Xenosaga Episode I Analysis (Ep.3): Fighting Gnosis (ft. TJTheEmperor) | State Of The Arc Podcast
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- Опубліковано 15 вер 2024
- In this episode of our Xenosaga podcast, we get to fight some gnosis. The trouble with fighting gnosis, is that it's futile, as you're fighting against knowledge itself, which seeks you out from all corners... other than that, we get to see some flashbacks and dreams. Join us as we analyze!
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• Xenosaga Episode I: A ...
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About the Hilbert Effect:
While this is all sudo-science and theoretical mathematics are thrown together with real life physics (or rather fantasy-world physics, because it's an RPG), it is possible to explain exactly what the Hilbert Effect in Xenosaga does based on the name.
In mathematics, the Hilbert space is a model that sets a number of rules and normalizes the relationship between real numbers and complex numbers. It is named after David Hilbert, who you mentioned in the last episode already. He is pretty much responsible for a lot of the modern mathematics and complex numbers were just one of these many fields.
Complex numbers have a real part and an imaginary part, so they are 2-dimensional compared to our normal 1-dimensional real numbers. Normally you couldn't do operations between them, but thanks to the Hilbert space which establishes a common rule set between them, it is possible to do operations between them.
And this is what the Hilbert Effect does in Xenosaga as well. People and Gnosis both live in the same space or domain. They don't come from another plane of reality or something like that (like the Wave existence in Xenogears for example). They live in the same domain as us. However, they live in imaginary space, while we live in real space. And because of this higher dimension, they can interact with us, like you could perceive a 2D image from 3D space. But we can't interact with them. The Hilbert Effect creates a limited Hilbert space, which establishes shared rules between us and the Gnosis, so even if we still exist in different dimensions in this space, we can now affect them normally.
I loved these nerdy kinds of terms in Xenosaga. It is very high fiction, but there is still a good amount of thought put into naming them or how people in a universe where these things exist, would use them.
Another great example is the DSSS. The Double-slit sensory system. With a double-slit experiment you can perceive effects of quantum physics, which is something that normally only happens in nano-space. It's too tiny to "see" quantum physics. But the double-slit experiment shows effects of quantum physics in our real world. Just like a DSSS in Xenosaga can scan for Gnosis.
Thank you so much for writing that out. It was a great and interesting read, and reminds me of another reason these videos are so great. They try very hard to understand as much as they can, but even when they miss something or gloss over too quickly a cool comment like yours eventually picks up the slack.
@@maskedbadass6802 And I thank you for going out of your way writing your appreciation. :)
I like writing about these things, but it sometimes feels like no one is actually reading that.
I feel like using the 2D & 3D example works really well to explain why creatures can interact with our world but we canot interact with theirs. A childrens math book I read used such an example. Say, we live in a 2D world/plane, so there's an x and a y axis. Everything we see and all the movement we make is along these two axes. A creature from 3D space would have an additional z axis. Unless they enter the same xy plane as us, we can't even perceive them. That creature could move objects on our plane around by only intersecting with our plane at the same position as the object it's pushing. Kind of like drawing on paper (a 2D world) with a pen (a 3D "creature").
God I love it when games prompt me to do some outside research on these kinds of topics
One important thing that's easy to gloss over: when Shion is talking to one of the realians in the bay, the "symptoms" he describes are clearly infatuation for another realian. Shion completely fails to pick up on this and suggests it might be a bug in his OS. This is one of the things that clearly marks Shion as clueless when it comes to human relationships very early on.
If you keep talking to that Realian, Shion comes to the realization they’ve got a crush on Allen.
@@XenithflareGaming I thought that was the technician standing next to them speaking in thought bubbles while eavesdropping on them.
Shion actually says in quotation marks I get it, you have a crush on Allen
+ dknight2175
Absolutely not Shion. If you pay attention to the technician’s character model, it clearly is the technician and not Shion saying that the Realian must be in love with Allen. The technician even asks herself if Shion must be super dense for not realizing the Realian has feelings for Allen but Shion just continues to be oblivious to the fact.
+Alan_Chapman
You are correct. You can tell who is speaking by the character models and it is clearly the technician’s character model picking up on the fact that the Realian has the hots for Allen whereas Shion is completely oblivious and theorizes there is some sort of illness.
There are many artful, meaningful camera shots in this game. If you look at the camera shots of Shion's later flashbacks to Kevin, you'll notice how the camera emphasizes how she feels about him before their relationship begins. Also, there's one of the all-time great smash cuts later when Junior says to Shion: "You're the head of Vector research for a reason, right?" The smash cut by itself tells us that this statement is loaded with meaning that we can't see just yet. But if I had to guess why the camera cuts are so slow, I'd say that the relatively young, inexperienced Monolithsoft team couldn't load assets from memory quickly enough to have fast camera work. Asset optimization is a HUGE part of game development, and with any new engine or platform, you're going to have to spend a lot of time learning the (frequently arcane) tricks for optimizing and loading your assets. The reason I think this is that most of the really slow stuff comes as dead air at the end of shots. I think Takahashi wanted to cut sooner, but simply couldn't because the graphics engine couldn't load the next shot that fast.
I didn't think of that. Always great to read your comments and insights on these podcast episodes!
Timestamps:
1. *Intro* (0:00:00)
2. *Reporting to the bridge* (0:00:24)
> Lieutenant Vanderkam commits assault (0:01:12)
> Introduction to Kevin (0:03:34)
> Shion has 'contact' with the Zohar (0:07:50)
> The first use of the term 'Gnosis' (0:15:06)
> The Realian infirmary (0:18:12)
> Lieutenant Virgil, DME addiction and Realians (0:24:52)
> Reporting to the Commander and Cherenkov's secret meeting (0:38:12)
> Shion goes to sleep. KOS-MOS awakens (0:44:27)
3. *Gnosis attack* (0:49:11)
> Flashback to the KOS-MOS incident two years ago (0:49:45)
> Discussing the camera work (0:51:10)
> The awakening of KOS-MOS (0:55:38)
> Sneaking past the Gnosis (0:56:53)
> Gunshots all miraculously miss Shion (0:58:25)
> Re-examining the term 'Gnosis' and the Book of Enoch (1:00:34)
> Cherenkov tries to send the Zohar Emulator to hyperspace (1:03:23)
> Lieutenant Virgil exploits Realian protocol to use them as explosives (1:04:47)
> KOS-MOS 'kills' Lieutenant Virgil. Zohar Emulator is taken by the Gnosis (1:06:44)
> TJ's note (1:09:30)
> Casen's notes (1:12:03)
> The mysteries introduced during this play session (1:21:15)
4. *Outro* (1:22:37)
I love that you guys are doing Xenosaga. A real gem of a series from PS2 era, at least the first one.
All three are, IMO.
Before Episode 1 released there were leaks about episodes 1 and 2. Probably based on the original outline for Episode 2 before it was changed. Some of your speculations are way closer to those leaks than the direction the rewritten Episode 2 took. So you are probably picking up on the set up for the original plans
It would be amazing if you ever featured on one of these episodes. You're knowledge is insane regarding anything Xeno.
Where would one find these leaks?
@@harishramachandra1746 He made a video about them called 'Xenosaga's Original Story?' ua-cam.com/video/3eq6PfzVT4M/v-deo.html where he linked them in the description and talks about them in the video itself.
@@jet_j9964 thank you
The thing that has stuck with me the most from this game when I played it way back when was this Gnosis attack sequence. I remember it being the first game where my mind actually became cognizant of the blood and violence that was occurring on screen. The juxtaposition of these futuristic, clean corridors I had spent the past hour or two exploring with gunshot holes and blood puddles really struck me way back when.
Shion casually watching Vanderkam beat the snot out of those guys had me like "oh i see, its a Shulk watching Vangarre beat the snot out of his subordinates moment" lol
Thank you guys for existing. I found you a week ago and just finished xenogears 21 episodes and am enjoying these and metal gear as well. You set out to attack all the subject matter with the grace and deep dissection that the stories deserved. Excellent work fellas. No one better
These guys are amazing! Enjoy their content!
Xenogears was good. That got me into them. Then they did FF X and MGS among others, those were good too 👍 .
"How many mysteries have been setup so far?"
Way more than will be answered in this game.
I absolutely love that Gnosis attack sequence, not least because of the music.
TJ is like that guest party member who joins you during an entire section of an RPG. I'm pumped for this new episode!
Sephiroth in Clouds flashback 😂👌
This is the first time I'm playing the game you're podcasting about. I'm ay ahead of you guys, but man, I have to say, it's incredible how a game can live up to 20+ years of expectations. I always wanted to play Xenosaga (mainly because of KOS-MOS) since I was a teenager.
Good luck with 2 friend, 3 is worth it, check out the wiki on 1+2 so you can learn the differences between the ds version and the ps2 versions since it was never translated.
51:30 Do you know what the Gnosis remind me of? The Specter enemies in Final Fantasy Spirits Within.
The great thing about Xenosaga is that it throws up a great amount, maybe even an overwhelming amount of mysteries, which are each very interesting in their own right. And when they are cleared up eventually, almost all of them actually have a great emotional impact.
I really can't wait for the next episode! This is always something I look forward to each week, now. :D
The early dialogue about the Realians reminds me of the Replicants from Blade Runner and Roy Batty’s rebellion.
I would safely assume that's where they take inspiration from and also Ghost in the Shell.
Kos-mos appearance to save Shion is one of my favourite scenes of thos old games. And after that how her character is developed is amazing!!
Most underrated jrpg in history
desperately needs a remaster trilogy on PS5 and Switch.
I'd like to think it's more recognized now than it was in its time.
Love this series and everything you guys do.
KOS-MOS arriving to save Shion at the last second is one of my favorite moments in gaming. The fear of the Gnosis felt so real and KOS-MOS comes in acting like a big hero.
I hope I am not the only one here who thinks that the little girl, Nephilim, looks like a younger Elly from Gears.
I believe the visual reference is intentional.
someone rep[ied to me, but for some reason youtube is not letting me see it. :(
Spoilers...
Ok, I have no idea why I am not seeing any of the replies in this section. Is UA-cam Drunk? can someone tell me what is being posted?
Check out Krelian’s speech about universal creation at the end of Gears. It explains how souls of humankind can reappear outside the Xenogears universe!
Loving this series so far! I really hope you play the sequels as there’s a ton of payoff in them.
Oh cool! A breakdown of my favorite storyline, next to Xenogears.
The sequence where Shion, Virgil, and the realians shows Shion's cognitive dissonance in her life. But this scene also really hooked me to this game.
It unfolded beautifully and I really wished it would have continued.
Xenogears is much the same way, like the infamous second disc.
Great story:)
One thing I want to point out that shouldn't be a spoiler but is just an analysis; the gnosis aren't freezing people, they're turning them to salt. I could be mistaken, but that's what I always thought. That's obviously a reference to something, as I'm sure you know.
Going back to Kos-Mos and the incident 2 years ago. It’s my understanding that Shion is trying desperately to create Kos-Mos as a fully feeling being. Shion wants her creation to bridge that gap between machine and human and become more human. That’s why Shion says that she hopes Kos-Mos feels sadness one day. The machine they built so years ago had apathy instead of empathy and a cold logic.
17:23 I think this has to be one of the best ways to do a tutorial I've seen. Most tutorials are very immersion breaking whereas this is not at all....though those partition doors take a SO LONG! It's like 5 minutes after pushing the button that they close.
I absolutely love hearing both your thoughts on what could be the interpretation of a character/scene/piece from the game having never played it before. It really opens ones eyes and makes you think that each of us can view things differently depending on our own inherent knowledge, experience, and past interactions.
i don't think its a spoiler nor do i think its ever explicitly mentioned, but i believed what margolis point was, that the fact that there were people who touched the zohar and disappeared was what would attract the gnosis
about shion activating kos mos in her sleep, im not sure about it, i think it was similar to what happened in the virtual reality when kos mos encounters the gnosis boss, and you have the scene with kos mos developed new neural networks at an astonishing speed.
These games are perfect for your guys channel. It requires extensive research and deep dive analysis to really understand everything but this has been a long time coming project from you guys so I am looking forward to it.
Speaking of the cameras. It's interesting that you feel like the camera work (I guess mostly in intense action scenes?) is a downgrade from Xenogears. Because when I first played it there was nothing like this I've ever seen in a video game. Maybe we are just spoiled by the Hollywood action we get today, but if you watch Lord of the Rings today, for example, it feels much more static compared to The Hobbit, for example. And probably it feels way more static compared to what you remember it looking.
I guess we now have a lot of 3D action movies where the camera is following objects in these impossible angles in slow motion, that we kinda expect that of a game or movie, now, if the rest of the camera work in it is decent enough. But in reality, it was still a learning progress what a director can do with a completely free camera in 3D CG like that.
Xenosaga actually ruined other games for me when it comes to shot composition and camera techniques. Because here we had a game that was using techniques like Vertigo Effects and scene layouts like you would see them in actual movies shot by a camera in real life. Up to that point, cutscenes in video games didn't look like that for the most part. They were always very static, showing almost only full shots of a scene with no sense of photographic layouting in them. I remember playing Tales of Vesperia and Star Ocean 4 long after that (which both are about 7 years younger, a whole generation) and I was still drawing comparisons how bad the shots in these games look, compared to Xenosaga. And I really disliked these games just because of the amateurish way in which cutscenes were shot in them. I am still comparing modern games to Xenosaga now and feel that only now games have reached the level of Xenosaga way back then.
The thing with Shon being a little more open/expressive(?) with non-human beings might be something with how some people tend to be with pets/objects/toys. Possibly it's alluding to that kind of behaviour? idk.
BEST Podcast on YT!
I love how I have not played this game before and following along playing parts and watching each episode after it first time doing that with your podcast because I had most of the time played the games already! I am really enjoying it! the fact it is your first time too makes it even more better hearing theories.
so excited about your blind first play! XS1 has a pretty slow start, but I think the game earns its pacing in the long term. I tend to hate games that have stilted and linear openings, but in replays I've always enjoyed how juicy this introduction is when you have all the pieces. I can hear you both asking the right questions so I think the narrative is working....
Really enjoyed this podcast, thank you for making it! You guys are also hilarious, it was so much fun listening to your reactions to certain scenes xD I had a couple comments that are not spoilers that I wanted to share. It's been awhile since I've played, so I had to refresh a little from watching a couple cutscenes.
-On your point about why they are using bullets to fight the Gnosis when they are useless, it seemed to me that no one assigned on this ship really knew much about the Gnosis. It seemed like it's mostly rumors/theories to go off of. We see the captain and others being shocked on the bridge just from seeing them gate in randomly that should be "impossible." The military are setting up blockades when the Gnosis can come in from anywhere. Even Virgil seemed shocked that the Gnosis seemed so unaffected by their weapons. It's as though only those assigned in Vector (since they made the Hilbert Effect in Kosmos - and even then those working with Shion probably made it based off of those rumors/theories on how to combat something that is not in the same plane as you) and Cherenkov, were the only ones who seemed to know more about how the Gnosis really work. On that ship anyway.
And I thought about why this may be the case. It appears that almost everyone died to the Gnosis here and the only survivors were those who Kosmos saved. But before this no one had a Kosmos. So there probably weren't very many survivors, if any, to give detailed reports about how the gnosis really work. Perhaps attacks by the Gnosis aren't that often to be able to spread enough news about them, but still enough for them make anti-gnosis projects like Kosmos?
-When you brought out about how Virgil “knows” something more. I felt that it was just him saying he knew more about Realians than the Realians themselves if that makes sense lol. Virgil said I know your secret to Shion about the override system only after leaning in close to her. This indicated to me that the Realians may not know about that system. It is a secret after all. Especially because they acknowledge for themselves to have "free will," so if they did find out that they had an override system installed inside of them, that may not actually go down very well lol?
-On Casen's point about where Virgil was willing to sacrifice the Realians and Shion wasn't and how Shion didn't really have a point. I was actually wondering if the Realians were really dead? Some of them were still twitching when Virgil looked at them. So many of them could have still been alive, just injured. And if they're not fully human, which I imagine that a man-made weapon would be more robotic in some ways than human in order to be more impervious(?), then perhaps like zombies that the brain would have to be damaged for them to truly be dead? Maybe some of the Realians didn't keep fighting because they were very injured making it hard for them to move normally. And perhaps like any person when severely injured, may have chose to try and survive and self-preserve by not going past their limits to keep fighting pointlessly. But Virgil decided to override that natural human instinct to survive and forced them to move beyond their limitations like dolls and do something that they were not choosing to do in that moment, like self-sacrifice.
You asked the question what would anyone do in a situation like that, and I thought well if you're willing to sacrifice yourself that's your decision, but who are we to demand that others (human or not) sacrifice themselves for us? The Realian from earlier expressed that he was fighting of his own free will, but many of the Realians couldn't fight at that moment. Maybe some were dead or maybe they were limited in mobility and could have been saved later if someone with the knowledge on how to repair Realians came along. But that override system took their few human rights away and turned them into machines to be used and discarded.
Of course this isn't me not seeing Virgil's perspective that machines should be used as such and humans expect machines to work for them. And he quoted the Miltian Charter knowing that he had the backing of the law to do what he did. But it does make you wonder that if a robot can express emotions like humans and even communicate in an almost sentient way, though they may not be human, do they not at least deserve some respect and be allowed to have some free will? Like whether or not they want to die for you? I think about all the loveable androids from Star Wars and how the thought of some of them self-sacrificing or dying is always so emotional, even though they are only robots. So I felt Shion had a point that Realians should have been allowed a choice on how they wanted to die.
Anyways, sorry for such a long comment! Thanks again for a great podcast, this first section of Xenosaga had always been my favorite as a kid, so I was so excited to see that you guys were doing an analysis on it. Really appreciated how you guys covered FF Tactics as well! Hope to see more!
Maybe a coincidence but I wonder if the name Vanderkam is a reference to the Theologian James Vanderkam. He’s written books about gnostic texts going back to well before Xenogears. Not really significant but a fun reference if that’s true. Considering all the name checks in Xenogears to real world people I think its not too far fetched. They were just pulling names off their book shelf for reference :)
@29:46 Elmer Fudd in the house “what the fetch that’s cwazy!”
Funny thing about kosmos first priority being to protect vector employees, it's probably not the company trying to be nice, it's probably them protecting their asset as they can repair kosmos
Kevin is the man. Especially in Episode 3.
Oh, interesting, I got the impression that the scene with Keven was from the past? A flashback to before whatever happened in Miltia? KOS-MOS activating and going berserk and killing Keven? Her telling him "good morning, KOS-MOS" which she does in the future- in the opening of the game? I dunno what gave me that impression, and maybe my timeline on the KOS-MOS project is all screwed, but... 🤷♀
oh wait- during that cutscene she was in a room that had a window and it was raining outside, right? That's why I thought it was on Miltia and that it was a flashback. i dunno, i'd have to rewatch that
I'm hopeful you dive into the game's database to discuss some of the themes. Similar to FF8, there's a lot of context you can miss out on by not diving in.
Realians were basically invented as a slave class because humanity needed the labor due to it's galactic expansion. They were what was come up with after a few other ideas didn't ethically work out, which you'll come across in the next few episodes. Most of these specific themes only come up in E1 and are mostly scrapped in the last two games (poor thematic focus in E2 + a need to expedite and finish the grand story in E3).
Vanderkam! So cool to see one of the souls of humankind from Xenogears!
NO SPOILERS HERE, just comments.
Pay attention to every Gnosis boss's names. There is a trend to their names. Gives me Nier vibes with their boss names, but this is more mythological rather than Fantastical/Fairy Tail.
My issue with the "let this happen if everyone's going to die" argument is that a person who may be on death's door still shouldn't be sacrificed for a Chance to save others when they still have a Chance too. But it's a tough argument to make as it's often so nuanced and gray and in a case by case basis with often very little time in the moment. They did not know the gnosis would ignore the blown up bridge.
(Overhinting: Also that last part you guys mentioned of KOS-MOS and Margulis getting the same info that it was just an emulator at the same time hints at some setup for much later I'm astounded by.)
Yeah, you have access to the database pretty early on. I went in there and read every entry I could all at once to try and absorb all of the terms and stuff that I knew I'd need to understand well as they're used in dialogue, but primarily went in there for the DME addiction part, so I learned about all of that before ever talking to any npc who went into any detail about it.
As for Realian flesh, I think I remember it saying something like Realians can be made up of different things, some can be made of X, some can be of Y, or some could be made of a type of silicone? Id have to look at that database entry again.
Thanks for the great podcast guys! The opening hours were one of my favourite parts of Xenosaga 1. I think the developers did a really good job of introducing some fun mysteries and solid character foundations (and Xenogears allusions), as well as creating a tense and exciting sequence with the Gnosis attack. Not perfect, but definitely entertaining!
odd, can't see the comments, however another great episode. I really need to replay the next game you guy's do a analysis for. it'll be fun to experience it again.
Yeah, I had the same issue yesterday, but now I can see them all today!
It's fun hearing them speculate about things I know the answers to, haha.
New to your channel and will subscribe.
Thanks for bringing attention to this series!
Hoping to see a port someday or even the impossible with a part 4
Also, TJ Emperor does an amazing job in both his videos and yours!
I can’t wait for the next episode guys!
This is an intersting listen, epsecially from those who haven't played the series before. I will say that there are tons of subtext in the Woglinde scenes that is more apparent upon a replay.
To subtlety answer one question though, no, Shion did not activate KOS-MOS here. You'll get clues about who actually did so later on.
There's sooo much in the Database thing when you get it, I spent like half an hour reading the stuff from there when I first got it.
54:00-ish. The camera might be slowing down because we’re supposed to see it through Shion’s (gigantic) eyes. She’s shocked and when tragedies happen time seems to slow down. Maybe it’s not a mistake.
Hope things are getting better for you, Mike.
16:20 Sephiroth is only shown after 5 to 6 hours of game, basically after you exit Midgar.
I'm not sure if it's all mechs in the universe, but the mechs you have are called "AGWS" - anti-gnosis weapon system. If the mechs in the realian scene are using them, they sure suck at fighting them
You guys were confused or misremembered Kevin (good morning) scene, it was not on the ship, but 2 years ago, before KOS-MOS accident.
So : 1. Kevin is not on this ship. 2. It's Kevin's body in Shion's hands in later flashback.
That's why Kevin wasn't in the room during VR tutorial thing.
It's strange that TJ didn't point out that mistake.
I can only think he was trying to avoid spoilers, but I think he erred here. I'd definitely had said something.
So, here’s the thing - I was considering saying something about Kevin, but out of an abundance of caution for what would be considered a spoiler, I said nothing. I don’t believe Kevin’s death is explicitly referenced by a character (Allen, I think) until a bit later, so I chose to wait until then before getting into that. But you’re right - he’s not on the ship because he was a casualty of KOS-MOS going out of control two years ago.
I’m not sure it’s revealed to be 2 years ago is it?
Can't blame anyone for not spotting that this is a flashback scene because the lab in it looks very much like the lab on the Woglinde now. Which makes sense, because they need a certain layout to work on her. Maybe they both had their noses down in their note-book at that moment, but as far as I remember, the very first thing shown in that scene are the windows with trees outside. I know it is a dark scene, but I vividly remember this stucking out to me the most back then, because we were on a ship.
Speaking of dark, I hope they are either playing on an emulator or with very good SCART converters into a digital format. Because details in dark scenes get lost extremely fast in PS2 games when you are playing on a modern display and you are not using an optimal method to convert the signal.
@@TJTheEmperor I'm playing along with guys and stop where they say to stop. I know overall ideas of this 3 games and few big spoilers like this character is that and that one is this. I don't know any details other that what I learned playing along.
I think guys miss out on many details and nuances by not reading ingame Database.
Wow, i totally missed this part of details in the game, wow
Something I am surprised that they didn't mention is that the gnosis are transforming people into salt. I am not that well versed that symbolism but I believe the pillars of salt are a classical punishment that angels deliver upon the people who disobey them
One of the things that I love about this game was the slowness (don't know if thats a real word XD English is not my first language), particularly because when I played it i didn´t have acces to internet nor did I have the guide, and none of my friends even knew the game, so I had to do everything very slow so I didn´t miss anything important, I probably talked to each and every npc and look around every corner XDDD
Most people use a walkthru to find items and secrets. I use this podcast as a walkthru for the story lmao
Great but it would not hurt to add some more game footage mixed in there.
Regarding the game engine - it would most certainly be developed more and upgraded/enhanced side-by-side with the making of the sequels.
You guys are too cool.
Hm. Lots to think about, but my read on the Gnosis is not that they are "the knowing ones" (though I should look into that - unfamiliar). Instead, I understood them to be spirits of humans (or other lifeforms) who are unhappy with reality. Or reject it altogether, basically yelling at the team to stop this tomfoolery and end human society already.
Realians remind me a lot of Replicants.
At the rate we are going i hope we can get to the end of episode 3 before the year 2100
I played this years ago when it came out. I don’t think it’s as good as xenogears but it’s worth Checking out.
When you remember what happened to Virgil, but you can't spoil it.
Love your guys content but still wondering where the legend of dragoon story analysis is please make it happen and keep up the great work on xenogears version 1.7
And historically and symbolically speaking, the X is just another cross shape lol
Bridget Hoffman did a great job as KOS-MOS!
I like the Blade Runner vibes
This is making me want to just play the beginning of XS 1 again when I'm at the half way point of the game Lol.
I think KOS-MOS woke herself up for reasons that are revealed later. Either that, of the President of Vector turn on, but I don't think Shion did it.
Chad central talking about the best J-rpg's have to offer.
The only things I would add is that the first scene w/ Kevin and Shion discussing what to do when chaos wakes up is a flashback, Kevin not on the ship. Also in the second flashback when Shion is holding the dead person, that dead person is actually Kevin. I think you are supposed put that together in the moment. That is why Allen won't ask Shion out, and why they are so hesitant to turn Kos-Mos on.
Realians are not always in red, just the military ones look like that. There are many other models of Realians that have different appearances as seen in the Realian maintenance bay. If you talk to the people on the bridge they will mention another type of Realian called the 100 series observational Realians that are also in development by Vector and are supposed to be paired w/ the AGWS units. These Realians are supposed to be able to use the Hilbert Effect like KOS-MOS, but also like KOS-MOS are not yet in operation.
I also always assumed that Kos-Mos activated due to the Gnosis arriving or because the little girl in Shion's room was actually the one who activated the autoboot up protocol.
Yes
I can't figure out where to play up to for next episode? Still the first save with Ziggy-8?
That X face guy bro
The Gnosis are pretty much the same thing "in effect" (not necessarily in lore/origin) as the alien ghosts in the Final Fantasy: Spirits Within movie... just saying. Given the timing of when the movie was made, and when Xenogears was presented to Squaresoft... I don't think it has any bearing on the Gnosis of these games, at least from memory. I'll just leave that there for ya.
1:07:19 Its even more similar to what Shulk does in Future Connected where he tweaks his Monado R-EX to give it a type of Hilbert Effect ability so that they're able to attack the Fog King.
about Kevin: (SPOILEEEEEERS!!!!)
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maybe I'm confused and remembering it wrong, but Kevin is dead, wasn't the scene a flashback?. I think it was an important part of the plot that a disaster happened years ago. (I haven't played the game in a long time).
You are correct
This was a flashback to just before they were going to wake KOS-MOS for the first time 2 yrs ago on Miltia if memory serves me correctly. This is the reason she doesn't want to activate KOS-MOS and pushes her so hard in simulations in the enchephalon.
playing all 3 games or just the first one?
Hey this question is coming from someone who hasn't played "Xenosaga" but wants to: Basically I don't consider the first couple hours of an RPG spoiler territory, as its mostly exposition, and I really like watching these Podcasts and I don't wanna miss the content but I also don't have "Xenosaga" yet lol. Could anyone more familiar with "Xenosaga" tell me about how far into the game this podcast is? Like is this still basically the introductory/exposition/set up section (e.g. Lahan Village - Black Moon Forest in "Xenogears", or the whole intro Colony 9 section in "Xenoblade")?
the problem is xenosaga is a 6 part story cut down to 3 with the 2nd being something of a derail with little input from the original story writers.
in terms of episode 1 there are still several "introduction" chapters where new characters will be introduced. the next episode will still be in the intro section, depending on how much detail they go, it might be two more episodes of introduction.
as far as the series there are a large number of story lines, characters, and plot points, that will not be resolved properly until episode 3
so if you are really planning to get in to the game, you should be ready to play all 3.
@@radicalantitheist Thank you for the reply! I figured I would be something like that. I feel like much like "Gears", mysteries and world building will be introduced so well its hard to say when the into/tutorial is over and it's no longer the "intro".
There’s a lot to discuss in the first 2-3 hours of exposition. There’s not a whole lot of game at first. The gameplay picks up after the woglinde, which is mostly watching movies and cutscenes. If you watched a play through on UA-cam, you won’t miss much gameplay.
If this was Xenogears,this would be when he Gears cash at Lahan and everything goes nuts.
I would love it if they could port Xenosaga to PS4!
Whenever I hear realiens I think of the cult from the 90s
It’s been 20 years since I’ve played this, wasn’t it established right from the get go that Kevin was supposed to be dead at this point?
it's sad to see you two not believe in God after all he's done for you all good and perfect things was given to you wife kids this channel etc
yet to call him tyrannical or too dislike him or not believe it's sad yet despite this he still good to you but patience has a limt
i hope you go to God and find him in this life i like your channel and hope you become saved with love
Do all the references in this actually pay off with some depth or is it like Evangelion where they just use names to sound deep
Unlike TJ, I really enjoyed the design change and new voice actress for Shion in Episode 2. Shion looks way too Chibi in Episode 1 and there's something way too cutesy about her voice actress, especially with her pronunciation of 'KOS-MOS.'
Xenosaga 2 is my personal favorite of the trilogy. It’s not the best game in the world. But, I like it, because it was taking more then a few risks. It hasn’t aged well.
@@joshuahelmeke Finally some fellow Xenosaga 2 defenders. I didn't care for the XS1 character designs and found the game absolutely dull. I thought Xenosaga 2 really kicked it up. Better battle system, better cutscene presentation, more and better music.
@@El-Duderino-His-Dudeness Yeah, the battle system is brilliant, they should have kept it going for XS3 and made it more transparent/intuitive.
I love launching people into the air with KOS-MOS or Jin and then pummeling the enemy for at least four or five turns with the rest of my party.
everything about shion in 2 was worse.
2 did introduce a few gameplay aspects
that I hadn’t seen before in other rpgs. The idea of staggering and juggling was copied and I think actually kind of perfected in the much-hated FF13 series.
The gameplay of 1 suffered from the same things that most rpgs did at the time. Games were getting praise for how “big” the moves were with next gen graphics. They got drunk with the processing power of new hardware and everyone made their moves way too long and flashy; because they were finally able to. That’s cool the first time you see it, but after awhile, watching the prolonged animations becomes a chore. It’s like when lotr came out with the massive scope of their battle scenes. After that, for awhile, so many felt the need to make 2/3 of their movie about battle scenes.
KOS-MOS is in Xenoblade she is one of the summonable . . .swords? . . .characters? she can be summoned
Man I'm replaying this....lovely game trying to do it with no guides at all and I need rage breaks lol. You do zero damage and take a billion. This game is like Dark Souls level of difficulty. Either I'm dumb and I'm not seeing the obvious thing I need to do with this boss or I need to grind a bit or something I dunno.
So everybody in xenogears is basically realians 'bio-robots' built from deus. Is what I'm getting.
The only logical thing after this is a Neon Genesis Evangelion Analysis. Up vote this so they see it!
I have to disagree that One cannot act as a mediator for long. In fact I believe that's the only way you maintain the core of your humanity. We are now being encouraged to take one side strongly in all matters which is purely collectivist and dilutes our true human natures. What you will find by the end is that the character has been corrupted by ideology, Not that they become purified by it.
Bioroid = Biological Android. Example: Melphina (Outlaw Star)
Probably, when they interact with beings in the same dimensional plane. Think about what it would like require for someone to have full control of their intangibility. When would you try to attack and expand that weakness? You would pull as much of it into your dimensional frequency as possible or close to it
What i like the most here is, this game is so good that you guys are failing on your predictions. Neither Virgil eat realian flesh, or Shion activated Kos-mos. A lot of information isn't revealed until the third game.
In this section I gotta mention my first criticism to the game's phylosohical writing. Namely, the argument between Shion and Virgil about removing the emergency control protocol on the Realians. The thing is, although the concept itself is very good... It's very poorly thought out.
Basically, the whole exchange is based on Virgil essentially calling Shion a hypocrite for being all high and mighty about Realian rights, and yet doing nothing about removing that part of their programming.
Because, it turns out... Virgil is 100% wrong: Shion CAN'T take that programming out of the Realians. She just can't.
If she tried to remove that part of their programming, the only thing that would happen is that Shion would be fired on the spot, the Realian would get their programming to its original state, and nothing of value would have been gained.
And that if she did it on a SINGLE unit.
Virgil (and the game) frames the whole thing as if Shion was in some sort of privileged, almost god-like position that would allow her to change the fate of Realian-kind with a flick of her wrist. But no, Shion is just the head of a corporate project. How the hell is she supposed to be able to change the structure of her company, let alone being able to influence on laws and prejudiced that came about from freaking (SPOILER).
So yeah, great philosophical idea, but poorly thought out in the script.
Actually, I'm surprised you didn't notice that the Gnosis turn people into pillars of salt, and that Shion's MWS is the Hamsa, the hand of Fatima. MegaMan also uses the symbology of the Evil Eye, which seems to be used here in KOSMOS, and her Hilbert See No Evil Effect. And then there's the Final Fantasy Cosmos and Chaos references...
One thing about this game guys, and it should be known before you play it, is that everyone in this game is extremely unhinged.
Just like xeno gears myfavorit part is watching Cason get things so wrong but be in the right sphere, lol. I can’t wait till they get to game three.