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out of curiosity, did you use the original Cyanotype-chemistry (solution A + B etc), or one of the two Mike Ware came up with? I wonder if this would change the results, but I would assume they still produce the same chemicals after exposure and washing?

@N_N_N the tannic acid is ph sensitive. If you dip a cyanotype toned in tannic acid into an acid bath it turns gray, if you dip it into a basic solution it turns a reddish color. My guess is that when you dip it in an acidic bath it makes some of the bleached cyanotype solution turn slightly blue again and combined with the reddish color of the tannic acid it causes a "split tone" affect. Because of how the subtractive color works I think that the blue and reddish together are making the gray color.

@N_N_N this was original cyanotype chemistry. The new cyanotype should work the same but amonia works better as a bleach for it.

​@@matthewbary1 makes sense, thanks!

@@N_N_N No problem

@sillysandwich4654 While the particular wavelengths used in these led lights are not necessarily dangerous like sun rays, I would still use eye protection. It might look dull, but that is just because we can't see those wavelengths and it is 80 watts so definitely wear eye protection

I am working on the tri color cyanotype video as an addition to what I have already made. It is what I was working towards in the first place and I finally got it to work

@@matthewbary1 congratulations on your cyanotypes journey. It’s sooo cool and gracious of you to share it with the rest of us, your fan club 😁🤗

I have. I need to make a more advanced video on cyanotype toning, I have found many ways and many toners to get prints that look as good as any salt print and even some very nice dark black prints using split toning. Espresso, tannic acid, wine tannins, and oak galls all make great prints

That is a very good idea

To be honest with you, I'm kind of surprised I was able to get it, dicromates are hazardous and must be handled with care. There is a process called the Chiba system that uses the same ferric citrate used in cyanotype along with a diluted peroxide developer. I am in the process of using it to make a safe replacement for the dichromate process. The book "carbon transfer printing" actually describes the process but you can find results online as well.

No, that was related to how densely I printed the negative and the light source. My bigger exposure unit is only 15 minutes

@@matthewbary1 Thank you

@@NuttakitSuk No problem

You definitely can it will just be a different outcome. You can also half bleach and tone as well, which makes a more black looking image. For toning without bleaching, try instant coffee.

If you are using a digital projector you will have to scan the film and display it on the projector. As for how far, it just depends on the size you want but the bigger the longer it will take.

@matthewbary1 thank you! How long approx will it take with a normal projector?

@@alinamiro4913 Most likely it will take several hours of exposure

@@matthewbary1 thank you! That worked, love the result. appreciate so much your effort in making these instructions!

@@matthewbary1 thank you so much! That worked with great results. Thanks again for the detailed instructions and explanations you are making!

Glad it was helpful!

I am not sure if anyone has used the "new cyanotype" on fabric. The resulting "Prussian blue" would be the same from ether so I would use the classic as it is more stable and several people have already done it on fabric.

The bleaching bath you simply mix till you have a PH of 11-12. As far as the tannic acid I would say 1 tablespoon per liter of water.

@@matthewbary1 Thank you very much!

I have also issue finding potassium dychromate because its banned in europe due to his high toxicity, does Diazidostilbene work at the same measure ? sorry for all this questions but you are my last hope

To achieve darker or lighter/higher or lower contrast you simply adjust the amount of pigment up or down and/or the sensitizer up or down to create the desired results.

There is a method that uses "ferric ammonium citrate" used in cyanotypes and dilute hydrogen peroxide to achieve the same result without dichromate . The method is referenced in the book "Carbon Transfer Printing" by by Sandy King (Author), Don Nelson (Author), John Lockhart (Author). essentially the steps are the same as in my video but the dichromate is replaced with the "ferric ammonium citrate" and no potassium hydroxide is needed. after it dries and is exposed you first develop it with a dilute amount of hydrogen peroxide then rinse off the unexposed glop. This must all be done at lower temperatures than with dichromate as this method does not harden as well. I need to make a video on the subject as I am trying to provide methods where dichromate's are not available or where someone may not want to use them due to there toxicity. The process in question is called the Chiba system

@@matthewbary1 Thank you for your reply ! i have found Potassium Ferricyanide as replacement for dichromate and i will try it this week, i have ferric ammonium citrate and i have tried the chiba system but the problem is that the gelatine doenst stick to the glass when its dry but i will try your recipe with it!

@@LUNAIRErec remember to use cool water when developing and fan dry to speed up drying

I have avoided the "new cyanotype" formula as it is just very complicated and very sensitive. You almost have to make it right before you use it as if it sits to long it goes blue. Also you have to be careful of the paper used, how much humidity is in the air when it dries, just allot of issues with it so I avoid it at all cost. However if you really want to pursue this method I recommend going to www.alternativephotography.com/ and check out the section on "new cyanotype" and maybe you will have more luck with it than myself.

Thanks for taking the time to answer ! I print cyanotype using this technique since 7 years and I am very happy with the result when it works but there is a lot of random in the result depending on the chemicals and I am very frustrated with that... I don't understand what is the cause of it...

Inkjet photo papers stain very badly when toned, which is why I avoid them. This is unfortunate because inkjet paper creates a very high resolution image

I tried a 100w led and it was faster but the print was blurry. It may have been that the extra heat it created caused warping but I'm not sure. It did not seem to affect the enlarger but it may have to do with the lenses it has.

If you rinsed it after the vinegar it's possible the wash water was to alkaline. Try the vinegar soak again but rinse it in water that has some vinegar added to make sure it is not alkaline and that may help

Thank you so much for the quick reply! I tried the same print again, and I left it in the vinegar longer. I think that has done the trick. But I will also try your advice as well; the water here is pretty alkaline. Thanks again!@@matthewbary1

I explain bleaching in the Due tone video series I made. It will help with bleaching and toning.

A normal cyanotype solution is a 20/10 mixture, I am diluting the 20 solution in half making it 10 and only that one for the first layer, the second layer is the 10/10 solution diluted in half which would bring the individual components to 5/5.

It is a digital negative so I just added it on the computer

Do you mean lace directly on the paper or a picture of lace?

Moat cyanotypes were of lace directly on paper. But now I found some were the lace is blue on a white background, so I assume they were made using a photographic negative.

It could be possible to do this with Ortho Litho film to make large negatives @@friedasorber1653

There is tannic acid in all kinds of tea and other plant roots and leaves they just have other compounds as well that will affect the color of the print. Tannic acid is just the pure form which I have bought from Ebay but green tea has the same affect as the pure stuff. You can use wine tannins but they are more prone to staining. As far as bleaching I want to do a master class on toning at some point because there are several ways to do it, yes you can bleach it all the way which I did here but you can also "split tone" where you 1/4 or 1/2 bleach and then tone which makes the image more detailed and better quality in my opinion.

And yes you want to use "soda crystals"

Thank you very much. When I get time I'll refer back to this.

Washing soda or "Sodium carbonate" dissolved in water is all you need. It is just baking soda that has been heated so it is perfectly safe

Color and intensity are the same. If you want a darker color from ether tannic acid or green tea that is just going to depend on the thickness of your emulsion on the paper. Essentially if you double coat your paper you will get almost twice the intensity but it doesn't matter which one you use.

I have noticed this in several types of paper. Just be aware when you pre treat with acid it causes particles to precipitate out which may require thorough rinsing

@@matthewbary1 Yes, I rinse thoroughly. before drying. I used Sulfamic acid instead of vinegar/acetic acid because I read somewhere (can't remember where) that sulfamate salts rinse cleaner than acetate salts.

@mattmarks2526 I have read that as well. My go to solution is to not do anything to the paper and develop the cyanotype in hot water with citric acid or undiluted vinegar. It also seems to help to make denser negatives and expose for much longer times.

Very glad to hear it worked for you

Washing soda. Sodium carbonate

It should work on any anything, just keep in mind some things hold more emulsion than others and some things allow emulsion to penetrate deeper so this will affect your negative density and exposure times but otherwise everything would be the same. Hope that helps.

@@matthewbary1 thank you so much!!!

Does citric acid lowers exposure time?

That is great to know. I am sure several people using this film are making cyanotype prints with it.

It is just water

yes they are separate