A interesting idea I pondered was (which you also touched on the video): what if Inquisitor's armor would have a fortified version? With the area of Morytania in mind, making it so you sacrifice Justiciar Armor to make Saradomin Plates to fortify the armor, making it so that both Inquisitor and Justificiar would maintain a good price. As for the armor set effect, you could double the accuracy of the armor (I have not ran the numbers for this), give it a higher prayer bonus and a very slight increase in defense bonus. This would make it so Inquisitor (F) would be the best for accuracy while Torva would remain the best option for Max gear. This would also make sense in lore btw. So... win win?
I can't argue that bots don't farm nightmare. When I have done it in the past, I pretty much always see at least one to report (and I do!) - You're right. Though, I don't really think it's possible to ban all bots. Plus, I imagine the price may drop further the more the rates are improved; hence my making this video. I guess we'll see when project rebalance is eventually dropped!
Had to login to my account to leave you a comment here-- I think you really nailed the suggestions for inquisitor armour. People might expect that someone whose account was literally built for this set would have a purely self-serving opinion, but IMO your suggestions would really benefit everyone and leave the armour set in a great spot. I especially like giving inquisitor the upgrade treatment similar to bandos -> torva or armadyl -> masori. TBH though, given it's rarity, I wouldn't even mind buffing it a bit further than you were suggesting. Torva is in a spot where it sort of eclipses all other armour sets due to having both super high strength and defence bonuses. I think there's probably room for a torva-tier sidegrade (being the upgraded inquisitor set) that is the glass cannon set Jagex aimed to achieve with this armour: incredibly high crush bonuses that push its DPS passed torva for some crush use cases, but dangerously low def bonuses that punish bad gameplay. Great video and suggestions!
im glad im not the only one to point this out. my proposal has been maintaining the 2.5% damage and increase accuracy slightly ( but not too much) maybe 4% idk. as for the mace? only increase its melee strength a bit but not its accuracy. that accuracy for the mace will only be obtained while wearing inquisitor so it goes hand and hand along with TECHNICALLY the crush style weaponry. youve also pointed out the negative stat bonuses so we leveled there. youve read my mind 7:15. this is all i have to say and jagex needs to watch your video and read my comment. inquisitor cannot fall behind!!!!!
I think being able to fortify through use of justiciar makes the most sense. This upgrade removes both the set passive of justiciar and the negative stab and slash bonus of inq. This upgraded set should have better defense than barrows armor and the helmet should increase to maybe +7 str creating a niche between torva. Defense requirements should be 80 for the upgraded set.
I've come to really love the 30 defence niche, and I suspect that someone at Jagex does as well considering that the (semi-) recently added Masori armour has that requirement. I really hope no changes come to the defence requirement of Inquisitor. I have seen a suggestion that it could be combined with justiciar which, while odd from a lore perspective, would revive both sets in a nice way.
Me too, haha; I find the niche interesting. Like I said in the video, these are just suggestions and the ways I see the armour being 'improved' in some way, shape, or form. At the end of the day, most likely none of my suggestions will be implemented and this video will go down as a simple thought experiment :P Definitely see your point on Inquis/Justi combination.
Glass cannon armour can work, it just needs to have clear benefits. Your point about inq at cox kinda shows this. Yes, people may have swapped to arma in places, but they still brought inq over bandos because they wanted the dps. Currently, torva is just better dps overall in most places where inq was used. At the places where inq is better dps, it's typically not by enough to justify using it over torva. Giving inq the dps to beat out torva when using crush would give people a reason to use it. They could let it give more consistent specs when using crush. DWH, new elder maul, and even bgs would all benefit from that, and defence reduction is massive for scythe. Giving inq as a set some kind of spec accuracy or interaction would make it a lot more desirable.
@@Lyfe You highlighted the key issues pretty well. Inq is such a cool armour set with pretty interesting lore. I really hope they make it relevant without the mace by adjusting the armour itself rather than tying all buffs to the weapon.
It'd be sick if they would just remove the negative slash and stab bonuses & add some more prayer bonus imo. It'd give Inqusitor a clear advantage over bandos besides its crush attack, that it'd function like a proselyte set but with high prayer bonus, but also with strength bonus.
- They should have buffed the stats of Mace/Rapier/Saeldor by themselves make them a worthwhile upgrade over whip/bludgeon - Inquisitor should sit between Bandos and Torva in gear progression (with it obviously being better for crush weapons than Torva) - [Controversial] Scythe's crush option should be nerfed/removed to allow room for other/future crush weapon progression (and the attack style never made sense) - Time to get a drop is still ridiculously long for items that most people don't consider worth going for - I know reddit suggests it a lot but breaking down justiciar to improve Inquistors (Removes negative attack bonus, improves defence/prayer) Guess we'll see what happens on June 5th when the majority of the combat changes are added, I guarantee there will be a swathe of complaints everywhere haha.
I honestly agree on all points, well thought out! Though, I think at the base level Inquisitor's should have the negative melee attack bonuses removed. (I may have phrased it wrong in the video, but Inquisitor's already has more prayer bonus than Bandos and that should remain too.) When I was thinking about points for this video, I tried to consider every player, but as we all know you can't please everyone! Neither can Jagex, haha. We'll definitely see when the update drops
I still think the Inq Armor should go from 0.5% per piece/2.5% set to 1% per piece/3% per set while still keeping the +1.5% per piece with mace. This would make it work better on task and slightly buff the overall set. Alongside this, make the Helm +6 Str instead of +4 so it ties with the Faceguard (currently on par with a Blood Moon Helm...) and remove the negative slash and stab attack bonuses. That wouldn't be a huge buff, but it would make it feel a bit better to use. If we did want to fortify as well, we could break down Justi for it; makes more sense lore wise to just do that instead of needing a new boss drop.
Who is using Inquisitor's armour on slayer task? I think I'm missing some vital information here. Idk about your buff numbers, but like I said in the video, even just the 7.5% current boost gives the mace 2 max hits. Anything less would give... less, lmao. Personally, I intentionally didn't touch adjusting the specific melee str bonuses, but you make a good point there. So while these changes may make Inquisitor's feel better to use, would this make the set more desirable by players? Yeah, I saw a Justi comment earlier, totally could go that way with it!
I like and agree with the idea of buffing 1-handed weapons with the set. That helps with the DWH idea, whilst still giving the DWH some minor buff relative to the elder maul changes. Though it does make bludgeon even less worthwhile of an upgrade for irons (thanks to the new dualies). Personally I like what someone else mentioned here, of making it 1% per piece without a full set bonus and increasing the helm's strength bonus (though I would increase it to 5, rather than 6). I would also increase the body's and skirt's strength bonus by 1. This makes the full set +3 strength and +0.5% accuracy/damage relative to the current state (and +1% for slayer), at +3% accuracy/damage for the set. It would still give way to the neitiznot faceguard being a better upgrade for non-crush options. You could then still apply this to your one-handed suggestion, by making the armour effect doubled for one-hand weapons (2% vs 1%), making it +3 strength and +3.5% accuracy/damage relative to the current state (and +3% for slayer), at +6% accuracy/damage for the set. This makes it only a minor upgrade over current state for scythe, but a more considerable upgrade for mace/DWH/etc. I disagree with inquisitor being fortified. It being a glass cannon armour set is part of what makes it fun to use. You can get the extra DPS but you're gonna have to either play well (tank flicking during 4:1, for example, which is a skill expression in itself) or consider your combat options carefully. The issue is that the DPS is so close to torva, that overall it doesn't see as much use. A crush-prominent raid (we have a stab one, a slash one, so... raids 4?) would help bring more to the forefront. I also disagree with changes to the regular version of Nightmare. The main reasons why Phosani gets camped a lot more are: 1) it's a faster grind for the items, 2) you don't have to put together a team. Regular nightmare having chip damage and non-guaranteed max hits (people seem to be asking for this across the game - it's not necessarily always a good thing, as explained in a second) is a good thing imo. The chip damage allows for some interesting gameplay decisions when it comes to both 1) optimising trips for various team sizes and 2) solo encounters - I got my first GM solo time with ironman gear because I utilised redemptions (and some pnecks) to minimise the DPS loss I'd otherwis get from brews, for example. You can guarantee redemptions on the boss to survive the *entire* fight, which is pretty cool. A lack of guranteed max hits on minions gives way to interesting team and different solo gameplay relative to Phosani. For example, for the parasites, the optimal weapon to use is claws for regular Nightmare vs elder maul/godsword (or mace with absolute max) for Phosani. This diversity in strategy is a good thing imo. Also, since Phosani exists, there's no need to emulate the changes that were made for it, otherwise you just have Phosani and Phosani-lite, rather than Phosani and Nightmare. Likewise I don't agree with removing the first phase of Phosani. If the time per successful unique roll is to be decreased, it should be via a change to the drop rates, not a change to the fight. The length of the fight adds to the engagement of it and reducing the length would also make it a bit easier per kill. I don't really have any gripes with either of the fights, but I do think the drop rates are bad. More so than the armour, the orbs are ludicrious (and Jagex calling them flex items is dumb, especially given the upcoming elemental changes). I think the armour could do with a bit of love (as suggested above) and I think we could do with more end-game crush-prominent encounters. Cheers for the video and platform for discussion! :)
I appreciate the long and detailed responses to my points! I replied to another comment saying this, but these are just suggestions I came up with in attempts to make the armour/boss fights more desirable to all players. At the end of the day, I really just wanted to see how other people felt and what would make them engage with this content. I think I'd summarize my opinions about Inquisitor's armour as "it just need more to make it feel worth it." How that is implemented is definitely up to the discretion of the devs. The way you specified is definitely a way of going about it. So on the fortifying point, you're saying that the armour will gain value from new crush-based content being introduced into the game. I think this content would have to be carefully curated for the set for this to work. So that we'd see that armour set being used a majority of the time over other options. For example, looking at Phosani right now; Inquisitor's is the best armour to use, yet I still see some people using Torva instead. Maybe they're just not in the know? Who knows? I think that's a completely fair argument on both counts of the nightmare/Phosani boss fights. What about reduced chip damage? For example, 2-3 max for mage/range and 5 max for melee. You'd still be able to capitalize on Phoenix necklaces & Redemption while retaining the identity of the current fight. To me, chip damage feels incredibly bad at normal nightmare. Either way, I feel the normal nightmare needs some form of QoL as the boss is dead right now. (Even in the 'mass' worlds.) And I don't think that just buffing the mace/armour will achieve reviving the player's will to kill the boss in the long term... Short term? Sure, maybe. Personally, I don't mind (and even like) the length of the Phosani boss fight, however I have heard sentiments that the boss fight is too long. To that point, reducing the length of the fight tackles both improving drop rates as well as accessibility for players who can't handle longer boss fights. There's effectively no difference between phase 1 and 2 aside from the special-type of attacks changing. (Paras -> Husk.) In the video, I mentioned Jagex pins the fight at 9m23s on average, which even after removing a phase, still makes it a long boss fight at around 7m, lol. All this to say, personally I think Phosani's is fine, lol. To my understanding, you're definitely more on the side of further drop rate buffs, rather than adjusting the fights themselves; I totally get that sentiment even though I am arguing the opposite, haha. Happy to provide a place to discuss and thank you again for your detailed comment! :D
@@Lyfe Yeah I think for me the two important things to make Inquisitor more worth it is a slightly increase to it's damage output (as I mentioned before) and more end-game content for where crush is useful. I personally don't know of anyone who purposefully uses torva over inquisitor for Phosani, if they have the budget for both. If they don't want to drop the extra gp on inquisitor, they may use torva, but I highly doubt they're camping the boss if so (unless iron), because they're trolling themselves a bit with that. I do know people who bring torva for speedrunning (you switch into it for dinhs/voidwaker specs) - I sadly do not own any torva on the iron, so I just camp inquisitor. The main place that has been inquisitor pushed out of common end-game use is solo CM speeds (and to some degree team CM speeds), or just high efficiency runs. Before torva and recent CoX changes, it was more efficient and faster to run inquisitor at the highest level as it was a straight upgrade for several bosses. Torva changed that by offering new max hits and more reliability (from the defence). Some of the CoX updates made it more torva-friendly too, such as the guaranteed first DWH spec at Tekton - inquisitor only benefits the second spec *and* is strictly worse than torva for the first spec now. For teams, I believe the current optimised meta is to have two inquisitor sets and the rest on torva, to maximise defence reduction speccing. So it does see some good use there, but it's only really used by fairly high level players as a result. But even considering all of that, there is a slight lack of crush-weak end-game content, where inquisitor would then be preference. Pre-torva, for any neutrally weak content that saw non-scythe options, inquisitor was a straight upgrade on bandos, terms of DPS. So imo the tweak to the effect of the armour shouldn't be too great (I've seen suggestions for 10% for both accuracy/damage, which I think is a bit much) as part of the improvement can come from more aligned content. As an aside, funnily enough my BiS against Vardorvis is inquisitor + mace and, if I got the helm, it would even beat out the blade. I'm somewhat open to reduced chip damage, but not quite so low as that. I think even -1 max hit for mage/range would be fine, since that's already a 16% reduction in the amount of damage you take over the course of the fight. A max hit of 4 (which is -2) would mean a 33% reduction, which feels a bit much. I think melee should stay higher because there are counterplays to the damage: 1) you can step back to null the damage, 2) you can tank swap to share the damage. Plus in regular Nightmare, melee is chosen as a attack a lower proportion of the time (well, same as Phosani up until P4). But I wouldn't be against it being lowered to, say, 7 (-22% damage on average). The main argument, from my POV, for lowered chip damage is less emphasis on the blood fury, which is a good thing. So I think a ~16-22% reduction would bring future kills with a torture in line with current kills with a blood fury, which is a good thing. I think the best way to revive normal Nightmare is to incentivise doing it in teams somehow, to make decently efficient teams of 4-5 more comparable to Phosani's rates. That way you have the option of doing Phosani for the best solo rates, or team Nightmare for similar rates with friends. However, I think Phosani should still have the best rates, as the harder encounter. But it could be the case that highly efficient 4-5 player teams make it the same rate, but it would require high levels of coordination. But also bear in mind part of the reason regular is dead is, like Phosani, the gp rates are considerably lower than what they used to be (as well as gp holding less value relative to before, especially with some of the money makers around today). Bots heavily contribute to this sadly and most times I head to Phosani I see some obsidian-clad binary bucko heading over too. Another reason, for irons, is just that the time investment isn't worth the usefulness, which would be solved by aforementioned changes and see more irons visit the boss. It's worth also mentioning that there's a lot more diversity of content nowadays, which means all older content has been spread more thin, such as regular GWD. Well one thing to consider about removing one of the phases in which you can get paras/husks is that you get an inconsistency across fights for the number of phases for each. It would no longer be two phases of each, but two of one and one of the other. This would be annoying when balancing an inventory setup for similar length trips to current, but with more kc/trip, as you could just get double parasites every time and have to use more balm/sanfew. More of an ironman concern, but worth thinking about. Atm a learner will take likely take 10-13 minutes for their first Phosani kill, depending on gear and experience with the regular boss encounter. An very experienced player will take roughly 6:45-8:30, depending on gear (absolute max should result in 6:45-7:00 kills and ironmen may find it harder to push below an 8:30 average without a megarare or some of her own drops). I average roughly 7:30ish (two pieces of inquisitor, mace, close to max melee elsewhere, shadow but missing heart and one piece of ancestral). To me, if you want to do end-game content, 10 or even 15 minutes isn't a big ask of someone's time, especially if drops are adjusted to account for it. And experience/gear (aka progression) will bring that down to 8-9 minutes anyway. CG is pretty similar for first timers in terms of the time spent for the overall encounter (~12 minutes) and a bit faster at the highest end (I probably average ~6:15-6:20) I think if you want to make the fight shorter, I would reduce the boss and pillar HP by ~10-15%, rather than removing a phase. This would reduce the fight time by around 40-100 seconds, depending on gear, etc. But tbh I would rather they didn't change anything about the fight itself. I'm definitely more on Team Buff-The-Rates lol. To be honest, I think the armour proposal is fine as it stands, but the orb rates need to be revisited. For Phosani. For regular, like I mentioned earlier, something could be done with the team scaling to make it more enticing to run it with friends. Again, sorry for such a long comment! I just spilled my thoughts out :D
@@pzodeosrs I read through it all, and all of your points are well reasoned with information to boot. Thanks for contributing to the conversation so earnestly! :D
@@Lyfe I appreciate you taking the time to read it and discuss both POVs :) I've not kept up to date with your account/series in quite a while now, but I still recommend it due to the fantastic storytelling - keep up the good work!
Let us fortify like masouri for more defence. Give 5% accuracy and damage pr amor piece while wearing the mace and 2.5% while wearing other one-handed weapons. I love Nightmare for the complexity and drop table. I don't want to be bombarded with skilling supplies, higher dopamine release when an item drops
@@Lyfe it's decent enough for it to be mentioned in the blog atleast. The way they word it is that it's a set bonus stop there. It's only ever used at Vasa crystals in CMs and maybe zerker toa build or something.
just one thing id like to note, normaly in games ive seen when they boost things like this its normally in prep for a bigger badder boss in the future that will make that set up BIS, eg destiny 2 they nerf weapons all the time anticipation for raids knowing current set ups would make it way to stong, much like how they wanted to nerf voidwaker i imagine they wanted to bring out a brew with the herblore activity that would give back special like in TOA,, knowing they arnt going to nerf the voidwaker i imagin they just scrapped tht idea. going back to the mace, currently as it sits, looking at what potential they can do in the future. while it sucks i just rambled on about nerfs. Buffs inquisitors should hae just been a crush bonus to any weapon allowing for potential upgrades in the future for the mace
i really really dislike over complicating things just for balance(simplicity and readability > balance as a design choice imo). set bonus in this game only apply to the items in that set. imo they have 2 options to stay inline and not overly complicate things. 1, just buff the inq armor set bonus or 2, make the inq set include the mace(IE: it no longer works on any otther weapon). this "its an armor set bonus like void that works for everything but its also has a seperate set bonus that includes a weapon like barrows both at the same time" is really really messy to me and i dont like it. ^^
I decided to take a bit more time to think about your comment before responding and considering it. And I'd have to say I'd agree. Simplicity and readability is very important for OSRS in particular. Heck, it's a simple game at the base level. Inquisitor's should have one or the other, not both like currently proposed.
I think it should never be better than a scythe but have the armour set to the 2.5% bonus with full set with all weapons but with the mace make it a 5 or 6% buff didnt do the math on it but whatever makes it less than scythe+torva. Would leave it at a nice upgrade from bandos but not make it bis, really should be 2nd highest dmg output and leave the bad defense alone
The armour set already provides 2.5% acc/dmg to all crush attack style weapons. (Unless you're saying that it should just retain that, which I believe it is.) Like I said in the video, the mace only gets 2 max hits in max gear with the current proposed 7.5% boost. So dropping that further would be reductive to their buffing proposal, haha. As it stands, I don't think the current changes will make the mace/armour more desirable by players, but I guess we'll see, eh?
@@Lyfe I think they should have buffed the weapons (mace/blade/rapier on their own), and for inq armor, agreed with you on giving them more crush accuracy. I've also seen the idea on reddit multiple times of making a way to fortify inq. Tying mace buff to a set makes inq less worthwhile compared to Torva at a lot of places like raids.
I can assure you, I still miss plenty DWH specs with inquisitor's lol. Also, I don't think I recommended making it a BIS strength armour; Torva has that crown for sure
While guthix sleeps gives us tormented demons, make them drop armour upgrade materials to the inquisitors set, it fits the theme of zamorak monsters to upgrade zamorak related armour. Back in rs2 tormented demons dropped armour parts to create dragon platebody and kiteshield, and since we already have those from adamant and rune dragons that would be an awesome idea imo. The upgrades maybe include an increase bonus to demon bane damage maybe? Potential demonbane boss added to the game, or to increase the defensive bonuses of the inquisitor set making it more viable in different places. I love the inquisitor set it looks great and deserves some love.
let us merge the armor with justiciar to make the ulitmate door build. Like lets drop some sort of merger item off phosani. Or let raids 4 be crush weak and drop that shit.
Haha, Justi seems to be the go to recommended item for 'upgrading' Inquisitor's defence. Idk how the end product would look, but to me, it feels/sounds like a good path to go regarding both armour sets' prices. Idk about dropping another unique-type of item from Phosani itself; its unique drop table is already pretty bloated.
i dont get why the scythe even has a crush mode, if its BIS slash, then it should be slash only its not like theres a precedent where weapons need multiple styles, we have plenty where its all slash or all crush
Personally I think that scythe should only get its 3 hits on slash, it should have a stab option, and crush should be removed from it. Either you're gonna slash someone with a scythe or maybe do a downward stab with the tip of it. How are you crushing with it?
I agree with the scythe point, I don't really see how it crushes with a giant blade like that, lol. However, I do think it's cool that weapons can have multiple styles
This just seems like an elaborate plot for you to extend the content available to your accounts restrictions. Personally, I've seen better methods of pushing agenda in this game. If you had access to the new boss that dropped new materials with your armor you could then by product raise your defense level and increase your access several pieces of gear/content. This would in turn allow you to diversify you video's and push out more content to further boost your channel, nice try. - algorithm boost brought to you by ChatGPT
your opinion is wrong and youre coping
💀
FUCK YOU!!!! 🤬
refuses to elaborate
Leaves 🏃♂️
sorry Lyfe, love the series but i agree with this comment
A interesting idea I pondered was (which you also touched on the video): what if Inquisitor's armor would have a fortified version? With the area of Morytania in mind, making it so you sacrifice Justiciar Armor to make Saradomin Plates to fortify the armor, making it so that both Inquisitor and Justificiar would maintain a good price. As for the armor set effect, you could double the accuracy of the armor (I have not ran the numbers for this), give it a higher prayer bonus and a very slight increase in defense bonus.
This would make it so Inquisitor (F) would be the best for accuracy while Torva would remain the best option for Max gear.
This would also make sense in lore btw. So... win win?
Price is going down because only bots are farming nightmare. If they make it 3x more common but ban all the bots the price is going up anyways
I can't argue that bots don't farm nightmare. When I have done it in the past, I pretty much always see at least one to report (and I do!) - You're right.
Though, I don't really think it's possible to ban all bots. Plus, I imagine the price may drop further the more the rates are improved; hence my making this video. I guess we'll see when project rebalance is eventually dropped!
Had to login to my account to leave you a comment here-- I think you really nailed the suggestions for inquisitor armour. People might expect that someone whose account was literally built for this set would have a purely self-serving opinion, but IMO your suggestions would really benefit everyone and leave the armour set in a great spot. I especially like giving inquisitor the upgrade treatment similar to bandos -> torva or armadyl -> masori. TBH though, given it's rarity, I wouldn't even mind buffing it a bit further than you were suggesting. Torva is in a spot where it sort of eclipses all other armour sets due to having both super high strength and defence bonuses. I think there's probably room for a torva-tier sidegrade (being the upgraded inquisitor set) that is the glass cannon set Jagex aimed to achieve with this armour: incredibly high crush bonuses that push its DPS passed torva for some crush use cases, but dangerously low def bonuses that punish bad gameplay. Great video and suggestions!
Thanks for the well thought out comment, Zorte! :D
im glad im not the only one to point this out. my proposal has been maintaining the 2.5% damage and increase accuracy slightly ( but not too much) maybe 4% idk. as for the mace? only increase its melee strength a bit but not its accuracy. that accuracy for the mace will only be obtained while wearing inquisitor so it goes hand and hand along with TECHNICALLY the crush style weaponry. youve also pointed out the negative stat bonuses so we leveled there. youve read my mind 7:15. this is all i have to say and jagex needs to watch your video and read my comment. inquisitor cannot fall behind!!!!!
I think being able to fortify through use of justiciar makes the most sense. This upgrade removes both the set passive of justiciar and the negative stab and slash bonus of inq.
This upgraded set should have better defense than barrows armor and the helmet should increase to maybe +7 str creating a niche between torva. Defense requirements should be 80 for the upgraded set.
I've come to really love the 30 defence niche, and I suspect that someone at Jagex does as well considering that the (semi-) recently added Masori armour has that requirement. I really hope no changes come to the defence requirement of Inquisitor. I have seen a suggestion that it could be combined with justiciar which, while odd from a lore perspective, would revive both sets in a nice way.
Me too, haha; I find the niche interesting.
Like I said in the video, these are just suggestions and the ways I see the armour being 'improved' in some way, shape, or form. At the end of the day, most likely none of my suggestions will be implemented and this video will go down as a simple thought experiment :P
Definitely see your point on Inquis/Justi combination.
Dude, you are 100% right thank you
Glass cannon armour can work, it just needs to have clear benefits. Your point about inq at cox kinda shows this. Yes, people may have swapped to arma in places, but they still brought inq over bandos because they wanted the dps. Currently, torva is just better dps overall in most places where inq was used. At the places where inq is better dps, it's typically not by enough to justify using it over torva. Giving inq the dps to beat out torva when using crush would give people a reason to use it. They could let it give more consistent specs when using crush. DWH, new elder maul, and even bgs would all benefit from that, and defence reduction is massive for scythe. Giving inq as a set some kind of spec accuracy or interaction would make it a lot more desirable.
Yeah, I think the whole point of this video is just to say, "Hey, I think the Inquisitor's armour needs a little bit more to make it desirable."
@@Lyfe You highlighted the key issues pretty well. Inq is such a cool armour set with pretty interesting lore. I really hope they make it relevant without the mace by adjusting the armour itself rather than tying all buffs to the weapon.
It'd be sick if they would just remove the negative slash and stab bonuses & add some more prayer bonus imo. It'd give Inqusitor a clear advantage over bandos besides its crush attack, that it'd function like a proselyte set but with high prayer bonus, but also with strength bonus.
- They should have buffed the stats of Mace/Rapier/Saeldor by themselves make them a worthwhile upgrade over whip/bludgeon
- Inquisitor should sit between Bandos and Torva in gear progression (with it obviously being better for crush weapons than Torva)
- [Controversial] Scythe's crush option should be nerfed/removed to allow room for other/future crush weapon progression (and the attack style never made sense)
- Time to get a drop is still ridiculously long for items that most people don't consider worth going for
- I know reddit suggests it a lot but breaking down justiciar to improve Inquistors (Removes negative attack bonus, improves defence/prayer)
Guess we'll see what happens on June 5th when the majority of the combat changes are added, I guarantee there will be a swathe of complaints everywhere haha.
I honestly agree on all points, well thought out! Though, I think at the base level Inquisitor's should have the negative melee attack bonuses removed. (I may have phrased it wrong in the video, but Inquisitor's already has more prayer bonus than Bandos and that should remain too.)
When I was thinking about points for this video, I tried to consider every player, but as we all know you can't please everyone! Neither can Jagex, haha. We'll definitely see when the update drops
L take. just because you can't afford a scy lmfaooooo
I still think the Inq Armor should go from 0.5% per piece/2.5% set to 1% per piece/3% per set while still keeping the +1.5% per piece with mace. This would make it work better on task and slightly buff the overall set. Alongside this, make the Helm +6 Str instead of +4 so it ties with the Faceguard (currently on par with a Blood Moon Helm...) and remove the negative slash and stab attack bonuses. That wouldn't be a huge buff, but it would make it feel a bit better to use. If we did want to fortify as well, we could break down Justi for it; makes more sense lore wise to just do that instead of needing a new boss drop.
Who is using Inquisitor's armour on slayer task? I think I'm missing some vital information here.
Idk about your buff numbers, but like I said in the video, even just the 7.5% current boost gives the mace 2 max hits. Anything less would give... less, lmao.
Personally, I intentionally didn't touch adjusting the specific melee str bonuses, but you make a good point there.
So while these changes may make Inquisitor's feel better to use, would this make the set more desirable by players?
Yeah, I saw a Justi comment earlier, totally could go that way with it!
I like and agree with the idea of buffing 1-handed weapons with the set. That helps with the DWH idea, whilst still giving the DWH some minor buff relative to the elder maul changes. Though it does make bludgeon even less worthwhile of an upgrade for irons (thanks to the new dualies). Personally I like what someone else mentioned here, of making it 1% per piece without a full set bonus and increasing the helm's strength bonus (though I would increase it to 5, rather than 6). I would also increase the body's and skirt's strength bonus by 1. This makes the full set +3 strength and +0.5% accuracy/damage relative to the current state (and +1% for slayer), at +3% accuracy/damage for the set. It would still give way to the neitiznot faceguard being a better upgrade for non-crush options. You could then still apply this to your one-handed suggestion, by making the armour effect doubled for one-hand weapons (2% vs 1%), making it +3 strength and +3.5% accuracy/damage relative to the current state (and +3% for slayer), at +6% accuracy/damage for the set. This makes it only a minor upgrade over current state for scythe, but a more considerable upgrade for mace/DWH/etc.
I disagree with inquisitor being fortified. It being a glass cannon armour set is part of what makes it fun to use. You can get the extra DPS but you're gonna have to either play well (tank flicking during 4:1, for example, which is a skill expression in itself) or consider your combat options carefully. The issue is that the DPS is so close to torva, that overall it doesn't see as much use. A crush-prominent raid (we have a stab one, a slash one, so... raids 4?) would help bring more to the forefront.
I also disagree with changes to the regular version of Nightmare. The main reasons why Phosani gets camped a lot more are: 1) it's a faster grind for the items, 2) you don't have to put together a team. Regular nightmare having chip damage and non-guaranteed max hits (people seem to be asking for this across the game - it's not necessarily always a good thing, as explained in a second) is a good thing imo. The chip damage allows for some interesting gameplay decisions when it comes to both 1) optimising trips for various team sizes and 2) solo encounters - I got my first GM solo time with ironman gear because I utilised redemptions (and some pnecks) to minimise the DPS loss I'd otherwis get from brews, for example. You can guarantee redemptions on the boss to survive the *entire* fight, which is pretty cool. A lack of guranteed max hits on minions gives way to interesting team and different solo gameplay relative to Phosani. For example, for the parasites, the optimal weapon to use is claws for regular Nightmare vs elder maul/godsword (or mace with absolute max) for Phosani. This diversity in strategy is a good thing imo. Also, since Phosani exists, there's no need to emulate the changes that were made for it, otherwise you just have Phosani and Phosani-lite, rather than Phosani and Nightmare.
Likewise I don't agree with removing the first phase of Phosani. If the time per successful unique roll is to be decreased, it should be via a change to the drop rates, not a change to the fight. The length of the fight adds to the engagement of it and reducing the length would also make it a bit easier per kill.
I don't really have any gripes with either of the fights, but I do think the drop rates are bad. More so than the armour, the orbs are ludicrious (and Jagex calling them flex items is dumb, especially given the upcoming elemental changes). I think the armour could do with a bit of love (as suggested above) and I think we could do with more end-game crush-prominent encounters.
Cheers for the video and platform for discussion! :)
I appreciate the long and detailed responses to my points! I replied to another comment saying this, but these are just suggestions I came up with in attempts to make the armour/boss fights more desirable to all players. At the end of the day, I really just wanted to see how other people felt and what would make them engage with this content.
I think I'd summarize my opinions about Inquisitor's armour as "it just need more to make it feel worth it." How that is implemented is definitely up to the discretion of the devs. The way you specified is definitely a way of going about it.
So on the fortifying point, you're saying that the armour will gain value from new crush-based content being introduced into the game. I think this content would have to be carefully curated for the set for this to work. So that we'd see that armour set being used a majority of the time over other options. For example, looking at Phosani right now; Inquisitor's is the best armour to use, yet I still see some people using Torva instead. Maybe they're just not in the know? Who knows?
I think that's a completely fair argument on both counts of the nightmare/Phosani boss fights. What about reduced chip damage? For example, 2-3 max for mage/range and 5 max for melee. You'd still be able to capitalize on Phoenix necklaces & Redemption while retaining the identity of the current fight. To me, chip damage feels incredibly bad at normal nightmare. Either way, I feel the normal nightmare needs some form of QoL as the boss is dead right now. (Even in the 'mass' worlds.) And I don't think that just buffing the mace/armour will achieve reviving the player's will to kill the boss in the long term... Short term? Sure, maybe.
Personally, I don't mind (and even like) the length of the Phosani boss fight, however I have heard sentiments that the boss fight is too long. To that point, reducing the length of the fight tackles both improving drop rates as well as accessibility for players who can't handle longer boss fights. There's effectively no difference between phase 1 and 2 aside from the special-type of attacks changing. (Paras -> Husk.) In the video, I mentioned Jagex pins the fight at 9m23s on average, which even after removing a phase, still makes it a long boss fight at around 7m, lol. All this to say, personally I think Phosani's is fine, lol.
To my understanding, you're definitely more on the side of further drop rate buffs, rather than adjusting the fights themselves; I totally get that sentiment even though I am arguing the opposite, haha.
Happy to provide a place to discuss and thank you again for your detailed comment! :D
@@Lyfe Yeah I think for me the two important things to make Inquisitor more worth it is a slightly increase to it's damage output (as I mentioned before) and more end-game content for where crush is useful.
I personally don't know of anyone who purposefully uses torva over inquisitor for Phosani, if they have the budget for both. If they don't want to drop the extra gp on inquisitor, they may use torva, but I highly doubt they're camping the boss if so (unless iron), because they're trolling themselves a bit with that.
I do know people who bring torva for speedrunning (you switch into it for dinhs/voidwaker specs) - I sadly do not own any torva on the iron, so I just camp inquisitor. The main place that has been inquisitor pushed out of common end-game use is solo CM speeds (and to some degree team CM speeds), or just high efficiency runs. Before torva and recent CoX changes, it was more efficient and faster to run inquisitor at the highest level as it was a straight upgrade for several bosses. Torva changed that by offering new max hits and more reliability (from the defence). Some of the CoX updates made it more torva-friendly too, such as the guaranteed first DWH spec at Tekton - inquisitor only benefits the second spec *and* is strictly worse than torva for the first spec now. For teams, I believe the current optimised meta is to have two inquisitor sets and the rest on torva, to maximise defence reduction speccing. So it does see some good use there, but it's only really used by fairly high level players as a result.
But even considering all of that, there is a slight lack of crush-weak end-game content, where inquisitor would then be preference. Pre-torva, for any neutrally weak content that saw non-scythe options, inquisitor was a straight upgrade on bandos, terms of DPS. So imo the tweak to the effect of the armour shouldn't be too great (I've seen suggestions for 10% for both accuracy/damage, which I think is a bit much) as part of the improvement can come from more aligned content. As an aside, funnily enough my BiS against Vardorvis is inquisitor + mace and, if I got the helm, it would even beat out the blade.
I'm somewhat open to reduced chip damage, but not quite so low as that. I think even -1 max hit for mage/range would be fine, since that's already a 16% reduction in the amount of damage you take over the course of the fight. A max hit of 4 (which is -2) would mean a 33% reduction, which feels a bit much. I think melee should stay higher because there are counterplays to the damage: 1) you can step back to null the damage, 2) you can tank swap to share the damage. Plus in regular Nightmare, melee is chosen as a attack a lower proportion of the time (well, same as Phosani up until P4). But I wouldn't be against it being lowered to, say, 7 (-22% damage on average). The main argument, from my POV, for lowered chip damage is less emphasis on the blood fury, which is a good thing. So I think a ~16-22% reduction would bring future kills with a torture in line with current kills with a blood fury, which is a good thing.
I think the best way to revive normal Nightmare is to incentivise doing it in teams somehow, to make decently efficient teams of 4-5 more comparable to Phosani's rates. That way you have the option of doing Phosani for the best solo rates, or team Nightmare for similar rates with friends. However, I think Phosani should still have the best rates, as the harder encounter. But it could be the case that highly efficient 4-5 player teams make it the same rate, but it would require high levels of coordination. But also bear in mind part of the reason regular is dead is, like Phosani, the gp rates are considerably lower than what they used to be (as well as gp holding less value relative to before, especially with some of the money makers around today). Bots heavily contribute to this sadly and most times I head to Phosani I see some obsidian-clad binary bucko heading over too. Another reason, for irons, is just that the time investment isn't worth the usefulness, which would be solved by aforementioned changes and see more irons visit the boss.
It's worth also mentioning that there's a lot more diversity of content nowadays, which means all older content has been spread more thin, such as regular GWD.
Well one thing to consider about removing one of the phases in which you can get paras/husks is that you get an inconsistency across fights for the number of phases for each. It would no longer be two phases of each, but two of one and one of the other. This would be annoying when balancing an inventory setup for similar length trips to current, but with more kc/trip, as you could just get double parasites every time and have to use more balm/sanfew. More of an ironman concern, but worth thinking about.
Atm a learner will take likely take 10-13 minutes for their first Phosani kill, depending on gear and experience with the regular boss encounter. An very experienced player will take roughly 6:45-8:30, depending on gear (absolute max should result in 6:45-7:00 kills and ironmen may find it harder to push below an 8:30 average without a megarare or some of her own drops). I average roughly 7:30ish (two pieces of inquisitor, mace, close to max melee elsewhere, shadow but missing heart and one piece of ancestral). To me, if you want to do end-game content, 10 or even 15 minutes isn't a big ask of someone's time, especially if drops are adjusted to account for it. And experience/gear (aka progression) will bring that down to 8-9 minutes anyway. CG is pretty similar for first timers in terms of the time spent for the overall encounter (~12 minutes) and a bit faster at the highest end (I probably average ~6:15-6:20)
I think if you want to make the fight shorter, I would reduce the boss and pillar HP by ~10-15%, rather than removing a phase. This would reduce the fight time by around 40-100 seconds, depending on gear, etc. But tbh I would rather they didn't change anything about the fight itself. I'm definitely more on Team Buff-The-Rates lol. To be honest, I think the armour proposal is fine as it stands, but the orb rates need to be revisited. For Phosani. For regular, like I mentioned earlier, something could be done with the team scaling to make it more enticing to run it with friends.
Again, sorry for such a long comment! I just spilled my thoughts out :D
@@pzodeosrs I read through it all, and all of your points are well reasoned with information to boot. Thanks for contributing to the conversation so earnestly! :D
@@Lyfe I appreciate you taking the time to read it and discuss both POVs :)
I've not kept up to date with your account/series in quite a while now, but I still recommend it due to the fantastic storytelling - keep up the good work!
Subbed
Sold bandos
Bought inqui
Best combination to massacre crabs for quick EXP on strength
haven't started the video yet but I agree with Lyfe
Haha
Let us fortify like masouri for more defence.
Give 5% accuracy and damage pr amor piece while wearing the mace and 2.5% while wearing other one-handed weapons.
I love Nightmare for the complexity and drop table. I don't want to be bombarded with skilling supplies, higher dopamine release when an item drops
One thing I want to point out is that they didn't mention weather the mace buff applies only to crush.
Fair. Though, is the stab option really that good on the Inq mace?
@@Lyfe it's decent enough for it to be mentioned in the blog atleast. The way they word it is that it's a set bonus stop there.
It's only ever used at Vasa crystals in CMs and maybe zerker toa build or something.
just one thing id like to note, normaly in games ive seen when they boost things like this its normally in prep for a bigger badder boss in the future that will make that set up BIS, eg destiny 2 they nerf weapons all the time anticipation for raids knowing current set ups would make it way to stong, much like how they wanted to nerf voidwaker i imagine they wanted to bring out a brew with the herblore activity that would give back special like in TOA,, knowing they arnt going to nerf the voidwaker i imagin they just scrapped tht idea. going back to the mace, currently as it sits, looking at what potential they can do in the future. while it sucks i just rambled on about nerfs. Buffs inquisitors should hae just been a crush bonus to any weapon allowing for potential upgrades in the future for the mace
Nice insight. - lmao, I enjoyed reading this comment.
3 max hits is a very big deal as a pker
Thanks for letting me know, perhaps the one handed crush weapon isn't the way to go.
i really really dislike over complicating things just for balance(simplicity and readability > balance as a design choice imo). set bonus in this game only apply to the items in that set. imo they have 2 options to stay inline and not overly complicate things. 1, just buff the inq armor set bonus or 2, make the inq set include the mace(IE: it no longer works on any otther weapon). this "its an armor set bonus like void that works for everything but its also has a seperate set bonus that includes a weapon like barrows both at the same time" is really really messy to me and i dont like it. ^^
I decided to take a bit more time to think about your comment before responding and considering it.
And I'd have to say I'd agree. Simplicity and readability is very important for OSRS in particular. Heck, it's a simple game at the base level. Inquisitor's should have one or the other, not both like currently proposed.
I think it should never be better than a scythe but have the armour set to the 2.5% bonus with full set with all weapons but with the mace make it a 5 or 6% buff didnt do the math on it but whatever makes it less than scythe+torva. Would leave it at a nice upgrade from bandos but not make it bis, really should be 2nd highest dmg output and leave the bad defense alone
The armour set already provides 2.5% acc/dmg to all crush attack style weapons. (Unless you're saying that it should just retain that, which I believe it is.)
Like I said in the video, the mace only gets 2 max hits in max gear with the current proposed 7.5% boost. So dropping that further would be reductive to their buffing proposal, haha.
As it stands, I don't think the current changes will make the mace/armour more desirable by players, but I guess we'll see, eh?
i paid 550m for full inq a few years back...
Crazy how times change, eh?
the buff should have been to the tier 80 weapons, not the armor
Currently it is to the T80 weapon; you just need to use the armour to achieve that buff.
@@Lyfe I think they should have buffed the weapons (mace/blade/rapier on their own), and for inq armor, agreed with you on giving them more crush accuracy.
I've also seen the idea on reddit multiple times of making a way to fortify inq.
Tying mace buff to a set makes inq less worthwhile compared to Torva at a lot of places like raids.
Its not a dilema haha. Its bis crush, dwh specs go brrrr. Its useful for speed running, not really supposed to be a bis strength armor
I can assure you, I still miss plenty DWH specs with inquisitor's lol. Also, I don't think I recommended making it a BIS strength armour; Torva has that crown for sure
While guthix sleeps gives us tormented demons, make them drop armour upgrade materials to the inquisitors set, it fits the theme of zamorak monsters to upgrade zamorak related armour.
Back in rs2 tormented demons dropped armour parts to create dragon platebody and kiteshield, and since we already have those from adamant and rune dragons that would be an awesome idea imo.
The upgrades maybe include an increase bonus to demon bane damage maybe? Potential demonbane boss added to the game, or to increase the defensive bonuses of the inquisitor set making it more viable in different places.
I love the inquisitor set it looks great and deserves some love.
That's an interesting idea!
Idk about adding a demonbane effect, but I definitely agree that I love the set and it looks great/deserves some love
let us merge the armor with justiciar to make the ulitmate door build. Like lets drop some sort of merger item off phosani. Or let raids 4 be crush weak and drop that shit.
Haha, Justi seems to be the go to recommended item for 'upgrading' Inquisitor's defence. Idk how the end product would look, but to me, it feels/sounds like a good path to go regarding both armour sets' prices.
Idk about dropping another unique-type of item from Phosani itself; its unique drop table is already pretty bloated.
@@Lyfe raids 4 then!
@@2small_paul Potential 👀
@@Lyfe There's even a mermaid boss. Like the mermaid chick you buy your crap back from at Nightmare
i dont get why the scythe even has a crush mode, if its BIS slash, then it should be slash only
its not like theres a precedent where weapons need multiple styles, we have plenty where its all slash or all crush
Personally I think that scythe should only get its 3 hits on slash, it should have a stab option, and crush should be removed from it. Either you're gonna slash someone with a scythe or maybe do a downward stab with the tip of it. How are you crushing with it?
I agree with the scythe point, I don't really see how it crushes with a giant blade like that, lol.
However, I do think it's cool that weapons can have multiple styles
It's so weird that a raids mega rare weapon is better than one from a boss that drops gwd tier loot
Scy is fine
im scard of nightmare\
I, too, was once scared of the nightmare. Only you can conquer your dreams!
This just seems like an elaborate plot for you to extend the content available to your accounts restrictions. Personally, I've seen better methods of pushing agenda in this game. If you had access to the new boss that dropped new materials with your armor you could then by product raise your defense level and increase your access several pieces of gear/content. This would in turn allow you to diversify you video's and push out more content to further boost your channel, nice try. - algorithm boost brought to you by ChatGPT
Holy, you caught me.