular computer and that were not unique to an SBC like the Pi I responded with disappointment, which it appears you interpreted as me being sarcastic. Given that that was likely my fault, please accept my apologies.
I am aware of a few things for which the Pi is uniquely suited for, but not many so when you said “thousands” I was really intrigued to learn more. Again, it was my disappointment that you were referring to things I could do with other computers as opposed to things the Pi is uniquely capable of.
Finally, the last thing I want to do is create drama from my comments. I plan to start posting videos about home labs and I was just looking for more ideas on how to use a Pi in ways I cannot just use virtual machines and containers on a Proxmox server for.
P.S. Also, to be clear, my mention of x86 was not antagonistic to ARM, it was just my way of referring to the type of computers that most people typically run servers on today, nothing more.
So good to have Eben himself explain directly what the challenges and subsequent solutions to Pi availability have been over this past crazy 3 years or so. I've always admired his vision and was afraid that he had strayed from it (having read varions press articles) but it's clear that he is doing the very best he can by all interested parties. Thanks Jeff for asking the right questions. Awesome stuff as ever.
You are being too generous, he didn't do the best he could for ALL parties. He did the best he could for OEMs and users got any leftovers. That isn't doing the best for ALL parties. You noticed, he never mentions the split; was it 99:1, 90:10?
@@paultruzzi911 You are welcome to your opinion, correct or otherrwise.
I loved this interview. I watched it twice. :) I appreciated hearing Ebon's explanation for the shortages and the very human physical reaction he had when you brought up some people stating that they would never purchase a Pi again because of the shortages. He has always been an interesting and truly good human being.
Great interview! Enjoyed every minute and all the bits of humor!
The PI being out of stock and the Pico being plentiful has actually been very interesting. We're discovering that the Pico is a really capable computer that we have overlooked because the PI was available. Reading some sensors and posting the numbers to a server was typically a job for a full blown PI but really a Pico WiFi can do it for a lot cheaper and a lot less power.
I really appreciate my PI more now and will use it as a proper computer or a proper server and give the job of running a single program to the Pico. Really that's what a Pico is, something to run a single program from boot up. Where as a PI is a general purpose computer similar to a PC in that it has an operating system and can run a bunch of programs at the same time.
I guess in years past the big pi may have been seen more fittingly as embedded ala pico, but I don't go back so far
Microprocessors are able to run lots of tasks, it’s just to select a proper RTOS (i.e. Chibios, RTOS)
The pico is not a computer, it's a micro processor, it's a completely different thing
is pico the first microcontroller that you came across? never heard of arduino or esp?
@@somethingsomething464 There was the PIC from Microchip. They were popular in the 1990's for 'chipping' a PlayStation so it thought pirated CDs were genuine. Technically things like the Z80 and 6502 were micro controllers that needed a few support chips. The radical part was fitting memory, storage and IO into the package meaning you no longer needed data and address pins, they could be used for IO. Your typical 1980 microprocessor had 40 pins and none of them did anything useful, then along came the PIC and prity much all it's pins did something you could use, like turn on an LED or read a sensor.
The amazing thing about a Pico is that it's about 100 times more powerful than a Z80 or 6809 from the 1980's yet it's still a little chip that you turn on an LED and read a sensor like a PIC.
Hi Jeff, I hope you enjoyed your trip to my side of the pond. Welcome to the UK 😊
Just got a Raspberry Pi 4 8GB to upgrade my current 2GB model today! Got it from the last Adafruit restock and unfortunately the shipping and other fees to Europe made it very overpriced...
Nice! I hope stock improves around the globe too, so we don't have to do this complicated dance of ordering from other countries just because they're available there!
Considering they are made in the UK its near impossible to buy one here!
@@AndrewAHayes Consider back ordering from RapidOnline UK. I ordered an 8GB in January and received it four days later. I was so surprised I back-ordered another 3 to build a K3S cluster, and they arrived in four weeks. I don't know if I was just lucky, but I figured I could always cancel the order if I found them somewhere else quicker.
Eben Upton and the Pi Foundation demonstrated great skill and integrity in managing one of the greatest crises ever to come out of left field. So nice to see Jeff Geerling get the chance to sit down with the great man and have a really excellent conversation!
Raspberry is part of history. Changed my life in many crazy projects , not too fancy but small and super practical.
Hope to see new models soon. That should help reduce the demand/scalping for the Pi4.
You and me both!
hope they release RISC-V variant
They already said the Pi 5 would definitely NOT be coming out in 2023. On the other hand that doesn't eliminate a variant of the zero, compute module, or pico, or perhaps even a more efficient version of an older existing model or even a new version of the 4 with even more RAM or a new storage option.
@@hackerx7329 If there are enough chips available worldwide, come on chip manufactures and politicians, pull your finger out : )
With new models of Pi, they will have new Compute Modules for mass manufacturers. The regular Pis only get built when all the CM orders are filled.
This is awesome. Congrats Jeff on the sponsorship and the opportunity to travel and talk tech.
Nice to see the Archimedes get a shout out. Had an A410 back a while, followed by a RiscPC.
"I think I might have missed another one..."
💀Dude eclipsed the sun with all that shade.
As someone who benefits from smaller vendors at work that use embedded pi’s in their specialized devices, the prioritization was VERY appreciated. As an enthusiast it is difficult but understandable.
If you have a choice between keeping companies in business by getting them product, or getting product to hobbyists, the former is always the right choice. This man’s decision kept people employed. I can wait a little longer to get Pis for my projects.
So great to hear someone who knows their products and is passionate about them, about how they are used, and the community that uses them.
too bad the products suck and are defended by fanboys as if it was the iPhone.
I was one of the lucky few who ordered a Oi Zero 2 on release day and it been running the Octopi installation on my 3D printer since. I recall checking a month later and couldn't find anyone selling one, and according to Rpi locator they only turn up in the UK rarely, so I was lucky. For what it it, its a great little board and I look forward to it becoming more generally available.
It is a great little board that never really got to spread its wings-but it sounds like it should be in stock most places by the end of this month!
@@JeffGeerling the pi zero 2 has been out of stock so long, I feel like it might not ever get it's time to truly shine
Great interview. Nice to hear strait from Stathan's mount.
I love their reasoning when adding features and pricing.
This shortage has left me without a pi since 2020. I volunteer at one of the foundation's own code clubs and we don't have a single board, and are relying on microbit devices
Did you ever own a Raspi? If so, where is it? And if not: how did you become a volunteer?
Where do you live? I've managed to easily get 3 this year from retailers in the UK.
@@georgebarlowr Did you pay MSRP? I could get one but I am not paying inflated prices or scalpers.
I suspect you're being a bit over dramatic. If the members of a Raspberry Pi club don't have a single Pi between them, it's clearly not a club with any interest in Raspberry Pis.
Sadly I only had to get my pi4 8gb ram from a scalper but other then that they been pretty good for me I do need more pi zeros tho :( 2 down one left 😢 there amazing devices to mess around with hopefully zeros are back in stock soon
Jeff I enjoyed your interview with Eban Upton. My son who worked with RPis both professionally and then as a hobbyist started me on them. I was able to do a few projects with lots of help. I never bothered to investigate the history of the company but learned lots from your interview. A job well done.
Thx for the Canadian coupon code!!!!!! 🎉🎉🎉 🇨🇦🇨🇦🇨🇦
As an Acorn Electron user from way back who lusted after a BBC Model B this made me smile muchly. Thanks Jeff!
My first computer was an Electron too. It's fun to compare the specs of those devices with modern computers and be amazed at what they could do.
@@edwardharman1153 Indeed, I still in awe of how those wizards coded the likes of Elite with such limitations. My first computer was a ZX81 and it started a career path that I continue to this day :)
Are you sure you didn't hire Jason Statham for this interview? - awesome interview, and glad you liked your visit to us here in the UK.
Hope to be back soon!
First David Bombal and now you talking with Eben Upton. This is a must see video.
Ha, that interview was a surprise to me, I had no idea David was going to be at Pi HQ, otherwise I would've tried to align my schedule better :) - we've met virtually a couple times, but as with most others outside of St. Louis, never met in person!
@@JeffGeerling After seeing your video, you talk about different things than David. Even though you were slower than David, I don't feel like it was the same. It is always great to have different angles on a subject.
@@JeffGeerling Be great to meet in person! Hopefully one of these days we can also interview you on my channel :)
Ha, "The other fruit company". Excellent work as always Jeff, keep up the good work.
As someone who also cut his computing teeth on the BBC Micro, AND was lucky enough to work with with Sophie Wilson straight out of uni, I enjoyed every minute of that interview! Throughout, I kept thinking of an old Rory Gallagher line: this guy sounds as if he has eight bollocks 😅
Thank you Jeff. I was prompted to check rpilocator while watching this and actually found stock of the PI4 available to purchase here in the UK 🎉
This is what true Hero's look like, Always liked Eben, every interview I find something more to like.
Eben clearly swiped that shirt from their merch closet moments before the interview
Hehe... there's a story there, and it has to do with evil meeting room number 4 being hotter than the blazes!
I've seen lots of pi's in the wild in shops and businesses and its always a pleasant sight seeing them used for everything
I work in a tech company… My boss unexpectedly came to the and saw me watching this video… and he asked me WHY THE HELL ARE YOU LOOKING AT SOME ACTOR INTERVIEW??? YOU SOULD AT LEAST BE WATCHING A TECH VIDEO… fortunately I managed to have a conversation before he could reach his office and send me a warning email for watching a Jason Statham video…
The raspberry shirt helped a lot here
Well, you weren't watching Jason Statham, but I think you may have been watching someone acting....
Thanx Jeff for bringing the Pi community the inside info. Great interview and I can never be angry at the RPi foundation. Every company took a great hit worldwide because of Covid! 👌
Hearing him talk about the shortage, the business priorities, and the effect on people was IMMENSELY helpful in calming my anger at the company; even if it was hard to understand through his Miley Cyrus level of vocal fry. Looking forward to buying more Raspberry Pi's and thank you to Jeff for doing this interview.
amazing that this started out as a way to get children to learn to code, and then parents got hold of their children's Pi and remembered their own childhood with amiga's, spectrums, and BBC micros. the kids never saw the Pi again as parents took over for "safety" reasons like with train sets and Scalextric. its the industrial uses of the Pi that has amazed me, with a £90 Pi basically replacing a £4000 PLC in industrial uses.
That's the really shitty thing. They've become so expensive that most parents won't buy a Pi for their kids, which was literally the target demographic of the Pi to begin with.
After waiting for a cm4 for over a year I finally got a second hand Intel NUC. I am very happy about the versatility of it and I don't need to thinker or worried about performance.
A NUC is an excellent little computer, especially if you're going for more server/homelab/media center type usage.
How much did you pay for Intel NUC? Is it doing the job?
Thanks for this trip and interview. Nicely done
That is one of the better interviews I have seen with Eben. Thanks. Most interesting.
Phenomenon example of an intelligent interview when the interviewer and interviewee are so passionate about the subject matter. Truly entertaining to watch
Fantastic interview; definitely enjoyed that and a lot of what was said aligned with what I thought was happening (although talking about prioritising some of the OEM customers wasn't quite what I thought). Also glad you asked about RISC-V. You should try to get in touch with Alex Bradbury about it, I know he was working on Risc-V at one stage. I suspect internally there is some RISC-V designs, but still probably some time away from actual silicon.
That was excellent! Thanks for spending the time/effort/money to do this.
Thank YOU for watching!
As for RiscV in class A, I think that another alternative like the Power core is better, it already has optimizations at some level including linux kernel, and it doesn't have the licensing costs, in addition to being a very mature ISA with decades of history.
9:26 I was an angry customer. I never said "I'll never use a pi again" though - never *really* angry at RasPi (was a bit till this was explained here). I would have bought one if they became available. I was just mostly mad at scalpers selling used pis at premium NEW prices and frustrated that half the projects I wanted to do with a pi, I couldn't. I ended up having to do something else or abandoning the projects completely. That said, this was cathartic and much needed. Thank you Jeff and Eben for this video.
I basically started "the RPi hobby" in 2022 as a better alternative to what I was doing before. Learning DIY electronics went a bit further as well.
Did they tell you about the history of that Sony factory? Not only does it make Sony products and also the RPi range but it was once home to a product from Sir Clive Sinclair. The Sinclair C5 was made there back when the factory made washing machines. Failed in Wales!! (OK, showing my age a bit now)
Regardless of who paid for the trip, it certainly seems like they're on a bit of a "media tour" with all the interviews that have popped up over the last couple of weeks.
This trip was actually in the plans for the past 6 months, though my surgery and recovery delayed it a bit. I don't know about the other interviewers, but for me it was a long-planned event, just kept getting delayed :(
@@JeffGeerling your health issues were clearly part of the conspiracy
Think it's more of the globe opening up as travel restrictions lifted, with an appropriate amount of lag for logistical travel planning. Timing is good, as ~6 month from when chip shortage blog was posted. In another 6 months, will be fascinating to look back and see how stock prognostics materialized.
Thanks Jeff, great interview and allowing Eben to speak freely, interesting to hear both the technical as well as commercial constraints.
I have a new respect for Jason Statham now. Between all his work in action flicks, how did he have the time to co-found the development of Raspberry Pi?
Thanks for getting that interview Jeff - Love it!
Quite a lot of anger in the community I've seen actually stems from the day that the raspberry pi official social media account instantly blocked a load of long time customers for querying the post which delightfully announced they had hired an ex surveillance cop
That whole situation (seems like the perfect storm that had shockwaves through Mastodon, Twitter, and Reddit all at once) was a good lesson in how *not* to do PR.
@@JeffGeerling Or who not to allow access to the company social media accounts. Because we all know who that official was!
It was so rude
They really screwed up on that one! I got blocked as well! :(
@@dfgdfg_ yes, she was extremely rude. And incompetent as PR person.
I respect that he's straightforward with it, and he's got a point. At my last job, we worked with a company (ProDataKey, or PDK, out of Utah! Give 'em a lookup!) that employed Raspberry Pis in their products, and their stuff was REALLY nice. They're probably one of these smaller companies that he's talking about, I was on a first-name basis with their support team (not because of their products, but because of the approach that company took towards their approach and quality-control of installing access control infrastructure - i was not a fan), and they were all great. Definitely a smaller company, but definitely a good one.
So I can see that argument. I'm also glad he's not corporate-speaking to us, and being pretty blunt, like, "Yeah, we went for the industrial market." I get that. But at the same time, I can't imagine that the folks at AdaFruit or SparkFun or the like couldn't also move 3,000+ units pretty reliably. Like, THOSE businesses matter, too, homeslice. >:/
This is on of the most interesting vids you have done. Not to say the others aren't good, but this one was excellent. Thank you. Or since you are in the UK, Cheers!
Back in the States now, but hope to be back in the UK again!
A great interview Jeff. Eben is the antithesis of most entrepreneurs these days. He's not in it for the money and the fame, but because he genuinely wants to provide affordable ways for everyday people to get into computing, programming and electronics etc. The fact that they didn't hike prices, they tried to be equitable to their customers and still provide really long term support for their products speaks volumes.
The CM4s coming back will be sweet. Been eyeballing the waveshare UPS carrier board.
I just want enough to finally build my final CM4 cluster I've wanted to build a couple years now.
@@JeffGeerling I got my Turing Pi 2 a few weeks ago and admit that I paid an obscene price to put a single CM4 in it... but soon!
I was lucky enough to get some pis before the shortage. The device and the software has been solid for me. Some of the most fun I've had with computers. Opened me up to many ideas, like interfacing the GPIO with relays to control things, IOT, home networking, NAS.... many things I would not have bothered with if not for the pi and the FOSS community around it (thanks Jeff for being a champion here). Business choices must be tough. Glad someone else has to make the call and gamble their money on it. I could still use a couple more pis. And even more so, if any of mine should happen to fail, not having another to replace it would hurt.
Personally I've largely given up with RPI. I still have some and if I want to mess around with some physical projects I'd go to them but for anything that doesn't need GPIO then it's going to sit as a VM or container on a cheap 2nd hand intel box. The biggest problem for me was their complete PR failure of treating the hobbyist as an irrelevant community and anyone who even politely asked about future availability found themselves facing insane levels of aggression (if not actual hate) from RPI business - they forgot where they came from, and what they were supposed to represent - education and hobbyist - and went for profits on sales to business. Interesting also recently to note that some businesses that were using RPI in their products have also ditched. them in favour of other SBCs which are more widely available.
Whoever printed that shirt deserves a shout-out.
Either you applied a ton of post production or this is one of the most vibrant shirt I have ever seen xD
Its funny that when I look back on the thing that got me started in automation and programming, it can all be traced back to me playing around with raspberry pis. Who would have thought that me buying a few single board computers would lead me down the path I'm on now regarding data analytics, automation, and most importantly, python. Crazy stuff.
Thank you for traveling over for this one, great interview!
I've given up on Raspberry Pi. I get the feeling they got a taste of success and don't care about the hobbiest market now. Their are lagging in technology, and when you can finally get one you have to pay a lot. I've had some success with Orange Pi now. Its a real shame.
100%
Eben addressed that concern (though not the 'lagging in technology' bit), and love or hate the decision, I think I understand the reasoning behind it.
I think by the end of this year, a lot of us will be excited again, because instead of paying $50 for an SBC that mostly works, we'll be able to spend $35 for an SBC that definitely works.
something something stockholm syndrome
Orange pi 5 works great for my use-case, im selling my rpi4b
Agreed. Raspberry Pi started out as a foundation selling computers for hobbyists and children, but now the founder says he'd prefer to keep selling to businesses over the average hobbyist and that "businesses are just people"...well, for the smallest of small businesses I'd agree, but the companies buying up entire production runs of Compute Module 4s or setting up giant compute clusters are not small family businesses. At a certain size, business is not "just people". The business side is more lucrative and they can sell higher volumes at once. I see why that's appealing to them, but it completely nullifies their original goal of providing cheap computers for hobby and educational purposes. Prioritizing businesses over those original markets shows the their true nature. Actions speak louder than words. If they actually wanted to prioritize the hobby and educational markets they wouldn't even be making Compute Modules during a shortage.
Great video Jeff. The innovation in the SBC space has accelerated and advanced alternatives based on Rockchip, NXP, Nvidia have emerged, improved and removed some of the market dependence on Pi. This factor combined with the advanced AIoT features, TOPS and performance for prices similar to the Pi4 running Linux (Debian), windows11 and Android changes how makers, students and industrial customers select SBC platforms.
Thanks for this. This level of transparency, with great explanation of the thought process, is what we need from more companies.
This guy got a new fan.
Eben, on the very slim chance you read this, as someone who works in the technology side of higher education, who has seen the most amazing projects come through based on the Pi, and as a Beeb owner - I can categorically tell you that yes - the Pi will and already has that affection you speak of.
It bought back that idea of “general hackery” similar to the 70s and 80s that the computer industry practically lost for 30 years and as already led to legions of new computer engineers doing things and pushing boundaries that they absolutely wouldn’t be without the mighty Pi.
That's wonderful to hear. We do love our "general hackery". Thank you for the kind words!
Pi is now an also ran. Lots of better cheaper alternatives are available now. They blew it.
Thanks so much for this interview. Great to hear from Evan
It'd be one thing if they weren't available for like six months or a year, but it's been three solid years since we've been able to buy one. If that's not abandoning the maker community and everyone who made the company so successful in the first place, then I don't know what is.
Yep. I keep making the same comment on every video: I've been waiting 3 years for an authorized seller to have one in stock... :( It looks like they are about to get caught up... but I wonder how much business they lost by having none available and how many competitors will become a better Pi alternative.
Damn right. Not to mention making it ridiculously expensive for somebody to get into the community, especially kids or people who don't want to commit a ton of money right away. One could argue that the introduction of multiple different versions of the 4 was the nail in the coffin.
@@heyitismyusername doesn't help that the mainstream community rarely talks about alternatives, meaning some people are under the impression that there's no new SBCs to even buy that'll be compatible.
Wonderful interview! Thank you for making the journey and asking some of the hard questions.
If they already abadoned diy market for oem/corporate, they might have as well floated prices to maximise profits, which would allow them to expand production capacity and secure more wafer allocation for newer products.
Literally, what he said is 'we proritised big orders, deal with it' but in PR-speech
Great interview. I look forward to the factory tour one. :)
Thanks! Maybe between all of us UA-camy people, we can keep up a 6 month interview cycle :)
What a great interview Jeff. You got a lot out of him that we've never heard before. I hadn't ever heard him acknowledge the scalping and he actually admitted he wished he would have controlled the "commercial partners" by grilling them on what they need the Pis for much earlier.
The RISC-V answers were also very interesting. He was just bragging about how RP2040 was a completely new platform and how impressed he was that people jumped on board. RISC-V is also a relatively new platform and people are definitely jumping right into that one too. I suppose his argument would be it's still ARM based (and he kind of mentioned that).
Although I disagree with some of the things he said I actually like him better after the interview. He manned up to some mistakes that I've been griping about for years. That goes a long way with me. He said he has no regrets about not letting the commercial customers go under but you can tell he does regret not vetting the commercial customers better and earlier and that also goes a long way with me.
This year's first quarter being their worst ever checks out. We'll see if he can hit these late year numbers on the Pi Zero (and I keep trying to tell people we're almost exclusively talking about Pi Zeros and maybe some Pi 4s).
I'm honestly more sad these days than I am angry with them. Except for maybe the cameras part. He just straight up said "I never feel bad about that and taking the margin from that". They should feel bad about the camera not being open source though and more open. That's probably the worst thing he said though and everyone knows that the official accessories are pure margin / vendor lock-in anyways.
At the end of the day mistakes were made and he at least owned up to a lot of those!
My pi 4 supply has dwindled to a single unit. Its a champ though and has been covering a few different projects.
This man is a legend,
I still have a raspberry pi 1model B(256 MB), it's limited resources is what make me love it as it drives me to optimize the code as possible as I can even though I didn't touch it for years now.
Thanks Jeff
I love this mindset. The bloat and inefficiency we've seen in some spaces is really frustrating.
@@PsRohrbaugh You should watch Kaze and his Super Mario 64 optimizations
Fantastic level of transparency from Ebon, refreshing from someone in business.
The thing I’m most excited about is Picamera2 moving out of beta; when it does happen I can move forward with my GPS PPS disciplined time lapse camera.
Ooh, that sounds like a fun project!
I've been a long time Pi user, having ordered my first Pi about 6 minutes after sales first opened for the original model. I have a project on the shelf waiting for a Raspberry Pi 4. It will use DPI at custom clocks so I don't know if any other SBC that is capable of doing this, and even if some do their lack of open documentation is a showstopper. I've had a 4Gb Pi 4 (it will be my first Pi 4) on backorder now for about 14 months, and no sign of the order being fulfilled any time soon.
As a hobbyist I find this frustrating, but it's just the reality. I'm pleased with the way raspberry pi foundation has handled the shortage and just hope I'll be able to get my hands on one soon!,
Lucky the shortage is over, there is surplus on many components now, I hope RP can catchup with the demand this year like most other companies.
Was there ever a shortage of RP2040?
There wasn't a shortage, but there was a slight delay in getting the chip (separate from the Pico) shipping in volume; Eben mentioned that was one thing he was sad they couldn't deliver sooner (to help with the microcontroller shortage sooner).
Excellent video 👍🏻👍🏻. Thanks Jeff
Jeff just to let you know, we British don't all speak like the pie dude. Its a Cambridge thing lol
I'm from Hull, Liverpool you can't understand lol and the Scottish not a chance haha 😆
haha well I also visited Wales, and they do speak a bit different there too!
@Jeff Geerling I travelled to Nottingham yesterday to collect a TV Jeff stopped twice 95 miles there 4 different accents I couldn't believe it and I'm brittish. PS Jeff thank you for all your videos, you sir are amazing
Certainly have fond memories of my BBC Micro 32K, not so fond a time getting burgled and it getting stolen.. :( But it did get replaced with a Master Compact, that floppy drive was a big upgrade for me, after having used cassette tape.
Later getting a A3000, so was of course an early user of a RISC machine.. :) It was an amazing machine at the time, the OS even though parts of it were initially written in BASIC was super fast & way ahead of Windows & Mac. I always remember it's party trick of been able to format a floppy drive, at the same time as copying files to it. I always thought it not taking off across the pond was a missed opportunity. Even if you look at screenshots of the 1987 Risc OS, I think it still looks amazing, I wish I aged that well.. :) Remember this was when Windows 2.0 was released.. Yuck!!
Been moving away from RsPi's
They ditched there initial costumer base to make more provide of from "Here we sell you a Box now give us money".
And the price is still at 180€ for a Pi4 .... so yeah f**it RsPi is dead for small projects
Make sure to follow rpilocator.com - for the past month now, there have been multiple Pi 4 models popping up at MSRP at retailers around the world. The price never went up from retailers, but you had to have a lot of patience until recently (many people backordered on Digikey too, and would eventually get a shipment even of CM4).
@@JeffGeerling Yeah i know that list. Also i am on waiting lists since May 2021 but the shops don't get any RsPi's sooo they can display the price at 50~60€ but in reality you can't get a unit for that price :(
@@JeffGeerling Come on how could you not tell this guy was full of crap half the time? You're a very nice guy but he could barely look at you when you asked him some of your "tougher" questions. Also, I'm surprised you didn't push back when he mentioned that they've kept their original pricing this whole time. Are you kidding me??? What a load of garbage. Just like Nvidia this company no longer cares about the consumers that got them to where they are today. Their priority is selling to enterprises/businesses and when they feel like it they'll throw consumers some crumbs.
It's wonderful to listen to them talking, enjoyed it to the end
On community anger. I've definitely been a little pissed about not being able to get a pi, AND I think that it was the right call, letting people who bet their livelihoods on the pis stay at the front of the line.
Really enjoyed the conversation!
Currently I can buy them in the UK, lots of them and at the right price not those crazy prices after the scalpers get their hands on them : )
One case where tech in the UK is easier to acquire than in North America or Asia!
Hi Jeff, first thanks for another great video and fantastic interview, very interesting.. I got into the PI just before the pandemic so I had a couple of Pi4 and Pi3. My 3 runs 24/7. I believe that we only touch the surface of what these units can do. I will say my only wish is I was 30 or 40 years younger, as I wish I would be around in 40 years to see where all this is going. Thanks again Jeff and congratulations on your trip as well.