Destiny is way older. People needed either traces of ancient DNA or required gene therapy in order to access the systems on Atlantis. Nicholas Rush pointed out that Destiny predated that and no gene therapy was required. Not to mention Destiny had an older Stargate on board. The Seeder ships (which planted Stargates on planets) were older still. Destiny caught up to one of them in season 2.
Well Atlantis could have been upgraded over the millennia? The Ancient Atlantis may have been a normal city and millions of years later became the city ship we see today.
@@endorfinator5502 i’m sure Atlantis was upgraded over the millennia but in the pilot we see what I’m assuming is Atlantis takeoff from earth and an implication that it flew to Pegasus galaxy.
@@endorfinator5502 Had they continued SGU, they were going to have Eli find another stasis room with some ancients in stasis who were the maintenance crew working on the ship when there was a malfunction that launched the Destiny from Earth before they could have time to beam off. Eli was going to revive them and in doing so learn that they were not suppose to have been on the ship. They were suppose to have beamed off when the crew for the Destiny boarded but it never happened. Instead they placed themselves in stasis until the other ancients could gate aboard and take over but it never happened. One of the things they were going to inform Eli and the others of was that Atlantis was just in the beginning stages when they left Earth.
The protogates alone mean that either one of two things happened: 1: Destiny is actually over 50 MILLION years old, because of the dated ice around the Antarctic gate. 2: Either the plague that ultimately killed Ayiana (the frozen lady near the Antarctic gate) or some other disaster was so bad ancient society degenerated technologically and had to "reinvent" a lot of stuff, leading to Destiny still having maybe been older than Atlantis, but not quite predating the OG milky way gates.
“Stargate origins, take it or leave it” ya definitely leave it. I always thought destiny was older, it has a different type of ftl, no drone weapons, most of the tech on board wasnt guarded by having or not having the ancient gene, which was a reaction to the wraith. The ship looks cruder than Atlantis too
Atlantis is older but the difference is where destiny was a ship set on auto pilot Atlantis was a city ship actively lived on and potentially upgrades and developed using vast resources around them also the gate of milky way and pegasus seem more advanced
Why would it have drone weapons? You would want something that is easily replenish able. Using the sun's energy as a weapon is a good way to always have weapons on board. They dont go into great detail but i bet the weapons are packed so dense each shot is like a 100k nuks.
What if rush's madness is infecting your mind. Anyways, universe took a way darker tone than anything ever done by stargate, maybe it should have ended for the sake of their suffering
The Atlantis problem is easily resolved. London's 2 thousand years old but there's very little left from its start. Everything in Atlantis got rebuilt and updated right up until the time they abandoned it. When we launched voyager 1, that was it. No hardware updates after that time. The same goes for Destiny.
They state it in the show a few times. Atlantis launch from earth was approx 3 million ago, the milky way gates were said to be around 50 million yrs old and Destiny was said to have been older than that. So, at the very least Destiny is 50 million years old, likely a bit older as the gates Destiny uses are older and less advanced. I don't think they discuss the time issues of the ship using FTL that isn't hyperspace, it physically travels that fast in real space, it should be experiencing extreme time dilation as ftl would be considered relativistic speeds? But they mess all that up with the comm stones and ke3p8mg I'm contact with earth
@@TheAkashicTraveller well they never specify what kind of FTL it is. It seems to fly in real space as it destroyed the drones when it flew through them. But I suppose technically that could be some sort of warp drive. But remember in stargate Atlantis when they found the ancient crew between galaxies. They were going 99.9% the speed of light if I remember correctly, and that was with sublight engines. I wish SG universe would return and flesh all that out a bit. I can't remember how long it took them to go between the 2 galaxies in the show but it wasn't that long, Destiny is almost as fast as the daedelus(dunno how to spell it lol)
@@silenttitan416I don't recall anyone saying that the Milky Way gates were anywhere near that old. In my mind, I imagine that the Ancients had routine plans for maintenance of the gate network in a well-settled and mostly peaceful galaxy like ours. Whenever they developed new improvements to the basic gate design, they would plan and schedule a galaxy-wide upgrade of all stargates. We never saw the Ancients when they dominated the Milky Way, before the Goa'uld became a threat, but if we could see them, their civilization reined over the galaxy for millions of years, the population probably numbered in many billions and they had millions of ships capable of crossing the galaxy. For them, replacing all gates in the galaxy every 10,000 or 20,000 years would be easy. If course, if their civilization was a lot smaller than what I described, it might reflect a limited imagination.
@@scorpiusbalthazar4327 $130 is not worth my time. I've been prepping for survival. At one time I probably would have jumped right on board with purchasing that, but not now. My wife and I just purchased a 4 wheel drive truck and camping equipment to run to the hills in we have to.
I liked in the SGU pilot that there were big gates that the full-size Starships jump through, for some reason got me super excited for the show. Thinking of how they could utilize it for different reasons. Also I thought it was cool in Stargate Atlantis but they had Gates that were in the vacuum of space. I always thought during SG-1 & constantly posted about it online why didn't the governments of earth or others make a ship, fighter, transport aircraft or vehicle that they take threw the gates. So the SG1 team didn't have to walk everywhere the went on every planet. I mean at least a 4 wheeler or something. Just my thoughts lol
I've always taken it as canon that Rush didn't want to explain much further to "lesser minds" the minute details that go into such a vast topic of Destiny vs. Atlantis...and that led him to choose the statement he made of 'millions' (instead of billions or what not) when he described it. He has always been that guy, "...so just do as I tell you cause there's no time to explain or we're all going to die."
Huh, my impression of the man was that he broadly didn't have a damn clue what he was talking about most of the time and was bulldozing people with his arrogant act in order to keep people from questioning his obvious bullshit.
I like the idea that character sometimes misspeak. They are legit human beings, we make mistakes. If properly used , it adds to story telling by misleading the watcher/reader. I hope one day when they do a retcon they have the character blatantly say "I'm human, sue me"
He didn't misspeak. He's from Earth and as a scientist, he simply doesn't know. He's guessing. Common sense tells you that Destiny is older. How else could the gates get out into the Universe???
The problem with Origins wasn't that Catherine Langford didn't do that. It's that Ra didn't do that. Had Ra known that Earth was still active he'd have obliterated it and this was prior to the installation of the iris which means that the door was wide open.
Ra knew about earth but ignored it. Not sure if it's cannon but i think in one of the books he tries to occupy it but his ship is obliterated by jumpers and he concludes that earth is a no go because the ancients are protecting it (i believe one of the jumpers was piloted by the Sg-1 team stranded there while another was done by Januus who time travelled with his jumper there. In any case he then simply leaves the planet alone and does his best to make every other goa'uld forget this place exists along with the Jaffa (Season 1 SG1 Teal'c saying: Tau'ri was lost a long time ago).
@@iondustt all the ancients who went back to earth from Atlantis could have easily built MANY jumpers and left them all around in the many thousands of years before Cathrines trip and the original movie finds ra. Like specifically the waves of ancients going back during the time that dr. Weir went back in time during the first branching timeline of arriving to Atlantis but instead of going back to earth with them she secretly stayed and put herself into stasis to rotate the zpms every few thousand years so that the city would rise when they got there again in the future.
I always thought Destiny was older than Atlantis. It becomes evident when you look at the designs of the two ships and at the technology they hold. The chair on Destiny, is an example. When you compare it with the chair Atlantis has. You can see which one is older.
You overthinking it. Atlantis had the adres to destiny, to have adress, means must be younger then destiny. Period. What other explanation is needed ? If it was older it whould not had the adress or posobility to dial it. Also there is a episode that explained that Atlantis was luched at the end of their civilization as a masterpiece of their technology when their planet was destroyed. Destiny on the other hand was lunched in early ages when they where exploring the universe and noticed the code in background radiation. So even try making this a mistery is ONE clickbait or Second the autor of the video lacks the basic knowledge of the Fan of the stargate universe :P
@@Shark-pi4oi Even if Atlantis was older, it could still have the address for Destiny if people had remained in Atlantis until after the launch of Destiny.
@@landshark1215 Could, should, whould. Not likeli as it was lunched as last save of their race. So not realy a posible option. As i said it lunched and was last of their advanced technology. How whould they develop somthing like destiny with their limited resources. They whould not, thats the point of last stand. Later they left the miliky way because they lost hope and wanted start new, later they abandoned all technology and assended. In that order. After assention there was no longer anything build and after atlantis came to the planet where they find it they didnt build any more advanced technology, they where hiding. They created replicators, and kinda Wraith, and they had no idea how to kill them so they hiden. Also ORI where basicli ancient brothers, before they developed most of their technology. Kinda full time job create one disaster after another. :D
@@Shark-pi4oi Atlantis was launched to escape a plague ravaging the Milky Way and their civilization continued in the Pegasus galaxy for almost a million years. But, Atlantis already existed on Earth for an unspecified time before it was launched to Pegasus, so it could still be older than Destiny and just have been upgraded later, with the address for Destiny in its database. That's not to say it is, but your premise is flawed and shows a lack of understanding of the mythos of the shows. The Ancients didn't go into hiding in the Pegasus galaxy until near the end of their time there, because they were losing the war with the Wraith, so they initially hid and then chose to return to Earth. After that, they mingled with the new human civilizations arisen on Earth before ascending.
@@landshark1215 Thats all true and i dont deny it. But how you cant see that all the facts lead only to one conclusion. That destiny was lunched in early stages of their expansion. Not only does the adress in atlantis databese sugest it. So does the posibility to dial it only from advanced gate located on atlantis. The difference in advancement of the ship. Lack of zero point moduls on destiny. The early developed gates used in project are hint as well with their masive downgrades to use. Also later design with advancement had a lot of minimalism implemented not like destiny thats more like cyberpunk look. The lack of clocking technology . There is many small details that make it clearly older model. Even asgard had better ships. IF you stil hold on the slim posibility that anything is posible there whould not be any fact that could change your believe. Also the atlantis had data about most of the ancient stuctures and planets that hiden the technology that was created be merlin, who is one of the guys who deasended back to help humans. The ones who left the atlantis left the human comander in stasis of the ship in the time travel paradox episode. She didnt sleep for milion years. She actualy slept for 10 000 years. That whould also make sense as for now its estimated that merlin and arthur or morgana mith dates around 12 000 years. A destiny is 100 000 years or more old, make the ship in fact younger. :P
What about the other city ship in the Atlantis episode the tower??.Wonder how many city ships the ancients built and I'm sure they all didn't go to Pegasus' and didn't all leave earth at the same time.For all we know Atlantis could have been the first or last city ship to leave earth.
there are possibly ancients that weren't okay with ascending.. or the best part is that.. the ascended ancients could come back anytime they want. a spinoff for the ascended ancients would also be cool, to see wtf they are up to.. but that would take away too much from their mystery also.. what if the asgards were a splinter group of the ancients in the first place... what if the ancients living in their galaxy were their ancestors who weren't into ascending and were more into cloning and living forever?
I'm watching through SG1 currently and when Daniel starts talking about Atlantis, I'm pretty sure he says it was the Ancients crown jewel and one of the last things they built before disappearing kind of thing. So in my mind there was absolutely no doubt about the answer to this videos question. Destiny is older. Simply because Atlantis was built so late in their civilisation's time-line.
It’s mentioned several times in sgu (just finished it) that the control chair on destiny was a very early model. A precursor to the one found on earth or in Atlantis.
Daniel isn't always right, we see Atlantis taking off from earth in the pilot. Either Daniel is wrong about when that happened or Rush is wrong about how old destiny is.
@@DaDunge By the time it takes off from earth the ancients we're already almost wiped out by a plague. Their journeys in pegasus we're probably considered the tail end of their civilization.
What happens on screen is canon, but you're right, that doesn't mean a character can't misspeak or be wrong about something. The Othalla thing, it wasn't clear if Daniel was referencing the galaxy or the planet, because the question itself was a bit vague. If the question is a bit vague, then why can't Daniel be as confused as the audience about the question he's being asked?
It's specifically said in canon that Destiny is the oldest technology ever seen and that Atlantis is the crown jewel that served right up until the Ancients abandoned Pegasus.
That would mean Atlantis was possibly the last city ship launched by the ancients...which would subsequently be equipped with the most up to date tech available....
I believe at some point it was said that Destiny gate might have been one of the first (so that would put it millions of years ago when Alteran colonised milky way), while Atlantis was launched during the plague and Lanteans left it to mingle with early humans only 12 thousand years ago or so.
Atlantis I believe was a prototype. They speak of a even more grandiose project that was being built when the plague hit. It was the plague that stopped work on it as it was one of the sites of the first infections. They moved to trying to cure the plague and find other options, like the strange time machine SG1 finds that only creates a time loop. When all those efforts failed all those left uninfected boarded Atlantis and left the Milky Way for Pegasus.
technically, "hundreds of thousands" can also be "millions." It's just more "hundreds of thousands" than a few which, granted, isn't the usual usage, but it isn't incorrect.
Precisely. It's like the word "several", an abstract amount. It annoys me when fans jump to one definitive assumption and then fight over it. In this case, onscreen canon is an abstract amount.
Sure, but this is Rush talking. Even if he wasn't manipulating or outright lying, he could simply be wrong. Humans in SG always only had fragments of knowledge of the ancients. He puts the pieces together, and with his star-system-sized ego claims final answers. There's plenty of contradictions in dialogue - don't get too attached to things people say, especially when they aren't particularly trustworthy, are known for at least "short-cutting" answers and are way too impressed with themselves. Now, if they actually found records and talked about those, we would have some stronger evidence. It's certainly possible Rush was referencing those, but we don't know. And even with explicit records, we don't know if they were interpreted correctly, if they were faulty (due to human/ancient error or data corruption over time, for example), or heck, maybe it was just a sci-fi novel some ancient guy was writing :) Not to mention that technology just doesn't work that way. Even if you know the gene lock was used in Pegasus, and wasn't used in Milky Way (which is already _very_ tricky to establish, especially when you consider that there were at least two migrations of ancients, not to mention the whole Dakara superweapon thing!), that doesn't mean it was a novel technology, or that you should expect it was automatically used everywhere once it was developed. It was used on Atlantis for a reason - that same reason wasn't necessarily at play for Destiny, and each technology also has drawbacks. According to most of the information we have, the Ancients were _really_ ancient, so they were very different from our current (and ridiculously short, compared to the Ancients' development) high-tech race. Technology isn't a progression from worse to better; everything has benefits and costs.
@@DialtheGate a little off topic here. I never understood the purpose of the Stargate in SGU they can only be use when destiny was in the system and it had about 6 hours until FTL then it would be useless. why would the ancients go through all that trouble. Also due to the fact that the Stargates in SGU don't work as far out and don't even look updated like the once in Atlantis I would say destiny is older
@@youngmystery8417 It's because these are temporary gates and there is no network yet. In other words, they operate in stand alone mode. It is the DHD's that create the network. None of the gates in SGU have DHD's, they are operated by a basic remote dialing device, the presence of Destiny is not required. The coordinate system or symbol system for each galaxy is unique to that galaxy, think of it as the difference between MAC addresses and IP addresses. Carter explains in an episode of SG-1 that a Stargate without a DHD is limited to about a 300 light year radius. It makes a lot of sense from a colonization stand point to pre-drop a bunch of temp gates. It provides easy and quick access to new planets and the resources for a permanent gate are already in place.
@@youngmystery8417 also remember that they had very little control of Destiny; the Ancients would have had the command codes and knowledge of the ship to take over and stop whenever and wherever they wanted.
the comics already stated the fact detsiny was older, in fact accoriding to the comics, destiny actually launched slightly premature due to a technical fault. Also atlantis is probably only a few hundred years older depending on how long bulding it too as the comics also tell us how the city ships were in early contruction when destiny launched as they were competing projects.
I have a slightly different theory... Destiny may have been launched WAY earlier than Atlantis, however it has spent far more time at/near/beyond light speed and may be subjected to time dilation to the point that the internal equipment of Destiny may indeed only be a few hundred thousand years old instead of X number of millions of years older than Atlantis. What makes me curious is in the show it doesn't appear that Destiny ever sends reports back to home base...
I've been watching your interviews lately, & they were great! It was cool to hear some of the stories from the sets. As for this video, I just wanted to mention my thoughts on a couple things... The way I understood the Ida/Othala thing is that the Asgard lived in the Ida galaxy, but they had to leave because of the replicators. Thats when they went to Othala, but I believe that's a planet, not a galaxy. I don't recall anything about a different galaxy, but I will look for a reference next watch though...I literally watch it every day, I'm currently in S4. I keep it running at home just because it's like comfort food for my mind. Plus I put it on when I sleep, so, yeah, I watch Stargate ALOT! ...My wife is sick of it! Lol. The other thing I was gonna mention was the thing about the germans with the dhd. I remember in the ep '1969', Daniel pretends to be related to a german scientist that worked with the dhd...I'm guessing that's where the background in 'Origins' came from. There may be a reference in the episode 'The Torment of Tantalus,' but I don't recall anything specific. I hope this doesn't come off as "I'm right/you're wrong," I just wanted to discuss my favorite show...🤘😁 Keep up the great vids, & keep spinning that dial...Puppet General Hammond wants it to spin! 🤪
How is this even a question, Destiny is said to predate the technology of both Pegasus AND the Milky Way Ancients. It is essentially Alteran technology, in essence, WAAAAY Older.
i personally don't count origins as cannon. but going back to the origonal question, destiny is much much older than Atlantis. and you can tell by the tech they were using on not only the ship, but also the stargates used in the show of SGU. then the second gate system is built in the milky way then Pegasus gates. anyway this would make the most sense.
@@chronosschiron The guy on the left says he worked on the show, of course he is trying to justify it as canon. Meanwhile first time I heard about Origins was 2 weeks ago, kinda tells you about the splash in the fanbase it made, smaller than a drop of water in the ocean.
Yeah, but that's all counter-canon anyway. In Ark of Truth, you see the ancient guy's notes on the stargates BEFORE they left the Ori Galaxy, and it details a Stargate that looks like the Milky Way model, not the Destiny series - which we know was launched from the Milky Way because of the galaxy map shown in SGU where it traveled through Pegasus. Why create the milky way design and NOT use it on the destiny expedition? Because the writers screwed up, plain and simple.
@@noblevi3623 I have two possible explanations for that, either the tech wasn't yet ready for the SG1-Gates and/or they had rescource concerns in the new galaxy or they chose a cheeper alternativ since the Seedships would have to work with very limited recources.
So my opinion when it comes down to the perspective of why they didn't use and Milky Way gate on the destiny was because that design was added much much later on. My assumption is the SGU Gates were originally in the Milky when they were first created, and mostly used for testing until they were perfected enough to send on the seeding mission. At some point in time they were dismantled for the newer more improved versions to take their place, however these new additions would have taken place long after the Destiny was sent on its mission. Understand in the lore yes the ancient Alteran who creates the Stargates designs on a piece of paper that he was drawing, but it's entirely possible that was one of the many designs he had in mind. However I will admit the gate that's on board destiny is far more advanced than all the others that were added along the path that the destiny has taken. So far it's the only gate of its design that can withstand a 9 Chevron wormhole. And it's my assumption that back on Earth where the ancient Alteran first built these Stargates, started to advance the design of the Stargate after sending destiny on its mission and eventually came up with a better working Stargate, which is when they started replacing all the old ones that were in the Milky Way with the new design.
The thing about the age of Atlantis vs the age of Destiny, Atlantis was also lived-in, so as time goes on, technology in the city could have been upgraded, renovations done on the buildings, etc, where Destiny had been empty since it's launch with nobody to look after her. I can totally see how people might think that Atlantis would be older. But it's good that there was a definitive answer given by one of the creators of the shows.
I would assume that Atlantis was built first, but lived in longer. Destiny was launched unmanned. When it launched, Atlantis probably looked a lot like Destiny in terms of technology. But they continued to live in Atlantis, to innovate in the tech that they had. Meanwhile Destiny just continued on with no upgrades.
Plausible but neither one has MWG style ring transporters while Atlantis has those elevator/transporters. We know the city was occupied for apparently millions of years and must've changed while Destiny never was, we assume, and just never had them. Considering how much help those would've been built into the gate pedestal it's reasonable to think Destiny was from before ring transporters came along, so probably older than Atlantis no matter how much the city changed.
Writers made mistakes remembering their own previously established facts...they're human after all... Just like when Zelenka in Vegas tells McKay “the wraith needs a power source (US national grid) to signal Pegasus from earth, Even a ZPM can’t do that” 🤣 ...a ZPM that when explodes takes out most of an entire solar system is less powerful than the power grid of Nevada, according to that episode 😆
@@metalzonemt-2 originally when they brought up the idea of the ZPM it was supposed to be powerful enough to wipe out all life in the milky way, but then they dialed it back when they got to Atlantis, but i do remember an defective ZPM that was very unstable and could potentially cause a much more massive payload of the average ZPM because of how unstable this one was in comparison.
@@metalzonemt-2 you’re thinking of the depleted one that (Cumulus) gave SG1 that was coated with a bomb material that would destroy the surface of the earth , a half to fully charged one would indeed destroy the solar system.
It was Project Arcturus that destroyed 5/6 of a solar system, not a ZPM. McKay rigged a ZPM overload on the Asuran Atlantis and three ZPMs only destroyed the ship, there was no effect on Lantea.
Vegas happens in an alternate reality. Maybe in that reality they never encountered a proper, fully charged ZPM, just almost depleted ones. In that reality they don't even know about Atlantis. BTW if this is true, then how the wraith know about Earth?
Been reading a lot of the remarks on here. Personally, there still is years of shows here. Atlantis, and universe could have gone the power and weapons motifs, original Stargate could have touch all that and new worlds and people and new ships. Either way, all 3 were the best shows ever and look forward to a new day when SG comes back to thrill us and answer new questions. How did they make zpms, destiny's power charging, just for starts, battle ships with mass weapons and shields and new gizmos ect, ect. Who haven't we run into out there, what new people's, civilization, maybe another tollens group, trade gizmos and medicines and food. It's just endless. Anyway, waiting patiently on another new show.
I like to think that atlantis is older, but it got updates as the Ancient technology got more advanced, that what I believe, and the idea that I'm using in my table top.
Well the reason why it never came to mine about the Stargates on Atlanta was newer was that the ancients was living there so they were doing upgrades to the city
I always thought that Destiny is older. Destiny looks older and it has an aesthetic similar to the SG-1 gates and DHD, which we know are 2nd-gen technology.
The seeder ships were automated and sent out long before atlantis' construction. Made sense to me. Hell, even some kind of ancient experiment that they just sent on its way and kept on
I might have missed it. Did the Ancients sent out multiple "Destiny's" in multiple directions or just a single ship? I would think the Ancients would send multiple ships towards larger galaxy cluster seeding planets and gathering information instead of just one.
@TJ of Someplace it makes sense, it's silly to think they were only in the milky way and Pegasus after that. But I dunno about more Destiny ships, because it chasing the signal remember, it has to go in a specific direction (origin of the big bang) so Destiny is technically headed directly for the centrepoint of the entire universe.
@TJ of Someplace yea that would be interesting, I always though maybe some ancients may have just started following along Destiny path, using the stargates like a nomadic tribe seeding civilisation. Like the crew of the Destiny in the drone galaxy. The descendants of Destiny crew had started to move along the corridor of gates and unfortunately attracted the drones and got wiped out? Because Destiny went through Pegasus first, maybe it went through ida, who knows. But surely the nearest few galaxies at least would be inhabited by some ancients that decided to move on after the milky way was seeded and humans too.
Actually I think Atlantis is older, the reason, to why Destiny isn't as advanced as Atlantis is, because Atlantis has been renovated and updated for tens or hundreds of thousands of years after Destiny has been send on the mission. Atlantis has had it's last updates ten thousand years ago, when Ancients left it, but Destiny has never been updated, it has been built hundreds of thousands of years ago and immedietly send on the mission. (sorry, for the bad grammar, but English is my third language and I started watching the shows in the original a few weeks ago - until then I always saw them in my native language)
I mean.. It could very well be that Atlantis was older but since people lived on it it was constantly upgraded so it was much more advanced by the time the ancients abandoned it.
Regarding SGO, David is right, canon evolves but where fans had issues is many felt Catherine's past has been retconned. Which is often frowned upon. You may like the perception you have about a character and how they fit in but then some new info about them comes to light that entirely changes how you receive them. Like for example: Say Destiny actually had a previous crew of explorers who are long gone. As good or bad as that sounds it changes the idea (one I personally like) that Destiny has been empty since its launch and Rush and co are the first.
The technology on Destiny looks older than Atlantis. The look of Destiny is so much more robust, it has a feel of say NASA Apollo, compared to NASA Space Shuttle being more akin to Atlantis. Also the gates that Destiny uses to connect to on the planets are only needed to be short range and of limited function. Since they are manufactured on an automated assembly line on an automated ship, they may be designed to be as simple as possible. In fact it would be suprising if they weren't meant to be as simple as can be, since complexity brings problems that could be avoided.
The Destiny stargates are clearly designed to use less power because it means less materials needed to be gathered by the seeding ships which we have to assume are also the same ships used to gather materials.
Yep. Not only it looked more advanced but it also was able to solve a huge problem they previous two generations of gates had. That being manual dialing. It sounds wierd considering that in many cases the ability to manually dial the gate could save you from problems. On the other hand it also means that its easier for "less worthy" beings to access the network wheter or not they have access to a DHD. But that wasn't the reason why they removed this feature from the pegasus gates. Simply put the previous generations were more mechanical. More moving parts mean more things that could end up broken (SG-1 Season 2: The Fifth Race, SG-1 Season-8: Zero Hour).
@@vadfarkas14 at the time the issue of a gait breaking wasn't as big a deal as it would be during the time of the shows and films. Its like breaking down on a busy modern interstate today, it sucks but you are in the middle of an active living civilization and help is never far away. During the era of the shows and films its more like someone that barely knows what a car is discovers a running car and must depend on it to get them from place to place with practically no infrastructure or people to rely on when things break. Plus like, vampire hobos.... the analogy may be a bit thin by this point.
I think the question of whether Destiny is older than Atlantis is out of place, it's clear that it is. The more important question is whether is older Destiny or the Antarctic Stargate, which is supposedly 50 million years old. At first glance, it looks like it's the Antarctic Stargate, since Destiny's Stargates have a shorter range and are less durable, but that may be due to the nature of Destiny's task, where the Stargates were basically just for resupply, so were basically just disposable. And they were built automatically to save as much energy as possible in production, needed to fly and make many more Stargates at the same time, so they also have a shorter range. And no need to travel across the galaxy for resupply, and maybe don't even have location updates because the Seed ship "seeded" Stargates a few centuries or decades before Destiny's flyby, so due to the movement of the stars, it's not even possible for them to have a longer range. So I'd say Destiny is no older than 50 million years, maybe it wouldn't even last that long in a functioning state. Destiny is probably much newer than Antarctic Stargate, but still older than Atlantis.
What I didn't get was gate addresses were well defined as a point in space by that time. Destiny was moving the entire time. I could understand Atlantis computer keeping track of (or calculating) it's location based on time. But then they dialed it from a random planet, so was the DHD keeping track of Destiny's location in case someone dialed it's access code???
Most people don’t understand how purpose built Destiny is compared to other known ships even Atlantis! It has several technologies specifically designed for it’s mission and extreme long term use. It’s FTL system is FTL but not Hyperspace specifically, so it can scan for the signatures in CMBR that show intelligent design. They had to have some form of super advance/sarcophagus technology built into Destiny, since 50 million years later it still hasn’t collected all the data it needs. The energy collection of the ship was done via stars, because either ZPM’s were not created then or were not viable for production on ship. The gates on the ship are the earliest prototype of stargates known with limit range and function. From the Ori movie, we know Amil who created the Ark of Truth, was the one to also design the first prototype of the gates, this happen back in Alteran original home galaxy! We also see far more design similarities between the Alteran ship that was used to leave their original home galaxy and Destiny compared to any other Lantean technology. We know the Alteran settled first on Dakara when they arrived in Avalon (Milky Way) so the Destiny Project must’ve happened not far off then since it was launched from Earth but no remains or mentions of it existed. Fun fact is whether Alterans were around on Earth when the dinosaurs extinction happened? Also the Alterans gave up on Destiny project because it would have taken million upon millions of years to discover their answers, which is what prompted their society to look for alternatives which was ascension, this came directly from their search for the intelligent design in CMBR, it won’t surprise me if they did discover traces of it on their travel from original home galaxy to Avalon since it was so far away hyperspace travel was deemed too slow to be viable travel form!
Most of the search results I find for how old the Destiny is only say it launched "over 50 million years ago." One video by The Gate Guy talking about whether or not the Destiny gate could dial gates on the seed ships says the seed ships (tho I don't recall if he cited a source) were launched about 2000 years before the Destiny herself. One video by Generation Films about the Destiny talks about the confusion over the age of the ship and cites (tho I can't find the entry) Joseph Mallozzi's "blog" where he states that "the 60 million year figure is correct and thus predates the gates in the milky way galaxy." Other than thinking 60 was a typo and that he meant 50, this seems right to me given that the Destiny predates the Ancient Gene security protocol and has the v1 gate if you think of the SG-1 gate as v2 and the Atlantis gate as v3. The 1 million year figure provided by the comic "Back to Destiny" seems counter to established lore given that the Ancients fled the Milky Way 5-10 million years ago and didn't come back until 10,000 years ago.
One ship was between Galaxies at "Relativistic speed" Which meant even though the people onboard were only a few years older over ten thousand years had passed for Atlantis and Milky way. If Destiny was traveling at "Relativistic speed" So the ships computer would count the time that passed as Hundreds of thousands years how many years passed in the normal flow of time?
@@DialtheGate Because the communication is instant (or close enough to) because it's traveling through subspace. Quite literally outside of either physical plane of reference relative to Destiny.
Othala the galaxy was named after Othala the planet in Ida galaxy. The Asgard move there because of increasing replicator presence in Ida. This is SG1 canon
The way I understand it, Daniel never reached peak enlightment, and thus never unlocked all of his abilities as an Ascended being. I doubt Oma would have even let him as she probably knew that he would be incapable of staying impartial.
I see it just as an expression to imply that something is really old. Then there's a mathematical interpretation of it too: If you say something is millions of years old, it can't be less than that. But if you say something is hundreds of thousands of years old.... well, there's no upper limit to that, you can just keep counting in increments of a hundred thousand years until you reach far beyond the millions.
If Atlantis was older it would show a great many signs of being so. It would show signs of being updated and overhauled. there would still be remnants of the original architecture not to mention records of having done so. I so absolutely no evidence or reason to believe that Atlantis is older.
Good, because whether he realizes it or not, you can not build an Atlantis system before you have Destiny's tech, Destiny has to predate any Atlantis style system; or to put it another way the Atlantis cities are a later improved development of the Destiny tech.
I don't understand how this is even a question, It's very obviously older than even the milkyway gates. Several times we hear the Destiny gate is one of the first gates ever made, Atlantis left for Pegasus sometime around 1 million to 10 million years ago, and the oldest milkyway gate we know of was 50 million years old, so Destiny is somewhere above 50 million years old.
We know that Atlantis was launched from Earth "several million years ago", but we know nothing about the Ancients' maintenance and upgrades to the city-ship during the several million years they spent in Pegasus. It could very easily be that, as durable and long-lived as their technology is, maybe the Ancients undertook a formal rebuilding of the city every 100,000 years or so. Look up the "Ship Of Thesus". Maybe the Atlantis we saw submerged 10,000 years ago had no parts in common with the city that initially brought the Ancients to Pegasus. It could have been rebuilt several times over, and the current Atlantis could be far less than a million years old. We also know that the Pegasus Ancients built at least one other city ship while in Pegasus. It may be that they built a whole fleet of them in Pegasus (before the Wraith first became a serious threat, I would assume) and incorporated a few minor pieces of older city-ships into the build of the newer models, like reusing seasoned ship timber for sentimental reasons in the keel or planks of a new wooden ship. As for Destiny, in the episode "Aftermath", the one where the shuttle crashed, the ship's AI (in the guise of Dr. Franklin) told Rush that the ship spent "over a million years" in flight. Sadly, no exact age was given.This estimate of "over a million years" fits perfectly with the passage of time in the show's two seasons. It took Destiny several months to finish crossing the Nakai's galaxy, then an unspecified period of possibly months to cross the void to the galaxy of Novus.
A city isn't built and left at the stage it is built. Tue city could have been occupied and improved upon for millions of years. A ship gets built and can at best have slight modifications built on it but if its unmanned then...
It's really fun to think about it, who knows; how many ships like Destiny's? how many city like Atlantist? what at the end of the journey of SGU? did they find what they're looking for? What Furlings looks like? What if the Alien at the end of SGU actually the good guys and they're trying to stop Destiny's because it might unleashed something they should not know?
@@pupinek123pupinek2 wow, that's a good question, how about you, how they can dial up to others ship? Maybe, different specific types of gates which solely to connect with other ship through mainframe and database. Which only can be unlocked using unique signatures 🤷♂️
@@muhammaduqbahahmadtermizi1252 Other ships you mean the Seed ships ? We dont know if the have stargates. Seed ships were meant to be completely self sufficient without crew. So they propably dont have stragates. And if there are more ships like Destiny ? Who knows. What is interesting is that all the existing gates have 9 chevrons (Milky way and Pegasus) Its like all the gates have the capability to dial up Destiny.
I recall a scene in the show where the commander kills an injured guy after a crash, by covering his mouth. As they are flying down to a planet, the ship's AI tells Rush, "The weather is pretty rough." Rush says, "The Ancients built that shuttle." And the AI replies, "The Ancients built that shuttle a million years ago." Rush radios the pilot, "Watch out for the weather."
Just the chair is a good giveaway of this. The gate types on the ship also seems to be somewhere in between the basic and the Atlantis type. Also if you have a technology of Atlantis you should have ZPMs all around as back up batteries. Not to mention drones. Bit of side story. There is no way in hell McKay/Carter duo can not figure out how to catch up on Destiny with the Hammond. Asgard core configured to replicate Atlantis wormhole drive...... :D
@druidofscosglen2868 Asgard have 60.000 years of history. The Core works like a mind reader and not a library. You have to "explain" to it what you want to make.
What about the the Asgard in aren't they at least in two galaxies? In their original galaxy and aren't first contact in Pegasus with Atlantis also begs question aren't Asgard in Pegasus after end of unending where they blow up in their original Galaxy?
Its only true to the best of his knowledge, and not everyone is right about everything. Great for the clarification though that we know Destiny is older.
Well, maybe the moment of Destiny launching was given in Destiny's local time (it was written in the ship's logbook or something, wasn't it?) and because it's constantly moving with at least relativistic speed the time dilation factor makes the Earth time goes some 100x faster, so in Earth local time it was launched dozen million years ago?
According to the comics, Destiny and city ships were competing projects and Destiny was finished first. Hard to say if Atlantis specifically was that old.
To be honest it's probably best to consider the comics and books as non cannon if they come up against evidence in cannon disproving them. Or in this case the word of a show runner. It's also pretty obvious that the destiny is older that both the milky way gate system and Atlantis. The gate is inferior, the chair is inferior, and most importantly the destiny has a light speed drive while Atlantis has an obviously superior and faster intergalactic hyper drive.
@@matyasofinvention6304 It's not that obvious to me. City ships and the gate system have been very obviously upgraded over the course of their existence. I can imagine Atlantis being as old as destiny, but ship-of-theseus style, where literally everything on atlantis was replaced by upgrades. The pegasus gate system is known to be seeded by destiny's vanguard of seed ships. In fact, it's known to be the very first one. It was obviously upgraded afterwards. The reason why destiny doesn't use hyperdrive is because it can't due to the nature of its mission. We know this was a deliberate choice, because ancients had intergalactic hyperdrives at that point (we know this, because the Ori have them too).
@@matyasofinvention6304 It is also possible that Destiny's gates are not an older design than milkyway's. It may be the case they are deliberately simplified to make it possible to build them quickly using easily accessible resources. Notice the seed ships need to progress at least as fast as destiny. How the hell would they find large enough deposits of naquadah to churn out milkyway-type stargates quickly enough? You might counter-argue that Destiny's gate is also that simple design for no apparent reason, but we don't know if that's true. It's clearly capable of dialing earth. The thing that limits its rage when connecting to nearby planets seems to be the simple design of the gates it is connecting to.
I'm no pro, but wouldn't it be reasonable to presume the seed ships were sent out and then Atlantis was later moved (did they move it from Earth or build it there? I forget) to the new galaxy once it was discovered and seeded? They were all sent from Earth weren't they? That's what I thought anyway.
I never liked the fact that the timeline for the ancient civilization was on the order of 50 million years. One million years, maybe...but to me even that's a stretch. The reason being is that it doesn't seem realistic. How could a civilization remember its own history for that long, let alone something not wipe it out or it not wipe itself out? If the ancients had been around for a little over a million years, Destiny was 900,000 and Atlantis was say 500,000 years old...that just seems more plausible to me rather than they left the Ori galaxy 50 million years previous and the gate system is millions of years old. Doesn't matter ultimately, love stargate no matter what
Could it be some issue of difference in time passage due to gravitationally induced time dilation? I know it seems like while standing on the deck of the Destiny you'd go off of it's local, absolute time for age, and the same while at Atlantis, but couldn't the Destiny be hundreds of thousands of years old in it's local temporal reference frame, but older than Atlantis by Atlantis' temporal reference frame? I know this effect has been proven by our astronauts, specifically with one twin who is now slightly younger than the other. If this is the case we might even be able to establish specific ages of Atlantis and Destiny that correlate to Destiny's distance from it's launch point.
That would make sense if there was a time dilation while they talk with folks back on Earth, particularly during FTL, but we see time flowing the same.
My headcanon is that the Destiny's mission was complete long ago. That the ancients figured out how to get data back from Destiny, mayby using the gate somewhat like the Midway bridge to get a data connection. Then the data it collected allowed them to create the ZPMs.
If Destiny's mission was complete then there would be records on board detailing that. I straight up think the Ancients literally just forgot Destiny even existed.
@@godofawesum223 Would there? Or would the ancients have just grabbed the data and done everything else? Also said data would later be hidden or destroyed like all the rest of the data on producing ZPMs presumably was given it was never found.
My head canon is that Atlantis has existed before destiny. But it’s like New York. It’s taken many forms and evolved over time. The modern Atlantis was built long after destiny launched. But an “Atlantis” was around before that, just more primitive.
2:57 I'd like to argue against assention making you all-knowing. Daniel might have all the knowledge in his mind, but it would be similar to having all human knowledge on you phone. You might not know the mass of the moon but can easily pull it up
Why do we need this question asked? it's clear the ship is much older then the city. just look at the weapons they have.the city has solely drones for protection where the ship has guns,a support ship and not a puddlejumper gate ship craft.if you don't have this much common sense these shows are too much for you.
The stargates on destiny could also have a shorter range, because they're made by the seed ships (automated) and may not have all the best materials, having to use materials only from the planets in the seed ships path. (Are they made of naquadah like Milky Way stargates? I think they're made of naquadah anyways.)
In SGU they said destiny was launched from Earth from this statement we can assume Destiny was launched before the Anchients fled the plague in the milky way to another galaxy, so yes Destiny is likely much older than Atlantis.
I wish you two shows go back on Stargate Atlantis. Stargate Universes I want you guys bring this back I don't know why you guys can't Truitt and no reason I love Stargate
Well, wouldn't the seed ships need to go first? They are probably the oldest. Even with the advancements, I think the seed ships need to have been 100K years ahead of Destiny. This gave the ships time to plan out routes and build the gates. At least the Ancients tech is backward compatible.
It's not hard to get tow different microphones to be the same volume. Use a limiter or compressor. Right now my fucking ear are ringing since I turned up to David then Darrens voice melted my headphones.It's not a small difference. 11dB by the meter of my mixer.
Yeh... I think you care too much about not being wrong by telling "canon evolves" instead of "retcon". Stargate is my fav sci-fi show. But the the flaws of coherency were always here, without disguising behind "canon evolves" quote. Even if canon do evolves as fact, doesn't mean you can put this everytime to justify flaws in writing or mistakes with lines of dialogues. Here, with all the content of SGU and other shows, we can definitely put things together. Like, Ancient seat command is older on the Destiny than on Atlantis, so it means Destiny is older in conception / launch. Things like that. But there is also those other things, being problematic or anachronistic, and never explained. In the facts, canon evolving is the best trick used by writers to justify their mistakes. Nothing wrong with that when it's still "logical" or accurate trough explanation. But sometimes, it's a bit easy. Like, during 8 years, you had this idea / concept ascended beings are by definition pure hearted and without malice. Then you have the brain using x% capacity to evolve. Then you have ascended beings able to ascend others non ascended beings. Then you have... The Oris. Or the stargates deposited by ships to stake out Destiny's path: why Milky Way doesn't have it? Destiny departure was Earth. Does it mean, Destiny crossed all the Milky way without having any planet to reach? If stargates from SGU are older, and Ancients colonized Milky Way with models we saw in SG1, it means they colonized Milky Way BEFORE launching Destiny, because Destiny USE stargate concept. And they spread stargates ARRIVING in the Milky Way. You can't send a ship with a Stargate inside able to connect with other stargates if you don't have the concept of stargates ongoing since long time. Or it's like sending a ship with a smartphone inside before smartphone was created. So why models are older and limited in reach in SGU? Or more, why the system of gates in the Milky Way is the same since the network was created, but the ones from Destiny are older in design and reach, when it must have been created after the current design found in the Milky Way? Technically, the door inside Destiny's ship must have been created based on the model you found on the Milky Way, because, you can't lauch a ship with a stargate inside, able to connect with other stargates, without having stargate devices created. Also, the fact Destiny has remote to activate stargates, and there is no DHD. Again: - You have a stargate inside Destiny - Destiny was launched from Earth - Destiny's stargate must connect to other stargates to let people come in - Stargates use whormholes - Stargate are deposited by Seed ships for Destiny's path - Seed ships are launched BEFORE Destiny's launch - Stargates were created BEFORE Seed ships were launched - Stargates were spread in the Milky Way BEFORE Destiny's departure ... But stargate inside Destiny or the ones from the Seed ships are "older" from the current model from Milky Way. ... But current model in the Milky Way is the same since its creation based on so many dialogues from SG1, SGA. If they launched Destiny and Seed ships BEFORE creating stargates, how Seed ships can provide a path of stargates for Destiny? If they launched Destiny and Seed ships AFTER creating stargates, how stargates deposited by Seed ships are older than Milky Way stargates? You see the problem or anachronism, or i start again? You have a tech described as older than any tech saw in the franchise from Ancients, the one in SGU, launched AFTER the current tech we saw in SG1, the gates, or it would have mean they launched Destiny with a stargate inside before developing stargate, in would have not make any sense at all, specially considering the main concept is the 9th chevron as a fixed address to reach Destiny wherever it's located in the universe. Gates are older than Destiny if you considerate Ancients started to colonize Milky Way before launching Destiny, but Destiny's gate is older than their development in the Milky Way. ... Or the gene of the Ancients to activate devices: they told trough Atlantis series, it was a way to prevent Wraiths to use their technology. But in the facts, Atlantis was launched from earth, and the seat founded in Antarctic, that is older than the departure of the Ancients from Milky way to Pegasus, is activated trough the gene only. It's pure anachronism. Or the inconsistency of how to activate the supergate. Because, if i remember correctly, the amount of energy was basically tremendous, black hole only way, however, Ark of truth, go & back, not really a problem. Or the supergate itself: the size of the elements. First, each part came out from a stargate, so, what is the diameter again, 3m? Then you see each element is way bigger than a ship not able to go trough the stargate... Or the gates in SGU: how do they have power & energy to work again, without DHD? Those gates only work trough Destiny handle controller to activate. How do they activate between them? It was established trough years of episodes in SG1 that the DHD provides the power, or any kind of power can sources the gate, but still, this need power to activate. Sometimes the other gate provide the power, but in SGU, gates are alimented by? I mean, at some point, they focused too much on "don't minding details", when it was the cement of why Stargate was great: the lore, to the point the lore itself changed for one episode, then changed again, or else. Like communications in subspace or during hyperspace or else. One time it's impossible to contact a ship in hyperspace, other time they have Landry doing a speech on 3 screens directly from earth when they are currently on hyperspace... Or in SGU, one time Destiny's shield protects from any kind of energy blast because of frequency, but if you specify the right frequency, the shield is stronger against weapons using this frequency, however, they can do kamikaze impact. but... They go INSIDE a sun, sun is also matter, not only energy. So, a drone can do kamikaze damage, but sun "physical" impacts don't do damages? But when you're in hyperspace, you can't use the shields (Asgard tech at least). Demonstrated with how they exploded a ship on hyperspace to counter replicators and destroy them by self-destruct of the ship to explode them on hyperspace. Or Destiny's shield again, with FTL: they told Destiny don't use hyperspace travel, and remain in the current "dimension" it is, so obviously the shield is activated when it is on FTL, but they don't suffer problems of time relativity or else. But if you watch this episode of SGA, they encounter an Aurora battle ship full of Ancients who traveled without using hyperspace remaining in same dimension but with speed close to light, definitely being affected by relativity, because they departed from Atlantis 10000 years ago, then still only a few weeks? days?... Past for them? So what, the FTL device from Destiny has this "bubble hyperspace explanation". Ok. But what is this bubble? Hyperspace use another dimension "road". So, Destiny use... What? A "bubble road"? Still on same dimension but using bubble which isn't same dimension by definition? I loved all this ideas about different ways to travel. But some of them really are too much full of inconsistency. Well, whatever. Still my best favorite sci-fi franchise.
Being Amazon has this we can look to see what they shall decide . Hoping it shall be good is about all I can hope for myself . If you look at the full body of work then this does have a great shot at being something special that we can all look forward too . I just hope they do something before I become ascended .
A statement like "Hundreds of thousands" is an abstract amount, much like the word "several". Ignoring that Rush was making an estimate on screen, the statement shouldn't be taken as meaning an exact amount. Calling destiny hundreds of thousands of years old or millions of years old, mean the same thing really.
According to the wiki (which has info from the comics/books that continued the story), Destiny was launched over 50 million years ago, while Atlantis was built some 30 million years ago, on Earth. Though I have a memory of them coming on/with Atlantis from the Ori galaxy with Atlantis? Or did they come by some other means. Either way, Destiny is far older than Atlantis, and the other city ships for that matter, as apparently the city ships were still in the planning stages when Destiny was launched.
Nah they came from the ori galaxy in a very large ship, a type of city ship but not Atlantis. In one of the Atlantis episodes it said they launched Atlantis approx 3 million years ago not 30. It literally comes up on the screen in the episone where they find ancient woman frozen in the ice.
Destiny does not have to be older than Atlantis. Unless of course, the Atlantis we see was built as we see it. If you took a B-17 and flew it over modern day New York, the B-17 is antiquated compared to the current version New York. This doesn't mean New York is younger.
Logically, Destiny is older as it was the one that "seeded the gate system" in general. Meaning it had to travel further and do more traveling through a galaxy to seed the gates. PLUS, Atlantis was considered the "crowning achievement" for the Ancients, and either the "actual" last city or at least one OF the last cities founded. So, not as old, but actually more advanced. Also: 100s of 1000's CAN BE Millions. And since Rush would have NO MEANS to determine HOW MANY 100's of 1000's, it is easily capable of being 3million while Atlantis is 2million. Not to mention the possibility of "rounding numbers" so that 2.5 would be rounded UP to 3, but 2.4 would be rounded DOWN to simply 2.
I think the reason you could not travel galaxy wide was because of safety issues and the reason you couldn't travel back to the milky way was because of security reasons
There's no reason to believe Rush knows what he's talking about. He's not all knowing, just a smart dude who stumbled upon Destiny. He could have misinterpreted the date. He had tendencies of arrogance and lying so i'm not suprised. Atlantis date is set in stone since it was a flashback with a date on the screen, so that one is for sure right.
I always fanwank the discrepancy as the Destiny and the seeder ships were built at the same time but the word launch is NOT the build date. It isn't even the date that it was in space and travelled to the edge of the next universe. It's official "launch" is only when it started it's journey to the other universe. Think of it like, a helicopter or plane is just a plane UNTIL it picks up the President. ONLY then does it get the classification Marine One or Air Force One. So it wasn't Destiny, some other designation would hold the prior launch date, until it reached the other universe.
All you had to look at was the tech involved. No drones, weaker shielding, primitive computer systems, and then look at the style of the building compared to atlantis. Atlantis, as depicted, did not take off from the ancients homeworld, so most likely it was built after they left and landed in the milky way. Destiny would be in response to something they learned after leaving home and it would require less materials than atlantis.
The thing confuses me about Ancents timeline leaving earth they leave behind Cyla Urbanus ( or Ayiana) who gets frozen and sg1 interact with has the virus that wiped out the ancients that didn't ascend so that means that they ether had the virus while in pegasus but had no issues for that entire time or they came back and somehow got the virus again after millions of years
From what I surmised the uninflected flees the Galaxy with some remaining till the virus ran it’s course and then they restarted life, she was probably exposed at some juncture in that period
Just look at the architecture and design of both things and how damaged Destiny was. Atlantis was technically much more advanced. Sure Destiny is way older. No question about that.
well, hundreds of thousands of years does fit within the limitation of millions of years if we aren't specifying how many hundreds are required to determine Destiny's age...so Rush wasn't wrong, just really vague
You can tell by the visual aesthetic that Destiny is way older, I thought that when I first watched when aired, but then again what happened to kino's and remote DHD's on Atlantis? Off topic though, in respect to what came first, I don't feel the Destiny Stargate is the first iteration, the sketch by Amelius was clearly what led to the Milky Way gate, the glyph icons are not Destiny-style, they're Milky Way-style.
Destiny was build for a long-duration semi-unmanned flight. I think it would be designed to be spartan and rugged than Atlantis, which would benefit from having a full-time crew.
well, maybe destiny was sent out at the time they were in construction of atlantis and the ships we saw in the show and they needed the gates put in planets....several million years ago atlantis left earth for pegasus galaxy...so go figure estimate calculation based on what was said or shown in the show....
Atlantis on Earth, before the plague, was millions of years ago. Destiny was launched before the plague. Atlantis fled Earth and spent the long journey to the Pegasus galaxy using time dilation to ride out the plague and let life re-evolve. Atlantis arrived in the Pegasus galaxy ten-thousand-plus years ago and came into conflict with the Wrath.
Destiny was tens, possibly hundreds, of millions of years old. This is a multiple of hundreds of thousands, so Rush wasn't wrong it that scene. Atlantis left Earth 'several millions of years ago', and was probably already millions of years old, or it may have been built to get to Pegasus. Either way, compared to Destiny, Atlantis is basically brand new.
This pertains to Stargate in general with how things work. I thought it was always convenient they only had one bar of power left on the ZPM. I always thought it made better sense for the ZPMs to power much smaller vehicles than something as large as Atlantis. Something like the shield generators on the Children of the Corn planet made perfect sense. Something as large as Atlantis or any other large facility should be able to tap directly into subspace to access Zero Point Energy (ZPE) and use just like turning on a light switch instead of having to use ZPM/batteries. The Ancients were pretty smart and were able to manufacture ZPMs so why not connect directly to the source or at least find the ZPM manufacturing/charging facility on Atlantis, it's probably in the same location as the one on the Replicator Atlantis. I noticed the offworld gates weren't connected to a power source other than the Power Crystal in the DHD and that connection to the gate was wireless. I'm assuming there's a highly advanced Tesla Coil type wireless electrical connection going on here. It would also make better sense if the DHD was some kind of Tesla Coil that harnessed either the planet's natural electrical field or the ZPE in subspace, again no need for the Power Crystal. I can see the ZPM and Power Crystal as plot devices to limit stories but in actuality they're a redundancy or power cells for smaller vehicles and devices.
@@metalzonemt-2 From what I can remember that was the case. Instead of incrementally moving the power setting up at 1% at a time, Rodney got greedy and went in multiples of 10% which led to the overload. I knew from the beginning of the episode it wasn't going to work because the ZPM was their plot device to manage the show so they had to show something else that didn't work to keep the fans at bay. I was thinking from an outside the box point of view of the show as to what may be plausible without the show's ingrained restrictions.
@@JohnFourtyTwo It was established that Project Arcturus wouldn't have worked no matter how much or little power it was attempting to extract. The problem is that subspace is a part of our reality, drawing power from it in that matter, damages the fundamental structures of reality which lead the physics around the containment Chamber breaking down. When this happens there is no way to maintain containment since the fundamental principle of the universe in that localized area don't apply anymore and as a result the power system becomes unstable and explodes. Now if he was drawing less power the explosion might have been smaller, but in the grand scheme of the device's functionality it destroying a country or a solar system is a little immaterial.
i get the feeling that Atlantis did have something like this aboard the city. because you have to remember that the city of the ship was never fully discovered. we only explored a small portion of the city in all seasons of the show, just like that hidden laboratory for janis that had all kinds of advanced tech that were useful, it's just as possible the ship had many other things found within the city that the atlantians were working on or even common place, the ZPM's could have had a charger that was safe and could be used on the ship, compared to that outpost that mkay destroyed that part of the Galaxy with. mkay was a brilliant scientist but he was dumb because of his arrogance and over confidence that got him into trouble in situations that could have been avoided had he paced himself and researched everything with risk factors in mind. funny enough many of the atlantians had this same kind of Hubris which often got them killed because they were too confident that they would always win because of how smart they were. if you remember an episode where they find an aurora class ship that's traveling in FTL and they stop it and find out that real life atlantians are aboard the ship, well in this episode the expedition get kicked out of Atlantis because it belongs to the atlantians and the atlantians decide they have all they need to destroy the replicators. because of a plan they set in motion 10,000 years ago within their base code to never attack their creators. they bet the rest of their lives on that stupid idea that the replicators would never figure it out, so they had no other plans or back up plans just in case things didn't go as planned. like maybe Thor's race was right, they need someone dumber than they are, to figure out how to approach certain decisions in how to defeat an enemy such as the replicators. suddenly regular humans are playing 4d chess and the atlantians and Asgard are playing 2d chess because their superiority in knowledge it's almost like they don't think of contingency plans when they approach an conflict of any kind.
@@quinnsinclair7028 i liked the power extracted from the stars idea that destiny had more than the ZPM tech. like don't get me wrong it was cool that they condensed that power in a much smaller container and that it could run the ship. but they could just as well done the same thing with the power from the stars only much more efficient and hold more power than the tech on the destiny. and what does every Galaxy have plenty of? stars of course, so they had plenty of gas stations in space, and if they wanted to they could make some kind of automated system where they take a small puddle jumper with the ZPM containers integrated into the ship in such a way for it to fly into the chronosphere of the star to extract as much power as needed and take it back home to Atlantis or something like this. or maybe they built a base of operations near the star to collect power but also use the star as an unlimited source of ammo as the destiny had with the use of it's energy weapons as long as they had plenty of fuel in the tank. and use the star to protect themselves against any who might attack them. or just convert a few puddle jumpers into an massive automated flying power house that would charge within the sun and return to Atlantis as if they were like an usb that provided power plugging into the city's grid. i think this sounds kind of cool to be honest. and i wouldn't put this kind of tech idea behind them, have you noticed we haven't seen any of the alteran's second advancements of tech besides the second stargates within the milky way Galaxy, we know that the gould stole their tech, but the gould also designed much of their tech to reflect gould as a species separated from the alterans tech. other than the gate system's and the ring platforms within the milky way galaxy and maybe that download knowledge device they used and also that cube that healed ppl's bodies that the gould reverse engineered into their sarcophagus and the weapon on dakara, i think there might have been some alteran tech that Anubis reverse engineered to use but i'm not sure that tech was indeed the alteran's tech, but we never see any of their space ships or weapons, unless the zat gun and the staff weapon are also based off of alteran tech. but again, no space ships within our galaxy that are alteran tech related exist that we know of. it's almost like they skipped a generation of flying in space and only sent out the automated seed ships within the milky way galaxy to seed planets with stargates. or maybe they did indeed have space ships, but used them all against the wraith or some other foe that we have yet to know about.
Destiny is way older. People needed either traces of ancient DNA or required gene therapy in order to access the systems on Atlantis. Nicholas Rush pointed out that Destiny predated that and no gene therapy was required. Not to mention Destiny had an older Stargate on board.
The Seeder ships (which planted Stargates on planets) were older still. Destiny caught up to one of them in season 2.
Well Atlantis could have been upgraded over the millennia? The Ancient Atlantis may have been a normal city and millions of years later became the city ship we see today.
@@endorfinator5502 i’m sure Atlantis was upgraded over the millennia but in the pilot we see what I’m assuming is Atlantis takeoff from earth and an implication that it flew to Pegasus galaxy.
Or flew off to get pizza.
@@endorfinator5502 Had they continued SGU, they were going to have Eli find another stasis room with some ancients in stasis who were the maintenance crew working on the ship when there was a malfunction that launched the Destiny from
Earth before they could have time to beam off. Eli was going to revive them and in doing so learn that they were not suppose to have been on the ship. They were suppose to have beamed off when the crew for the Destiny boarded but it never happened. Instead they placed themselves in stasis until the other ancients could gate aboard and take over but it never happened. One of the things they were going to inform Eli and the others of was that Atlantis was just in the beginning stages when they left Earth.
The protogates alone mean that either one of two things happened:
1: Destiny is actually over 50 MILLION years old, because of the dated ice around the Antarctic gate.
2: Either the plague that ultimately killed Ayiana (the frozen lady near the Antarctic gate) or some other disaster was so bad ancient society degenerated technologically and had to "reinvent" a lot of stuff, leading to Destiny still having maybe been older than Atlantis, but not quite predating the OG milky way gates.
“Stargate origins, take it or leave it” ya definitely leave it. I always thought destiny was older, it has a different type of ftl, no drone weapons, most of the tech on board wasnt guarded by having or not having the ancient gene, which was a reaction to the wraith. The ship looks cruder than Atlantis too
I agree, Origins did not exist and is not cannon.
Atlantis is older but the difference is where destiny was a ship set on auto pilot Atlantis was a city ship actively lived on and potentially upgrades and developed using vast resources around them also the gate of milky way and pegasus seem more advanced
Why would it have drone weapons? You would want something that is easily replenish able. Using the sun's energy as a weapon is a good way to always have weapons on board. They dont go into great detail but i bet the weapons are packed so dense each shot is like a 100k nuks.
Stargate Universe was my favorite Stargate and I really wish it had gone longer, I'm still heartbroken that it ended so soon
What if rush's madness is infecting your mind.
Anyways, universe took a way darker tone than anything ever done by stargate, maybe it should have ended for the sake of their suffering
The Atlantis problem is easily resolved.
London's 2 thousand years old but there's very little left from its start.
Everything in Atlantis got rebuilt and updated right up until the time they abandoned it.
When we launched voyager 1, that was it. No hardware updates after that time.
The same goes for Destiny.
They state it in the show a few times. Atlantis launch from earth was approx 3 million ago, the milky way gates were said to be around 50 million yrs old and Destiny was said to have been older than that. So, at the very least Destiny is 50 million years old, likely a bit older as the gates Destiny uses are older and less advanced. I don't think they discuss the time issues of the ship using FTL that isn't hyperspace, it physically travels that fast in real space, it should be experiencing extreme time dilation as ftl would be considered relativistic speeds? But they mess all that up with the comm stones and ke3p8mg I'm contact with earth
@@silenttitan416 There's no way it physcally moves that fast. It's probably a warp drive.
@@TheAkashicTraveller well they never specify what kind of FTL it is. It seems to fly in real space as it destroyed the drones when it flew through them. But I suppose technically that could be some sort of warp drive. But remember in stargate Atlantis when they found the ancient crew between galaxies. They were going 99.9% the speed of light if I remember correctly, and that was with sublight engines. I wish SG universe would return and flesh all that out a bit. I can't remember how long it took them to go between the 2 galaxies in the show but it wasn't that long, Destiny is almost as fast as the daedelus(dunno how to spell it lol)
@@silenttitan416I don't recall anyone saying that the Milky Way gates were anywhere near that old. In my mind, I imagine that the Ancients had routine plans for maintenance of the gate network in a well-settled and mostly peaceful galaxy like ours. Whenever they developed new improvements to the basic gate design, they would plan and schedule a galaxy-wide upgrade of all stargates. We never saw the Ancients when they dominated the Milky Way, before the Goa'uld became a threat, but if we could see them, their civilization reined over the galaxy for millions of years, the population probably numbered in many billions and they had millions of ships capable of crossing the galaxy. For them, replacing all gates in the galaxy every 10,000 or 20,000 years would be easy.
If course, if their civilization was a lot smaller than what I described, it might reflect a limited imagination.
@AndrewHalliwell yes, thank you! I just got done writing about this in another comment above. Atlantis could be a real "ship of Theseus".
I wish we could have had a Season 3 of Universe, and season 2 on Blu ray. I also wish for SG-1 on Blu Ray too!
That series should of NEVER been cancelled, they could have taken it all over the place.
I wish we could have had a season 11 of universe
@@scorpiusbalthazar4327 $130 is not worth my time. I've been prepping for survival. At one time I probably would have jumped right on board with purchasing that, but not now. My wife and I just purchased a 4 wheel drive truck and camping equipment to run to the hills in we have to.
I liked in the SGU pilot that there were big gates that the full-size Starships jump through, for some reason got me super excited for the show. Thinking of how they could utilize it for different reasons.
Also I thought it was cool in Stargate Atlantis but they had Gates that were in the vacuum of space. I always thought during SG-1 & constantly posted about it online why didn't the governments of earth or others make a ship, fighter, transport aircraft or vehicle that they take threw the gates. So the SG1 team didn't have to walk everywhere the went on every planet. I mean at least a 4 wheeler or something. Just my thoughts lol
@@scorpiusbalthazar4327 yes but the Blu ray is just poorly done upscale with all the film grain removed.
I've always taken it as canon that Rush didn't want to explain much further to "lesser minds" the minute details that go into such a vast topic of Destiny vs. Atlantis...and that led him to choose the statement he made of 'millions' (instead of billions or what not) when he described it.
He has always been that guy, "...so just do as I tell you cause there's no time to explain or we're all going to die."
Huh, my impression of the man was that he broadly didn't have a damn clue what he was talking about most of the time and was bulldozing people with his arrogant act in order to keep people from questioning his obvious bullshit.
I like the idea that character sometimes misspeak. They are legit human beings, we make mistakes. If properly used , it adds to story telling by misleading the watcher/reader. I hope one day when they do a retcon they have the character blatantly say "I'm human, sue me"
He didn't misspeak. He's from Earth and as a scientist, he simply doesn't know. He's guessing. Common sense tells you that Destiny is older. How else could the gates get out into the Universe???
John Sheppard thinking the gate room would be flooded (despite gate+water interactions not working like that) is probably the definitive example 😂
Misspeaking is tight! 😁
The problem with Origins wasn't that Catherine Langford didn't do that. It's that Ra didn't do that. Had Ra known that Earth was still active he'd have obliterated it and this was prior to the installation of the iris which means that the door was wide open.
Ra knew about earth but ignored it. Not sure if it's cannon but i think in one of the books he tries to occupy it but his ship is obliterated by jumpers and he concludes that earth is a no go because the ancients are protecting it (i believe one of the jumpers was piloted by the Sg-1 team stranded there while another was done by Januus who time travelled with his jumper there. In any case he then simply leaves the planet alone and does his best to make every other goa'uld forget this place exists along with the Jaffa (Season 1 SG1 Teal'c saying: Tau'ri was lost a long time ago).
@@vadfarkas14 Ra was dead by the time Earth had jumpers. Also Ra obviously discovered Earth level of technology in the movie.
@@iondustt mobeius. They went back in time to get a zpm. Hence the jumper. The other jumper was the ancient Januus who travelled there.
I think it's funny, because we're talking about the same jumper, just from separate timelines.
@@iondustt all the ancients who went back to earth from Atlantis could have easily built MANY jumpers and left them all around in the many thousands of years before Cathrines trip and the original movie finds ra. Like specifically the waves of ancients going back during the time that dr. Weir went back in time during the first branching timeline of arriving to Atlantis but instead of going back to earth with them she secretly stayed and put herself into stasis to rotate the zpms every few thousand years so that the city would rise when they got there again in the future.
I always thought Destiny was older than Atlantis. It becomes evident when you look at the designs of the two ships and at the technology they hold.
The chair on Destiny, is an example. When you compare it with the chair Atlantis has. You can see which one is older.
You overthinking it. Atlantis had the adres to destiny, to have adress, means must be younger then destiny. Period. What other explanation is needed ? If it was older it whould not had the adress or posobility to dial it. Also there is a episode that explained that Atlantis was luched at the end of their civilization as a masterpiece of their technology when their planet was destroyed. Destiny on the other hand was lunched in early ages when they where exploring the universe and noticed the code in background radiation. So even try making this a mistery is ONE clickbait or Second the autor of the video lacks the basic knowledge of the Fan of the stargate universe :P
@@Shark-pi4oi Even if Atlantis was older, it could still have the address for Destiny if people had remained in Atlantis until after the launch of Destiny.
@@landshark1215 Could, should, whould. Not likeli as it was lunched as last save of their race. So not realy a posible option. As i said it lunched and was last of their advanced technology. How whould they develop somthing like destiny with their limited resources. They whould not, thats the point of last stand. Later they left the miliky way because they lost hope and wanted start new, later they abandoned all technology and assended. In that order. After assention there was no longer anything build and after atlantis came to the planet where they find it they didnt build any more advanced technology, they where hiding. They created replicators, and kinda Wraith, and they had no idea how to kill them so they hiden. Also ORI where basicli ancient brothers, before they developed most of their technology. Kinda full time job create one disaster after another. :D
@@Shark-pi4oi Atlantis was launched to escape a plague ravaging the Milky Way and their civilization continued in the Pegasus galaxy for almost a million years. But, Atlantis already existed on Earth for an unspecified time before it was launched to Pegasus, so it could still be older than Destiny and just have been upgraded later, with the address for Destiny in its database. That's not to say it is, but your premise is flawed and shows a lack of understanding of the mythos of the shows. The Ancients didn't go into hiding in the Pegasus galaxy until near the end of their time there, because they were losing the war with the Wraith, so they initially hid and then chose to return to Earth. After that, they mingled with the new human civilizations arisen on Earth before ascending.
@@landshark1215 Thats all true and i dont deny it. But how you cant see that all the facts lead only to one conclusion. That destiny was lunched in early stages of their expansion. Not only does the adress in atlantis databese sugest it. So does the posibility to dial it only from advanced gate located on atlantis. The difference in advancement of the ship. Lack of zero point moduls on destiny. The early developed gates used in project are hint as well with their masive downgrades to use. Also later design with advancement had a lot of minimalism implemented not like destiny thats more like cyberpunk look. The lack of clocking technology . There is many small details that make it clearly older model. Even asgard had better ships. IF you stil hold on the slim posibility that anything is posible there whould not be any fact that could change your believe. Also the atlantis had data about most of the ancient stuctures and planets that hiden the technology that was created be merlin, who is one of the guys who deasended back to help humans. The ones who left the atlantis left the human comander in stasis of the ship in the time travel paradox episode. She didnt sleep for milion years. She actualy slept for 10 000 years. That whould also make sense as for now its estimated that merlin and arthur or morgana mith dates around 12 000 years. A destiny is 100 000 years or more old, make the ship in fact younger. :P
What about the other city ship in the Atlantis episode the tower??.Wonder how many city ships the ancients built and I'm sure they all didn't go to Pegasus' and didn't all leave earth at the same time.For all we know Atlantis could have been the first or last city ship to leave earth.
It stands to reason there's other city ships in Pegasus and elsewhere.
there are possibly ancients that weren't okay with ascending.. or the best part is that.. the ascended ancients could come back anytime they want.
a spinoff for the ascended ancients would also be cool, to see wtf they are up to.. but that would take away too much from their mystery
also.. what if the asgards were a splinter group of the ancients in the first place... what if the ancients living in their galaxy were their ancestors who weren't into ascending and were more into cloning and living forever?
I'm watching through SG1 currently and when Daniel starts talking about Atlantis, I'm pretty sure he says it was the Ancients crown jewel and one of the last things they built before disappearing kind of thing. So in my mind there was absolutely no doubt about the answer to this videos question. Destiny is older. Simply because Atlantis was built so late in their civilisation's time-line.
It’s mentioned several times in sgu (just finished it) that the control chair on destiny was a very early model. A precursor to the one found on earth or in Atlantis.
Daniel isn't always right, we see Atlantis taking off from earth in the pilot. Either Daniel is wrong about when that happened or Rush is wrong about how old destiny is.
@@DaDunge By the time it takes off from earth the ancients we're already almost wiped out by a plague.
Their journeys in pegasus we're probably considered the tail end of their civilization.
@@DaDunge Atlantis was used to leave Earth, they failed to defeat the Wraith and were wiped out.
Destiny was sent out long before they left Earth.
@@KillerofGods Yes but Daniel says it's millions of years ago that the ancients left for Pegasus.
What happens on screen is canon, but you're right, that doesn't mean a character can't misspeak or be wrong about something. The Othalla thing, it wasn't clear if Daniel was referencing the galaxy or the planet, because the question itself was a bit vague. If the question is a bit vague, then why can't Daniel be as confused as the audience about the question he's being asked?
I think this is important. What happens in Canon, but canonically wrong is still valid; and canon.
@@SkylerLinux indeed, characters can be canonically wrong.
Rush could have been just saying hundreds of thousands, but was really meaning so many hundreds of thousands it would be millions.
I'm glad you guys are still at this. :)
It's specifically said in canon that Destiny is the oldest technology ever seen and that Atlantis is the crown jewel that served right up until the Ancients abandoned Pegasus.
That would mean Atlantis was possibly the last city ship launched by the ancients...which would subsequently be equipped with the most up to date tech available....
I believe at some point it was said that Destiny gate might have been one of the first (so that would put it millions of years ago when Alteran colonised milky way), while Atlantis was launched during the plague and Lanteans left it to mingle with early humans only 12 thousand years ago or so.
Atlantis I believe was a prototype. They speak of a even more grandiose project that was being built when the plague hit. It was the plague that stopped work on it as it was one of the sites of the first infections. They moved to trying to cure the plague and find other options, like the strange time machine SG1 finds that only creates a time loop. When all those efforts failed all those left uninfected boarded Atlantis and left the Milky Way for Pegasus.
@@GamerLoggos We see several other city ships in the different series'
With the exception of the communications stones and terminal and the Ark of Truth
technically, "hundreds of thousands" can also be "millions." It's just more "hundreds of thousands" than a few which, granted, isn't the usual usage, but it isn't incorrect.
You are technically correct. The best kind of correct.
Precisely. It's like the word "several", an abstract amount. It annoys me when fans jump to one definitive assumption and then fight over it. In this case, onscreen canon is an abstract amount.
Yeah, fifty hundred thousand is five million, just said differently.
What about that scene where rush finds the chair and they ask don’t they need the gene and rush said this technology predates that technology
Excellent point
Sure, but this is Rush talking. Even if he wasn't manipulating or outright lying, he could simply be wrong. Humans in SG always only had fragments of knowledge of the ancients. He puts the pieces together, and with his star-system-sized ego claims final answers. There's plenty of contradictions in dialogue - don't get too attached to things people say, especially when they aren't particularly trustworthy, are known for at least "short-cutting" answers and are way too impressed with themselves. Now, if they actually found records and talked about those, we would have some stronger evidence. It's certainly possible Rush was referencing those, but we don't know. And even with explicit records, we don't know if they were interpreted correctly, if they were faulty (due to human/ancient error or data corruption over time, for example), or heck, maybe it was just a sci-fi novel some ancient guy was writing :)
Not to mention that technology just doesn't work that way. Even if you know the gene lock was used in Pegasus, and wasn't used in Milky Way (which is already _very_ tricky to establish, especially when you consider that there were at least two migrations of ancients, not to mention the whole Dakara superweapon thing!), that doesn't mean it was a novel technology, or that you should expect it was automatically used everywhere once it was developed. It was used on Atlantis for a reason - that same reason wasn't necessarily at play for Destiny, and each technology also has drawbacks. According to most of the information we have, the Ancients were _really_ ancient, so they were very different from our current (and ridiculously short, compared to the Ancients' development) high-tech race. Technology isn't a progression from worse to better; everything has benefits and costs.
@@DialtheGate a little off topic here. I never understood the purpose of the Stargate in SGU they can only be use when destiny was in the system and it had about 6 hours until FTL then it would be useless. why would the ancients go through all that trouble.
Also due to the fact that the Stargates in SGU don't work as far out and don't even look updated like the once in Atlantis I would say destiny is older
@@youngmystery8417 It's because these are temporary gates and there is no network yet. In other words, they operate in stand alone mode. It is the DHD's that create the network. None of the gates in SGU have DHD's, they are operated by a basic remote dialing device, the presence of Destiny is not required. The coordinate system or symbol system for each galaxy is unique to that galaxy, think of it as the difference between MAC addresses and IP addresses. Carter explains in an episode of SG-1 that a Stargate without a DHD is limited to about a 300 light year radius. It makes a lot of sense from a colonization stand point to pre-drop a bunch of temp gates. It provides easy and quick access to new planets and the resources for a permanent gate are already in place.
@@youngmystery8417 also remember that they had very little control of Destiny; the Ancients would have had the command codes and knowledge of the ship to take over and stop whenever and wherever they wanted.
the comics already stated the fact detsiny was older, in fact accoriding to the comics, destiny actually launched slightly premature due to a technical fault. Also atlantis is probably only a few hundred years older depending on how long bulding it too as the comics also tell us how the city ships were in early contruction when destiny launched as they were competing projects.
That may be, but the comics are not Brad and Robert’s vision. Also, MGM currently only considers live action content to be canon.
Makes sense, Destiny is older but for atlantis over the millenia it would be renovated and updated etc so I don't feel a conflict.
I have a slightly different theory... Destiny may have been launched WAY earlier than Atlantis, however it has spent far more time at/near/beyond light speed and may be subjected to time dilation to the point that the internal equipment of Destiny may indeed only be a few hundred thousand years old instead of X number of millions of years older than Atlantis. What makes me curious is in the show it doesn't appear that Destiny ever sends reports back to home base...
I've been watching your interviews lately, & they were great! It was cool to hear some of the stories from the sets.
As for this video, I just wanted to mention my thoughts on a couple things...
The way I understood the Ida/Othala thing is that the Asgard lived in the Ida galaxy, but they had to leave because of the replicators. Thats when they went to Othala, but I believe that's a planet, not a galaxy. I don't recall anything about a different galaxy, but I will look for a reference next watch though...I literally watch it every day, I'm currently in S4. I keep it running at home just because it's like comfort food for my mind. Plus I put it on when I sleep, so, yeah, I watch Stargate ALOT! ...My wife is sick of it! Lol.
The other thing I was gonna mention was the thing about the germans with the dhd. I remember in the ep '1969', Daniel pretends to be related to a german scientist that worked with the dhd...I'm guessing that's where the background in 'Origins' came from. There may be a reference in the episode 'The Torment of Tantalus,' but I don't recall anything specific.
I hope this doesn't come off as "I'm right/you're wrong," I just wanted to discuss my favorite show...🤘😁
Keep up the great vids, & keep spinning that dial...Puppet General Hammond wants it to spin! 🤪
How is this even a question, Destiny is said to predate the technology of both Pegasus AND the Milky Way Ancients. It is essentially Alteran technology, in essence, WAAAAY Older.
Exactly. Protogates, protochair, etc etc. It's hardly advanced that the Prometheus.
i personally don't count origins as cannon.
but going back to the origonal question, destiny is much much older than Atlantis.
and you can tell by the tech they were using on not only the ship, but also the stargates used in the show of SGU. then the second gate system is built in the milky way then Pegasus gates.
anyway this would make the most sense.
@@chronosschiron The guy on the left says he worked on the show, of course he is trying to justify it as canon.
Meanwhile first time I heard about Origins was 2 weeks ago, kinda tells you about the splash in the fanbase it made, smaller than a drop of water in the ocean.
Yeah, but that's all counter-canon anyway. In Ark of Truth, you see the ancient guy's notes on the stargates BEFORE they left the Ori Galaxy, and it details a Stargate that looks like the Milky Way model, not the Destiny series - which we know was launched from the Milky Way because of the galaxy map shown in SGU where it traveled through Pegasus.
Why create the milky way design and NOT use it on the destiny expedition? Because the writers screwed up, plain and simple.
@@noblevi3623 I have two possible explanations for that, either the tech wasn't yet ready for the SG1-Gates and/or they had rescource concerns in the new galaxy or they chose a cheeper alternativ since the Seedships would have to work with very limited recources.
So my opinion when it comes down to the perspective of why they didn't use and Milky Way gate on the destiny was because that design was added much much later on.
My assumption is the SGU Gates were originally in the Milky when they were first created, and mostly used for testing until they were perfected enough to send on the seeding mission.
At some point in time they were dismantled for the newer more improved versions to take their place, however these new additions would have taken place long after the Destiny was sent on its mission.
Understand in the lore yes the ancient Alteran who creates the Stargates designs on a piece of paper that he was drawing, but it's entirely possible that was one of the many designs he had in mind.
However I will admit the gate that's on board destiny is far more advanced than all the others that were added along the path that the destiny has taken. So far it's the only gate of its design that can withstand a 9 Chevron wormhole.
And it's my assumption that back on Earth where the ancient Alteran first built these Stargates, started to advance the design of the Stargate after sending destiny on its mission and eventually came up with a better working Stargate, which is when they started replacing all the old ones that were in the Milky Way with the new design.
Love your new channel! Long time fan for the show all the way back top when I was posted to BC while this was filming. Great stuff!
The thing about the age of Atlantis vs the age of Destiny, Atlantis was also lived-in, so as time goes on, technology in the city could have been upgraded, renovations done on the buildings, etc, where Destiny had been empty since it's launch with nobody to look after her.
I can totally see how people might think that Atlantis would be older.
But it's good that there was a definitive answer given by one of the creators of the shows.
I would assume that Atlantis was built first, but lived in longer. Destiny was launched unmanned. When it launched, Atlantis probably looked a lot like Destiny in terms of technology. But they continued to live in Atlantis, to innovate in the tech that they had. Meanwhile Destiny just continued on with no upgrades.
Plausible but neither one has MWG style ring transporters while Atlantis has those elevator/transporters. We know the city was occupied for apparently millions of years and must've changed while Destiny never was, we assume, and just never had them. Considering how much help those would've been built into the gate pedestal it's reasonable to think Destiny was from before ring transporters came along, so probably older than Atlantis no matter how much the city changed.
Writers made mistakes remembering their own previously established facts...they're human after all...
Just like when Zelenka in Vegas tells McKay “the wraith needs a power source (US national grid) to signal Pegasus from earth, Even a ZPM can’t do that” 🤣 ...a ZPM that when explodes takes out most of an entire solar system is less powerful than the power grid of Nevada, according to that episode 😆
I don't think exploding ZPM can take out a solar system. I think it was more like a continent or a planet.
@@metalzonemt-2
originally when they brought up the idea of the ZPM it was supposed to be powerful enough to wipe out all life in the milky way, but then they dialed it back when they got to Atlantis, but i do remember an defective ZPM that was very unstable and could potentially cause a much more massive payload of the average ZPM because of how unstable this one was in comparison.
@@metalzonemt-2 you’re thinking of the depleted one that (Cumulus) gave SG1 that was coated with a bomb material that would destroy the surface of the earth , a half to fully charged one would indeed destroy the solar system.
It was Project Arcturus that destroyed 5/6 of a solar system, not a ZPM. McKay rigged a ZPM overload on the Asuran Atlantis and three ZPMs only destroyed the ship, there was no effect on Lantea.
Vegas happens in an alternate reality. Maybe in that reality they never encountered a proper, fully charged ZPM, just almost depleted ones. In that reality they don't even know about Atlantis. BTW if this is true, then how the wraith know about Earth?
Been reading a lot of the remarks on here. Personally, there still is years of shows here. Atlantis, and universe could have gone the power and weapons motifs, original Stargate could have touch all that and new worlds and people and new ships. Either way, all 3 were the best shows ever and look forward to a new day when SG comes back to thrill us and answer new questions. How did they make zpms, destiny's power charging, just for starts, battle ships with mass weapons and shields and new gizmos ect, ect. Who haven't we run into out there, what new people's, civilization, maybe another tollens group, trade gizmos and medicines and food. It's just endless. Anyway, waiting patiently on another new show.
Furlings!
That was explained in the very first episode when they found the course logs and again when they found the chair room.
I like to think that atlantis is older, but it got updates as the Ancient technology got more advanced, that what I believe, and the idea that I'm using in my table top.
Well the reason why it never came to mine about the Stargates on Atlanta was newer was that the ancients was living there so they were doing upgrades to the city
I always thought that Destiny is older. Destiny looks older and it has an aesthetic similar to the SG-1 gates and DHD, which we know are 2nd-gen technology.
The seeder ships were automated and sent out long before atlantis' construction. Made sense to me. Hell, even some kind of ancient experiment that they just sent on its way and kept on
I might have missed it. Did the Ancients sent out multiple "Destiny's" in multiple directions or just a single ship? I would think the Ancients would send multiple ships towards larger galaxy cluster seeding planets and gathering information instead of just one.
There could certainly have been more Destinys.
@@DialtheGate then why was only one address in the database?
@TJ of Someplace it makes sense, it's silly to think they were only in the milky way and Pegasus after that. But I dunno about more Destiny ships, because it chasing the signal remember, it has to go in a specific direction (origin of the big bang) so Destiny is technically headed directly for the centrepoint of the entire universe.
@TJ of Someplace yea that would be interesting, I always though maybe some ancients may have just started following along Destiny path, using the stargates like a nomadic tribe seeding civilisation. Like the crew of the Destiny in the drone galaxy. The descendants of Destiny crew had started to move along the corridor of gates and unfortunately attracted the drones and got wiped out? Because Destiny went through Pegasus first, maybe it went through ida, who knows. But surely the nearest few galaxies at least would be inhabited by some ancients that decided to move on after the milky way was seeded and humans too.
@TJ of Someplace the milky way had humans millions of years ago too, but the ancients used the dakara weapon and wiped everyone out didn't they?
Actually I think Atlantis is older, the reason, to why Destiny isn't as advanced as Atlantis is, because Atlantis has been renovated and updated for tens or hundreds of thousands of years after Destiny has been send on the mission. Atlantis has had it's last updates ten thousand years ago, when Ancients left it, but Destiny has never been updated, it has been built hundreds of thousands of years ago and immedietly send on the mission. (sorry, for the bad grammar, but English is my third language and I started watching the shows in the original a few weeks ago - until then I always saw them in my native language)
I mean.. It could very well be that Atlantis was older but since people lived on it it was constantly upgraded so it was much more advanced by the time the ancients abandoned it.
Regarding SGO, David is right, canon evolves but where fans had issues is many felt Catherine's past has been retconned. Which is often frowned upon. You may like the perception you have about a character and how they fit in but then some new info about them comes to light that entirely changes how you receive them.
Like for example: Say Destiny actually had a previous crew of explorers who are long gone. As good or bad as that sounds it changes the idea (one I personally like) that Destiny has been empty since its launch and Rush and co are the first.
The technology on Destiny looks older than Atlantis. The look of Destiny is so much more robust, it has a feel of say NASA Apollo, compared to NASA Space Shuttle being more akin to Atlantis. Also the gates that Destiny uses to connect to on the planets are only needed to be short range and of limited function. Since they are manufactured on an automated assembly line on an automated ship, they may be designed to be as simple as possible. In fact it would be suprising if they weren't meant to be as simple as can be, since complexity brings problems that could be avoided.
The Destiny stargates are clearly designed to use less power because it means less materials needed to be gathered by the seeding ships which we have to assume are also the same ships used to gather materials.
nice content, i liked the sg-a gate the most, you could see it was the most newest one
Yep. Not only it looked more advanced but it also was able to solve a huge problem they previous two generations of gates had. That being manual dialing. It sounds wierd considering that in many cases the ability to manually dial the gate could save you from problems. On the other hand it also means that its easier for "less worthy" beings to access the network wheter or not they have access to a DHD. But that wasn't the reason why they removed this feature from the pegasus gates. Simply put the previous generations were more mechanical. More moving parts mean more things that could end up broken (SG-1 Season 2: The Fifth Race, SG-1 Season-8: Zero Hour).
@@vadfarkas14 at the time the issue of a gait breaking wasn't as big a deal as it would be during the time of the shows and films. Its like breaking down on a busy modern interstate today, it sucks but you are in the middle of an active living civilization and help is never far away.
During the era of the shows and films its more like someone that barely knows what a car is discovers a running car and must depend on it to get them from place to place with practically no infrastructure or people to rely on when things break.
Plus like, vampire hobos.... the analogy may be a bit thin by this point.
@@DrewLSsix by huge problem i meant a big inconvinience. Also we cannot assume all alterans knew how to repair a stargate.
I think the question of whether Destiny is older than Atlantis is out of place, it's clear that it is. The more important question is whether is older Destiny or the Antarctic Stargate, which is supposedly 50 million years old. At first glance, it looks like it's the Antarctic Stargate, since Destiny's Stargates have a shorter range and are less durable, but that may be due to the nature of Destiny's task, where the Stargates were basically just for resupply, so were basically just disposable. And they were built automatically to save as much energy as possible in production, needed to fly and make many more Stargates at the same time, so they also have a shorter range. And no need to travel across the galaxy for resupply, and maybe don't even have location updates because the Seed ship "seeded" Stargates a few centuries or decades before Destiny's flyby, so due to the movement of the stars, it's not even possible for them to have a longer range. So I'd say Destiny is no older than 50 million years, maybe it wouldn't even last that long in a functioning state. Destiny is probably much newer than Antarctic Stargate, but still older than Atlantis.
What I didn't get was gate addresses were well defined as a point in space by that time.
Destiny was moving the entire time. I could understand Atlantis computer keeping track of (or calculating) it's location based on time.
But then they dialed it from a random planet, so was the DHD keeping track of Destiny's location in case someone dialed it's access code???
Most people don’t understand how purpose built Destiny is compared to other known ships even Atlantis! It has several technologies specifically designed for it’s mission and extreme long term use. It’s FTL system is FTL but not Hyperspace specifically, so it can scan for the signatures in CMBR that show intelligent design. They had to have some form of super advance/sarcophagus technology built into Destiny, since 50 million years later it still hasn’t collected all the data it needs. The energy collection of the ship was done via stars, because either ZPM’s were not created then or were not viable for production on ship. The gates on the ship are the earliest prototype of stargates known with limit range and function. From the Ori movie, we know Amil who created the Ark of Truth, was the one to also design the first prototype of the gates, this happen back in Alteran original home galaxy! We also see far more design similarities between the Alteran ship that was used to leave their original home galaxy and Destiny compared to any other Lantean technology. We know the Alteran settled first on Dakara when they arrived in Avalon (Milky Way) so the Destiny Project must’ve happened not far off then since it was launched from Earth but no remains or mentions of it existed. Fun fact is whether Alterans were around on Earth when the dinosaurs extinction happened? Also the Alterans gave up on Destiny project because it would have taken million upon millions of years to discover their answers, which is what prompted their society to look for alternatives which was ascension, this came directly from their search for the intelligent design in CMBR, it won’t surprise me if they did discover traces of it on their travel from original home galaxy to Avalon since it was so far away hyperspace travel was deemed too slow to be viable travel form!
Most of the search results I find for how old the Destiny is only say it launched "over 50 million years ago." One video by The Gate Guy talking about whether or not the Destiny gate could dial gates on the seed ships says the seed ships (tho I don't recall if he cited a source) were launched about 2000 years before the Destiny herself. One video by Generation Films about the Destiny talks about the confusion over the age of the ship and cites (tho I can't find the entry) Joseph Mallozzi's "blog" where he states that "the 60 million year figure is correct and thus predates the gates in the milky way galaxy." Other than thinking 60 was a typo and that he meant 50, this seems right to me given that the Destiny predates the Ancient Gene security protocol and has the v1 gate if you think of the SG-1 gate as v2 and the Atlantis gate as v3. The 1 million year figure provided by the comic "Back to Destiny" seems counter to established lore given that the Ancients fled the Milky Way 5-10 million years ago and didn't come back until 10,000 years ago.
One ship was between Galaxies at "Relativistic speed" Which meant even though the people onboard were only a few years older over ten thousand years had passed for Atlantis and Milky way. If Destiny was traveling at "Relativistic speed" So the ships computer would count the time that passed as Hundreds of thousands years how many years passed in the normal flow of time?
Why wouldn’t the communication stones transmit the people home in extreme slow motion then?
@@DialtheGate Because the communication is instant (or close enough to) because it's traveling through subspace. Quite literally outside of either physical plane of reference relative to Destiny.
Othala the galaxy was named after Othala the planet in Ida galaxy. The Asgard move there because of increasing replicator presence in Ida. This is SG1 canon
Amazon please do something with this series
The way I understand it, Daniel never reached peak enlightment, and thus never unlocked all of his abilities as an Ascended being.
I doubt Oma would have even let him as she probably knew that he would be incapable of staying impartial.
his knowledge was wiped anyway.
I see it just as an expression to imply that something is really old.
Then there's a mathematical interpretation of it too:
If you say something is millions of years old, it can't be less than that.
But if you say something is hundreds of thousands of years old.... well, there's no upper limit to that, you can just keep counting in increments of a hundred thousand years until you reach far beyond the millions.
Atlantis was built first, Destiny was launched later, Atlantis was upgraded in the post-Destiny launch era. That's how I've always viewed it.
If Atlantis was older it would show a great many signs of being so. It would show signs of being updated and overhauled. there would still be remnants of the original architecture not to mention records of having done so. I so absolutely no evidence or reason to believe that Atlantis is older.
Love these insights!
Good, because whether he realizes it or not, you can not build an Atlantis system before you have Destiny's tech, Destiny has to predate any Atlantis style system; or to put it another way the Atlantis cities are a later improved development of the Destiny tech.
I don't understand how this is even a question, It's very obviously older than even the milkyway gates. Several times we hear the Destiny gate is one of the first gates ever made, Atlantis left for Pegasus sometime around 1 million to 10 million years ago, and the oldest milkyway gate we know of was 50 million years old, so Destiny is somewhere above 50 million years old.
Hey I found an arquebus and a fully auto HK, wonder which is older.
Fun canon fact from Origins, you can power a Stargate with a 1939 car battery.
We know that Atlantis was launched from Earth "several million years ago", but we know nothing about the Ancients' maintenance and upgrades to the city-ship during the several million years they spent in Pegasus. It could very easily be that, as durable and long-lived as their technology is, maybe the Ancients undertook a formal rebuilding of the city every 100,000 years or so. Look up the "Ship Of Thesus". Maybe the Atlantis we saw submerged 10,000 years ago had no parts in common with the city that initially brought the Ancients to Pegasus. It could have been rebuilt several times over, and the current Atlantis could be far less than a million years old. We also know that the Pegasus Ancients built at least one other city ship while in Pegasus. It may be that they built a whole fleet of them in Pegasus (before the Wraith first became a serious threat, I would assume) and incorporated a few minor pieces of older city-ships into the build of the newer models, like reusing seasoned ship timber for sentimental reasons in the keel or planks of a new wooden ship.
As for Destiny, in the episode "Aftermath", the one where the shuttle crashed, the ship's AI (in the guise of Dr. Franklin) told Rush that the ship spent "over a million years" in flight. Sadly, no exact age was given.This estimate of "over a million years" fits perfectly with the passage of time in the show's two seasons. It took Destiny several months to finish crossing the Nakai's galaxy, then an unspecified period of possibly months to cross the void to the galaxy of Novus.
Well the seed ships would be older still
A city isn't built and left at the stage it is built. Tue city could have been occupied and improved upon for millions of years. A ship gets built and can at best have slight modifications built on it but if its unmanned then...
It's really fun to think about it, who knows; how many ships like Destiny's? how many city like Atlantist? what at the end of the journey of SGU? did they find what they're looking for? What Furlings looks like? What if the Alien at the end of SGU actually the good guys and they're trying to stop Destiny's because it might unleashed something they should not know?
if there would be more ships like Destiny how would you dial it ? isnt the 9th chevron specially only for Destiny ?
@@pupinek123pupinek2 wow, that's a good question, how about you, how they can dial up to others ship? Maybe, different specific types of gates which solely to connect with other ship through mainframe and database. Which only can be unlocked using unique signatures 🤷♂️
@@muhammaduqbahahmadtermizi1252
Other ships you mean the Seed ships ? We dont know if the have stargates. Seed ships were meant to be completely self sufficient without crew. So they propably dont have stragates.
And if there are more ships like Destiny ? Who knows. What is interesting is that all the existing gates have 9 chevrons (Milky way and Pegasus) Its like all the gates have the capability to dial up Destiny.
I wasn't even aware this was a thing.
I recall a scene in the show where the commander kills an injured guy after a crash, by covering his mouth. As they are flying down to a planet, the ship's AI tells Rush, "The weather is pretty rough." Rush says, "The Ancients built that shuttle." And the AI replies, "The Ancients built that shuttle a million years ago."
Rush radios the pilot, "Watch out for the weather."
Just the chair is a good giveaway of this. The gate types on the ship also seems to be somewhere in between the basic and the Atlantis type. Also if you have a technology of Atlantis you should have ZPMs all around as back up batteries. Not to mention drones.
Bit of side story. There is no way in hell McKay/Carter duo can not figure out how to catch up on Destiny with the Hammond. Asgard core configured to replicate Atlantis wormhole drive...... :D
@druidofscosglen2868 Asgard have 60.000 years of history. The Core works like a mind reader and not a library. You have to "explain" to it what you want to make.
What about the the Asgard in aren't they at least in two galaxies?
In their original galaxy and aren't first contact in Pegasus with Atlantis also begs question aren't Asgard in Pegasus after end of unending where they blow up in their original Galaxy?
Its only true to the best of his knowledge, and not everyone is right about everything. Great for the clarification though that we know Destiny is older.
Well, maybe the moment of Destiny launching was given in Destiny's local time (it was written in the ship's logbook or something, wasn't it?) and because it's constantly moving with at least relativistic speed the time dilation factor makes the Earth time goes some 100x faster, so in Earth local time it was launched dozen million years ago?
According to the comics, Destiny and city ships were competing projects and Destiny was finished first. Hard to say if Atlantis specifically was that old.
To be honest it's probably best to consider the comics and books as non cannon if they come up against evidence in cannon disproving them. Or in this case the word of a show runner. It's also pretty obvious that the destiny is older that both the milky way gate system and Atlantis. The gate is inferior, the chair is inferior, and most importantly the destiny has a light speed drive while Atlantis has an obviously superior and faster intergalactic hyper drive.
@@matyasofinvention6304 It's not that obvious to me. City ships and the gate system have been very obviously upgraded over the course of their existence.
I can imagine Atlantis being as old as destiny, but ship-of-theseus style, where literally everything on atlantis was replaced by upgrades.
The pegasus gate system is known to be seeded by destiny's vanguard of seed ships. In fact, it's known to be the very first one. It was obviously upgraded afterwards.
The reason why destiny doesn't use hyperdrive is because it can't due to the nature of its mission. We know this was a deliberate choice, because ancients had intergalactic hyperdrives at that point (we know this, because the Ori have them too).
@@matyasofinvention6304 It is also possible that Destiny's gates are not an older design than milkyway's.
It may be the case they are deliberately simplified to make it possible to build them quickly using easily accessible resources. Notice the seed ships need to progress at least as fast as destiny.
How the hell would they find large enough deposits of naquadah to churn out milkyway-type stargates quickly enough?
You might counter-argue that Destiny's gate is also that simple design for no apparent reason, but we don't know if that's true. It's clearly capable of dialing earth. The thing that limits its rage when connecting to nearby planets seems to be the simple design of the gates it is connecting to.
I'm no pro, but wouldn't it be reasonable to presume the seed ships were sent out and then Atlantis was later moved (did they move it from Earth or build it there? I forget) to the new galaxy once it was discovered and seeded? They were all sent from Earth weren't they? That's what I thought anyway.
I never liked the fact that the timeline for the ancient civilization was on the order of 50 million years. One million years, maybe...but to me even that's a stretch. The reason being is that it doesn't seem realistic. How could a civilization remember its own history for that long, let alone something not wipe it out or it not wipe itself out? If the ancients had been around for a little over a million years, Destiny was 900,000 and Atlantis was say 500,000 years old...that just seems more plausible to me rather than they left the Ori galaxy 50 million years previous and the gate system is millions of years old. Doesn't matter ultimately, love stargate no matter what
Could it be some issue of difference in time passage due to gravitationally induced time dilation? I know it seems like while standing on the deck of the Destiny you'd go off of it's local, absolute time for age, and the same while at Atlantis, but couldn't the Destiny be hundreds of thousands of years old in it's local temporal reference frame, but older than Atlantis by Atlantis' temporal reference frame? I know this effect has been proven by our astronauts, specifically with one twin who is now slightly younger than the other. If this is the case we might even be able to establish specific ages of Atlantis and Destiny that correlate to Destiny's distance from it's launch point.
That would make sense if there was a time dilation while they talk with folks back on Earth, particularly during FTL, but we see time flowing the same.
The comic books answer many questions also. They are better than a show with filler.
My headcanon is that the Destiny's mission was complete long ago. That the ancients figured out how to get data back from Destiny, mayby using the gate somewhat like the Midway bridge to get a data connection. Then the data it collected allowed them to create the ZPMs.
If Destiny's mission was complete then there would be records on board detailing that. I straight up think the Ancients literally just forgot Destiny even existed.
@@godofawesum223 Would there? Or would the ancients have just grabbed the data and done everything else? Also said data would later be hidden or destroyed like all the rest of the data on producing ZPMs presumably was given it was never found.
My head canon is that Atlantis has existed before destiny. But it’s like New York. It’s taken many forms and evolved over time. The modern Atlantis was built long after destiny launched. But an “Atlantis” was around before that, just more primitive.
2:57 I'd like to argue against assention making you all-knowing. Daniel might have all the knowledge in his mind, but it would be similar to having all human knowledge on you phone. You might not know the mass of the moon but can easily pull it up
Why do we need this question asked? it's clear the ship is much older then the city. just look at the weapons they have.the city has solely drones for protection where the ship has guns,a support ship and not a puddlejumper gate ship craft.if you don't have this much common sense these shows are too much for you.
The stargates on destiny could also have a shorter range, because they're made by the seed ships (automated) and may not have all the best materials, having to use materials only from the planets in the seed ships path. (Are they made of naquadah like Milky Way stargates? I think they're made of naquadah anyways.)
In SGU they said destiny was launched from Earth from this statement we can assume Destiny was launched before the Anchients fled the plague in the milky way to another galaxy, so yes Destiny is likely much older than Atlantis.
I wish you two shows go back on Stargate Atlantis. Stargate Universes I want you guys bring this back I don't know why you guys can't Truitt and no reason I love Stargate
Well, wouldn't the seed ships need to go first? They are probably the oldest. Even with the advancements, I think the seed ships need to have been 100K years ahead of Destiny. This gave the ships time to plan out routes and build the gates. At least the Ancients tech is backward compatible.
It's not hard to get tow different microphones to be the same volume.
Use a limiter or compressor.
Right now my fucking ear are ringing since I turned up to David then Darrens voice melted my headphones.It's not a small difference.
11dB by the meter of my mixer.
Yeh... I think you care too much about not being wrong by telling "canon evolves" instead of "retcon".
Stargate is my fav sci-fi show. But the the flaws of coherency were always here, without disguising behind "canon evolves" quote. Even if canon do evolves as fact, doesn't mean you can put this everytime to justify flaws in writing or mistakes with lines of dialogues.
Here, with all the content of SGU and other shows, we can definitely put things together. Like, Ancient seat command is older on the Destiny than on Atlantis, so it means Destiny is older in conception / launch.
Things like that.
But there is also those other things, being problematic or anachronistic, and never explained. In the facts, canon evolving is the best trick used by writers to justify their mistakes. Nothing wrong with that when it's still "logical" or accurate trough explanation. But sometimes, it's a bit easy.
Like, during 8 years, you had this idea / concept ascended beings are by definition pure hearted and without malice. Then you have the brain using x% capacity to evolve. Then you have ascended beings able to ascend others non ascended beings. Then you have... The Oris.
Or the stargates deposited by ships to stake out Destiny's path: why Milky Way doesn't have it? Destiny departure was Earth. Does it mean, Destiny crossed all the Milky way without having any planet to reach? If stargates from SGU are older, and Ancients colonized Milky Way with models we saw in SG1, it means they colonized Milky Way BEFORE launching Destiny, because Destiny USE stargate concept. And they spread stargates ARRIVING in the Milky Way. You can't send a ship with a Stargate inside able to connect with other stargates if you don't have the concept of stargates ongoing since long time. Or it's like sending a ship with a smartphone inside before smartphone was created. So why models are older and limited in reach in SGU? Or more, why the system of gates in the Milky Way is the same since the network was created, but the ones from Destiny are older in design and reach, when it must have been created after the current design found in the Milky Way? Technically, the door inside Destiny's ship must have been created based on the model you found on the Milky Way, because, you can't lauch a ship with a stargate inside, able to connect with other stargates, without having stargate devices created. Also, the fact Destiny has remote to activate stargates, and there is no DHD.
Again:
- You have a stargate inside Destiny
- Destiny was launched from Earth
- Destiny's stargate must connect to other stargates to let people come in
- Stargates use whormholes
- Stargate are deposited by Seed ships for Destiny's path
- Seed ships are launched BEFORE Destiny's launch
- Stargates were created BEFORE Seed ships were launched
- Stargates were spread in the Milky Way BEFORE Destiny's departure
... But stargate inside Destiny or the ones from the Seed ships are "older" from the current model from Milky Way.
... But current model in the Milky Way is the same since its creation based on so many dialogues from SG1, SGA.
If they launched Destiny and Seed ships BEFORE creating stargates, how Seed ships can provide a path of stargates for Destiny?
If they launched Destiny and Seed ships AFTER creating stargates, how stargates deposited by Seed ships are older than Milky Way stargates?
You see the problem or anachronism, or i start again?
You have a tech described as older than any tech saw in the franchise from Ancients, the one in SGU, launched AFTER the current tech we saw in SG1, the gates, or it would have mean they launched Destiny with a stargate inside before developing stargate, in would have not make any sense at all, specially considering the main concept is the 9th chevron as a fixed address to reach Destiny wherever it's located in the universe.
Gates are older than Destiny if you considerate Ancients started to colonize Milky Way before launching Destiny, but Destiny's gate is older than their development in the Milky Way.
...
Or the gene of the Ancients to activate devices: they told trough Atlantis series, it was a way to prevent Wraiths to use their technology. But in the facts, Atlantis was launched from earth, and the seat founded in Antarctic, that is older than the departure of the Ancients from Milky way to Pegasus, is activated trough the gene only. It's pure anachronism.
Or the inconsistency of how to activate the supergate. Because, if i remember correctly, the amount of energy was basically tremendous, black hole only way, however, Ark of truth, go & back, not really a problem.
Or the supergate itself: the size of the elements. First, each part came out from a stargate, so, what is the diameter again, 3m? Then you see each element is way bigger than a ship not able to go trough the stargate...
Or the gates in SGU: how do they have power & energy to work again, without DHD? Those gates only work trough Destiny handle controller to activate. How do they activate between them? It was established trough years of episodes in SG1 that the DHD provides the power, or any kind of power can sources the gate, but still, this need power to activate. Sometimes the other gate provide the power, but in SGU, gates are alimented by?
I mean, at some point, they focused too much on "don't minding details", when it was the cement of why Stargate was great: the lore, to the point the lore itself changed for one episode, then changed again, or else.
Like communications in subspace or during hyperspace or else. One time it's impossible to contact a ship in hyperspace, other time they have Landry doing a speech on 3 screens directly from earth when they are currently on hyperspace...
Or in SGU, one time Destiny's shield protects from any kind of energy blast because of frequency, but if you specify the right frequency, the shield is stronger against weapons using this frequency, however, they can do kamikaze impact. but... They go INSIDE a sun, sun is also matter, not only energy. So, a drone can do kamikaze damage, but sun "physical" impacts don't do damages?
But when you're in hyperspace, you can't use the shields (Asgard tech at least). Demonstrated with how they exploded a ship on hyperspace to counter replicators and destroy them by self-destruct of the ship to explode them on hyperspace.
Or Destiny's shield again, with FTL: they told Destiny don't use hyperspace travel, and remain in the current "dimension" it is, so obviously the shield is activated when it is on FTL, but they don't suffer problems of time relativity or else. But if you watch this episode of SGA, they encounter an Aurora battle ship full of Ancients who traveled without using hyperspace remaining in same dimension but with speed close to light, definitely being affected by relativity, because they departed from Atlantis 10000 years ago, then still only a few weeks? days?... Past for them?
So what, the FTL device from Destiny has this "bubble hyperspace explanation". Ok. But what is this bubble? Hyperspace use another dimension "road". So, Destiny use... What? A "bubble road"? Still on same dimension but using bubble which isn't same dimension by definition?
I loved all this ideas about different ways to travel. But some of them really are too much full of inconsistency.
Well, whatever. Still my best favorite sci-fi franchise.
Being Amazon has this we can look to see what they shall decide . Hoping it shall be good is about all I can hope for myself . If you look at the full body of work then this does have a great shot at being something special that we can all look forward too . I just hope they do something before I become ascended .
A statement like "Hundreds of thousands" is an abstract amount, much like the word "several". Ignoring that Rush was making an estimate on screen, the statement shouldn't be taken as meaning an exact amount. Calling destiny hundreds of thousands of years old or millions of years old, mean the same thing really.
According to the wiki (which has info from the comics/books that continued the story), Destiny was launched over 50 million years ago, while Atlantis was built some 30 million years ago, on Earth. Though I have a memory of them coming on/with Atlantis from the Ori galaxy with Atlantis? Or did they come by some other means.
Either way, Destiny is far older than Atlantis, and the other city ships for that matter, as apparently the city ships were still in the planning stages when Destiny was launched.
Nah they came from the ori galaxy in a very large ship, a type of city ship but not Atlantis. In one of the Atlantis episodes it said they launched Atlantis approx 3 million years ago not 30. It literally comes up on the screen in the episone where they find ancient woman frozen in the ice.
Destiny does not have to be older than Atlantis. Unless of course, the Atlantis we see was built as we see it. If you took a B-17 and flew it over modern day New York, the B-17 is antiquated compared to the current version New York. This doesn't mean New York is younger.
Logically, Destiny is older as it was the one that "seeded the gate system" in general. Meaning it had to travel further and do more traveling through a galaxy to seed the gates.
PLUS, Atlantis was considered the "crowning achievement" for the Ancients, and either the "actual" last city or at least one OF the last cities founded. So, not as old, but actually more advanced.
Also: 100s of 1000's CAN BE Millions. And since Rush would have NO MEANS to determine HOW MANY 100's of 1000's, it is easily capable of being 3million while Atlantis is 2million. Not to mention the possibility of "rounding numbers" so that 2.5 would be rounded UP to 3, but 2.4 would be rounded DOWN to simply 2.
I think the reason you could not travel galaxy wide was because of safety issues and the reason you couldn't travel back to the milky way was because of security reasons
There's no reason to believe Rush knows what he's talking about. He's not all knowing, just a smart dude who stumbled upon Destiny. He could have misinterpreted the date. He had tendencies of arrogance and lying so i'm not suprised.
Atlantis date is set in stone since it was a flashback with a date on the screen, so that one is for sure right.
I always fanwank the discrepancy as the Destiny and the seeder ships were built at the same time but the word launch is NOT the build date. It isn't even the date that it was in space and travelled to the edge of the next universe. It's official "launch" is only when it started it's journey to the other universe.
Think of it like, a helicopter or plane is just a plane UNTIL it picks up the President. ONLY then does it get the classification Marine One or Air Force One. So it wasn't Destiny, some other designation would hold the prior launch date, until it reached the other universe.
All you had to look at was the tech involved. No drones, weaker shielding, primitive computer systems, and then look at the style of the building compared to atlantis. Atlantis, as depicted, did not take off from the ancients homeworld, so most likely it was built after they left and landed in the milky way. Destiny would be in response to something they learned after leaving home and it would require less materials than atlantis.
The thing confuses me about Ancents timeline leaving earth they leave behind Cyla Urbanus ( or Ayiana) who gets frozen and sg1 interact with has the virus that wiped out the ancients that didn't ascend so that means that they ether had the virus while in pegasus but had no issues for that entire time or they came back and somehow got the virus again after millions of years
Typhoid Mary. Lots of parallels.
From what I surmised the uninflected flees the Galaxy with some remaining till the virus ran it’s course and then they restarted life, she was probably exposed at some juncture in that period
What was the thing about the Harsees child? Why is that a thing? It that just the glue that binds the movie with the show?
Just look at the architecture and design of both things and how damaged Destiny was. Atlantis was technically much more advanced. Sure Destiny is way older. No question about that.
I live next door to Destini and she's only 22.
well, hundreds of thousands of years does fit within the limitation of millions of years if we aren't specifying how many hundreds are required to determine Destiny's age...so Rush wasn't wrong, just really vague
You can tell by the visual aesthetic that Destiny is way older, I thought that when I first watched when aired, but then again what happened to kino's and remote DHD's on Atlantis? Off topic though, in respect to what came first, I don't feel the Destiny Stargate is the first iteration, the sketch by Amelius was clearly what led to the Milky Way gate, the glyph icons are not Destiny-style, they're Milky Way-style.
Destiny was build for a long-duration semi-unmanned flight. I think it would be designed to be spartan and rugged than Atlantis, which would benefit from having a full-time crew.
well, maybe destiny was sent out at the time they were in construction of atlantis and the ships we saw in the show and they needed the gates put in planets....several million years ago atlantis left earth for pegasus galaxy...so go figure estimate calculation based on what was said or shown in the show....
Who actually thought Atlantis is older than Destiny? LMAO
Atlantis on Earth, before the plague, was millions of years ago. Destiny was launched before the plague. Atlantis fled Earth and spent the long journey to the Pegasus galaxy using time dilation to ride out the plague and let life re-evolve. Atlantis arrived in the Pegasus galaxy ten-thousand-plus years ago and came into conflict with the Wrath.
Destiny was tens, possibly hundreds, of millions of years old. This is a multiple of hundreds of thousands, so Rush wasn't wrong it that scene.
Atlantis left Earth 'several millions of years ago', and was probably already millions of years old, or it may have been built to get to Pegasus. Either way, compared to Destiny, Atlantis is basically brand new.
Relativity. There's, possibly, math to make both statements true.
This pertains to Stargate in general with how things work.
I thought it was always convenient they only had one bar of power left on the ZPM. I always thought it made better sense for the ZPMs to power much smaller vehicles than something as large as Atlantis. Something like the shield generators on the Children of the Corn planet made perfect sense.
Something as large as Atlantis or any other large facility should be able to tap directly into subspace to access Zero Point Energy (ZPE) and use just like turning on a light switch instead of having to use ZPM/batteries. The Ancients were pretty smart and were able to manufacture ZPMs so why not connect directly to the source or at least find the ZPM manufacturing/charging facility on Atlantis, it's probably in the same location as the one on the Replicator Atlantis.
I noticed the offworld gates weren't connected to a power source other than the Power Crystal in the DHD and that connection to the gate was wireless. I'm assuming there's a highly advanced Tesla Coil type wireless electrical connection going on here. It would also make better sense if the DHD was some kind of Tesla Coil that harnessed either the planet's natural electrical field or the ZPE in subspace, again no need for the Power Crystal.
I can see the ZPM and Power Crystal as plot devices to limit stories but in actuality they're a redundancy or power cells for smaller vehicles and devices.
Wasn't it subspace energy that they had tried with the device that Rodney destroyed the solar system with?
@@metalzonemt-2 From what I can remember that was the case. Instead of incrementally moving the power setting up at 1% at a time, Rodney got greedy and went in multiples of 10% which led to the overload.
I knew from the beginning of the episode it wasn't going to work because the ZPM was their plot device to manage the show so they had to show something else that didn't work to keep the fans at bay.
I was thinking from an outside the box point of view of the show as to what may be plausible without the show's ingrained restrictions.
@@JohnFourtyTwo It was established that Project Arcturus wouldn't have worked no matter how much or little power it was attempting to extract. The problem is that subspace is a part of our reality, drawing power from it in that matter, damages the fundamental structures of reality which lead the physics around the containment Chamber breaking down. When this happens there is no way to maintain containment since the fundamental principle of the universe in that localized area don't apply anymore and as a result the power system becomes unstable and explodes.
Now if he was drawing less power the explosion might have been smaller, but in the grand scheme of the device's functionality it destroying a country or a solar system is a little immaterial.
i get the feeling that Atlantis did have something like this aboard the city. because you have to remember that the city of the ship was never fully discovered. we only explored a small portion of the city in all seasons of the show, just like that hidden laboratory for janis that had all kinds of advanced tech that were useful, it's just as possible the ship had many other things found within the city that the atlantians were working on or even common place, the ZPM's could have had a charger that was safe and could be used on the ship, compared to that outpost that mkay destroyed that part of the Galaxy with.
mkay was a brilliant scientist but he was dumb because of his arrogance and over confidence that got him into trouble in situations that could have been avoided had he paced himself and researched everything with risk factors in mind. funny enough many of the atlantians had this same kind of Hubris which often got them killed because they were too confident that they would always win because of how smart they were.
if you remember an episode where they find an aurora class ship that's traveling in FTL and they stop it and find out that real life atlantians are aboard the ship, well in this episode the expedition get kicked out of Atlantis because it belongs to the atlantians and the atlantians decide they have all they need to destroy the replicators. because of a plan they set in motion 10,000 years ago within their base code to never attack their creators.
they bet the rest of their lives on that stupid idea that the replicators would never figure it out, so they had no other plans or back up plans just in case things didn't go as planned. like maybe Thor's race was right, they need someone dumber than they are, to figure out how to approach certain decisions in how to defeat an enemy such as the replicators.
suddenly regular humans are playing 4d chess and the atlantians and Asgard are playing 2d chess because their superiority in knowledge it's almost like they don't think of contingency plans when they approach an conflict of any kind.
@@quinnsinclair7028
i liked the power extracted from the stars idea that destiny had more than the ZPM tech. like don't get me wrong it was cool that they condensed that power in a much smaller container and that it could run the ship. but they could just as well done the same thing with the power from the stars only much more efficient and hold more power than the tech on the destiny.
and what does every Galaxy have plenty of? stars of course, so they had plenty of gas stations in space, and if they wanted to they could make some kind of automated system where they take a small puddle jumper with the ZPM containers integrated into the ship in such a way for it to fly into the chronosphere of the star to extract as much power as needed and take it back home to Atlantis or something like this. or maybe they built a base of operations near the star to collect power but also use the star as an unlimited source of ammo as the destiny had with the use of it's energy weapons as long as they had plenty of fuel in the tank. and use the star to protect themselves against any who might attack them.
or just convert a few puddle jumpers into an massive automated flying power house that would charge within the sun and return to Atlantis as if they were like an usb that provided power plugging into the city's grid.
i think this sounds kind of cool to be honest. and i wouldn't put this kind of tech idea behind them, have you noticed we haven't seen any of the alteran's second advancements of tech besides the second stargates within the milky way Galaxy, we know that the gould stole their tech, but the gould also designed much of their tech to reflect gould as a species separated from the alterans tech.
other than the gate system's and the ring platforms within the milky way galaxy and maybe that download knowledge device they used and also that cube that healed ppl's bodies that the gould reverse engineered into their sarcophagus and the weapon on dakara, i think there might have been some alteran tech that Anubis reverse engineered to use but i'm not sure that tech was indeed the alteran's tech, but we never see any of their space ships or weapons, unless the zat gun and the staff weapon are also based off of alteran tech. but again, no space ships within our galaxy that are alteran tech related exist that we know of.
it's almost like they skipped a generation of flying in space and only sent out the automated seed ships within the milky way galaxy to seed planets with stargates. or maybe they did indeed have space ships, but used them all against the wraith or some other foe that we have yet to know about.