Pathé Theatre Disc, 50 cm diameter, ca 1913.
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- Опубліковано 17 вер 2024
- NOTE ADDED 12th FEB 2018: For the frequency response of this record, see early78s.uk/?p... .Many of us collect ‘old78s’, and derive great satisfaction from them. Especially, ‘oddball’ types of disc are of great interest. In this video, a 20" (50cm) French Pathé ‘Theatre Disc’ from 1913 is introduced and described. The ‘usual’ 50 cm Pathés ran at 120 r.p.m. in order to be loud, for playing out of doors, or in large halls. But they also briefly produced a series of discs that ran at just 60 r.p.m. which afforded extended playing time. Such a disc is illustrated in this video.
I was blown away by just how good this old acoustical recording actually is. Incredible.
Hi There. Pathé recordings (as with some others) often sound very convincing, even when we know the frequency response was limited. It only goes to show that the 'usual' quoted parameters of audio: signal to noise ratio, frequency response, wow & flutter, distortion &c., don't always apply to early mechanical recordings. That's why they are such fun to research! Best wishes for Xmas 2019, Norman.
@@bixanorak First I want to thank you for this wonderful channel, and this particularly wonderful video. As for sound quality on pre-electric discs, many moons ago I read the comments of a certain legendary vinyl mastering engineer who pointed out that, for all their supposed technical limitations, they have the ability to reproduce timbre like no other.
@@denniseldridge2936 I wholeheartedly agree WRT timbre reproduction, it is unmatched. You can almost hear the brand names of the instruments come through...
The quality of audio is great for 1913, by the way, especially when you consider that it was recorded acoustically, without a microphone and a pre-amplifier. What a pity that Rachmaninov was not recorded by Pathe!
Wladislaw Semyonov He was recorded as late as 1942 by RCA Victor. My parents had a record.
EJP - I found those Rachmaninov recordings on Spotify recently: open.spotify.com/playlist/5S5QgEjAAQGlf5OpH4qjt2?si=EttZj77bS5qAozZTZG1nFA
wait, how do you record without a microphone??? am i retarded?
@@wigwagstudios2474Not me, but sound engineers of the beginning og the 20-th century, they recorded acoustically, without the microphone, using a special horn.
Wtf wonder how that works I guess the sound just vibrates
I almost fell off my chair when you played it, incredible! Well done.
Many thanks! Cheers, Norman.
I LOVE analogue recordings, mainly because of how honest and true they are... You got back what you put in.
Sounds very good for a record that's over 100 years old. I didn't even know such large records existed. Thanks for the video.
Records are truly the longest lasting media format ever.
Nope.... that'll be digital.
Paper!
@@SSJfraz Try playing a digital file 100 years from now. CDs from 20 years ago don't play anymore. What's more, if 1 bit in a digital file is corrupted, you can't hear anything. Even if a physical recorded disc gets scratched or broken, you can still listen to it.
Really? CDs from 20 years ago don't play any longer? My CD from 31 years ago, which plays perfectly, mustn't know it's not supposed to play any longer, al least according to you? What a load of old bollocks you do talk!!!!
@@marcse7en I agree. I hear all these horror stories of "CD Rot" I too have some CDs from the mid- 80's, they play fine. I think storage and handling errors have a lot to do with deterioration. And the quality of the molding to start with.
what an absolute mad lad, i love it!
I used to transfer old vinyl, records, cassettes, reel to reel, well, basically any kind of sound onto digital (mostly CDs), so this is absolutely fascinating to me.
Subscribed!
I still do archival work. Would Iike to try my Packburn 323 Impulse Noise Reduction unit on this disc to see what it sounds like.
Fascinating, and a really good sound quality for the time. Thanks Norman. I used to have an eleven inch 78rpm record, too. My father had several 13” ones in his collection, along with some large c. 15” Pathé ones which he played at 120 rpm, from the centre outwards. He made a record deck to play them on. If ever you find a Lemco transcription deck (I have one!), then you can set the playing speed anywhere from about 85 rpm down to about 13 rpm. This makes it easy to play 120 rpm discs at half speed, enabling better tracking on warped records, and a simple doubling of playback speed in Audacity (my favourite free, cross-platform audio editing application). The only adaptation you will need to be able to play large disks would be to remove the playing arm and stand, before using your improvised one!
I'm only a young man but that music was interesting and the way you made the record player was great, keep up the good work Norman.
The homemade record player was a very practical and creative solution! Well done!
Thank you very much, Leo! All the best. Cheers, Norman.
I just stumbled across this video. I always enjoy a pleasant presentation from a mildly mad scientist. Thank you for putting this together.
Pathe are the unsung revolutionaries of early 20th century recording technology
No doubt this will amuse the Audiophiles of this world especially that very practical job you did on making a tone arm so you could play the record. I have to say for such an old recording it sounds very good and that was certainly fascinating and I had no idea they made records this big. I have to confess I stopped buying vinyl back in the late 90's and the more compact disc format certainly freed up a lot more space for me to store my record collection. I think if they still made records this big I might need an mansion to store them :)))))) Excellent job done here Professor and very well enjoyed watching and listening.
Absolutely fascinating! Thanks, Prof.!
You're welcome. More later... Cheers, Norman.
i knew they existed i gotta get me some 60 rpm records i love this the fuzzyness is sweet too what a treasure to find thank ya m8 for showing this
Really enjoyable to listen to. I never knew such records existed. Thanks Prof!
Many thanks! Cheers, Norman.
Cher Professeur Champ, Merci beaucoup pour le disc Pathé =; il c'est terrifique est magnifique. Vos est ne pas le professeur bonqueurs, mais professeur brillant! Merci mille fois! A Bientot.
Cher ami Parlophonique:
Je vous remercie pour vos aimables paroles. Mais attention: il y a plus de choses dans le pipeline, comme jouer un 78 disque de 1929 à travers un amplificateur fabriqué uniquement à partir de lampes et de composants contemporains, y compris le haut-parleur! Meilleurs vœux, Norman.
C'est excitant. Sois toujours mon coeur! 'Ere! This ain't 'arf putting a strain on my schoolboy French! Hahahha! However, excellent news and I am looking forward to it all.
VwestLife sent me from his Victor 33&1/3rd Video which is a Part 2 to Techmoan's forgotten 1947/8 format war video. This was a very Interesting Video.
And me! This is a really good video; I must watch some more on the Norman Field channel. The lab coat is great, by the way.
Yes, very nice lab coat! Looks like it is monogrammed as well! I can’t believe I had never subscribed before today! That problem is now solved! I remember binge watching many of Dr. Fields videos. Probably watched all at that time! I distinctly remember his making of 78rpm discs and using a somewhat rare EDISON record to do so. Great stuff! Thank You Mr. Field!
Quality is better than so many records from the 1970s'!
I hit the "LIKE" button once you took a drink.
Thanks for writing. The trouble is, the videos are made scene by scene, which takes forever - quite often 6 or 8 hours, so into the evening I'm getting tired & like a drink! 8^) I should really start in the mornings. Cheers, Norman.
you know you cant drink all day unless you start in the morning!
Τhanks for the excellent video! The largest discs I knew of were the Vitaphone discs, but it's the first time I see one of the 50 cm Pathés. Great recording, too!
Glenn Johnson Absolutely love this and what a whopper of a record.Well done sir!Pure genius!!
Thanks very much! Glad you liked it & it was fun to make too. Best of luck& keep safe! Cheers,
Norman.
Still enjoying this channel very much.
What an unexpacted good Sound Quality! Sounds nearly Electric!
Plattensammler88 I agree! Certainly the enhancements helped! There is another video on UA-cam of someone playing a large center start Disc by Pathe’ of la Marseille. Also astonishing sound quality!
Fascinating! Thanks for a look at this format that was unknown to me until recently.
This is some positively fantastic archeological work on a fascinatingly bizarre disc. Great video!
Glad you liked the video. It's always interesting to 'compel' an obsolete medium to give up its secrets! The result are sometimes disappointing - but not in this case. Best wishes for Xmas 2019 and New Year 2020. Norman.
you holding the record really just shows how big they really were!
Amazing!!! Thanks for sharing! Greetings from Santiago de Chile!
Hi there, and thanks for writing. Glad you liked the video... it was a good idea from Pathé to have such discs, but they were not available for very long. ¡Mis mejores deseos para ti y tu familia en Santiago de Chile! Norman.
@@bixanorak Hi Norman!! How are you? I never realized you had replied my comment! What a nice surprise, I just saw it! Yeah! I love these Pathé records too! I've just seen two of these here in Chile. They are in the Museum of Science and Technology and it's quite impressive how big and beautiful they were... I wish I had one in my collection. Muchas gracias por tus buenos deseos! Los mejores deseos para ti también y gracias por compartir tus excelentes e interesantes videos. Saludos desde Chile 🇨🇱🇨🇱
Wow! Cool! Thanks for the demo. Very unusual format.
This video is fascinating, and I'm sending it to people who usually wouldn't watch these as I do. Nice to see someone else using Diamond Cut. The video looks like the change was 'sloped' from 78rpm to 60rpm, and I noticed in comments you double checked the speed change. Well done--quoting George Formby, "It's turned out nice again!"
Very nice of you to reply, Darren; thanks. It's great fun playing odd-ball discs, and better still when it actually works! 8^) Funny you should mention George Formby - my dad was an excellent Formby emulator, so I grew up with the Formby classics from an early age. Only last night I listened to 'Fanlight Fanny' on YT. And after having known 'Grandad's Flannelette Nightshirt' from the age of 5 or 6 (I'm 74 now), had never realised that the first 8 bars are a direct copy of 'Land of Hope and Glory'. Played it on YT a year or so ago & it finally dawned on me & was helpless with laughter for several minutes. Formby was such an optimistic, 'sunshine' bloke, wasn't he? 'Hee-hee - I'm a Dinky-Doo!' Cheers, Norman.
wonderful, i always have a pitcher of martinis ready when i play my 'Victor" discs,wonderful reproduction of this acoustical ..a pleasure to hear. Congrads ! CHEERS!
Hi Eric & thanks for writing. Glad you liked it. Got some other slightly quirky discs toput up, though not a large as 50 cm! Take care. Cheers, Norman.
Sounds amazing! :) Just a thought - why not record it at 33rpm and double the speed? Then the deterioration from the digital retiming of the waveform would be less! Also, the warp would have less affect on the needle at a lower speed i'm guessing. (I've kind of guessed this already as I'm writing, that I'm guessing your deck is very much pre a 33rpm speed!) Anyway, an immediate subscribe and follow from me x
Good idea, acoustic recordings has not much bass, so it would work perfectly
If you lived in 1913, I hope you liked marches because it was the blues of the day -- the core style from which everything else popular seemed to derive.
Mal-2 KSC Not really, ragtime was the blues of the day.
These are shellac records, yes? If so, I imagine they're substantially thicker than the common 10 or 12 inch shellac discs in order to resist breakage. They must weigh a ton.
Hi there. Yes - just weighed it; ~1.7 Kg. Say 3.75 pounds. Other, earlier 20" (50cm) Pathés were thicker so must have been heavier. Cheers, Norman.
@@bixanorak this thing could be a perfect murder weapon for some old English detective novel
Good heavens! What a great idea. Every Christmas, for the last 3 years, I have written an imitation Sherlock Holmes story, just for my family. You have just given me the core ides for the Xmas 2019 Holmes story. Many Thanks! (I'll try to remember to come back here & put in a link.) Cheers, Norman.
@@bixanorak You are welcome! But don't use one real please- for your family and for history of music xoxoxo. "Mr. X how did you kill your wife?" - "Well, I just wanted her to be in my league and tried to put some Rachmaninoff in her head!"
@@savelysavely2483 Mrs. Peacock in the conservatory with a Pathe disc...!
I met a man who was a player in the London Philharmonic. He lived in a huge house in Kensington and he showed me his collection of large records.
I vaguely remember that some were huge and its nice to see someone show these supersize records so I know I was not deluding myself.
Hi there & thanks for writing. There were several different reasons for having large size discs (not just longer playing time) but all of them had disadvantages. They were expensive; they were cumbersome, the 16" (& over) sizes needed dedicated turntables &c., &c. Perhpas the largest class of these were the 16" 'Transcriptions', mostly used in the U.S.A. for syndicating radio programmes across that vast country with 4 time zones. They were made in their drillions, but were never available to the public. But a lot of the transcription material has appeared over the last 30 years on specialised labels. Cheers, Nrman.
@@bixanorak I had thought the recoding were on 16" and 20" discs but I wasn't sure when I mention it on the Techmoan site. Thank you for confirming I am not mad.
I don't know how I ended up here, but it's a really cool video. Thank you for sharing.
Pleasing selection. Thanks for this posting.
very cool thanks for the videos I love your content I always learn something new when I tune in.
Good To hear from you again most interesting as usual Excellent Trig
I’ve been watching record videos on UA-cam since I was 11 how am I just now finding your channel
Hi Jessee & thanks for subscribing - I've subscribed to your channel too. Glad you liked the video. Best wishes from England. Norman.
Similar thing I did to recover one of mom's old 16 2/3 RPM records that she had not heard in years, used a 33RPM player to record at highest sample rate, and then resampled to half speed, and did the declick and noise reduction on it to get it back again. Then took her collection of 78RPM Polish records and did the same recording to disk, and made her a CD with them all on it. Noise reduction on the 78's was relatively easy, just low pass filtered past 10kHz, with a gentle slope, as they do not have much above that aside from track noise anyway there.
Hi there. Yes, it's great to bring stuff back to life, especially if a family member benefits. Keep up the good work - there are millions of 'old records', and most of 'em will mean something to somebody! Cheers, Norman.
Fascinating and excellent! Thank you!
Sounds awesome!
Hi George. Thanks for writing, & glad you liked the video. It certainly was a short-lived format, so good to have an example of it. Of course, it wouldn't be very difficult to contrive a 60 rpm turntable... 🤔
Wow, is it the good old Univolt turntable that made a comeback appearance? Inspiring, informative and entertaining video. I was also wondering how on earth you were going to play that gigantic disc, but you solved it well. Always a pleasure to take part of your lessons, professor Field. Cheers!
Hi Björn! Hope all going OK with you - I have watched some of your videos over the years, of course! Yes, the old Univolt, with the arm removed, was the ideal thing for a very big record. At first I couldn't find it, then thought of looking in my garden shed. There it was. How could I have left so valuable an artefact in so bad an environment??? Of course, I left it overnight in the house to warm up. But it worked as well as ever. Better still, a generous friend of mine has found another one, this one with the right pick-up arm, which he is giving to me. The arm on mine was too long. When it comes, it must certainly be given its own video! In the meantime, wishing you all the best of luck in finding more desirable records, of all formats. Cheers & thanks, Norman.
I could hear sound effects great!!!... from that record
I used to have a few 8 inch Rex discs. Also a 4 inch disc. That Pathe one is a whopper.
Love the new lab coat. Very fitting. It's like watching Arthur C. Clarke's Mysterious Universe for music with each video. I keep wondering what's going to be discovered for us to listen to next. Not to mention all the creative ways to make it possible and all the information about the discovery. Considering the cutter that you have, have you considered making a 78 rpm LP of that recording?
Glad you like the stuff. Yes, there's more to come - a home made cylinder player, and eventually a mechanical home recorder for wax discs, also home recorders on aluminium discs - they're pretty hard to make work well. Cheers & thanks, Norman.
Auf diese 50cm Pateè Platten wurde ab 1911-23 Opern Gesamtaufnahme heraus gebracht! Auf den Platten waren Seite 1. und 3. und auf der nächsten Platte Seite 2. und 4.!
Let's go back in time... amazing...I would like to hear the blue Danube orangial recording with Struss himself
I like your tie, relatively.....thanks for posting this video.
Thanks for watching - all the best & keep safe!
Awesome thank you
Thanks! Yes, it's one of those real 'extreme' disc records... Where on earth do you file it in your record collection?? 🤔 Have a good Christmas - cheers, Norman.
@@bixanorak well, I don't have a massive record collection so I'll probably not put it in any specific place, I'm just interested in old records and interesting records because I'm 13 and I have been raised listening to vinyls and CDs. I have just started collecting vinyls and I'm trying to get strange formats. I am currently after a 11"
Merry Christmas!
It’s sad that this method wasn’t standardized. I mean the pick up traveling from the center to outwards. Usually music has the best and loudest part on the end and the dynamic would be the best when the ”groove speed” is the fastest.
Interestingly, this way of recording going from the center to outwards was standardized with the technology that replaced the records, the compact disc.
@@Nolroa yeah, the LaserDisc started from the outside inwards, and its descendants in the CD and DVD families do the same.
Cool rig with the improvised tone arm. Have a large floor model Victrola from 1908 that could probably handle discs this large with a speed governor to match.
You are the best. Thanks.
Many thanks for writing, Tim. Glad you liked the video! Cheers, Norman.
Thanks for adding that note, that was exactly my question, even thru UA-cam not only the freq response but also the seeming 'fullness' of the recording is like nothing I've ever heard on a recording by any of the other 'biggies'...can this be laid to the venue acoustics in which the session was taken?! or is it simply the physical differences in the 'enregistrement' itself (groove pitch, speed, etc.) vs other companies? Wow. (and I assume they had to change sheet music VERY quietly in the one continuous take?!) Humbly I present my attempt at mimicking an acoustic recording, using what I knew from tech discussions on various 78rpm forums and listening to many era 'popular' recordings. Sort of a dual impression of Billy Murray and of Pryor's Band, recreated on a synthesizer - this is comedy band Power Salad (myself & my lyricist partner), featuring "Arthur's Prior Band" with "In My Driverless Car", hope you get a bit of a yuk, and thanks so much for the great videos (the one on the 78rpm home cut discs is an inspiration, wish I had a machine like that!) ua-cam.com/video/vfRStLsskZc/v-deo.html
Thanks professor. Cheers!
That's a pretty good band and a very nice recording. I suppose it's possible I'm used to hearing bands who were having to adjust their performance to the limitations of the media. Even at 60 rpm the bandwidth must be pretty good towards the outer edge here.
Hi there. I've added a page to one of my websites that shows the frequency response - the link is now at the top of the video description, but I think it can also go here: early78s.uk/?page_id=3923 . You'll see the added level of the upper frequencies near the edge of the disc, as we would expect, though, of course the actual bandwidth is the same. Thanks for the suggestion! Cheers, Norman.
Thanks for the link Norman. One comment is warranted about that page: Please remember that the particular notes which are played by the instruments will also produce peaks and troughs in the measured frequency response plot. So not all of them are artefacts of the recording process. Thanks again.
I think I can safely say that's the most detailed response I've had to a UA-cam comment - thanks for taking the time to do that. I suppose by bandwidth, I was meaning the capability of the medium itself; the faster the disc is moving, the broader the range of frequencies it's capable of recording accurately. I assume, looking at the oscilloscope traces, that the bandwidth in this recording was being limited by the equipment capturing and transcribing the audio. The disc must surely have been capable of storing higher frequencies; they just weren't present in the signal to be recorded. But the higher frequencies that *were* present were captured better as the "groove velocity" increased.
As very much an amateur when it comes to 78s (with no lab coat to speak of), and with regard to what you say about R.I.A.A. equalisation, I'd be interested in an overview of your set-up for capturing the audio. For example, are you using a preamplifier, or is that being done in software (and if so, how is the pickup connected to the soundcard)? That kind of thing.
Now that's a charming presentation! Or shall I say: Je suis enchanté!
One question: which is the stylus you use for Pathés? I didn't get the name right I think. Thanks so much!
Many thanks for writing - glad you liked the presentation. The cartridge & stylus used, was a Shure M44, with an elliptical stylus, of size 0.0035 inches - or, ~0.0089 mm. Fortunately, it worked OK; but the reason I used that cartridge & stylus, was because it was just lying around, spare. For lateral 78s, I use several Shure SC35 cartridges, each in its own head-shell, with different stylus sizes. I did not want to take any of these SC35s out of their headshells, so used the M44. Also, it was already wired for playing vertical cut: with the Shures (as I'm shure(!) you know) you join the two positives L & R, and take the output from LG & RG. For playing smaller vertical cut discs, I use the SC35s in stereo, and process the signal in the recording software. There is a general view that Pathé vertical cut discs *always* require a large size stylus; but I have found that this is not really the case: so the best plan to make a good transfer is to try various size styli, & find out which one sounds best. Sometimes, quite a small stylus - say 0.0028" will be the best. One can never tell; everything Pathé is usually 'A Law Unto Itself'! Hope this of of some help. Cheers, Norman.
@@bixanorak Could you make a video about how to properly wire a cartridge for playing vertical cut?
In 1904 U.S.A. Victor Talking Machine co made 14 inch records also playing at 60 r.p..m. also.
While only made for one year, Victor console machineade up to about 1924 had BOTH the turntable clearence AND variable speed regulater with 60 Marked, thoubunmarked could go that sliw.
When electric ( Orthophonic,} as ,victor called them, came on both dpeed setting and clearemcevdissppeted
The 1913 verticle dounducj better than the 1904 lateral Victors.
Thank you Professor Norman for this very interesting contribution!
Also the music is interesting, I assume the recording is mechanical which sounds very good.
I hope that you can digitize more of this kind of interesting gramophone records, and that for a very long time so that we can enjoy it.
Thanks. Yes, mechanical recording. It was played 'flat' but I put in a few +dB around 200 Hz and also around 3500 Hz. Cheers, Norman.
Oh, I did enjoy that. This video appeared in my 'recommended' selection and for once, I decided to have a look. I like your laid-back style. I also liked your laid-back stylus! But I have to ask what software you used to do the reduction. I couldn't see anything to identify it. I used to wear one of those white coats in a previous occupation. They were comfortable, but they got dirty quickly. Cheers, from one bon vivant to another.
Hi & thanks for writing. I wired the Shure M44 for mono., & the signal went through a home-assembled Rod Elliott phono preamplifier set to flat response, which is what you need for mechanical recordings - no EQ! At least, not usually to start with. * Then into an auxiliary input on an old NAD 3020A, with the PC in/out in the tape loop - the old way when there were tape recorders - remember them? For decrackling I use Izotope RX-4 which is very good at decrackling, then for general editing, pitch correction &c I always use Diamond Cut simply because I've used it for 16 or 18 years, & am very used to it. (It *does* get updated occasionally, though 8^) ) Good luck, Norman.
* see sound-au.com/project91.htm
Awesome!
Many thanks! Cheers, Norman.
Very good quality for the time. I guess the projectionests were kept busy while the musicians took a break.
Entertaining genius. thank you.
Hi Norman, most enjoyable video, thanks for posting. What make was the turntable groaning under the weight of that disc? I assume it was direct drive if you couldn't slow it down to 60rpm.
Hey, Norman! I am going to ask a silly question! But what is a "Truncated Stylus"?? Thank You so much!
Reminding me much of WFMU's _Antique Phonograph Music Program_. I'll let you look that up; it's a treat.
Oh yes - I've heard of that; must check it out. Thanks Mickey. Cheers, Norman.
Johann Strauss I would like to hear his recording of the blue Danube and Tale of Vienna Woods!!!
Thanks for writing. Alas, the original Johan Strauss II (1825-1899) did not record as far as I know. But there was also a Johann Strauss III - (1866 - 1939) who was certainly a close reative, and who made 70 or 80 Edison cylinders in Germany, around 1910 onwards. Some of them are on-line! See:
cylinders.library.ucsb.edu/search.php?nq=1&query_type=call_number&query=cylinder8624
Cheers, Norman.
Wonderful video, that record sounds really good. How much does a 20" disc weigh?
Hi there. This one weighs 1.7 Kg, around 3.75 pounds. In fact, this one is *thinner* than some I have seen. It wouldn't surprise me if the thicker type would get up to 5 or even 6 pounds! Cheers, Norman.
If the thinker ones that are 5-6 lbs are the 120 RPM ones, that must be one heck of a turntable used to spin them that fast!
i love your accent man
Thanks. I live in Birmingham, England, and there is a definite 'Brummie' accent, but of course on UA-cam I try to speak 'on my best behaviour'! 8^) Cheers, Norman.
@@bixanorak and your french is not bad at all.
Amazing,I love your pick up arm :)
Thanks for writing. Yes - it would have been better with square balsa wood but I couldn't find any lurning in the workshop! Cheers, Norman.
It would be cool if we could get record players that could play these sizes.
BAD BIKER BENNY such a tiny market, only is oddballs who love old records, and then the few who actually have larger than 12” records. Best Regards, David
Speaking of odd-sized records, I have a 5-inch record by The Misfits, and a copy of Slayer's "Repentless" album as a set of 6.66-inch 45s.
That's great, Richard; being an old stick-in-the-mud, didn't know that odd size discs were still being made! And of course, they need documenting just as much as the old ones. Keep up the good work. Cheers, Norman.
i was STUNNED when i first heard an acoustic recording, from 1903, on a Library of Congress compilation. it was two female singers. there is a purity about the sound of an acoustic recording that neither analog nor digital can capture. GREAT video, Prof, THANK YOU! btw - is this a two sided disk?
Yes, the disc is double sided. Yes - the 'spell' that an ancient recording may cast (as long as you - us - we - *believe in it*), can be extremely powerful. There are several recordings, some jazz, some classical, that when I first heard them, they were so beautiful, they made me cry - and don't mind admitting it. Music is some kind of essential thing for life, I think. Cheers, Norman.
@@bixanorak "At the temple gate" from "pearl fishers" by Caruso and Ancona makes the hairs on the back of my neck stand up, on an acoustic machine they are literally standing in your living room singing at full volume, from beyond the grave...
But thats analog
To slow your turntable down you could use a voltage variac.
Thanks for writing, & glad you liked the video. I have direct drive turntables that will go down to 16.6 rpm, but the disc won't fit on them! So I used a 1931 78 rpm turntable with it's pickup arm removed. The trouble is, it has an AC synchronous motor, based on the 50 Hz mains supply we have in Europe. So using a Variac would have reduced the voltage, but the turntable speed (dictated by the mains frequency) would have kept to 78 as best as it could - so the rotating force - the *torque* - would have been reduced because of the lower voltage. This might have been OK, except that the 'drag' on the pickup gets less as the pick-up nears the centre of the disc, so the rotation would speed up somewhat. Then, we would have to correct that in software &c. BUT - there are many applications in which voltage Variacs are, indeed, extremely useful. Wishing you all the best in these troubled times, and have a good Christmas, & above all *stay safe*! Cheers, Norman.
Being British, I wonder if that was a glass of Chateau Thames :-)
Lenco L-75 16-80 R.P.M. without steps. My opinion Pathe 20 inch plays at 125 R.P.M. Newmade players for that speed does exist, but the armlength? Play the 125 R.P.M. s at 62,5 , record them at 9,5, play at 19.
Great video 😄
Norman, you look GREAT in your crisp, white "Mad Scientist" lab coat! It lends a certain air of authority to the whole proceeding. I too have an abiding curiosity about these Pathé 50 cm discs (or "Manhole Covers" as I call them). Especially about the frequency range and signal-to-noise of the 120 RPM specimens. ARE they appreciably higher-fidelity than other acoustic records? Or is that defeated by the cylinder-dubbing process? Anyway - - good work, Professor!
Many thanks for writing. 'Manhole cover' is excellent! Are they better fidelity... fascinating point; They weren't supposed to be better, only louder... however, the groove velocity being so high at 120 rpm, one might expect the master cylinder to be transferred more faithfully? The reverse, in fact, of 'inner groove distortion' on an edge start disc. 'Outer groove enhancement'! Also, it had not crossed my mind until now, that the two separate tracks on the 60 rpm disc must have come from two large Master cylinders... dubbing the 20" discs must have been an impressive sight! All the best for now & keep safe. Cheers, Norman.
Love the labcoat! I've e-mailed you recently, never saw a reply. Hope all is well.
Sometimes you sound a lot like Michael Caine ! I am a Ham Operator ! I love all your Videos !
Many thanks. We've been messing around with FT8 lately - very interesting results in poor HF condx. 73, Norman, G4LQF.
I LOVE IT!!!
marvelous!
This may interest Techmoan
Was made to be played with a ball-sapphire, in hill and dale style? If so, did you use a normal 78 needle to play it?
Correct - originally ball sapphire. Vuideo used 0.0035" TE stylus in a Shure M44. A regular 78 stylus (.002 conical) would very likely work as well. Cheers, Norman.
there is an 11 inch record probably the only one(s) in existence made by a British band of the 80s as a novelty, I mean it's their regular album but they made it an 11 inch so that they could put on the sleeve: "world's only 11" record" or similar and I bought it just because of that, if you're interested I can dig it out and send you a photo in email
There are quite a few odd pressings, heart, star and blob shaped ones come to mind... But that would be great to preserve!
That was very interesting.
Hi there & thanks for writing. Glad you liked the video, & hope to make others that will also be interesting! Best regards, Norman.
the compact disc of the 1910s. ^_^
i found some old Pathe disk small one well im just wonder if someone could help me find something abou them or if someone knows something about them im really curios
Hi Norbert - well, all you have to do is google: 'Pathé - history' & you'll get lots of hits! But do put in the é at the end of Pathé (it's Alt+130) to maximise the number of hits. Good hunting! Cheers, Norman.
The tiny record you showed remembers the size of a CD; I have seen lots of them at an old record and music score shop in Berlin. About the largest one, it plays anticlockwise, right?
Centre-start records play clockwise. Some records were centre-start on one side and outer-start on the other :-)
Bravo pour votre français ! ;)
Norman I am interested in the concept of preparing the Sure Brothers cartridge to play a Pathe discs. Could you elaborate. Also would the same process apply to a 2 minute cylinder disc? I would like to try this!
Hi there. It's quite simple: Shures have R and RG (right and right ground of course), and L and LG. You join R and L, and take the output from RG and LG. This is in Shure's leaflet, and certainly applies to the M44 and SC35 cartridges which are the ones I use, but probably works for all Shures (and maybe Stantons &c as well.) Yes, you can play 2-min (and 4-min) cylinders with a cartridge wired like that; in fact we have made an electric cylinder player which works quite well with a Shure SC35. A elliptical stylus of .0035" suits Blue Amberols, but for Wax Amberols a conical is better, as the elliptical can act as a chisel on the softer wax! As for soft brown wax cylinders, I have no experience, so be very carefuI with those. I'll eventually make a video of the player. Also, another video of a simple dodge using a single transistor, so you can use your stereo cartridges without messing around with their leads!
How interesting
Please handle even the less valued recordings a bit more carfefully. This is enough to make any record collector grind their teeth. Please.
Don't worry; I've been handling discs & cylinders for over 70 years. Therefore, please do have a little more respect for your elders and betters, OK?
Playing a large record disc at 120 rpm , I would be standing behind a bullet proof screen just in case it might take of my head off
Thanks. Yes, you don't want to drop one on your foot! An Edison disc is bad enough... Cheers, Norman.
If you think that is dangerous, how about the Marconi-Stille magnetic tape recorders of the 30's 1/4" razor sharp steel tape running at 3 meters per second!
Definitely not be in front of that. I often wondered whether they recorded to disc or they had some kind of tape thanks.
The BBC had them installed and first used the Marconi machines in May 1935. It was not until after the war that recording studios started installing standard audio tape recorders, with Capitol records installing their first Ampex 200A in 1947.
mspysu79 - The BBC used two wire recorders until the mid-1970's. Good old Auntie Beeb; on the bleeding edge of technology, as always! ;-p
LOVE the lab coat!
I love the lab coat.
8:27 Therefore, Edison Diamond Discs were 5 mm thick
Hi Rob. Ah - well: I just measured a couple & they were 6mm - which is obviously a quarter of an inch - so it's OK really! Cheers, Norman.
@@bixanorak Well it was quarter inch. America stucks in feet, inches, miles etc.
@@bixanorak My point is, bigger records has to be thicker, not to warp
@@robfriedrich2822 Yes, agreeed: the Edison discs were thick to remain flat. Most 20 inch Pathés were thick too, but the one n this vdeo in thinner - and is rather warped! Cheers, Normn.
Rupert Bear sent me here.
PATHE ALSO MADE FILMS......SOUND IS QUITE GOOD FOR 1913......