More Realistic Color in KeyShot with ACES
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- Опубліковано 19 чер 2024
- Learn about the new ACES feature in KeyShot ver. 2023.3 or newer!
Download the free KeyShot Rendering Roadmap:
willgibbons.com/roadmap
Read more about Linear and Gamma:
www.willgibbons.com/linear-wo...
Level up your KeyShot skills with the Rendering Masterclass:
courses.willgibbons.com/keysh...
EXR-IO Plugin:
www.exr-io.com/
DJV Viewer:
darbyjohnston.github.io/DJV/
Timestamps:
0:00 - Introduction
0:30 - What is ACES?
0:41 - Basic color science
1:03 - What is a color space?
1:41 - What is a color space transform?
2:34 - Benefits of color management
3:07 - Why use ACES?
5:26 - Best file formats for post production
6:25 - Best file formats for different software
7:02 - Free plugins for EXR files
7:23 - ACES best practices
Super important topic. Thank you very much!
My pleasure! Thank you.
Learned a ton from this! Thank you!
Very welcome!
Love the content
Thank you. This video was a bit of a labor of love. Maybe a bit niche for the KS community, but I enjoyed it.
Great explained such a complex topic!
Always cool to learn something useful!
Thanks, Will
My pleasure!
thanks for deep dive explanation.
No worries!
Nice one Will!
Thanks Ryan!
love it , can you make a video about reed flower or something like that . tks you very much
What do you mean by this?
Thank you for this. I saw this recently and wondered why everything looked washed out.
IF at all possible could you perhaps do a Tutorial on lighting Jewellery with Physical Lights. Ive been trying to do this for about 2 months and just cannot seem to get good results. Either the Diamonds looks terrible, There are countless fireflies or the Metal just does not look right.
I know you have made a few Jewellery Videos already but all of them relied on HDRIs which have very limited Animation Capabilities.
Cheers! I'm not sure if I will be doing this anytime soon. I do understand your point about HDRI vs Physical Lights. Generally, the tips in my HDRI-based videos are still relevant. But for fireflies, that's tricky because you can use the firefly filter and denoise, but they can make the animation flicker a bit or kill those specular reflections you want in the diamond. If you can use a diffuse material on the ground, that may help. Also, increasing samples on area lights significantly can help reduce them too. Try 64 material samples on the area lights or even higher and see if it helps at all. Unfortunately, this will affect render times.
Thank you So much for this. I'll give it a try. I've been trying a bunch of new stuff recently and I am quickly discovering some limitations that Keyshot has and now looking at slowly transitioning over to Blender with Octane as I see it has a lot more flexibility but also is a hell of a lot more complicated to use than keyshot which is kind of a put off. But I Guess that is going to be the trade off.@@WillGibbons
Good stuff Will! Unfortunately I didn’t quite get it right. From all what I know real ACES technical works only in VRAY. And it is a bit complicated there for the moment as it involves to build your textures in a certain way. Your materials have an option to change your Chanels from srgb for diffuse channel to aces for bump or displeis to use data not pixel values. Also to convert an output aces image you need to use osio in postproduction software like fusion nuke or davinchi resolve. It is a long and complicated process which doesn’t pay off in the end. What is realised in Corona renderer though is more like another curve algorithm to cut highlights and lighter shadows. It is fake and only distort things instead of giving a solution. Which I suppose is how it works in Keyshot as well. Am I right?
I just looked in the V-Ray manual, been a while since I used it. But doesn't seem to complicated. It doesn't really has to do anything, with the diffuse/albedo textures you use for materials. It does need you to use linear sRGB images with raw encoding for maps like normal/displacement/roughness but that's what you already should use in V-Ray for renders to be correct. The values of those raw files are actually used for the render calculations. Besides that it's mainly just impacting the output files.
While more streamlined I think it's not really that much different than for example creating a PDF with a certain profile, whatever your input images in your document were the profile takes care of a conversion so they all end up with the same profile ready for print.
What I miss in KeyShot is a clear overview of the images which are used in the scene since whatever output you like you need to know the textures of the materials are of the right kind. Currently that's really hard while using the right type of textures is way more important than the which profile you will use at the end. If I'm correct KS currently internally translates 8-bit roughness/displacement/etc to 32-bit so it has 32-bit to render with, that's like the RAW/linear V-Ray also want you to use.
IMO it would be much better if it warns you if there are for example 8-bit roughness/displacement maps in the scene since those textures are basically wrong. Converting them to 32-bit doesn't make the texture any better. Bit of a side step of the ACES story but way more important if you want the right results. Whatever you select on output depends like Will says a lot on what other footage you will use or where your files will end up. For example, if you just need images for online they will look different on basically any other monitor anyway no need to get a headache about color profiles.
I personally like the linear exr files without any profiles attached so I do some post in Photoshop for stills or DaVinci for animation. It doesn't help if there are already profiles attached. If you will use the render output of KS as final image than the ACES option is really nice.
Not sure if this helped you in anyway but I think you're right about there's often no need to use it. But I don't think it's really a complicated thing to use, based on the few steps I see in V-Ray's manual. BTW, that would be cool in KS as well, a more physical correct simulation of a camera like V-Ray has... dreams for 2024 ;)
@@secondskins-nl I see what you mean and agree on what you say. But. As you might be not considered complex scenes for example an interior with hundreds of objects and hundreds more complex materials containing at least few layered materials which consists of compost maps of several textures piled on top of each other. Now go to each texture and start adjusting it, moreover if you need to remake the existing textures to conform them to raw standards. That’s hundreds not in the case of KS where you got one object with few materials. And anyway you end up with really washed out output which as I said you have to convert back using OCIO plugin to restore the results back. Lowering the gamma in post production gives you way incorrect results. So it is not complicated but time consuming. I personally prefer to fake it until I make it just eye balling and working in linear space. But it is shame that with all this AI adventures there is still no render engine which will give you the exact physical results and all you need to do is just click the shutter.
@@WizardValYeah you're right but basically those composed maps with combined textures won't work well in V-Ray with or without ACES, they lack bit depth. Fine for real time/game engines but not for detailed photorealistic renders. Those are also 'invented' to have a much better performance in real time renders since you save on draw calls and amount of textures/vram. Not really the kind of textures you should use in renderers like Corona/V-Ray/KS. Of course it doesn't have to be really noticeable but that's the same when using lossy instead of lossless bitmap formats. If you already start with compromises at the base (textures) you're already behind in getting the best results in the final render. I prefer to start off with the most ideal situation (if possible).
I totally agree on fake it till you make it and these days there's not really much 'exact physical results' in anything you see on screen. You can render nice natural physical correct and than someone drops a nice LUT file on it for the 'right' atmosphere.
@@secondskins-nl Me too buddy. I am usually adapting my approach to the customer needs and when it’s up to a detailed photorealistic interior render at least 6k the whole workflow is built around 8k maps, in other cases it is just about some furniture or products for the marketing department so it doesn’t matter how high your texture is as long as it will be printed on a smal a6 brochure or used on Instagram. My point with developers is now its time for a unified more like universal algorithms built in render engine that will be a built in stone base for workflow so you don’t need to tweak much afterwards everything. Like photographers - they just use cameras and lights not tweaking and engineering their cameras and lights using screwdrivers every time when they set up a new scene. They don’t adjust the materials to look better, do they?
Sorry for the late replies @secondskins-nl and @WizardVal and thanks for the conversation.
So, much of what @secondkins-nl said is spot-on.
I've not used V-ray, but currently, quite a few render engines support an ACES and you do indeed want your textures to be transformed to an ACEScg 'color space' before rendering in a scene that will be output to ACEScg.
But specifically, with KeyShot, that's not the case. In KeyShot, everything is going to be rendered in Linear sRGB. All your textures are also converted to Linear sRGB in KeyShot. And fairly recently, if you had a color profile (not color space) written to your texture (like Adobe sRGB), then KeyShot will now detect and convert to sRGB to retain more accurate final output.
In the end, as far as I understand, KeyShot is applying a LUT to (ACES Image Transform) to your image after rendering. You still end up with an sRGB image (not ACEScg). And if you render to an 8-bit format, then that image is alrady gamma-corrected, hence it appears 'correct' on your display. Rendering to a natively 32-bit format will result in a Linear-encoded image. That's when you'd want to linearize your imgae (or gamma-correct) it in another application when doing post production. For example, DaVinci Resolve (which I use a lot) lets you specify your footage/rendreing as Linear and it automatically applies a display transform so your linear footage looks right on screen when editing. Then, at final render, if you output say a PNG (8-bit), you'll get a gamma-corrected sRGB, just like you would had you rendered a PNG straight from KeyShot.
OCIO should not need to be used in most cases. But if you're using software that doesn't have any built-in image transforms like Resolve, you could use OCIO to let the software know that you're working with 'linear' file and that you'd like to view it with a gamma of 2.2 which would make it look correct on your display.
I hope this is helpful. I'm not an 'expert', but have heavily been learning about this and at this time, this is how I understand all of this.
How to do bouncing animation in keyshot
Sorry, that's not possible. KeyShot doesn't support deformation animations.