My Mum and Dad bought me the C64c Counesiour Collection for Xmas from Dixons for £299 and with a handful of blank cassettes and friends the in pack games didn't last long, Cluedo and Monopoly were ok though. I knew I'd seen that Mouse and cheese box somewhere in the thumbnail, oh the memories this has brought back, as always thanks NN.
Great video. Always love the content here. Quick note: the nomenclature for the Commodore mouse was never “one three fifty” or “one three five one”. Always “thirteen fifty” or “thirteen fifty one”.
Wow I can remember this as a child in the 80's loved how you could create digital drawings. You could also save them with the tape version too. But mainly used it with Arkanoid having competitions with my dad who could get furthest. Anyway thanks for showing such a classic piece of equipment. Keep up the good work.
Oh wow, I almost forgot about 'Mouse Cheese', at least in the sense I forgot its name. I had one of these with my Commodore C64c around Christmas 1988 or 89, I forget which. But What fond memories I have. Cheese was a pretty good little paint package too. The only game I remember using the Neos mouse for was Operation Wolf, as it was a heck of a lot easier than with the joystick!
I still remember the day I got mine, my father bought it for me and I remember being in the car looking inside the box on the way home. I'd already gotten a printer before then so it was great to be able to print out pictures instead of text. I'd quite often draw and print out pictures for visitors. Was a damn sight better than a Koala pad anyway.
Oh, I had this! I remember getting it in a car boot sale in the early 90s. The paint program was cool. I remember the C64 version of Operation Wolf had proper support for it too.
I've got the tape version. It hasn't got the instructions, so it's interesting to find out about the different mode. Very nice to see Arkanoid supports it. I never could figure out the Image System.
@@acertainshape I've got a strong feeling that they are secretly married. Which is fine. The only problem is whether to call Nostalgia Nerd "Nostalgia Kitten" or Octavius Kitten "Octavius Nerd". To be honest I don't think it's fair to call Octavius a nerd so I'm going with Nostalgia Kitten.
@@colinjohnston8519 What I was getting at is that when people get married one usually takes the surname of the other. So I was weighing up who should take the other's name. Octavius or Nerd? So I agree that nerds don't mind being called nerds (mostly). However I'm talking about Octavius. If she is a nerd though then I stand corrected.
@@octaviusking Sigh, what happened to the good old days when the guy got down on one knee, looked you in the eyes and said "I forged your signature on the marriage license. We're married"
I had a 1351 and GEOS; I also used it to play a few "desktop" type games, Origin Software's OGRE in particular. It had drop-down menus, etc., you could context click on units on screen, etc. Very mac-like.
Brings back happy memories of drawing pictures using Canvas on the Atari ST. We only had the demo version with save disabled so we just videoed our creations.
There was someone offering a version of this for the Tatung Einstein. It was the same mouse but with an adapter and software written for the Einstein. I tried to get hold of it in the early 90s through B&H Computers but they couldn't get hold of the mice anymore :(
If I remember my Residents lore correctly, the Neos Mouse and Cheese program was used to make the text on their album "Stars and Hank Forever". The main artwork was done on an Amiga, but PourKnow Graffixs did the text on a c64 to make sure it had the blocky pixelated look they wanted.
“There are some more things to click here. In any case I hope you have a -great evening- [mouse].” ...in an era when most of us will be using track pads and touch screens.
A band called TTF (The Time Feequency) did a cover for one of their singles on a amstrad 6128 with a similar bit of software and hardware :) Amstrad Action did a article on it away back in the day....
Had exactly that mouse in the day. The softvare was crap but the mouse was wonderful to use in other programs. Such a difference compared to a joystick or keyboard.
Those mouses look a lot like the atari ST mouses which use optical sensors, which also seemingly just die like this. Usually a it's capacitor / chip failure which can be fixed easily enough.
Had the floppy disk version, used the enhancer 2000 disk drive, not a sex aid, to load it. It was a bit of fun at the time, but Deluxe Paint on the Amiga a few years later, changed my world.
Had this via the Connoisseur's Collection and I really thought I was living in the future. While I didn't take to the Cheese application the joystick mode was useful as a stopgap however, when my QuickShot 2's leaf switches broke when playing Warhawk, and it came into its own by the time Operation Wolf came round!
Not sure if you mentioned it in the video, but would a 1351 work with that Cheese software? Seems the Neos mouse is nearly a 1351 in brown mousy clothing.
Doesn't Britain have a version of the Epyx Fast Load cartridge? It would make disk loading so much better. If y'all have a Final Cartridge 3 there's a turbo tape load function IIRC.
I have Arkanoid CIB floppy disk version for my C64 but the boxed Commodore-brand mouse I was sold with it is an Amiga mouse. :( Still, it supports ubiquitous paddle controllers so all is not lost!
Also did anyone complete the programs in the back of the manuals, Me and my sister would spend hours, one reading and one typing but never got one to work, just mainly syntax errors, you can see where our system of working was ripe for errors, both the Vic 20 and C64, but I'd still love to know what those programs are even 30 odd years later.
11:25 I recall how with some kind of games I did use a joystick, I had no doubt the arrow keys were the way to go in this case, and as a matter of fact, if joystick had been the only option, I might have quit playing that game.
@ roughly 2:12, is it really 512 microseconds? So it's written to the register almost 2000 times a second? Dang, that's not shabby, considering the default USB polling rate is only 125 Hz. I know, writing to registers at nearly 2000 Hz vs. polling rate on USB aren't the same thing, but still.
Still got my mouse and cheese, I remember doing quite alot of artwork with it. Until I could get a better paper-round and save for a500 with deluxe paint. Cheese was my art program of choice (not that I had any others).
Bloody hell, I had this as a kid! I have no idea what happend to it but I'm glad I had the disk version. I dont remember using the mouse on anything else other than Cheese.
I remember using this and running it through a VHS and creating animation - the result was terrible because a)pausing and restarting on a VHS left a load of distortion and b)I can't draw for toffee! - still it was fun and kept me quiet for days!
Looks super fluid in the paint program, compared to the 1351. Keep mine around pretty much just to play Arkanoid. It's indeed pretty clunky using paint programs or GEOS. The Neos mouse seems to have more supported games than the 1351 as well.
Can't say I ever cared about this mouse, nor do I find the branding anything but silly, but I think the VICE dev-team might actually be interested in this - friend of mine asked me about those neos mice a while ago. So feel free to contact them :)
It's not that the right button does drawing and you feel weird for using it that way, it's that the software was made for lefties and you use it with the wrong hand.
I looked at the Neos mouse, but went with the CBM 1351 instead. The 1351 works fine with GEOS as well as DESKTOP in the Final Cartridge III. Worth noting here, since it use special features of the SID chip that isn't of interest for games, it does not work with SwinSID and similar new SID replicas, only a genuine 8580 or a 6582 can be used, probably same with Paddles, but i haven't tested those.
Does anyone remember an Amiga animation program, I think was called "phanta Vision" or something I very well have got the title slightly wrong, but one of the standard animations were dinosaurs in a swamp, pre-JurassicPark if I'm right that would make a great video.
I got that Mouse Cheese system for my c64 too. It works with the included paint package but not with geos sadly :( Or at least i couldnt get it to work. Im missing something as you stated clearly it works with GEOS
i don´t know funcionallity with geos and the neos mouse. but geos with my 1351 mouse from commodore worked well when the correct inputdriver was selectet
Whenever a chef is called exellent, a wild Ashens soon appear.
My Mum and Dad bought me the C64c Counesiour Collection for Xmas from Dixons for £299 and with a handful of blank cassettes and friends the in pack games didn't last long, Cluedo and Monopoly were ok though. I knew I'd seen that Mouse and cheese box somewhere in the thumbnail, oh the memories this has brought back, as always thanks NN.
Your rat is freakin' adorable. Also, make sure to put your floppy disk in the Chef Excellence cheese bags after use. Don't want it spoiling!
Stay fresh, cheese disk!
An excellent cheese bag
"An Excellent Mousecheese"
I miss Chef Excellence
An Excellent Comment
An Excellent Reply
An excellent chef
An excellent statement
An Excellent thread
OMG I had one of these. I have not seen one for 30 years. You brought back some happy memories.
(I even wrote my own version of "mac paint" for it .)
Its not "nye-on", its "ni-hon", which means Japan.
anglons will never learn apperently
Great video. Always love the content here.
Quick note: the nomenclature for the Commodore mouse was never “one three fifty” or “one three five one”. Always “thirteen fifty” or “thirteen fifty one”.
Wow I can remember this as a child in the 80's loved how you could create digital drawings. You could also save them with the tape version too.
But mainly used it with Arkanoid having competitions with my dad who could get furthest.
Anyway thanks for showing such a classic piece of equipment. Keep up the good work.
Is it any Gouda? Well done sir. Well done.
Oh wow, I almost forgot about 'Mouse Cheese', at least in the sense I forgot its name. I had one of these with my Commodore C64c around Christmas 1988 or 89, I forget which. But What fond memories I have. Cheese was a pretty good little paint package too. The only game I remember using the Neos mouse for was Operation Wolf, as it was a heck of a lot easier than with the joystick!
I still remember the day I got mine, my father bought it for me and I remember being in the car looking inside the box on the way home. I'd already gotten a printer before then so it was great to be able to print out pictures instead of text. I'd quite often draw and print out pictures for visitors. Was a damn sight better than a Koala pad anyway.
Oh, I had this! I remember getting it in a car boot sale in the early 90s. The paint program was cool. I remember the C64 version of Operation Wolf had proper support for it too.
I've got the tape version. It hasn't got the instructions, so it's interesting to find out about the different mode. Very nice to see Arkanoid supports it. I never could figure out the Image System.
hmmm someone stole a rat off octav1us kitten
Do they live in the same town?
@@acertainshape I've got a strong feeling that they are secretly married. Which is fine. The only problem is whether to call Nostalgia Nerd "Nostalgia Kitten" or Octavius Kitten "Octavius Nerd".
To be honest I don't think it's fair to call Octavius a nerd so I'm going with Nostalgia Kitten.
@@IceCreamKimi nurds don't mind being called nurds. Hence the name of this channel..
@@colinjohnston8519 What I was getting at is that when people get married one usually takes the surname of the other. So I was weighing up who should take the other's name. Octavius or Nerd?
So I agree that nerds don't mind being called nerds (mostly). However I'm talking about Octavius. If she is a nerd though then I stand corrected.
@@octaviusking Sigh, what happened to the good old days when the guy got down on one knee, looked you in the eyes and said "I forged your signature on the marriage license. We're married"
one question though: on the disk it says "SYS 16484" but you run it by "SYS 4096". why?
I like these vintage hardware/software videos a lot.
I had a 1351 and GEOS; I also used it to play a few "desktop" type games, Origin Software's OGRE in particular. It had drop-down menus, etc., you could context click on units on screen, etc. Very mac-like.
Wow I never thought I would ever see another device with American SNES colors!
Mouse and cheese. What lovely simple times. Fast forward 20+ years later and what we get? Two girls and one cup.
I had this bundle! Got it as a kid as a reward for getting a wart removed from my thumb. Which meant the mouse hurt for three weeks. Worth it!
Brings back happy memories of drawing pictures using Canvas on the Atari ST. We only had the demo version with save disabled so we just videoed our creations.
There was someone offering a version of this for the Tatung Einstein. It was the same mouse but with an adapter and software written for the Einstein. I tried to get hold of it in the early 90s through B&H Computers but they couldn't get hold of the mice anymore :(
The styrofoam story was great! My experience was trying to spray paint a large styrofoam airplane.
Memories
You wouldn't happen to have any more books in the works by any chance? I need more!
The NEOS mouse is great. And hold one mouse-button down when powering up and you don't have to unplug it - it turns into a "joystick".
If I remember my Residents lore correctly, the Neos Mouse and Cheese program was used to make the text on their album "Stars and Hank Forever". The main artwork was done on an Amiga, but PourKnow Graffixs did the text on a c64 to make sure it had the blocky pixelated look they wanted.
Pornographics (and all variations on that spelling wise), is the name of the design arm of the Residents output. In case someone was wondering.
"Remove the sponge from the rear cver" at 5:32. Apparently proof reading wasn't a thing in the 80s? 😂
Also, "conent the cheese".
Grafik Maus sounds like the name of a German EDM band.
ua-cam.com/video/9346vKpsh1E/v-deo.html
@@StefanNoack ohgodwhy
So Octavious rats do cameo appearance ;)
Nice find! I do have NEOS mouse with Cheese and a slot expander for the MSX system.
My dad had this. Must've been the late eighties. Loaded it up once, drew some lines, then used the mouse for Arkanoid!
I want a "pint" command for my computer. so that I can type it in any time I like and get a pint of lager. (kind of like a muffin button...)
I love the nod to Chef Excellence. LOL
Ah the 80s where computer mouse packages are bundled with paint-like program.
Looks pretty neat. I've been meaning to find a 1530 so I can try out GEOS with the 64C I recently acquired.
“There are some more things to click here. In any case I hope you have a -great evening- [mouse].”
...in an era when most of us will be using track pads and touch screens.
I had Cheese for my C64. Loved it!
Great video as always.
Have you done anything on GEOS at all?
I got a C64 as my first computer for my 8th birthday, and it came with this. SYS 4096 is forever engraved on my brain.
Arkanoid... wow, I must have spent hundreds and hundreds of hours playing that. One of my all time favourite 8-bit games from my youth!
NN, how does Arkanoid with a mouse stack up against Arkanoid with a paddle?
A band called TTF (The Time Feequency) did a cover for one of their singles on a amstrad 6128 with a similar bit of software and hardware :) Amstrad Action did a article on it away back in the day....
Had exactly that mouse in the day. The softvare was crap but the mouse was wonderful to use in other programs. Such a difference compared to a joystick or keyboard.
Those mouses look a lot like the atari ST mouses which use optical sensors, which also seemingly just die like this. Usually a it's capacitor / chip failure which can be fixed easily enough.
Got this with my C64 and had a lot of fun with it
Had the floppy disk version, used the enhancer 2000 disk drive, not a sex aid, to load it. It was a bit of fun at the time, but Deluxe Paint on the Amiga a few years later, changed my world.
I never knew the C64 could even support a mouse. fascinating.
I don't think there was that much use for it though, not much software.. was there?
For the mouse that didn't work, did you try it after the program had loaded per the instructions?
"Yea, Michael I'm just gonna get a GINSTER'S from the FRIDGE, put it on the SLATE!"
Had this via the Connoisseur's Collection and I really thought I was living in the future. While I didn't take to the Cheese application the joystick mode was useful as a stopgap however, when my QuickShot 2's leaf switches broke when playing Warhawk, and it came into its own by the time Operation Wolf came round!
Not sure if you mentioned it in the video, but would a 1351 work with that Cheese software? Seems the Neos mouse is nearly a 1351 in brown mousy clothing.
Doesn't Britain have a version of the Epyx Fast Load cartridge? It would make disk loading so much better. If y'all have a Final Cartridge 3 there's a turbo tape load function IIRC.
I have Arkanoid CIB floppy disk version for my C64 but the boxed Commodore-brand mouse I was sold with it is an Amiga mouse. :(
Still, it supports ubiquitous paddle controllers so all is not lost!
Also did anyone complete the programs in the back of the manuals, Me and my sister would spend hours, one reading and one typing but never got one to work, just mainly syntax errors, you can see where our system of working was ripe for errors, both the Vic 20 and C64, but I'd still love to know what those programs are even 30 odd years later.
11:25 I recall how with some kind of games I did use a joystick, I had no doubt the arrow keys were the way to go in this case, and as a matter of fact, if joystick had been the only option, I might have quit playing that game.
I remember getting a mouse for my 8-bit Sharp computer. Apart from a paint program and Arkanoid, it was also great for Lemmings... and not much else.
Is it compatible with Operation Wolf?
Thank god the inventor of the mouse didn't call it a "nob".
so many pointless arguments over who called whom a nobhead when you really just said nobpad
How many times have you grabbed your nob
Hey, we have enough of those jokes already because of 'joystick' thanks. ;p
The Norwegian word for mouse is slang for vagina. But we have gotten so used to it so it is almost not funny anymore :(
That would be Douglas Engelbart. Look up ‘mother of all demos’.
I loved this thing with GEOS back in the day on my C128
The MSX version I have has the software on both tape and cartridge, quite handy. Also I can't remember the mouse interfering with anything else.
Got one of these too, used it to play Operation Wolf more than doodling on Cheese but there you go
So was the first mouse broken because it was plugged in before loading? And would the second one work with the tape?
@ roughly 2:12, is it really 512 microseconds? So it's written to the register almost 2000 times a second? Dang, that's not shabby, considering the default USB polling rate is only 125 Hz. I know, writing to registers at nearly 2000 Hz vs. polling rate on USB aren't the same thing, but still.
I had this. It was single-handedly responsible for making me think a mouse was a pointless pc peripheral until 1999...
A neat little video. One more thing: have you tried your NEOS Mouse with GEOS? That could be an interesting topic for another video.
Sooooo, who remembers the genuine cheese in Mercenary then? No mouse needed there!
Maybe you had to hold the mouse button to put it into joystick mode for the tape version?
Still got my mouse and cheese, I remember doing quite alot of artwork with it. Until I could get a better paper-round and save for a500 with deluxe paint. Cheese was my art program of choice (not that I had any others).
Bloody hell, I had this as a kid! I have no idea what happend to it but I'm glad I had the disk version. I dont remember using the mouse on anything else other than Cheese.
9:09 Me trying to draw something just by looking at it and thinking "well, it's just copying something, easy task"
Where did you find the rat?
Nice video, very interesting.
Is this a mouse for left-handed people? Why are the buttons reversed?
The 5:26 mark was An Excellent cameo
I have a bunch of these and find it astounding for a ball mouse...what quality.
I remember using this and running it through a VHS and creating animation - the result was terrible because a)pausing and restarting on a VHS left a load of distortion and b)I can't draw for toffee! - still it was fun and kept me quiet for days!
Looks super fluid in the paint program, compared to the 1351. Keep mine around pretty much just to play Arkanoid. It's indeed pretty clunky using paint programs or GEOS.
The Neos mouse seems to have more supported games than the 1351 as well.
Will it work with a vic20? Could be funny to play Cheese and Onion with the Cheese mouse :D
Can't say I ever cared about this mouse, nor do I find the branding anything but silly, but I think the VICE dev-team might actually be interested in this - friend of mine asked me about those neos mice a while ago. So feel free to contact them :)
I spent so much time with Koala Painter and a joystick, drawing was one of the best things to do with a home computer.
I had this! Did a fair bit of drawing with it, and played a lot of Operation Wolf :D
The Neos mouse was also compatable with Operation Wolf.
It's not that the right button does drawing and you feel weird for using it that way, it's that the software was made for lefties and you use it with the wrong hand.
what a "cheesy" video :D
Mouse cheese, or rather mouse trap cheese, is something you can actually buy in Norway
I had this on the C64. GEOS too. Such a nerd.
Mainly uses right mouse button? And I though Blender was the only program with a weird right-mouse-centric operation!
I found a Japanese version of that mouse for the MSX at a garage sale sometime a few years ago. I live in upstate NY. I have no idea how it got here.
"what else would you call a paint program?"
uncomfortably long pause
it's "paint"
draw , sketch
Funniest shit i've ever seen
Love the reference to Stuart
I looked at the Neos mouse, but went with the CBM 1351 instead. The 1351 works fine with GEOS as well as DESKTOP in the Final Cartridge III.
Worth noting here, since it use special features of the SID chip that isn't of interest for games, it does not work with SwinSID and similar new SID replicas, only a genuine 8580 or a 6582 can be used, probably same with Paddles, but i haven't tested those.
Newer SwinSIDs support mice.
Wow I remember spending ages trying to draw with a joystick on Image System. I could never figure out how to change colour though!
Does anyone remember an Amiga animation program, I think was called "phanta Vision" or something I very well have got the title slightly wrong, but one of the standard animations were dinosaurs in a swamp, pre-JurassicPark if I'm right that would make a great video.
I got that Mouse Cheese system for my c64 too. It works with the included paint package but not with geos sadly :( Or at least i couldnt get it to work. Im missing something as you stated clearly it works with GEOS
i don´t know funcionallity with geos and the neos mouse. but geos with my 1351 mouse from commodore worked well when the correct inputdriver was selectet
The mouse is good enough to go back in time...
i need more of that rat, please use the boy in more videos.
An Excellent Product
I was kind of hoping he woulda grabbed that rat and slid it around the desk and tried to click it...
Your intro was very very funny. But in the interest of transparency you should know I'm 2 shots of rum in to my evening.
You can pixel with megadrive controller
Faulty cable ?