James crumbley is not aware he has a different defense than the mom? He needed to separate himself from her immediately...his wife will take him down with her...
I think it’s really strange that the mother doesn’t cry in hearing how she let her son down by not addressing his mental health. That would really hurt most mothers to hear how they failed their children in their own words.
Seriously? What kid hasn't said these things to a parent? At some point a child will think some place is haunted, or that they think they saw a ghost. This is ridiculous!
@Detroit Free Press. I think you have (in the titles) Part 1 and Part 2 mixed up. Part 1 begins where this leaves off, and includes closing statements, the judges final ruling.
Especially considering the outcome of her neglect. She cried during her trial about another child, but her own child, knowing he is imprisoned for life, she is taking notes and not even really attending.
I had bad/inadequate parents & parenting so, most of this is familiar to me. What's sad is how society REFUSES to honestly look at parenting and deal with the ugliness that bad parenting produces. My brother did time for ARMED ROBBERY, and, thanks to therapy, I can say exactly what happened to him & why and that it all comes down to ROTTEN PARENTING. Societies need to get honest and DO SOMETHING about BAD PARENTING - which consistently turns out BAD KIDS (like my brother) who then leave home and commit all kinds of crimes - thanks to faulty/inadequate parenting! Genetics or insanity might be part the picture, but BAD parenting is usually the basic problem.
@@ryanmurphy5472 not for everything of course but a lack of love and concern in the household makes for extremely fucked up children. Jennifer Crumbley especially was a horrible mother. But her childhood may have been fucked up too. Though it could be just narcissism with her. Americas finest. And of course Jennifer Crumbley just loved Donald Trump. He attracts criminals, sociopaths, con artists & fundamentally disturbed people
I Absolutely Agree !!! He was raising himself … These parents Are responsible for this …. All of this !!! Who tells a kid …. JUST DON’T GET CAUGHT !!!! Really !!!
My parents had 4 kids, only one of us was a problem child, he got the same attention as the other 3, it isn't always bad parenting, some kids are just more problematic, and more rebel like. How kids deal with peer pressure has a lot to do with it, because kids just want acceptance from their peers. It isn't always bad parenting...in this case I think there are many reasons for what happened and yes I think that bad parenting is only one aspect of this kids problems and more so his mom's, she strikes me as a woman who cares nothing for her son except when the mood suits her. In her eyes she was the bread winner of the family and she did what she wanted. She didn't even have health insurance on her kid, just herself. She cared more about her horses medical issues than she did about her son. Dad was just trying to do his part until something better than an Uber driver came along and I'll place money that his wife made it clear that she wore the pants in that family until dad got his act together. I still think what this kid did was horribly wrong and should pay the price, but his parents should also be held accountable.
I completely agree, a child's behavior is learnt behavior wether it be good or bad.. everything is learnt from our own parents. I had a bad childhood and because of it I had to live & learn the hard way. It was because how I was raised. Luckily I am strong willed & minded, I was able to break those cycles. But this mother completely shut her son out of her life , she is detached from her child & has been for awhile. No job is more important than me being a mother. I would have left work, walked in that school give my son a hug, asked if he was okay & wouldn't have left without him. Especially if I thought he was a lil weird, a loner or possibly suicidal. The father is completely nuts himself, Ethan spent most time with him. Apples don't fall far from the tree. I believe the father probably talked about shooting a person at one point. Whether it be in the Heat of the moment pissed at a person or just saying I'll shoot somebody if they came up on my property. Putting it in Ethan's head that it's okay to shoot people who have crossed your personal line. He's never known love, they had affairs Ethan most likely knew about. He was left at home in the dust. Hallucinating with all that time by himself on his hands he became dark as he was neglected.
Not even two minutes in and she’s already embarrassing herself- Is she really in truly trying to imply that just because Jennifer didn’t use her cell phone to talk to Ethan...(ON HIS CELL PHONE), doesn’t mean they didn’t speak. As she could have used her work phone to call him ON HIS CELL PHONE??!!! Where’s the logic in this? How this woman is a lawyer is beyond me and how the prosecution can sit there straight faced, is REALLY beyond me.
I believe if parents are charged with a crime because the didn’t seek medical help for their child due to religious beliefs, then I think they can make these charges stick. Neglect comes in many ways!!
James Crumbley looks like the more responsive parent. He should get his own defense because the mom seems more neglectful, and the case could be made that she is more culpable than James. The court should not have allowed the Crumbley's to share a defense. The Crumbley's were asked if they understood the ramifications of this, but it was under a highly emotional state. It just should not be allowed. Period. This is keeping things open for an appeal.
I see your point. However, one of the evidence to prove gross negligence hence foreseeable causation to involuntary manslaughter, is the fact that the dad didn't lock the gun' case. The gun was readily accessible...I think the combination was 000 or something silly like that. So I think that James crumbley is pretty liable in this sense.
@@caterinawilliams998in Michigan it isn’t a law to have your firearm locked up nor is it illegal to buy your teenager a gun and go to the shooting range either.
However, Michigan is one of a majority of states that does not have a law requiring safe storage of a gun. Only two states- Massachusetts and Oregon- have a law requiring guns be locked and safely stored when not being carried.
And this is law that goes into effect 2024 Come February, Michiganders will also be required to safely store firearms when minors are present. A person could be guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by not more than 93 days in jail, a fine of no more than $500, or both, if a minor obtains the firearm due to improper storage. Additional fines and fees are then prescribed for an adult if the minor hurt another with an unsafely stored firearm. These increase should a minor kill another with the obtained firearm. To encourage the purchase of gun safety devices, Gov. Gretchen Whitmer also signed off on two bills that amend Michigan’s sales and use tax to exempt trigger and barrel locks, safes, lock boxes and other items designated to enhance home firearm safety.
All 4 of my children take their phones to school. They aren't "allowed" to use them in class, but are permitted to have them...but in that school it was a class by class basis...I don't think that's inappropriate necessarily
I think that’s normal nowadays. They can’t use them in class but it’s a safety thing. I was in middle school when cell phones started being a thing and even then we were allowed to have our phones in class.
I agree. Honestly, I have no idea where she is trying to get with some of her "bad" questions!?!?! Her "bad" questions, in my opinion, would freak me out if she were defending me. Not that I have ever been in this or any situation requiring an attorney to defend me.
James Crumbley does not look well at all. Jennifer Crumbley looks just fine. You can see physically who’s taking the severity of this horrific situation more seriously. Mother of the Year. Not.
I agree. Based on the evidence so far, it seems like James cared more for his son and had a warmer relationship with him. James should NOT be sharing a defense with his wife. They should be tried separately. The mom seems narcissistic and cold and that will not help in James' defense. James may have received a lesser sentence as he seems somewhat more sympathetic and in touch with Ethan and at least called 911.
Oh wow!!..What a great observation- He’s also shown waaaaay more emotion than she has. I think I’ve seen her cry once and I’m certain it had nothing to do with anything/anyone else but herself.
Defense questioning style looks suspiciously like “leading the witness” tactics. Saying “correct” at the end of every sentence may make it look like a question. However up to that time the defense is declaring to the person that they think/do/don’t do, etc. a certain thing, in a certain way. Sounds leading. I’m surprised that the prosecution doesn’t object. If I was on that stand I would respectfully ask the judge to instruct the defense to avoid this. This style can also look a little like badgering/ attempting to control. A good courtroom attorney knows how to question thoughtfully and well. I fast forward through the defense questioning now. Drives me nuts!
I thought I was the only one who was bothered this!!!… I can’t STAND that!!…I never thought about it as leading though. That’s a great point. Prosecution prob isn’t objecting because they know they don’t have to- Not only is it a slam dunk case given the circumstances surrounding it. But given they have terrible defense lawyers. It’s quite possible they’re not objecting on purpose…perhaps allowing them to dig that hole a bit deeper/embarrass themselves and their clients a bit more? I’m sorry I just can’t stand these lawyers. The brunette especially. Mainly her style of questioning as you mentioned.
The parents are depraved and self-absorbed brats for not seeking treatment for their child. It will turn out is was all about money and what they didn't want to sacrifice to help their child. She wanted her horse more than she wanted her own child. Fry them. this is the perfect example of why health care should be free. This isn't the first case were someone lash out because they couldn't access healthcare.
The thing is, she could have added Ethan to her insurance. She was spending thousands of dollars on the horses including veterinary treatment, yet wasn’t taking Ethan to the doctor. She could definitely access health care!
In Norway all childrens health care is FREE. Payed through our taxes and by the state and goverment. Even dental health care for kids from newborn till 19 years old is FREE. We are lucky here. Health for grown is also covered by taxes if need hospital and only pays a small amount if I go to doctors appointment. Our health system and wellfare system is payed by our taxes and oil money funds. Many other countries too have free health care for children. USA is crazy in many ways, like their love for guns and weapon laws. Who buys their child guns? I have sons and would never buy my kids weapons at any age. Hate guns and weapons. See the results
Jennifer Crumbley Attorneys needs to go back to law school ...She has to be the worse attorney i have ever seen defend a client..She doesn't make any sense in her line of questioning..She has to go. I love to know where she graduated from..Not to mention she soo boring..
Teenagers can lie just like anyone can lie. This is why he said he decided he had suicidal ideations which the other things he was seeing had pointed to probability of causing harm. This def attorney is slow. She didn’t even let him explain how it work before she started TRYING to prove it was faulty!
The texts to the friend about having hallucinations and wanting to see a doctor are so sad. All I can wonder is what could be done to prevent this kind of thing from happening ever again? What lessons can we learn? I think we need to talk about mental illness more openly. We need to talk about signs and symptoms and behaviors of mental illness in kids and teens so young people can lean when to alert adults to a potentially sick person. And then we need to have a system in place to get these kids the help they need even when the parents are neglectful, as they most certainly were in this case. I keep asking myself what could have been done to prevent what happened and all I can see are failures to recognize how dangerously ill this young boy was months before this happened. Are there other out there like Ethan? Of course. Is there a kid talking with a friend right now, listening to a peer telling him about disturbing behavior that involved animal cruelty and signs of mental illness, like seeing demons or having a breakdown? Yes. It is likely given the rates of mental illness is skyrocketing. Maybe we need some type of mental illness recognition program in schools. Rates of mental illness is increasing and we need a way to get kids help. We can't rely on school counselors. These people are mainly in the schools to ensure kids have the credits they need to graduate. When a counselor asks if a kid is okay or needs help, the counselor isn't really trained to understand kids often lie about how things are. Also, in school counselors have too many students to give attention to a mentally ill student who needs more than a few minutes of attention. The school is just not currently equipped for the current rates of mentally ill students it has. And these rates ate climbing.
Very well said. And how desperately we need universal healthcare. This poor kid was totally reliant on his parent’s insuring him and when they chose to insure themselves but not him, he didn’t stand a chance. Even if he called 911, I don’t know how easily he could get care. Do we have state sponsored healthcare if CPS took him into foster case? I don’t think this poor kid had seen a doctor in years.
Do you see the difference in the PILES OF PAPER on the defenses table vs the states? And this "wedding hair" def lawyer still has a row of paper on the handrail to reference while talking to the the "witness"... Love that he "helps her out" with what shes trying to say... Id fire her in a second.....
Defense attorney needs to start out by saying to the counselor," thank you for your service....." She gets up there with a hand on her hip....the counselor is NOT on trial....oh, honey.
McDonald is so ridiculous using hobbies as "evidence." A mom having a healthy hobbie doesn't make her a bad mom. And is it bad to have good work ethic??? A mom is not allowed to seek success? How many hours does Karen McDonald work? Is her husband stepping in to take care of her children? Then, how is she different from any other working mom?
And I think she has five kids do you really think that she is spending all of her time with her children looks like she does self-care every time she goes and of course she has a new fresh haircut. Oh, that’s being a neglectful parent because she did something for herself give me a break just prosecutor is ridiculous.
Where was CPS, and the school nurse ? Seems like schoolshooters are outcast of society, or failed by everyone and the system. Usually these kids, like NC too have been showing troubling behaviour and mental health. Too big school is not good. Kids are not seen, or known by teachers or counslers. Friends should tell someone cause they see and know. Educate children too. About if their friends are sad and hurt they should tell grownups.
OK I think it’s weird the way the attorney, the defense attorneys talk to their clients bro like they’re too close to them ? I don’t remember any attorneys whispering to the clients like that. It just seems strange to me, but maybe I’m wrong I don’t know.
I know this comment was a month ago but I'm noticing this too especially now watching James' trial, his attorney is always grabbing and stroking his shoulder and bringing him in super close lol
This Defense Attorney. Knows the Game. For sure. So many lies from the Prosecution. Has backfired. No truth to anything they have stated has been true yet. Liking this Defense Attorney.
That isn't what they were hired to do. That is irrelevant. Their job is to keep their clients out of prison. Just because they are working for the defense, it doesn't mean they do not feel compassion for the victims. Defense attorneys are obligated to complete their job once retained, no matter how they personally feel. Only in rare cases is a defense attorney allowed to quit.
@@kam0406 They know who did it. I don't care of their defense, there are 4 innocent lives taken. I have seen many cases like this still offer the condolences to the families. That is the problem with these bone head defense attorney they lack human decency.
Correct Correct Correct... Give me a freaking break! I don't know it the crumbs paid for these lawyers.... but they got ripped off if they did... Oh my...
Even if he was sent home from school that day I dont think it would have changed anything. Only thing that could have helped maybe was if he was sent to doctors and hospital that exact same day. He had already decided to kill and had gun in his bag. He needed to be admitted to hospital for suicidal thoughs. That day. Ethan lied to the counsler about the video. Defense wants to blame the school, but E had for many years been neglected by his PARENTS in everything. Then bought a dangerous weapon for Christmas !!!!!!!!! They did not care about their son and seem uneducated, ignorant and retarded
Does not seem the parents cleaned their house either. The cops photos shows a messy and dirty house. Ethans room too. No sheets on bed and mice droppings in his drawer !!!!! I have never had dirry , messy house. Just the kids toys when they were young. Have 3 and worked full time. Cleaned our home together with my husband, clean clothes and beds. Tidy. Watched so many trials in USA these late years and almost all the photos and bodycameras in the houses shows messy and dirty houses. Dont the americans clean and tidy their homes. Or are all criminals messy ? And filthy. Those parents were never home so guess nobody cleaned . Kids with anxiety are afraid alone in the dark and see " monsters " under bed or closets. Very young, small kids are all afraid of the dark cause their fantasy is at high level. Growns dont like being in the dark alone either. For a boy being left alone in the home at night many times in that filthy house no wonder he became scared and developed anxiety. Clear child neglect in this case, and then buy a gun for him. Mental illness is no excuse for killing others. He planned it. Cruel to animals is typical for serial killers too. But this boy if he was so angry and depressed he could taken his or his parents lives, not innoncent schoolmates. Schoolshooters seems to copycat and they are evil and wants attention. They also feed their minds with hateful stuff and violance from games and videos. Over a long period of time. These parents did not know their son at all and chose to close their eyes to his calling for help and the creepy signs of danger.
Yes, yes they are. This is done all the time and is one of the routine pulls the police do when conducting an investigation. Why do you think they aren’t admissible?
Honestly I feel bad for the parents at first. It's not like they wanted their child to do this. But honestly they neglected him. I honestly feel bad for Ethan more than I do the parents. But honestly 4 young innocent lives were lost, 7 (6 kids) will never be the same again & 100's of minors "children" are traumatized! I also believe that the school staff that knew of the incident on the 29th & 30th of November should have been charged equally as the parents. Every adult that was involved School staff and parents are equally to blame! Police should have been called on Monday and Ethan should have been sent home on Monday until further notice. Tuesday would have never happened if they took action right away.
James crumbley is not aware he has a different defense than the mom? He needed to separate himself from her immediately...his wife will take him down with her...
I think it’s really strange that the mother doesn’t cry in hearing how she let her son down by not addressing his mental health. That would really hurt most mothers to hear how they failed their children in their own words.
Seriously? What kid hasn't said these things to a parent? At some point a child will think some place is haunted, or that they think they saw a ghost. This is ridiculous!
No they won’t. Ethan us a liar!
@Detroit Free Press. I think you have (in the titles) Part 1 and Part 2 mixed up. Part 1 begins where this leaves off, and includes closing statements, the judges final ruling.
How many times did the word " love" show up? Answer: zero
Exactly
NEVER !!!!!
So your saying a parent not saying I love you or using the word love is criminal?
Especially considering the outcome of her neglect. She cried during her trial about another child, but her own child, knowing he is imprisoned for life, she is taking notes and not even really attending.
These "parents" make me sick!!!
No parent is PERFECT but when you have a child they become more important than you. Or ANYONE else.
I had bad/inadequate parents & parenting so, most of this is familiar to me. What's sad is how society REFUSES to honestly look at parenting and deal with the ugliness that bad parenting produces. My brother did time for ARMED ROBBERY, and, thanks to therapy, I can say exactly what happened to him & why and that it all comes down to ROTTEN PARENTING. Societies need to get honest and DO SOMETHING about BAD PARENTING - which consistently turns out BAD KIDS (like my brother) who then leave home and commit all kinds of crimes - thanks to faulty/inadequate parenting! Genetics or insanity might be part the picture, but BAD parenting is usually the basic problem.
That’s your brother’s choice. Can’t blame the parents for everything.
@@ryanmurphy5472 not for everything of course but a lack of love and concern in the household makes for extremely fucked up children.
Jennifer Crumbley especially was a horrible mother. But her childhood may have been fucked up too. Though it could be just narcissism with her.
Americas finest. And of course Jennifer Crumbley just loved Donald Trump. He attracts criminals, sociopaths, con artists & fundamentally disturbed people
I Absolutely Agree !!! He was raising himself … These parents Are responsible for this …. All of this !!! Who tells a kid …. JUST DON’T GET CAUGHT !!!! Really !!!
My parents had 4 kids, only one of us was a problem child, he got the same attention as the other 3, it isn't always bad parenting, some kids are just more problematic, and more rebel like. How kids deal with peer pressure has a lot to do with it, because kids just want acceptance from their peers. It isn't always bad parenting...in this case I think there are many reasons for what happened and yes I think that bad parenting is only one aspect of this kids problems and more so his mom's, she strikes me as a woman who cares nothing for her son except when the mood suits her. In her eyes she was the bread winner of the family and she did what she wanted. She didn't even have health insurance on her kid, just herself. She cared more about her horses medical issues than she did about her son. Dad was just trying to do his part until something better than an Uber driver came along and I'll place money that his wife made it clear that she wore the pants in that family until dad got his act together. I still think what this kid did was horribly wrong and should pay the price, but his parents should also be held accountable.
I completely agree, a child's behavior is learnt behavior wether it be good or bad.. everything is learnt from our own parents. I had a bad childhood and because of it I had to live & learn the hard way. It was because how I was raised. Luckily I am strong willed & minded, I was able to break those cycles. But this mother completely shut her son out of her life , she is detached from her child & has been for awhile. No job is more important than me being a mother. I would have left work, walked in that school give my son a hug, asked if he was okay & wouldn't have left without him. Especially if I thought he was a lil weird, a loner or possibly suicidal. The father is completely nuts himself, Ethan spent most time with him. Apples don't fall far from the tree. I believe the father probably talked about shooting a person at one point. Whether it be in the Heat of the moment pissed at a person or just saying I'll shoot somebody if they came up on my property. Putting it in Ethan's head that it's okay to shoot people who have crossed your personal line. He's never known love, they had affairs Ethan most likely knew about. He was left at home in the dust. Hallucinating with all that time by himself on his hands he became dark as he was neglected.
What a great defense attorney just saying "correct " and fixing her hair for the cameras lol 😆
I’ve never seen an attorneys hands shake so much when defending her case. Her lack of confidence is not surprising.
Yea. I’m thinking it’s cocaine or diet pills. I don’t know how she has 4 kids and that thin
@@jennisthecoolestpersonever9098 That's interesting. What ingredient in diet pills might cause that effect?
@@lizettewanzer8650 I know it’s phen something
She also asked a lot of "Bad Questions" in her own words!! 🤷♀️🤣
@@lizettewanzer8650 ephedrine
What a shitshow, and the defense attorneys have NO defense. God bless all of the victims 🙏🏽
Not even two minutes in and she’s already embarrassing herself-
Is she really in truly trying to imply that just because Jennifer didn’t use her cell phone to talk to Ethan...(ON HIS CELL PHONE), doesn’t mean they didn’t speak. As she could have used her work phone to call him ON HIS CELL PHONE??!!!
Where’s the logic in this?
How this woman is a lawyer is beyond me and how the prosecution can sit there straight faced, is REALLY beyond me.
Thank you and this could be something that he did has a way of irritating her and she knew it.
How do you know or not know that they had conversations at home not all conversations take place over cell phones people
The guy doesn’t care for the defense attorneys and I concur
Why wasn't this child's belongings searched omg
I believe if parents are charged with a crime because the didn’t seek medical help for their child due to religious beliefs, then I think they can make these charges stick. Neglect comes in many ways!!
James Crumbley looks like the more responsive parent. He should get his own defense because the mom seems more neglectful, and the case could be made that she is more culpable than James. The court should not have allowed the Crumbley's to share a defense. The Crumbley's were asked if they understood the ramifications of this, but it was under a highly emotional state. It just should not be allowed. Period. This is keeping things open for an appeal.
I see your point. However, one of the evidence to prove gross negligence hence foreseeable causation to involuntary manslaughter, is the fact that the dad didn't lock the gun' case. The gun was readily accessible...I think the combination was 000 or something silly like that. So I think that James crumbley is pretty liable in this sense.
@@caterinawilliams998in Michigan it isn’t a law to have your firearm locked up nor is it illegal to buy your teenager a gun and go to the shooting range either.
However, Michigan is one of a majority of states that does not have a law requiring safe storage of a gun. Only two states- Massachusetts and Oregon- have a law requiring guns be locked and safely stored when not being carried.
And this is law that goes into effect 2024
Come February, Michiganders will also be required to safely store firearms when minors are present. A person could be guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by not more than 93 days in jail, a fine of no more than $500, or both, if a minor obtains the firearm due to improper storage.
Additional fines and fees are then prescribed for an adult if the minor hurt another with an unsafely stored firearm. These increase should a minor kill another with the obtained firearm.
To encourage the purchase of gun safety devices, Gov. Gretchen Whitmer also signed off on two bills that amend Michigan’s sales and use tax to exempt trigger and barrel locks, safes, lock boxes and other items designated to enhance home firearm safety.
@@tammyirwin703 and so if this is the case the defense will use this to undermine the parents ' responsibility
Crumbley - seat in jail, no change in bail ( $500K each) & going for trial.
They would be free on OR if they had not tied to run.
@@chipsdad5861 probably (Canada & back to Artist’s roots)
Why are children allowed to have PHONES in class?????
All 4 of my children take their phones to school. They aren't "allowed" to use them in class, but are permitted to have them...but in that school it was a class by class basis...I don't think that's inappropriate necessarily
I think that’s normal nowadays. They can’t use them in class but it’s a safety thing. I was in middle school when cell phones started being a thing and even then we were allowed to have our phones in class.
@@swimgirl24its only normal because we allowed it.
His mom is a piece of work wow 🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️
"I think it's a bad question, and that's my fault." Really? Then why did you ask it? 🤔
I agree. Honestly, I have no idea where she is trying to get with some of her "bad" questions!?!?! Her "bad" questions, in my opinion, would freak me out if she were defending me. Not that I have ever been in this or any situation requiring an attorney to defend me.
Defense attorney is one strange woman 😂
James Crumbley does not look well at all.
Jennifer Crumbley looks just fine.
You can see physically who’s taking the severity of this horrific situation more seriously.
Mother of the Year. Not.
I'm not the only one who noticed that. You are so right.
I agree. Based on the evidence so far, it seems like James cared more for his son and had a warmer relationship with him. James should NOT be sharing a defense with his wife. They should be tried separately. The mom seems narcissistic and cold and that will not help in James' defense. James may have received a lesser sentence as he seems somewhat more sympathetic and in touch with Ethan and at least called 911.
Oh wow!!..What a great observation-
He’s also shown waaaaay more emotion than she has. I think I’ve seen her cry once and I’m certain it had nothing to do with anything/anyone else but herself.
Her defense attorney is worried about HOW SHE LOOKS FOR THE CAMERAS INSTEAD OF DOING HER JOB 🤢🤢🤢🤢🤢
Defense questioning style looks suspiciously like “leading the witness” tactics. Saying “correct” at the end of every sentence may make it look like a question. However up to that time the defense is declaring to the person that they think/do/don’t do, etc. a certain thing, in a certain way. Sounds leading. I’m surprised that the prosecution doesn’t object. If I was on that stand I would respectfully ask the judge to instruct the defense to avoid this. This style can also look a little like badgering/ attempting to control. A good courtroom attorney knows how to question thoughtfully and well. I fast forward through the defense questioning now. Drives me nuts!
I thought I was the only one who was bothered this!!!…
I can’t STAND that!!…I never thought about it as leading though. That’s a great point.
Prosecution prob isn’t objecting because they know they don’t have to-
Not only is it a slam dunk case given the circumstances surrounding it. But given they have terrible defense lawyers.
It’s quite possible they’re not objecting on purpose…perhaps allowing them to dig that hole a bit deeper/embarrass themselves and their clients a bit more?
I’m sorry I just can’t stand these lawyers. The brunette especially. Mainly her style of questioning as you mentioned.
All the prosecutors care about is the media. Panting a dark pic.
Isn't it cross examination? You're supposed to ask leading questions on cross.
That's what you do on cross examination
Why are they shackled??
the mother's lawyer was Larry Nassar's attorney
yuck!
WOW!!! I had no idea... She doesn't seem like a very good attorney.. 🤷♀️
Well, that explains a lot...
So
The parents are depraved and self-absorbed brats for not seeking treatment for their child.
It will turn out is was all about money and what they didn't want to sacrifice to help their child.
She wanted her horse more than she wanted her own child.
Fry them.
this is the perfect example of why health care should be free.
This isn't the first case were someone lash out because they couldn't access healthcare.
The thing is, she could have added Ethan to her insurance. She was spending thousands of dollars on the horses including veterinary treatment, yet wasn’t taking Ethan to the doctor. She could definitely access health care!
@@baby5968 The horse was cared for better than her own son.
@@timmyeades7908 yes exactly! It’s very sad
self absorbed is right ....,
In Norway all childrens health care is FREE. Payed through our taxes and by the state and goverment. Even dental health care for kids from newborn till 19 years old is FREE. We are lucky here. Health for grown is also covered by taxes if need hospital and only pays a small amount if I go to doctors appointment. Our health system and wellfare system is payed by our taxes and oil money funds. Many other countries too have free health care for children. USA is crazy in many ways, like their love for guns and weapon laws. Who buys their child guns? I have sons and would never buy my kids weapons at any age. Hate guns and weapons. See the results
the way the defense lawyer words her questions "....correct?" is so annoying!
Beyond annoying! I cringe everytime
And she says "just to be clear " too
Seriously! I do not envy the jury that will have to listen to that repeatedly throughout the trial.
What about the blonde one: "Is that fair?" after nearly every question.
Lol your all sensitive
Shaking like a leaf 🍃
Just because they talk about other things doesn’t make the awful things they talk about any better
She had papers spread all over the place lol
Jennifer Crumbley Attorneys needs to go back to law school ...She has to be the worse attorney i have ever seen defend a client..She doesn't make any sense in her line of questioning..She has to go. I love to know where she graduated from..Not to mention she soo boring..
Teenagers can lie just like anyone can lie. This is why he said he decided he had suicidal ideations which the other things he was seeing had pointed to probability of causing harm. This def attorney is slow. She didn’t even let him explain how it work before she started TRYING to prove it was faulty!
The parents need to be held accountable. How could you buy him a Gun !! the Key, is the Parent buy the Gun ! How about a AK-47
Oh son, you're seeing demons? Here's a gun!!
Absolutely correct! It makes you wonder if they would have been okay with him drinking or doing other activities that he's not of age to do...
I am glad the defense has horrible attorneys. Cause they deserve to be in prison. They are just as guilty as their son.
Wow just wow
I’m amazed at how bad her lawyer is at this. Umm and licking her finger every minute
These parents are just as guilty as their son
How can the parents sit through any of this and take notes? Just disturbing
It's their asses on the line, what do you mean?
Because they’re allowed to assist in their defense it’s their constitutional right to participate
Omg these defense attorneys are horrible!
The texts to the friend about having hallucinations and wanting to see a doctor are so sad.
All I can wonder is what could be done to prevent this kind of thing from happening ever again? What lessons can we learn?
I think we need to talk about mental illness more openly. We need to talk about signs and symptoms and behaviors of mental illness in kids and teens so young people can lean when to alert adults to a potentially sick person. And then we need to have a system in place to get these kids the help they need even when the parents are neglectful, as they most certainly were in this case. I keep asking myself what could have been done to prevent what happened and all I can see are failures to recognize how dangerously ill this young boy was months before this happened. Are there other out there like Ethan? Of course. Is there a kid talking with a friend right now, listening to a peer telling him about disturbing behavior that involved animal cruelty and signs of mental illness, like seeing demons or having a breakdown? Yes. It is likely given the rates of mental illness is skyrocketing.
Maybe we need some type of mental illness recognition program in schools. Rates of mental illness is increasing and we need a way to get kids help. We can't rely on school counselors. These people are mainly in the schools to ensure kids have the credits they need to graduate. When a counselor asks if a kid is okay or needs help, the counselor isn't really trained to understand kids often lie about how things are. Also, in school counselors have too many students to give attention to a mentally ill student who needs more than a few minutes of attention. The school is just not currently equipped for the current rates of mentally ill students it has. And these rates ate climbing.
Well said. I couldn’t agree more
Very well said. And how desperately we need universal healthcare. This poor kid was totally reliant on his parent’s insuring him and when they chose to insure themselves but not him, he didn’t stand a chance. Even if he called 911, I don’t know how easily he could get care. Do we have state sponsored healthcare if CPS took him into foster case? I don’t think this poor kid had seen a doctor in years.
@@swimgirl24this is truly heartbreaking 😢
Do you see the difference in the PILES OF PAPER on the defenses table vs the states? And this "wedding hair" def lawyer still has a row of paper on the handrail to reference while talking to the the "witness"... Love that he "helps her out" with what shes trying to say... Id fire her in a second.....
James Crumbley Attorneys does alot better job then Jen Crumbley Attorneys she has no idea what she doinging
..
Defense attorney needs to start out by saying to the counselor," thank you for your service....." She gets up there with a hand on her hip....the counselor is NOT on trial....oh, honey.
Because he did speak to the Prosecutor before his Testimony today.
McDonald is so ridiculous using hobbies as "evidence." A mom having a healthy hobbie doesn't make her a bad mom. And is it bad to have good work ethic??? A mom is not allowed to seek success? How many hours does Karen McDonald work? Is her husband stepping in to take care of her children? Then, how is she different from any other working mom?
Exactly
And I think she has five kids do you really think that she is spending all of her time with her children looks like she does self-care every time she goes and of course she has a new fresh haircut. Oh, that’s being a neglectful parent because she did something for herself give me a break just prosecutor is ridiculous.
It’s Jonny’s phone. How does the detective not understand that question? Wow
Prosecutors lying typical
Where was CPS, and the school nurse ? Seems like schoolshooters are outcast of society, or failed by everyone and the system. Usually these kids, like NC too have been showing troubling behaviour and mental health. Too big school is not good. Kids are not seen, or known by teachers or counslers. Friends should tell someone cause they see and know. Educate children too. About if their friends are sad and hurt they should tell grownups.
this is part 1. it should be called No Love.
Shannon Smith is awesome!
Yikes the defense isn’t very good at this are they ?
OK I think it’s weird the way the attorney, the defense attorneys talk to their clients bro like they’re too close to them ? I don’t remember any attorneys whispering to the clients like that. It just seems strange to me, but maybe I’m wrong I don’t know.
I know this comment was a month ago but I'm noticing this too especially now watching James' trial, his attorney is always grabbing and stroking his shoulder and bringing him in super close lol
The defense for this case seems EXTREMELY unprepared and inexperienced. These people stand no chance.
Just think how much these lawyers will learn from this, they get better while the crumblys spend the rest of their lives in jail
@@justmeinhere5905 You don't spend the rest of your life in jail for manslaughter.
This Defense Attorney. Knows the Game. For sure. So many lies from the Prosecution. Has backfired. No truth to anything they have stated has been true yet. Liking this Defense Attorney.
Me too 100%
I don’t
Have these defense lawyers ever offer condolences to the victims
That isn't what they were hired to do. That is irrelevant. Their job is to keep their clients out of prison. Just because they are working for the defense, it doesn't mean they do not feel compassion for the victims. Defense attorneys are obligated to complete their job once retained, no matter how they personally feel. Only in rare cases is a defense attorney allowed to quit.
@@kam0406 They know who did it. I don't care of their defense, there are 4 innocent lives taken. I have seen many cases like this still offer the condolences to the families. That is the problem with these bone head defense
attorney they lack human decency.
That's not their job
@@jillbeck5317 You would be saying different if were your child.
@@smwoutdoorfishingadventures but it isn't proper coming from them.
Correct Correct Correct... Give me a freaking break!
I don't know it the crumbs paid for these lawyers.... but
they got ripped off if they did... Oh my...
Even if he was sent home from school that day I dont think it would have changed anything. Only thing that could have helped maybe was if he was sent to doctors and hospital that exact same day. He had already decided to kill and had gun in his bag. He needed to be admitted to hospital for suicidal thoughs. That day. Ethan lied to the counsler about the video. Defense wants to blame the school, but E had for many years been neglected by his PARENTS in everything. Then bought a dangerous weapon for Christmas !!!!!!!!! They did not care about their son and seem uneducated, ignorant and retarded
America needs to change its gun laws. How is it legal to give your CHILD a gun!!!
Hopefully they will be found guilty during a trial!
the parents are trash. thoughts for the victims and their families. The defense attorney should never get hired again my god how awful!
Does not seem the parents cleaned their house either. The cops photos shows a messy and dirty house. Ethans room too. No sheets on bed and mice droppings in his drawer !!!!! I have never had dirry , messy house. Just the kids toys when they were young. Have 3 and worked full time. Cleaned our home together with my husband, clean clothes and beds. Tidy. Watched so many trials in USA these late years and almost all the photos and bodycameras in the houses shows messy and dirty houses. Dont the americans clean and tidy their homes. Or are all criminals messy ? And filthy. Those parents were never home so guess nobody cleaned . Kids with anxiety are afraid alone in the dark and see " monsters " under bed or closets. Very young, small kids are all afraid of the dark cause their fantasy is at high level. Growns dont like being in the dark alone either. For a boy being left alone in the home at night many times in that filthy house no wonder he became scared and developed anxiety. Clear child neglect in this case, and then buy a gun for him. Mental illness is no excuse for killing others. He planned it. Cruel to animals is typical for serial killers too. But this boy if he was so angry and depressed he could taken his or his parents lives, not innoncent schoolmates. Schoolshooters seems to copycat and they are evil and wants attention. They also feed their minds with hateful stuff and violance from games and videos. Over a long period of time. These parents did not know their son at all and chose to close their eyes to his calling for help and the creepy signs of danger.
Nothing to do with law.
Her defense sucks lol 😂
By the way, text messages and voicemails are not admissible evidence in the United States of America.
Yes, yes they are. This is done all the time and is one of the routine pulls the police do when conducting an investigation. Why do you think they aren’t admissible?
I don’t know where are you. Yes they are and they have been since cell phones and texting have been available
@@tammyirwin703they shouldn't be.
@@jlorde8838 I agree because a lot of the times they are misconstrued and taken out of context, but that’s just my opinion
@@tammyirwin703 those definitely were.
Articulo...94
FREE JAMES
FREE JENNIFER
Why don't u ask to take their place
No..worque..diputado..mexico..america..jjuez
So Many Nasty comments about the Parents. Don’t judge. This could be any of our Children.
Not true.
Are you serious. These parents are negligent
Honestly I feel bad for the parents at first. It's not like they wanted their child to do this. But honestly they neglected him. I honestly feel bad for Ethan more than I do the parents. But honestly 4 young innocent lives were lost, 7 (6 kids) will never be the same again & 100's of minors "children" are traumatized! I also believe that the school staff that knew of the incident on the 29th & 30th of November should have been charged equally as the parents. Every adult that was involved School staff and parents are equally to blame! Police should have been called on Monday and Ethan should have been sent home on Monday until further notice. Tuesday would have never happened if they took action right away.
@@Xyz46786 oh yes it is true
@@Mangrovejack58 how?