@@MindBodySoulOk Roughly 12 microns/ meter/ celcius witch is a fraction of what your aluminum mast is going the other way. Don't forget the spreaders are also playing the shrinking/ expanding game😉
And with that my idea to change to Dynema rigging went down to the abysses: I love late fall sailing in Norway and sometimes I keep the boat on water during winter too. Seems to be just to cold for synthetics here .....
If it’s going to be cold for an extended period of time, just adjust the rigging for that temperature. The only time it’s bad is if it fluctuates dramatically from day to day
@@RiggingDoctor I understand but the the problem is those cold nights like you had with temps down to freezing followed by warm day, especially in Sept-Oct when fall sailing is the most glorious. Maybe rig a quick tightening but adjustable lever mechanism or tackle, just as there was on old classic boats for their running backstays?
A combination of turnbuckles and deadeyes may work for quick adjustments.. I would love to see a scientifically based example of this stretch and tighten please. Ie Did you film the next day in the warm, so that you can show before and after? I can see now why they say one needs the same material on opposing forces- I have a new steel forestay and I was planning to install a dyneema backstay- now I can see that that would be a problem when the steel contacts and the dyneema expands - the mast will bend forward, and under wind and sail load it may collapse. I currently have baby stay and check stays in dyneema and I think I will push on to remove the four thirty-year old shrouds and install dyneema on those; and put on a new steel backstay. Thanks for the heads up on this. Any advice?
Is not the Dynema expanding, come on. Its the mast changing the lengh with temperature. Dynema is a polimer, doesn't change its lengh with temperature. And don't quit the idea of using Dynema. I already have the solution. I will put it on paper.
Thanks for making this video! I was seriously considering swapping from stainless steel wire to Dyneema rigging. Nope! Not after seeing how unbelievably loose your rig is in the cold!!! I never would have guessed that that would happen!
'Back in the day', (mid-70's) SS for a suite of standing rigging for my Herreshoff Marco Polo was pretty much outside the budget....so I went with galvanized, linseed oiled and served the lower 10' or so. It lasted until the 10 year refit and was replaced with minimal cost, though I choose to use Nico-Press the second time around. -Veteran '66-68 (EX- Schooner 'Valkyrie')
We have a 48v system so it’s always in 48v for the motor and 12v for the house loads. When it’s our life and not an educational course, we cut the units short. The issue is that then other people who don’t live this exact life only get partial information when we cut units out of the sentence
If I hadn’t given a Thumbs Up, parrots in cozy fleece jackets woulda done it. Thanks for the rigging info; had no idea. Good reminder to stay where the weather suits my clothes. 😎⛵️🌴
Beaufort, is a French word meaning, good fort ? its what i was told so not sure? but all Beaufort's i know are towns and in good spots, if you think defense etc.
I love the feather baby hoodies. Too cute. Interesting about the synthetic rigging - my mind was 180° opposite of the reality. For some reason I thought colder weather would cause the lines to be more taught, and warmer the weather more slack. Thanks for the info!
It's the mast that expands and contracts with temperature causing the dyneema rigging to go taut or slack, respectively. The dyneems doesn't expand or contract much. The same thing happens in aircraft with control cables. When the aluminum airframe heat soaks, it expands faster than the steel control cables, causing them to go taut. The opposite occurs when they cold soak.
@@maxrudder6091 Thanks for this input - it makes so much sense. I presume if the rigging were steel it would expand and contract in a more similar way to the mast, but there would be some slackening and tightening if there were big temperature differences.
Exactly. Steel and aluminum move in a similar way, but synthetic moves in the opposite. Imagine the temperature drops 50°F and the mast contracts 2mm, but the stay expands 3mm. Now the stay is 5mm too long and that will make it very slack. The good thing is when it warms up it all goes right back into place.
Logic Herb! Is the length of mast that modified. The steel rig has a long elastic deformation dominium. It will stretch. The synthetic one has none. What you tightened was the elongation given by the braiding. But no problem, being in bed with the flu I have time to create. Based on your videos I will build a stretcher with a constant keeping tension and I had already an idea how to mechanically inspect the stays with a camera fixed on a climbing device you can command electrical from the deck. I am thinking even at a small tank leaving a coat of a treatment. Getting back on metal or bronze rings for sail, these, by rubbing on stay, the pressure and temperature will force the carbon chains to stick on rings forming a solid coat. Thinking at on boat momentary solution, I would take out as many pad eyes as possible and put them 2 on each stay pulling them with rope on opposite direction with the proper distance in between, to ensure the necessary torque for stretching.
Jerry and Maddie are so cute saying hello to each other! Not a 100% on the law but would a hurricane lantern or the equivalent in electric by a good option for a anchor light, just run it up on the main.
Yep. Any white light that can be seen from any direction works. As a backup, sailboats can run a Lanturn up a halyard to provide illumination. We just like to have plenty of power to run our electric anchor light as well as our fridge.
Based on the linear coefficient of thermal expansion of carbon fiber, aluminum, and Dyneema, I believe that it would be less of an issue with carbon but I have no real world experience with Dyneema on a carbon spar.
very interesting to see the dyneema behave like that. I guess it is dangerous to use if in a climate where temperatures drop a lot at night. Would it make sense to use steel cable tensioners to be able to quickly tension the ropes?
Ok so how does the synthetic rigging manage in the day and night cycle? Are the differences in temperature large enough for the rigging to be slack at night?
On the ocean, the temperatures are quite consistent, so it doesn’t affect the rigging much. The big issue is when a severe cold front comes through and the temperature drops more than 40°F. That’s when it becomes an issue.
A mast jack would solve this problem. It can be done with two small bottle jacks either side of the mast heel. And a bar through the mast. You lift the mast up and use shims under until you get the required tension. This is normal on race boats and boats over about 65ft.
It's odd to think you reached freezing temperatures because I generally think of weather as warmer as you go south and I haven't turned the heat on my boat...I'm in Canada. Obviously weather is varied with cold fronts and high/low pressure systems etc but it's still a surprise 😉
A friend lives in the Pacific North West, and said a month ago that the East Pacific North South South North Current, switches direction which marks the start of Autumn, and that happened 31 days early this Year, which may have triggered an early Rctic Jet Stream move South early as well ? I'm wondering how that's going to affect on this Eastern side of the Atlantic tbh. Still, Oil tank gets filled up in the coming week, so fingers crossed. Best Wishes. Bob. 👍🤔
Do you have any concerns about the mast stability when in cold temps with the rigging loose? Do you limit your activities (besides running with the sails down) to limit stress on the mast? Keep up the great videos!
Hello there! Possible rigging is developed with less sensitivity. Till then we have choices. Seems a clear winner in the tropics. Not so much for rapid latitude changes. I am adopting it for non stay lines already. After all the distances, use of a deck generator would you make a different decision on electric drive? Diesel electric hybrid, diesel generator serial electric? I personally have reluctantly gone to fitting a Beta 16 with electric drive/hydrogenerator pods off the rudder. The new electric will have to wait with the costs. My primary issue is getting gasoline and deck generators off my boat.
This worked for the ICW but our goal is not to be running a generator at all 😉 We have plans for Windpuff since we will be building that system from the keel up!
Your Feathered Crew look Adorable! And how come Corgy doesn't get clothes? Hope you enjoy Beaufort. Lived there at Downtown Marina for years then headed South for warmer weather. Sounds as though you are doing the same, yet Dafuskye is in Georgia am I correct? It's been almost 30 years since being in that area. Love your Crew and you two are great to share your adventure! Stay Warm and Enjoy!
@@RiggingDoctor So then you are heading North these Days? Smiles...............it's gonna be cold going north for Fall, enjoy the ride wherever the journey leads you! Fair winds
15 amps of current at 50+ volts adds up quick. Easily 75-100 amp hours per day. The solar photovoltaic modules performance increases as temperature drops below 70°f. I often see 15-20% more energy production than rated. Sometimes I think about upgrading to a 150-200 volt charge controller. When the sun is low on the horizon and my strings are producing a minimal current I often wonder about the possibility of having a switch panel with three way switches to achieve a simple fast way of reconfiguring series and parallel configurations. E.G. In winter I get more than rated output between 10 a.m. and 3 p.m. but have several hours in the a.m. where switching to full amperage would pick up another 20-30% energy production. Later, after 3 p.m. switching to maximum string voltage would gain an additional 10-20% energy production. It just plain feels good to produce more power than rated. Feels great actually. Probably the thing that makes me wonder most is why people neglect solar domestic hot water panels. The evacuated tubes type panels will produce hotter water than natural gas or propane burners. My evacuated tube solar panel makes more water than I can use , in January at -40f, whenever the sun shines. If you want steam - the evacuated tubes will do it too. Best solar money can buy! I keep wondering if there is a way to inflate a vinyl boat properly with a nice dense foam? Or if anyone does sections.
Hi guys, I watched this about the cold slack rigging a few days ago & haven't been able to get it outta my head. What's the issue with using ratchets instead of all than carry-on with the checkstays, surely it would be much easier to tighten/loosen as required?
at first i was going to ask if the mast is shrinking in the cold, but i watched again and your lifeline went slack, so something to look forward to not since i have dyneema rigging except headstay and forestay. launching december
It’s a combination. The aluminum shrinks a tiny bit and the Dyneema expands a lot as the temperature drops. If you tighten it in the winter, you must mark where it was set so that you can ease it out before it gets warm because it will shrink right back to where it was in hot weather! For years, ours goes slack in the winter and we don’t mess with it, then it tightens back up when it warms again. I always say: “if it’s too cold for the rigging, then it’s too cold for me!”
What are the expansion rate of your rigging. Let's take your forstay as an example, is it to much for a steel spring to take up the slack. I have seen numbers between 0,5 to 0,6mm expansion per meter between 0-40°C but have not found information on Dyneema if it is concerning induvidual threads or braided ropes (where the thred lenght obviously is significantly longer per meter of rope). I know it's more weight (but it's on the deck at least) and it would need some service but a spring that holds 1000kg and travels less than 0.2m is a industrial standard fare and could actually be easily be used to monitor/correct the tension on the rigging.
I have toyed with this idea, but the issue is that spring would have to resist the full load of the sails. In effect, the spring would be so strong that it would then stress the rig as it would always be under maximum load. It’s a good thought but I haven’t been able to figure it out yet.
@@RiggingDoctor Good point, the engineer in me says that the solution is to splice 1/3 stainless to 2/3 of dyneema and call the problem solved, the team leader in me says that that is not a splice I ever will sign off on and the mechanic in me says just by pass the spring with a chain hook when you start sailing. The sailor in me says keep the manila it's a Gaff rig you are outfitting. 😉
In Baltimore, we had a day of -20°F and it was insanely loose. It’s still enough to keep the mast up though. And you can use the rigging as docklines 🤪
It depends on the boat, but when Wisdom heels over, the force can reach 86,500Nm. I have thought of a spring system in the past and my idea didn’t work so I would love to see and discuss your idea. If a spring could work, it would absorb the stretch and keep the rig tension year round! If you would like to chat about this, my email is riggingdr@gmail.com 😉
Awesome video herb but I have questions! How big is you battery bank in terms of power output and are they lipo4? How long and how heavy is you boat? How long since the bottom been cleaned on Wisdom? Before you turned up river were sailing with the current? I can't believe how cold it is this time of year. Smooth sailing guys👍
The battery bank is roughly 18kW of LiFePO4. Length: 45 Waterline: 32 It’s been a few months but it stays really clean with our bottom paint. Displacement: 18T Before we turned up, we were going against the wind and current, when we turned, it began pushing us.
Off course they can cross an ocean they sail across it using the wind, it’s a sailing boat, an engine is just auxiliary power whether electric or diesel. They could extend range a bit by having more solar, more batteries and a watt and sea if they wanted to, they don’t seem to need to. Having more dedicated house batteries may be an idea to keep lights on for safety.
@@andrewbrown2063 Thank you for your input Andrew but I was driving at the dudy cycle of their motor. Wondering if it could run indefinitely. I know electric motors can run to cross an ocean but does not mean their motor is designed to do so being they are a sailboat. I am more or less doing a bit of research on boats and as a live person Herby is the best I've found for info.✌️
@@jamesfrankland38thangs58 the motor is air cooled. It is designed for 24/7 operation with infinite runtime. As long as there is electricity to run it.
Very entertaining! The backstay obviously could easily take a lot of slack out of itself and the headstay. As for the shrouds, wouldn't simply tying them good together ease any problem? Perhaps except for your professional pride, I'd say.
It wouldn’t look great but it would get the job done. The same way pinching the backstays tightens them, you could pinch the shrouds to tighten them up at the moment.
They were the best thing at the time but they are far from the specs of modern ropes. They rot easily and weaken when they get wet. Synthetic is unaffected by water and never rots.
It would, but I have it set for 80°F. +30 would be 110°F and you don’t see that kind of heat on the water. The water is a nice buffer for the air temperature against going too hot.
Invent a hydraulic mast step that can push the mast up a small amount to compensate for rigging stretch during unusually cold conditions. Of course, elevating the mast would overtighten the lower shrouds in order to adequately tighten the upper shrouds, forestay and backstay...
@@RiggingDoctor I must admit I pushed the start of the season a bit while living in Michigan. These days, I'd rather have it in the 50s or above. Don't ask my wife about her Lake Huron sail with me in a snowsquall on an Alcort Sunfish, back in the '70s...
But what about the sunlight? In direct sun things become hot obviously, much hotter than ambient. And at night they actually become colder than ambient if there is a clear sky. There can easily be 40C difference between day and night even if air temperature stays the same. I'm considering synthetic rigging, but it bothers me.
Synthetic rigging seems a no go unless you can deal with that coefficient of expansion issue. ( You could do something like 'bi-metals' that are self adjusting - but you'd have to have a long lever going to a piece of steel or something.) What might solve the problem is a wind up wheel or just two bolts on a wheel or lever that can be manually turned to adjust tension so you can sail on cold days, but then left slack for 'average temperatures.' I know it's Bew-Fert South Carolina, but BO -fort, North Carolina. Except the last North Carolinian I encounter said Bew-Fert for his state's one. Beaufort, SC is really pretty and dreamy in the pre-dawn fog. But I remember pre-dawn out on the sea islands as 5-6 bugs per cubic inch.
Would this be the same with pre-stretched dyneema/spectra? Or do you have prestretch? Some race boats have hydraulic or Jack screw mast compression posts that could be used to adjust rig for the temperature? Growing up sailing in UK, a temperature sensitive rig would be a problem ……
This is the same for all UHMWPE fibers. Ours is heat set and prestretched, but it still goes slack in the cold and tightens right back up on its own whence warms again.
UK too, and agreed. Pretty much convinced me to stick with 1x19 stainless Rigging, for my Next Sailboat, especially perhaps as Cruising only, with a lot of long distance Sailing, with in mast Furling, which need the top of the mast within one inch of the bottom for Furling reliability. Once initial stretch is tuned out, should be good for years with occasional checking after haulouts. tbh, with previous boats after initial post initial stretch tune ups, only change needed was after re Rigging. But after the 1979 Fastnet Race disaster, not that I was in that Race, but it was clear there was a ig problen with IOR specced boats, so I decided to not bother again.Since, I've stuck to daysailing and Cruising. Best Wishes and Fair Winds. Bob. 👍
With in mast furling, you really want to stay with steel. It won’t change with temperature and the tight tolerance needed for the mainsail can be maintained.
... Aaahhh ... synthetic rigging (vectra, spectra, dynema, etc ) does not stretch ... but it does "elongate" !!! This is because the fibers do not stretch, but the "braid" tightens up like a "chinese Finger Torture " toy ... the result is the the actual length of the rigging gets longer ... or shorter ... I have used synthetic line to rig my multi-hulls since the masts rotate and the spreaders are self contained completely on the mast. And I have seen it tried w/ wooden masts ... NOPE!!! ended up breaking the mast as the shrouds went slack ... But for sheet lines (no ropes on a boat!!!!), halyards etc ... they are fine ...
It’s awesome but if it’s not a proper thermosyphon, you risk a steam explosion. I have thought about it but then didn’t mess with it and instead installed an electric unit.
@@RiggingDoctor That put me in mind of a couple of twenty somethings in Mustang suits in an open 18 foot Lund tooling around the Tongass in South East Alaska looking for property to buy. She looked like the little boy in Christmas Story except orange. The feathered Loons were laughing at the frozen loons in the boat. We had fun though.
My old steel rigging was really bad but thankfully the Dyneema hasn’t been bad on Wisdom. Each boat is different so some will hum and some will be silent.
Oh, oh, oh! Man, I realized something important now How far is the stove from your inner keeled mast? If you heated hard the inner mast, it pushed up the outer mast, same time transmitting heat to it and stretching the braiding of Dynema more then you did. In the morning, stove cold, interior mast shrinked and adding the outer mast contraction, there's your slacking!!!
They are pretty close to each other, only a few feet away. The problem is the mast is aluminum and acts as a heatsink. If you try to warm the inner mast, it will transmit the heat to the outside as the entire mast will generally heat at the same pace. As you try to warm the mast, the outside part will suck all the heat out and you will be left with a cold boat. For that reason, the mast is hidden behind insulation so that the boat stays warm inside and the cold mast is in a separate environment.
Quote Dyneema® fiber is used in hoses designed for liquefied natural gas (LNG) transfer at -162°C. So, no way it gets longer in low temp. In fact I don't know a material doing this.
And let me tell you another thing. Temperature goes with the flow, one end taped, no flow, no temperature advance, The flow exists, takes temperature with it and heats the entire tube. I am still one of best after sales automotive engineers. Trust me
It’s not so much with flow as with conducting the temperature. Also, Dyneema does expand as it cools and at -162° it will be a bit longer than when it was 20°. On a shorter thread in a hose, the change won’t be as notable as on a very long stay.
They will need to weave and integrate another material into the dyneema that has the opposite thermodynamic properties in the future to solve this, just as they did centuries ago to make accurate measuring rods for map making in Britain and as John Harrison did in making the clock that solved the longitude problem. It must be possible these days. Come on dyneema and spectra makers!
The problem would be the Dyneema herniating in the line that is contracting as it expands. Also, all the load would be transferred to that line since the Dyneema would be too long. I have seen another sailboat where he used electric fence tensioning spools to tighten his lashings in a hurry to accommodate for winter stretch. He knew how many turns he took it to let back out the same number of turns in the spring.
Because we put them out once a week, and sometimes the contents of an entire episode are 2 or 3 days. It adds up. If we condense every week into one episode, we would have to take out a lot and we would have no leeway if we spend any time not filming. This is how most channels operate
ok, so mast shrinks when cold. syn rigging elongates when cold. do either of these affect the strength of the mast or rigging? if tge overall strenght does not change then why is it not safe to sail? I mean it is usual for your down wind stays to be slack anyway... as long as it's nit so loose that yiu are in danger of being dismasted, how does lack of tension affect the overall strength. Obviously, your sail won't be as efficent, as it will not have the optimum shape, but as long as the base of the mast is not going anywhere, I see no issue with sailing with a loose rig.
The issue is the mast will bend farther than you want it to. The strength is the same but the mast bends over farther than I would like with sails on it. Also, the luff would be incredibly baggy so the sail won’t work very well on a close reach. In the ocean, on very cold days, we would simply fly the trysail with its head at the spreaders and the staysail. The loads were low on the rig and the mast didn’t move too much. I try to keep the loads lower so that the slack rig won’t bend over as far as if I was full sail.
The first sentence of the video said we were at Daufuskie and then midway through the video we talk about how we just crossed the border from Georgia to South Carolina…
I watch you two with more then mild interest, see we have three children and when the time comes we will be living on a boat.... my macaw will be fine as he knows what no means,, our cockatoo's on the other hand?????
When you go to trade your car in the salesman that sold you the vinyl top will tell you I could give you more for your car, but it has that pesky vinyl top. One day dynema, lithium batteries, electric motors,, and wiring will be replaced by graphene. Dynema is 9 times stronger than steel, but graphene is 300 times stronger than steel. They make graphene capacitors that are small now to replace batteries. It is the best conductor in the world. It makes super sharp razer blades, and if you got the jab it is in your blood.
While Dyneema has this one issue, we have managed to cruise many miles and many years without it crippling our efforts. On days when it’s too cold for the rigging, we still find ways to move so it isn’t the end of the world.
Damn Jerry, you just ruined my whole day. I was seriously considering synthetic but I sail seasons that get cold at either ends. It doesn't sound like it's going to work if 40 degrees is the cutoff point. Unless you have a solution perhaps?
Turnbuckles will be your friend in northern climates. All you need to do is mark the “summer” points on the turnbuckles and be sure to always leave them loosened to that point in the event of a warm day while you are away from the boat. When you are sailing in cold weather, all you need to do is tighten the turnbuckles to take out the slack.
There is no "cutoff point". The fact that the rigging went so slack in 40 degree drop means even with a moderate temperature change, which can be quite common inland, the rigging is going well under tension specs. The stuff may be "OK" while at sea, but plenty of gales and thunderstorms can drop temps 30-50 degrees instantly. Combined with the susceptibility to abrasion, I can see why it is not popular. I doubt very much that most sailboat owners would be willing to constantly be adjusting turnbuckles. It's a fad.
Synthetic isn’t for everyone. We like to show the full story instead of only focusing on the glamorous parts of synthetic so that other can make informed decisions. I keep my rigging tuned for 80°F. It’s good for +/-20°F but beyond that I start to baby the rigging. At 30°F, we are talking about a 50°F drop from its ideal temperature. I haven’t experienced a cold front drop that drastically, normally they are about 10°F on the eastern coast of the US.
Garbage, just as you saw here. Over/under tension problems, constantly messing with turnbuckles, and the big one: The lifeline is dangerously slack so it's not doing it's job. There's enough maintenance on a sailboat that knowingly adding more maintenance doesn't make sense. I will bet $1 that this experiment will end and he goes back to cable. They had to motor and listen to that loud generator when they could have been sailing if not for the rigging choice.
I’ve had this rigging for over 7 years and 20,000nm so I’m very comfortable with my choice. If this rigging was made of steel, it would be the right tension but it would also be needing replacement for the second time, as steel rigging lasts for 10 years or 10,000nm. I think you are confusing stays with lifelines though, because lifelines are set at a variety of tensions. Racers like them looser so that crew can hang off the side of the boat and lean into the lifeline more comfortably. Cruisers like them tighter so that if they grab onto it, the line won’t budge and will offer good support. The most important part of the choice of the materials for your boat is knowing how to use them properly so that you don’t cause unnecessary damage. My personal view for the rigging is “if it’s too cold for the rigging, it’s too cold for me”
Correct. You either need very stable temperatures or to be there adjusting it as needed. You can use halyards as temporary winter stays, but the peace of mind from a keel stepped mast makes this a much more comfortable setup.
I have a problem finding more info on dyneema rigging, I found a eye T terminal but what would be better fitting a toggle or doing a eye splice with out the thimble and fit it directly to the eye T terminal?
I am using F and I did grow up in the US. It’s the temperature range I think in and speak in. Google makes converting to C extremely easy so the rest of the world can follow along if they are concerned about their own temperature ranges.
I would restart the video if you got slammed with a bunch of ads. It’s a 16 minute video, so if you have that many ads loading, it would be worth starting it over.
So there is NO "metal core" in your Synthetic Rigging? Is is al PLASTIC?? What does the seawater do to it? You have NOT sayd enything about that in the videos i have seen when you are talking about your synthetic rigging. Al you have sayd is : The HET and the COLD. Nothing about the water ore THE SUN, Why? You call yourself : Rigging Doctor so i look forevard to the reply : )
It is all plastic and water has no effect on it. The sun has a negligible effect on it as well which is why we never talk about it much, but that’s a great topic for a video!
Because pure “rop” (I assume you mean rope made of polyester) has all the problems you asked about. Dyneema is a different type of plastic from polyester and doesn’t have these problems.
@@RiggingDoctor LOL L OL I am OLD so ROPE fore me have NO "fake" things in it. Naturale. Yes polyester are made of " a naturale thing" called oil that again comes from "the natural" etc etc ..dead long time etc etc : )
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The Cuban music while it’s 30* f. Brilliant😂
Haha glad you appreciated that
Great info, insane how much it stretches, really an important point to know when making a decision on rigging. Andy UK
We strive to give the full story on everything we do so you can make an informed decision.
Is there a chart for stretch and temps?
@@MindBodySoulOk Roughly 12 microns/ meter/ celcius witch is a fraction of what your aluminum mast is going the other way. Don't forget the spreaders are also playing the shrinking/ expanding game😉
And with that my idea to change to Dynema rigging went down to the abysses: I love late fall sailing in Norway and sometimes I keep the boat on water during winter too. Seems to be just to cold for synthetics here .....
If it’s going to be cold for an extended period of time, just adjust the rigging for that temperature. The only time it’s bad is if it fluctuates dramatically from day to day
@@RiggingDoctor I understand but the the problem is those cold nights like you had with temps down to freezing followed by warm day, especially in Sept-Oct when fall sailing is the most glorious. Maybe rig a quick tightening but adjustable lever mechanism or tackle, just as there was on old classic boats for their running backstays?
Yeah, you could have a tweaker on the stays to give them more tension.
A combination of turnbuckles and deadeyes may work for quick adjustments..
I would love to see a scientifically based example of this stretch and tighten please. Ie Did you film the next day in the warm, so that you can show before and after?
I can see now why they say one needs the same material on opposing forces- I have a new steel forestay and I was planning to install a dyneema backstay- now I can see that that would be a problem when the steel contacts and the dyneema expands - the mast will bend forward, and under wind and sail load it may collapse.
I currently have baby stay and check stays in dyneema and I think I will push on to remove the four thirty-year old shrouds and install dyneema on those; and put on a new steel backstay. Thanks for the heads up on this. Any advice?
Is not the Dynema expanding, come on. Its the mast changing the lengh with temperature. Dynema is a polimer, doesn't change its lengh with temperature. And don't quit the idea of using Dynema. I already have the solution. I will put it on paper.
The music is awesome! Thanks
Thanks guys
Awesome insight... Food for thought for my rigging replacement
Thanks for making this video! I was seriously considering swapping from stainless steel wire to Dyneema rigging. Nope! Not after seeing how unbelievably loose your rig is in the cold!!! I never would have guessed that that would happen!
That’s why I make these videos, so that you can be fully informed on the issues involved!
Hey found you two on another channel talking to a couple bums. So I decided to come and subscribe!
Welcome aboard!
'Back in the day', (mid-70's) SS for a suite of standing rigging for my Herreshoff Marco Polo was pretty much outside the budget....so I went with galvanized, linseed oiled and served the lower 10' or so. It lasted until the 10 year refit and was replaced with minimal cost, though I choose to use Nico-Press the second time around. -Veteran '66-68 (EX- Schooner 'Valkyrie')
Always great content. Thank you for the inspiration
Thank you for watching!
PARROTS IN HOODIES! HOLY CRAP!
Where are you at that. It is so cold?? Need some of that cool in TEXAS.
👍
Mentioning amps without volts is like saying you're going 48 miles trying to tell someone the speed without the time.
We have a 48v system so it’s always in 48v for the motor and 12v for the house loads.
When it’s our life and not an educational course, we cut the units short. The issue is that then other people who don’t live this exact life only get partial information when we cut units out of the sentence
Love the channel guys 👍👊👊
Thanks 😊
If I hadn’t given a Thumbs Up, parrots in cozy fleece jackets woulda done it. Thanks for the rigging info; had no idea. Good reminder to stay where the weather suits my clothes. 😎⛵️🌴
If it’s too cold for the rigging, it’s too cold for me!
Beaufort, is a French word meaning, good fort ? its what i was told so not sure? but all Beaufort's i know are towns and in good spots, if you think defense etc.
I love the feather baby hoodies. Too cute. Interesting about the synthetic rigging - my mind was 180° opposite of the reality. For some reason I thought colder weather would cause the lines to be more taught, and warmer the weather more slack. Thanks for the info!
It's the mast that expands and contracts with temperature causing the dyneema rigging to go taut or slack, respectively. The dyneems doesn't expand or contract much. The same thing happens in aircraft with control cables. When the aluminum airframe heat soaks, it expands faster than the steel control cables, causing them to go taut. The opposite occurs when they cold soak.
It’s amazing how various materials can make the need for special considerations when rigging everything together.
@@maxrudder6091 Thanks for this input - it makes so much sense. I presume if the rigging were steel it would expand and contract in a more similar way to the mast, but there would be some slackening and tightening if there were big temperature differences.
Exactly. Steel and aluminum move in a similar way, but synthetic moves in the opposite.
Imagine the temperature drops 50°F and the mast contracts 2mm, but the stay expands 3mm. Now the stay is 5mm too long and that will make it very slack.
The good thing is when it warms up it all goes right back into place.
Logic Herb! Is the length of mast that modified. The steel rig has a long elastic deformation dominium. It will stretch. The synthetic one has none. What you tightened was the elongation given by the braiding. But no problem, being in bed with the flu I have time to create. Based on your videos I will build a stretcher with a constant keeping tension and I had already an idea how to mechanically inspect the stays with a camera fixed on a climbing device you can command electrical from the deck. I am thinking even at a small tank leaving a coat of a treatment. Getting back on metal or bronze rings for sail, these, by rubbing on stay, the pressure and temperature will force the carbon chains to stick on rings forming a solid coat.
Thinking at on boat momentary solution, I would take out as many pad eyes as possible and put them 2 on each stay pulling them with rope on opposite direction with the proper distance in between, to ensure the necessary torque for stretching.
I like your thought process!
Enjoying your channel more and more. Just as it is. No nonsense. And lots of good info. And my weak spot for parrots. Subscribed..
That’s wonderful! Thanks for sharing :)
Jerry and Maddie are so cute saying hello to each other!
Not a 100% on the law but would a hurricane lantern or the equivalent in electric by a good option for a anchor light, just run it up on the main.
Yep. Any white light that can be seen from any direction works. As a backup, sailboats can run a Lanturn up a halyard to provide illumination.
We just like to have plenty of power to run our electric anchor light as well as our fridge.
Thanks for the video, very informative! Is the issue with slack in dyneema rigging less of an issue with a carbon mast vs aluminium?
Based on the linear coefficient of thermal expansion of carbon fiber, aluminum, and Dyneema, I believe that it would be less of an issue with carbon but I have no real world experience with Dyneema on a carbon spar.
very interesting to see the dyneema behave like that. I guess it is dangerous to use if in a climate where temperatures drop a lot at night.
Would it make sense to use steel cable tensioners to be able to quickly tension the ropes?
In climates with drastic swings, having a turnbuckle is a huge help! You can tighten and loosen as needed with ease.
A nice listen....
Ok so how does the synthetic rigging manage in the day and night cycle? Are the differences in temperature large enough for the rigging to be slack at night?
On the ocean, the temperatures are quite consistent, so it doesn’t affect the rigging much.
The big issue is when a severe cold front comes through and the temperature drops more than 40°F. That’s when it becomes an issue.
A mast jack would solve this problem. It can be done with two small bottle jacks either side of the mast heel. And a bar through the mast. You lift the mast up and use shims under until you get the required tension. This is normal on race boats and boats over about 65ft.
It’s also how production boats that come with synthetic rigging do it too
Or switch to a carbon mast. The problem is not the Dyneema it's the aluminum mast. Mach the rigging and mast C.T.E.
What happened to the theory heat expands and cold contacts? I enjoyed sailing along with Ya's and can't wait till the next Ep.29.
That’s the coefficient of thermal expansion. Most things have a positive coefficient but Dyneema has a negative coefficient so it goes backwards 😵💫
@@RiggingDoctor physics Major , aren’t ya!!
Try telling water that it's supposed to contract as it freezes 🤔
It's odd to think you reached freezing temperatures because I generally think of weather as warmer as you go south and I haven't turned the heat on my boat...I'm in Canada. Obviously weather is varied with cold fronts and high/low pressure systems etc but it's still a surprise 😉
It was a huge surprise to me as well!
@@RiggingDoctor lol
A friend lives in the Pacific North West, and said a month ago that the East Pacific North South South North Current, switches direction which marks the start of Autumn, and that happened 31 days early this Year, which may have triggered an early Rctic Jet Stream move South early as well ? I'm wondering how that's going to affect on this Eastern side of the Atlantic tbh. Still, Oil tank gets filled up in the coming week, so fingers crossed. Best Wishes. Bob. 👍🤔
Thank you for the content! What do you usually use for your furnace? Is it just dry wood?
It is a wonderful Dickinson Diesel heater
Do you have any concerns about the mast stability when in cold temps with the rigging loose? Do you limit your activities (besides running with the sails down) to limit stress on the mast? Keep up the great videos!
With a keel stepped mast, we have no concerns during cold days. We just keep the sails down and take it easy
Hello there! Possible rigging is developed with less sensitivity. Till then we have choices. Seems a clear winner in the tropics. Not so much for rapid latitude changes. I am adopting it for non stay lines already.
After all the distances, use of a deck generator would you make a different decision on electric drive? Diesel electric hybrid, diesel generator serial electric?
I personally have reluctantly gone to fitting a Beta 16 with electric drive/hydrogenerator pods off the rudder. The new electric will have to wait with the costs.
My primary issue is getting gasoline and deck generators off my boat.
This worked for the ICW but our goal is not to be running a generator at all 😉
We have plans for Windpuff since we will be building that system from the keel up!
@@RiggingDoctor Most keen, lessons of time are golden.
Your Feathered Crew look Adorable! And how come Corgy doesn't get clothes? Hope you enjoy Beaufort. Lived there at Downtown Marina for years then headed South for warmer weather. Sounds as though you are doing the same, yet Dafuskye is in Georgia am I correct? It's been almost 30 years since being in that area. Love your Crew and you two are great to share your adventure! Stay Warm and Enjoy!
Daufuskie is just over the state line on the SC side.
Morty is always wearing a thick fur coat 😉
@@RiggingDoctor So then you are heading North these Days? Smiles...............it's gonna be cold going north for Fall, enjoy the ride wherever the journey leads you! Fair winds
Well, thanks for the info. Looks like my dyneema be only as soft shackle.
That’s why I put the information out there, if you are informed then you can make the best decisions.
Your info is valuable, was thinking about changing front stay to hank on dyneema . Looks like curler staying on.
15 amps of current at 50+ volts adds up quick. Easily 75-100 amp hours per day.
The solar photovoltaic modules performance increases as temperature drops below 70°f. I often see 15-20% more energy production than rated. Sometimes I think about upgrading to a 150-200 volt charge controller. When the sun is low on the horizon and my strings are producing a minimal current I often wonder about the possibility of having a switch panel with three way switches to achieve a simple fast way of reconfiguring series and parallel configurations. E.G. In winter I get more than rated output between 10 a.m. and 3 p.m. but have several hours in the a.m. where switching to full amperage would pick up another 20-30% energy production. Later, after 3 p.m. switching to maximum string voltage would gain an additional 10-20% energy production. It just plain feels good to produce more power than rated. Feels great actually.
Probably the thing that makes me wonder most is why people neglect solar domestic hot water panels. The evacuated tubes type panels will produce hotter water than natural gas or propane burners. My evacuated tube solar panel makes more water than I can use , in January at -40f, whenever the sun shines. If you want steam - the evacuated tubes will do it too. Best solar money can buy!
I keep wondering if there is a way to inflate a vinyl boat properly with a nice dense foam? Or if anyone does sections.
It’s al about getting as much power as we can during the day 😎
@@RiggingDoctor great feeling.....I do evacuated tube water too. Best purchase money can buy.✌️👀👍
I have looked at them but can’t find a safe place to install it!
I love your bobble hat or beanie
Hi guys, I watched this about the cold slack rigging a few days ago & haven't been able to get it outta my head. What's the issue with using ratchets instead of all than carry-on with the checkstays, surely it would be much easier to tighten/loosen as required?
at first i was going to ask if the mast is shrinking in the cold, but i watched again and your lifeline went slack, so something to look forward to not since i have dyneema rigging except headstay and forestay. launching december
It’s a combination. The aluminum shrinks a tiny bit and the Dyneema expands a lot as the temperature drops.
If you tighten it in the winter, you must mark where it was set so that you can ease it out before it gets warm because it will shrink right back to where it was in hot weather!
For years, ours goes slack in the winter and we don’t mess with it, then it tightens back up when it warms again.
I always say: “if it’s too cold for the rigging, then it’s too cold for me!”
What are the expansion rate of your rigging. Let's take your forstay as an example, is it to much for a steel spring to take up the slack.
I have seen numbers between 0,5 to 0,6mm expansion per meter between 0-40°C but have not found information on Dyneema if it is concerning induvidual threads or braided ropes (where the thred lenght obviously is significantly longer per meter of rope).
I know it's more weight (but it's on the deck at least) and it would need some service but a spring that holds 1000kg and travels less than 0.2m is a industrial standard fare and could actually be easily be used to monitor/correct the tension on the rigging.
I have toyed with this idea, but the issue is that spring would have to resist the full load of the sails. In effect, the spring would be so strong that it would then stress the rig as it would always be under maximum load.
It’s a good thought but I haven’t been able to figure it out yet.
@@RiggingDoctor Good point, the engineer in me says that the solution is to splice 1/3 stainless to 2/3 of dyneema and call the problem solved, the team leader in me says that that is not a splice I ever will sign off on and the mechanic in me says just by pass the spring with a chain hook when you start sailing. The sailor in me says keep the manila it's a Gaff rig you are outfitting. 😉
It's not that Dynema is expanding with the cold. It is shrinking less than the aluminum mast....
The aluminum mast does contract, but the loose rigging is exasperated by the Dyneema expanding as it cools.
I did not know that about Dyneema or perhaps you told me and I forgot, that's impressive slack. What's the plan at the slip? and Hello to Gerry
In Baltimore, we had a day of -20°F and it was insanely loose. It’s still enough to keep the mast up though. And you can use the rigging as docklines 🤪
Do you have any value of the stretching force in N/m ? If not can you get one tool for measuring? Or building one. I have to calculate the spring
It depends on the boat, but when Wisdom heels over, the force can reach 86,500Nm. I have thought of a spring system in the past and my idea didn’t work so I would love to see and discuss your idea. If a spring could work, it would absorb the stretch and keep the rig tension year round!
If you would like to chat about this, my email is riggingdr@gmail.com 😉
@@RiggingDoctor, I sent, is Queued.
The tray of barbecue cancels and supersedes the synthetic rigging catching cold! This time til next time... :¬) Webhead USA
😎🍖
Awesome video herb but I have questions! How big is you battery bank in terms of power output and are they lipo4? How long and how heavy is you boat? How long since the bottom been cleaned on Wisdom? Before you turned up river were sailing with the current?
I can't believe how cold it is this time of year. Smooth sailing guys👍
The battery bank is roughly 18kW of LiFePO4.
Length: 45
Waterline: 32
It’s been a few months but it stays really clean with our bottom paint.
Displacement: 18T
Before we turned up, we were going against the wind and current, when we turned, it began pushing us.
@@RiggingDoctor Just a dumb question⁉️ If you had enough power feeding the motor could you cross an ocean with your set-up❓
Off course they can cross an ocean they sail across it using the wind, it’s a sailing boat, an engine is just auxiliary power whether electric or diesel. They could extend range a bit by having more solar, more batteries and a watt and sea if they wanted to, they don’t seem to need to. Having more dedicated house batteries may be an idea to keep lights on for safety.
@@andrewbrown2063 Thank you for your input Andrew but I was driving at the dudy cycle of their motor. Wondering if it could run indefinitely. I know electric motors can run to cross an ocean but does not mean their motor is designed to do so being they are a sailboat. I am more or less doing a bit of research on boats and as a live person Herby is the best I've found for info.✌️
@@jamesfrankland38thangs58 the motor is air cooled. It is designed for 24/7 operation with infinite runtime. As long as there is electricity to run it.
Very entertaining! The backstay obviously could easily take a lot of slack out of itself and the headstay. As for the shrouds, wouldn't simply tying them good together ease any problem? Perhaps except for your professional pride, I'd say.
It wouldn’t look great but it would get the job done. The same way pinching the backstays tightens them, you could pinch the shrouds to tighten them up at the moment.
Why are hemp ropes not used for rigging as they did in the past? Are they not better than synthetic ones?
They were the best thing at the time but they are far from the specs of modern ropes. They rot easily and weaken when they get wet. Synthetic is unaffected by water and never rots.
If a 30-degree drop in temp loosens the rig, does a 30-degree rise in the hot summer sun tighten the rig?
It would, but I have it set for 80°F. +30 would be 110°F and you don’t see that kind of heat on the water. The water is a nice buffer for the air temperature against going too hot.
Invent a hydraulic mast step that can push the mast up a small amount to compensate for rigging stretch during unusually cold conditions. Of course, elevating the mast would overtighten the lower shrouds in order to adequately tighten the upper shrouds, forestay and backstay...
Or wait for a warmer day to go sailing. Who wants to sail in below freezing temperatures?
@@RiggingDoctor I must admit I pushed the start of the season a bit while living in Michigan. These days, I'd rather have it in the 50s or above. Don't ask my wife about her Lake Huron sail with me in a snowsquall on an Alcort Sunfish, back in the '70s...
🥶
But what about the sunlight? In direct sun things become hot obviously, much hotter than ambient. And at night they actually become colder than ambient if there is a clear sky. There can easily be 40C difference between day and night even if air temperature stays the same. I'm considering synthetic rigging, but it bothers me.
We’ve had ours for 7 years in the sunlight and had no problems whatsoever
@@RiggingDoctor But why ambient temperature has sugnificant effect and heating by sun - doesn't?
Synthetic rigging seems a no go unless you can deal with that coefficient of expansion issue. ( You could do something like 'bi-metals' that are self adjusting - but you'd have to have a long lever going to a piece of steel or something.) What might solve the problem is a wind up wheel or just two bolts on a wheel or lever that can be manually turned to adjust tension so you can sail on cold days, but then left slack for 'average temperatures.'
I know it's Bew-Fert South Carolina, but BO -fort, North Carolina. Except the last North Carolinian I encounter said Bew-Fert for his state's one. Beaufort, SC is really pretty and dreamy in the pre-dawn fog. But I remember pre-dawn out on the sea islands as 5-6 bugs per cubic inch.
If I couldn’t figure out how to invent this system to make synthetic standing rigging work, I was going to go with galvanized rigging as a Plan B
Just get a carbon fiber mast.
Would this be the same with pre-stretched dyneema/spectra? Or do you have prestretch?
Some race boats have hydraulic or Jack screw mast compression posts that could be used to adjust rig for the temperature?
Growing up sailing in UK, a temperature sensitive rig would be a problem ……
This is the same for all UHMWPE fibers. Ours is heat set and prestretched, but it still goes slack in the cold and tightens right back up on its own whence warms again.
UK too, and agreed. Pretty much convinced me to stick with 1x19 stainless Rigging, for my Next Sailboat, especially perhaps as Cruising only, with a lot of long distance Sailing, with in mast Furling, which need the top of the mast within one inch of the bottom for Furling reliability. Once initial stretch is tuned out, should be good for years with occasional checking after haulouts. tbh, with previous boats after initial post initial stretch tune ups, only change needed was after re Rigging. But after the 1979 Fastnet Race disaster, not that I was in that Race, but it was clear there was a ig problen with IOR specced boats, so I decided to not bother again.Since, I've stuck to daysailing and Cruising. Best Wishes and Fair Winds. Bob. 👍
With in mast furling, you really want to stay with steel. It won’t change with temperature and the tight tolerance needed for the mainsail can be maintained.
... Aaahhh ... synthetic rigging (vectra, spectra, dynema, etc ) does not stretch ... but it does "elongate" !!! This is because the fibers do not stretch, but the "braid" tightens up like a "chinese Finger Torture " toy ... the result is the the actual length of the rigging gets longer ... or shorter ... I have used synthetic line to rig my multi-hulls since the masts rotate and the spreaders are self contained completely on the mast. And I have seen it tried w/ wooden masts ... NOPE!!! ended up breaking the mast as the shrouds went slack ... But for sheet lines (no ropes on a boat!!!!), halyards etc ... they are fine ...
Any thoughts on a hot water loop with the diesel heater? Thinking your model doesn't have that option so using the first pipe.
Hello Hello
It’s awesome but if it’s not a proper thermosyphon, you risk a steam explosion. I have thought about it but then didn’t mess with it and instead installed an electric unit.
Not dragging the tender = < gen + > anchor lite
Order of priorities
🙂
@@RiggingDoctor brilliant video but
Beaufort is where they filmed Forrest Gump when he was on his shrimp boat. Cool little town
We loved it there!
Me: "Hey Honey, look at those Loons out on the water."
Her: "Yeah and there are some birds too. Turn the heat up."
Haven’t seen your comments in a while! The heater is a nice part of the boat!
@@RiggingDoctor That put me in mind of a couple of twenty somethings in Mustang suits in an open 18 foot Lund tooling around the Tongass in South East Alaska looking for property to buy. She looked like the little boy in Christmas Story except orange. The feathered Loons were laughing at the frozen loons in the boat. We had fun though.
Here in New Zealand you wont get a Cat1 in order to cruise offshore if your rig uses syntetic!
That’s a shame, it’s far superior to steel for offshore cruising. Glad we are registered in the US!
The real problem with my Dyneema rigging is that it hums incredibly loud down below from the vibration
My old steel rigging was really bad but thankfully the Dyneema hasn’t been bad on Wisdom. Each boat is different so some will hum and some will be silent.
Oh, oh, oh! Man, I realized something important now
How far is the stove from your inner keeled mast? If you heated hard the inner mast, it pushed up the outer mast, same time transmitting heat to it and stretching the braiding of Dynema more then you did. In the morning, stove cold, interior mast shrinked and adding the outer mast contraction, there's your slacking!!!
They are pretty close to each other, only a few feet away. The problem is the mast is aluminum and acts as a heatsink. If you try to warm the inner mast, it will transmit the heat to the outside as the entire mast will generally heat at the same pace. As you try to warm the mast, the outside part will suck all the heat out and you will be left with a cold boat. For that reason, the mast is hidden behind insulation so that the boat stays warm inside and the cold mast is in a separate environment.
The vapors from water you boiled could have entered inside mast? Anyway, the cause is there. Stretched braiding.
Quote Dyneema® fiber is used in hoses designed for liquefied natural gas (LNG) transfer at -162°C.
So, no way it gets longer in low temp. In fact I don't know a material doing this.
And let me tell you another thing. Temperature goes with the flow, one end taped, no flow, no temperature advance, The flow exists, takes temperature with it and heats the entire tube. I am still one of best after sales automotive engineers. Trust me
It’s not so much with flow as with conducting the temperature. Also, Dyneema does expand as it cools and at -162° it will be a bit longer than when it was 20°. On a shorter thread in a hose, the change won’t be as notable as on a very long stay.
They will need to weave and integrate another material into the dyneema that has the opposite thermodynamic properties in the future to solve this, just as they did centuries ago to make accurate measuring rods for map making in Britain and as John Harrison did in making the clock that solved the longitude problem. It must be possible these days. Come on dyneema and spectra makers!
The problem would be the Dyneema herniating in the line that is contracting as it expands. Also, all the load would be transferred to that line since the Dyneema would be too long.
I have seen another sailboat where he used electric fence tensioning spools to tighten his lashings in a hurry to accommodate for winter stretch. He knew how many turns he took it to let back out the same number of turns in the spring.
True, but your aluminum mast expands and contracts at about twice that rate, so the dyneema is only a third of your problem.
Indeed. The end result is still a very slack rig.
Some folks are using it for steering cables, mistake?
It’s an experiment! We can all learn from the results 😉
Why does it take 6 months to get your episodes out?
Because we put them out once a week, and sometimes the contents of an entire episode are 2 or 3 days. It adds up. If we condense every week into one episode, we would have to take out a lot and we would have no leeway if we spend any time not filming. This is how most channels operate
ok, so mast shrinks when cold. syn rigging elongates when cold. do either of these affect the strength of the mast or rigging? if tge overall strenght does not change then why is it not safe to sail? I mean it is usual for your down wind stays to be slack anyway... as long as it's nit so loose that yiu are in danger of being dismasted, how does lack of tension affect the overall strength. Obviously, your sail won't be as efficent, as it will not have the optimum shape, but as long as the base of the mast is not going anywhere, I see no issue with sailing with a loose rig.
The issue is the mast will bend farther than you want it to. The strength is the same but the mast bends over farther than I would like with sails on it. Also, the luff would be incredibly baggy so the sail won’t work very well on a close reach.
In the ocean, on very cold days, we would simply fly the trysail with its head at the spreaders and the staysail. The loads were low on the rig and the mast didn’t move too much. I try to keep the loads lower so that the slack rig won’t bend over as far as if I was full sail.
Why not take the slack out for the day with the turnbuckles, and then ease them tomorrow?
Because we don’t have turnbuckles except on the head stay. They were out of our budget when we did the rigging.
Running the generator is cheating if you think you are running on solar....just saying. How many amp hours do you have in your battery again?
384 usable amps of the 500ah. We like to keep it on the conservative side so they last longer
@@RiggingDoctor Thanks, that seems like a pretty good range on that AH.
Wish you would tell where you are at, globally!
The first sentence of the video said we were at Daufuskie and then midway through the video we talk about how we just crossed the border from Georgia to South Carolina…
You can't get a muffler for the generator?
It has a crappy one. We got a new generator that is much quieter now and it makes life much more bearable
@@RiggingDoctor Sweet
Are you guys following The Digital Mermaid's battery build and soon to come electric conversion?
I have not but that sounds pretty cool!
To bad it expands like this. But, I have full confidence in your rigging abilities!!! Mo Problem! 🙏❤️🇺🇸⛵️🤙
Hey, when wad this video done. Like 4-5 years ago! LOL
Forgot about the birds. Y'all go through some crazy weather.
@@melinda5777 last year or earlier this, my understanding
March 2022
Note to self stay in warm weather if rigging is synthetic.
Or stay in weather that is warm for a long time or cold for a long time so you don’t have to be constantly adjusting it.
I see the southern hemisphere has cooled by 20f since tonga
😉
👍!!!
Nice cactus, peyote?
It would explain why Charles is crazy after chomping on it.
👍👍👍
I watch you two with more then mild interest, see we have three children and when the time comes we will be living on a boat.... my macaw will be fine as he knows what no means,, our cockatoo's on the other hand?????
Birds on a boat make it more interesting! Everyone will come by your boat to say hi. It’s a great way to meet new people in the anchorage 😎
20 amps from the generator. That’s not much, 240 watts?
20 amps at 48v, it’s about a kilowatt
@@RiggingDoctor Ok I was thinking 12 volts, surely 48volts not common But a big difference, and better for a number of reasons
W
You ova seas now Mr. Patroy
We are back in the US now
When you go to trade your car in the salesman that sold you the vinyl top will tell you I could give you more for your car, but it has that pesky vinyl top. One day dynema, lithium batteries, electric motors,, and wiring will be replaced by graphene. Dynema is 9 times stronger than steel, but graphene is 300 times stronger than steel. They make graphene capacitors that are small now to replace batteries. It is the best conductor in the world. It makes super sharp razer blades, and if you got the jab it is in your blood.
While Dyneema has this one issue, we have managed to cruise many miles and many years without it crippling our efforts. On days when it’s too cold for the rigging, we still find ways to move so it isn’t the end of the world.
I think people are missing the point that tightening and loosening is not too difficult with practice, it’s just the time and the fiddling about.
Graphene will snap in half due to that lack of flexibility. Rigging needs to have some flex.
@@jonathanoasis A graphene line the size of a 10-pound test fishing string will pick up a 3,000-pound car.
@@rickcreel3657 and it will snap with any laeral force.
Damn Jerry, you just ruined my whole day. I was seriously considering synthetic but I sail seasons that get cold at either ends. It doesn't sound like it's going to work if 40 degrees is the cutoff point. Unless you have a solution perhaps?
Turnbuckles will be your friend in northern climates. All you need to do is mark the “summer” points on the turnbuckles and be sure to always leave them loosened to that point in the event of a warm day while you are away from the boat.
When you are sailing in cold weather, all you need to do is tighten the turnbuckles to take out the slack.
In the spring and fall there’s a twenty degree difference in 12 hours.
There is no "cutoff point". The fact that the rigging went so slack in 40 degree drop means even with a moderate temperature change, which can be quite common inland, the rigging is going well under tension specs. The stuff may be "OK" while at sea, but plenty of gales and thunderstorms can drop temps 30-50 degrees instantly. Combined with the susceptibility to abrasion, I can see why it is not popular. I doubt very much that most sailboat owners would be willing to constantly be adjusting turnbuckles. It's a fad.
Synthetic isn’t for everyone. We like to show the full story instead of only focusing on the glamorous parts of synthetic so that other can make informed decisions.
I keep my rigging tuned for 80°F. It’s good for +/-20°F but beyond that I start to baby the rigging. At 30°F, we are talking about a 50°F drop from its ideal temperature.
I haven’t experienced a cold front drop that drastically, normally they are about 10°F on the eastern coast of the US.
My personal view on the matter is: “if it’s too cold for the rigging, then it’s too cold for me”.
Papagaios de contrabando??
No, son legales en los Estados Unidos.
“ Rigging Doctor” could you please ucomment on the practicality of Dyneema Lifelines…
That’s a great topic for a video!
Garbage, just as you saw here. Over/under tension problems, constantly messing with turnbuckles, and the big one: The lifeline is dangerously slack so it's not doing it's job. There's enough maintenance on a sailboat that knowingly adding more maintenance doesn't make sense. I will bet $1 that this experiment will end and he goes back to cable. They had to motor and listen to that loud generator when they could have been sailing if not for the rigging choice.
@@RiggingDoctor Thankyou, please do, Ignore the Naysayers.
I’ve had this rigging for over 7 years and 20,000nm so I’m very comfortable with my choice. If this rigging was made of steel, it would be the right tension but it would also be needing replacement for the second time, as steel rigging lasts for 10 years or 10,000nm.
I think you are confusing stays with lifelines though, because lifelines are set at a variety of tensions. Racers like them looser so that crew can hang off the side of the boat and lean into the lifeline more comfortably. Cruisers like them tighter so that if they grab onto it, the line won’t budge and will offer good support.
The most important part of the choice of the materials for your boat is knowing how to use them properly so that you don’t cause unnecessary damage.
My personal view for the rigging is “if it’s too cold for the rigging, it’s too cold for me”
So basically it’s not a good idea to fit dyneema if I have a deckstep mast ?
Correct. You either need very stable temperatures or to be there adjusting it as needed. You can use halyards as temporary winter stays, but the peace of mind from a keel stepped mast makes this a much more comfortable setup.
I’m in the Caribbean so I should be good I guess.
You would be fine, and you wouldn’t have to worry about corrosion which is the killer of steel rigging down there.
I have a problem finding more info on dyneema rigging, I found a eye T terminal but what would be better fitting a toggle or doing a eye splice with out the thimble and fit it directly to the eye T terminal?
I like to attach the eye to the t-ball with a toggle so I can easily remove the fittings if needed.
Hang on, if your lifeline is slack, that ain’t the mast.
😂
Don't forget about global warming just because it's getting colder.
There's always next summer to start global whining all over again.
😎
I guess you are just talking to Americans. No one else uses F.
I am using F and I did grow up in the US. It’s the temperature range I think in and speak in. Google makes converting to C extremely easy so the rest of the world can follow along if they are concerned about their own temperature ranges.
Unwatchable! More adds than content. Shame
I would restart the video if you got slammed with a bunch of ads. It’s a 16 minute video, so if you have that many ads loading, it would be worth starting it over.
So there is NO "metal core" in your Synthetic Rigging? Is is al PLASTIC?? What does the seawater do to it? You have NOT sayd enything about that in the videos i have seen when you are talking about your synthetic rigging. Al you have sayd is : The HET and the COLD. Nothing about the water ore THE SUN, Why? You call yourself : Rigging Doctor so i look forevard to the reply : )
It is all plastic and water has no effect on it. The sun has a negligible effect on it as well which is why we never talk about it much, but that’s a great topic for a video!
@@RiggingDoctor LOL LOL thats is NOT true. Why did you NOT use pure rop?
Because pure “rop” (I assume you mean rope made of polyester) has all the problems you asked about. Dyneema is a different type of plastic from polyester and doesn’t have these problems.
@@RiggingDoctor LOL L OL I am OLD so ROPE fore me have NO "fake" things in it. Naturale. Yes polyester are made of " a naturale thing" called oil that again comes from "the natural" etc etc ..dead long time etc etc : )
I wonder if someone can use both medal and synthetic rigging at the same time long term.