Hey mate, loved the video. The content and technical knowledge is one of the best I’ve seen. I would like to see more. As a suggestion for any future videos I think a microphone would be a huge improvement to the video.
Great video, and a scientific approach, i think i just made your 100th subscriber!! :) good luck with your channel, looking forward to more videos, cheers!!
Thanks for the homework! Finally someone can clearly explain the actual science behind pressure fermenting. I am curious how far you can push the temperature and pressure used to control its effect. I am looking into whether I should be investing in temperature control or pressure systems when I ferment at room temperature which in Texas during the summer is easily above the "ideal" temperatures the yeast packets ask for :) The answer is probably a degree of both but I tend to lean towards the pressure control system.
superb. Loved the video and the Analysis. A yeast we are using a lot at the moment is London Ale III - and have great success with it both ambient and pressure fermenting. We use it across both West Coast IPA's and East coast IPAs and English Ales. Would be superb to see the similar experiment done for that yeast - if you are still looking for suggestions.
Hi did you consider that pressure fermentation carbonates the beer and changes the SG of the beer so it can give false readings with the tilt. Did you do a SG with a hydrometer at the end ??
Hello. Excellent video! I was wondering if there is some proper ratio between temperature and pressure? For example if yeast temperature range is 18-22 C and i want to start the fermentation at 22 C and put 5 psi pressure will it be enough to keep esters on the same low level as if i put 15 psi? It is said that pressure over 15 psi inhibit yeast growth. On the other hand the home brewer from Sweden (dr Hans) has some other methods with good results in the end. He starts fermentation at the highest temperature point dedicated to particular yeast strain and ramp it up in the last phase of fermentation about 3 deg. He calculates pressure using carbonation calculator. If he for example want to ferment IPA the right carbonation is about 2.4 vol. and if the fermenting process ends at 25 C he adjust the spunding valve about 30 psi. He keeps the pressure from the start until the end of fermentation (only ramp up the temperature in the last phase). He claims he never had a problem with yeast growth (he pitches the the same amount as for kinetic fermentation according to the yeast instructions). He also claims that he get some ester from the yeast and Hefeweizen does its banana flavor. Very interesting method but I never test it so far but I think it is wort to try it and make a split batch. I am wondering what is your opinion. Best regards
Hey Mikolaj, Great piece of information and its always interesting to see other fellow brewers take on a topic. The method used by Dr Hans to set pressure level based on desired Volume of CO2 seems clever and should work well for its intended purpose. I just provided my view (and explanation behind it) on fermenting at extremely high pressures and temperatures, in response to another comment on this video if you want to read in detail but the short answer to the question of fermenting at 30psi is that it is highly strain dependent. Yeast labs usually propagate their yeast at temperatures exceeding the temp range they suggest for 'ideal' fermentation. This allows the yeast cells to not just multiply quicker but also develop thicker cell walls and ability to withstand higher stress than what it usually is intended to experience during fermentation. Fermenting at high pressures and temps. will no doubt have an affect on on the vitality and viability of the yeast cells. How much a cell gets affected will depend on the strain of the yeast and the conditions it was propagated at. It will make for an interesting experiment to check the pressure limits of various brewing strains and see what the failing point is for each. Measuring the viability of the yeast after every repitch under higher pressures will also provide more insight and quantify the 'damage' to the yeast. For ester production under pressure for beers where esters are desired (Hefeweizens etc.), Esters will certainly still be produced (because the yeast strains for such beers are more expressive for esters) but not as much if you were to ferment at same temp. as pressure ferment but without the pressure. Your question regarding the ratio of Pressure to Temp. is an interesting one and something I have attempted to find in research literature myself but the explanation gets very complicated as the dependency is not linear. Many additional forces come into play such as transport phenomena, genetic make up of a strain, nutrient quality of the wort, pH, oxygen etc. If you wish to ferment at 22C and apply 5psi pressure, I would expect higher ester production than the usual 15psi condition as the pressure applied is not enough to counteract the increase in temperature. The higher the temp you wish to ferment at, the higher the pressure will need to be to counteract that change. The boundary limit being the highest temp stated on the pack for your yeast (or maybe a bit more than that, up until you start noticing yeast damage). Hope this answers your question :) Cheers, Shiv!
@@thezythologist9032 Hello. Thank you for your reply. I really appreciate it. Can’t wait for next videos on your UA-cam channel. Excellent job ! Cheers
I'd be interested to see the result using the same process but pressure fermenting using the upper end of the temperature range for the US-05 recommendation of 26degrees compared to the 18degrees ambient. Excellent video!
What about sulphur compounds? I would imagine they would have a tougher time escaping during a pressurized fermentation, and more would stay in solution. But maybe the warmer fermentation helps evolve them faster as well.
The reduced lag time confuses me a bit. I would not expect that given the beers were at the same temperature. Any ideas on that? I thought that "faster" fermentation with pressure mostly came from the freedom to ferment warmer. The lab analysis is a useful part of this. What lab did you use and what did it cost?
this is awesome. Thank you for this and whatever comes next. I have a request and a suggestion. first the request. when watching the swedish drhans, an urge to experiment comes along, and what he does is ferment at even higher temp's, and psi's above the 30's. would you do a test to see the effects that has? now the suggestion. The human is an unpatient kind of being. When you show the spreadsheet in full from the start, people will read it and move on alot quicker than you do, so maybe break it up and present it evolving line by line, perhaps in powerpoint. or something else where you can break it up and keep the suspense up for longer. just my 2 cents. now i'll go subscribe and wait with longing for more :-)
G'day Hen! Thank you for watching this video and sharing your thoughts. I have personally never fermented at that high of a pressure for any yeast and that high of a temperature for a non kviek yeast. Just based on background knowledge I would hypothesise one would not gain any more increase in fermentation speed which is restricted by expression of certain genes in the yeast. As we saw, the esters are also already reduced to negligible amounts even under 15psi. Applying external pressure also 'stresses' the yeast cells leading to rupture of cell walls and overloading of its glucose and nutrient reserves. The higher the pressure or stress, the higher will be the damage to yeast health and lower the vitality and viability. I am yet to quantify the reduction in vitality after fermenting at 15psi but I wonder how much it will decrease after fermenting at 30psi. Having said all of the above, this is still a hypotheses as it will highly depend on the strain of yeast used and its biochemical properties. You have certainly fed my curiosity and I will be experimenting with this in the near future. I always appreciate feedback (especially with things I am new to) and totally agree with your suggestion. I will be taking your feedback to improve my future videos :) Thanks again for both, the request and the feedback! Cheers, Shiv
Great video! It seems that pressure fermentation can help produce cleaner tasting beer while cutting down on time. What about if esters are actually needed like in Weiss with banana flavour? Would esters still be produced at higher temperature range of the yeast? Would be interesting to know.
Hey Roman, Interesting question! While ester production can be altered using physical parameters such as Temp and Pressure, it still predominantly relies on the biochemical make up of the yeast strain used. Since Weiss and similar beer styles use yeast that has more expressive ester production, the total ester content will most likely still be higher in a beer fermented under pressure with Weiss yeast compared to a beer fermented under pressure using us-05 (for instance). However the esters will be highest in a beer fermented with Weiss yeast under no external pressure. If you want to promote ester production while gaining the benefit of faster fermentation; Ferment under pressure--> Faster Fermentation and Ferment at high end of temp range--> Max esters possible while still fermenting faster. If you still find the esters to be lacking, you will have to ferment without pressure and ferment slower as a trade off for more esters. Hope this helps! Cheers, Shiv
I've been doing pressurized fermentation for 12 years. only lagers, usually w34 / 70. I would love to see a more scientific analysis of an experiment with this yeast.
Cheers Rob! I have a long list of yeast strains I want to test under pressure and lager yeast is at the top end of the list at the moment. Will keep you posted through another video or blogs on my website (Coming soon!). Thanks for watching!
Hi Shiv, great videos and looking forward to more brewing science! Would it be OK to quote and credit your lab results in a presentation about pressure fermenting I'm doing in a couple of weeks? It's for our homebrew group, London Amateur Brewers, for our UA-cam channel.
Thanks for your video. Just wanted to mention your audio levels are quite low which makes it difficult to watch/listen to your work. Using an external mic that can get close to you instead of just the mic on the camera is the best way as well as setting levels in camera and/or in your video editor.
@@shorza1 Haha my brewery cat (Pils) might just take control of the channel soon, considering she has video bombed 2 of my 3 videos already! Thanks for watching :)
This is probably the best write up and research I have seen on pressure fermentation. I have you do more studies and post the results.
Just came from part 1. Amazing content. Looking forward to results. Already subscribed after part 1 alone. This needs a much bigger audience.
Thanks for being so freaking smart! Best video on pressure fermentation.
Great new channel, definite must for spreadsheet geeks!
I love to meet a fellow data nerd ;)
Love the scientific analysis and all the work that went into it. Keep it up mate, great videos! 🍻
Hey mate, loved the video. The content and technical knowledge is one of the best I’ve seen.
I would like to see more.
As a suggestion for any future videos I think a microphone would be a huge improvement to the video.
Great video, and a scientific approach, i think i just made your 100th subscriber!! :) good luck with your channel, looking forward to more videos, cheers!!
Woohoo! Thanks for the support. Hopefully more and more brewers discover the channel soon and join the journey of scientific discovery in brewing :)
Thanks for the homework! Finally someone can clearly explain the actual science behind pressure fermenting. I am curious how far you can push the temperature and pressure used to control its effect. I am looking into whether I should be investing in temperature control or pressure systems when I ferment at room temperature which in Texas during the summer is easily above the "ideal" temperatures the yeast packets ask for :) The answer is probably a degree of both but I tend to lean towards the pressure control system.
Excellent videos on pressure fermentation with very interesting results. Thanks!
superb. Loved the video and the Analysis. A yeast we are using a lot at the moment is London Ale III - and have great success with it both ambient and pressure fermenting. We use it across both West Coast IPA's and East coast IPAs and English Ales. Would be superb to see the similar experiment done for that yeast - if you are still looking for suggestions.
Good work, honest work
Marvelous, thanks for your research
This video is Gold
Nice content, and my humble suggestion is to get a mic. I can't hear you clearly ^^
Seconded; the audio is quite muffled. Also, subscribed. 😉
@@MrJest2 Thirded
Great video, would like to see the differences between the two in regards to a lager. Cheers!
This is pure gold!
Hi did you consider that pressure fermentation carbonates the beer and changes the SG of the beer so it can give false readings with the tilt.
Did you do a SG with a hydrometer at the end ??
Hello. Excellent video! I was wondering if there is some proper ratio between temperature and pressure? For example if yeast temperature range is 18-22 C and i want to start the fermentation at 22 C and put 5 psi pressure will it be enough to keep esters on the same low level as if i put 15 psi? It is said that pressure over 15 psi inhibit yeast growth. On the other hand the home brewer from Sweden (dr Hans) has some other methods with good results in the end. He starts fermentation at the highest temperature point dedicated to particular yeast strain and ramp it up in the last phase of fermentation about 3 deg. He calculates pressure using carbonation calculator. If he for example want to ferment IPA the right carbonation is about 2.4 vol. and if the fermenting process ends at 25 C he adjust the spunding valve about 30 psi. He keeps the pressure from the start until the end of fermentation (only ramp up the temperature in the last phase). He claims he never had a problem with yeast growth (he pitches the the same amount as for kinetic fermentation according to the yeast instructions). He also claims that he get some ester from the yeast and Hefeweizen does its banana flavor. Very interesting method but I never test it so far but I think it is wort to try it and make a split batch. I am wondering what is your opinion. Best regards
Hey Mikolaj,
Great piece of information and its always interesting to see other fellow brewers take on a topic. The method used by Dr Hans to set pressure level based on desired Volume of CO2 seems clever and should work well for its intended purpose.
I just provided my view (and explanation behind it) on fermenting at extremely high pressures and temperatures, in response to another comment on this video if you want to read in detail but the short answer to the question of fermenting at 30psi is that it is highly strain dependent. Yeast labs usually propagate their yeast at temperatures exceeding the temp range they suggest for 'ideal' fermentation. This allows the yeast cells to not just multiply quicker but also develop thicker cell walls and ability to withstand higher stress than what it usually is intended to experience during fermentation. Fermenting at high pressures and temps. will no doubt have an affect on on the vitality and viability of the yeast cells. How much a cell gets affected will depend on the strain of the yeast and the conditions it was propagated at. It will make for an interesting experiment to check the pressure limits of various brewing strains and see what the failing point is for each. Measuring the viability of the yeast after every repitch under higher pressures will also provide more insight and quantify the 'damage' to the yeast.
For ester production under pressure for beers where esters are desired (Hefeweizens etc.), Esters will certainly still be produced (because the yeast strains for such beers are more expressive for esters) but not as much if you were to ferment at same temp. as pressure ferment but without the pressure.
Your question regarding the ratio of Pressure to Temp. is an interesting one and something I have attempted to find in research literature myself but the explanation gets very complicated as the dependency is not linear. Many additional forces come into play such as transport phenomena, genetic make up of a strain, nutrient quality of the wort, pH, oxygen etc. If you wish to ferment at 22C and apply 5psi pressure, I would expect higher ester production than the usual 15psi condition as the pressure applied is not enough to counteract the increase in temperature. The higher the temp you wish to ferment at, the higher the pressure will need to be to counteract that change. The boundary limit being the highest temp stated on the pack for your yeast (or maybe a bit more than that, up until you start noticing yeast damage).
Hope this answers your question :)
Cheers,
Shiv!
@@thezythologist9032 Hello. Thank you for your reply. I really appreciate it. Can’t wait for next videos on your UA-cam channel. Excellent job ! Cheers
I'd be interested to see the result using the same process but pressure fermenting using the upper end of the temperature range for the US-05 recommendation of 26degrees compared to the 18degrees ambient. Excellent video!
What about sulphur compounds? I would imagine they would have a tougher time escaping during a pressurized fermentation, and more would stay in solution. But maybe the warmer fermentation helps evolve them faster as well.
The reduced lag time confuses me a bit. I would not expect that given the beers were at the same temperature. Any ideas on that? I thought that "faster" fermentation with pressure mostly came from the freedom to ferment warmer. The lab analysis is a useful part of this. What lab did you use and what did it cost?
this is awesome. Thank you for this and whatever comes next.
I have a request and a suggestion.
first the request. when watching the swedish drhans, an urge to experiment comes along, and what he does is ferment at even higher temp's, and psi's above the 30's. would you do a test to see the effects that has?
now the suggestion. The human is an unpatient kind of being. When you show the spreadsheet in full from the start, people will read it and move on alot quicker than you do, so maybe break it up and present it evolving line by line, perhaps in powerpoint. or something else where you can break it up and keep the suspense up for longer.
just my 2 cents. now i'll go subscribe and wait with longing for more :-)
G'day Hen!
Thank you for watching this video and sharing your thoughts.
I have personally never fermented at that high of a pressure for any yeast and that high of a temperature for a non kviek yeast. Just based on background knowledge I would hypothesise one would not gain any more increase in fermentation speed which is restricted by expression of certain genes in the yeast. As we saw, the esters are also already reduced to negligible amounts even under 15psi. Applying external pressure also 'stresses' the yeast cells leading to rupture of cell walls and overloading of its glucose and nutrient reserves. The higher the pressure or stress, the higher will be the damage to yeast health and lower the vitality and viability. I am yet to quantify the reduction in vitality after fermenting at 15psi but I wonder how much it will decrease after fermenting at 30psi.
Having said all of the above, this is still a hypotheses as it will highly depend on the strain of yeast used and its biochemical properties. You have certainly fed my curiosity and I will be experimenting with this in the near future.
I always appreciate feedback (especially with things I am new to) and totally agree with your suggestion. I will be taking your feedback to improve my future videos :)
Thanks again for both, the request and the feedback!
Cheers,
Shiv
Great video! It seems that pressure fermentation can help produce cleaner tasting beer while cutting down on time. What about if esters are actually needed like in Weiss with banana flavour? Would esters still be produced at higher temperature range of the yeast? Would be interesting to know.
Hey Roman,
Interesting question! While ester production can be altered using physical parameters such as Temp and Pressure, it still predominantly relies on the biochemical make up of the yeast strain used. Since Weiss and similar beer styles use yeast that has more expressive ester production, the total ester content will most likely still be higher in a beer fermented under pressure with Weiss yeast compared to a beer fermented under pressure using us-05 (for instance). However the esters will be highest in a beer fermented with Weiss yeast under no external pressure.
If you want to promote ester production while gaining the benefit of faster fermentation;
Ferment under pressure--> Faster Fermentation
and
Ferment at high end of temp range--> Max esters possible while still fermenting faster.
If you still find the esters to be lacking, you will have to ferment without pressure and ferment slower as a trade off for more esters.
Hope this helps!
Cheers,
Shiv
Really enjoyed this. Really good to learn 😂👍
I've been doing pressurized fermentation for 12 years. only lagers, usually w34 / 70. I would love to see a more scientific analysis of an experiment with this yeast.
So the spunding valve is Mount from the start to the end of the fermentation? Not just before some points from the fg? Right?
Great video
Great video. Would love to see the same experiment on a lager. Perhaps 34/70 yeast both at 14 degrees one under pressure one standard non pressure.
Cheers Rob! I have a long list of yeast strains I want to test under pressure and lager yeast is at the top end of the list at the moment. Will keep you posted through another video or blogs on my website (Coming soon!). Thanks for watching!
Superb video
Great video!
Great video👍👍
Hi Shiv, great videos and looking forward to more brewing science! Would it be OK to quote and credit your lab results in a presentation about pressure fermenting I'm doing in a couple of weeks? It's for our homebrew group, London Amateur Brewers, for our UA-cam channel.
Thanks for your video. Just wanted to mention your audio levels are quite low which makes it difficult to watch/listen to your work. Using an external mic that can get close to you instead of just the mic on the camera is the best way as well as setting levels in camera and/or in your video editor.
Making a good beer is lots of works not sitting down and talking.
I wish the guy would stop talking throughout this cat video. 😆
Thanks for taking the time to do this experiment
@@shorza1 Haha my brewery cat (Pils) might just take control of the channel soon, considering she has video bombed 2 of my 3 videos already! Thanks for watching :)