It is simply not possible that the doctrine of the trinity can be found without human instruction. It is a doctrine of men, and no one who studies the Scriptures with the Holy Spirit will ever find the doctrine inside Holy Writ, without being told what to believe by a man.
Indeed. *The trinity is intellectual philosophical speculation.* - *"Toward the end of the 1st century, and during the 2nd, many learned men came over both from Judaism and paganism to Christianity. These brought with them into the Christian schools of theology their Platonic ideas and phraseology"* (article "Trinity," Vol. 10, p. 553).
Do you have a translator who could translate this topic into Russian? A very interesting and important topic. I really want to listen to it in a human translation, and not in an artificial intelligence translation.
Heavenly TRIO 3 Persons Beings “There are three living Persons of the heavenly trio; in the name of these three great powers-The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit-Those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will co-operate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ.”-Special Testimonies, Series B, No. 7, 63. (Evangelism, 615. Synonyms for TRIO: trinity, threesome, . group of three, trilogy You are born unto God, and you stand under the sanction and the power of the three holiest beings in heaven, who are able to keep you from falling. 7MR 267.2
In 1966 Leroy Froom wrote a letter to R.A. Anderson bragging how they both had a part in compiling the E.G. White quotations in “Evangelism” in order to combat the Columbian Union Conference leaders who were still non-trinitarian at the time (1946). Dr Froom stated, “You know what it did with men in the Columbia Union… They either had to lay down their arms, and accept those statements, or else they had to reject the Spirit of Prophecy.” [Letter from Leroy Froom to Roy Allen Anderson. Jan 18 1966].
Christ (God) the Rock In Exodus and Numbers, God provides water from the rock for his people. In 1 Corinthians, Paul identifies the rock as Christ. 1 Corinthians 10-4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. Psalm 18-2 The LORD [is] my rock, and my fortress, and my deliverer; my God, my strength, in whom I will trust; my buckler, and the horn of my salvation, [and] my high tower. 1 Samuel 2-2 [There is] none holy as the LORD: for [there is] none beside thee: neither [is there] any rock like our God. Deuteronomy 32-3-4 KJV Because I will publish the name of the LORD: ascribe ye greatness unto our God. [4] He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he. It was Christ, by the power of His word, that caused the refreshing stream to flow for Israel. "They drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ." 1 Corinthians 10-4. He was the source of all temporal as well as spiritual blessings. Christ, the true Rock, was with them in all their wanderings. "They thirsted not when He led them through the deserts: He caused the waters to flow out of the rock for them; He clave the rock also, and the waters gushed out." "They ran in the dry places like a river." Isaiah 48-21; Psalm 105-41. {РР 411.2} "On Christ the solid rock I stand, all other ground is sinking sand. All other ground is sinking sand."
The Holy Spirit represents both Christ and the Father but is a different PERSON. When He represents Christ He is described as the Spirit of Christ. When representing the Father, He is called the Spirit of the Father. The Holy Spirit is the Comforter, in Christ’s name. He personifies Christ, yet is a distinct personality. Ms93.1893.8 Distinct means "not the same as" "another" Until you understand what it means by personify you will struggle with how the Holy Spirit can "become Christ to us" while a distinct Person. He takes on personality, thoughts and words of Christ on his behalf. He knows the mind of Christs and the Father's thoughts. 1 Corinthians 2-11 - even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Definition of Personify Personify- embody, epitomize, exemplify, manifest,typify, express, image, imitate, impersonate, materialize, mirror, substantiate.
*@Keating-ue6do:* - *Jesus is speaking of HIMSELF in a 'third person' which is a grammatical construct called a simile *So, John 16:7-8 is no proof at all of the Comforter as a 'third being'.* - *Jesus is just speaking of Himself and HIS Spirit that He is going to send.* - *And why does Jesus need to go to heaven first before He can send the Holy Spirit?* - *If the Holy Spirit is another 'God' of the Godhead,* - *then he could just come anytime himself.* - *But the CLEAR truth is, Jesus had to go to heaven first before sending the Spirit, because it is Christ's very own Spirit that He receives from the Father.* - *Therefore, the Spirit could not come until Jesus was in heaven with the Father.* *"They did not think that the subject of their conversation was walking by their side; FOR CHRIST REFERRED TO HIMSELF AS THOUGH HE WERE ANOTHER PERSON."* - Desire of Ages, p.800.1 *Now take a look at this,* - John 15:26 “But when *the Comforter* is come, whom *I will send* unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me.” ... *Note the word 'proceedeth' in the original Greek means to literally COME OUT of someone.* So, the *Spirit which Jesus was to send literally comes out of the Father. It is God's own Spirit* and *NOT another being.* *Strong's Concordance G3875 is found five times in scripture (KJV).* John 14:16, 14:26, 15:26, 16:7 and 1 John 2:1 - *Its usage is: an ADVOCATE, Intercessor, a consoler, COMFORTER, helper, Paraclete or Parakletos.* 1 John 2:1 reads "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, *we have an ADVOCATE with the Father, JESUS CHRIST THE RIGHTEOUS."* *On page 83 in the book ‘Seventh-day Adventists believe… Chapter 7‘, it does say that ‘ruach’ also denotes vitality, courage, temper and the seat of the emotions. *Now, let me draw your attention to an Old Testament text.* - *This confirms that "ruach" [spirit] refers to a person’s experience of conversion.* *It reads,* “A new heart also will I give you, and a new *spirit [ruach H7307]* will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. And I will put *my spirit [ruach H7307*] within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.” Ezekiel 36:26 -27 *Notice two things happening here.* - *1.)* - *God renews our spirit.* - *2.)* - *He puts His Spirit [the Holy Spirit] within us.* *These Scriptures describe what we usually call conversion,* - *or as we sometimes say,* - “being born again’.* - *It is a person becoming a “new creature”* - *or to put it differently,* - *God dwelling within us through His Holy Spirit* [see 2 Corinthians 5:17, Galatians 6:15, 1 Corinthians 3:16 and 1 Corinthians 6:19 etc]. *Note very importantly that “ruach” is used to refer to both the human spirit and God’s Spirit [the Holy Spirit].* *Very strange to relate though,* - *when applied to God’s Spirit [the Holy Spirit],* - Seventh-day Adventist theologians do not say that “ruach” is just the “divine energy, or life principle” [spark of life] that animates God, as described in the Fundamental Beliefs.*- *THEY SAY THAT IT IS ANOTHER PERSON like God the Father and Christ.* - *There is a serious inconsistency with their reasoning.* *At conversion, God does not renew our “spark” of life or “energising principle.” - *He renews the “inner man” [our inner person or personality].* *As the apostle Paul says,* - “But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in *newness of spirit,* and not in the oldness of the letter.” Romans 7:6 *As David put it,* - “Create in me a clean heart, O God; and *renew a right spirit [ruach H7307] within me.”* Psalms 51:10 *There are serious inconsistencies in the teaching of the Seventh-Day Adventist GC Fundamental Beliefs.* *We can see that even in the Old Testament, the spirit of man is most certainly not simply the spark [breath] of life or energising principle.* - *It is something so much more.* *Also, on page 83 the Seventh-day Adventists Believe… concludes,* - *“Ruach” is used frequently of the Spirit of God,* as in Isaiah 63:10. Never in the Old Testament, with respect to man, does ruach denote an intelligent entity capable *of sentient existence apart from a physical body.”* *The word “sentient” in the dictionary means having the faculty or faculties of sensation or perception,* - *therefore what is being said is that the word “ruach” [translated “Spirit” here] never “with respect to man” denotes an intelligent entity capable of perception or sensation apart from a physical body.* - *With the latter I would agree but why does it when it refers to God’s Spirit [the Holy Spirit]?* - *Again,* - *there are serious inconsistencies.* *The human spirit -- our personal identity* --- *The Scriptures tell us,* “And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, *receive my spirit.”* Acts 7:59 *As did Jesus [Jn **19:30**], Stephen was calling on God to receive his spirit. He was placing it into God’s care and safekeeping.* *The spirit is the personal identity of the person to whom it belongs.* - *In other words, it is who and what a person is [the mental disposition of the person],* - *meaning the character.* *Ellen White says of this spirit that returns to God,* - *“Our personal identity is preserved in the resurrection,* though not the same particles of matter or material substance as went into the grave. The wondrous works of God are a mystery to man. *The spirit, the character of man, is returned to God, there to be preserved. In the resurrection every man will have his own character.”* - 15LtMs, Ms 76, 1900, par. 10 *She then adds,* “God in His own time will call forth the dead, giving again the breath of life, and bidding the dry bones live. The same form will come forth, but it will be free from disease and every defect. It lives again *bearing the same individuality of features, so that friend will recognise friend. There is no law of God in nature* which shows that God gives back the same identical particles of matter which composed the body before death. *God shall give the righteous dead a body that will please Him.”* [Ibid] *Here we are told that the spirit of a human being [that which is returned to God at death] is the CHARACTER of a person.* - *It is his or her personal identity.* - *Ellen White does not say that it is simply the breath of life or the “spark of life”.* - *She wrote this in 1900, which was 2 years after the publication of “The Desire of Ages”.* - *Notice too that she says* --- *“The spirit [the character of a person] “is returned to God, there to be preserved.”* *It can only be reasoned that she is referring to Ecclesiastes 12:7.* - *This is the text of Scripture that says,* - “Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and *the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.”* Ecclesiastes 12:7 *In commenting on the words “the spirit” as in this verse, the Seventh-day Adventist Bible Commentary, Volume 3, page 1104* - *in keeping with the ‘Seventh-day Adventists Believe…’ it says, “That which here returns to God *is simply the life principle* imparted by God to both man and beast [see on Eccl. 3:19-21, where ruach is translated “breath”].” Concerning the Hebrew “ruach” translated as spirit, it also says on page 83 of the “Seventh-day Adventist Believe, "In the sense of breath, the ruach of men *is identical with the ruach of animals* (Eccl. 3:19). The ruach of man *leaves the body at death* (Ps. 146:4) and *returns to God* (Eccl. 12:7; cf. Job 34:14)” (Seventh-day Adventists Believe … a Biblical Exposition of 27 Fundamental Doctrines, page 83, chapter 7 ‘The Nature of Man’) *To substantiate this,* - *the words of Solomon are used where he says [speaking of what happens when a person dies].* “Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the *spirit [ruach] shall return unto God who gave it.”* Ecclesiastes 12:7 *Again, this appears to be contrary to what we have been told through the spirit of prophecy which is that the spirit that returns to God at death to be preserved is the character of a person.* *The spirit is the personal identity of the person to whom it belongs.* - *In other words, it is who and what a person is [the mental disposition of the person],* - *meaning the character.* *1.)* Why are the Hebrew and Greek root words for "Spirit" [rauch and pneuma) the same, where applied to God, Angel, Man, or beast (God - Genesis 1:2; Angel - Hebrews 1:7; Man - 1 Corinthians 2:11; Beast-Ecclesiastes 3:21] *2.)* Why is "Spirit" not considered a separate entity when applied to angel, demon, or man and yet considered to be so when applied to God? [Hebrews 1:7, 14, Mark 5:12, 13, 1 Corinthians 2:11] *3.)* Why are "Spirit" and "breath" synonymous, coming from the same root word in the Hebrew tongue? [Genesis 1:2, Psalms 33:6, Job 27:3] If you look up the Hebrew word, “spirit” in the Strong’s Concordance, he/it is described as the *wind, breath, mind, spirit [Strong’s H7307 Ruwach]. “Spirit” is the divine breath of God, His spoken word, and the creative, life-giving power.* *Strong’s Concordance tells us* the Hebrew and the *Greek word translated as “spirit”* in the Bible have the same meaning. *The Hebrew word רוּח† ‘ruach’ or rûwach [H7307] means “breath” or “wind”, “seat or organ of mental acts”, which is the same word translated as spirit in Genesis 1:2. The Greek word ‘pneuma’ means, wind, breath, spirit.* In other words, if wind and breath are the same idea, then spirit must also fit the pattern.
*@Keating-ue6do:* *The Holy Spirit IS Christ [is "Christ's Spirit" His RISEN victorious life]:* *From Scripture ALONE we can proof that the "Spirit" is Christ's Spirit.* - *In Proverbs 8 we see that it is "Wisdom" that was "brought forth."* - *We know that this refers to Christ and can refer to no one else.* - *So "Wisdom" is Christ.* - *Then we find references to the "Spirit of Wisdom"* [see Isa. 11:2; Acts 6:3 and Eph. 1:17]. - *If "Wisdom" is Christ, then the "Spirit of Wisdom" must be the "Spirit of Christ."* - *This same truth is expressed in the Holy Spirit's title of the "Spirit of Truth."* - *Christ said:* - *"I am…the Truth."* - *If the Christ is the Truth, then the "Spirit of Truth" must be the "Spirit of Christ."* *In John 14:16-17, Jesus referred to the other "Helper" as "the Spirit of Truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but [Christ told his disciples] you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you"* [John 14:17]. - *If you believe the Spirit of Prophecy, there can be no doubt that this "other Helper"* - *the "Spirit of Truth"* - *is, in fact, Jesus Christ [Christ's Holy Spirit].* *Jesus not only described the Holy Spirit as the "Spirit of Truth,"* - *but also as the "Comforter" ["Helper" and "Comforter" are used synonymously and come from the same Greek word]:* - *"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you"* [Jn. 14:26 KJV. See also: Jn. 15:26 & 16:7] . - *Jesus is our comforter:* - *"I, even I, am He who comforts you"* [Isa. 51:12]. - *The Spirit of Prophecy leaves us no doubt as to the identity of the "Comforter."* *Jesus said that He would not leave us* - *"comfortless"* - *and said:* - *"I will come to you"* [John 14:18]. - *Jesus also said* - *"where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst"* [Mat. 18:20]. - *He assured us;* - *"lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the world"* [Mat. 28:20 KJV]. - *How is Jesus to "come" to us?* - *How is He "in our midst"?* - *How can He be with us "to the end of the world"?* - *He tells us how in John 14:16 where He says that the8 - *"comforter/helper"* - *would "abide with you forever."* - *Jesus, in His humanity cannot be in all places at all times - He cannot* - *"abide"* - *with everyone, everywhere, "forever."* *SOP:* *"Cumbered with humanity Christ could not be in every place personally, therefore it was altogether for their advantage that He should leave them to go to His Father and send the Holy Spirit to be His successor on earth"* [MS 1084 [14MR p. 23.3]). - *"The Son of God, now at the Father's right hand, still pleads as man's intercessor. He still retains His human nature, is still the Saviour of mankind"* [ST. July 15, 1908; par. 7]. - *In the person of His "Holy Spirit" form, Christ could be in all places at all times and "abide with us forever."* - *"While Jesus, our Intercessor, pleads for us in heaven, the Holy Spirit works in us, to will and do of His good pleasure"* [MS 99 [2MR p. 37.1]. - *"Christ declared that after his ascension, he would send to his church, as his crowning gift, the Comforter, who was to take his place. This Comforter is the Holy Spirit,--the soul of his life, the efficacy of his church, the light and life of the world. With his Spirit Christ sends a reconciling influence and a power that takes away sin.* [Par.1] - *In the gift of the Spirit, Jesus gave to man the highest good that heaven could bestow…* [par.2]" - *RH May 19, 1904; par. 1,2.* *The inspired Apostles understood and taught that the Holy Spirit is Christ's Spirit:* - *"Now the Lord is THAT Spirit,* and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty"* [2 Cor. 3:17 ] - And that, *"if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him."* [Rom. 8:9]. - *They taught that it is only through our acceptance of Christ [expressed in our baptism] that His Spirit is given to us:* - *"Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit"* [Acts 2:38]. *The Bible states that Christ is* - *"He who comforts you."* [Isa. 51:12]. - *And Ellen White has clearly demonstrated that the "Comforter" -- the Spirit of Truth -- the Holy Spirit, is none other than Christ: *"Christ was the spirit of truth"* [Southern Watchman; October 25, 1898; par. 2 m.egwwritings.org/en/book/492.20?ss]. - *"He is the Comforter"* [RH Jan 27, 1903, par. 13]. - *“Jesus the Comforter.”* [19MR 297.3, 1892] - *She even tells us that the Holy Spirit is *"the soul of His life"* [RH: May 19, 1904; par. 1 m.egwwritings.org/en/book/821.24246#24246] which has been given to us that we may become a *"partaker of the [His] divine nature"* [Ibid, par. 3]. - *This really ought to be argument enough to establish this fact - but apparently it isn't, for we continue to deny this Truth. So, let's dig a little deeper.* *While Jesus ministers in the sanctuary above, He is still by His Spirit the minister of the church on earth. He is withdrawn from the eye of sense, but His parting promise is fulfilled, "Lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world." Matt. **28:20**. While He delegates His power to inferior ministers, His energizing presence is still with His church.* DA 166.2. *This is why Jesus could promise:* *i)* I will come to you. *ii)* I will never leave you nor forsake you. *iii)* I am with you always even unto the end of the world. *iv)* Where two or three are gathered in my name there am I in the midst of them. *v)* “The impartation of the Spirit is the impartation of the life of Christ.” DA 80 *vi)* “Christ gives them the breath of His own Spirit, the life of His own life.” MH 159 *If you disbelieve the SOP, how do you answer John 20:22?* John 20:22 *“And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:”* *The Word of God here gives us a practical illustration of the impartation of the Spirit; which is the life of Christ, it is His very own breath.* - *He didn’t breathe a person on them.* *It is a part of Him, Jesus,* - *not someone else being breath on them.* *The Comforter according to Scripture?* Isaiah 49: 13 *Jehovah hath comforted his people,* and will have mercy upon his afflicted. Isaiah 51: 3 For *Jehovah shall comfort Zion:... v12 I, even I, am he that comforteth you...* Isaiah 52: 9 *for Jehovah hath comforted* his people...* Isaiah 66: 13 *I [Jehovah] comfort you; and ye shall be comforted in Jerusalem.* Zechariah 1:17 *Jehovah shall yet comfort Zion...* John 14:18 Jesus says, *“I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.* 2 Corinthians 1: 3 Blessed be God, even *the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies, and the God of all comfort; 4 Who comforteth us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort them which are in any trouble, by the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God.* Romans 15:15 “Now *the God of patience and of comfort* grant you to be of the same mind one with another according to Christ Jesus” ASV 2 Corinthians 1:4 *“Who comforteth us in all our affliction, that we may be able to comfort them that are in any affliction, *through the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God.”* 2 Corinthians 7: 6 Nevertheless *God, that comforteth those that are cast down, comforted* us by the coming of Titus; 7 And not by his coming only, but by the consolation wherewith he was comforted in you, when he told us your earnest desire, your mourning, your fervent mind toward me; so that I rejoiced the more. *If the Holy Spirit is a being like the Father and Son then the spirit will cease to be a spirit.* - *The Holy Spirit is the very presence of God and of Jesus comforting us in our affliction* - *[if you like, the intangible presence/aspect or the omnipresence of God and His Son Jesus].* Zechariah 2:10 ‘Sing and rejoice, … *I come, and I will dwell in the midst of thee, saith the Lord.’* *Jesus promised,* - *“… lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”* Matthew 28:20
@@seekertruth3577 The Holy Spirit is the Comforter, in Christ’s name. He personifies Christ, yet is a distinct personality. Ms93.1893.8 Until you understand what it means by personify you will struggle with how the Holy Spirit can "become Christ to us" while a distinct Person. He takes on personality, thoughts and words of Christ on his behalf. He knows the mind of Christs and the Father's thoughts. 1 Corinthians 2:11 - even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Definition of Personify Personify- embody, epitomize, exemplify, manifest,typify, express, image, imitate, impersonate, materialize, mirror, substantiate.
SDA vs Catholic vs Anti-trinitarian CATHOLIC TRINITY The Trinity of the Catholic Church is derived from Greek philosophy and teaches that it is the Father who eternally generates the Son. The Son is seen as having been derived/begotten by the Father while the Holy Spirit proceeds from both. This implies that the generation of the Son depends on the Father theologically and that the Father is the only one without origin. The Catholic Church affirms the eternal subordination of the Son. ANTI-TRINITARIANS Anti-Trinitarians have substantial similarities to the Roman Catholic Church’s concept of the trinity. They seem to have inherited the Roman Catholic Church’s understanding of God with the Son in subordination to the Father having been begotten in a birthing event deriving his existence from the Father. This similarity is also seen in the procession of the Holy Spirit from both the Father and Son. SDA GODHEAD The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are one Godhead or one God with three co-eternal, co-equal divine Persons each God, in perfect unity though distinct from one another, None is the origin of the others. The anti-trinitarians in reality are expounding Roman Catholic trinity doctrine. They are under a strong delusion and it is possible that Rome herself is at the head of their movement and has them deceived.
You said “ The anti-trinitarians in reality are expounding Roman Catholic trinity doctrine. They are under a strong delusion and it is possible that Rome herself is at the head of their movement and has them deceived.” Is that why the non trinitarians are a part of the catholic run world council of churches and the SDA trinitairans are not a part of that?
I am afraid you don’t know who believes what. The following is a statement from the SDA handbook of theology. So this is as official as it gets. “In the being of God is an essential coprimordiality of three coequal, coeternal, nonoriginated persons. Moreover, Adventism conceives the idea of persons in its biblical sense, as referring to three individual centers of intelligence and action” pg 150 Notice it says THE Being of God has three intelligences. You are the one who actually believes identical to the catholic doctrine
@@andrewwhitehurst5001 Of course you capitalise the word being to change its meaning. something that is conceivable and hence capable of existing (2) : something that actually exists (3) : the totality of existing things. (4) the state of existing “There are three living Persons of the heavenly trio; in the name of these three great powers-The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit-Those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will co-operate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ.”-Special Testimonies, Series B, No. 7, 63. (Evangelism, 615. Synonyms for TRIO: trinity, threesome, . group of three, trilogy You are born unto God, and you stand under the sanction and the power of the three holiest beings in heaven, who are able to keep you from falling. 7MR 267.2
Amen 🙏🏽
A very good study! It’s pitiful that the church has gone against the Bible and SOP!
It is simply not possible that the doctrine of the trinity can be found without human instruction.
It is a doctrine of men, and no one who studies the Scriptures with the Holy Spirit will ever find the doctrine inside Holy Writ, without being told what to believe by a man.
Good point!
Indeed. *The trinity is intellectual philosophical speculation.* - *"Toward the end of the 1st century, and during the 2nd, many learned men came over both from Judaism and paganism to Christianity. These brought with them into the Christian schools of theology their Platonic ideas and phraseology"* (article "Trinity," Vol. 10, p. 553).
Truth, yes, truth.
DIVESTED!!! Amen!
Amen
Amen ❤
Do you have a translator who could translate this topic into Russian? A very interesting and important topic. I really want to listen to it in a human translation, and not in an artificial intelligence translation.
I wish we did but unfortunately at this point I don’t know if anyone who can do that. I am very sorry
What about copying the transcript and using something like google-translator into your language?
Heavenly TRIO 3 Persons Beings
“There are three living Persons of the heavenly trio; in the name of these three great powers-The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit-Those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will co-operate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ.”-Special Testimonies, Series B, No. 7, 63. (Evangelism, 615.
Synonyms for TRIO: trinity, threesome, . group of three, trilogy
You are born unto God, and you stand under the sanction and the power of the three holiest beings in heaven, who are able to keep you from falling. 7MR 267.2
In 1966 Leroy Froom wrote a letter to R.A. Anderson bragging how they both had a part in compiling the E.G. White quotations in “Evangelism” in order to combat the Columbian Union Conference leaders who were still non-trinitarian at the time (1946). Dr Froom stated, “You know what it did with men in the Columbia Union… They either had to lay down their arms, and accept those statements, or else they had to reject the Spirit of Prophecy.” [Letter from Leroy Froom to Roy Allen Anderson. Jan 18 1966].
Christ (God) the Rock
In Exodus and Numbers, God provides water from the rock for his people. In 1 Corinthians, Paul identifies the rock as Christ.
1 Corinthians 10-4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
Psalm 18-2 The LORD [is] my rock, and my fortress, and my deliverer; my God, my strength, in whom I will trust; my buckler, and the horn of my salvation, [and] my high tower.
1 Samuel 2-2 [There is] none holy as the LORD: for [there is] none beside thee: neither [is there] any rock like our God.
Deuteronomy 32-3-4 KJV
Because I will publish the name of the LORD: ascribe ye greatness unto our God. [4] He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.
It was Christ, by the power of His word, that caused the refreshing stream to flow for Israel. "They drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ." 1
Corinthians 10-4. He was the source of all temporal as well as spiritual blessings. Christ, the true Rock, was with them in all their wanderings. "They thirsted not when He led them through the deserts: He caused the waters to flow out of the rock for them; He clave the rock also, and the waters gushed out." "They ran in the dry places like a river." Isaiah 48-21; Psalm 105-41. {РР 411.2}
"On Christ the solid rock I stand, all other ground is sinking sand. All other ground is sinking sand."
The Holy Spirit represents both Christ and the Father but is a different PERSON. When He represents Christ He is described as the Spirit of Christ. When representing the Father, He is called the Spirit of the Father.
The Holy Spirit is the Comforter, in Christ’s name. He personifies Christ, yet is a distinct personality. Ms93.1893.8
Distinct means "not the same as" "another"
Until you understand what it means by personify you will struggle with how the Holy Spirit can "become Christ to us" while a distinct Person. He takes on personality, thoughts and words of Christ on his behalf. He knows the mind of Christs and the Father's thoughts. 1 Corinthians 2-11 - even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
Definition of Personify
Personify- embody, epitomize, exemplify, manifest,typify, express, image, imitate, impersonate, materialize, mirror, substantiate.
Your right in a sense that Christ comes in a distinct person UNSEEN
“Impersonate” is the best word you used
*@Keating-ue6do:* - *Jesus is speaking of HIMSELF in a 'third person' which is a grammatical construct called a simile *So, John 16:7-8 is no proof at all of the Comforter as a 'third being'.* - *Jesus is just speaking of Himself and HIS Spirit that He is going to send.* - *And why does Jesus need to go to heaven first before He can send the Holy Spirit?* - *If the Holy Spirit is another 'God' of the Godhead,* - *then he could just come anytime himself.* - *But the CLEAR truth is, Jesus had to go to heaven first before sending the Spirit, because it is Christ's very own Spirit that He receives from the Father.* - *Therefore, the Spirit could not come until Jesus was in heaven with the Father.*
*"They did not think that the subject of their conversation was walking by their side; FOR CHRIST REFERRED TO HIMSELF AS THOUGH HE WERE ANOTHER PERSON."* - Desire of Ages, p.800.1
*Now take a look at this,* - John 15:26 “But when *the Comforter* is come, whom *I will send* unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me.” ... *Note the word 'proceedeth' in the original Greek means to literally COME OUT of someone.* So, the *Spirit which Jesus was to send literally comes out of the Father. It is God's own Spirit* and *NOT another being.*
*Strong's Concordance G3875 is found five times in scripture (KJV).* John 14:16, 14:26, 15:26, 16:7 and 1 John 2:1 - *Its usage is: an ADVOCATE, Intercessor, a consoler, COMFORTER, helper, Paraclete or Parakletos.* 1 John 2:1 reads "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, *we have an ADVOCATE with the Father, JESUS CHRIST THE RIGHTEOUS."*
*On page 83 in the book ‘Seventh-day Adventists believe… Chapter 7‘, it does say that ‘ruach’ also denotes vitality, courage, temper and the seat of the emotions.
*Now, let me draw your attention to an Old Testament text.* - *This confirms that "ruach" [spirit] refers to a person’s experience of conversion.*
*It reads,* “A new heart also will I give you, and a new *spirit [ruach H7307]* will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. And I will put *my spirit [ruach H7307*] within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.” Ezekiel 36:26 -27
*Notice two things happening here.* - *1.)* - *God renews our spirit.* - *2.)* - *He puts His Spirit [the Holy Spirit] within us.*
*These Scriptures describe what we usually call conversion,* - *or as we sometimes say,* - “being born again’.* - *It is a person becoming a “new creature”* - *or to put it differently,* - *God dwelling within us through His Holy Spirit* [see 2 Corinthians 5:17, Galatians 6:15, 1 Corinthians 3:16 and 1 Corinthians 6:19 etc]. *Note very importantly that “ruach” is used to refer to both the human spirit and God’s Spirit [the Holy Spirit].*
*Very strange to relate though,* - *when applied to God’s Spirit [the Holy Spirit],* - Seventh-day Adventist theologians do not say that “ruach” is just the “divine energy, or life principle” [spark of life] that animates God, as described in the Fundamental Beliefs.*- *THEY SAY THAT IT IS ANOTHER PERSON like God the Father and Christ.* - *There is a serious inconsistency with their reasoning.*
*At conversion, God does not renew our “spark” of life or “energising principle.” - *He renews the “inner man” [our inner person or personality].*
*As the apostle Paul says,* - “But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in *newness of spirit,* and not in the oldness of the letter.” Romans 7:6
*As David put it,* - “Create in me a clean heart, O God; and *renew a right spirit [ruach H7307] within me.”* Psalms 51:10
*There are serious inconsistencies in the teaching of the Seventh-Day Adventist GC Fundamental Beliefs.*
*We can see that even in the Old Testament, the spirit of man is most certainly not simply the spark [breath] of life or energising principle.* - *It is something so much more.*
*Also, on page 83 the Seventh-day Adventists Believe… concludes,* - *“Ruach” is used frequently of the Spirit of God,* as in Isaiah 63:10. Never in the Old Testament, with respect to man, does ruach denote an intelligent entity capable *of sentient existence apart from a physical body.”*
*The word “sentient” in the dictionary means having the faculty or faculties of sensation or perception,* - *therefore what is being said is that the word “ruach” [translated “Spirit” here] never “with respect to man” denotes an intelligent entity capable of perception or sensation apart from a physical body.* - *With the latter I would agree but why does it when it refers to God’s Spirit [the Holy Spirit]?* - *Again,* - *there are serious inconsistencies.*
*The human spirit -- our personal identity* --- *The Scriptures tell us,* “And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, *receive my spirit.”* Acts 7:59
*As did Jesus [Jn **19:30**], Stephen was calling on God to receive his spirit. He was placing it into God’s care and safekeeping.*
*The spirit is the personal identity of the person to whom it belongs.* - *In other words, it is who and what a person is [the mental disposition of the person],* - *meaning the character.*
*Ellen White says of this spirit that returns to God,* - *“Our personal identity is preserved in the resurrection,* though not the same particles of matter or material substance as went into the grave. The wondrous works of God are a mystery to man. *The spirit, the character of man, is returned to God, there to be preserved. In the resurrection every man will have his own character.”* - 15LtMs, Ms 76, 1900, par. 10
*She then adds,* “God in His own time will call forth the dead, giving again the breath of life, and bidding the dry bones live. The same form will come forth, but it will be free from disease and every defect. It lives again *bearing the same individuality of features, so that friend will recognise friend. There is no law of God in nature* which shows that God gives back the same identical particles of matter which composed the body before death. *God shall give the righteous dead a body that will please Him.”* [Ibid]
*Here we are told that the spirit of a human being [that which is returned to God at death] is the CHARACTER of a person.* - *It is his or her personal identity.* - *Ellen White does not say that it is simply the breath of life or the “spark of life”.* - *She wrote this in 1900, which was 2 years after the publication of “The Desire of Ages”.* - *Notice too that she says* --- *“The spirit [the character of a person] “is returned to God, there to be preserved.”*
*It can only be reasoned that she is referring to Ecclesiastes 12:7.* - *This is the text of Scripture that says,* - “Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and *the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.”* Ecclesiastes 12:7
*In commenting on the words “the spirit” as in this verse, the Seventh-day Adventist Bible Commentary, Volume 3, page 1104* - *in keeping with the ‘Seventh-day Adventists Believe…’ it says, “That which here returns to God *is simply the life principle* imparted by God to both man and beast [see on Eccl. 3:19-21, where ruach is translated “breath”].”
Concerning the Hebrew “ruach” translated as spirit, it also says on page 83 of the “Seventh-day Adventist Believe, "In the sense of breath, the ruach of men *is identical with the ruach of animals* (Eccl. 3:19). The ruach of man *leaves the body at death* (Ps. 146:4) and *returns to God* (Eccl. 12:7; cf. Job 34:14)” (Seventh-day Adventists Believe … a Biblical Exposition of 27 Fundamental Doctrines, page 83, chapter 7 ‘The Nature of Man’)
*To substantiate this,* - *the words of Solomon are used where he says [speaking of what happens when a person dies].*
“Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the *spirit [ruach] shall return unto God who gave it.”* Ecclesiastes 12:7
*Again, this appears to be contrary to what we have been told through the spirit of prophecy which is that the spirit that returns to God at death to be preserved is the character of a person.*
*The spirit is the personal identity of the person to whom it belongs.* - *In other words, it is who and what a person is [the mental disposition of the person],* - *meaning the character.*
*1.)* Why are the Hebrew and Greek root words for "Spirit" [rauch and pneuma) the same, where applied to God, Angel, Man, or beast (God - Genesis 1:2; Angel - Hebrews 1:7; Man - 1 Corinthians 2:11; Beast-Ecclesiastes 3:21]
*2.)* Why is "Spirit" not considered a separate entity when applied to angel, demon, or man and yet considered to be so when applied to God? [Hebrews 1:7, 14, Mark 5:12, 13, 1 Corinthians 2:11]
*3.)* Why are "Spirit" and "breath" synonymous, coming from the same root word in the Hebrew tongue? [Genesis 1:2, Psalms 33:6, Job 27:3]
If you look up the Hebrew word, “spirit” in the Strong’s Concordance, he/it is described as the *wind, breath, mind, spirit [Strong’s H7307 Ruwach]. “Spirit” is the divine breath of God, His spoken word, and the creative, life-giving power.*
*Strong’s Concordance tells us* the Hebrew and the *Greek word translated as “spirit”* in the Bible have the same meaning. *The Hebrew word רוּח† ‘ruach’ or rûwach [H7307] means “breath” or “wind”, “seat or organ of mental acts”, which is the same word translated as spirit in Genesis 1:2. The Greek word ‘pneuma’ means, wind, breath, spirit.* In other words, if wind and breath are the same idea, then spirit must also fit the pattern.
*@Keating-ue6do:* *The Holy Spirit IS Christ [is "Christ's Spirit" His RISEN victorious life]:*
*From Scripture ALONE we can proof that the "Spirit" is Christ's Spirit.* - *In Proverbs 8 we see that it is "Wisdom" that was "brought forth."* - *We know that this refers to Christ and can refer to no one else.* - *So "Wisdom" is Christ.* - *Then we find references to the "Spirit of Wisdom"* [see Isa. 11:2; Acts 6:3 and Eph. 1:17]. - *If "Wisdom" is Christ, then the "Spirit of Wisdom" must be the "Spirit of Christ."* - *This same truth is expressed in the Holy Spirit's title of the "Spirit of Truth."* - *Christ said:* - *"I am…the Truth."* - *If the Christ is the Truth, then the "Spirit of Truth" must be the "Spirit of Christ."*
*In John 14:16-17, Jesus referred to the other "Helper" as "the Spirit of Truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but [Christ told his disciples] you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you"* [John 14:17]. - *If you believe the Spirit of Prophecy, there can be no doubt that this "other Helper"* - *the "Spirit of Truth"* - *is, in fact, Jesus Christ [Christ's Holy Spirit].*
*Jesus not only described the Holy Spirit as the "Spirit of Truth,"* - *but also as the "Comforter" ["Helper" and "Comforter" are used synonymously and come from the same Greek word]:* - *"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you"* [Jn. 14:26 KJV. See also: Jn. 15:26 & 16:7] . - *Jesus is our comforter:* - *"I, even I, am He who comforts you"* [Isa. 51:12]. - *The Spirit of Prophecy leaves us no doubt as to the identity of the "Comforter."*
*Jesus said that He would not leave us* - *"comfortless"* - *and said:* - *"I will come to you"* [John 14:18]. - *Jesus also said* - *"where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst"* [Mat. 18:20]. - *He assured us;* - *"lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the world"* [Mat. 28:20 KJV]. - *How is Jesus to "come" to us?* - *How is He "in our midst"?* - *How can He be with us "to the end of the world"?* - *He tells us how in John 14:16 where He says that the8 - *"comforter/helper"* - *would "abide with you forever."* - *Jesus, in His humanity cannot be in all places at all times - He cannot* - *"abide"* - *with everyone, everywhere, "forever."*
*SOP:* *"Cumbered with humanity Christ could not be in every place personally, therefore it was altogether for their advantage that He should leave them to go to His Father and send the Holy Spirit to be His successor on earth"* [MS 1084 [14MR p. 23.3]). - *"The Son of God, now at the Father's right hand, still pleads as man's intercessor. He still retains His human nature, is still the Saviour of mankind"* [ST. July 15, 1908; par. 7]. - *In the person of His "Holy Spirit" form, Christ could be in all places at all times and "abide with us forever."* - *"While Jesus, our Intercessor, pleads for us in heaven, the Holy Spirit works in us, to will and do of His good pleasure"* [MS 99 [2MR p. 37.1]. - *"Christ declared that after his ascension, he would send to his church, as his crowning gift, the Comforter, who was to take his place. This Comforter is the Holy Spirit,--the soul of his life, the efficacy of his church, the light and life of the world. With his Spirit Christ sends a reconciling influence and a power that takes away sin.* [Par.1] - *In the gift of the Spirit, Jesus gave to man the highest good that heaven could bestow…* [par.2]" - *RH May 19, 1904; par. 1,2.*
*The inspired Apostles understood and taught that the Holy Spirit is Christ's Spirit:* - *"Now the Lord is THAT Spirit,* and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty"* [2 Cor. 3:17 ] - And that, *"if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him."* [Rom. 8:9]. - *They taught that it is only through our acceptance of Christ [expressed in our baptism] that His Spirit is given to us:* - *"Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit"* [Acts 2:38].
*The Bible states that Christ is* - *"He who comforts you."* [Isa. 51:12]. - *And Ellen White has clearly demonstrated that the "Comforter" -- the Spirit of Truth -- the Holy Spirit, is none other than Christ: *"Christ was the spirit of truth"* [Southern Watchman; October 25, 1898; par. 2 m.egwwritings.org/en/book/492.20?ss]. - *"He is the Comforter"* [RH Jan 27, 1903, par. 13]. - *“Jesus the Comforter.”* [19MR 297.3, 1892] - *She even tells us that the Holy Spirit is *"the soul of His life"* [RH: May 19, 1904; par. 1
m.egwwritings.org/en/book/821.24246#24246] which has been given to us that we may become a *"partaker of the [His] divine nature"* [Ibid, par. 3]. - *This really ought to be argument enough to establish this fact - but apparently it isn't, for we continue to deny this Truth. So, let's dig a little deeper.*
*While Jesus ministers in the sanctuary above, He is still by His Spirit the minister of the church on earth. He is withdrawn from the eye of sense, but His parting promise is fulfilled, "Lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world." Matt. **28:20**. While He delegates His power to inferior ministers, His energizing presence is still with His church.* DA 166.2.
*This is why Jesus could promise:*
*i)* I will come to you.
*ii)* I will never leave you nor forsake you.
*iii)* I am with you always even unto the end of the world.
*iv)* Where two or three are gathered in my name there am I in the midst of them.
*v)* “The impartation of the Spirit is the impartation of the life of Christ.” DA 80
*vi)* “Christ gives them the breath of His own Spirit, the life of His own life.” MH 159
*If you disbelieve the SOP, how do you answer John 20:22?*
John 20:22 *“And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:”*
*The Word of God here gives us a practical illustration of the impartation of the Spirit; which is the life of Christ, it is His very own breath.* - *He didn’t breathe a person on them.*
*It is a part of Him, Jesus,* - *not someone else being breath on them.*
*The Comforter according to Scripture?*
Isaiah 49: 13 *Jehovah hath comforted his people,* and will have mercy upon his afflicted.
Isaiah 51: 3 For *Jehovah shall comfort Zion:... v12 I, even I, am he that comforteth you...*
Isaiah 52: 9 *for Jehovah hath comforted* his people...*
Isaiah 66: 13 *I [Jehovah] comfort you; and ye shall be comforted in Jerusalem.*
Zechariah 1:17 *Jehovah shall yet comfort Zion...*
John 14:18 Jesus says, *“I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.*
2 Corinthians 1: 3 Blessed be God, even *the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies, and the God of all comfort; 4 Who comforteth us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort them which are in any trouble, by the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God.*
Romans 15:15 “Now *the God of patience and of comfort* grant you to be of the same mind one with another according to Christ Jesus” ASV
2 Corinthians 1:4 *“Who comforteth us in all our affliction, that we may be able to comfort them that are in any affliction, *through the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God.”*
2 Corinthians 7: 6 Nevertheless *God, that comforteth those that are cast down, comforted* us by the coming of Titus; 7 And not by his coming only, but by the consolation wherewith he was comforted in you, when he told us your earnest desire, your mourning, your fervent mind toward me; so that I rejoiced the more.
*If the Holy Spirit is a being like the Father and Son then the spirit will cease to be a spirit.* - *The Holy Spirit is the very presence of God and of Jesus comforting us in our affliction* - *[if you like, the intangible presence/aspect or the omnipresence of God and His Son Jesus].*
Zechariah 2:10 ‘Sing and rejoice, … *I come, and I will dwell in the midst of thee, saith the Lord.’*
*Jesus promised,* - *“… lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”* Matthew 28:20
@@seekertruth3577 The Holy Spirit is the Comforter, in Christ’s name. He personifies Christ, yet is a distinct personality. Ms93.1893.8
Until you understand what it means by personify you will struggle with how the Holy Spirit can "become Christ to us" while a distinct Person. He takes on personality, thoughts and words of Christ on his behalf. He knows the mind of Christs and the Father's thoughts. 1 Corinthians 2:11 - even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
Definition of Personify
Personify- embody, epitomize, exemplify, manifest,typify, express, image, imitate, impersonate, materialize, mirror, substantiate.
SDA vs Catholic vs Anti-trinitarian
CATHOLIC TRINITY
The Trinity of the Catholic Church is derived from Greek philosophy and teaches that it is the Father who eternally generates the Son. The Son is seen as having been derived/begotten by the Father while the Holy Spirit proceeds from both. This implies that the generation of the Son depends on the Father theologically and that the Father is the only one without origin. The Catholic Church affirms the eternal subordination of the Son.
ANTI-TRINITARIANS
Anti-Trinitarians have substantial similarities to the Roman Catholic Church’s concept of the trinity. They seem to have inherited the Roman Catholic Church’s understanding of God
with the Son in subordination to the Father having been begotten in a birthing event deriving his existence from the Father. This similarity is also seen in the procession of the Holy Spirit from both the Father and Son.
SDA GODHEAD
The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are one Godhead or one God with three co-eternal, co-equal divine Persons each God, in perfect unity though distinct from one another, None is the origin of the others.
The anti-trinitarians in reality are expounding Roman Catholic trinity doctrine. They are under a strong delusion and it is possible that Rome herself is at the head of their movement and has them deceived.
You said “ The anti-trinitarians in reality are expounding Roman Catholic trinity doctrine. They are under a strong delusion and it is possible that Rome herself is at the head of their movement and has them deceived.”
Is that why the non trinitarians are a part of the catholic run world council of churches and the SDA trinitairans are not a part of that?
I am afraid you don’t know who believes what. The following is a statement from the SDA handbook of theology. So this is as official as it gets.
“In the being of God is an essential coprimordiality of three coequal, coeternal, nonoriginated persons. Moreover, Adventism conceives the idea of persons in its biblical sense, as referring to three individual centers of intelligence and action” pg 150
Notice it says THE Being of God has three intelligences. You are the one who actually believes identical to the catholic doctrine
@@andrewwhitehurst5001 Of course you capitalise the word being to change its meaning.
something that is conceivable and hence capable of existing
(2)
: something that actually exists
(3)
: the totality of existing things.
(4) the state of existing
“There are three living Persons of the heavenly trio; in the name of these three great powers-The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit-Those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will co-operate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ.”-Special Testimonies, Series B, No. 7, 63. (Evangelism, 615.
Synonyms for TRIO: trinity, threesome, . group of three, trilogy
You are born unto God, and you stand under the sanction and the power of the three holiest beings in heaven, who are able to keep you from falling. 7MR 267.2