@@Chicken_Wing91 funny how ace fails to mention that. Ace forgets there’s no such thing as halfway crooks. “Hate to break it to you cat man, I’m making more” never forget.
Well, what the hell can you do???? Really, all four, actually are not fond of each other. Ace and Peter were buddies but such severe alcoholics/addicts.
Dylan Connolly he wasn’t the original lead guitarist.... he’s a paid employee now. Which is not a bad thing but you need to realize that a band is made up of personalities...... take one of those personalities or replace one of those personalities and the bands’ sound changes.... listen to unmask.... you can tell that Peter wasn’t playing the drums on that record.... or the solo in the song Flaming Youth is not Ace..... the band sounds good now but they don’t sound like the original.... glad I got to see the original lineup in 1997 on the reunion tour..... they kicked ass....
Dylan Connolly Ace joined the band in 1972 ..... not getting your point.... Ace is the original lead guitarist..... Tommy is out placing Ace’s licks.... singing Ace’s songs..... what Tommy song is Ace playing.....Ace and Peter were part of the original band that made that original sound...... Gene, Paul, Peter and Ace are Kiss...... I’ve seen tribute bands that are better than Kiss..... doesn’t make them Kiss.....
Dylan Connolly Tommy is a paid employee playing Ace’s role..... Ace, along with Peter, was an original member that help make that band what it is......... Those four guys created the sound that is Kiss......all those that came after are just replacements...... doesn’t matter their history with the band. Eric Carr, Vinnie, Mark and Bruce did not have to dress up like a former members...... Hell.... Bob Kulick has a longer history with the band than any of those others guys........ still not getting your point..... still doesn’t make Tommy an original member...... he’s playing Ace....
Tommy was doing a cover band of kiss and everyone was cool with it now people have an issue. And Tommy Thayer is a great guitarist playing in black and blue. So he's got other outlets to play in.
Because it was a cover band. Why would anyone care that he was in a cover band? He had so many outlets prior to joining Kiss that he was bringing Peter his spaghetti.
Fan from the early 70s. You can't replace the persona of the band by putting different people behind the makeup. I don't miss kiss at all. I have all my memories, albums posters etc.... if I choose to live in the past. The old music is the best. Seen them (original) 4 times and that was enough for me.
Agree 100%. As a working musician, I cannot blame Eric or Tommy, as I would do the same; it’s a job. However, as a fan, if I want to see a tribute band, I’ll go to a local venue and attend for free.
I got balls to say that " I would much rather watch the videos of the concerts in 1976-1977 when I was a part of seeing them at the height of their popularity then and being a part of that time before it started falling apart". What they are doing now is a tribute band of the original line up and should have ended when the original farewell tour was done, they could have done other things away from KISS and come back in a different version of KISS, at least that way I wouldn't feel the way I do about the band now but I'm only a fan and they have convinced others to like this version they are now and they can afford to since they got my money for all the albums, merchandise and concert tickets I've bought over the years so why should my opinion matter?
I love Kiss and I have no animosity toward Tommy or Eric. Even though I’m not of the generation that saw the original lineup ( I was born right around the time of first makeup reunion tour) I just can’t do the whole fake Ace and Peter thing. I’d be much more into it if Ace and Eric were given their own designs like Eric and Vinnie way back in the past. I don’t even watch clips of this lineup let alone go to a concert.
I honestly don't blame Ace. Gene and Paul don't care who they step on in order to get what they want. In the end it was good that Ace played. It helped play a huge role in sticking it to Gene and Paul. The four orginal members should've called it quits after the reunion tour. Obviously at that point from everyone's perspective it wasn't going to be sustainable but of course the reunited Kiss was another huge paycheck for Gene and Paul so they were going to raise their bank accounts at the expense of Ace and Peter.
I have not bought a single KISS item since the Anthology DVDs. Which are really not that in depth imo. If it isn't the original KISS, l ain't buying it unless it's the Creatures era!!
@@russellfrew6334 Well I am sure,,,,, I believe that's why Ace and Peter quite I am sure if it was even straight up across the board they would of stayed to getting longer but with Gene and Paul greedyness who knows!!
@@russellfrew6334 Peter and Ace have said way worse things about Gene and Paul than they ever have. And I for one support the fact that Gene and Paul make money on what they do. Nobody works for free, and I guarantee none of you would do any different. They still pay Peter and Ace, even when they weren’t part of the band. Those guys need to take a step back and look at how much they really contributed in their inebriated states and then tell us who really kept KISS going in the 70’s onwards.
I have already made a comment but Eddie trunks is one of the biggest biggest kiss fans that ever lived and he's calling it like he sees it I always felt that Ace was the best musician in the band and I liked his songs the best and to me there is no other cat Then Pete I'm going back to vinyl I have Dynasty alive love gun and debut I always enjoy them thank you
What .WHAT???? ..Ed. Yes it was Tommy Thayers decision to apply Ace Frehley's designed SPACE Mack-up and join KISS He could have said sorry I can't do that , but Tommy Thayer had a past of trying to be Ace Frehley's SPACEMAN ..he was ACE in the KISS tribute band COLD GIN , he already knew the part to play , not always the solos .Yes he could say NO , no one made him do it .Tommy is not dumb he's getting BUCK $ for being the SPACEMAN maybe not what the real Ace would have been earning from tours, mech. etc..but he's getting paid , no one twisted his arm or any one else waiting in the wings to jump at that job , this is the music BUSINESS. Don't blame Gene or Paul maybe it's not the greatest thing to have done , but Ace Frehley and Peter Criss have made the decision NOT to be involved anymore , Gene and Paul have been here the whole time ,they want Kiss to go out in Mack-up to the final.shows ..this is the 4 that most concert goers recognize.I kinda understand the way they think about newer Mack-up characters.Eric Carr's (R.I.P.) and the FOX are LOVED by fans just as much as the 4 originals , Vinnie's AnKh Warrior no one understood it and than it was gone , newer characters would confuse the fans that are not DIEHARD FANS .I LOVE KISS first saw them 1974 Louisville KY seen as many shows and as possible at least one pre tour .Thanks for your post 🤟🤟 , keep the ROCK ALIVE ..
Ace and peter fucked up their chances by choosing booze and drugs and being unreliable, over the band and the fans and never gave a shit, and have never apologized to the fans ONCE. It's their own fault...
He also likes to go on about how they dont want to meet us, but he the opinionated dj is their bff. Most any musician I ever met hates opinionated djs.
It's his career, it's his job. The job allows him to meet and know a whole crew of rock musicians over 35+ years. Any one of us would probably love to do what he does. And reap the same benefits of knowing amazing musicians.
Good on tommy and Eric for sticking strong and not letting the comments bother them . Makeup is makeup time has passed things ain’t going to be the same after 40 years
The thing is this wouldn't be happening if Ace & Peter haven't given up the persona makeup to Paul & Gene for money. So it's obvious they care more about the money than their trademark makeup. What did they think was gonna happen with their makeup? It is what it is ?
Indeed they are to blame also if they go along with it. I understand the temptation they would feel to have done it, but a true KISS fan wouldn't disrespect Ace & Peter like that or betray the KISS Army in such a way.
It would have been great if Eric and Tommy had come up with their own characters, allowing Ace and Peter to join them onstage in their characters anytime it made sense (to Paul and Gene). Could still have marketed all the original characters (and the new characters). May not have been ideal to market the touring band with alternate characters, but there would always be the possibility that one or both of the originals could join them at any time.
New characters for Tommy & Eric would have worked fine. Paul & Gene like to blame Carr & Vinnie's characters as part of the reason KISS was failing in the early 80's, but having new characters in the band wasn't the problem...the problem was that it was a new decade and music and fashions changed and KISS were no longer in style or considered cool anymore, and also KISS put out poppy sounding records for a few years prior which ruined their reputation.
You would think Gene and Paul, the masters of marketing, would figure that out. More characters, more $$$. But, they didn't. Just like when they say they give the fans what they want. They think they do. If I never hear RnRAN again in my life I won't be disappointed. You can also include Love Gun, Firehouse, Deuce, and the rest of them. Same setlist for 20 years. BORING! Who wants to see the same show over and over? That's why I checked out 20 years ago. You tell me the setlist has songs like Magic Touch, X-Ray Eyes, Charisma, Exciter, Under the Gun, Hide Your Heart, Larger Than Life, Room Service, Just a Boy, Rockin in the USA, Got Love for Sale, Two Timer, She's So European, Naked City, Killer, Saint and Sinner, All Hell's Breakin Loose, Young and Wasted, Thrills in the Night, King of the Mountain, Secretly Cruel, Who Wants to Be Lonely, Hell or High Water, Good Girl Gone Bad, Betrayed, Rise to It and I'll go. Gene and Paul should do their final tour like Thin Lizzy did in '83. Scrap the makeup and have each guitarist come out and do a few songs from their respective era, with a jam at the end with everyone, even Vinnie. Set up a stand for Mark St. John and have a set of sticks for Eric Carr in their memory. Push the egos aside and do it for the fans.
Eddie is right there is even talk about Gene and Paul getting substitutes for themselves that is menudo the original lineup is the best always will be for me I know I'm old but they turned into a tribute band take a look at Foreigner one original member
Gary XHLC It’s because the original 4 were themselves. The makeup was their personalities. They were larger than life. The 2 after we’re just face paint. That’s why it didn’t work. But personally I have no problem with the current line up
Totally agree with you! It diminishes Kiss’s legacy, and it’s so uncool to have Tommy & Eric as Peter & Ace, not knowing any better I thought it was the original Kiss band at that VH1 rock honors when I found out it wasn’t and there was two guys dressed like the originals I thought it was soooo tacky !!! Feel cheated out of seeing the complete real thing
Ive been listening to him talking about this thing with the face paint for like 2 years now lol.. Funny when he's talking about putting ACDC making another guy into "The School Boy" that would be funny too..
Of course Ace didn’t want to play in a “tribute” band honoring the band he helped start, while they (and his replacement) received an award. That’s absurd. I can’t believe he agreed to do it in the first place. What a humiliating experience, and why you would talk him into that is odd as well. Although, you were producing, so your loyalties were to the show, not to the human beings. Ugh. Glad I missed it.
Perhaps new makeups could result in another creatures tour moneywise..i think this is an underlying issue that nobody has confronted..i wish I saw creatures and would go to see them if they did new makeups ..so long as they look cool..i think it is a fear of failure but that was then ..maiden and preist stole the kiss fans back in 83..wish kiss made it to jersey I would have been blown away..i am still waiting ..I like the Ankh too...right now we aint got much as far as any bands playing soon...the new kiss does sound great ...wish there was more creatures footage
I agree with Eddie, it put KISS in the eyes of many, as just another manufactured group, a la Menudo, Backstreet Boys, etc., and why I have not been to a Kiss concert in twenty years
Kiss was always criticized for being a production. Neil Bogart, Bill Aucoin and Sean Delaney all contributed to the band's development. Kiss wanted management to shape them into a refined act, and that's what they did. Kiss believed that without good management, you were just another band in the bar jamming it out. Kiss wanted to become a polished, refined act and with Bogart, Aucoin and Delaney they succeeded. The greatest leap the band ever made was the one from the loft with a somewhat primitive idea to the much more polished act produced by Aucoin and Bogart, bankrolled with a show and a small production. Without Aucoin and Bogart, the band would not have been prepared to launch.
Huge KISS fan here and as much as I love the 70’s KISS, and respect Ace and Peter’s contributions to the band, the simple fact is they didn’t love the band enough to hang around. They both had problems with drugs and alcohol that they should have dealt with earlier. They had no desire to learn about the music business and get better at being a part of it. After the solo albums they gave up on the band and only thought of themselves. And ultimately money was more important because they sold their characters to Gene and Paul. They walked away willingly for money, and they still get well paid for it. They made their choice. Tommy has been around the band as early as 1985. He knows it inside and out. He’s a great guitar player and the best person to take over the lead guitar. People need to understand that there are literally no bands out there that haven’t changed their lineups at some point. I never got to see KISS in their 70’s heyday, but as I got older I got my opportunity to experience a KISS show, and got to take my 12yr old daughter, who is a massive KISS fan too. You can’t buy the look on my daughters face for those two hours during that show, and she’ll have that memory forever. That wouldn’t have happened without Tommy, Eric, Paul and Gene.
KISS ceased to be a band after Revenge and created a nostalgia act with Doc McGhee driving it in 1996. They've lived on that ever since. So you have an entire generation of kids who only know KISS as a show, who do not make any association with them as a band, so there is nothing to violate in their eyes regarding origins. And if we're being completely transparent, Peter and Ace are just as guilty. No one got back together for the art of the concept. This was a cash grab because all four originals NEEDED it. The fact they are no longer part of that cash grab today does not subtract its lack of relevance from when they were participating. KISS conceptually died off in 1983 when they removed the makeup. Everything since has been a cosplay with rotating players...and wigs. Who is playing which part is immaterial in the grand scheme of how the public sees it. So Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons have actually rendered themselves pointless.
You are too generous with the band's lifespan. I cut them off as a hungry, hard rock band up to "Destroyer". After that, it became a KISSness, a cartoon, more show than music and disjointed due to internal conflicts and the spoils of fame and $$. And yes, HTH is their best studio album, as sloppy a production that it is, it rocks.
For many, Beth was the fork in the road; they lost a lot of the earlier fans after that, but gained a new, younger audience. Their peak merchandising years from 77-79 benefited greatly by this development. The massive amount of money generated by a hit single (Beth) began rolling in; they would do it again in 1979 with a disco hit. In 1980, Kiss signed one of the most lucrative recording contracts in the record business; their merchandising rights were a multi-million dollar machine. The band's popularity suffered greatly as a result of disco backlash, eventually dropping their makeup entirely and finally charting another hit song in '90 with Forever.
That is what I've always said, that Kiss really ended in 96 when Ace and Peter came back! Up until that point they were a current band releasing new music every 2 years. This ended with the reunion tour!
If they returned to the stage have Eric singer as fox man Tommy Thayer as the warrior ( Vinnie Vincent make up ) then ace and Peter be spaceman and cat man
Paul and gene once said: We only work here, and the fans are in charge... That is not true. Because if that was true, me and many people around the world would say: Ace & Peter back, or Ace back. Right now! But I guess, it's a different story ha Paul & Gene...
Those two characters fucked up their opportunity to be in the band by being unreliable, pissing and moaning about money, and being drunk and high. They didn't give a shit and have never apologized to the fans. They don't give a rats banana why should you
Well it is Paul n gene's band and they have the right to do what ever they want. If ace n pete had of sorted them selves early on in the piece, they would probably still be in the band.
Seen kiss farewell tour in 2001 great show great concert loud as hell that's the real kiss. Would not pay $0.02 to go see them now wrote them off years ago
At every show, Paul and Gene both introduce the Spaceman as Tommy Thayer. Eric Carr's character was ok , Vinnie ? not so much. I would put Ace's make up on in a heartbeat if I were offered the gig. Whether you like it or not, They've moved on and have been very successful. It is what it is. I don't sit around and dwell on it even though, I wouldn't mind Ace playing with Kiss again.
Here is the thing. With KISS keeping the original makeup of ACE AND PETER their names will live forever. Eric and Tommy had no choice on their customs.
Granted "Kiss" owns the makeup rights, but I have to agree with Eddie on this. The example of Angus Young's school boy outfit is a perfect example. I WAS a long time fan, and I also agree I would be fine if they would have given them new characters. I get it is a business and sometimes artist get along sometimes they don't. I was a fan with all the other era's of KIss because it was just different people in the band. It was not new members acting and dressing like old members. By the way didn't Gene Simmons sue King Diamond for make up looking too close to his ??
Exactly. Tommy and Eric have a job and they’re simply wearing the uniform required by their boss. Only hardcore KISS fans care. I don’t like it but it is what it is. I agree with Eddie, if Tommy and Eric were their own characters it wouldn’t be an issue.
The way I see it, Tommy and Eric didn't have to accept the offer. I don't like seeing two other guys dressed up as ,Peter and Ace,who were my hero's when kiss first came out. It's the kiss I grew up on and worshipped up till 79. It's the kiss who still looked and mostly sounded good putting on those spectacular shows. It's the kiss who I never actually heard speaking badly of other bands and trying to make themselves look so much better,and that could just of been due to the fact that you didn't have stuff like the internet and all the publicized media like today. But , who the hell really cares anymore??? Kiss is washed up and just needs to quit no matter who is in the band at this point. They don't look good on the makeup, and can't really put on the kind of shows they used to. People get old and that's a fact.
How many Actors have played Batman, Superman. You gonna stop being fans of them too? Kinda Hypocritical. Do you skip the Tribute bands who put on the make-up? Why can people doing a Tribute band get away with it, but not the people who actually own the rights? Seems like you just want to be mad at Gene and Paul for something.
I don't know man, four guys got together and formed a band and then they decided that band was going to be their livelihood. And that business revolved around presenting an illusion that was based on four fictional characters. Paul Stanley isn't starchild. Starchild is a character he portrays. When you have a role on Broadway and you get too old for that role and they replace you with another actor nobody's crying about that. It's because they're playing a character and that character belongs to the story. The four characters those guys portrayed are kiss. The people behind the greasepaint has never mattered in any other facet of the entertainment industry. I don't see where this is any different Ed.
I agree with Eddie Trunk 100%. Their last two studio albums were garbage, and Paul can't sing nearly as well as he used to. I gave up on them around 2001 as well.
@@natecannon6746 longest tenure doesn't mean much for a band who's material has not had any relevance in the last 20 years (his tenure). Vinnie has more impact, he has actually written songs people know and the current guy has to play.
Don't know why I listen to this. They are a tribute band and that's it. I like the 70's up to Lick It Up. That's the Kiss I'll still listen to. I haven't seen them live for decades. No interested in who they've become.
originally Singer, Thayer were filling in...people didn't seem to care... to say that who owns the make up rights is irrelevant, sorry it's very relevant .Frehley Criss sold those rights gave up their characters.Very small% of people even care. Vinnie Carrs characters were failures lowest point in KISS popularity.
Bottom line, both Peter and Ace quit multiple times. They sold the rights to their makeup and persona. The new owners can do what they please with it. I also think it’s ridiculous what is happening. But I think Ace and Peter are being drama queens about the issue created by selling their stuff.
Please In A perfect world Ace and Peter Would have played Their hearts out on every Kiss Album And would have respected there health And in doing so would have respected the Fans But no, things got out of control and Peter And Ace didn't care And got 2 chances At Life
can understand why ace and peter wouldn't do it, its just not right and would be weird, the only way they could make it work for ace and peter to make appearances during the final few shows would be to have an mtv 'unplugged' style set maybe, but a full makeup thing would never work and rightly so
My problem with Tommy is a backstage interview I saw with the band all in makeup. I’m guessing it was before they hit a stage. Anyway there getting interviewed and the reporter asked Tommy very nice & innocent. Uve been the replacement for so many years Do u think the fans accept u now and don’t look at u as a stand in. Tommy gets pissed with reporter “IM NOT A STAND IN IM NOT A REPLACEMENT I AM THE LEAD GUITARIST N KISS”. Whatever until Ace wants to hit the stage with Gene and Paul
This all started when Peter dropped out during Farwell tour, so Eric Singer had to fill those shoes..literally. Then Ace would not open for Aerosmith, ergo; Tommy had to fill those shoes. Thus, the Pandoras Box was opened indefinitely.
True. It's because Peter suddenly left after knowing his salary smaller than Ace. The show must go on. After read their stories, we knew both peter and ace have no good work ethic and so unprofessional,, their ego broke the band again and again even Kiss gave them many chances.
@@JohnyLim6393 All true, but still, having others play those characters is absurd. Most real longtime Kiss fans refuse to buy in. Just like having multiple "farewell" tours that go on for years is ludicrous.
Yeah he’s a good guitarist. But Kiss doesn’t attempt to try something new but survive off their old hits. Tommy may have been in the band longer than Ace but the reality is Tommy play’s live kiss only has released three albums with tommy officially the lead guitarist. Anyone that goes to listen to their favorite kiss song from that time are still listening to Ace at the end of the day because the current group doesn’t want to risk doing anything new or make some changes
I agree with Eddie I love KISS and the original lineup and I hate that KISS dress Eric and Tommy as Peter and Ace and I can't stand that Paul is lip syncing I'd be fine with KISS dressing Eric and Tommy in there own makeup I saw Ace as a solo act in 2019
For More Eddie Trunk amzn.to/2PKBm6h
Ace and Peter should have showed up at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Induction Ceremony in full costume and makeup.
Paul and Gene Probably would have sued them.
@@mr.brenman2132 peter they could have but not ace because he didn’t sell the rights to them. He licenses it to kiss
That would have been so great😂. But, gene and Paul would have sued them probably. Monet grubbing assholes.
@@Chicken_Wing91 funny how ace fails to mention that. Ace forgets there’s no such thing as halfway crooks. “Hate to break it to you cat man, I’m making more” never forget.
@@monstersofthemidw100 yes i know i read peter’s book. But that was then This is now
BTW ...The "Tribute Band" with Rob Zombie, Tommy Lee, Gilby Clark, Slash and Ace Frehley was far better than any Kiss could come up with.
Absolutely 💯
I saw the first farewell tour in 7th grade. I checked out after that too. Ace's Army.
How many 'Farewell tours' have they done? I think I was in high school when they did their first one and I'm in my 50s now
@@jonesy2111 They have only done 1.
@@kenshinshimura5083 🤣🤣🤣 For the last 30 odd years maybe
@@jonesy2111 Nope just 1 man trust me I'm a Diehard fan bro.
If I hear Eddie say 1 more time I know those guys Lol....
I'm pretty sure that if I knew the people that he knows, I would be dropping names faster than molten mozzarella!
Don't you know any people in the industry you work in?
A "Fucking" men
Right with on that .
Eddie trunk: obsessed more about other men’s makeup choices than I am with my life
I agree with eddie trunk
Eddie I been talking about someone else wearing ace make up for 18 yrs trunk stay tuned I wi talk about it again VERY SOON
There's only one KISS...Ace Peter Paul Gene...Period!!!!!!!!
Absolutely! Nothing more than a cover band now!
Well, what the hell can you do???? Really, all four, actually are not fond of each other. Ace and Peter were buddies but such severe alcoholics/addicts.
Dylan Connolly he wasn’t the original lead guitarist.... he’s a paid employee now. Which is not a bad thing but you need to realize that a band is made up of personalities...... take one of those personalities or replace one of those personalities and the bands’ sound changes.... listen to unmask.... you can tell that Peter wasn’t playing the drums on that record.... or the solo in the song Flaming Youth is not Ace..... the band sounds good now but they don’t sound like the original.... glad I got to see the original lineup in 1997 on the reunion tour..... they kicked ass....
Dylan Connolly Ace joined the band in 1972 ..... not getting your point.... Ace is the original lead guitarist..... Tommy is out placing Ace’s licks.... singing Ace’s songs..... what Tommy song is Ace playing.....Ace and Peter were part of the original band that made that original sound...... Gene, Paul, Peter and Ace are Kiss...... I’ve seen tribute bands that are better than Kiss..... doesn’t make them Kiss.....
Dylan Connolly Tommy is a paid employee playing Ace’s role..... Ace, along with Peter, was an original member that help make that band what it is......... Those four guys created the sound that is Kiss......all those that came after are just replacements...... doesn’t matter their history with the band. Eric Carr, Vinnie, Mark and Bruce did not have to dress up like a former members...... Hell.... Bob Kulick has a longer history with the band than any of those others guys........ still not getting your point..... still doesn’t make Tommy an original member...... he’s playing Ace....
Tommy was doing a cover band of kiss and everyone was cool with it now people have an issue. And Tommy Thayer is a great guitarist playing in black and blue. So he's got other outlets to play in.
Because it was a cover band. Why would anyone care that he was in a cover band? He had so many outlets prior to joining Kiss that he was bringing Peter his spaghetti.
Just for kicks, Tommy and Eric should come out in the Ankh Warrior and Fox makeup.
Yes on the Fox. No, on the ankh, was stupid and has no mass impact and looked bad on anyone.
@@trissloan2340 Vinnie's makeup was cool...much cooler than a fake Spaceman.
They did well with all the make up designs. Good job
They should never touch the Fox Makeup leave Eric Carr rest in peace man.
Fan from the early 70s. You can't replace the persona of the band by putting different people behind the makeup. I don't miss kiss at all. I have all my memories, albums posters etc.... if I choose to live in the past. The old music is the best. Seen them (original) 4 times and that was enough for me.
hes comfortable in someone's eleses skin lol...Thommy got Ace autograph 1977. ....thommy gives Autographs for Ace 2022
Agree 100%. As a working musician, I cannot blame Eric or Tommy, as I would do the same; it’s a job. However, as a fan, if I want to see a tribute band, I’ll go to a local venue and attend for free.
Do tribute band's play for free where you're from?
I got balls to say that " I would much rather watch the videos of the concerts in 1976-1977 when I was a part of seeing them at the height of their popularity then and being a part of that time before it started falling apart". What they are doing now is a tribute band of the original line up and should have ended when the original farewell tour was done, they could have done other things away from KISS and come back in a different version of KISS, at least that way I wouldn't feel the way I do about the band now but I'm only a fan and they have convinced others to like this version they are now and they can afford to since they got my money for all the albums, merchandise and concert tickets I've bought over the years so why should my opinion matter?
Amen! MR SMITH
Thank
I love Kiss and I have no animosity toward Tommy or Eric. Even though I’m not of the generation that saw the original lineup ( I was born right around the time of first makeup reunion tour) I just can’t do the whole fake Ace and Peter thing. I’d be much more into it if Ace and Eric were given their own designs like Eric and Vinnie way back in the past.
I don’t even watch clips of this lineup let alone go to a concert.
I honestly don't blame Ace. Gene and Paul don't care who they step on in order to get what they want. In the end it was good that Ace played. It helped play a huge role in sticking it to Gene and Paul. The four orginal members should've called it quits after the reunion tour. Obviously at that point from everyone's perspective it wasn't going to be sustainable but of course the reunited Kiss was another huge paycheck for Gene and Paul so they were going to raise their bank accounts at the expense of Ace and Peter.
I remember seeing Kiss in 1984, Bruce was on stage yet people shouted 'welcome, Mark'...! ;-)
A real life Kiss Meets The Phantom battle with the 2 Spacemans and 2 Catmans. I'd pay to see that show!!
I have not bought a single KISS item since the Anthology DVDs. Which are really not that in depth imo. If it isn't the original KISS, l ain't buying it unless it's the Creatures era!!
🔥Peter Criss told Eddie that he heard that KISS pays Tommy $24,000 a show. PC was mad because Gene & Paul paid him WAY less back in 96 & 97.
I truthfully think Gene and Paul are doing this on purpose to piss Ace and Peter off just doesn't stop!!
Gene and Paul are control freaks and greedy for the money. I’m sure their percentage was even higher than the other guys. Ace &Peter.
@@russellfrew6334 Well I am sure,,,,, I believe that's why Ace and Peter quite I am sure if it was even straight up across the board they would of stayed to getting longer but with Gene and Paul greedyness who knows!!
Aaron Son 25%. X 4. Would have been fair
@@russellfrew6334 Peter and Ace have said way worse things about Gene and Paul than they ever have. And I for one support the fact that Gene and Paul make money on what they do. Nobody works for free, and I guarantee none of you would do any different. They still pay Peter and Ace, even when they weren’t part of the band. Those guys need to take a step back and look at how much they really contributed in their inebriated states and then tell us who really kept KISS going in the 70’s onwards.
Nothing's better than the originals.. just my opinion.. God bless the younger generation that loves todays Kiss.. Whatever works for the fan...
I have already made a comment but Eddie trunks is one of the biggest biggest kiss fans that ever lived and he's calling it like he sees it I always felt that Ace was the best musician in the band and I liked his songs the best and to me there is no other cat Then Pete I'm going back to vinyl I have Dynasty alive love gun and debut I always enjoy them thank you
Ace sold his make up to Gene years ago. So gene deserve the copyrigh of it. So why blame tommy? He is a much better guitarist and person
thank god for eddie saving Ace and convincing him to play that night, FMD!
Saving Ace to play with the tribute band thank God.
What .WHAT???? ..Ed. Yes it was Tommy Thayers decision to apply Ace Frehley's designed SPACE Mack-up and join KISS He could have said sorry I can't do that , but Tommy Thayer had a past of trying to be Ace Frehley's SPACEMAN ..he was ACE in the KISS tribute band COLD GIN , he already knew the part to play , not always the solos .Yes he could say NO , no one made him do it .Tommy is not dumb he's getting BUCK $ for being the SPACEMAN maybe not what the real Ace would have been earning from tours, mech. etc..but he's getting paid , no one twisted his arm or any one else waiting in the wings to jump at that job , this is the music BUSINESS.
Don't blame Gene or Paul maybe it's not the greatest thing to have done , but Ace Frehley and Peter Criss have made the decision NOT to be involved anymore , Gene and Paul have been here the whole time ,they want Kiss to go out in Mack-up to the final.shows ..this is the 4 that most concert goers recognize.I kinda understand the way they think about newer Mack-up characters.Eric Carr's (R.I.P.) and the FOX are LOVED by fans just as much as the 4 originals , Vinnie's AnKh Warrior no one understood it and than it was gone , newer characters would confuse the fans that are not DIEHARD FANS .I LOVE KISS first saw them 1974 Louisville KY seen as many shows and as possible at least one pre tour .Thanks for your post 🤟🤟 , keep the ROCK ALIVE ..
i respect tommy and eric singer but my favorite kiss musciians are ace and peter and vinnie and mark and eric carr may they both rest in peace
You forgot Bruce Kulick
@@williamcharlesschneider4825 sorry bruce to when mark wasn't in kiss i grew up listening to kiss with bruce thanks so much
Ace and peter fucked up their chances by choosing booze and drugs and being unreliable, over the band and the fans and never gave a shit, and have never apologized to the fans ONCE. It's their own fault...
Are you telling me that's not Ace on guitar?
No, sure isn't. Ace plays Trout :)
@@applejacks971 Yes, initially trout was a side gig, as Ace was a busy plumber/ducky boy.
@Mauricio93201 Tell me about it lmao drunk ace is the best
applejacks971 no he plays the space bear
Eddie I know every rock star and they look up to me trunk
He also likes to go on about how they dont want to meet us, but he the opinionated dj is their bff. Most any musician I ever met hates opinionated djs.
Get educated..You need it
Metal "it's ok though if I know people in the industry I work in" head
@@picassoboy52 Eddie I taught gezzer how to bowl trunk
It's his career, it's his job. The job allows him to meet and know a whole crew of rock musicians over 35+ years. Any one of us would probably love to do what he does. And reap the same benefits of knowing amazing musicians.
Good on tommy and Eric for sticking strong and not letting the comments bother them . Makeup is makeup time has passed things ain’t going to be the same after 40 years
FUCK YOU
Yeah replace Paul and Gene with wannabes.What does it matter. DUMBASSES
Well Its the TRUTH!!!!!!!!!
The thing is this wouldn't be happening if Ace & Peter haven't given up the persona makeup to Paul & Gene for money. So it's obvious they care more about the money than their trademark makeup. What did they think was gonna happen with their makeup? It is what it is ?
Hi guys. Did anyone know Eddie signed Ace to Megaforce Records?
He did make the decision to put Ace’s makeup on. No one held a gun to his head. He could’ve said no.
Tommy is a god damn imposter!!!!😂
If things can't be the way they were 40 years ago... KISS (Paul & Gene) sure as shit keeps trying to recreate and live off it.
But Tommy and Eric accepted those terms to join the band.
Indeed they are to blame also if they go along with it. I understand the temptation they would feel to have done it, but a true KISS fan wouldn't disrespect Ace & Peter like that or betray the KISS Army in such a way.
If they didn't do it someone else would and people would piss and moan about whoever it is
And who can blame them? They are great players and they deserve it.
@@landerryan1485 They don't deserve it...Having their own makeup is what they deserve.
They accepted those terms like anyone else in their position would. Don't even try to act like you wouldn't.
*Paul & Gene know the majority of concert goers don't even know it's not the original drummer & lead guitarist.* *Fact!*
Not that hard to tell the difference. Paul even shouts their name when they get done with a solo.
Paul & Gene do mentioned their names more than once at the shows.
It would have been great if Eric and Tommy had come up with their own characters, allowing Ace and Peter to join them onstage in their characters anytime it made sense (to Paul and Gene). Could still have marketed all the original characters (and the new characters). May not have been ideal to market the touring band with alternate characters, but there would always be the possibility that one or both of the originals could join them at any time.
New characters for Tommy & Eric would have worked fine. Paul & Gene like to blame Carr & Vinnie's characters as part of the reason KISS was failing in the early 80's, but having new characters in the band wasn't the problem...the problem was that it was a new decade and music and fashions changed and KISS were no longer in style or considered cool anymore, and also KISS put out poppy sounding records for a few years prior which ruined their reputation.
This idea makes huge sense. Fans buy anything. But the thought of Ace or Peter showing up at anytime. What great click bait.
You would think Gene and Paul, the masters of marketing, would figure that out. More characters, more $$$. But, they didn't. Just like when they say they give the fans what they want. They think they do. If I never hear RnRAN again in my life I won't be disappointed. You can also include Love Gun, Firehouse, Deuce, and the rest of them. Same setlist for 20 years. BORING! Who wants to see the same show over and over? That's why I checked out 20 years ago. You tell me the setlist has songs like Magic Touch, X-Ray Eyes, Charisma, Exciter, Under the Gun, Hide Your Heart, Larger Than Life, Room Service, Just a Boy, Rockin in the USA, Got Love for Sale, Two Timer, She's So European, Naked City, Killer, Saint and Sinner, All Hell's Breakin Loose, Young and Wasted, Thrills in the Night, King of the Mountain, Secretly Cruel, Who Wants to Be Lonely, Hell or High Water, Good Girl Gone Bad, Betrayed, Rise to It and I'll go. Gene and Paul should do their final tour like Thin Lizzy did in '83. Scrap the makeup and have each guitarist come out and do a few songs from their respective era, with a jam at the end with everyone, even Vinnie. Set up a stand for Mark St. John and have a set of sticks for Eric Carr in their memory. Push the egos aside and do it for the fans.
Fans don't want to see new characters.
@@natecannon6746 Only the casual fans who don't care who's wearing whose makeup.
Eddie is right there is even talk about Gene and Paul getting substitutes for themselves that is menudo the original lineup is the best always will be for me I know I'm old but they turned into a tribute band take a look at Foreigner one original member
Ask Gene if he remembers getting nuckeld on top of the foot back in 74/75 👊😂 yeah it was me.
Had they created two new characters, they could have opened up a whole new line of memorabilia........cha-ching
They did. Ankh Warrior and Fox. Zero traction, quickly forgotten.
eric carr and vinnie had their own mask though
New characters didn't go over well the first time.
They are far too old for any of it to matter.
Gary XHLC It’s because the original 4 were themselves. The makeup was their personalities. They were larger than life. The 2 after we’re just face paint. That’s why it didn’t work. But personally I have no problem with the current line up
Eddie, I feel the same!
I heard Eddie and ace are friends
Totally agree with you! It diminishes Kiss’s legacy, and it’s so uncool to have Tommy & Eric as Peter & Ace, not knowing any better I thought it was the original Kiss band at that VH1 rock honors when I found out it wasn’t and there was two guys dressed like the originals I thought it was soooo tacky !!! Feel cheated out of seeing the complete real thing
Just like Dio not opening for Ozzy, they have too much respect for themselves, and I don't blame them for not doing it, I wouldn't either..
Ive been listening to him talking about this thing with the face paint for like 2 years now lol..
Funny when he's talking about putting ACDC making another guy into "The School Boy" that would be funny too..
Of course Ace didn’t want to play in a “tribute” band honoring the band he helped start, while they (and his replacement) received an award. That’s absurd. I can’t believe he agreed to do it in the first place. What a humiliating experience, and why you would talk him into that is odd as well. Although, you were producing, so your loyalties were to the show, not to the human beings. Ugh. Glad I missed it.
Chris Stanley Exactly.
yet he posed with pictures with Tommy
Old men arguing about old men with makeup , high heels and wigs!!! A hidden love for drag queens!
One of the most gibberish comments ever posted
Bruh.... you listened to it
Ace will always be my favorite Spaceman
KISS is a brand, not a band. Their decision show it's always about money, not about music.
Name me one band that is going out on your after 30 years for the music. It’s about a paycheck. And rightfully so.
Perhaps new makeups could result in another creatures tour moneywise..i think this is an underlying issue that nobody has confronted..i wish I saw creatures and would go to see them if they did new makeups ..so long as they look cool..i think it is a fear of failure but that was then ..maiden and preist stole the kiss fans back in 83..wish kiss made it to jersey I would have been blown away..i am still waiting ..I like the Ankh too...right now we aint got much as far as any bands playing soon...the new kiss does sound great ...wish there was more creatures footage
Yep yep indeed
I agree with Eddie, it put KISS in the eyes of many, as just another manufactured group, a la Menudo, Backstreet Boys, etc., and why I have not been to a Kiss concert in twenty years
Kiss was always criticized for being a production. Neil Bogart, Bill Aucoin and Sean Delaney all contributed to the band's development. Kiss wanted management to shape them into a refined act, and that's what they did. Kiss believed that without good management, you were just another band in the bar jamming it out. Kiss wanted to become a polished, refined act and with Bogart, Aucoin and Delaney they succeeded. The greatest leap the band ever made was the one from the loft with a somewhat primitive idea to the much more polished act produced by Aucoin and Bogart, bankrolled with a show and a small production. Without Aucoin and Bogart, the band would not have been prepared to launch.
I get the impression Eddie doesn't think Tommy and Eric, wearing Ace and Peter's makeup isn't a good idea.
This is a new opinion for him.
I also got the impression that Eddie is really self important and knows a lot of people
Huge KISS fan here and as much as I love the 70’s KISS, and respect Ace and Peter’s contributions to the band, the simple fact is they didn’t love the band enough to hang around. They both had problems with drugs and alcohol that they should have dealt with earlier. They had no desire to learn about the music business and get better at being a part of it. After the solo albums they gave up on the band and only thought of themselves. And ultimately money was more important because they sold their characters to Gene and Paul. They walked away willingly for money, and they still get well paid for it. They made their choice.
Tommy has been around the band as early as 1985. He knows it inside and out. He’s a great guitar player and the best person to take over the lead guitar.
People need to understand that there are literally no bands out there that haven’t changed their lineups at some point.
I never got to see KISS in their 70’s heyday, but as I got older I got my opportunity to experience a KISS show, and got to take my 12yr old daughter, who is a massive KISS fan too. You can’t buy the look on my daughters face for those two hours during that show, and she’ll have that memory forever. That wouldn’t have happened without Tommy, Eric, Paul and Gene.
If I was going to replace Ace I wouldn't wear the same makeup design I would use Paul Stanley's Bandit design
Hey Everybody Eddie knows all the guys in KISS !!! Really…. He really does . lol ….
KISS ceased to be a band after Revenge and created a nostalgia act with Doc McGhee driving it in 1996. They've lived on that ever since. So you have an entire generation of kids who only know KISS as a show, who do not make any association with them as a band, so there is nothing to violate in their eyes regarding origins.
And if we're being completely transparent, Peter and Ace are just as guilty. No one got back together for the art of the concept. This was a cash grab because all four originals NEEDED it. The fact they are no longer part of that cash grab today does not subtract its lack of relevance from when they were participating. KISS conceptually died off in 1983 when they removed the makeup. Everything since has been a cosplay with rotating players...and wigs. Who is playing which part is immaterial in the grand scheme of how the public sees it. So Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons have actually rendered themselves pointless.
Well said.
You are too generous with the band's lifespan. I cut them off as a hungry, hard rock band up to "Destroyer". After that, it became a KISSness, a cartoon, more show than music and disjointed due to internal conflicts and the spoils of fame and $$. And yes, HTH is their best studio album, as sloppy a production that it is, it rocks.
For many, Beth was the fork in the road; they lost a lot of the earlier fans after that, but gained a new, younger audience. Their peak merchandising years from 77-79 benefited greatly by this development. The massive amount of money generated by a hit single (Beth) began rolling in; they would do it again in 1979 with a disco hit. In 1980, Kiss signed one of the most lucrative recording contracts in the record business; their merchandising rights were a multi-million dollar machine. The band's popularity suffered greatly as a result of disco backlash, eventually dropping their makeup entirely and finally charting another hit song in '90 with Forever.
That is what I've always said, that Kiss really ended in 96 when Ace and Peter came back! Up until that point they were a current band releasing new music every 2 years. This ended with the reunion tour!
Rick Baker loved loved revenge
Eddie Trunk attacks KISS, then moments later demonstrates why Ace is not in the band anymore....
500% correct! It’s wrong and I’ll NEVER be able to digest it!
If they returned to the stage have Eric singer as fox man Tommy Thayer as the warrior ( Vinnie Vincent make up ) then ace and Peter be spaceman and cat man
After ace n peter were out of kiss after they downed the classic makeup.they should have just continued without makeup
Paul and gene once said: We only work here, and the fans are in charge...
That is not true.
Because if that was true, me and many people around the world would say: Ace & Peter back, or Ace back. Right now!
But I guess, it's a different story ha Paul & Gene...
Those two characters fucked up their opportunity to be in the band by being unreliable, pissing and moaning about money, and being drunk and high. They didn't give a shit and have never apologized to the fans. They don't give a rats banana why should you
@@picassoboy52 ALL 4 of them messed up a good thing.
Listen history will repeat itself. Ace and Peter will not show up or they'd come in drugged up.
Well it is Paul n gene's band and they have the right to do what ever they want. If ace n pete had of sorted them selves early on in the piece, they would probably still be in the band.
Ed, your absolutely right.
End of the road. The show's are ok. I want the 75 KISS out fits
Paul and Gene should just play shows with an Ace and Peter Hologram. Problem solved.
Seen kiss farewell tour in 2001 great show great concert loud as hell that's the real kiss. Would not pay $0.02 to go see them now wrote them off years ago
At every show, Paul and Gene both introduce the Spaceman as Tommy Thayer. Eric Carr's character was ok , Vinnie ? not so much. I would put Ace's make up on in a heartbeat if I were offered the gig. Whether you like it or not, They've moved on and have been very successful. It is what it is. I don't sit around and dwell on it even though, I wouldn't mind Ace playing with Kiss again.
Here is the thing. With KISS keeping the original makeup of ACE AND PETER their names will live forever. Eric and Tommy had no choice on their customs.
Eddie, get over it! It's THEATER ROCK. The make up is part of a legacy theatrical show.
Yeah i know them too
🤣
Eddie Trunk for president!
When Gene and Paul step aside,the roles of Starchild and Demon will be filled by some young guys.the band will continue on.
Granted "Kiss" owns the makeup rights, but I have to agree with Eddie on this. The example of Angus Young's school boy outfit is a perfect example. I WAS a long time fan, and I also agree I would be fine if they would have given them new characters. I get it is a business and sometimes artist get along sometimes they don't. I was a fan with all the other era's of KIss because it was just different people in the band. It was not new members acting and dressing like old members. By the way didn't Gene Simmons sue King Diamond for make up looking too close to his ??
Exactly. Tommy and Eric have a job and they’re simply wearing the uniform required by their boss.
Only hardcore KISS fans care. I don’t like it but it is what it is. I agree with Eddie, if Tommy and Eric were their own characters it wouldn’t be an issue.
The way I see it, Tommy and Eric didn't have to accept the offer. I don't like seeing two other guys dressed up as ,Peter and Ace,who were my hero's when kiss first came out. It's the kiss I grew up on and worshipped up till 79. It's the kiss who still looked and mostly sounded good putting on those spectacular shows. It's the kiss who I never actually heard speaking badly of other bands and trying to make themselves look so much better,and that could just of been due to the fact that you didn't have stuff like the internet and all the publicized media like today.
But , who the hell really cares anymore??? Kiss is washed up and just needs to quit no matter who is in the band at this point. They don't look good on the makeup, and can't really put on the kind of shows they used to. People get old and that's a fact.
How many Actors have played Batman, Superman. You gonna stop being fans of them too? Kinda Hypocritical. Do you skip the Tribute bands who put on the make-up? Why can people doing a Tribute band get away with it, but not the people who actually own the rights? Seems like you just want to be mad at Gene and Paul for something.
No
I don't know man, four guys got together and formed a band and then they decided that band was going to be their livelihood.
And that business revolved around presenting an illusion that was based on four fictional characters. Paul Stanley isn't starchild. Starchild is a character he portrays.
When you have a role on Broadway and you get too old for that role and they replace you with another actor nobody's crying about that. It's because they're playing a character and that character belongs to the story. The four characters those guys portrayed are kiss.
The people behind the greasepaint has never mattered in any other facet of the entertainment industry. I don't see where this is any different Ed.
They should tour and play nothing but KISS songs from Lick it Up to Revenge. Shows who the true fans are. Lol.
I agree with Eddie Trunk 100%. Their last two studio albums were garbage, and Paul can't sing nearly as well as he used to. I gave up on them around 2001 as well.
Tommy is like joe Perry in aces makeup
Ace nowadays would look like Ron Jeremy in Aces makeup
Good thing it's not Aces makeup anymore
More like the guy nobody knows or cares about in Ace's makeup.
@@williamthomas4125
Longest tenured guitarist Kiss has had, pretty sure he's well known. The fans care about him.
@@natecannon6746 longest tenure doesn't mean much for a band who's material has not had any relevance in the last 20 years (his tenure). Vinnie has more impact, he has actually written songs people know and the current guy has to play.
This is several years old.
FRAY-LEE!
DRUG-EE
WHY are we still talking about this???
Don't know why I listen to this. They are a tribute band and that's it. I like the 70's up to Lick It Up. That's the Kiss I'll still listen to. I haven't seen them live for decades. No interested in who they've become.
Peter can’t physically handle a tour like that. It sucks but it’s true.
originally Singer, Thayer were filling in...people didn't seem to care... to say that who owns the make up rights is irrelevant, sorry it's very relevant .Frehley Criss sold those rights gave up their characters.Very small% of people even care. Vinnie Carrs characters were failures lowest point in KISS popularity.
Vinnie Vincent had his own identity and his own classic songs Ace-Lite has kareoke and nothing more.
Bottom line, both Peter and Ace quit multiple times. They sold the rights to their makeup and persona. The new owners can do what they please with it. I also think it’s ridiculous what is happening. But I think Ace and Peter are being drama queens about the issue created by selling their stuff.
Why couldn't Tommy come up with his own costume gimmick like vinnie Vincent did his own costume gimmick
Did you not hear what he said?
Excuse me it was 2000 I seen kiss farewell tour
Please
In A perfect world
Ace and Peter
Would have played
Their hearts out on every Kiss Album
And would have respected there health
And in doing so would have respected the Fans
But no, things got out of control and Peter
And Ace didn't care
And got 2 chances
At Life
Guys who fucked themselves always look to blame someone else
For their own mistakes
can understand why ace and peter wouldn't do it, its just not right and would be weird, the only way they could make it work for ace and peter to make appearances during the final few shows would be to have an mtv 'unplugged' style set maybe, but a full makeup thing would never work and rightly so
You know if they are going to wear other people’s make up, seems how it’s the end of the road, I’d like to see Eric wear Eric Carr’s make up
My problem with Tommy is a backstage interview I saw with the band all in makeup. I’m guessing it was before they hit a stage. Anyway there getting interviewed and the reporter asked Tommy very nice & innocent. Uve been the replacement for so many years Do u think the fans accept u now and don’t look at u as a stand in. Tommy gets pissed with reporter “IM
NOT A STAND IN IM NOT A REPLACEMENT I AM THE LEAD GUITARIST N KISS”. Whatever until Ace wants to hit the stage with Gene and Paul
This all started when Peter dropped out during Farwell tour, so Eric Singer had to fill those shoes..literally. Then Ace would not open for Aerosmith, ergo; Tommy had to fill those shoes. Thus, the Pandoras Box was opened indefinitely.
True. It's because Peter suddenly left after knowing his salary smaller than Ace.
The show must go on.
After read their stories, we knew both peter and ace have no good work ethic and so unprofessional,, their ego broke the band again and again even Kiss gave them many chances.
@@JohnyLim6393 All true, but still, having others play those characters is absurd. Most real longtime Kiss fans refuse to buy in. Just like having multiple "farewell" tours that go on for years is ludicrous.
Yeah he’s a good guitarist. But Kiss doesn’t attempt to try something new but survive off their old hits. Tommy may have been in the band longer than Ace but the reality is Tommy play’s live kiss only has released three albums with tommy officially the lead guitarist. Anyone that goes to listen to their favorite kiss song from that time are still listening to Ace at the end of the day because the current group doesn’t want to risk doing anything new or make some changes
It’s 2020 who cares 🤷🏻♀️ Ace is great and Tommy is great 🥂
I agree with Eddie I love KISS and the original lineup and I hate that KISS dress Eric and Tommy as Peter and Ace and I can't stand that Paul is lip syncing I'd be fine with KISS dressing Eric and Tommy in there own makeup I saw Ace as a solo act in 2019
Dude please those 2 guys where losers and lost the gig.. get real.. they didnt want to work as hard as the other 2 guys so to bad.. jesus