I agree. I really liked this little chapter in Klingon history. It made perfect sense for the Klingons to have a misguided attempt to make themselves stronger backfire on them.
It presents another plot hole though.....A re-occuring character in DS9 was Dax's "best-friend" what was Kirk's arch-enemy in the TOS, who's name was "Kor". Although this might explain what some Klingons have bumps, and others don't. But in TOS, Kor had no bumps, while in DS9 he did......was this disease curable later in the cannon?
It wasn't really the disease that was the issue -- It was the "disfigurement" from the disease. Kor may have had cosmetic surgery at some point to correct it. "Cranial reconstruction" is even mentioned at 0:47.
They did say that reversing the effects may be possible in the future. They probably found that resolution sometime between TOS and DS9s timelines. Kor and the others would have gone through it then.
In the DS9 episode, Bashir and O'Brien seperately ask if it was genetic engineering or a retroviral plague. I love that the Enterprise writers made the answer be both.
I loved Worf's non-answer to their questions. "We do not discuss it with outsiders." This is one of those questions where you would normally have to stop the story dead for a few minutes while Worf fills in all the backstory.
I think Roddenberry said Klingons were always written with forehead ridges but the FX makeup was too expensive in the 60s, I say this explanation was the best one they could have come up with.
that happened a lot on the original series. roddenberry also wanted the enterprise to be able to land on planets but again, the visual effects were not in the budget so he invented the idea of the transporter, so the ship would not have to land. the company that the studio hired to produce costumes couldn't make spock's ears look realistic, so the makeup artist on the show used his own money, 600 dollars, to have a friend who worked at mgm make spock's ears because the studio refused to pay for it. shatner once said that each episode was made with money equivalent to the weekly catering bill for any modern tv show. set decorators would scrounge dumpsters at the studio for cardboard and styrofoam that they used to build the enterprise sets.
@@marzsit9833 And they did a phenomenal job with what they could put together! I imagine TOS but with a modern FX budget! I think the producers of SNW have said we might get to TOS territory if the show does get more seasons.
Discovery is set within the same "Prime" reality as The Original Series, the first two seasons in the 2250s. Abrams was only involved with the 2009 film and its 2013 into Darkness sequel.
@@mattb6369 If you think Discovery is set in the prime universe, then you trust the words of CBS PR more than your own eyes. Don't let people piss in your mouth and tell you it's raining.
A wonderfully written explanation of why Kirk era Klingons looked more human, now ruined by Star Trek Discovery... unless they come up with a valid reason for the back and forth appearance.
It was mentioned in the video that the Klingon doctor is thinking about going into cranial restoration practice, in other words, restoring the ridges via surgery. If the practice becomes popular, other surgeons will get in on the gravy train.
The virus didn't affect all Klingons, to my knowledge (and the information on Memory Alpha) it was only a couple of millions. So unless the ridgeless Klingons don't exist AT ALL in STDisc, everything's okay.
Marty theMartian What if a group a Klingons, lets say a Subspecies reacted differently on the Augment Virus. Instead of devolping a more human appearance, they degenerated into a past phenotype in their Evolution, which had a more advanced Exosceleton.
Roddenberry stated, " There is no explanation in canon.. "It was simply a better makeup ability and budget during Star Trek the Motion Picture." STE made a nice canon explanation for the differences between TOS, STMP and STE
@@VoodooV1 I agree. I read something similar from Gene which is much better solution then all these episodes and changes: "The TOS Klingons were always like this, you just couldn't see it on the low definition TV sets"
@@VoodooV1 I like canonical consistency. And the TOS Klingons looked cool in their own right. I for one like that this was addressed with a cool story too.
I think the cranial reconstruction becoming popular explains the discovery klingons. The augment virus created a huge backlash and was seen as an attack on the very idea of being a klingon. So they overcompensated with the reconstructive surgery, went out of their way to demonstrate just how extremely klingon they were.
I congratulate you to an explanation to the DISCO-Klingons that, as contrived as it has to be, given the almost impossible setup, would actually work in-universe.
That seems unlikely, since there was an episode in which a Klingon posed as a human, and was only found out when his DNA was scanned. I think it was the one about the Tribbles?
Aw who needs an explanation for the Klingons looking the way they do after ST TOS? They look that way because special effects were better by the time the movies were made. That's all the explanation necessary.
Std,lol,fail. Std is in the fanfiction verse separate from the rodenberry/Berman timeline and the Kelvin timeline and the Terran empire timeline and all the timelines from that ones tng episode.
Discovery, Picard, Lower Decks and Prodigy are ALL in the TOS/TNG/DS9/Voy universe. Personally, I don't like Enterprise, never really watched it, and I don't think it fits in canon. Still Enterprise is Canon. The fact that I dont like it doesnt make it non-canon.
This is my one of my favorite episodes of enterprise and I can't help but think back to Star Trek DS9 episode where Worf in the others travel 2 time of James D Kirk in Trouble with Tribbles when asked why Klingons look like that wolf said it's something we don't talk about outside the empire well now we know why I like what they did here with this this is why this is one of my favorite episodes of Star Trek Enterprise and this show was very underrated and didn't get enough credit for some pretty good stories
The problem with Troubles and Tribbleations was taht those Klingons, didn't recognize that Worf was a "normal" Klingon with ridges, sitting with humans! We all realize that it was a matter of more advanced make up and effects, and we as Trek fans all have imaginations! The way I have delt with it, the Klingons always looked the way do with head ridges, the shows budget and portral was the only reason for it. Same as it's the only reason why the sets looked the way they do. I dislike the new Discorvery Klingons. They should have left them as they were.
i honestly found Enterprise to b my favorite of the star trek series, mainly because it shows us what it was like for humanity before the federation was even an idea
If I remember correctly the Klingons came across Khan and his re-engineered humans and lost very badly to the super humans. They decided they would do the same re-engineering but instead of becoming super Klingons they became more human.
No, Klingons encountered Soong’s band of augments who were grown in artificial wombs in the 22nd century. Khan and crew are sleeping on the Botany bay. The augments in Enterprise were embryos made during Khan’s reign on earth and artificially gestated and raised by an earlier ancestor of Soong who later invested Data and Lore. It all makes sense why Lore turned out bad with his past failures with the augments Lore was like an artificial augment himself.
You’re referring to the plot, right? They encountered Augments in a previous episode, but they are unaffiliated with Khan. They were just a group of Augments.
At this point the Klingons never ran into Khan's Augments. The Augments from ENT were a different set, raised by Arik Soong, and it was from these Augments' DNA that they derived their research from. Arik was an ancestor (a great or great-great grandfather) to Noonien Soong, the creator of Data.
Std,lol,fail. Std is in the fanfiction verse separate from the rodenberry/Berman timeline and the Kelvin timeline and the Terran empire timeline and all the timelines from that ones tng episode.
The effect was probably temporary but it may have taken years maybe decades to wear off. Kang, Kor, and Koloth grew back their cranial ridges when they were old men.
The other Klingon from Trouble with Tribles would have been their age and his ridges hadnt grown back by the era of DS9, while all three of theirs had. Either he had surgery to remain human looking or the three had surgery to add ridges.
Actually they kinda did in season 2, one of the Klingon characters says to the MC “yeah the klingons have started to grow their hair again” A bit too much of a development for a few lines of dialogue but it certainly explains why all of the klingons in discovery were bald: the houses that followed T’Kuvma shaved their heads as a sign of respect to him, after the war they had no need to continue the tradition so they started growing it back
@@daetoris4473 That doesn't work so well. For one all the houses kinda do their own thing. Also the reason of them shaving their heads during times of war doesn't work because they were like that before. It's not a "Klingon tradition" it's a wonky way to do a retcon to address all the complaints and confusion making it feel like a reboot when they say it isn't. I mean what's next ... they will stop the "tradition" of creating a second set of nostrils?
@@daetoris4473 That they had Hair again in Season 2 only made it worse. First, it clashed with the already established Make-up. But more importantly: The reason for them being bald in Season 1, according to background information, was because the ridges hold sensory organs that have to be exposed. In other words, in trying to appeal to long-term fans, they came up with a half-assed solution and broke their own rules. They really should have went with the post-TMP-makeup in the first place.
I always thought they should have added a part, somewhere in ENT, where they find out the infected Klingons have risen up, and had a cultural revolution. They tossed out all the Klingon cultural stuff that led to their disfigurement (the high council, obsession with honor, you know, the NG Klingon stuff), and established a new government with themselves in control. Then, you just establish a date sometime around TMP where Traditionalists come back into power. Could have made the DIS Klingons like holdouts who were immune or had the resources to "remain Klingon"; maybe the end of war with the DIS klingons is the start of the fall of the TOS klingons.
This is what I love of the prime universe. Everything connected. Blah that Kelvin and that damn hybrid star trek discovery that doesn't know what it's doing.
Star Trek Discovery is the biggest mistake the franchise ever made. The powers that be within Star Trek knew the franchise ran out of steam years ago. They couldn't generate enough new steam with the Kelvin timeline, so they re-wrote, re-invented, and killed something that inspired a populace, not just demographics, for a better society.
popular opinion is that Star Trek Discovery *_IS_* part of the Kelvin Timeline: regardless of whatever opinions that the creators try to say otherwise... and we have indeed verified that the only people that are working on that series were those that worked on the Abrahams Trilogy that was ALL part of the Kelvin Timeline.
Shwatvogel "And then STD proceeds to just ignore this altogether" That's okay. I just ignore STD/Abramsverse altogether. It effectively means no new ST for me, but I have five television series, an animated series, a number of movies, a metric ton of fanfic, multiple comic book series, well over 300 novels (last time I looked, probably a lot more now), and legions of fans of the original franchise to sustain me for many years to come. Probably for the rest of my life.
Aren't the Klingons we see on the ship supposed to be very old klingons? maybe even having been in cryostatic suspension, this would mean they might predate the virus that took away their ridges
Roddenberry said Klingons always looked like they did in the movies. DS9 re-canonized the TOS ascetics, and this tried to bridge the gap. Then along came Discovery.
Std,lol,fail. Std is in the fanfiction verse separate from the rodenberry/Berman timeline and the Kelvin timeline and the Terran empire timeline and all the timelines from that ones tng episode.
@@skyserf your right, fanfiction is written by people who love and respect the world of the story and want to experience more for the sake of that world.
You have to give STE some credit here. Sure the explanation might be absurd, but at least they tried to provide a legitimate one. It was probably the best anyone could come up with under the circumstances.
I thought Enterprise Season 4 was too downbeat and heavy. And the less said about the ending - the better. But I REALLY like that it tried to fix a LOT of Star Trek universe, continuity errors - like this one. And they generally did it VERY well.
I wonder how they are going to explain the Klingons in the new Star Trek Series? I mean they look really jacked up if you've seen the Trailer for Discovery.
There are hints that Discovery era Klingons were found on a mausoleum ship so they would have been isolated from the virus. They are relics from an even older era of Klingon.
The answer is... they won't explain it. They've spit on continuity and canon and redefined one of Trek's most iconic species as hairless orc-things that dress like Dark Eldar.
Yeah, and they looked a lot different. Also, Romulans in the Abramverse love shaved heads and tattoos, and they're not nearly as secretive. Also, the NCC-1701 is like three times as big in the Abramverse. So yeah, the Narada's emergence fucked up a lot of things unexplainably. :-P
Rob H The Romulans is from prime universe. But they were just a bunch of renegade miners and somewhat of a fringe group since Nero, unlike the rest of Romulans, actually helped Spock(and failed of course).
see , in star trek somehow, fuck knows how really, everyone is on relatively even footing, for some reason humanties first useful ships the NX class can stand up to the raptor could probably expect to come home in a 2 NX on 1 raptor. when the narada shows up outta fucking nowhere and randomly attacks a ship for simply being federation, emergency forwarding plans would be activated, i beleive kirk is his 30's or 40's when he gets command of the enterprise, hes a captain with a service record at the time however the enterprise was likely just viewed as any other ship of the line, the line at that point being the constitution class. so the events leading up to it the incrementation of iterative but relatively uninspired designs just better than the previous. i dunno what reason the constitution was built in canon. in axanar its due to the klingons looking to whoop our ass before we do it to them, meaning we had to put a ship together that simply worked in the abrams we've a much greater imagined threat, a giant ship with firepower not heard of outside of a full fleet of ships, i feel fairly safe in saying the narada could take a wing of D7's without much issue. star fleet however, needs a large vessal to respond to such massive size, everything needs scaled up, more generators, capacitors, boarding party sizes and less time to work out how to microlise a few things, then a few other things. i take the ship to simply be an emergency activation of a design that was likely expecting a later launch like it did in ToS. so yeah, i actually buy the size massiving.
The Constitution class ships were ships for exploration. Exploring parts of the galaxy that hasn't been explored. That is why they were doing star mapping missions in areas. The weapons were for defensive purposes in case any hostile species were encounted. They officially discovered a number of sentinent creatures.. In a war the heavy stuff would have been brought in. The Galaxy class ships like Enterprise D would have to be refitted, before going into combat with new crews and maybe better weapons, for the Dominion wars.
Ok, I have just watched this episode on cable TV, I haven’t searched anything for Star Trek Enterprise related on UA-cam. This isn’t first time I watch Enterprise and then get same part of the episode in recommendations. My FBI agent is trying too hard.
And yet Star Trek: Discovery Klingons do not look like either this, the old generation versions or the new generation version (which with these Enterprise episodes were finally tied together) - even though the new series is meant to be after this and before the old generation :-(
That really upset me too. Enterprise worked very hard to give a good explanation to this... and now Discovery seems to be throwing that out the airlock. I hope that it turns out the Klingons in Discovery are a new breed or something.... Like Romulans and Remans.
And... they are not. Apparently we are expected to believe that Klingons just look like this now. Hairless with another set of nostrils and an appetite for human flesh.
Let's be constructive about this. Perhaps the Klingons we see are supposed to represent the infected ones and be the same as in the original series and when they are cured they will go Worf-ish.
Thodnern Or maybe the producers just didn't give a fuck about continuity and just took a big shit to appeal diverse audiences and to force their stupid political agenda. Just the same as Star Wars... Wrecking it to oblivion.
No wonder klingons are pissed off all the time.They keep changing their look once a generation.I'd be angry too if i could barely recognise my grandpa as part of the same species while my kids would ask 'are you sure youre our dad??'.
Fans asked if Worf comes back for Star Trek Picard (which he is)...will they change him to look like Discoverie's Klingons...the writers said no...his explanation Klingons look different depending on what region there from....just like what they did with the Romulans. So I guess there are some that still look like worf(TNG) and others that look like whatever Discovery did to them.
This recon was my biggest gripe with Enterprise. The forehead thing didn't need an explanation, and Worf refusing to answer the question was a perfectly funny way to address it. It wasn't even the only time an alien race got redesigned. Compare the Romulans from TOS to TNG some time.
A lot of people saying that Discovery retcons this retcon, but they mention that only millions are effected I doubt there a that few Klingons, so I guess only a handful (which in the empire is probably a good few million) were effected so the Klingons in discovery can still have the ridges and those that didn’t we just didn’t happen to see them, that said it would have helped if we did see a number of them
I thought it would be a cool story that it was a pathogen picked up from Tribbles on Space Station K7. Hence the great War where the Kingons destroyed the Tribble home world.
Now THAT is how you retcon...
I agree. I really liked this little chapter in Klingon history. It made perfect sense for the Klingons to have a misguided attempt to make themselves stronger backfire on them.
It presents another plot hole though.....A re-occuring character in DS9 was Dax's "best-friend" what was Kirk's arch-enemy in the TOS, who's name was "Kor". Although this might explain what some Klingons have bumps, and others don't. But in TOS, Kor had no bumps, while in DS9 he did......was this disease curable later in the cannon?
It wasn't really the disease that was the issue -- It was the "disfigurement" from the disease. Kor may have had cosmetic surgery at some point to correct it. "Cranial reconstruction" is even mentioned at 0:47.
They did say that reversing the effects may be possible in the future. They probably found that resolution sometime between TOS and DS9s timelines. Kor and the others would have gone through it then.
Cap Tin the cure was shown on voyager and implemented in the star trek online game.
In the DS9 episode, Bashir and O'Brien seperately ask if it was genetic engineering or a retroviral plague. I love that the Enterprise writers made the answer be both.
Worf: "We do not discus it to outsiders."
James Landon what episode did Woof say that?
Season 5 Episode 6 ------> "Trials of Tribble-ations"
I loved Worf's non-answer to their questions. "We do not discuss it with outsiders." This is one of those questions where you would normally have to stop the story dead for a few minutes while Worf fills in all the backstory.
Because back then, the writers and CBS cared about Star Trek.
"We don't talk about it to outsider" Worf DS9 “Trials and Tribble-ations,”
KlunkerRider "It would be too stupid to explain."
I remember that clip from DS9, Cool episode hands down 🌎
@@cactuspete1973: For me, second only to "Trouble with Tribbles."
I usually watch them back to back.
KlunkerRider Bashir’s guesses were correct.
*outsiders
Even without the ridges he still looks more Klingon than discovery klingons.
No shit right!
Even the Uruk Hai from LotR look more klingon than Disco klingons 😁
#NotmyKlingon
What if TOS Klingons?
@@waltervargas57 still better than that discovery season 1 monstrosity
I think Roddenberry said Klingons were always written with forehead ridges but the FX makeup was too expensive in the 60s, I say this explanation was the best one they could have come up with.
that happened a lot on the original series. roddenberry also wanted the enterprise to be able to land on planets but again, the visual effects were not in the budget so he invented the idea of the transporter, so the ship would not have to land. the company that the studio hired to produce costumes couldn't make spock's ears look realistic, so the makeup artist on the show used his own money, 600 dollars, to have a friend who worked at mgm make spock's ears because the studio refused to pay for it. shatner once said that each episode was made with money equivalent to the weekly catering bill for any modern tv show. set decorators would scrounge dumpsters at the studio for cardboard and styrofoam that they used to build the enterprise sets.
@@marzsit9833 And they did a phenomenal job with what they could put together! I imagine TOS but with a modern FX budget! I think the producers of SNW have said we might get to TOS territory if the show does get more seasons.
That doesn’t make sense to me because the point of the episode _The Trouble With Tribbles_ was that you could not tell a human apart from a Klingon.
If that's the case why didn't they get ridges in the animated series?
@@MildMisanthropeMaybeMassive well isnt like you couldnt write around the budget problems after the fact.
These are the Klingons I expected in Star Trek Discovery, I call shade!
but making the bad guys brown would be racist
Instead you got blue monster people. These things happen when JJ Abrams is involved.
Discovery is set within the same "Prime" reality as The Original Series, the first two seasons in the 2250s. Abrams was only involved with the 2009 film and its 2013 into Darkness sequel.
sadly, we got the '09 Star Trek variant, which shouldn't have happened. The JJKlingons in the prime timeline, not the '09 soft reboot stuff.
@@mattb6369 If you think Discovery is set in the prime universe, then you trust the words of CBS PR more than your own eyes. Don't let people piss in your mouth and tell you it's raining.
I love how he says to Archer, " You didn't think we were all soldiers, did you?"
A wonderfully written explanation of why Kirk era Klingons looked more human, now ruined by Star Trek Discovery... unless they come up with a valid reason for the back and forth appearance.
"Ancient Klingons waking up from cryo storage" is what I've heard. Not sure if I believe it.
It was mentioned in the video that the Klingon doctor is thinking about going into cranial restoration practice, in other words, restoring the ridges via surgery. If the practice becomes popular, other surgeons will get in on the gravy train.
The virus didn't affect all Klingons, to my knowledge (and the information on Memory Alpha) it was only a couple of millions.
So unless the ridgeless Klingons don't exist AT ALL in STDisc, everything's okay.
But they should, seeing as how the divergence point is in the Kirk era, which is AFTER the Archer era.
Marty theMartian What if a group a Klingons, lets say a Subspecies reacted differently on the Augment Virus. Instead of devolping a more human appearance, they degenerated into a past phenotype in their Evolution, which had a more advanced Exosceleton.
Roddenberry stated, " There is no explanation in canon.. "It was simply a better makeup ability and budget during Star Trek the Motion Picture." STE made a nice canon explanation for the differences between TOS, STMP and STE
nah it was pretty stupid to devote multiple episodes to a stupid makeup change
@@VoodooV1 I agree. I read something similar from Gene which is much better solution then all these episodes and changes: "The TOS Klingons were always like this, you just couldn't see it on the low definition TV sets"
@@VoodooV1 I like canonical consistency. And the TOS Klingons looked cool in their own right. I for one like that this was addressed with a cool story too.
@@Tamamo-no-Bae How did they look cool? They were dudes with beards.
Well the problem really started with Trials and Tribble-ations, since there they explain that, yes, Klingons from TOS and TNG do indeed look different
I always wondered about how the Star Trek canon dealt with this. Thanks.
I think the cranial reconstruction becoming popular explains the discovery klingons. The augment virus created a huge backlash and was seen as an attack on the very idea of being a klingon. So they overcompensated with the reconstructive surgery, went out of their way to demonstrate just how extremely klingon they were.
Damn you just solvrd an big debacle
Or it was just bad writing
@@Xanduur Or it was both.
I congratulate you to an explanation to the DISCO-Klingons that, as contrived as it has to be, given the almost impossible setup, would actually work in-universe.
that actually makes an incredible amount of sense. And so very Klingon.
Ferengi raised the cost of latex.
😂true
At least this explains why the Klingons on the original Star Trek looked different than the ones after the first motion picture.
Supposedly they were always intended to have the forehead ridges but the original TV budget wouldn't permit it.
That seems unlikely, since there was an episode in which a Klingon posed as a human, and was only found out when his DNA was scanned. I think it was the one about the Tribbles?
Yes, it was Trouble with Tribbles.
Aw who needs an explanation for the Klingons looking the way they do after ST TOS? They look that way because special effects were better by the time the movies were made. That's all the explanation necessary.
Learn to read, mate.
Enterprise was the last cannon show, CBS needs to take notes
I prefer _canon_ ; the kurtzman trek is re-imagined (alternate) trek, as is the jj trek of 2009 ~ 2016.
Std,lol,fail. Std is in the fanfiction verse separate from the rodenberry/Berman timeline and the Kelvin timeline and the Terran empire timeline and all the timelines from that ones tng episode.
This is cute but no matter what it's cannon
Discovery, Picard, Lower Decks and Prodigy are ALL in the TOS/TNG/DS9/Voy universe. Personally, I don't like Enterprise, never really watched it, and I don't think it fits in canon. Still Enterprise is Canon. The fact that I dont like it doesnt make it non-canon.
@@matthewdrexler188 no, Discovery is in the same universe as TNG/DS9, etc.
This was a great in-universe explanation.
I loved this two-parter!
Dr Phlox is my favorite medical officer in Star Trek. Such a great actor and character.
Yeah hes awesome.
The holographic emergency doc was pretty good too.
This is my one of my favorite episodes of enterprise and I can't help but think back to Star Trek DS9 episode where Worf in the others travel 2 time of James D Kirk in Trouble with Tribbles when asked why Klingons look like that wolf said it's something we don't talk about outside the empire well now we know why I like what they did here with this this is why this is one of my favorite episodes of Star Trek Enterprise and this show was very underrated and didn't get enough credit for some pretty good stories
Sadly the entire ST Enterprise was an underrated series :(
that's James T Kirk try reading as he say to you.
Yeah but they have ruined it with STD.
@@daviniarobbins9298 in my opinion STD isn't canon
The problem with Troubles and Tribbleations was taht those Klingons, didn't recognize that Worf was a "normal" Klingon with ridges, sitting with humans! We all realize that it was a matter of more advanced make up and effects, and we as Trek fans all have imaginations! The way I have delt with it, the Klingons always looked the way do with head ridges, the shows budget and portral was the only reason for it. Same as it's the only reason why the sets looked the way they do. I dislike the new Discorvery Klingons. They should have left them as they were.
Dr Bashier: "Those are KLINGONS!?"
We do not speak about it with outsiders
Alright, you boys have had enough
THIS WAS FANTASTIC WRITING. NICE WAY TO FILL IN THE PLOT HOLES. I STILL THINK THIS SHOW IS UNDER RATED.
i honestly found Enterprise to b my favorite of the star trek series, mainly because it shows us what it was like for humanity before the federation was even an idea
John Schuck, one of the greatest peripheral Trek actors. He started on McMillan Wife back in the 70's
Don't forget the dentist in the movie M*A*S*H.
@@brennonguilbeau569 Captain Walter Koskiusko "Painless Pole" Waldowski.
yep, and I'm old enough that I can say I watched that show, when I was a lot younger.
I like the fact the problem was touched in DS9 firstly and they held it untill Enterprise and they explained it
This show was just getting good.
this series gave a very elegant explanation of the differences in appearance of the Klingons from the original series, and later.
If I remember correctly the Klingons came across Khan and his re-engineered humans and lost very badly to the super humans. They decided they would do the same re-engineering but instead of becoming super Klingons they became more human.
No, Klingons encountered Soong’s band of augments who were grown in artificial wombs in the 22nd century. Khan and crew are sleeping on the Botany bay. The augments in Enterprise were embryos made during Khan’s reign on earth and artificially gestated and raised by an earlier ancestor of Soong who later invested Data and Lore. It all makes sense why Lore turned out bad with his past failures with the augments Lore was like an artificial augment himself.
You’re referring to the plot, right? They encountered Augments in a previous episode, but they are unaffiliated with Khan. They were just a group of Augments.
At this point the Klingons never ran into Khan's Augments. The Augments from ENT were a different set, raised by Arik Soong, and it was from these Augments' DNA that they derived their research from. Arik was an ancestor (a great or great-great grandfather) to Noonien Soong, the creator of Data.
And then cbs ignored this and made klingons look like my poop after a pot roast dinner.
Maybe the poop Klingons are a subspecies, like the Reman are to the Romulans.
Fly around Uranus and clean up the poop Klingons.
LOL I thought they looked familiar
The best looking Klingons in my opinion verses space Vikings 🙄
If this was real, I’d say you’re being racist
Deep Space 9, TNG both "alluded" to this subject. I'm glad they all had a "puzzle" to this story.
then they suddenly turned to xenomorph kling orcs
Std,lol,fail. Std is in the fanfiction verse separate from the rodenberry/Berman timeline and the Kelvin timeline and the Terran empire timeline and all the timelines from that ones tng episode.
The effect was probably temporary but it may have taken years maybe decades to wear off. Kang, Kor, and Koloth grew back their cranial ridges when they were old men.
Or perhaps the medical technology advanced to the point where they could have re-ridged their craniums.
That, or they had enough money and standing to afford the standard of reconstructive surgery they received.
The other Klingon from Trouble with Tribles would have been their age and his ridges hadnt grown back by the era of DS9, while all three of theirs had. Either he had surgery to remain human looking or the three had surgery to add ridges.
Probably because they did honorable things that helped them earn their ridges
The effect was temporary, by the time of the movies and TNG, all of the ill effects worn off.
Even the TOS Klingons retained their original look.
Okay. Now they have to explain me why in Discovery they are jet black and lack hair.
Because they don't care. They don't explain. The break the rules and ideas within their own show.
Actually they kinda did in season 2, one of the Klingon characters says to the MC “yeah the klingons have started to grow their hair again”
A bit too much of a development for a few lines of dialogue but it certainly explains why all of the klingons in discovery were bald: the houses that followed T’Kuvma shaved their heads as a sign of respect to him, after the war they had no need to continue the tradition so they started growing it back
@@daetoris4473 That doesn't work so well. For one all the houses kinda do their own thing. Also the reason of them shaving their heads during times of war doesn't work because they were like that before.
It's not a "Klingon tradition" it's a wonky way to do a retcon to address all the complaints and confusion making it feel like a reboot when they say it isn't. I mean what's next ... they will stop the "tradition" of creating a second set of nostrils?
Answer: Because Discovery isn't Star Trek, despite it's name.
@@daetoris4473 That they had Hair again in Season 2 only made it worse. First, it clashed with the already established Make-up. But more importantly: The reason for them being bald in Season 1, according to background information, was because the ridges hold sensory organs that have to be exposed. In other words, in trying to appeal to long-term fans, they came up with a half-assed solution and broke their own rules.
They really should have went with the post-TMP-makeup in the first place.
I was always taught they were just different races of the Klingon species.
I liked this it worked
Then discovery happened
Star Trek reached entire cultures. Discovery reaches only certain demographics within cultures.
What is this Discovery that you speak of?
@@SheldonAdama17, Star Trek: Discovery, the biggest fiasco within Star History.
Yeah I just refuse to watch it after the first season.
@@SisyphusJP so much cancer just just justify the Kelvin timeline
And a few centuries later (along the S.T. timeline), John Shuck will return as Klingon Ambassador Kamarog in Star Trek TNG movies IV and VI. 🖖
Wow he did look familiar I thought I was raceblind to them for a sec lol
I always thought they should have added a part, somewhere in ENT, where they find out the infected Klingons have risen up, and had a cultural revolution. They tossed out all the Klingon cultural stuff that led to their disfigurement (the high council, obsession with honor, you know, the NG Klingon stuff), and established a new government with themselves in control.
Then, you just establish a date sometime around TMP where Traditionalists come back into power. Could have made the DIS Klingons like holdouts who were immune or had the resources to "remain Klingon"; maybe the end of war with the DIS klingons is the start of the fall of the TOS klingons.
This is what I love of the prime universe. Everything connected. Blah that Kelvin and that damn hybrid star trek discovery that doesn't know what it's doing.
Star Trek Discovery is the biggest mistake the franchise ever made. The powers that be within Star Trek knew the franchise ran out of steam years ago. They couldn't generate enough new steam with the Kelvin timeline, so they re-wrote, re-invented, and killed something that inspired a populace, not just demographics, for a better society.
@@ericburow6436 at least the Kelvin films were good films, same cannot be said of ST:D
Sgt. Enright never gets a break.
And then STD proceeds to just ignore this altogether.
popular opinion is that Star Trek Discovery *_IS_* part of the Kelvin Timeline: regardless of whatever opinions that the creators try to say otherwise... and we have indeed verified that the only people that are working on that series were those that worked on the Abrahams Trilogy that was ALL part of the Kelvin Timeline.
@@0hvist Or, discovery is just a bad show with bad writing.
Schwatvogel I just pretend that show does not exist.
@@scottm4969 Thats the exact mindset I will approach "Picard" with next month: Discovery never existed, lets start fresh.
Shwatvogel "And then STD proceeds to just ignore this altogether"
That's okay. I just ignore STD/Abramsverse altogether. It effectively means no new ST for me, but I have five television series, an animated series, a number of movies, a metric ton of fanfic, multiple comic book series, well over 300 novels (last time I looked, probably a lot more now), and legions of fans of the original franchise to sustain me for many years to come. Probably for the rest of my life.
Really nice way to explain the change from no ridges to ridges.
smoother than a baby Klingon's behind.
Now how are they going to explain how the klingons look like in discovery?
"Game over, man! Game over!" (R.I.P. Bill Paxton)
The producers of Star Trek discovery which is really throwing the baby out with the bathwater they have no honor.
Aren't the Klingons we see on the ship supposed to be very old klingons? maybe even having been in cryostatic suspension, this would mean they might predate the virus that took away their ridges
An attempt to cure the virus?
Q did it
And then Discovery blew it all to hell yet again!
Elegant explanation!!
Watching this now answers so much.. I have before but at the time i did not understand.
"My targ won't even recognize me."
Yeah, but Pippi Longstocking will
Now this is how you keep a franchise’s continuity. An art that has since been forgotten as Discovery has shown.
I want to see more of Dr Flox's race of people in Star Trek shows, specially if they date back to the very very first pre Captain Kirk NX Enterprise!
Roddenberry said Klingons always looked like they did in the movies. DS9 re-canonized the TOS ascetics, and this tried to bridge the gap.
Then along came Discovery.
Glad to finally see an explanation, it only took 5 different series before we finally get an explanation for it, lol.
And in other news, "there shall be no peace - as long as Kirk lives!".
Great episode 😀
This guy was in M.A.S.H. with that bucket dude👍
I’ve rewatched all TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT at least 5 times.
I don’t think I’ll finish the STD and PIC.
Std,lol,fail. Std is in the fanfiction verse separate from the rodenberry/Berman timeline and the Kelvin timeline and the Terran empire timeline and all the timelines from that ones tng episode.
@@matthewdrexler188 I think fanfiction is better than the STD.
@@skyserf your right, fanfiction is written by people who love and respect the world of the story and want to experience more for the sake of that world.
Now explain to me why the Klingons in Star Trek discovery look like shit
What's wrong with the Discovery Klingons
I just dont care for discovery. Some liberal got their hands on it and now i just dont care that it exists
Discovery Klingons are in the middle/ final stage of transformation caused by the virus.
Your only answer is "A liberal got their hands on it", seriously?
we don't talk about that....(whispering in your ear) never
John Shuck. Fantastic actor.
The Klingons without the ridges seem more civilized, so apparently the change is more than cosmetic.
"The klingons - over there, and over there"
"We do not speak of it"
Dude caught the Humanpox and came out lookin' like the Cowardly Lion. Poor sod. lol
You have to give STE some credit here. Sure the explanation might be absurd, but at least they tried to provide a legitimate one. It was probably the best anyone could come up with under the circumstances.
TheStapleGunKid it's Star trek there is a lot of absurd shit.
Well luckily he did manage to fix the effects of the disorder and regained his people's facial honor but man, rough couple of years for them.
Was that John Schuk?
I knew he looked familiar!😊
@@tornadogirl9099 For me, it was the voice.
I thought Enterprise Season 4 was too downbeat and heavy. And the less said about the ending - the better.
But I REALLY like that it tried to fix a LOT of Star Trek universe, continuity errors - like this one.
And they generally did it VERY well.
The obtuse finale aside, S4 of ST: Enterprise is best, certainly compared to the preceding 3 seasons.
They are beautiful. Qapla!
This is one of the rare redeeming moments in enterprise .
Gotta love Enterprise filling in gaps from previous Trek
What they should have done, is making it so there were two species of Klingon. One Strong, and in control. The other weaker, and subservient.
Like they did with Romulans...
Klingons had tribbles for their regular diet, so their foreheads grew more ridges. Thanks to Scotty for beaming them into the Klingon vessel 🤣
thank you
I wonder how they are going to explain the Klingons in the new Star Trek Series? I mean they look really jacked up if you've seen the Trailer for Discovery.
There are hints that Discovery era Klingons were found on a mausoleum ship so they would have been isolated from the virus. They are relics from an even older era of Klingon.
They're extremely religious and isolationists living on a Sarcophagus Ship
The answer is... they won't explain it. They've spit on continuity and canon and redefined one of Trek's most iconic species as hairless orc-things that dress like Dark Eldar.
AHHHHH i hear Warhammer lore being talked of, let us all contemplate on the Warp of space and time
"Cranial reconstruction" should be the explanation for 2250s Klingons in Discovery and the Kelvin Timeline
Klingon: I don't look like a bipedal fish. Damn it, I require more work!
Discoklingons do not look like fish.
So, now why are they all purple in the 23rd century?! god damn it
They can go to hell for bastardizing the most iconic Trek species.
Is the guy who played the klingon in this scene, also played Drol, caretaker of the Great machine, on Bab 5? The later version of Drol
Yes! John Schuck
I guess they got their ridges back a lot earlier in the Abramsverse...
Yeah, and they looked a lot different. Also, Romulans in the Abramverse love shaved heads and tattoos, and they're not nearly as secretive. Also, the NCC-1701 is like three times as big in the Abramverse.
So yeah, the Narada's emergence fucked up a lot of things unexplainably. :-P
Rob H The Romulans is from prime universe. But they were just a bunch of renegade miners and somewhat of a fringe group since Nero, unlike the rest of Romulans, actually helped Spock(and failed of course).
see , in star trek somehow, fuck knows how really, everyone is on relatively even footing, for some reason humanties first useful ships the NX class can stand up to the raptor could probably expect to come home in a 2 NX on 1 raptor. when the narada shows up outta fucking nowhere and randomly attacks a ship for simply being federation, emergency forwarding plans would be activated, i beleive kirk is his 30's or 40's when he gets command of the enterprise, hes a captain with a service record at the time however the enterprise was likely just viewed as any other ship of the line, the line at that point being the constitution class. so the events leading up to it the incrementation of iterative but relatively uninspired designs just better than the previous.
i dunno what reason the constitution was built in canon. in axanar its due to the klingons looking to whoop our ass before we do it to them, meaning we had to put a ship together that simply worked
in the abrams we've a much greater imagined threat, a giant ship with firepower not heard of outside of a full fleet of ships, i feel fairly safe in saying the narada could take a wing of D7's without much issue. star fleet however, needs a large vessal to respond to such massive size, everything needs scaled up, more generators, capacitors, boarding party sizes and less time to work out how to microlise a few things, then a few other things. i take the ship to simply be an emergency activation of a design that was likely expecting a later launch like it did in ToS.
so yeah, i actually buy the size massiving.
At the very least, the Klingons in the JJ-Movies at least look somewhat like Klingons, unlike what I've seen so far of "Star Trek Discovery"
The Constitution class ships were ships for exploration. Exploring parts of the galaxy that hasn't been explored. That is why they were doing star mapping missions in areas. The weapons were for defensive purposes in case any hostile species were encounted. They officially discovered a number of sentinent creatures.. In a war the heavy stuff would have been brought in. The Galaxy class ships like Enterprise D would have to be refitted, before going into combat with new crews and maybe better weapons, for the Dominion wars.
Now they need to explain Star Trek: Discovery.
Gregory Matthews
1 word says it all to describe
STAR TREK :
DISCOVERY
💩SHITTY💩
STD is a one off abomination.
I guess it would have been difficult to have Dr. Phlox say "All right, bub, part of your f-in' head is coming right off."
Don't worry, he can always have a job taking care of the great machine on Epsilon III...
I can't wait for a similar episode in a future Trek show to explain why the STD klingons look the way they do.
now explain the klingons from "discovery" ... lol
MrRadensen Discovery is from a aborted universe
Small inbred band of Klingons seperate from the main genetic line.
We rather not discuss it to Off Worlders
Ok, I have just watched this episode on cable TV, I haven’t searched anything for Star Trek Enterprise related on UA-cam. This isn’t first time I watch Enterprise and then get same part of the episode in recommendations.
My FBI agent is trying too hard.
What season and episode is this?
Discovery-era Klingons = The fighting Klingon-hai
And yet Star Trek: Discovery Klingons do not look like either this, the old generation versions or the new generation version (which with these Enterprise episodes were finally tied together) - even though the new series is meant to be after this and before the old generation :-(
That really upset me too. Enterprise worked very hard to give a good explanation to this... and now Discovery seems to be throwing that out the airlock.
I hope that it turns out the Klingons in Discovery are a new breed or something.... Like Romulans and Remans.
And... they are not. Apparently we are expected to believe that Klingons just look like this now. Hairless with another set of nostrils and an appetite for human flesh.
Let's be constructive about this. Perhaps the Klingons we see are supposed to represent the infected ones and be the same as in the original series and when they are cured they will go Worf-ish.
Thodnern Or maybe the producers just didn't give a fuck about continuity and just took a big shit to appeal diverse audiences and to force their stupid political agenda. Just the same as Star Wars... Wrecking it to oblivion.
KLamki1 maybe but just complaining about it rather then trying to find the good in it isn't helping.
... Isn't that the same actor who played the Klingon ambassador is the Undiscovered Country? Guess they promoted him instead. XD
Wow coming from a Klingon that's high honor
What is the other NX class ship there?
I wish this had more seasons :(
No wonder klingons are pissed off all the time.They keep changing their look once a generation.I'd be angry too if i could barely recognise my grandpa as part of the same species while my kids would ask 'are you sure youre our dad??'.
Fucking thank you
Wolf would have been like "kill me, its more than i can stand."
This Klingon reminds me of Santa from the guardians movie.
Might be the same actor.
Love Enterprise, but the reaction to tribble causing is will always be my cannon.
Meanwhile the Klingons in discovery look like Orcs from Lord of the Rings
Now we're ready for Kirk😂
Fans asked if Worf comes back for Star Trek Picard (which he is)...will they change him to look like Discoverie's Klingons...the writers said no...his explanation Klingons look different depending on what region there from....just like what they did with the Romulans. So I guess there are some that still look like worf(TNG) and others that look like whatever Discovery did to them.
This recon was my biggest gripe with Enterprise. The forehead thing didn't need an explanation, and Worf refusing to answer the question was a perfectly funny way to address it.
It wasn't even the only time an alien race got redesigned. Compare the Romulans from TOS to TNG some time.
A lot of people saying that Discovery retcons this retcon, but they mention that only millions are effected I doubt there a that few Klingons, so I guess only a handful (which in the empire is probably a good few million) were effected so the Klingons in discovery can still have the ridges and those that didn’t we just didn’t happen to see them, that said it would have helped if we did see a number of them
“We do not discuss it with outsiders.”
- Worf
And they should've left it at that instead of trying to lawyer in the difference. This plot in ENT ruined the joke.
They all call him Smoothbrain now.
What other Starfleet ship is that?
I thought it would be a cool story that it was a pathogen picked up from Tribbles on Space Station K7. Hence the great War where the Kingons destroyed the Tribble home world.
Flox face always remind me of DS9
Was that Ezri Dax (Nicole DeBoa ) walking in the room with SubCmdr T’Pol or is it me?
Mongo Boogie - It wasn’t her.